PDA

View Full Version : anyone willing to grade the 2008 Draft???



icehole3
06-07-2008, 10:57 AM
I'm by no means an expert and I pretty much depend on you guys Doug Dirt, OBM, WV Red, MarioRijo you guys do a great job posting good sound info, I was just wondering if you guys feel as good as I do about the draft? Ive been praying that the Reds would draft pitchers in the first 5 rounds and then draft the best power hitters they could find, so Im tickled pink and have absolutely no complaints. Every year I would like the early round focus to be on good solid pitching and then power hitters and I dont care what position they play because if a guy can slug teams will either want that guy in a trade or you can find a spot for him. So of course just looking at the top 10 picks (4 out of first 6 pitchers) I give this team an A+.

http://www.sternfannetwork.com/forum/images/smilies/Big/bigthumbup.gif

dougdirt
06-07-2008, 02:01 PM
I am not thrilled so much about the middle rounds, but if they can sign two of the high school pitchers they took between rounds 15 and 50, it would get a significant upgrade. Again though, its too early to give it much of a grade because it all depends on who signs.

RedlegJake
06-07-2008, 02:17 PM
IMO, the draft isn't over until Aug 15th when we see who actually signed. I agree with Doug that the draft could be pretty strong if they sign some of the later round fliers like Peterson. Realistically, I don't see the Reds offering much over slot money, though so I'm not real hopeful there.

Mario-Rijo
06-07-2008, 02:22 PM
It's early like DD said but even more than that the Reds have a proclivity for drafting somewhat seldom used arms (i.e. fresh arms) so they are usually tough to gauge until they have had some time in the system.

I think it's fair to say though that the Reds are definitely in search mode for bullpen arms and leadoff hitter/cf/ss types, which is a need throughout the system. And I know you are not supposed to draft for need persay but it looks as though they have to some extent. I felt they perhaps chose some suspect guys to fit a position(s) of need when there was some higher ceiling types ava. But I have very limited info to base that on so I'll just say that's my opinion.

So based on that I would grade their philosophy and not what they got. I would say their philosphy is a B-/C+ overall and in this instance if you put a gun to my head.

RedsManRick
06-07-2008, 02:23 PM
When we look at drafts in retrospect, we're usually pretty happy if we get two decent major leaguers out of it. Anything after the 15th round is really a shot in the dark. It will be interesting to see how things pan out.

fearofpopvol1
06-07-2008, 02:30 PM
Day 1...I'd probably give the Reds an A-/B+ just based on talent and projectability. Day 2, I was not so impressed. I know a lot of it is a crapshoot, but I thought they could've done better. I'd probably give day 2 a C/C-. Of course, actually signing the players trump everything else.

RedlegJake
06-07-2008, 02:49 PM
Day 1...I'd probably give the Reds an A-/B+ just based on talent and projectability. Day 2, I was not so impressed. I know a lot of it is a crapshoot, but I thought they could've done better. I'd probably give day 2 a C/C-. Of course, actually signing the players trump everything else.

I'd agree with that immediate impression. Who they sign in Day 2 is what could change that grade significantly. There are a couple guys who are almost certain to go to college, imo, that could change everything if they signed. Of course, that's true of about every team's 2nd day draft.

lollipopcurve
06-07-2008, 03:03 PM
For me, it's Alonso and cross your fingers another player or two emerges. The lack of a 2nd rounder and no supplementals puts this draft behind a bit, at least out of the gate. As others have noted, let's see how well they do getting them signed.

I'd love to see Sappelt or Means show something, and I'm curious about the Cline kid, but for the most part the amateur haul so far this year (Latin signings still to come in July) comes down to two players for me -- Alonso and Duran.

icehole3
08-16-2008, 06:36 AM
Im going to call this draft and additions to the minors an A+, I love all the pitchers added thru the draft and the Jr-Dunn trades and the power of Alonso is a bonus pick IMO, next year I hope they use their top 5 picks on flame throwing type pitchers

icehole3
08-16-2008, 07:38 AM
my top 10 as of 8-16-08

Alonso
Bailey
Frazier
Stubbs
Soto
Lotzkar
Owings
Thompson
Mesoraco
Duran

RedEye
08-16-2008, 08:50 AM
my top 10 as of 8-16-08

Alonso
Bailey
Frazier
Stubbs
Soto
Lotzkar
Owings
Thompson
Mesoraco
Duran

So Yorman Rodriguez falls just off the list?

camisadelgolf
08-16-2008, 08:58 AM
I'm not sure what you're using to qualify players, but for the record, Micah Owings isn't a rookie this year, and Homer Bailey is currently in his rookie year.

