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Redman15
10-07-2008, 02:16 PM
Stubbs is playing LF and Valaika is at SS. They are the only 2 Reds in the starting line up today.

RedsManRick
10-07-2008, 02:38 PM
Stubbs is playing LF and Valaika is at SS. They are the only 2 Reds in the starting line up today.

Who is in CF that is pushing Stubbs to LF?

Dickerson and Stubbs, the best defending LF platoon in history...

camisadelgolf
10-07-2008, 02:54 PM
Who is in CF that is pushing Stubbs to LF?

Dickerson and Stubbs, the best defending LF platoon in history...

Austin Jackson of the Yankees' organization. At the beginning of the year, Baseball America ranked him as the Yankees' number two prospect (behind Joba Chameberlain) and as the Yankees' best defense outfielder.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080228&content_id=2395257&vkey=spt2008news&fext=.jsp&c_id=nyy
http://minors.baseball-reference.com/players.cgi?pid=7082

Redman15
10-07-2008, 04:05 PM
Stubbs and Valaika both struck out their 1st at bats.

Matt700wlw
10-07-2008, 04:30 PM
Stubbs and Valaika both struck out their 1st at bats.

Trade them ;)

camisadelgolf
10-07-2008, 04:49 PM
Stubbs has struck out, walked, walked, and scored. Valakia is 1-2 with a single and a two-out RBI.

Redman15
10-07-2008, 05:21 PM
Peoria up 6-0. Watson in to pitch.

Redman15
10-07-2008, 05:24 PM
Watson gets 2 quick outs and then loads the bases. A 2 out double makes it 6-2 in the T6. Watson strikes out Rodriquez to end the 6th.

dougdirt
10-07-2008, 05:38 PM
Watson gets 2 quick outs and then loads the bases. A 2 out double makes it 6-2 in the T6. Watson strikes out Rodriquez to end the 6th.

That game sums up Watson's entire year this year.

Redman15
10-07-2008, 06:02 PM
Stubbs infield hit and RBI. 10-3 B8.

Redman15
10-08-2008, 11:35 AM
Stubby has a blog on the AFL. Here is his 1st blog.

Arizona Fall League Kicks Off
Greetings everyone from Peoria, AZ! I'm Drew Stubbs, and I'll be leading this blog for the Cincinnati Reds. Before I get into our brief time so far out here, I'll tell you a little about myself. I grew up in the small town of Atlanta, TX. That's right, Texas and not Georgia. It is located in extreme northeast Texas, just south of Texarkana, and I wouldn't expect you to have heard of it unless you've been through the area. I was drafted by the Reds out of the University of Texas in the first round of the '06 draft. Prior to joining the Reds, I helped the Longhorns win a National Championship in 2005. I think my college teammates and I agree that that was the greatest experience of our lives...truly amazing. Since being in pro ball, I have 2 and a half seasons under my belt that have spanned places from Billings, MT to Louisville, KY. You definitely get to experience a whole lot of different scenery while climbing through the minor leagues. Joining me here on the Peoria Javelinas from the Reds are infielders Chris Valaika and Justin Turner, pitchers Carlos Fisher, Robert Manuel, Sean Watson, and Pedro Viola, and infielder/outfielder Sean Henry. I'm sure at some point you will hear from all of these great guys.

I have been in Arizona only a handful of days now, since Oct. 1, and I've already experienced the heat that it is known for. Thankfully, we've had a few days that have offered a break in temperature, but for the most part it has been pretty steamy. We just played our first game of the Fall League today, Oct. 7, but we have been working out as a team for the past 5 days. The workouts have been efficient and brief as we've gotten our work done by around lunch time each day. I think we prepared ourselves well because we were able to get a win against the Surprise Rafters in the league opener. Our pitching was sharp, and our offense put up plenty of runs to supply a nice lead for us. Hopefully, we'll be able to continue our success during the next month and a half.

Outside the field, it's been really laid back for my Reds teammates and I. We all live together in a large house about 5 minutes from the Peoria complex. It's been a little hectic at times trying to get everyone on the same page most of the time, but things have been great overall. Since games have now started, our days should be filled a little more and won't leave us with as much down time.

Well guys, this concludes my first week blog, but I'll be back next week to continue. Please feel free to ask any questions or drop a line or two. Until next time, have a great week!

Drew Stubbs

Here is the link. http://aflreds.mlblogs.com/

Redman15
10-08-2008, 03:03 PM
Henry,Valaika and Turner in the line up today. Viola gets the nod on the bump.

mace
10-08-2008, 03:15 PM
Am interested to see how it goes for Viola. After a rough start in the bullpen, he was close to sensational this year after being converted to a starter late in the season.

camisadelgolf
10-08-2008, 03:55 PM
I'm interested about Viola, as well. He's a very interesting prospect, imo. He kind of came out of nowhere last year, and just as people started to suspect that 2007 was just a flash in the pan, he turned it on again. The big question I have about him is whether he was used as a starter simply because the Reds wanted him to get more innings or because the Reds really think he projects well as a starter.

Redman15
10-08-2008, 04:00 PM
Pedro had a good 1st inning. In the 2nd he gave up a couple of doubles and a 3 run bomb. The Javs trail 4-0.

Henry 0-1 K
Valaika 1-1 1B
Turner 1-1 1B

Redman15
10-08-2008, 04:53 PM
Javs roll out a 7 spot to take a 7-5 lead. Valaika RBI double (2-3). Turner bases loaded single to score 2. (2-2). Fister replaces Viola on the bump.

Redman15
10-08-2008, 06:10 PM
Carlos Fisher in to close.8-7 Javs B9.
Fisher slams the door with a K,ground out, K.
Javs win!

dougdirt
10-08-2008, 06:28 PM
Carlos Fisher in to close.8-7 Javs B9.
Fisher slams the door with a K,ground out, K.
Javs win!

Carlos Fisher is the best reliever we have in the upper part of the system and there is no doubt in my mind about that.

GOYA
10-08-2008, 06:48 PM
Carlos Fisher is the best reliever we have in the upper part of the system and there is no doubt in my mind about that.

Yep. Something clicked in him this year. We can only hope it sticks. If it does, he may make the big league team in ST.

Kc61
10-08-2008, 07:30 PM
Carlos Fisher is the best reliever we have in the upper part of the system and there is no doubt in my mind about that.


Another not-so-veiled slap at Josh Roenicke. I doubt the Reds scouts and top brass have the same sense of certainty.

Fisher had a good 17 innings at AAA, but at AA his numbers were more down to earth. He seems like a good combo of grounders and strikeouts but I haven't heard him projected as a dominating type.

Roenicke had a couple rough outings in September for the Reds and yes, the old bromide, he relies heavily on his fastball. But he still is relatively inexperienced and at some point, for some team, he would seem to profile as the more dominant reliever. It's just a matter of time until he gets it together. His AAA numbers this year were outstanding with a 1.23 WHIP and 43 Ks in 39 innings. He's getting there.

And, frankly, Sean Watson belongs in this conversation. I know, his control isn't there yet, but he fanned 75 guys in 55 innings last season at two levels. If the question is potential, we need to look past the current pitcher and focus on what he could be with some growth.

Roenicke, Stewart and Watson seem like the guys with potential to dominate, at least for a few years. Fisher perhaps is more of a set up type or multi-inning middle guy. All talented, hard to be certain about how they may pan out.

Redman15
10-08-2008, 08:34 PM
The Reds players are off to a good start in Arizona.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081008&content_id=3604693&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

redsfandan
10-08-2008, 09:03 PM
...
Roenicke had a couple rough outings in September for the Reds and yes, the old bromide, he relies heavily on his fastball. But he still is relatively inexperienced and at some point, for some team, he would seem to profile as the more dominant reliever. It's just a matter of time until he gets it together. His AAA numbers this year were outstanding with a 1.23 WHIP and 43 Ks in 39 innings. He's getting there.
...


don't mean to nitpick but i'm not sure i'd call a 1.23 whip outstanding. good but not outstanding.

dougdirt
10-08-2008, 09:18 PM
Another not-so-veiled slap at Josh Roenicke. I doubt the Reds scouts and top brass have the same sense of certainty.

Fisher had a good 17 innings at AAA, but at AA his numbers were more down to earth. He seems like a good combo of grounders and strikeouts but I haven't heard him projected as a dominating type.

He has better secondary pitches and has a fastball thats comparable with Roenicke, but with more sink and induces more grounders. Not a shot at Roenicke, but praise for Fisher.



Roenicke had a couple rough outings in September for the Reds and yes, the old bromide, he relies heavily on his fastball. But he still is relatively inexperienced and at some point, for some team, he would seem to profile as the more dominant reliever. It's just a matter of time until he gets it together. His AAA numbers this year were outstanding with a 1.23 WHIP and 43 Ks in 39 innings. He's getting there.
For as inexperienced Roenicke is with the football and all, Fisher didn't pitch until his Junior year in college. Both have that lack of experience, but the only thing Roenicke does better than Fisher is an extra MPH or two on his fastball at its top speed.



And, frankly, Sean Watson belongs in this conversation. I know, his control isn't there yet, but he fanned 75 guys in 55 innings last season at two levels. If the question is potential, we need to look past the current pitcher and focus on what he could be with some growth.
If Watson can get something resembling control going, then yeah, he could be in the conversation. He hasn't shown that ability though, so he isn't.



Roenicke, Stewart and Watson seem like the guys with potential to dominate, at least for a few years. Fisher perhaps is more of a set up type or multi-inning middle guy. All talented, hard to be certain about how they may pan out.

Stewart is the best of that group and its not close. Roenicke is far ahead of Watson at this point. Fisher is ahead of Roenicke though. Fastball in the 92-96 range with good sink and offspeed stuff that he trusts and can throw for strikes. I would put that on par with anyone in the system thats not named Stewart as far as relievers go.

Kc61
10-08-2008, 09:42 PM
don't mean to nitpick but i'm not sure i'd call a 1.23 whip outstanding. good but not outstanding.

If not outstanding, then very good.

For a reliever, I always look for a WHIP of 1.3 or below. For a starter 1.4 or below.

Obviously WHIP has its limitations. If a pitcher allows lots of homers, all the WHIP in the world won't help him. But I think it's useful. If a pitcher allows lots of walks; or is easy to hit; it will show up in the WHIP.

Roenicke is obviously not easy to hit. But he has been prone to walks at some levels. His good AAA WHIP reflects that, at that level last year, he kept the walks under control.

