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View Full Version : Home runs at GABP



Kc61
07-18-2008, 12:16 AM
Tonight, in this awful loss to the Mets, several home runs were just regular long fly balls. On days like this, it's really arena baseball in this stadium. Tatis' homer. Wright's homer.

It's hard for me to figure out the overall impact of this stadium. I know that teams don't necessarily score more there. But in terms of homers, it must be pretty frustrating pitching in this ballpark.

I'm starting to think that the team should invest in a plan to neutralize the stadium a bit. It's hard to see any pitcher wanting to come to the Reds.

Falls City Beer
07-18-2008, 12:19 AM
I'm sick to death of blaming the stadium. The Reds could win the WS 10 years in a row in GABP if they're smart.

Jpup
07-18-2008, 12:21 AM
I'm sick to death of blaming the stadium. The Reds could win the WS 10 years in a row in GABP if they're smart.

Did you watch the game?

WVRedsFan
07-18-2008, 12:23 AM
I'm sick to death of blaming the stadium. The Reds could win the WS 10 years in a row in GABP if they're smart.

Totally agree. The dimensions of the stadium are reasonable, but long fly balls are long fly balls. Most of the homers at GABP would be homers anywhere. I'd like to see a statistic on that, but I'm sure there isn't one.

WVRedsFan
07-18-2008, 12:24 AM
Tonight, in this awful loss to the Mets, several home runs were just regular long fly balls. On days like this, it's really arena baseball in this stadium. Tatis' homer. Wright's homer.

It's hard for me to figure out the overall impact of this stadium. I know that teams don't necessarily score more there. But in terms of homers, it must be pretty frustrating pitching in this ballpark.

I'm starting to think that the team should invest in a plan to neutralize the stadium a bit. It's hard to see any pitcher wanting to come to the Reds.

Build a "Red Monster" in right field and elevate the sun deck?

Falls City Beer
07-18-2008, 12:24 AM
Did you watch the game?

I saw Billy Wagner retire the side in the ninth if that's what you're asking.

*BaseClogger*
07-18-2008, 12:28 AM
Both teams have to play in the same stadium, however, the Reds get to build their team to play in the park...

Jpup
07-18-2008, 12:36 AM
I saw Billy Wagner retire the side in the ninth if that's what you're asking.

Did you watch the balls that were hit out of the park by the Mets? The Wright homer was not even hit very well. The balls were definitely jumpin' tonight.

BuckeyeRedleg
07-18-2008, 12:40 AM
Did you watch the balls that were hit out of the park by the Mets? The Wright homer was not even hit very well. The balls were definitely jumpin' tonight.

I agree, That was a pretty weak dinger. So was the Tatis HR.

It must be nice to have hitter's that go the other way and expose that part of the park on a night like tonight.

letsgojunior
07-18-2008, 12:40 AM
I guess you could make the argument that the Reds might want to look into more groundball pitchers or possibly keep the infield grass higher, but at the same time, the ball flies out of numerous ballparks in baseball - Yankee Stadium (for LHH), Camden Yards, Coors Field, Wrigley when the wind blows out, and those teams manage to put together good seasons.

That said, one thing to keep in mind is that the Reds offense has been anemic for the better part of the season, and any change which shifted the park to a less-friendly offensive park would also significantly hurt a subpar offense.

Jpup
07-18-2008, 12:43 AM
I agree, That was a pretty weak dinger. So was the Tatis HR.

It must be nice to have hitter's that go the other way and expose that part of the park on a night like tonight.

Cordero wasn't his usual self tonight either. Maybe the rest hurt him. Wasn't the last time he pitched on Saturday? That's a long time off.

Kc61
07-18-2008, 12:56 AM
That said, one thing to keep in mind is that the Reds offense has been anemic for the better part of the season, and any change which shifted the park to a less-friendly offensive park would also significantly hurt a subpar offense.

I don't think it's that simple. One approach is to fix the stadium so it plays more like normal baseball. That should help the Reds adapt on the road. It also should help them attract some pitchers.

The other approach is to build a team for GABP. Such a team does not need guys who hit the ball 600 feet. You don't need huge power in GABP. The Reds should stress line drive hitters. They will hit their share of homers anyway at GABP. And they will adapt better in the larger stadiums since the offense won't be so home run dependent.

And Reds need high strikeout pitchers and ground ball pitchers. And, if they get ground ball pitchers, Reds need super infield defense, which they don't have.

