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OnBaseMachine
06-15-2008, 02:24 AM
West is best in FSL All-Star Game
Reds' Stubbs slugs two-run homer, wins MVP honors
By Lisa Winston / MLB.com

VIERA, Fla. - You've no doubt heard umpteen times that the Advanced Class A Florida State League is a pitchers' league. Well, the league's hitters were clearly hell-bent on making a mockery of that theory.

The teams combined for 12 runs on 23 hits Saturday, with the visiting West All Stars emerging victorious, 9-3, at the 47th annual Florida State League All-Star Game at Space Coast Stadium, home of the Brevard County Manatees.

Sarasota Reds outfielder Drew Stubbs earned Star of Stars MVP honors, going 1-for-3 with a two-run homer in the second inning.

"Both lineups had a lot of great hitters," said Stubbs, Cincinnati's top pick in the 2006 Draft out of Texas. "Some days the pitching is going to get the hitting and others it's vice-versa. It's one of those deals that can go either way, and tonight the bats just came alive."

The stage was set for offensive fireworks as leadoff hitter Brian Dinkelman of the Fort Myers Miracle (Twins) beat out an infield single off East starter Ryan Morse of the Vero Beach Devil Rays. Gus Milner of the Clearwater Threshers (Phillies) joined him on the bases by drawing a walk and, after moving to third base on a deep fly ball by Sarasota slugger Juan Francisco, Dinkelman scored the game's first run on a passed ball. Milner crossed the plate moments later when Blue Jays prospect J.P. Arencibia dunked an RBI single into right field.

The East responded quickly as Darren Ford of the Manatees led things off with a single and came around to score on a sacrifice fly to right by Palm Beach Cardinals cleanup hitter Tony Cruz.

With one out in the second against St. Lucie Mets right-hander Dylan Gee, Tampa Yankees outfielder James Cooper looped a soft liner to center for a single to set the stage for Stubbs' blast.

Known more for his speed than his power, Stubbs came into the game hitting .258 with three homers and 24 RBIs. But he hit a no-doubt-about-it shot off of Gee, whom he had faced recently when the Mets and Reds squared off. Stubbs didn't attribute his success Saturday night to that previous meeting, however.

"It was just one of many guys we faced during the year," he said. "It's not like I had a scouting report on him. I just saw good pitches and made good contact."

While most of the pitchers took their lumps to some degree, Clearwater's Edgar Garcia was not among them as he set down the East in order in the second and struck out Home Run Derby hero J.T. Hall for good measure. That unusual dominance earned him the game's Most Outstanding Pitcher award.

The score remained 4-1 until the fourth, when the East mounted its last big threat. The hosts scored a pair of runs as Jupiter Hammerheads (Marlins) first baseman Logan Morrison singled up the middle leading off and Cruz followed with a double to left. Hometown hero Taylor Green brought Morrison home with a groundout and Vero Beach's Cesar Suarez followed with a sacrifice fly to get the East within 4-3.

The West responded immediately in the fifth and never looked back. In one of the night's more unusual scoring scenarios, Cooper was hit by a pitch for the second time, this time iwith the bases loaded to make it 5-3.

In the sixth, Fort Myers' Danny Valencia put the game away and upped the lead to 7-3 when he laced a two-run triple to right field. For Valencia, who was 2-for-5, it was some redemption for a pair of earlier errors at third base.

The West added another run when Lakeland's Ryan Streiby singled home Valencia, then capped the scoring in the ninth on a leadoff homer by Lakeland's Cale Iorg.

The win went to West starter Rick Porcello of the Flying Tigers, who allowed one run on two hits in his lone inning. The 2007 first-round pick is in his debut pro season.

East starter Ryan Morse of the Devil Rays took the loss.

The West collected 13 hits, with Valencia, Dinkelman and Arencibia each picking up a pair. Every member of the starting lineup had at least one hit.

The East totaled 10 hits, with Morrison, Cruz and Daytona Cubs outfielder Jim Adduci registering two apiece.

http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080614&content_id=417144&vkey=news_l123&fext=.jsp&sid=l123

Homer Bailey
06-15-2008, 02:44 AM
Congrats Drew! Good luck in AA! (which should be soon.

crazyredfan40
06-15-2008, 10:11 AM
Hopefully it is either before Sarasota starts the second half or after the AA all-star game...

KoryMac5
06-15-2008, 10:16 AM
He's hitting .258 at Sarasota and has not impressed since being drafted. I know he has speed and plays his position well but those aren't enough to get a promotion to AA. I would want that average at around .280 or .200 before I would move him.

JaxRed
06-15-2008, 10:31 AM
And he's hitting .194 in his last 19 games, .206 in June and had a .196 average in May. No way does he deserve promotion.

dougdirt
06-15-2008, 10:51 AM
And he's hitting .194 in his last 19 games, .206 in June and had a .196 average in May. No way does he deserve promotion.