I still think that Roenicke is the kind of reliever who -- for a few seasons -- can be dominant. That extra yard on his fastball makes all the difference as compared with others. Not sure he's ready quite yet, maybe by mid-season 2009.

Redman15
10-09-2008, 08:50 PM
Stubby leading off and playing LF. Turner batting 7th playing 2nd.

BigRed07
10-10-2008, 01:04 AM
Peoria won 6-4. Stubbs 0-2,Turner 0-3, Manuel pitched 1 inning, 1 ER.

OnBaseMachine
10-10-2008, 11:10 AM
Stubbs did reach base twice with a walk and HBP.

Redman15
10-10-2008, 02:37 PM
Turner batting 2nd playing 2B; Valaika batting 5th and playing SS.

OnBaseMachine
10-10-2008, 06:10 PM
AFL offers serious training ground
Eight Reds prospects among those extending their seasons

CINCINNATI -- If a player is invited to play in the Arizona Fall League, it's a sign that his big league dream has come within grasping-reach.

Major League rosters are loaded with alumni that played in the AFL, which began play this week. The six-team league consists mainly of top-end prospects from the Double-A and Triple-A levels. The Reds sent eight prospects from their organization to participate this year.

"Anytime you can get guys additional playing time in any venue, it's good," Reds Minor League director Terry Reynolds said. "When you can get them playing against the better prospects from other organizations, it's even better."

Among Major Leaguers with AFL experience are Reds pitchers Aaron Harang and Bronson Arroyo, second baseman Brandon Phillips and first baseman Joey Votto. MLB superstars like Derek Jeter and Ryan Howard also played in the league.

The Reds playing in the AFL this year are pitchers Pedro Viola, Sean Watson, Robert Manuel and Carlos Fisher, outfielder Drew Stubbs and infielders Chris Valaika, Justin Turner and Sean Henry. Louisville coach Ted Power, a former Reds reliever, will be a pitching coach.

"I think it's a good experience and competition for those kids," Reds general manager Walt Jocketty said. "We're sending some pretty good players. If other teams did the same, there will be some very good competition."

The most familiar name to Reds fans among this year's AFL group will be Stubbs, Cincinnati's 2006 first-round Draft pick out of the Univ. of Texas. The 24-year-old reached Triple-A Louisville by the end of this season.

Louisville wasn't the intended target, originally. Stubbs began 2008 at Class A Sarasota and batted .261 over 86 games before making the move to Double-A Chattanooga. The stay only lasted 26 games while he batted .315 with a .400 on-base percentage.

In August, injuries and an outfield shortage at Louisville necessitated another promotion. Like Jay Bruce a year ago, it was supposed to be short stay before returning to Chattanooga. Instead, it became permanent.

"Truth be told, I thought it might be better for him to spend the whole summer in Double-A," Reynolds said. "But he was a pleasant surprise at Louisville. He held his own there."

Stubbs played center field exclusively at Louisville under manager Rick Sweet. There are plans to improve his versatility next season at the other two outfield spots. The Reds do not have to protect Stubbs on their 40-man roster until after the 2009 season. The decision hasn't been made yet whether to invite him to big league camp as a non-roster player next spring.

In 19 games with Louisville, Stubbs batted .293. Overall at the three levels, he batted .277 with seven homers, 57 RBIs, 33 doubles, 33 steals and a .371 OBP. He walked 67 times with 123 strikeouts.

The Reds have been working with Stubbs to not expand his strike zone too much and to cut down on the K's.

"He improved significantly. It's an area where he'll have to continue to work," Reynolds said. "We want him to put the ball in play and use his speed. We just don't want him to strike out. It's an effort for all of our coaches to get him better at that."

http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081010&content_id=3608586&vkey=news_cin&fext=.jsp&c_id=cin

Redman15
10-10-2008, 06:49 PM
Valaika 0-3 BB,Run, Turner 0-4,BB,Run. Javs lost 7-5.

icehole3
10-11-2008, 07:17 AM
Is Fisher a guy you start in the bullpen in the majors and as he builds confidence maybe project him to starter?

HokieRed
10-11-2008, 10:58 AM
Since Fisher was a starter until last year and has been switched to relief, I suspect the organizational plan is that he will remain a reliever, probably based on an assessment of his stuff. I've been a big fan of his since O'Brien drafted him and I think we will be very happy with him in the bullpen.

camisadelgolf
10-11-2008, 11:04 AM
Is Fisher a guy you start in the bullpen in the majors and as he builds confidence maybe project him to starter?

If that were the case, I think the Reds wouldn't have already converted him to reliever. As far as the Reds' pitching goes, I think an above-average reliever is needed more than a below average starter. If he adds another pitch, maybe it should be time to consider moving him back, but until then, I think the Reds made the right move.

OnBaseMachine
10-12-2008, 01:38 AM
10/11 game:

Peoria lost 5-2:

Henry: 2-for-4 walk
Valaika: 1-for-3 walk

Fisher: 1 IP, 1 H, 1 R, 0 BB, 1 K

Watson: 1 IP, 3 H, 3 R, 1 BB, 1 K

icehole3
10-12-2008, 10:50 AM
where does Watson start in 2009? AAA or AA

camisadelgolf
10-12-2008, 11:06 AM
where does Watson start in 2009? AAA or AA

He still has something to prove in AA, and there's plenty of depth at AAA, so I'd imagine he'd start at AA, despite his potential.

Edd Roush
10-12-2008, 12:57 PM
He still has something to prove in AA, and there's plenty of depth at AAA, so I'd imagine he'd start at AAA, despite his potential.


I don't follow your logic. If he still has something to prove in AA and there is depth in AAA, doesn't that mean he should start in AA? Did you just mistype?

camisadelgolf
10-12-2008, 01:00 PM
I don't follow your logic. If he still has something to prove in AA and there is depth in AAA, doesn't that mean he should start in AA? Did you just mistype?

Oops, that was a typo. I mean he should start at AA. My girlfriend was talking to me as I was posting, and I was trying to fake like I was paying attention to her.

icehole3
10-12-2008, 04:22 PM
Oops, that was a typo. I mean he should start at AA. My girlfriend was talking to me as I was posting, and I was trying to fake like I was paying attention to her.

thats hilarious

http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/9945/laugh2jl1.gif

cincyinco
10-12-2008, 04:41 PM
Oops, that was a typo. I mean he should start at AA. My girlfriend was talking to me as I was posting, and I was trying to fake like I was paying attention to her.


How ironic, my wife just got done yelling at me for this exact thing a few mins earlier..

Redman15
10-13-2008, 02:49 PM
Stubbs leading off and playing RF and Valaika is hitting 5th playing SS.

Redman15
10-13-2008, 05:43 PM
Javs lose 3-2. Stubbs 0-4 2 K's, Valaika 0-4 2 K's. No Reds pitchers got in the game today.

Orenda
10-13-2008, 08:08 PM
I hope Drew's toe isn't bothering him again. :rolleyes:



Sorry I couldn't resist.

Redman15
10-14-2008, 03:04 PM
Stubby leading off in CF. Valaika hitting 5th playing SS. Turner hitting 7th playing 2B. Viola gets the start on the bump for the Javs.

OnBaseMachine
10-14-2008, 04:23 PM
Viola's final line:

3 IP, 1 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 3 K

Redman15
10-14-2008, 05:05 PM
Manuel now on the bump for the Javs. He gives up 1 hit and 0 runs in 1 IP.
3-0 Javs lead in the B6.

Redman15
10-14-2008, 06:16 PM
Javs bullpen gives up 3 runs in the top of the 9th and lose 5-4.
Stubbs 1-5 2k; Valaika 1-4 rbi,k; Turner 1-3 k,bb.

HokieRed
10-14-2008, 10:51 PM
I am hoping that we stick with the Viola as a starter experiment a little longer. His value could be tremendous if he can find enough off-speed stuff to supplement that 95 mph heat.

icehole3
10-15-2008, 03:58 AM
Does anyone know if Soto is working with this kid?

Redman15
10-15-2008, 02:54 PM
Valaika hitting 6th playing SS. He is the only Red in the line-up.

Redman15
10-15-2008, 06:32 PM
Javs win 6-4. Valaika 2-5. Fisher gets the first 2 outs then a BB and a hit. He was replaced in the B9 by David Welch. Who walks the next hitter to load up the bases. He then gets Raynor to pop up for the save.

Redman15
10-16-2008, 06:56 PM
Javs win 9-8. Turner singles to drive in the tying run. Steals 2nd and scores the go ahead run on a Russo single.
Stubbs 1-5 (2 runs) SB
Turner 1-4 (run) SB, RBI
Watson 1.2 innings pitched. 3 ER on 6 hits(1 HR).

jmcclain19
10-16-2008, 07:49 PM
I went to a Surprise/Scottsdale AFL game last night.

I think Nolan Reimold might be my new favorite non-Red. A friend and I went and sat right behind the dugout and he talked to us the whole game. I jokingly asked him if he was better than Markakis and he just laughed and shook his head no.

Hoping I can catch some Reds prospects when I go on Saturday night - Peoria doesn't come over to my neck of the woods too often so I'll take advantage when I can.

BigRed07
10-16-2008, 10:05 PM
From milb on todays game.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081016&content_id=3625906&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

OnBaseMachine
10-17-2008, 02:57 PM
Another blog entry from Stubbs:

Week 2 progresses well

Hello again, everyone! This is Drew here, and I'm ready to update you on the first week of games from the Arizona Fall League. The Peoria Javelinas have gotten off to a nice start, winning three of the first five games. We have gotten solid pitching and defense from our guys to complement some nice offensive sprees. With the array of talent across the league, I feel that our team has done a nice job of capitalizing on opportunities, and that is why we have been able to be successful in our first week of games. Several of our players have impressed me, but I think one guy that stands out so far has been Carlos Triunfel of the Seattle Mariners. He has displayed some great offensive games as well as some nice plays in the field. One thing that is extraordinary about Carlos is that he is only 18 years of age! I can't believe how mature he plays the game since most of us guys are between the ages of 21-26. Obviously many other guys have done great things so far, but he is one that sticks out in my mind.

