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Reds Fanatic
05-05-2008, 04:56 PM
From John Fay:



Bill Bray was optioned to Triple-A Louisville. David Weathers was activated from the disabled list.

Bray took the news well. He pitched in the last three games.

"That's the first time I've done that in couple of years," he said. "I feel great today. I'm excited about that."

edabbs44
05-05-2008, 04:57 PM
Little to no sense.

BuckeyeRedleg
05-05-2008, 04:59 PM
Your Cincinnati Reds organization in a nutshell.

Tommyjohn25
05-05-2008, 05:01 PM
Well, you have to admit. Bray didn't do himself any favors impressing Jocketty. Still though, not sure why Mercker is still up here.

BuckeyeRedleg
05-05-2008, 05:04 PM
Bray had a limited opportunities to do anything. Although his command sometimes may be off, he does miss bats.

Weathers has little command and never misses bats.

Sea Ray
05-05-2008, 05:05 PM
Right now they need guys who can give them some innings 'cause this bullpen is spent. Bray probably wouldn't be available for the entire Cubs series and they need someone who can pitch in case we have another starter meltdown

edabbs44
05-05-2008, 05:08 PM
Well, you have to admit. Bray didn't do himself any favors impressing Jocketty. Still though, not sure why Mercker is still up here.

Not a big deal. Mercker only got an invite to ST because he wanted one last hurrah with the boys. The invite was a favor so he could go out on his own terms. He'll be a distant memory by opening day.

:)

membengal
05-05-2008, 05:10 PM
Let the winning begin!

SMcGavin
05-05-2008, 05:10 PM
Why Bray? This is stupid.

WMR
05-05-2008, 05:11 PM
Apathy setting in...

REDREAD
05-05-2008, 05:14 PM
Why Bray? This is stupid.


Because he has options, and Wayne stuck the Reds with Weathers' 4 million dollar contract..

Lincoln and Mercker are actually producing. I have no problem with keeping them on the roster. I'd prefer to just release Weathers, but I guess they have to go through the motions and hope someone takes Weathers off our hands at the trading deadline.. Cast probably isn't in the mood to eat another one of Wayne's turds.

Reds1
05-05-2008, 05:28 PM
Well, you have to admit. Bray didn't do himself any favors impressing Jocketty. Still though, not sure why Mercker is still up here.

Mercker no options. I don't agree, but that's why! Not impressed with Mercker. Oh well. Things will be changing as the year goes. The youth movement is on the way.

fearofpopvol1
05-05-2008, 05:33 PM
Where are the Jocketty defenders at?

RedsManRick
05-05-2008, 05:38 PM
A few productive weeks from Weathers could make him nice trade bait for the likes of the Yankees or Tigers.

Strikes Out Looking
05-05-2008, 05:38 PM
Where are the Jocketty defenders at?

He's in his office, signing checks to Juan Castro and Mike Stanton.

AmarilloRed
05-05-2008, 05:38 PM
The Reds seem to have a distressing habit of trying to save bad pitchers.

PuffyPig
05-05-2008, 05:39 PM
Bray had a limited opportunities to do anything. Although his command sometimes may be off, he does miss bats.

Weathers has little command and never misses bats.


Up until this year, Weathers had command and did miss some bats. He's been our best reliever over the last 2 years (before this year), and posters were asking for his release even 2 years ago.

Now he may be done, or his injury may have effected his control. I think he deserves the chance to find out.

Reds1
05-05-2008, 05:39 PM
Where are the Jocketty defenders at?

He hadn't done anything for the Reds yet! It's all hype until something happens.

Joseph
05-05-2008, 05:42 PM
Asinine decisions continue to doom this franchise to sub-mediocrity.

WVRedsFan
05-05-2008, 05:49 PM
Bray had a limited opportunities to do anything. Although his command sometimes may be off, he does miss bats.

Weathers has little command and never misses bats.


Bray didn't miss many this round, though it's a small sample size, as they say. He faced 21 batters and 6 of them got base hits. He also walked three which means in 4 innings he allowed 9 baserunners or roughly 2.5 per inning.

My guess is that they think he needs more work in AAA.

Rojo
05-05-2008, 05:58 PM
Weathers was a nice non-implosive saves place holder (which might've fooled another front office) but his arm just isn't highly-leveragable enough for set-up.

REDREAD
05-05-2008, 06:02 PM
Where are the Jocketty defenders at?

Don't see the point of this.. Wayne kept Bray down in Louisville in favor of Coffey. Jocketty brought Bray up and sent Coffey down.

Now Jocketty is forced to send Bray back down due to the bad contract Wayne gave to Weathers. In addition, Wayne's signing of Fogg also eats up another roster spot.