His BABIP over the last two months (May and June) have been well below where they should be based on his ball in play types. I think he should be moved up, but not just because of him. The guys in AA also deserve a move. Heisey should also go to AA.

BigRed07
06-15-2008, 10:56 AM
Congats to Stubby on winning the MVP!!!


West All-Stars
Player AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SO AVG
Dinkelman 2B 6 2 2 0 0 0 0 0 1 .333
Milner RF 4 2 1 0 0 0 0 1 0 .250
Valencia 3B 5 1 2 0 1 0 2 0 1 .400
Francisco DH 3 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 .333
Kunkel a- PH 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 .000
Arencibia C 3 1 2 0 0 0 1 0 0 .667
Ramos C 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 .000
Dopirak 1B 3 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 .333
Strieby b- PH 2 0 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 .500
Iorg SS 5 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 .200
Cooper LF 1 1 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 1.000
Heisey LF 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Stubbs CF 4 1 1 0 0 1 2 1 2 .250
Porcello P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Garcia P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Manship P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
O'Brien P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Slama P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Harker P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Geronimo P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
German P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Falkenbach P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Delaney P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000

Blue
06-15-2008, 11:44 AM
They should move him up based on his OBP. If he can maintain that OBP and play defense as advertised, he'll stick.

OnBaseMachine
06-15-2008, 11:46 AM
I would promote Stubbs to Chattanooga. It's time to see what they have in Stubbs. We need to get him to AA and find out what type of hitter Drew Stubbs can be.

Kc61
06-15-2008, 11:53 AM
His BABIP over the last two months (May and June) have been well below where they should be based on his ball in play types. I think he should be moved up, but not just because of him. The guys in AA also deserve a move. Heisey should also go to AA.

Let him go to AA already, maybe he can handle it. And congrats on winning this award.

But I hope he hits at AA. His hitting so far has been less than expected and it's been attributed mostly to injury, failure to choke up, monthly fluctuation, BABIP, the Florida State League, or other reasons.

Stubbs is an important prospect for the Reds since he is apparently defensively gifted, has good athleticism, and plays a key position. But the question is whether he can be expected to hit .280 with an .800 OPS at the major league level? (I'm not asking for .290 or .850, just .280 and .800.)

Or are we talking about a bottom of the order hitter in there primarily for defense?

fearofpopvol1
06-15-2008, 12:39 PM
Stubbs should absolutely go to AA. He's in a pitcher's friendly league.

It's time to see what he's made of. AA is going to make or break him.

Mario-Rijo
06-15-2008, 03:43 PM
Stubbs should absolutely go to AA. He's in a pitcher's friendly league.

It's time to see what he's made of. AA is going to make or break him.

Agreed, do it, do it, do it! :pimp:

Caveat Emperor
06-15-2008, 06:42 PM
And he's hitting .194 in his last 19 games, .206 in June and had a .196 average in May. No way does he deserve promotion.

At this point, I just give him the BJ Szymanski treatment -- push him through the organization and hope he figures something out along the way.

He's getting too old to still have a "prospect" label attached.

SarasotaFan
06-15-2008, 07:02 PM
Hit a homer in an all-star game you're guaranteed to get the MVP...it's kinda weird how that all works out.

membengal
06-15-2008, 11:04 PM
Francisco at A sarasota? An intruiging prospect for many on this board?

.776 OPS and on the Midwest All-star team.

Stubbs at A sarasota? A horriffic bust for many on this board?

.773 OPS and on the Midwest All-star team.

I just don't understand the wild disconnect in some people's expectations and from what a nice reality it is in the here and now. He is OPSing .380, stealing a ton of bags, and has shown decent pop for a league where pop goes to die (in general). He has, by all accounts, been as good as he was supposed to be with the glove.

Stubbs is NOT a bust, is NOT busting, and has earned his way to AA. I hope the move comes next week.

KoryMac5
06-15-2008, 11:09 PM
I will be very happy if Stubbs goes to AA and tears the cover off the ball, I just haven't seen anything from Billings and Sarasota to make me feel like this will happen. The kid has got some strengths but he needs to start putting it all together on a consistent basis, not just in spurts.

HokieRed
06-15-2008, 11:10 PM
I'm a Stubbs supporter, but the wild disconnect about expectations has to be understood in light of the fact Wayne passed on Tim Lincecum to take Stubbs.

reds44
06-15-2008, 11:11 PM
Francisco at A sarasota? An intruiging prospect for many on this board?

.776 OPS and on the Midwest All-star team.

Stubbs at A sarasota? A horriffic bust for many on this board?

.773 OPS and on the Midwest All-star team.

I just don't understand the wild disconnect in some people's expectations and from what a nice reality it is in the here and now. He is OPSing .380, stealing a ton of bags, and has shown decent pop for a league where pop goes to die (in general). He has, by all accounts, been as good as he was supposed to be with the glove.