Outside of the field, the Reds guys and myself have continued to enjoy ourselves with our living situation. Anytime you have seven guys living in a house to themselves, there is bound to be some fun times. Sean Watson and Justin Turner have become regulars to a high-speed go-cart track that is just down the street from us. I was able to swing in and watch them race after a workout today, and it is pretty entertaining to watch because the carts get going up to 45 mph! I'm sure we will all experience the carts at some point although most of us have not been yet. Other than this, we have had a little less overall free time since we play games most everyday of the week. We get done at the field around 4 o'clock for home games, and a little later for away games because of the travel back to Peoria. Therefore, we usually only have time to get back and prepare dinner for ourselves, or maybe get a weight workout in beforehand.

This has pretty much been the extent of the past week with the guys from the Reds, so I'll be ready to give another update on us in about a week! Take care everyone!

Drew

http://aflreds.mlblogs.com/archives/2008/10/week_2_progresses_well.html

OnBaseMachine
10-18-2008, 12:54 AM
10/17:

Valaika: 2-for-4 double
Turner: 0-for-3 walk

redsfandan
10-18-2008, 04:58 AM
does anyone have their accumulated stats so far?

GOYA
10-18-2008, 11:13 AM
does anyone have their accumulated stats so far?

Look here for everyone:

http://mlb.mlb.com/milb/stats/org.jsp?id=cin

icehole3
10-18-2008, 12:30 PM
the thing that stands out to me is Yonder's 7 walks, thats impressive, does it mean guys are already afraid to pitch to him?

mth123
10-18-2008, 04:34 PM
10-18:

Henry 0 for 2 so far.

Valaiak 1 for 2 with a Home Run.

Game is in the 4th inning.

mth123
10-18-2008, 04:46 PM
Robert Manual in in the top of the 5th:

1 IP, 1H, 0R, 0K, 0BB.

mth123
10-18-2008, 04:47 PM
Sean Henry leads-off the bottom of the 5th with a BB.

mth123
10-18-2008, 04:56 PM
Valaika up with guys on 1st and 2nd and singles to load the bases.

2 for 3 with a single, HR and a "Productive" RBI GO.

mth123
10-18-2008, 05:27 PM
Henry with a bunt single.

1 for 3 with a BB.

OnBaseMachine
10-18-2008, 05:31 PM
Phil Hughes got rocked: 2.2 IP, 7 H, 7 ER, 2 BB, 1 K, 1 HR. His stock is dropping like an anchor. A few years ago it looked like Homer Bailey, Phil Hughes, and Clay Buchholz would be established MLB starters by now, instead all three are struggling. They still have plenty of time though. Who knows, two years from now they could be All-Stars.

mth123
10-18-2008, 05:39 PM
Valaika Homers again.

OnBaseMachine
10-18-2008, 06:53 PM
10/18 final line:

Henry: 1-for-5 walk, SB
Valaika: 3-for-5 two home runs (#1, 2), 3 RBI

Manuel: 1 IP, 1 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 1 K

OnBaseMachine
10-18-2008, 09:06 PM
Valaika vaults Javs past Scorpions
Homers twice, drives in three runs in comeback victory

By Alan Friedman / Special to MLB.com

Chris Valaika feels fortunate to be competing in the Arizona Fall League. Opposing hurlers might not feel the same way.

The Reds infield prospect belted a pair of homers Saturday, including one that ignited a six-run seventh inning, as the Peoria Javelinas rallied for a wild 14-11 victory over the Scottsdale Scorpions.

Valaika, who went 3-for-5 to raise his AFL average to .333, smacked a solo homer in the second, delivered an RBI groundout in the fourth, singled and scored in the fifth and launched another solo shot in the seventh.

"It's been unbelievable to be able to play here with such great talent and against the caliber of guys you face here," said the 23-year-old shortstop, who batted .317 with 18 homers and 81 RBIs between Class A Advanced Sarasota and Double-A Chattanooga this season.

Cincinnati's third-round pick in the 2006 First-Year Player Draft has two homers, seven RBIs and six runs scored in nine fall games for the Javelinas (6-5).

"Playing every day here you get to pick up little things you might not pick up otherwise," Valaika said. "I've been real fortunate to get at-bats where I'm consistently seeing good pitching. Hopefully, I can stay consistent in what I do."

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081018&content_id=3629852&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

Mario-Rijo
10-19-2008, 02:48 AM
Valaika vaults Javs past Scorpions
Homers twice, drives in three runs in comeback victory

By Alan Friedman / Special to MLB.com

Chris Valaika feels fortunate to be competing in the Arizona Fall League. Opposing hurlers might not feel the same way.

The Reds infield prospect belted a pair of homers Saturday, including one that ignited a six-run seventh inning, as the Peoria Javelinas rallied for a wild 14-11 victory over the Scottsdale Scorpions.

Valaika, who went 3-for-5 to raise his AFL average to .333, smacked a solo homer in the second, delivered an RBI groundout in the fourth, singled and scored in the fifth and launched another solo shot in the seventh.

"It's been unbelievable to be able to play here with such great talent and against the caliber of guys you face here," said the 23-year-old shortstop, who batted .317 with 18 homers and 81 RBIs between Class A Advanced Sarasota and Double-A Chattanooga this season.

Cincinnati's third-round pick in the 2006 First-Year Player Draft has two homers, seven RBIs and six runs scored in nine fall games for the Javelinas (6-5).

"Playing every day here you get to pick up little things you might not pick up otherwise," Valaika said. "I've been real fortunate to get at-bats where I'm consistently seeing good pitching. Hopefully, I can stay consistent in what I do."

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081018&content_id=3629852&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

That's such an important statement to touch on and remember. These guys have to deal with such erratic pitching in the minors that it makes it hard to become a consistent performer themselves. In some cases anyway.

Redman15
10-20-2008, 06:01 PM
Stubbs leading off in the DH spot. Valaika hitting 5th playing SS. Viola gets the start.

Redman15
10-20-2008, 06:12 PM
Javs win 4-2. Viola 4.1 innings,6 hits 1 ER and 3 k's.
Stubbs 1-5. Valaika 0-4. Fisher in to close it out gets
the 1st two hitters then a walk. Next hitter grounds out
to Valaika to give Fish the save.

Redman15
10-21-2008, 03:54 PM
Valaika hitting 5th playing SS. Stubbs hitting 7th in RF. Turner hitting 9th at 2B.
It's the T1 and the Javs trail 6-0. Watson relieves Jeffress and walks the 1st guy and gives up a 2 run single before getting the 3rd out.

Redman15
10-21-2008, 04:32 PM
Valaika RBI single, Stubbs walks,Turner 2 RBI single. Hughes 3 run bomb. Javs roll up a 8 spot and now lead 8-6 headed to the T3.

Redman15
10-21-2008, 06:23 PM
Javs lead 16-7 in the T7. Turner is 4-4,3 Runs and 3 RBI's; Valaika is 2-4,1 Run, 1 RBI; Stubbs is 1-3, 2 Runs and a RBI.
Watson 1.1 inn,1 hit 0 ER's.

Redman15
10-21-2008, 07:53 PM
Javs win 18-11. Mr. Castellini and Mr. Jocketty were in the stands today. The Reds players did alright today.


Peo Javelinas
Player AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SO AVG
Cain LF 6 1 2 0 0 1 2 0 0 .444
Green 3B 2 1 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 .333
Russo 1-3B 2 0 1 0 0 0 2 1 0 .323
Jackson CF 6 1 3 0 0 0 2 0 0 .267
Hughes1B 6 2 3 0 1 1 4 0 3 .404
Valaika SS 5 1 2 0 0 0 1 0 0 .311
Hall DH 5 2 1 0 0 0 0 0 2 .258
Stubbs RF 4 3 1 1 0 0 1 1 2 .179
Spring C 3 3 2 0 0 1 2 1 0 .273
Turner 2B 4 4 4 1 0 0 3 1 0 .320
Jeffress P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Watson P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Fister P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Marquez P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Mason P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Wlodarczyk P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Aguilar P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000

BATTING
2B: Turner (1, Rodriguez, D), Stubbs (1, Rodriguez, D).
3B: Hughes, R (2, Harrell).
HR: Hughes, R (1, 2nd inning off Lopez, W, 2 on, 2 out), Spring (1, 3rd inning off Norrick, 0 on, 2 out), Cain (1, 3rd inning off Norrick, 1 on, 2 out).
TB: Cain 5; Green; Russo; Jackson, A 3; Hughes, R 8; Valaika 2; Hall; Stubbs 2; Spring 5; Turner 5.
RBI: Valaika (8), Turner 3 (6), Green (3), Jackson, A 2 (9), Hughes, R 4 (10), Spring 2 (6), Cain 2 (3), Stubbs (2), Russo 2 (5).
2-out RBI: Green; Jackson, A; Hughes, R 4; Spring; Cain 2; Russo 2.
Runners left in scoring position, 2 out: Hughes, R 2; Jackson, A.
SF: Spring.
Team LOB: 7.

FIELDING
E: Spring (2, throw).


1-Ran for Green in the 3rd.




Peo Javelinas
Player IP H R ER BB SO HR ERA
Jeffress 0.2 3 6 6 2 0 1 12.86
Watson (W, 1-1) 1.1 1 0 0 3 2 0 14.40
Fister (H, 2) 2.0 2 0 0 1 0 0 2.57
Marquez 1.2 0 1 0 4 1 0 2.70
Mason 1.0 4 3 3 0 0 0 15.75
Wlodarczyk 1.0 2 1 1 1 0 0 3.38
Aguilar 1.1 1 0 0 0 1 0 0.00

Redman15
10-21-2008, 08:13 PM
Stubbs and Fisher to represent the Reds in the Rising Star Game in the AFL.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/events/winterleagues/stars/2008/

lollipopcurve
10-22-2008, 07:05 AM
Do not forget the name Justin Turner. Jocketty has a history of administering a full dose of scrappiness at 2nd base -- Turner fits that prescription.

HBP
10-22-2008, 11:47 AM
Do not forget the name Justin Turner. Jocketty has a history of administering a full dose of scrappiness at 2nd base -- Turner fits that prescription.

The next Bo Hart ;)

GOYA
10-22-2008, 06:43 PM
10/22 Turner 4 for 6 with a double, Stubbs 3 for 6 with two doubles, Henry 4 for 6 with a HR. The Javelinas bats have been really hot lately.

OnBaseMachine
10-22-2008, 07:10 PM
Ben (Centerville, OH): The Reds Justin Turner went 4 for 4 last night in the Arizona Fall League with 4 runs, a BB, and an rbi, is he a legit 2B prospect or a future backup?

