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View Full Version : Kearns and Lopez



UPRedsFan
05-28-2008, 11:55 AM
Just happened to notice Kearns is hitting below .200 and Lopez is at .243 and they have 4 homeruns between them. Can't wait to see Thompson. Thank you Wayne!

muethibp
05-28-2008, 12:16 PM
Who knows whether Wayne viewed that trade as dumping Kearns and Lopez who were undeserving of the huge raises they were about to get? Somehow I find that a little unlikely, I think he thought he was giving value to get value. But, as it turned out, we were better off making the trade simply because it allowed us to move bad players and not have to pay their salary.

SarasotaFan
05-28-2008, 12:28 PM
Anyone ever heard of the saying "it'll all even out in the end?"

as it stands now Kearns is a career .261 hitter with about 15+ dingers each year. don't read into anything just cause he's hitting sub .200 right now. barring injuries (he's on the DL right now) his average will come back up. he'll get hot once he's healthy. it's just how things seem to work out....

44Magnum
05-28-2008, 12:36 PM
I don't know. I think Kearns peaked. He is lazy and it showed.
Lopez is what he is.
I can't help but think about the possibilities of nutritional supplements with those two.

SarasotaFan
05-28-2008, 12:37 PM
I don't know. I think Kearns peaked. He is lazy and it showed.
Lopez is what he is.
I can't help but think about the possibilities of nutritional supplements with those two.

you think they should have been included in the Mitchell Report ?

muethibp
05-28-2008, 01:04 PM
Anyone ever heard of the saying "it'll all even out in the end?"

as it stands now Kearns is a career .261 hitter with about 15+ dingers each year. don't read into anything just cause he's hitting sub .200 right now. barring injuries (he's on the DL right now) his average will come back up. he'll get hot once he's healthy. it's just how things seem to work out....

Maybe so, but it's hard to suggest that the Reds are missing either of them very much.

ChatterRed
05-28-2008, 01:50 PM
Who knows whether Wayne viewed that trade as dumping Kearns and Lopez who were undeserving of the huge raises they were about to get? Somehow I find that a little unlikely, I think he thought he was giving value to get value. But, as it turned out, we were better off making the trade simply because it allowed us to move bad players and not have to pay their salary.

I disagree. It was said at the time of the trade that it was partially a salary dump because the Reds weren't going to pay them the raises they had coming.

muethibp
05-28-2008, 01:50 PM
I disagree. It was said at the time of the trade that it was partially a salary dump because the Reds weren't going to pay them the raises they had coming.

I don't remember that but I take your word for it.

Hondo
05-28-2008, 03:39 PM
I still think we got crap for what we gave at the time.

The Snow Chief
05-28-2008, 04:29 PM
I still think we got crap for what we gave at the time.


I don't know man, Bray was a pretty damn good prospect. Former first rounder and a lefty. I would have given Lopez for him straight up now and then. It was apparent that Lopez can't play SS effectively and his bat no longer looks good when it is at another IF position.

Kearns and Wagner for Majewski, Thompson, that guy that is now with the Rays (forget his name), and Clayton seems fair to me, even back then. Kearns was getting ready to get very expensive relative to his production.

I thought the trade was at least a wash at the time and it is now looking like the Reds were the clear winners (even if Bray is only an average lefty and Thompson only develops to be a 5th starter).

Orodle
05-28-2008, 04:31 PM
Reds got the best out of that deal! Bray still has some promise and Thompson will be a major league pitcher. Where are all those ripping that trade now?

Hondo
05-28-2008, 04:47 PM
Reds got the best out of that deal! Bray still has some promise and Thompson will be a major league pitcher. Where are all those ripping that trade now?

Right here...

Kingspoint
05-28-2008, 05:09 PM
Anyone ever heard of the saying "it'll all even out in the end?"

as it stands now Kearns is a career .261 hitter with about 15+ dingers each year. don't read into anything just cause he's hitting sub .200 right now. barring injuries (he's on the DL right now) his average will come back up. he'll get hot once he's healthy. it's just how things seem to work out....

