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View Full Version : Would any one out there like Adrian Beltre as a Red?



BEETTLEBUG
08-18-2008, 07:57 PM
Would any one out there like Adrian Beltre as a Red?

Stephenk29
08-18-2008, 08:00 PM
at a reasonable rate. Right handed power hitter, why not?

Griffey012
08-18-2008, 08:34 PM
a lot of times I find myself comparing Edwin to a young Adrian Beltre. The only thing Beltre brings over Edwin is better defense, but if you remember, Beltre once made a good share of errors while a youngster with the Dodgers. Edwin brings just as much power and at least as good of a BA and OBP.

redsbuckeye
08-19-2008, 09:10 AM
Give me Edwin any day of the week and twice on Sundays. EE young, cost-controlled, and decent hitter. Beltre, older, expensive and fair hitter.

Beltre's defense, although oddly inconsistent, is still better than EE's.

Beltre turned possibly one of the biggest aberration years into a rediculous contract. He's never even come remotely close to those 2004 numbers again.

ChatterRed
08-19-2008, 09:44 AM
Yeah, Beltre is a 20 homer guy who put up 48 homers and his only 100+ rbi year in a contract season. Good for him, but he hasn't come close to being that same player.

Don't get me wrong. He is solid, but not great. For money purposes only, I'd just as well keep EE.

Ghosts of 1990
08-19-2008, 10:24 AM
I'd love it

tommycash
08-19-2008, 10:38 AM
Keep EE, say no to Beltre. Money can be better spent for other positions.

Bumstead
08-19-2008, 10:43 AM
Why in the world would we want a guy who only produces when it's convenient for him? Plus he's fat and has had foot problems...the two don't mix, I should know....:eek:

I think it's too early to give up on EE; give him another year or two while this team is being rebuilt and let's see what happens.

Bumstead

Focusonit
08-19-2008, 10:50 AM
Adrian Beltre makes me think of performance enhancing drugs for some reason. While I'm not opposed to moving EE. I would prefer the Reds not take on Beltre.

BLEEDS
08-19-2008, 11:27 AM
With some of the info "leaked" - I only say this because WJ makes WK look like a blabbermouth, though it's usually of the wilde goose chase variety - about moving EE/Votto to LF and/or Alonso to 3rd base when he gets here - this is the kind of move I could see WJ making for a year or two - maybe just one year - as part of a transition.

I don't know if they want to take on that salary, but at least it's only for one year.

We definitely need a RH power bat - whether that's a LF or 3rd base, I think we have options now.

I think a Burrell on a 3-4 year deal might be up WJ's alley as well.

PEACE

-BLEEDS

Rob387
08-19-2008, 11:54 AM
I have seen that bum play here in Seattle the last few years and I definitely think he is on the decline physically. IF you take away the one year in LA when he was juiced out of his mind and put up 48hr 121rbi .334avg he is a career .260 20hr 100+K guy.. no thanks

daBeastIzback
08-19-2008, 12:40 PM
Why in the world would we want a guy who only produces when it's convenient for him? Plus he's fat and has had foot problems...the two don't mix, I should know....:eek:

I think it's too early to give up on EE; give him another year or two while this team is being rebuilt and let's see what happens.

Bumstead

:confused:

i live in washington and so i watch the mariners n hes not fat, nor does he have foot problems.

daBeastIzback
08-19-2008, 12:44 PM
ne one seen his home/road splits? hes crazy good outta safeco. 800+ ops last couple years on the road.

hed mash in cincy. plus hes a stud on defense. hes just terrible at safeco, prolly cause the 'mike cameron effect'. i saw on USSM. its like no matter how hard beltre hits the ball hed just fly out to deep center or left. it gets in his head and then he trys and tweaks his swing. cameron did the same thing.

hed be a great pickup if he came at under $15 mill per year imo. plus hes heralded for his leadership.

tommycash
08-19-2008, 01:31 PM
ne one seen his home/road splits? hes crazy good outta safeco. 800+ ops last couple years on the road.

hed mash in cincy. plus hes a stud on defense. hes just terrible at safeco, prolly cause the 'mike cameron effect'. i saw on USSM. its like no matter how hard beltre hits the ball hed just fly out to deep center or left. it gets in his head and then he trys and tweaks his swing. cameron did the same thing.

hed be a great pickup if he came at under $15 mill per year imo. plus hes heralded for his leadership.