SportsNation Jim Callis: (2:04 PM ET ) I think he's more of a utilityman but it wouldn't surprise me if he emerged as a starting 2B for a couple of years. He's a gritty guy more than a toolsy guy, though.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/online/majors/espn-chat/2008/267072.html

OnBaseMachine
10-22-2008, 07:19 PM
I just noticed that Turner played third base today and Sean Henry played second base. IIRC Henry was drafted as a shortstop and eventually moved to center field. He seems like a great athlete. That would really raise his value if he can play multiple positions.

Mario-Rijo
10-22-2008, 07:42 PM
Why is it that some players are "Taxi Squad" players, Henry is apparently one of them. He only gets something like 2 games a week or 2 starts a week. I realize that they are "backups" but why the restrictions to how they are used? Anyone know the rundown on this?

OnBaseMachine
10-23-2008, 12:16 PM
Henry caps Javs' rout of Dogs
Collects four of 21 hits in Peoria's second straight blowout

By Danny Wild / Special to MLB.com

Reds prospect Sean Henry went 4-for-6 with a homer and five RBIs on Wednesday to power the Peoria Javelinas past the Phoenix Desert Dogs, 16-5.

Henry hit an RBI grounder in the second inning, singled and scored in the fourth, delivered a run-scoring single in the fifth, singled again in the sixth and slugged a three-run homer, his first of the fall, in the eighth.

It was Henry's most productive game since he drove in four runs for Class A Advanced St. Lucie on May 25, 2007.

The 23-year-old second baseman split the regular season between Double-A Chattanooga and Class A Advanced Sarasota, hitting .286 with 11 homers, 69 RBIs and 20 stolen bases. He had been mired in a 3-for-14 slump to start the Arizona Fall League campaign.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081022&content_id=3637339&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

lollipopcurve
10-23-2008, 01:31 PM
He had been mired in a 3-for-14 slump

It's a wonder he could drag himself to the park.

OnBaseMachine
10-23-2008, 01:57 PM
AFL Dish: Oh Henry!

Posted Oct. 23, 2008 10:42 am by Conor Glassey
Filed under: Arizona Fall League

Prospect Of The Day
Sean Henry has spent most of his minor league career in the outfield.

Drafted by the Mets out of high school in 2004, Henry was sent to Cincinnati in 2007 in the Jeff Conine trade. Henry has always hit well, but proved himself last year at Double-A Chattanooga when he hit .285/.361/.455 with 22 doubles and 11 home runs.

This fall, the Reds are trying him out at third base, but the position change doesn’t seem to be affecting his bat.

Yesterday with the Peoria Javelinas, Henry went 4-for-6 with a home run and five RBIs, helping his team defeat the Phoenix Desert Dogs, 16-5. Over 20 AFL at-bats, Henry is now hitting .350/.409/.500.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/prospects/?p=1752#more-1752

BRM
10-23-2008, 02:12 PM
AFL Dish: Oh Henry!

Posted Oct. 23, 2008 10:42 am by Conor Glassey
Filed under: Arizona Fall League

Prospect Of The Day
Sean Henry has spent most of his minor league career in the outfield.

Drafted by the Mets out of high school in 2004, Henry was sent to Cincinnati in 2007 in the Jeff Conine trade. Henry has always hit well, but proved himself last year at Double-A Chattanooga when he hit .285/.361/.455 with 22 doubles and 11 home runs.

This fall, the Reds are trying him out at third base, but the position change doesn’t seem to be affecting his bat.

Yesterday with the Peoria Javelinas, Henry went 4-for-6 with a home run and five RBIs, helping his team defeat the Phoenix Desert Dogs, 16-5. Over 20 AFL at-bats, Henry is now hitting .350/.409/.500.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/prospects/?p=1752#more-1752

The Reds must be trying to corner the market on corner guys. It seems like every good bat in the system profiles as such.

lollipopcurve
10-23-2008, 02:15 PM
This fall, the Reds are trying him out at third base

I think Henry's been in the OF and at 2B, not 3B. They had Turner at 3B yesterday.

OnBaseMachine
10-23-2008, 02:16 PM
The Reds must be trying to corner the market on corner guys. It seems like every good bat in the system profiles as such.

I think that was a mistake by BA. Henry played second base yesterday, not third. Justin Turner played some third so they may have gotten them mixed up. Henry's an athletic guy, he can play all three outfield positions as well as second base, plus he was drafted as a shortstop.

camisadelgolf
10-23-2008, 02:21 PM
If Sean Henry has good enough defense to play the infield, he goes from a reserve-outfielder-at-best to potentially a top-20-in-the-organization prospect. I'm glad to see that the Reds are trying.

BRM
10-23-2008, 02:25 PM
I think that was a mistake by BA. Henry played second base yesterday, not third. Justin Turner played some third so they may have gotten them mixed up. Henry's an athletic guy, he can play all three outfield positions as well as second base, plus he was drafted as a shortstop.

Ah, gotcha.

Bip Roberts
10-23-2008, 02:47 PM
They also could be just trying to make these guys have the most trade value as possible by not locking them into one position.

BigRed07
10-23-2008, 06:40 PM
Turner was at 2B today and was 1-2 with a double. Henry had a pinch hit double. Valaika was 0-4. Javs got beat 13-1.

PuffyPig
10-24-2008, 10:10 PM
They also could be just trying to make these guys have the most trade value as possible by not locking them into one position.

100% of GM's will think that moving around a player between positions means they aren't very competent at one postion.

Bip Roberts
10-24-2008, 10:18 PM
100% of GM's will think that moving around a player between positions means they aren't very competent at one postion.

If they show they are competent at other positions id imagine it adds some trade value to them. Pretty sure thats why the reds got Wilkin Castillo.

Mario-Rijo
10-24-2008, 11:08 PM
If Sean Henry has good enough defense to play the infield, he goes from a reserve-outfielder-at-best to potentially a top-20-in-the-organization prospect. I'm glad to see that the Reds are trying.

I think the poor kid is getting pigeon-holed myself. Granted some people just don't have a knack for certain things that they may have the talent for but allowing Cumberland to play CF over Henry was a bit odd to say the least.

Again i'll put his BA scouting report from that deal here and ask yourself why he isn't a good fit for CF.


Though Henry, 22, has made much slower progress than Castro, he was beginning to find his groove with St. Lucie. A 20th-round pick in 2004 from Diablo Valley (Calif.) CC, Henry spent nearly three full years in short-season ball, not joining low Class A Hagerstown until last August. An aggressive, athletic player with both bat and running speed, the righthanded-hitting Henry was off to a .293/.355/.456 start with St. Lucie, with 11 homers and 57 RBIs in 450 at-bats. He also chipped in 26 doubles, seven triples and 18 steals (in 29 attempts). Drafted as a shortstop, Henry was moved to second base in 2005 and to center field the next year, where he has shown aptitude.

:confused:

BTW not that it adds much but here's Cumberlands as well. Both of which can be found in a simple google search so I assume it's fine to post.


Tampa Bay harbored high hopes for Cumberland, the club's 10th-round pick from a Florida high school in 2003, but the right fielder had yet to translate his tools to on-field production. Even though the 22-year-old was batting just .246/.303/.347 for Montgomery at the time of the trade, he offers speed, arm strength, budding power from the left side and the athleticism to play all three outfield spots. Cumberland's trouble has been plate discipline, as he gives away too many at-bats. His brother Drew, a shortstop, was a Padres supplemental first-round pick in June.

OnBaseMachine
10-25-2008, 01:49 AM
In the AFL Rising Stars game tonight, Stubbs went 0-for-3 with two bases loaded walks, one of which came in the bottom of 9th to win the game. Carlos Fisher allowed an unearned run in 0.1 innings.

The box:

http://mlb.mlb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?t=g_box&gid=2008_10_24_afawin_afnwin_1&sid=l119

mth123
10-25-2008, 06:52 PM
10/25

Henry - 2 for 4 with an SB
Valaika - 2 for 2 with 2 BB (nice to see the BB from him)
Turner - 0 for 4
Watson - 1IP, 2H, 1ER, 1BB, 1K.

camisadelgolf
10-25-2008, 06:59 PM
Is Henry off the taxi squad? It seems like he's been playing a lot more lately.

Orenda
10-27-2008, 05:03 PM
Viola with another good game 5ip, 1 earned run, 2 hits, 2 bb, 3ks

Redman15
10-27-2008, 05:32 PM
Stubbs leading off in LF. Valiaka hitting 5th at SS. Henry hitting 9th in RF.
Stubbs 1-4,RBI,Run(Double)
Valaika 0-3,RBI(Sac Fly)
Henry 1-3,Run,RBI

Viola 5 IP, 2 hits , 1ER (win #2)
Manuel 1.1 IP 3 hits, 2ER
Fisher 1.0 IP, 0 R, 2 Ks.(save #3)

Javs win 6-3.

OnBaseMachine
10-29-2008, 01:47 AM
10/28...Javs lost 3-2:

Stubbs: 0-for-3 two walks
Valaika: 1-for-4
Turner: 2-for-4 double

Valaika made three errors (2 fielding, 1 throwing) at shortstop.

Redman15
10-29-2008, 02:55 PM
Turner is batting 7th and playing 1B. That's not a typo. Henry is hitting 8th and playing 2B.

BRM
10-29-2008, 02:58 PM
A 5'11" first baseman. You gotta love that.

Redman15
10-29-2008, 06:53 PM
Javs lost 10-2. Turner was 0-3 and Henry was 1-3. Watson went 1.1 IP
0 Runs and 1 hit.

OnBaseMachine
10-29-2008, 07:03 PM
Stubbs has another blog post up:

http://aflreds.mlblogs.com/archives/2008/10/rising_stars_games_adds_new_di.html

mth123
10-29-2008, 07:04 PM
Javs lost 10-2. Turner was 0-3 and Henry was 1-3. Watson went 1.1 IP
0 Runs and 1 hit.

Henry stole a base. 34 PAs, .387/.441/.516/.957 with 3 BB, 1HR and 6 SB. Add some versatility and he has improved his stock IMO.

Turner may be the only other Red in the AFL to improve his standing:
48PAs .341/.396/.432/.828. I have Valaika rated higher based on reputation/market value but I actually think Turner will be a better major league player.

Fisher has performed as expected. The others have been disappointing IMO, but Viola has made a nice recovery.