It just proves that 85% of REDSZONERS never knew what they were talking about to begin with when it comes to evaluating trades. They usually fail to see the value in how difficult it is to try to obtain good pitching and that you have to take more chances in order to get good pitching than you do good hitting.

LouisvilleCARDS
05-28-2008, 05:20 PM
Is this thing ever going to be put to rest? It's over, done with ,ancient history. They got two overpaid players to join their stable of crappy ex-Reds, and we got a hot prospect in Thompson who is tearing it up.

Lockdwn11
05-28-2008, 05:22 PM
I liked the trade back then and I love the trade right now.

Hondo
05-28-2008, 05:50 PM
Is this thing ever going to be put to rest? It's over, done with ,ancient history. They got two overpaid players to join their stable of crappy ex-Reds, and we got a hot prospect in Thompson who is tearing it up.

It was a terrible trade. The whole point was to improve the Bull Pen to help the team win the wild card, oh and then we recieved "banged up" merchandise (Majic) and the relievers Imploded.

At the time: Cincinnati gave up an All-Star SS in Felipe Lopez, and a OF in Austin Kearns that was "supposed" to hit .300 with 25-30 dingers and drive in 100 rbi year with 40 doubles...

Billy Beane would have gotton a truck load for those guys... It is worse than the Sean Casey for Dave Williams TRADE.

Well, both FL and AK have not ever been as productive as they were here, but at the time. That was a BAD, BAD trade...

If we are being honest... Everyone here feels better because Lopez and Kearns have sucked in Washington. Admit it!

UPRedsFan
05-28-2008, 06:22 PM
Being honest... It's affirmation now for my feeling at the time that the trade was a good one. I'll admit I expected Majewski to be better. But I still liked the trade because I never really liked Kearns for his lack of offense or Lopez for his poor defense.

durl
05-28-2008, 06:22 PM
The Reds are better because of the trade so it was a good one in my book. It didn't produce the immediate results we wanted but it did end up good for the Reds. Lopez needed to go because he had reverted to his career averages and was an error-prone fielder.

In the long run, we ended up with Keppinger in the infield and Bruce in the outfield. I like how things turned out.

ChatterRed
05-28-2008, 07:52 PM
I liked the trade back then and I love the trade right now.

Great trade. One of the best in Reds history. :D

ChatterRed
05-28-2008, 07:55 PM
It was a terrible trade. The whole point was to improve the Bull Pen to help the team win the wild card, oh and then we recieved "banged up" merchandise (Majic) and the relievers Imploded.

At the time: Cincinnati gave up an All-Star SS in Felipe Lopez, and a OF in Austin Kearns that was "supposed" to hit .300 with 25-30 dingers and drive in 100 rbi year with 40 doubles...

Billy Beane would have gotton a truck load for those guys... It is worse than the Sean Casey for Dave Williams TRADE.

Well, both FL and AK have not ever been as productive as they were here, but at the time. That was a BAD, BAD trade...

If we are being honest... Everyone here feels better because Lopez and Kearns have sucked in Washington. Admit it!

I read somewhere that the Reds were 82-80 at the halfway mark and that the top 4 hitters on the team went into the tank and hit something like less than .200 combined the rest of the season. It was also mentioned that those blaming the pitching completely that fact and still blame it on the pitching to this day.

Maybe the trade for bullpen help didn't matter since our hitters went into the tank? Huh. :thumbup:

Hondo
05-28-2008, 08:07 PM
I read somewhere that the Reds were 82-80 at the halfway mark and that the top 4 hitters on the team went into the tank and hit something like less than .200 combined the rest of the season. It was also mentioned that those blaming the pitching completely that fact and still blame it on the pitching to this day.

Maybe the trade for bullpen help didn't matter since our hitters went into the tank? Huh. :thumbup:

The trade took out 2 of the "hitters"

The whole Trade messed up the Reds chances for postseason. Pitching wasn't improved and it limited the offense... Royce Clayton was the Starting SS the rest of the year.

I repeat: Royce Clayton!

justincredible
05-29-2008, 08:17 AM
I liked the trade back then and I love the trade right now.

+1.