Without thinking about it too much, here's my current top ten:

1. Yonder Alonso
2. Todd Frazier
3. Juan Duran
4. Yorman Rodriguez
5. Kyle Lotzkar
6. Drew Stubbs
7. Daryl Thompson
8. Devin Mesoraco
9. Danny Dorn
10. Neftali Soto

. . . and a ton of honorable mentions.

redhawk61
08-16-2008, 09:50 AM
1.Alonso
2.Soto
3.Frazier
4.Stubbs
5.Lotzkar
6.Mesoraco
7.Valaika
8.Josh Roenicke
9.Henry
10.Stewart/Fransisco

Duran and Yorman would make the list, but to young right now to consider for the list for me

redhawk61
08-16-2008, 09:54 AM
regardless, after losing the big 4 from this list, it seems Buckley and company have revamped and restocked our farm system, and have probably secured our spot at least in the top 10 again, maybe even top 5:thumbup:

lollipopcurve
08-16-2008, 10:19 AM
08 draft = safe

Alonso and Stewart are nearly finished products -- seeing as how one is a 1B and the other a relief pitcher, the only chasnce they become true core players is if Alonso emerges as a middle of the lineup force and Stewart emerges as a closer -- if not, it's still likely you'll still get something out of both. Also great to see them successfully throw money at a couple of tough late round signs

It works well in balance with the higher risk investments in Latin America

jesusfan
08-16-2008, 10:27 AM
No Valaika??

icehole3
08-16-2008, 10:45 AM
No Valaika??

Its hard to crack the top 10.

icehole3
08-16-2008, 10:50 AM
I'm not sure what you're using to qualify players, but for the record, Micah Owings isn't a rookie this year, and Homer Bailey is currently in his rookie year.

Without thinking about it too much, here's my current top ten:

1. Yonder Alonso
2. Todd Frazier
3. Juan Duran
4. Yorman Rodriguez
5. Kyle Lotzkar
6. Drew Stubbs
7. Daryl Thompson
8. Devin Mesoraco
9. Danny Dorn
10. Neftali Soto

. . . and a ton of honorable mentions.

First its my list and its a list of guys not in major leagues, if Belisle was kicking booty I'd put him in there, like I said its my list of prospects. Yorman and Duran although theyre all world I wanna reserve some judgement on them right now I think they in the next tier though.

lollipopcurve
08-16-2008, 10:51 AM
For me, at first glance and in no particular order:

Frazier, Valaika, Stubbs, Alonso, Heisey, Stewart, Roenicke, Soto, Francisco, Dickerson

note: with Buck, Lotzkar and Mesoraco on the periphery, the organization is looking quite healthy right now (and I agree that Duran and Yorman are too young to rate)

princeton
08-16-2008, 11:02 AM
top 10 has been better.

but top 30 might turn out to be the best ever. It's the most expensive ever, by far. Mother lode or rathole? We won't know until some of these guys are oldd enough to actually graduate from high school.

princeton
08-16-2008, 11:12 AM
08 draft = safe

Alonso and Stewart are nearly finished products -- seeing as how one is a 1B and the other a relief pitcher, the only chasnce they become true core players is if Alonso emerges as a middle of the lineup force and Stewart emerges as a closer -- if not, it's still likely you'll still get something out of both. Also great to see them successfully throw money at a couple of tough late round signs

It works well in balance with the higher risk investments in Latin America


it's an interesting thought. The Reds have been adding "safe" picks (high floors/low ceilings) for a couple of years now. Stubbs and Mesoraco play key positions so they don't have to hit a ton to impact, which is kind of a safe way to play things. this year, I certainly thought that the no. 5 pick sounded more like Sam Lecure than you'd want, but the Reds seem happy with Sam Lecure.

however, I think Alonso is different. the Reds expect a LOT out of Alonso, and hope that he's not high floor/low ceiling. If he's Sean Casey, they'll probably be disappointed. I know that I will.

dougdirt
08-16-2008, 11:31 AM
I am willing to now grade the Reds 2008 draft. With the signing of Fairel and Sulbaran to go along with Alonso, I give them a B+.