Its a way small sample.

Redman15
10-30-2008, 04:00 PM
Stubby leading off in RF. Valaika hitting 5th at SS. Javs give up 4 runs in the 1st
for the 2nd straight day. 4-0 after 1.

Redman15
10-30-2008, 05:52 PM
Javs lose 7-1. Stubby was 0-3 with a HBP and Valaika was 0-4 with 3 K's.
Manuel 2.1 innings 2 H and 2 K's.

Redman15
10-31-2008, 03:08 PM
Javs at red hot Mesa. They have won 10 out of their last 11 games.
Stubbs hitting 2nd in LF.
Vakaika hitting 5th at SS.
Turner hitting 9th at 2B.

Redman15
10-31-2008, 04:44 PM
Javs tied 1-1 in B5. Stubbs is 0-3. Valaika is 1-2. Turner is 2-2.

Redman15
10-31-2008, 05:52 PM
Javs lose 3-2. Stubbs 0-4 (.188 avg). Valaika 1-4 Run (.273 avg)
Turner 3-4 (.375 avg) Fisher throw a 1,2,3 8th inning with 1 K.

OnBaseMachine
10-31-2008, 06:40 PM
Fisher is a stud. Another 1-2-3 inning with a K and two groundouts. His line so far in the AFL: 6 IP, 2 H, 1 R, 2 BB, 7 K, 1.50 ERA, 4.50 GO/FO.

HokieRed
11-01-2008, 12:02 AM
Whatever we do about the bullpen signings, it had better not get in the way of the development of Fisher and Roenicke, especially, IMHO, Fisher.

JaxRed
11-01-2008, 11:11 AM
Went to the AFL game in Mesa yesterday. First of 3 on extended weekend, It was played at HoHoKam Park which is Cubs sping training Park. Not sure why I thought it was a dive, but it's a nce park.

AFL teams wear the Major league uniforms with hats from AFL team. They use to have to wear AFL uniforms.

Stubbs looked good in LF, but bad at plate
Valaika couldn't come up with tough play in 1st innning and they gave him error. I was a little suprised the called it error. After that he looked good. Got one line drve hit.
Turner was flawless on normal chances in field and had good day at bat, but mostly fround balls that got thru.
Fiasher worn a practice jersey? And got two grounders and a K on high strike.

TRF
11-01-2008, 11:20 AM
Stubbs is having a very bad AFL at the dish. Is he really ready for AAA, or should he start at AA? I guess it depends on how the coaches evaluate his time in the AFL and if they see his AAA stats as a streak or indicative of his expected regular production. Notice I didn't say talent. I think he has talent, but lacks skills.

dougdirt
11-01-2008, 11:36 AM
Stubbs is having a very bad AFL at the dish. Is he really ready for AAA, or should he start at AA? I guess it depends on how the coaches evaluate his time in the AFL and if they see his AAA stats as a streak or indicative of his expected regular production. Notice I didn't say talent. I think he has talent, but lacks skills.

He is going to start in AAA because he showed his ability to play there last year just fine. We don't know if he is out there working on a specific thing or not right now, which could (and I stress could, because we don't know) be why he is struggling. There just is no way that the AFL is going to demote him back to AA after he showed success in AAA last season.

membengal
11-01-2008, 12:41 PM
I would start him at AA, but then again, I thought he should have finished at that level. I thought the move to AAA was rushed.

dougdirt
11-01-2008, 01:47 PM
I would start him at AA, but then again, I thought he should have finished at that level. I thought the move to AAA was rushed.

It was only done because AAA needed a centerfielder because of injuries, much like Bruce was promoted quickly from AA in 2007. Neither was planned, but both happened because of injuries. Given the success Stubbs showed in AAA though, I just don't see where they send him back to AA. Not that I don't think he couldn't benefit from a month or two there, but just that it won't happen.

SMcGavin
11-01-2008, 06:33 PM
I would start him at AA, but then again, I thought he should have finished at that level. I thought the move to AAA was rushed.

He was definitely rushed, but for better or worse I don't see the Reds sending him back to AA.

JaxRed
11-01-2008, 09:25 PM
Attending the game for Peoria tonight!! At game and they have wifi at park so I'm here to do some semi-play by play !!!

Chris Valaika standing right in front of me.

Ran by new complex in Gooodyear, couldn't see wheere they have started Reds part of conmplex at all. Indians facility done. Stadiuim far from done. I bet you they have one of those "still painting things as game starts" deals

JaxRed
11-01-2008, 09:27 PM
I'm at Peoria stadium whuch is shared facility for Padres/Mariners for ST. I think this in one they showed Reds. It is a fantastic facility. I can see why Reds were tempted.

I've never seen a comparable facility in Florida

BigRed07
11-01-2008, 09:29 PM
Turner is hitting 2nd playing 3B. Valaika is at SS hitting 4th.
Stubbs is hitting 5th in RF. Viola is the starting pitcher for the
Javs.

JaxRed
11-01-2008, 09:57 PM
Viola gives single to second hiitter, balks him to 2nd and then sharp grounder up middle scores him.

Next hitter hits huge bomb to RCF 3-0

Then sharp grounder past Turner for double, runner tries to steal 3rd and is caught


Then another bomb to LCF 4-0 thse weren't cheap

Oppo blooop in front of Stubbs then triple by Stubbs (I think he should have caught it, then single.

6-0


another single than the final out

JaxRed
11-01-2008, 10:21 PM
Viola starts 2nd with swing K and then another homer. Wow

then another K and then another homer 8-0


Then another K

BTW Turner grounded out in 1st, Valika to lead off 2nd

OnBaseMachine
11-01-2008, 10:22 PM
Not a good night for Pedro. He had been pitching well lately.

JaxRed
11-01-2008, 10:37 PM
In second, Valaika (who has hot girlfriend) hit toopper to 3rd that 3rd basenam coouldn't come up with for Stubbs hit to SS but beat throw to 1st to avoid dp. STubbs stole second

Watson pitching

JaxRed
11-01-2008, 10:51 PM
watson has walked 3 and given up a single 9-0 with 2 outs, not a good day for Reds pitchers so far

another single makes in 10-0

JaxRed
11-01-2008, 11:23 PM
Watson only piched one inning, Turner got on via erro next time, Valaikia made out, Can't remember how, Stubbs K's... he is not doing much out here.

I really like what I see from Atl catcher Flowers

BigRed07
11-01-2008, 11:26 PM
Turner scored on a Smoak triple. Valaika and Stubbs K'd.
10-1 Javs trail.

dougdirt
11-01-2008, 11:44 PM
John Sickels noted earlier today that a lot of the players look to be very tired, does it look that way Jaxred?

BigRed07
11-01-2008, 11:53 PM
Those guy's in the Mesa dugout arms and legs have to be getting tired the way their swinging it. 12 runs on 17 hits in the 1st six innings.

OnBaseMachine
11-01-2008, 11:53 PM
John Sickels noted earlier today that a lot of the players look to be very tired, does it look that way Jaxred?

That makes sense because there are a lot of top prospects currently struggling in that league.

sh0619
11-01-2008, 11:57 PM
Watson only piched one inning, Turner got on via erro next time, Valaikia made out, Can't remember how, Stubbs K's... he is not doing much out here.

I really like what I see from Atl catcher Flowers

How long will you be in AZ?

JaxRed
11-02-2008, 01:48 AM
thru Mondays game

mth123
11-02-2008, 05:02 AM
Bad Day in AZ.

Turner at 3B 0 for 4.
Valaika at SS 1 for 2.
Stubbs in RF 0 for 4 with an SB.
Viola 2 IP, 11H, 4HR, 8ER, 0BB, 4K.
Watson 1 IP, 2H, 2ER,3BB, 1K.

Under the radar guys like Turner, Sean Henry and Carlos Fisher are the only guys in AZ increasing their value which doesn't help as trading season gets going. Bigger names, that may be trade pieces, haven't impressed. Valaika has been Ho Hum. Stubbs, Viola, and Watson have been disasters. Robert Manuel may have added some value. He's followed up winning a AA relief award with a decent showing but its nothing eye catching. I doubt he has much market value. The Reds needed big performances from Stubbs and Valaika and they haven't done it..

icehole3
11-02-2008, 06:00 AM
these games are good for these guys development, the fact that theyre there is a feather in their caps IMO.

sh0619
11-02-2008, 11:23 AM
thru Mondays game

Well darn...some of the other "hot wives/girlfriends" will be there Friday! LOL :p:

Spring~Fields
11-02-2008, 02:04 PM
Bad Day in AZ.

Turner at 3B 0 for 4.
Valaika at SS 1 for 2.
Stubbs in RF 0 for 4 with an SB.
Viola 2 IP, 11H, 4HR, 8ER, 0BB, 4K.
Watson 1 IP, 2H, 2ER,3BB, 1K.

Under the radar guys like Turner, Sean Henry and Carlos Fisher are the only guys in AZ increasing their value which doesn't help as trading season gets going. Bigger names, that may be trade pieces, haven't impressed. Valaika has been Ho Hum. Stubbs, Viola, and Watson have been disasters. Robert Manuel may have added some value. He's followed up winning a AA relief award with a decent showing but its nothing eye catching. I doubt he has much market value. The Reds needed big performances from Stubbs and Valaika and they haven't done it..

You might be right that the trading resources for 09 are getting thiner. :(

TRF
11-02-2008, 04:19 PM
He is going to start in AAA because he showed his ability to play there last year just fine. We don't know if he is out there working on a specific thing or not right now, which could (and I stress could, because we don't know) be why he is struggling. There just is no way that the AFL is going to demote him back to AA after he showed success in AAA last season.

Success? it was 19 games. That screams small sample. He was getting killed in the FSL, but 19 games at AAA says he's ready?He's OPS'ing under .600 in the AFL, and that's attributed to "WORKING ON SOMETHING"? please. The AFL is not the place to work on things. It's a place to build on your recent success against the best prospects in baseball. He's failing in that respect.

OnBaseMachine
11-02-2008, 04:33 PM
There are quite a few top prospects struggling in the AFL. I wouldn't put too much weight into Stubbs struggles.

membengal
11-02-2008, 04:39 PM
I'd put some weight on it, and I have been one who thinks the complaining about Stubbs is over-the-top.

