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View Full Version : Is it time to trade Arroyo?



red-in-la
06-06-2008, 02:24 PM
Since the Reds seem to be spinning their wheels between 5th and 6th place, I think it is time to trade Arroyo for whatever the Reds can get and bring up Thompson or Maloney.

Thoughts?

flyer85
06-06-2008, 02:25 PM
said a few weeks ago that it would be a good time to see if they could fill some holes by dealing Arroyo, Encarnacion and Bailey.

*BaseClogger*
06-06-2008, 02:25 PM
The Reds should start fielding offers, but wait a little bit longer to determine whether or not they are sellers because they still might have a chance at the Wild Card (or at least let the fans think that)...

KronoRed
06-06-2008, 02:28 PM
said a few weeks ago that it would be a good time to see if they could fill some holes by dealing Arroyo, Encarnacion and Bailey.

Too early to admit this season is a lost cause, bad for attendance, better to wait for the Bruce spike to wear off.

flyer85
06-06-2008, 02:32 PM
Too early to admit this season is a lost cause, bad for attendance, better to wait for the Bruce spike to wear off.I honestly think you could deal those three and possibly improve the team.

Jpup
06-06-2008, 02:33 PM
it's past time. It won't matter because the Reds continue to amaze me at their unwillingness to put the best players on the field at all times. I truly believe they would be a lot more successful if they would.

Spring~Fields
06-06-2008, 03:09 PM
Since the Reds seem to be spinning their wheels between 5th and 6th place, I think it is time to trade Arroyo for whatever the Reds can get and bring up Thompson or Maloney.

Thoughts?

As soon as Jocketty and his staff are comfortable that Maloney and Thompson are ready, I think they are now, but, I am just a fan without the information available to Jocketty and staff.

I think that Jocketty will entertain thoughts of trading Arroyo and perhaps link that with what flyer85 is saying in Arroyo, Encarncion, Bailey to utilize them for upgrading the team.

SMcGavin
06-06-2008, 03:21 PM
No. He has pitched better than his numbers indicate, and those high numbers lessen his value. Besides, aren't we trying to win in 2009? Arroyo is a pretty big part of that and I'm not ready to rely on two of Bailey/Maloney/Thompson all season long in the rotation.

PuffyPig
06-06-2008, 03:35 PM
said a few weeks ago that it would be a good time to see if they could fill some holes by dealing Arroyo, Encarnacion and Bailey.


Perhaps you could trade them to fill the 3 holes trading them would create?

flyer85
06-06-2008, 03:36 PM
Perhaps you could trade them to fill the 3 holes trading them would create?maybe trading them doesn't create 3 holes ... but filling their roles could be through the trades or through internal means.

fearofpopvol1
06-06-2008, 03:50 PM
I just don't see the Reds dealing him. Whether they should or not is another question. The guy has been the face of the franchise this year. He's all over the JTM commercials, there's that huge billboard or whatever it is near the ballpark of him. I just don't see it this year.

KronoRed
06-06-2008, 03:54 PM
I honestly think you could deal those three and possibly improve the team.

Try and sell that to the beat writers and radio guys who would riot because the Reds are 'selling off the stars'

flyer85
06-06-2008, 03:55 PM
I just don't see it this year.Don't necessarily either but a good GM would explore the opportunities and if the right deal came along ... then pull the trigger. I think that Jocketty might be able to deal him to the Mets for a good return.

edabbs44
06-06-2008, 03:58 PM
The boat has left on dealing Arroyo. He might have had some pretty good value if they didn't extend him so early.

icehole3
06-06-2008, 04:02 PM
I just don't see the Reds dealing him. Whether they should or not is another question. The guy has been the face of the franchise this year. He's all over the JTM commercials, there's that huge billboard or whatever it is near the ballpark of him. I just don't see it this year.


that billboard is time warner's

Will M
06-06-2008, 04:03 PM
imo arroyo is movable in the right deal. i would not move him just to move him however. plus his numbers this year look bad due to his ugly april so his value might be lower than it should be.

walt has been about as informative on what his long term plan is as was wayne

RedsManRick
06-06-2008, 04:11 PM
Unless you clarify how his salary is going to be used, I don't see the purpose in trading him. He's still clearly one of the best 5 starters on the staff, probably #3, at worst #4. If trading him let's you extend Dunn or acquire a good catcher or CF, then by all means. But his value isn't terribly high at the moment. Now is no more the time than anytime else if the right deal comes along.

Chip R
06-06-2008, 04:22 PM
imo arroyo is movable in the right deal. i would not move him just to move him however.


I would agree. Don't trade him just to get rid of his salary but if the right deal is out there, Walt would be a fool not to seriously consider it.

*BaseClogger*
06-06-2008, 04:40 PM
I agree it greatly depends on the return. With the market for starting pitchers, who knows if the Reds could bring back a haul that improves other facets of the team. Remember, half a season of Kyle Lohse brought in Matt Maloney...

Will M
06-06-2008, 04:55 PM
1. how do the 2008 Reds look come July?

2. how has Homer pitched?

3. is Thompson doing well in AAA ( or in the bigs) ?

4. how is Arroyo pitching?