Degenerate39
08-16-2008, 11:50 AM
I'd go with a solid A-

Betterread
08-16-2008, 11:56 AM
I really like the Alonso and Stewart picks - they are safe and hit club needs directly.
I really like the LHP Howell and Sulbaran signings, but why don't the Reds just draft the best available talent in the first 10 rounds?
I don't have a clear read on Fairel, but for 250,000 why not see what he can do?
However, before giving a really good grade, I wish there was more talent. I think the Reds are looking at that talent in Latin AMerica and you have to respect that approach.
I'd give a B but I'm fairly confident that this draft will produce some major league players, so it's a solid B.

Grande Donkey
08-16-2008, 11:58 AM
I am willing to now grade the Reds 2008 draft. With the signing of Fairel and Sulbaran to go along with Alonso, I give them a B+.What would you give it if you added in the Duran, Rodriguez and Arias signings?

OnBaseMachine
08-16-2008, 12:12 PM
It's still very early to judge the draft but at least now we have an idea of who's in the fold and who's not. The Reds signed 34 of 49 picks and probably spent in upwards of 7.5 to 8 million dollars on the draft. My guess is the amount of signings and money spent both probably rank near the top in the majors. This draft saw the Reds go the safe route and draft polished players, and that tells me Jocketty and crew thinks this organization isn't too far from contending, and I agree with that assessment. Alonso and Zach Stewart both could probably see some time in Cincy by 2009. Alex Buchholz, David Sappelt, and Kyle Day were all interesting as college hitters. Buchholz has a chance at being a very good hitter down the road IMO. There were a couple other college relievers besides Zach Stewart drafted that I like in Blaine Howell and Mace Thurman. Both are lefties with quality stuff and both have pitched well to this point. What I really liked is that while there were plenty of safe picks, they also took some fliers and signed a few of them like Juan Carlos Sulbaran, Matt Fairel, Carter Morrison. All of those guys fell due to signability issues and the Reds still drafted and signed them. The combination of safe college picks who will move fast and some high school gems like Sulbaran and Morrison gives this draft a B+ in my book.

icehole3
08-16-2008, 01:09 PM
good analysis OBM, total agreement with that, Alonso makes this draft special IMO because they got some very good pitchers signed early and working in the minors for next year. Ive seen Fairel in the college world series he was the ace for Florida St and his fastball had a lot of movement seemed to be throwing in the 90-92 range, him and Thurman seemed to have similar stuff although Thurman is a reliever.

_Sir_Charles_
08-16-2008, 01:16 PM
I'd give it a solid 'A' because I'm looking at the entire haul...including Juan Duran, Yorman Rodriquez and Jr Arias. If you take out those 3...a solid 'B'.

Personally, I'm stunned by the dominance the Reds are showing in owning the Latin area. I can't remember the last time I saw real substance coming to the reds from OUTSIDE the US. VERY nice to see.

OnBaseMachine
08-16-2008, 01:50 PM
The Reds have become major players in not only the Dominican Republic and Venezuela but Canada as well. I know it's under different circumstances but they have become fairly big players in Canada in the last couple years. Last year they drafted five Canadians including two of their better pitching prospects in Kyle Lotzkar and Evan Hildenbrandt. This year they also grabbed Carter Morrison and were rumored to be interested in Brett Lawrie. They've also grabbed a few prospects from places like Taiwan, East Germany, Italy, and the Netherlands. It's so nice to see the Reds finally making their presence known in other countries and it's even better to see Castellini not being afraid to fork out the money to sign these prospects.

Blue
08-16-2008, 01:51 PM
Since I've turned into the resident knee-jerk pessimist lately, I'll give it an F+.