He needs to start at AA and build on what he was doing there before he was prematurely moved to AAA.

dougdirt
11-02-2008, 05:31 PM
Success? it was 19 games. That screams small sample. He was getting killed in the FSL, but 19 games at AAA says he's ready?He's OPS'ing under .600 in the AFL, and that's attributed to "WORKING ON SOMETHING"? please. The AFL is not the place to work on things. It's a place to build on your recent success against the best prospects in baseball. He's failing in that respect.

Where did I ever say he was ready? And he wasn't getting killed in the FSL. He was doing what most guys do in the FSL, holding their own until they leave. And no, your desire to rip Stubbs to shreds makes you read into things to much. I never said he was having a bad AFL because he was working on something, I said its possible that it could be one of the reasons. And as for the AFL not being the place to work on things..... what? A TON of guys are sent there for just that reason. Robert Manuel has said he was sent to the AFL to work on his change up. Todd Frazier has said he was in the HWL to work on his situational hitting with two strikes. Is Drew working on a specific thing? No clue. But he could be just like a bunch of other guys are.

TOBTTReds
11-02-2008, 05:34 PM
Success? it was 19 games. That screams small sample. He was getting killed in the FSL, but 19 games at AAA says he's ready?He's OPS'ing under .600 in the AFL, and that's attributed to "WORKING ON SOMETHING"? please. The AFL is not the place to work on things. It's a place to build on your recent success against the best prospects in baseball. He's failing in that respect.

This post is below your standard TRF.

Spring~Fields
11-02-2008, 09:08 PM
I said its possible that it could be one of the reasons. And as for the AFL not being the place to work on things..... what? A TON of guys are sent there for just that reason. Robert Manuel has said he was sent to the AFL to work on his change up. Todd Frazier has said he was in the HWL to work on his situational hitting with two strikes. Is Drew working on a specific thing? No clue. But he could be just like a bunch of other guys are.

You're right that he might be working on something there and that be what is going on.

SMcGavin
11-02-2008, 09:46 PM
I'd put some weight on it, and I have been one who thinks the complaining about Stubbs is over-the-top.

He needs to start at AA and build on what he was doing there before he was prematurely moved to AAA.

100% agree. Stubbs' performance in AFL isn't the be-all-end-all, but the sample size there is just about the same as his work in Louisville. Both need to be given a little bit of weight when evaluating the guy.

And I would start him in AA too but I just don't see it happening.

TRF
11-03-2008, 09:49 AM
Where did I ever say he was ready? And he wasn't getting killed in the FSL. He was doing what most guys do in the FSL, holding their own until they leave. And no, your desire to rip Stubbs to shreds makes you read into things to much. I never said he was having a bad AFL because he was working on something, I said its possible that it could be one of the reasons. And as for the AFL not being the place to work on things..... what? A TON of guys are sent there for just that reason. Robert Manuel has said he was sent to the AFL to work on his change up. Todd Frazier has said he was in the HWL to work on his situational hitting with two strikes. Is Drew working on a specific thing? No clue. But he could be just like a bunch of other guys are.
I'll concede the idea that it's possible he's working on something. Perhaps he's mentioned it in his blog. I haven't been following it too closely, so I don't really know.


100% agree. Stubbs' performance in AFL isn't the be-all-end-all, but the sample size there is just about the same as his work in Louisville. Both need to be given a little bit of weight when evaluating the guy.

And I would start him in AA too but I just don't see it happening.

I think he should start at AA because he's had no sustained success at any level since Low A. He needs to be in a situation where he can dominate pitchers that have adjusted to him. He certainly hasn't done that. After starting out white hot in high a ball, opposing pitchers all but shut him down for 60+ games. He got a taste of AAA and had a little success. Let him build on that at a level more conducive to his current skills and not his potential talent. AA is perfect for him right now, and that is NOT a knock on him. If he can rip up AA for 3+ months let him finish up in Louisville and compete for a spot with the Reds in 2010.

Redman15
11-03-2008, 07:26 PM
Stubby is the only Red in the line up tonight in RF hitting 7th.

BigRed07
11-03-2008, 11:33 PM
Stubbs 0-4 2k's and 6 LOB. Manuel pitched 1.1 innings,2 Hits 1 K, 0 ER Blown Save (1) . Javs lose again 5-3.

Screwball
11-04-2008, 05:40 AM
Stubbs 0-4 2k's and 6 LOB.

Stubbs has the struggs.

BRM
11-04-2008, 09:35 AM
Drew Stubbs updated line in the AFL (63 plate appearances):

.161/.277/.232

BRM
11-04-2008, 09:39 AM
Here's the other Reds lines:

Sean Henry .387/.441/.516/.957 (34 PA's)

Justin Turner .346/.393/.423/.816 (56 PA's)

Chris Valaika .279/.315/.397/.712 (72 PA's)

Spring~Fields
11-04-2008, 11:57 AM
How many of these guys do we anticipate will have a chance playing at Louisville this year?

BRM
11-04-2008, 11:59 AM
I think Stubbs and Valaika definitely start in Louisville. Turner has only had a 1/2 season in AA so he may start back there next year. Not sure where Henry will start.

Redman15
11-04-2008, 12:06 PM
Stubbs is having a rough time in the AFL. If he doesn't have a strong showing in Spring training he could end up in AA to work on some things.

BRM
11-04-2008, 12:09 PM
Stubbs is having a rough time in the AFL. If he doesn't have a strong showing in Spring training he could end up in AA to work on some things.

I see your point but I would imagine his strong showing in AAA last year puts him there in 2009.

TRF
11-04-2008, 01:45 PM
I see your point but I would imagine his strong showing in AAA last year puts him there in 2009.

19 games. And while he's only at about 14 games or so in the AFL, If you think his skill level at this point is somewhere in between then he needs to be in AA.

BRM
11-04-2008, 01:47 PM
19 games. And while he's only at about 14 games or so in the AFL, If you think his skill level at this point is somewhere in between then he needs to be in AA.

I wouldn't have a problem with him starting in AA next year. I just think the Reds will start him in Louisville unless he has an absolutely horrible ST.

Spring~Fields
11-04-2008, 02:51 PM
I think Stubbs and Valaika definitely start in Louisville. Turner has only had a 1/2 season in AA so he may start back there next year. Not sure where Henry will start.

Thanks BRM

TRF
11-04-2008, 03:25 PM
I think Henry should be in AAA. Henry, Cumberland and Dorn. All three are advanced bats, and 2 of them can play at least a competent CF. Not at Stubbs level, but competent. That's a very good hitting OF.

BRM
11-04-2008, 03:29 PM
I think Henry should be in AAA. Henry, Cumberland and Dorn. All three are advanced bats, and 2 of them can play at least a competent CF. Not at Stubbs level, but competent. That's a very good hitting OF.

I'd like to see that OF in Louisville. Although I still think Stubbs is there instead of Henry.

redsof72
11-04-2008, 04:25 PM
I do not have the ability to start threads but some notes that some may find interesting:

Among players who have become six year free agents (and are therefore no longer part of the Reds organization, at least for the moment) are Kevin Barker, Alvin Colina, Tonys Gutierrez, Aaron Herr, Mike Hrynio, Justin Lehr, Bobby Livingston, Rob Mackowiak, and Joe Valentine. Livingston was outrighted off the 40 man first.

Luis Bolivar and Chris Kroski were re-signed to minor league contracts for 2009.

Several players were unconditionally released. The only ones who had surfaced in a full-season league were Brett Bartles and Anthony Gressick.

OnBaseMachine
11-04-2008, 04:41 PM
Jerry Gil was also re-signed.

TRF
11-04-2008, 05:25 PM
After looking at their stats, maybe it should be Cumberland that is the odd man out if the Reds decide that Stubbs is a lock for AAA. Cumberlands stats for AA in 2008 were 100 points higher than his career OPS. His OBP and SLG about 50 points higher each. Kinda screams abnormal to me. Meanwhile Henry in an almost full season of A+ ball in 2007 had a .811 OPS. In 2008 in an almost full season of AA it was .813. That's steady production across two levels.

highheat11
11-04-2008, 05:27 PM
I do not have the ability to start threads but some notes that some may find interesting:

Among players who have become six year free agents (and are therefore no longer part of the Reds organization, at least for the moment) are Kevin Barker, Alvin Colina, Tonys Gutierrez, Aaron Herr, Mike Hrynio, Justin Lehr, Bobby Livingston, Rob Mackowiak, and Joe Valentine. Livingston was outrighted off the 40 man first.

Luis Bolivar and Chris Kroski were re-signed to minor league contracts for 2009.

Several players were unconditionally released. The only ones who had surfaced in a full-season league were Brett Bartles and Anthony Gressick.

Where did you get this information?

Mario-Rijo
11-04-2008, 05:38 PM
I do not have the ability to start threads but some notes that some may find interesting:

Among players who have become six year free agents (and are therefore no longer part of the Reds organization, at least for the moment) are Kevin Barker, Alvin Colina, Tonys Gutierrez, Aaron Herr, Mike Hrynio, Justin Lehr, Bobby Livingston, Rob Mackowiak, and Joe Valentine. Livingston was outrighted off the 40 man first.

Luis Bolivar and Chris Kroski were re-signed to minor league contracts for 2009.

Several players were unconditionally released. The only ones who had surfaced in a full-season league were Brett Bartles and Anthony Gressick.

I would expect Gutierrez back along with maybe Valentine, Colina & Livingston.

TRF
11-04-2008, 05:59 PM
wait. the Reds got Valentine again? when did that happen?

OnBaseMachine
11-04-2008, 06:02 PM
wait. the Reds got Valentine again? when did that happen?

The Reds signed him from an Independent League team back in early August.

JayBruceFan
11-04-2008, 06:07 PM
Wrong Thread

highheat11
11-04-2008, 06:08 PM
Does anybody know where the list of all the released players can be found?

Redman15
11-04-2008, 06:57 PM
Valaika is playing SS and hitting 6th. Turner is at 2nd hitting 9th today for the Javs.

mth123
11-04-2008, 08:23 PM
After looking at their stats, maybe it should be Cumberland that is the odd man out if the Reds decide that Stubbs is a lock for AAA. Cumberlands stats for AA in 2008 were 100 points higher than his career OPS. His OBP and SLG about 50 points higher each. Kinda screams abnormal to me. Meanwhile Henry in an almost full season of A+ ball in 2007 had a .811 OPS. In 2008 in an almost full season of AA it was .813. That's steady production across two levels.