Mercker and Lincoln are producing. The Reds can't afford to release them. Bray was marginal when he was up here. No big loss to send him down to AAA (And I thought the same about Wayne's decision to leave him in AAA).

Sea Ray
05-05-2008, 06:16 PM
This bullpen needs guys who can give us innings and right now that's Weathers.

BuckeyeRedleg
05-05-2008, 06:23 PM
Bray didn't miss many this round, though it's a small sample size, as they say.

Bray had 4 K's in 4 IP. A K an inning is what I mean by missing bats.

Weathers has 4 K's over his last 16.1 IP

Aronchis
05-05-2008, 06:55 PM
Why Weathers wasn't traded, only Cast/Kriv can tell us why(oh, yeah, we want to win now!!!).

He should be DFA'd.

Tommyjohn25
05-05-2008, 07:20 PM
Not a big deal. Mercker only got an invite to ST because he wanted one last hurrah with the boys. The invite was a favor so he could go out on his own terms. He'll be a distant memory by opening day.

:)

Touche' edabbs. Touche'..... ;)

Always Red
05-05-2008, 08:42 PM
Why Weathers wasn't traded, only Cast/Kriv can tell us why(oh, yeah, we want to win now!!!).

He should be DFA'd.

DFA'd: Maybe later...too much to eat right now.

Traded: Who wants that contract????

Bray didn't pitch all that great while here (OK, but not great), and he will be back. This team really doesn't need him right now, as bad as things are going.

The new GM will want to see and evaluate everyone before any more changes are made, IMO.

What this move does for me, is to tell me that there is no urgency to try to win right now; this year is in the process of being written off. If you are trying to really win, you don't make this move.

BTW, Dave Weathers has been a really effective reliever for this team the last few years. I have much enjoyed watching him pitch, and I think his contributions have been undervalued by many here. It does seem that his best days are behind him, though.

Patrick Bateman
05-05-2008, 09:08 PM
I'm getting frustrated with the lack of opportunities Bray has received. He's done a lot of good in AAA, to the degree that it's clear that there isn't a lot testing him down there. He's major league ready, and has lots of talent, especially relative to the competition.

Whether it be at the expense of Weathers of Merker, he needs to be here. Hell, it would be hard to justify dumping say Affeldt or Lincoln (2 guys pitching fine) but I'd rank the importance of giving Bray major league innings as a higher priority right now.

Now with Weathers and Merker on the team, that type of move would be unneccesary, as those 2 guys that have shown their age this season. Personally, I don't think either will be doing a lot of good here (but Weathers has fooled me before). But anyways, Bray needs to be here:

1. Because his abilities is very important for the future of this pen, and

2. Because he is currently one of the best 7 relievers in this organization

The injuries have been an annoycance with Bray, but he's healthy now, and it's time to see what he can do over an extended period of time.

PuffyPig
05-05-2008, 09:30 PM
Weayhers pitched a scoreless 8th inning, striking out 2. Now, he left a few pitches up high, giving up a double and a line out, but he missed some bats for the first time all year.

*BaseClogger*
05-05-2008, 09:55 PM
Weathers' contract won't look that prohibitive to the Tigers/Yankees in about two months--it's only got one year left...

klw
05-05-2008, 09:58 PM
Weathers' contract won't look that prohibitive to the Tigers/Yankees in about two months--it's only got one year left...

Tigers just DFA'd Jacque Jones.

The_jbh
05-05-2008, 10:29 PM
Everyone needs to chill out... you are forgetting that with Bray we have 3 lefty relievers in the bullpen... thats completely unnecessary whether Bray is one of our top reliever or not...

Weathers was our closer last year... and an effective one at that. People have a short memory. He is valuable as a set up man... he was hurt early on.

The only way Bray stays is if Merkcer goes... and I don't think you push Mercker into retirement when Bray was not that sharp in his three appearances. Affeldt will not go and shouldn't... he has been one of our more reliable relievers.

We don't need 3 lefties, we needed a reliever who could pitch innings, and Bray still could use some polish (and has options)... three strikes and ur in AAA

Reds1
05-05-2008, 10:43 PM
Weathers looked great tonight. Hope he's back. We can use him.

Crash Davis
05-05-2008, 11:19 PM
As a Cincinnati Red, Bill Bray as an ERA over 5.00.

In his 4 IP since recall, he as a WHIP over 2.00. Yet he's supposed to get every benefit of the doubt (and then some) because he struck out a bunch of never-will-be's in AAA?

I love the guy, and I still believe he'll end up contributing to the next good Reds team, but let's stop pretending he's earned a prominent spot in the bullpen. He's yet to earn anything. He's still ALL potential.