No way we should spend close to $15 million on Beltre and cut ties with a much cheaper and similar producing EdE

Griffey012
08-19-2008, 04:42 PM
The only way I wouldn't possibly mind him in a Reds uni is if we traded Edwin for a pitching talent of equal talent, someone in the majors with a high ceiling but has only been average and shown flashes to this point. And then replace Edwin with Beltre in the 6-8 million range.

Bumstead
08-19-2008, 06:08 PM
Well, he did have foot problems with the Dodgers and while comparing his size to my size would make me not want to call him fat...Of course his foot problems and other maladies ended when his contract year came up...Sounds like a great acquisition for Seattle; re-up him please. EE is better now and will be going forward.

No need to bring mediocre players in while rebuilding. Let EE continue to develop.

Bumstead

daBeastIzback
08-19-2008, 08:25 PM
i dun see how neone can call beltre avg tho, have u seen his splits? hes great on the road offensively + he plays great defense..

improbus
08-19-2008, 11:00 PM
Let me be subtle about this: NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

He will be Andruw Jones soon.

Bumstead
08-20-2008, 02:35 AM
Adrian Beltre OBP - .326 (career) OPS - .782 (career) =mediocre

Edwin Encarnacion OBP - .345 (career) OPS - .814 (career) = already better and young enough to improve.

How does it make sense to pay $10M+ per year for a worse player who is 4 years older?

Bumstead

Kingspoint
08-20-2008, 03:26 AM
Absolutely not.

I've seen him play over 500 times.

While the Defense is light's out better than EE's, the Offense isn't any better at all, and EE's young and improving every year.

BEETTLEBUG
08-20-2008, 09:21 AM
I think he is WJ's kind of short term player as is Pat Burrell.

improbus
08-20-2008, 09:54 AM
You guys do realize that by signing Burrell, we will most likely give the Phillies a our First Round pick. Beltre might be a second. That is counter-productive to rebuilding.

Brian
08-20-2008, 03:26 PM
Beltre is not a good use of funds. That money needs to be poured into pitching if a proper RH bat isn't available or too costly. Beltre simply doesn't upgade the position enough to scrap EE.

daBeastIzback
08-20-2008, 05:48 PM
Beltre doesn't make sense for the current Reds, but it's crazy that people are saying Edwin is better than him. You guys realize that in Cincy, Edwin plays in a bandbox, right? And that in Seattle, Beltre plays in a huge stadium, right? It's ignorant to just look at raw stats and say Edwin is better.

Look at Edwin's career numbers away from Cincy:
.262/.329/.441/.770

That's not bad, but certainly not anything special

Now, let's look at Beltre's away numbers over his career (yes, this applies to his Dodger days, because looking at the park factors, Dodger Stadium was very much a pitcher friendly park):
.278/.347/.481/.828

Now, that line is including his early Dodger years when he was 19 and 20 years of age. If you want to look at what he's done recently on the road:

Beltre last season on the road: .288/.320/.538/.858
Beltre this season on the road: .278/.347/.481/.828

Edwin last season on the road: .309/.360/.439/.799
Edwin this season on the road: .253/.332/.472/.804

Now I'm not saying that home stats should be disregarded completely, rather that I find the road stats to be more telling given the situations each of these two are in with extreme ball parks (Beltre in a pitcher's park, EE in a hitter's park)

Look at OPS+ for christ sakes. Edwin the last two seasons is at 101 and 108. Beltre the last two seasons is at 112 and 98 (his BABIP at home is in the .230s, which explains his poor offensive season this year)

From the team's perspective, it looks a helluva lot better to just keep EE, than go after an expensive Beltre.

But all I'm trying to say is that if Beltre and EE magically traded places, and Beltre had the same contract situation as EE, than I wouldn't be mad at all.

Bumstead
08-21-2008, 02:43 PM
[QUOTE=But all I'm trying to say is that if Beltre and EE magically traded places, and Beltre had the same contract situation as EE, than I wouldn't be mad at all.[/QUOTE]

Someone once said to me: "If 'ifs' and 'buts' were candy and nuts, Christmas would be everyday." ;)