Why not this:

Dorn 1B, Turner 2B, Janish SS, Valaika 3B, Henry LF, Stubbs CF, Cumberland RF, Tatum C and Griffin at Supersub with a Rotation of Bailey, Maloney, Thompson, Lecure and Jukich.

Could be a pretty good AAA team. Could flip flop positions with Turner and Valaika. Need to find out if Valaika can handle 2B.

Mario-Rijo
11-04-2008, 08:37 PM
Why not this:

Dorn 1B, Turner 2B, Janish SS, Valaika 3B, Henry LF, Stubbs CF, Cumberland RF, Tatum C and Griffin at Supersub with a Rotation of Bailey, Maloney, Thompson, Lecure and Jukich.

Could be a pretty good AAA team. Could flip flop positions with Turner and Valaika. Need to find out if Valaika can handle 2B.

Yeah I like it. I would mainly play Valaika at 2B with little deviation from the plan. I don't think he is a long term solution @ 3B or SS, doesn't have the arm for 3rd or the range for SS. Sure he could play those positions and be semi-passable but he's not ideally suited for either. He's probably still playing SS at times to see if another team believes he can pull it off. After the AFL if not dealt he is likely to be pushed to 2B, just a hunch.

BigRed07
11-05-2008, 12:01 AM
Valaika was 0-4.
Turner was 1-3.
Fisher had a rough night. 1 inn 4 hits 4 ER's.
Javs lost 9-3.

OnBaseMachine
11-05-2008, 12:09 AM
Fisher had been terrific up to this point. He threw 40 pitches so he should be unavailable for a few days.

OnBaseMachine
11-05-2008, 08:02 PM
11/5 game:

Henry: 0-for-4 walk
Valaika: 3-for-4 double

Watson: 1 IP, 3 H, 4 R, 1 ER, 2 BB, 1 K

Mario-Rijo
11-05-2008, 08:40 PM
11/5 game:

Henry: 0-for-4 walk
Valaika: 3-for-4 double

Watson: 1 IP, 3 H, 4 R, 1 ER, 2 BB, 1 K

Goodness gracious Watson. Somoene call Terry Reynolds and tell him to send his butt back to A Ball until he gets his stuff together. Has the kid had 1 performance where he didn't give up a run or more?

Redman15
11-06-2008, 02:14 PM
Stubby leading off in RF. Tuner batting 2nd at 2B. Valaika batting 6th at SS.
Javs are looking to end their 8 game losing streak today.

mace
11-06-2008, 02:37 PM
Does it bother anyone that Stubbs has gotten no starts at all (at least, not that I've seen) in center field? I realize that Austin Jackson is there, but surely he can't be better defensively than Stubbs. And even if he somehow is, you'd think Stubbs would at least get a few starts there. Do you suspect that the Reds have requested that he be used in left and right?

Mario-Rijo
11-06-2008, 02:55 PM
Does it bother anyone that Stubbs has gotten no starts at all (at least, not that I've seen) in center field? I realize that Austin Jackson is there, but surely he can't be better defensively than Stubbs. And even if he somehow is, you'd think Stubbs would at least get a few starts there. Do you suspect that the Reds have requested that he be used in left and right?

Actually most of the OF's there are CF's and there is supposed to be a rotation. But like you I don't recall seeing him in CF as of yet. I just assumed I missed it. I doubt the Reds have requested that specifically though.

Redman15
11-06-2008, 03:00 PM
Each team get to designate one player as a priority player. The Reds selected Valaika to play SS. The Yankees selected Jackson to play CF. The priority players get most of the playing time at their positions. That's why Stubb's is not getting much playing time in CF. That's also why Valaika has played in 20 games to Stubby's 12.

BRM
11-06-2008, 03:02 PM
Each team get to designate one player as a priority player. The Reds selected Valaika to play SS. The Yankees selected Jackson to play CF. The priority players get most of the playing time at their positions. That's why Stubb's is not getting much playing time in CF. That's also why Valaika has played in 20 games to Stubby's 12.

Thanks for that info! That's good to know.

Mario-Rijo
11-06-2008, 03:10 PM
Each team get to designate one player as a priority player. The Reds selected Valaika to play SS. The Yankees selected Jackson to play CF. The priority players get most of the playing time at their positions. That's why Stubb's is not getting much playing time in CF. That's also why Valaika has played in 20 games to Stubby's 12.

That's interesting. I suppose they know that Stubbs can play CF already so no real need for him to do so. Maybe they figure they can get someone to buy Valaika as an actual SS, or maybe they actually think he can pull it off.

Redman15
11-06-2008, 03:13 PM
The Reds must be happy with Valaika's progress as a SS. I don't think they are going to move him to another position anytime soon or the would have designated him as a priority player at that position for the AFL.

dougdirt
11-06-2008, 03:20 PM
The Reds must be happy with Valaika's progress as a SS. I don't think they are going to move him to another position anytime soon or the would have designated him as a priority player at that position for the AFL.

I have heard his range improved some this year at shortstop.

mace
11-06-2008, 03:49 PM
Each team get to designate one player as a priority player. The Reds selected Valaika to play SS. The Yankees selected Jackson to play CF. The priority players get most of the playing time at their positions. That's why Stubb's is not getting much playing time in CF. That's also why Valaika has played in 20 games to Stubby's 12.

Now that's good information. (And I'm amazed that somebody knew it.) Thank you.

Redman15
11-06-2008, 04:07 PM
Javs winning 6-0 in the T6. Stubby is 1-4,RBI. Turner 1-3,RBI. Valaika 1-3,Run.

Mario-Rijo
11-06-2008, 04:13 PM
I have heard his range improved some this year at shortstop.

Really, that's unusual. How the heck does one gain range? Become more svelt perhaps, or just being better at positioning oneself? Or both!? If so that's nice to hear.

TOBTTReds
11-06-2008, 04:20 PM
I have heard his range improved some this year at shortstop.

I watched him play about 15 games this year...his range was fine, and he made plays outside of his "zone" very well. A lot of good diving plays up the middle and short choppers. You know how Kepp's range is bad, it is probably worse because he makes no plays that he has to make really good plays on. CV makes great plays every game. I'm not against him playing SS every day if he is the best option. But if it is CV and BP in the infield in 2010. I would make the swap.

dougdirt
11-06-2008, 04:30 PM
Really, that's unusual. How the heck does one gain range? Become more svelt perhaps, or just being better at positioning oneself? Or both!? If so that's nice to hear.

He came in this year a little bit lighter. I am sure practice and hard work have helped as well.

Mario-Rijo
11-06-2008, 04:51 PM
He came in this year a little bit lighter. I am sure practice and hard work have helped as well.

Well that's encouraging in more than one way. Thanks for the info.

icehole3
11-07-2008, 04:17 AM
I honestly think the real SS of the future for the Reds is Cozart, with CV going to 2nd just saying.

mth123
11-07-2008, 04:52 AM
11/6

Stubbs 1 for 5 with a 3B.
Turner 1 for 5.
Valaika 1 for 4 with a BB, and a 3B.

Manuel 1 IP, 2H, 1K.

I'm underwhelmed with the collective showing of Reds players in the AFL. Good to see Valaika take a BB.

lollipopcurve
11-07-2008, 08:47 AM
I'm underwhelmed with the collective showing of Reds players in the AFL. Good to see Valaika take a BB.

I'm not. Stubbs and Watson have done poorly. Otherwise, Turner and Henry have solidified their stock as legit fringe prospects, Valaika has been solid (the guy does not seem to wear down -- remember, he played last winter in Hawaii, then a full season without injury in A/AA -- and that's a positive trait), Fisher has had only 1 bad outing, Manuel has been pretty good, and Viola has had some nice outings as a starter in a tough pitcher's environment. Overall, satisfactory in my book.

Redman15
11-07-2008, 01:49 PM
Turner is hitting 8th at 2B and Viola is on the bump for the Javs.
Here we go again. Javs trailing 6-0 after 1. Viola getting roughed up a bit.

Peo Saguaros Bottom 1st

* Ian Desmond homers (2) on a fly ball to left field.
* Daniel Murphy walks.
* Tyler Greene strikes out swinging.
* Kyle Blanks doubles (5) on a line drive to left fielder Lorenzo Cain. Daniel Murphy scores.
* Mike Baxter homers (3) on a fly ball to right field. Kyle Blanks scores.
* Coaching visit to mound.
* Chad Huffman walks.
* Leonard Davis doubles (3) on a line drive to right fielder J. T. Hall. Chad Huffman to 3rd.
* Sean Kazmar reaches on a fielder's choice, fielded by shortstop Carlos Triunfel. Chad Huffman scores. Leonard Davis scores. Sean Kazmar to 2nd. Throwing error by shortstop Carlos Triunfel.
* Josh Thole grounds out to first baseman Juan Miranda. Sean Kazmar to 3rd.
* Ian Desmond strikes out swinging.

Redman15
11-07-2008, 06:23 PM
Javs lose 13-4. Turner 2-4,RBI,Run. Viola 1 inn, 4 H, 6 R, 5 ER's.

mth123
11-07-2008, 09:12 PM
I'm not. Stubbs and Watson have done poorly. Otherwise, Turner and Henry have solidified their stock as legit fringe prospects, Valaika has been solid (the guy does not seem to wear down -- remember, he played last winter in Hawaii, then a full season without injury in A/AA -- and that's a positive trait), Fisher has had only 1 bad outing, Manuel has been pretty good, and Viola has had some nice outings as a starter in a tough pitcher's environment. Overall, satisfactory in my book.

I'll give you Turner and Henry. Valaika isn't doing much. As an offensive minded IF he's putting up .288/.326/.425/.751. Just like last year, decent competition seems to hold him down. He's proving that he'll need to hit .320 to have any value. He doesn't make up for it with his glove. Smells a lot like Jeff Keppinger to me. Stubbs has been horrible. Viola and Watson have been awful. Fisher and Manuel have been ok. Nobody has jumped out and created a buzz that the Reds can cash in for something. Collectively underwhelmed is pretty accurate IMO.