IF Arroyo is pitching well & 2 out of 3 of Cueto/Bailey/Thompson look like they can be counted on & the 2008 reds are out of it & the return for arroyo looks good THEN by all means move him. a lot of IFs.

mth123
06-06-2008, 08:37 PM
Anyone can be traded in the right deal. If the Reds deal Arroyo, they could go through an awful lot of Paul Wilson's, Jimmy Haynes's, and Ramon Ortiz's to relace him. It would cost more than he makes to get some one on the market that isn't as good. He'd better net at least two building blocks if you deal him.

kaldaniels
06-06-2008, 10:29 PM
I stay put on this rotation for the next 2 years. If Thompson/Maloney/whoever knocks our socks off...then we look at who we could deal and what return it would net. Arroyo's not this bad, Volquez is great, but won't be superman forever. Bailey and Cueto just need a year in the bigs.

Just my opinion but by the end of the year this staff will be seasoned and the Reds will have the best 1-5 in the majors in 2009. Enjoy the ride.

Marc D
06-08-2008, 08:52 PM
Look at all the positives that are coming now from having a well stocked farm system. Playing a little moneyball from here on out to keep it well stocked will determine if we have a nice long run of future success or just another 1999 here and there.

You have multiple guys who could be ready to give you similar production for less money very soon. You would get payflex that one can only hope is spent wisely. You could also very well get a nice haul in terms of prospects from a desperate contender.

Don't give him away and don't do it just for a salary dump but by all means yes, trade him for a decent offer.

The real question in my mind is do you move Harang or Cordero if someone offers a kings ransom? The exact details of that ransom are obviously the key but if its a bunch of near MLB ready young talent I say yes.

Highlifeman21
06-08-2008, 09:45 PM
I honestly think you could deal those three and possibly improve the team.

Arroyo and Bailey, definitely yes. Moving those 2 I could easily see making us a better team. I realize Bailey's young and still could develop, but I don't want to put the majority of the Reds' eggs in his basket.

EE is the wildcard, b/c who would play 3B? I don't wanna see Hairston or Keppinger play the hot corner, and I definitely don't want to see Freel man the position.

Benihana
06-08-2008, 09:48 PM
1. how do the 2008 Reds look come July?

2. how has Homer pitched?

3. is Thompson doing well in AAA ( or in the bigs) ?

4. how is Arroyo pitching?

IF Arroyo is pitching well & 2 out of 3 of Cueto/Bailey/Thompson look like they can be counted on & the 2008 reds are out of it & the return for arroyo looks good THEN by all means move him. a lot of IFs.

I agree with this. However I'd rather promote Maloney than Thompson. Thompson IMO would be well served by pitching out the remainder of the season in Louisville. Maloney on the other hand is ready for his shot. I'd like to see Bailey show that he can stick in the bigs before I'd move Arroyo however, and I'd also like to see Arroyo string together a few nice starts to increase his value.

If the Reds are more than ten games back at the ASBreak and Homer hasn't pitched his way back to Louisville, I would start to seriously consider offers on Arroyo. However, I don't move him unless we get a serious upgrade for now and the future at CF, SS, or C. Guys like Taylor Teagarden, Max Ramirez, Erick Aybar, Carlos Triunfel, etc. are who I'd be targeting in a return.

HokieRed
06-08-2008, 10:34 PM
Too bad we didn't trade Arroyo last year for Maloney and resign Lohse. Lohse was, by the way, one of three pitchers from the Reds organization last year to win major league games today: Lohse is now 7-2 with a 3.92 for the Cardinals, Dumatrait got another win, now 3-3 with a 3.44 for the Bucs, and Carlos Guevara got his first major league win today too. The sum total of our return for those three players--Maloney--struggled again today for Louisville. With an ERA around 4.5, it's hard to see what makes him ready to pitch in Cincinnati.

jojo
06-09-2008, 09:34 AM
I think it's begging the question to plan jettisoning Arroyo because of the presence of Homer. It's downright silly to decide that Maloney and Thompson make Arroyo expendable. No pitching prospect is a sure thing especially one that has a injury history (i.e. to any part that is essential to mechanics be it shoulder, arm, elbow, knee etc) or one that has lackluster stuff-especially one that is kicking a door in AAA, it's just the one to the bathroom stall.

Arroyo's contract isn't a "bad one" like Milton's was (which had no chance of working out). Arroyo's contract simply is a risky one where the upside is that he's paid pretty much what he's worth. There's a reasonable expectation that he'll be worth it over the next two years based upon his peripherals, his arsenal and his rubber arm. Also there's an out for the third year if he's obviously not a good risk at that point (or if the young arms do develop and it's obvious the Reds have cheaper options).

fearofpopvol1
06-09-2008, 12:44 PM
I think it's begging the question to plan jettisoning Arroyo because of the presence of Homer. It's downright silly to decide that Maloney and Thompson make Arroyo expendable. No pitching prospect is a sure thing especially one that has a injury history (i.e. to any part that is essential to mechanics be it shoulder, arm, elbow, knee etc) or one that has lackluster stuff-especially one that is kicking a door in AAA, it's just the one to the bathroom stall.

Arroyo's contract isn't a "bad one" like Milton's was (which had no chance of working out). Arroyo's contract simply is a risky one where the upside is that he's paid pretty much what he's worth. There's a reasonable expectation that he'll be worth it over the next two years based upon his peripherals, his arsenal and his rubber arm. Also there's an out for the third year if he's obviously not a good risk at that point (or if the young arms do develop and it's obvious the Reds have cheaper options).

I agree completely.

The other thing to consider too is since he's had a rough stretch (or a couple now), his value is at an all time low right now. Wouldn't you at least want to see him put together some good starts (which I have no doubt he'll do again) before you move him?