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Keystone12
05-20-2008, 10:57 AM
Whose OPS is closer to Ken Griffey Jr.'s?

A: Adam Dunn
B: Aaron Harang

elfmanvt07
05-20-2008, 11:03 AM
The fact you posted this makes me think it's AH. How saddening.

Ahhhorsepoo
05-20-2008, 11:16 AM
It's actually Adam Dunn.. with an OPS of .880..
Griffeys is .704..
and Harangs is .524..

soo griff is .176 away from dunn..
and .180 from harang..

I hope your point wasnt to say how great adam dunn is... before these last 5 games griffey had an OPS of .717
Dunns was .739..

which is not a big difference at all..

Griffey is in a big slump.. like he normally does when a big HR number is around the corner.. and dunn jsut happens to have gotten lucky a few more times recently than normal.. but your stat without knowing what it was 5 days ago is pointless..

justincredible
05-20-2008, 12:33 PM
It's actually Adam Dunn.. with an OPS of .880..
Griffeys is .704..
and Harangs is .524..

soo griff is .176 away from dunn..
and .180 from harang..

I hope your point wasnt to say how great adam dunn is... before these last 5 games griffey had an OPS of .717
Dunns was .739..

which is not a big difference at all..

Griffey is in a big slump.. like he normally does when a big HR number is around the corner.. and dunn jsut happens to have gotten lucky a few more times recently than normal.. but your stat without knowing what it was 5 days ago is pointless..

Yeah, Dunn's recent success has all been luck. :rolleyes:

Ahhhorsepoo
05-20-2008, 12:39 PM
Yeah, Dunn's recent success has all been luck. :rolleyes:

you are right this is pure skill and we should expect a homerun every night..

EVERY PERSON with skill has to have some luck on their side.. not that it makes them good.. but had griffey not gotten drafted by a team with outfielders of Mickey Brantly, Henry Cotto, and Glenn Wilson.. he might have been on the bench or in the minors alot.. fortunately for him they were terrible.. so he got his chance..

heck had texas gotten the number one pick.. they had a much better outfield (in comparison) with ruben sierra, and Incaviglia, and maybe would have drafted griffey and kept him in the minors for a few more years..

if you honestly think even good or great players dont need or encounter luck.. then you my friend are delusional..

It also might be lack of skill for pitcher that still havent realized Dunn cant hit a real fastball(95 mph or higher) to save his life.. he lives on hanging breaking balls and that is it..

Fil3232
05-20-2008, 12:46 PM
It also might be lack of skill for pitcher that still havent realized Dunn cant hit a real fastball(95 mph or higher) to save his life.. he lives on hanging breaking balls and that is it..

Your anti-Dunn schtick grows verrrrrry old. At least keep it factual.

durl
05-20-2008, 01:02 PM
It also might be lack of skill for pitcher that still havent realized Dunn cant hit a real fastball(95 mph or higher) to save his life.. he lives on hanging breaking balls and that is it..

I was looking for a website that would give stats on Dunn's homers. Pitch type, count, distance, etc., but I can't find anything. Do you have a source that we could view? That would be really interesting.

Ahhhorsepoo
05-20-2008, 01:02 PM
Your anti-Dunn schtick grows verrrrrry old. At least keep it factual.

you must not watch many games.. he can't hit a fastball.. and if he would shorten up his swing on 2 strikes he would eliminate 30 or 40 k's a year..

his BA against "power" pitchers is at least .060 lower than it is against finesse pitchers who use curveballs, and slower fastballs alot more..

Ahhhorsepoo
05-20-2008, 01:05 PM
I was looking for a website that would give stats on Dunn's homers. Pitch type, count, distance, etc., but I can't find anything. Do you have a source that we could view? That would be really interesting.

view splits at basbeall-reference.com and it goes into power vs. finesse.. but if you watch him against a pitcher with a fastball that reaches the upper 90's he is always way behind.. and just sitting red on a hanging breaking pitch..

Nasty_Boy
05-20-2008, 01:55 PM
You may not expect Dunn to hit a HR every night, but he's 5th all-time in AB/HR 14.05... So you can expect one about every 3.5 games.

How many guys hit upper 90's fastballs well? Wasn't the HR off Penny last night 94 mph?

Would eliminating 30-40 Ks a year result in basehits or just other outs?

Didn't Dunn eliminate 30+ Ks last season?

durl
05-20-2008, 01:57 PM
baseball-reference.com rocks...

I want to make sure I'm reading the Power v. Finesse info correctly. I looked at Dunn, Manny Ramirez, Berkman, and David Ortiz.

According to the Split stats, Dunn hits a greater percentage of his HRs against Power Pitchers than do any of those others. 24% of Dunn's homers are against power pitchers; Ramirez: 16%, Berkman: 22%, and Ortiz: 17%

Nasty_Boy
05-20-2008, 02:02 PM
I think your argument should be, "I don't like Dunn, never will, and no facts will change my mind!" This would make a lot more sense.

levydl
05-20-2008, 02:03 PM
view splits at basbeall-reference.com and it goes into power vs. finesse.. but if you watch him against a pitcher with a fastball that reaches the upper 90's he is always way behind.. and just sitting red on a hanging breaking pitch..