ChatterRed
05-29-2008, 08:59 AM
The trade took out 2 of the "hitters"

The whole Trade messed up the Reds chances for postseason. Pitching wasn't improved and it limited the offense... Royce Clayton was the Starting SS the rest of the year.

I repeat: Royce Clayton!

I believe it was Dunn and Griffey who hit less than .200 the rest of the way. I had the 4 hitters part wrong.

I also remember Kearns and Lopez cooling off alot for the Nats the rest of the way.

The point is, had Magic and Bray been healthy and contributed, the sucky offense would have lost games anyway.

Face it, with or without that trade, the Reds were going nowhere fast that year.

Get over it.

The Snow Chief
05-29-2008, 10:54 AM
I read somewhere that the Reds were 82-80 at the halfway mark and that the top 4 hitters on the team went into the tank and hit something like less than .200 combined the rest of the season. It was also mentioned that those blaming the pitching completely that fact and still blame it on the pitching to this day.

Maybe the trade for bullpen help didn't matter since our hitters went into the tank? Huh. :thumbup:


You are right, I did a write up on this and then my friend posted it on his baseball blog. The Reds actually improved their record for the first month after the trade and got close to even with the Cards at the end of August. In September, the whole team collapsed at the plate. Dunn, Griffey, EE, Phillips, Hatte, and Ross. If memory serves me correctly, all six of the other position players hit something like a combined .200 in September of 2006. Meanwhile, Deno (the guy who replaced Freel) and Aurilla (who replaced the ineffective SS Clayton for the majority of starts in September) had productive months at the plate. There is simply no truth to the assertion that the loss of Kearns and Lopez's bats cost us in September. It was everyone else's bat. If the trade had not been made, the Reds would have been sitting at home in 06 just as they did after the trade. Look at the numbers.

The only argument that can be made against the trade is that the Reds should have gotten better return at the time. Many people feel that way but there is no way of telling what other teams were willing to offer for those two. Perhaps their scouts saw the same defects that WK did. What can't be debated is that it did not alter the run in '06 and that the Reds are a better organization now for making the trade.

Hondo
05-29-2008, 01:37 PM
I believe it was Dunn and Griffey who hit less than .200 the rest of the way. I had the 4 hitters part wrong.

I also remember Kearns and Lopez cooling off alot for the Nats the rest of the way.

The point is, had Magic and Bray been healthy and contributed, the sucky offense would have lost games anyway.

Face it, with or without that trade, the Reds were going nowhere fast that year.

Get over it.

I am over it.

The point is, at the "time"... the Reds got nothing for their players... I don't care if Felipe and Austin cooled off the rest of the way... I don't care if it saved the team money... The 2 players we traded should have gotton more than the scrap heap we got... Including an injured ball player?

I am over it... Not clinging to it... My point is that the Reds wasted players and got minimal in return... If thompson ends up being a servicable major league pitcher, everyone will say, Reds won that one! But the fact is that he was a throw in, and if he does make a legit Starter, the Reds will have been like a Blind Squirrel finding a "Nut"

ChatterRed
05-29-2008, 02:13 PM
How did they waste players if Lopez and Kearns sucked the rest of that season and have sucked ever since? They would have sucked whether they had stayed and played for the Reds or been traded. And figuring how they went into the tank, and how Junior and Dunn also went into the tank.........NONE OF IT MATTERS. LOL. The trade is a wash at worst or best and Thompson's success could give the Reds the upper hand in that trade.

As for "at the time the Reds got nothing for their players"........the same could very easily be argued for what the Nats got in return, not to mention they are paying Kearns and Lopez's salaries. The Reds aren't paying much for Magic and Bray.

I still think the results in the standings would have been the same either way. I also am glad the Reds unloaded those two chumps and their salaries. Bray is better than either Kearns or Lopez by himself. Thompson could be a future major league starter.

smoke6
05-29-2008, 02:17 PM
I'm pretty happy with where we are right now (without Kearns and Lopez).

Ghosts of 1990
05-29-2008, 07:06 PM
hated to see Kearns go, but I was blinded. He's one of the most disappointing and enigmatic players I've ever had the pleasure of propping up non stop and hyping.