Line drive hitters, strikeout and ground ball pitchers, superb infield defense.

I don't know the full impact of this stadium but what I saw tonight was ridiculous. The Mets got to Cueto and Cordero with cheap homers and one can only guess what impact that has on a pitcher and a team.

Anyone who thinks this is just regular baseball in a regular stadium is IMO incorrect.

WVPacman
07-18-2008, 01:14 AM
They need to figure out a way to make GABP be more like Riverfront was.Riverfront was also a launching pad but you did'nt get no give me homeruns in that park..You had to earn it!!! They need to move the walls back or something b/c hitting a homerun in this park looks very easy.I agree as long as the ballpark stays the same the reds will keep losing out on free agent pitchers that can single handly carry a team on their shoulders b/c they will not want to pitch in this ballpark.

WVRedsFan
07-18-2008, 01:27 AM
Did you watch the balls that were hit out of the park by the Mets? The Wright homer was not even hit very well. The balls were definitely jumpin' tonight.

Those were cheap. I was just waiting for the screams that Junior should have had that, the bum. Fortunately, it went above the wall, hitting a fan and what appeared to be a catchable ball was not.

KronoRed
07-18-2008, 02:01 AM
If the Rockies can reach the world series then we have nothing to worry about.

dougdirt
07-18-2008, 02:28 AM
Maybe its just me, but as soon as Wright hit the ball, I yelled words that would likely get me banned from this site if I typed them. I knew that one was gone when he hit it even though it was real close to being off the wall. Tatis hit one that I figured was just a regular fly ball that ended up going out though.

For those wondering how much GABP plays into things, www.hittrackeronline.com and find out how many if you want to do the legwork and look up the home runs hit in GABP this year.

Jpup
07-18-2008, 02:45 AM
I am not completely blaming the ballpark. The Reds pitchers made mistakes. The Delgado homer was simply a bomb on a mistake pitch. The Wright & Tatis homers were on a bad pitches, but they were not hit very well. I don't know what the answer is, but moving the walls back could not hurt.

I think anyone should be able to agree that the ballpark does not help the Reds especially considering the limitations of attracting players to Cincinnati. Anyone with a reasonable mind and anyone that actually watches the ballgames should realize that something needs to be done.

Kc61
07-18-2008, 09:20 AM
If the Rockies can reach the world series then we have nothing to worry about.

The Rockies didnt make the World Series until they used a humidor on the baseballs. This was done to neutralize the impact of Coors. suddenly, the team was in the World Series.

If Castellini and Jocketty want to rebuild this team correctly, they need to work with experts to figure out exactly how this ballpark affects the game and team. Reds then need to address it either by modifying the stadium or structuring the team to take advantage of the stadium.

Last night, the Mets looked like a team better suited for GABP than the Reds. Their hitters took better advantage of the easier home run areas of the park and it gave the Mets the ballgame.

TeamBoone
07-18-2008, 09:21 AM
I've often wondered why they didn't extend the outfield/seats to be positioned ABOVE the street that runs behind the stadium, which they did in Riverfront but did not in the GAB.

TeamBoone
07-18-2008, 09:21 AM
Last night, the Mets looked like a team better suited for GABP than the Reds. Their hitters took better advantage of the easier home run areas of the park and it gave the Mets the ballgame.

Cordero gave the Mets the ballgame.

Kc61
07-18-2008, 09:30 AM
Cordero gave the Mets the ballgame.

He did for sure.

But the Mets got four runs last night on cheap homers. That also had an impact. If Reds have good defensive players and the fences are at a more "normal" distance, the Tatis and Wright homers are outs -- at the worst doubles. Indeed even at GABP I thought Griffey had a chance to catch Wright's ball.

I just don't think fans can ignore the obvious impact the stadium has on some games. And last night was annoying because it was the road team that took most advantage.

When you have a stadium like this, the home team needs to figure out how to benefit from the unusual features. Or do away with these features. But it's hard to watch the road team beat you by taking advantage of your own home ballpark.

WVRed
07-18-2008, 09:53 AM
The Rockies didnt make the World Series until they used a humidor on the baseballs. This was done to neutralize the impact of Coors. suddenly, the team was in the World Series.

If Castellini and Jocketty want to rebuild this team correctly, they need to work with experts to figure out exactly how this ballpark affects the game and team. Reds then need to address it either by modifying the stadium or structuring the team to take advantage of the stadium.