Did you see the 96 MPH fastball Dunn deposited last night? The guy runs hot and cold, but you seem to only want to acknowledge the cold.

Keystone12
05-20-2008, 02:08 PM
It's actually Adam Dunn.. with an OPS of .880..
Griffeys is .704..
and Harangs is .524..

soo griff is .176 away from dunn..
and .180 from harang..

I hope your point wasnt to say how great adam dunn is... before these last 5 games griffey had an OPS of .717
Dunns was .739..

which is not a big difference at all..

Griffey is in a big slump.. like he normally does when a big HR number is around the corner.. and dunn jsut happens to have gotten lucky a few more times recently than normal.. but your stat without knowing what it was 5 days ago is pointless..

No, my point is that Griffey has had a pretty terrible season thus far and it's past the point where it can be excused by a small sample size. I realize that it's actually Adam Dunn [I looked it up, of course], but the similarities in the differentials is hard not to notice.

Griffey's OBP is also near historic lows. Pitchers just don't fear the guy.

OUReds
05-20-2008, 02:24 PM
view splits at basbeall-reference.com and it goes into power vs. finesse.. but if you watch him against a pitcher with a fastball that reaches the upper 90's he is always way behind.. and just sitting red on a hanging breaking pitch..

Is that the argument for the day? Dunn can't hit power pitchers?

Do you know why Dunn hits worse against power pitchers then finesse pitchers? The secret lies in the criteria in which baseball reference uses to designate a power pitcher.

"Power pitchers strike out or walk more than 28% of batters faced, Finesse pitchers strike out or walks less than 24% of batters faced." Since a high strikeout total is a fair indicator of pitcher success, the "power pitchers" are simply better pitchers.

Dunn OPS vs. power .857
Dunn OPS vs. Finesse .998

So about 150 points difference.

Pujols vs. power .964
Pujols vs. Finesse 1.108

Manny vs. power .883
Manny vs. Finesse 1.061

Hmmmmmm.... about 150 points difference.
Maybe Manny and Pujols can't hit a fastball either?

I look forward to a new and exciting justification for hating our most productive offensive player tomorrow.

Fil3232
05-20-2008, 02:39 PM
I think your argument should be, "I don't like Dunn, never will, and no facts will change my mind!" This would make a lot more sense.

Exactly. Next it's going to be Dunn never hits HRs when there's a full moon...

BLEEDS
05-20-2008, 04:36 PM
Exactly. Next it's going to be Dunn never hits HRs when there's a full moon...

Actually, wasn't there just a full moon the other night?!?!

Must be he can't hit them WHEN there isn't a full moon - which since that only happens once a month or so, the Reds, as a small market team, simply cannot afford to have on our roster.

PEACE

-BLEEDS

CWRed
05-20-2008, 09:27 PM
I think your argument should be, "I don't like Dunn, never will, and no facts will change my mind!" This would make a lot more sense.

So so true. And so so sad all the Dunn-hating.

Hondo
05-20-2008, 10:06 PM
If this team doesn't act now and sign Dunn to a LTC, Somebody is going to make him a Higher Paid player than the Reds can... They need to Lock up their Left Fielder

Slyder
05-20-2008, 10:27 PM
you are right this is pure skill and we should expect a homerun every night..

EVERY PERSON with skill has to have some luck on their side.. not that it makes them good.. but had griffey not gotten drafted by a team with outfielders of Mickey Brantly, Henry Cotto, and Glenn Wilson.. he might have been on the bench or in the minors alot.. fortunately for him they were terrible.. so he got his chance..

heck had texas gotten the number one pick.. they had a much better outfield (in comparison) with ruben sierra, and Incaviglia, and maybe would have drafted griffey and kept him in the minors for a few more years..

if you honestly think even good or great players dont need or encounter luck.. then you my friend are delusional..

It also might be lack of skill for pitcher that still havent realized Dunn cant hit a real fastball(95 mph or higher) to save his life.. he lives on hanging breaking balls and that is it..

welcome to ignoreville population you and some guy who yaps about prospects partying habits.

Keystone12
05-21-2008, 10:40 AM
Is that the argument for the day? Dunn can't hit power pitchers?

Do you know why Dunn hits worse against power pitchers then finesse pitchers? The secret lies in the criteria in which baseball reference uses to designate a power pitcher.

"Power pitchers strike out or walk more than 28% of batters faced, Finesse pitchers strike out or walks less than 24% of batters faced." Since a high strikeout total is a fair indicator of pitcher success, the "power pitchers" are simply better pitchers.

Dunn OPS vs. power .857
Dunn OPS vs. Finesse .998

So about 150 points difference.

Pujols vs. power .964
Pujols vs. Finesse 1.108

Manny vs. power .883
Manny vs. Finesse 1.061

Hmmmmmm.... about 150 points difference.
Maybe Manny and Pujols can't hit a fastball either?

I look forward to a new and exciting justification for hating our most productive offensive player tomorrow.

Pwned!

:applauds: