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Jim Fazio
05-23-2008, 10:51 AM
I was one of the few who didn't like the trade of Hamilton, but consider this. You simply do not trade an every day player, one who will play in 150 + ( I know if is body holds up because of substance abuse) for a pitcher (Volquez who has been great) that will play in 30-35 games all year. Just doesn't make sense to me. Look at what Hamilton is doing, leading mvp contender, driving in runs at record pace and the Reds are no better. Just imagine what an outfield the Reds could have had in the years to come. I will never like this deal!!

muethibp
05-23-2008, 10:55 AM
I was hoping we would have an opportunity to discuss this trade. :rolleyes:

I think there are many people who will disagree with you when you say you don't trade a top hitter for a top starting pitcher. In any event, we got the best pitcher in baseball, by nearly any measure, in return. I find it hard to believe you wouldn't like the trade.

Jefferson24
05-23-2008, 11:12 AM
Volquez is a great pitcher, no doubt about that. What you have to ask yourself is would Hamilton's offense have been enough to win us 5 or 6 more games up to this point. Volquez has won 7 games, another pitcher in his spot may have won 1 or 2. So that is 5 wins that Volquez is responsible for. Would Josh's bat been enough to make up those 5 games? If so then we are even. If his bat would have been enough to win 10 more games, then were 5 ahead.

As good as Josh's bat is the reality is he may have made a difference in 3-4 games. So I think we are in better shape with Volquez. At least up to this point.

BlastFurnace
05-23-2008, 11:13 AM
I was one of the few who didn't like the trade of Hamilton, but consider this. You simply do not trade an every day player, one who will play in 150 + ( I know if is body holds up because of substance abuse) for a pitcher (Volquez who has been great) that will play in 30-35 games all year. Just doesn't make sense to me. Look at what Hamilton is doing, leading mvp contender, driving in runs at record pace and the Reds are no better. Just imagine what an outfield the Reds could have had in the years to come. I will never like this deal!!

I know we have discussed this before on the board...and I agree with you. I hated the trade when I heard about it...even though I live right outside of Arlington,Texas and knew all about Volquez...I would not have traded Josh for him either.

Volquez is a stud pitcher, and unfortunately we had to give up something to get something. I just wish that "something" would have been some other players. Keep in mind, the Narron's were hired by the Rangers after last season, and not only are they Josh's support system, but they knew the type of talent they were getting.

If Josh stays clean...and I am betting he will...he will be a star here Texas for a long time. They love him already here. The talk shows around here think they got the best end of the deal, just like many of our fans feel we did.

Only time will tell.

tommycash
05-23-2008, 11:24 AM
I heard that Josh's pee cures cancer and AIDS. We should have it bottled and sold at games. I loved Josh Hamilton, but I would make this trade every time. Sorry, but this is no knock on him, but a stud pitcher is hard to find, and we have our first stud pitcher since I don't know when.

BlastFurnace
05-23-2008, 11:29 AM
I heard that Josh's pee cures cancer and AIDS. We should have it bottled and sold at games. I loved Josh Hamilton, but I would make this trade every time. Sorry, but this is no knock on him, but a stud pitcher is hard to find, and we have our first stud pitcher since I don't know when.

I consider Aaron Harang a stud pitcher. Before Aaron...let's see...probably Jose Rijo of the early 90's. Before Rijo....Mario Soto and Tom Seaver.

schmidty622
05-23-2008, 11:32 AM
I was one of the few who didn't like the trade of Hamilton, but consider this. You simply do not trade an every day player, one who will play in 150 + ( I know if is body holds up because of substance abuse) for a pitcher (Volquez who has been great) that will play in 30-35 games all year. Just doesn't make sense to me. Look at what Hamilton is doing, leading mvp contender, driving in runs at record pace and the Reds are no better. Just imagine what an outfield the Reds could have had in the years to come. I will never like this deal!!

How bout next time you write this in an existing thread about Hamilton, that way everybody knows not to read it because we don't care what your views about Hamilton are. The trade happened, get over it.

captainmorgan07
05-23-2008, 11:43 AM
Aren't we all sick of going over and over this trade. Were both winners in the deal. We had a surplus of outfielders and we needed pitching. We made the deal. It works well for both teams.

ChatterRed
05-23-2008, 12:02 PM
How bout next time you write this in an existing thread about Hamilton, that way everybody knows not to read it because we don't care what your views about Hamilton are. The trade happened, get over it.


I think you may be sent to banned camp for that retort. Yikes. Lighten up, Francis! :thumbdown

Lockdwn11
05-23-2008, 12:04 PM
The title of this thread should read "Volquez Trade"

Hondo
05-23-2008, 12:11 PM
Is there anyway Redszone can make a "Josh Hamilton" Posting area next to the "Sun Deck"

That would solve 99% of the problem.

:cool:

Orodle
05-23-2008, 08:56 PM
I was one of the few who didn't like the trade of Hamilton, but consider this. You simply do not trade an every day player, one who will play in 150 + ( I know if is body holds up because of substance abuse) for a pitcher (Volquez who has been great) that will play in 30-35 games all year. Just doesn't make sense to me. Look at what Hamilton is doing, leading mvp contender, driving in runs at record pace and the Reds are no better. Just imagine what an outfield the Reds could have had in the years to come. I will never like this deal!!

really, are you serious?

Nuxhall41
05-23-2008, 09:21 PM
Just imagine if Volquez were 3-3 with a 5.00 ERA.

jmac
05-23-2008, 09:46 PM
I am taking this quote off another thread since it concerns Hamilton:
It's laughable that people actually think a starting pitcher is more valuable than someone winning the triple crown right now. It's absurd really.

My response:
Someone winning triple crown wouldnt mean much with Belisle and Fogg in rotation.
What is funny is all along, redszone has said trade this or that for pitching. We traded for pitching and the guy we traded is off to great start and some want him back.
Do we trade Dunn to a team where guys get on base like Hammy's mates do and watch Dunn hit 45 hr and drive in 135 and want him back too ?
Basically we want the guy we get to do great and the "other" guy to stink to make us feel better about the trade.
Yes the thought of Bruce/Hamilton in the OF does sound enticing but again...not so much with a rotation of Belisle/Fogg.
With Volquez here and Hamilton there, maybe if we concentrate on picking up Kinsler/Young from Texas in a swap for Patterson/Janish, our #3-5 guys will have some chances like Hamilton is getting right now.

OSUredsFAN
05-23-2008, 11:15 PM
Just imagine if Volquez were 3-3 with a 5.00 ERA.

just imagine if Hamilton had 5 HR with 20 RBI, what is your point? How many threads do we need involving this trade.

Nuxhall41
05-23-2008, 11:32 PM
just imagine if Hamilton had 5 HR with 20 RBI, what is your point? How many threads do we need involving this trade.

Apparently it went over your head. That was my point. Just imagine how many threads there would be if Volquez were 3-3 with a 5.00 ERA. Say a prayer of thanks that Volquez is dealing.

Kingspoint
05-24-2008, 01:49 AM
I was one of the few who didn't like the trade of Hamilton, but consider this. You simply do not trade an every day player, one who will play in 150 + ( I know if is body holds up because of substance abuse) for a pitcher (Volquez who has been great) that will play in 30-35 games all year. Just doesn't make sense to me. Look at what Hamilton is doing, leading mvp contender, driving in runs at record pace and the Reds are no better. Just imagine what an outfield the Reds could have had in the years to come. I will never like this deal!!


That same pitcher that makes those starts versus that batter who plays those games is responsible for more plate appearances. The pitcher faces about 720-750 PA's where the player faces about 620-650 PA's. That alone is why the pitcher is more valuable.

We got an ERA/Strikeout/Wins leader for a Triple Crown leader. That alone is simply amazing. It's got to be the 1st Time in the history of baseball trades.

Orodle
05-24-2008, 12:07 PM
That same pitcher that makes those starts versus that batter who plays those games is responsible for more plate appearances. The pitcher faces about 720-750 PA's where the player faces about 620-650 PA's. That alone is why the pitcher is more valuable.

We got an ERA/Strikeout/Wins leader for a Triple Crown leader. That alone is simply amazing. It's got to be the 1st Time in the history of baseball trades.

Great way to put it in perspective :thumbup:

You can have a great hitting team and play well but to be a championship team you have to have pitching and pitching is harder to find. I still love this deal. Would like Hamilton, but crazy for Volquez.

gilpdawg
05-24-2008, 03:34 PM
You simply do not trade an every day player, one who will play in 150 + ( I know if is body holds up because of substance abuse) for a pitcher (Volquez who has been great) that will play in 30-35 games all year.
And why exactly is that?

Ya think the Mets are regretting trading Nolan Ryan for Jim Fregosi? After all, Ryan only pitched in 35 games/year.

Volquez VORP-28.0
Hamilton VORP-26.5

The difference is negligible. I'll take Volquez in the long run.

Hondo
05-24-2008, 03:39 PM
And why exactly is that?

Ya think the Mets are regretting trading Nolan Ryan for Jim Fregosi? After all, Ryan only pitched in 35 games/year.

Yeah, but Jim Fregosi Managed the Phillies to the World Series in 1993, so there...

:cool:

Orodle
05-24-2008, 03:55 PM
You simply do not trade an every day player, one who will play in 150 + ( I know if is body holds up because of substance abuse) for a pitcher

this is Jim Bowden type talk

lidspinner
05-24-2008, 10:57 PM
you just simply cannot compare this trade untill 3-5 years down the road. I mean you can but these are all opinion untill we can get some long term stats to compare.
I too did not like the trade and I am still on the fence.....I just think that it is sooooo HARD to find GOOD starting pitching nowadays that you have to make that trade 9 times out of 10.....I am just still not 100% sold on that theory

Kingspoint
05-25-2008, 12:12 AM
you just simply cannot compare this trade untill 3-5 years down the road. I mean you can but these are all opinion untill we can get some long term stats to compare.
I too did not like the trade and I am still on the fence.....I just think that it is sooooo HARD to find GOOD starting pitching nowadays that you have to make that trade 9 times out of 10.....I am just still not 100% sold on that theory

You can't compare this trade 3-5 years down the road because elitest redszoners won't let you talk about it without throwing their comment out there, "I'm tired of hearing about...."