Last night, the Mets looked like a team better suited for GABP than the Reds. Their hitters took better advantage of the easier home run areas of the park and it gave the Mets the ballgame.

Colorado did make the playoffs once in 1995 when they had Castilla, Bichette, Galaragga, and Walker.

I agree with FCB in that the Reds can win in Great American the way it is. The only problem is the ownership and front office has yet to prove they are anything but inept in this category. Houston made the playoffs twice and made it to a World Series in a ballpark very similar to GABP, so it can be done.

Groundball pitchers are a necessity for GABP, as well as lefthanded hitters. We have the latter, but the first one is what is going to be a lot harder to find.

Kc61
07-18-2008, 10:24 AM
Colorado did make the playoffs once in 1995 when they had Castilla, Bichette, Galaragga, and Walker.

I agree with FCB in that the Reds can win in Great American the way it is. The only problem is the ownership and front office has yet to prove they are anything but inept in this category. Houston made the playoffs twice and made it to a World Series in a ballpark very similar to GABP, so it can be done.

Groundball pitchers are a necessity for GABP, as well as lefthanded hitters. We have the latter, but the first one is what is going to be a lot harder to find.

Colorado has hardly been a perennial winner and they found it necessary to use the humidor because the team understood Coors was hurting them. One or two playoff outings in all these years doesn't convince me Coors Field is neutral.

Again, there's been a lot written about the overall impact on a team (home and road) of playing in a stadium with pro-offensive tendencies. I hope the Reds are focusing on it because I think it does have an effect. Not only in home games but on the team's approach to the road outings as well.

SteelSD
07-18-2008, 10:25 AM
Should the Reds have better pitching, the park wouldn't at all be an issue. But they don't have better pitching so we look for ways to help a litter of HR-prone arms give up fewer longballs. Unfortunately, it wouldn't be sporting to surgically remove the wrapped core of all baseballs used at the GABP, so we want to move the fences back.

The interesting thing is that even though it wouldn't do squat to help the Reds win now or assist them in attracting high-priced FA starting pitching they can't afford anyway, it's not a bad idea. The reason it's not a bad idea is that the most valuable trade commodity for a small to mid-market team on a pound-for-pound basis is something that appears to be high-quality starting pitching. Doesn't have to actually BE high-quality starting pitching. It just has to appear to be that and anything a team can do to alter perception to that end can pay off geometrically via trade returns.

letsgojunior
07-18-2008, 10:29 AM
I don't think it's that simple. One approach is to fix the stadium so it plays more like normal baseball. That should help the Reds adapt on the road. It also should help them attract some pitchers.

That statement seems to presuppose that the Reds hit significantly worse on the road, which they don't. The Reds this year have scored more runs on the road (223 vs 201), and the home road differential between home and road is only 10 (60 at home versus 50 on the road).

Not to mention that park factor stats indicate that GAB is simply not as super-home run friendly as it would seem. GAB has ranked 7th among parks in the last two years (behind such teams as CHC, Baltimore, Houston, Colorado). The first three teams on that list have managed to put together numerous playoff appearances despite the homer friendly nature of their parks. Colorado was in the playoffs long before the humidor, and the Cubs
have been recent playoff contenders.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/stats/parkfactor?sort=HRFactor&season=2008

Moreover, I doubt they'll ever be able to attract truly superior pitching because of simple financing. Anytime one of the big three spenders is involved, the Reds will simply get outbid. Additionally, I doubt that the simply changing the infield grass or even putting the ball in a humidor would have much impact homer friendliness or unfriendliness: despite all the changes that have been made, Coors still manages to rank in the top 3 in home runs each year.



I don't know the full impact of this stadium but what I saw tonight was ridiculous. The Mets got to Cueto and Cordero with cheap homers and one can only guess what impact that has on a pitcher and a team.

Anyone who thinks this is just regular baseball in a regular stadium is IMO incorrect.

My personal view is that it was simply a superior team beating a lackluster team. I've seen plenty of Reds balls go 1-2 rows back in the stadium, including some game-deciding home runs.

redsmetz
07-18-2008, 10:57 AM
I'm disappointed and frustrated by last night's loss, but frankly, it's one game. In the course of a long season, you're going to have the occasional meltdown. Last night was our's. It shouldn't have happened, but it does and you move on. We could have capitilized in other situations. More times than not, the closer's going to finish it out. But we've been in this ball park six season now. We know it's pitfalls and it cuts both ways. Time to move on and take 'em on tonight.