There are quite few outrageous things going on with this Reds team (one of the slowest players in the league is currently batting 2nd and covering a fraction of a patch of grass in RF), but sending Bray to AAA is hardly outrageous based on his (lack of) performance in the majors.

fearofpopvol1
05-06-2008, 12:35 AM
Don't see the point of this.. Wayne kept Bray down in Louisville in favor of Coffey. Jocketty brought Bray up and sent Coffey down.

Now Jocketty is forced to send Bray back down due to the bad contract Wayne gave to Weathers. In addition, Wayne's signing of Fogg also eats up another roster spot.

Mercker and Lincoln are producing. The Reds can't afford to release them. Bray was marginal when he was up here. No big loss to send him down to AAA (And I thought the same about Wayne's decision to leave him in AAA).

This is the worst and lamest excuse I've ever heard. Wayne is gone. If Jocketty isn't a fan of these people...all he has to do is DFA them. Wayne isn't going to say no. Bray's striking out 4 in 4 IP was marginal? Compared to Weathers striking out 4 in 16 IP? Wow, glad you're not a scout for the Reds or evaluating talent.

SMcGavin
05-06-2008, 12:42 AM
Yet he's supposed to get every benefit of the doubt (and then some) because he struck out a bunch of never-will-be's in AAA?

No, it's because he has struck out a bunch of major leaguers. In 46 IP with the Reds, 41 K.

Reds1
05-06-2008, 01:04 AM
There are quite few outrageous things going on with this Reds team (one of the slowest players in the league is currently batting 2nd and covering a fraction of a patch of grass in RF

Ironically #2 on the web gems our Mr. slow RF. :) and #1 was felix going over the wall taking HR #598 of our sucky 2nd hole hitter - Just having fun! :)

bucksfan2
05-06-2008, 08:31 AM
C. Trent mentioned that Bray had pitched in the last 3 games before he was demoted. He was pretty much unable to pitch for a couple of days afterward. Bray had options and unfortunatly he was the easiest one to send down. He will be the first one called up again when a pitcher is DLed or released.

BuckeyeRedleg
05-06-2008, 08:35 AM
No, it's because he has struck out a bunch of major leaguers. In 46 IP with the Reds, 41 K.


Exactly.

And adding to that, he's a 24-year old former 1st round pick with a ton of upside.

edabbs44
05-06-2008, 12:15 PM
This is the worst and lamest excuse I've ever heard. Wayne is gone. If Jocketty isn't a fan of these people...all he has to do is DFA them. Wayne isn't going to say no. Bray's striking out 4 in 4 IP was marginal? Compared to Weathers striking out 4 in 16 IP? Wow, glad you're not a scout for the Reds or evaluating talent.

Do you really think Jocketty is allowed to just start DFAing anyone he pleases without Bob signing off?

The_jbh
05-06-2008, 02:51 PM
I would hope so if he is really our general manager

Highlifeman21
05-06-2008, 04:48 PM
A few productive weeks from Weathers could make him nice trade bait for the likes of the Yankees or Tigers.

I certainly hope we'll finally be showcasing a healthy David Weathers to move him by the trade deadline.

Weathers gave us some solid years, but his future isn't with us. Let's get a piece to help the future puzzle.

fearofpopvol1
05-06-2008, 06:01 PM
Do you really think Jocketty is allowed to just start DFAing anyone he pleases without Bob signing off?

You don't think Jocketty can DFA Kent Mercker if he wants or Mike Lincoln? Those guys make peanuts.

mth123
05-06-2008, 07:24 PM
As a Cincinnati Red, Bill Bray as an ERA over 5.00.

In his 4 IP since recall, he as a WHIP over 2.00. Yet he's supposed to get every benefit of the doubt (and then some) because he struck out a bunch of never-will-be's in AAA?

I love the guy, and I still believe he'll end up contributing to the next good Reds team, but let's stop pretending he's earned a prominent spot in the bullpen. He's yet to earn anything. He's still ALL potential.

There are quite few outrageous things going on with this Reds team (one of the slowest players in the league is currently batting 2nd and covering a fraction of a patch of grass in RF), but sending Bray to AAA is hardly outrageous based on his (lack of) performance in the majors.

My thoughts exactly. Bray has "progressed" from prospect to suspect IMO. He's never really been any good since the Red's acquired him. Jon Coutlangus was a better lefty and he is a fringe loogy at best. Bray needs to take a serious step forward.

edabbs44
05-06-2008, 08:30 PM
You don't think Jocketty can DFA Kent Mercker if he wants or Mike Lincoln? Those guys make peanuts.

Agreed there. I was referring more to Weathers getting DFAed.