Stubbs is NOT a bust, is NOT busting, and has earned his way to AA. I hope the move comes next week.
Francisco DOB: 6/24/1987
Stubbs DOB: 10/04/1984

Stubbs was also a first round pick.

And Francisco posses about every tool other than walking right now, so there is hope he can figure that out. Stubbs plays good defense, has good speed, walks a lot, and strikes out a lot.

I wouldn't label Stubbs a bust either, but that is why many people are happier with Francisco. If Stubbs ever posted a .378 OBP with his speed and defense in the majors nobody would complain.

membengal
06-15-2008, 11:19 PM
I don't give a flying piggy where Stubbs was drafted, frankly. Or whom he was drafted over.

Fact is, he is performing at a very fine level in a very tough hitters league, and making improvements. I am with many others in this forum who have tired of the rush to bury reds prospects at too early a juncture. I have high hopes for francisco. I have high hopes for Stubbs. I am glad the reds have both of those players in their organization. But I think it is insane to hammer one because he was drafted high and be happy with the other because he was drafted lower.

Caveat Emperor
06-15-2008, 11:20 PM
Stubbs at A sarasota? A horriffic bust for many on this board?

.773 OPS and on the Midwest All-star team.

I just don't understand the wild disconnect in some people's expectations and from what a nice reality it is in the here and now.

Ruben Mateo had an OPS of .860 in the FSL as a 19 year old back in '97. I've got many fond memories of him patrolling the outfield in Cincy.

Stubbs simply has not been impressive. If he were a 10th round pick, you'd be hearing nary a word about him at all. He hasn't performed in hitters leagues, he hasn't performed in pitchers leagues. If he makes it to the majors at all, it'll be on the strength of his glove.

Frankly, I'd be shocked if he ever plays in Cincinnati.

membengal
06-15-2008, 11:23 PM
Again, I don't care where he was picked. And good for Mateo. And as he advanced, he didn't pan out. Stuff happens.

And I think if Stubbs was picked 43rd round and OPSing .773 with a .380 OBP and that kind of speed and glove work, we would be hearing about him all day long and into the night with this board crowing about how awesome he was.

Silly that where he was picked colors the analysis. He is what he is. And what he is is not all that bad. In fact, it's actually quite promising. Time to move him to AA and see if he will continue to advance.

Caveat Emperor
06-15-2008, 11:28 PM
And I think if Stubbs was picked 43rd round and OPSing .773 with a .380 OBP and that kind of speed and glove work, we would be hearing about him all day long and into the night with this board crowing about how awesome he was.

There aren't a lot of 23 year old "prospects" that with OPS's south of .800 that generate a lot of buzz. RedsZone doesn't count -- most people here only follow Reds prospects closely, so we tend to be a bit myopic when it comes to objectively judging our prospects.

BTW -- Stubbs has an OBP of .380 and an SLG of .396. You can discount draft round, but the early buzz on him during the draft was that there were serious questions about whether he'd be able to make the transition from aluminum to wood. I think he's answered those questions, but not with the response anyone in the Reds organization wanted.

kaldaniels
06-16-2008, 12:28 AM
Ruben Mateo had an OPS of .860 in the FSL as a 19 year old back in '97. I've got many fond memories of him patrolling the outfield in Cincy.

Stubbs simply has not been impressive. If he were a 10th round pick, you'd be hearing nary a word about him at all. He hasn't performed in hitters leagues, he hasn't performed in pitchers leagues. If he makes it to the majors at all, it'll be on the strength of his glove.

Frankly, I'd be shocked if he ever plays in Cincinnati.

He'd be on the radar...not like he is now though. And oh how he would be pimped since he was the ASG MVP. After that he might even be one of the prospects who gets to sit at the Redszone "cool table" at lunch.

Mario-Rijo
06-16-2008, 01:20 AM
Francisco DOB: 6/24/1987
Stubbs DOB: 10/04/1984

Stubbs was also a first round pick.

And Francisco posses about every tool other than walking right now, so there is hope he can figure that out. Stubbs plays good defense, has good speed, walks a lot, and strikes out a lot.

I wouldn't label Stubbs a bust either, but that is why many people are happier with Francisco. If Stubbs ever posted a .378 OBP with his speed and defense in the majors nobody would complain.

He also makes a ton of errors at the 3rd base position, although he alledgedly has a strong arm it's apparently more erratic than Felipe Lopez's or his glove is. Whatever the case he has more flaws than one, but that big one is a HUGE one. He isn't just swinging at alot of pitcher's pitches and stuff just out of the zone, he swings at stuff thrown behind him practically. He has a long way to go but fortunately he is still rather young.

dougdirt
06-16-2008, 01:31 AM
Drew Stubbs is a fine prospect. His transition to wood has gone fine. In fact, he has seemingly gotten better at each level he has played.