BigRed07
11-07-2008, 09:38 PM
Here is a video from the AFL.
http://mlb.mlb.com/media/video.jsp?mid=200811063666904

mth123
11-09-2008, 03:27 AM
11/8

Stubbs 2 for 4 with a BB and a 2B.
Valaika 1 for 3 with a BB and a 2B.
Henry 0 for 1.
Watson 1 IP, 1 H, 2 BB, 2 ER, 1K.
Fisher .66 IP, 4H, 1 BB, 3 ER, 1K,

Nice game for Stubbs. Another walk for Valaika. Nice sign from him.
Add Fisher to the list of disappointments.

lollipopcurve
11-09-2008, 09:04 AM
He's proving that he'll need to hit .320 to have any value.

Strongly disagree here. I think there's a good chance Valaika becomes a solid defensive 2B with a plus bat. Do not forget he's still young and had 1 less year of college competition than the rest of his class. His history is of taking about a 1/2 year to adjust to a new level, then he rakes.

Declaring that players "prove" anything in a few weeks of the Arizona Fall League is reaching. Valaika is holding his own while playing just about every day (lots of players out there are part timing) at SS -- you know he's got to be wearing down, but he's grinding. Big positive in my book.

TRF
11-09-2008, 12:19 PM
Strongly disagree here. I think there's a good chance Valaika becomes a solid defensive 2B with a plus bat. Do not forget he's still young and had 1 less year of college competition than the rest of his class. His history is of taking about a 1/2 year to adjust to a new level, then he rakes.

Declaring that players "prove" anything in a few weeks of the Arizona Fall League is reaching. Valaika is holding his own while playing just about every day (lots of players out there are part timing) at SS -- you know he's got to be wearing down, but he's grinding. Big positive in my book.

I agree, but it's no less reaching than saying a player has proved something in a few weeks at AAA. That goes for Stubbs, Ramirez (MLB) or Bailey (who proved the opposite) It's the larger body of work we have to look at and progression/sample size. It's why I like Valaika but mistrust Stubbs.

mth123
11-09-2008, 02:15 PM
Strongly disagree here. I think there's a good chance Valaika becomes a solid defensive 2B with a plus bat. Do not forget he's still young and had 1 less year of college competition than the rest of his class. His history is of taking about a 1/2 year to adjust to a new level, then he rakes.

Declaring that players "prove" anything in a few weeks of the Arizona Fall League is reaching. Valaika is holding his own while playing just about every day (lots of players out there are part timing) at SS -- you know he's got to be wearing down, but he's grinding. Big positive in my book.

Batting average is his only plus tool. He needs to maximize it to get on base enough. He has moderate power that plays well in the MI. If he is a good MI defensively, then he's a pretty good player. So far there isn't any evidence that he will be good enough for the MI. Until the position question gets settled, I can't rate a guy real highly when the adequacy of his offense is position dependent.

JayBruceFan
11-09-2008, 02:21 PM
Stubbs needs to quit bloggin and start hittin

dougdirt
11-09-2008, 02:23 PM
Batting average is his only plus tool. He needs to maximize it to get on base enough. He has moderate power that plays well in the MI. If he is a good MI defensively, then he's a pretty good player. So far there isn't any evidence that he will be good enough for the MI. Until the position question gets settled, I can't rate a guy real highly when the adequacy of his offense is position dependent.

There isn't any evidence that he is a bad MI defensively either.

TRF
11-09-2008, 04:24 PM
There isn't any evidence that he is a bad MI defensively either.

It will be interesting to see where he starts next year and at what level. If he's at AAA is it at SS or 2B?

dougdirt
11-09-2008, 04:36 PM
It will be interesting to see where he starts next year and at what level. If he's at AAA is it at SS or 2B?

Gotta be at SS. Janish is what he is.... a good backup glove.

Redman15
11-10-2008, 02:12 PM
Turner hitting 2nd playing 2B. Valaika hitting 6th playing SS.
Javs lead 10-4 in the B5.
Turner 2-3,Dbl,R : Valaika 0-0,RBI,2R,2BB,SF.

Orenda
11-10-2008, 07:57 PM
Turner 2-5, dbl, 1r
Valaika 1-2, 1rbi, 3r, 2bb's
Manuel 1ip 0 h, 0bb, 1k

RedsManRick
11-10-2008, 08:11 PM
FWIW, in his article on the AFL today, Joe Sheehan said the following "Chris Valaika looked good enough on a few plays to make me think he can stay at shortstop." Joe would be the first to tell you he's not a scout, but it's still good to hear.

JayBruceFan
11-10-2008, 09:29 PM
Has his defense ever been questioned before?

Other than by people on this board?

dougdirt
11-10-2008, 09:31 PM
Has his defense ever been questioned before?

Other than by people on this board?

Yeah it has been.

SMcGavin
11-10-2008, 09:32 PM
FWIW, in his article on the AFL today, Joe Sheehan said the following "Chris Valaika looked good enough on a few plays to make me think he can stay at shortstop." Joe would be the first to tell you he's not a scout, but it's still good to hear.

Good to hear.

JayBruceFan
11-11-2008, 12:18 AM
Yeah it has been.

By Whom?

The Reds?

dougdirt
11-11-2008, 12:19 AM
By Whom?

The Reds?

Scouts, not necessarily the Reds scouts though.

RED VAN HOT
11-11-2008, 12:55 AM
Scouts, not necessarily the Reds scouts though.

Also, Baseball America in the 2006 draft write-up called his range below average. The same synopsis noted that he was coming off a severe knee injury in college although they did not connect the two events.

dougdirt
11-11-2008, 02:48 AM
Also, Baseball America in the 2006 draft write-up called his range below average. The same synopsis noted that he was coming off a severe knee injury in college although they did not connect the two events.

I believe its because prior to the knee injury he was still viewed as having below average range. That said, there are more and more reports coming out that have his range improving to the point that people other than the Reds think that he can stick at the position.

mth123
11-11-2008, 03:48 AM
Turner 2-5, dbl, 1r
Valaika 1-2, 1rbi, 3r, 2bb's
Manuel 1ip 0 h, 0bb, 1k

Valaika with 2BB. Very encouraging. OBP is up to .344.

Betterread
11-11-2008, 10:08 AM
I believe its because prior to the knee injury he was still viewed as having below average range. That said, there are more and more reports coming out that have his range improving to the point that people other than the Reds think that he can stick at the position.

That's encouraging to hear. What is the talk about his arm?
Thanks for covering the AFL and not only tracking stats, but actually listening to what scouts are saying, and then analyzing their observations in a realistic context.

Redman15
11-11-2008, 02:07 PM
Stubby leading off today and Valaika is hitting the the 5 hole for the Javs today.

Javs give up 4 runs in the 9th to lose 8-4.
Stubbs 1-4, 2R, RBI, SB : Valaika 1-5.

dougdirt
11-11-2008, 05:55 PM
Stubbs also had a walk in the game.

Redman15
11-12-2008, 02:08 PM
The Javs line up is loaded with Reds today. Henry is leading off playing RF.
Turner is hitting 2nd playing 2B. Valaika is in the 5 hole playing SS. Stubby is
hitting 7th playing CF.

Redman15
11-12-2008, 05:23 PM
Javs lose 3-2. Reds pitching coach Powers was ejected in the 5th. Valaika was ejected in the 8th after being striking out looking.
Henry was 1-4, Sac B. Turner 1-4, 2B, RBI.
Valaika 2-4. Stubbs 0-4.

BRM
11-12-2008, 05:27 PM
Stubbs' line: .188/.300/.290

Should we be mildly concerned or is this just a blip?

Viola and Watson are getting lit up too.

OnBaseMachine
11-12-2008, 05:33 PM
I'm a bit disappointed but still not overly concerned. These guys have been playing baseball for roughly nine months now if you include spring training. They are bound to be getting tired. I think all this proves is that he's not ready for the major leagues yet.

BRM
11-12-2008, 05:36 PM
I'm a bit disappointed but still not overly concerned. These guys have been playing baseball for roughly nine months now if you include spring training. They are bound to be getting tired. I think all this proves is that he's not ready for the major leagues yet.

So you would start him in Louisville next year for sure?

OnBaseMachine
11-12-2008, 05:41 PM
So you would start him in Louisville next year for sure?

Probably, though I wouldn't rule out the possibility of starting him in Carolina.

BRM
11-12-2008, 05:43 PM
Probably, though I wouldn't rule out the possibility of starting him in Carolina.

He was sent to Louisville last year due to a shortage of outfielders there, right? It wasn't necessarily a merit promotion IIRC. You'd have to take into account that he did hit well while he was there though.

BoydsOfSummer
11-13-2008, 06:43 PM
Stubbs' line: .188/.300/.290

Should we be mildly concerned or is this just a blip?

Viola and Watson are getting lit up too.

Maybe he's working on scrappiness. :D

OnBaseMachine
11-14-2008, 01:29 AM
11/13 game:

Valaika: 1-for-4

Viola: 4 IP, 1 H, 1 R, 0 BB, 6 K
Watson: 0.2 IP, 2 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 0 K
Fisher: 0.1 IP, 4 H, 4 R, 2 BB, 0 K

Fisher got off to a great start in the AFL but his last three outings have been disastrous. Think maybe he's getting tired? If so, it's understandable. These guys have been playing since March.

TRF
11-14-2008, 10:13 AM
11/13 game:

Valaika: 1-for-4

Viola: 4 IP, 1 H, 1 R, 0 BB, 6 K
Watson: 0.2 IP, 2 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 0 K
Fisher: 0.1 IP, 4 H, 4 R, 2 BB, 0 K

Fisher got off to a great start in the AFL but his last three outings have been disastrous. Think maybe he's getting tired? If so, it's understandable. These guys have been playing since March.

I suppose so. Everyone is different. Viola had an outstanding outing though.

Frazier and Alonso don't seem tired in Hawaii. :)

Nasty_Boy
11-14-2008, 10:48 AM
Alonso also had a month and a half break, while Frazier has missed some time with injury. Everybody responds differently... Hopefully our prospects are tired while everyone else's just stink. :D

OnBaseMachine
11-14-2008, 01:10 PM
I'd imagine it's tougher playing in the AFL. Players have that nasty dry desert heat to deal with and most of the games are during the day. That's gotta be tough.

BRM
11-14-2008, 01:31 PM
Rotoworld isn't too impressed with Stubbs in the AFL. It is Rotoworld though. It's from yesterday morning. The "doesn't seem to have a whole lot of upside" comment is what got me.



Drew Stubbs went 0-for-4 and fanned three times Wednesday, leaving him with a .178 average in the AFL.

Stubbs has fanned 25 times in 73 at-bats. That's been the knock against him since before the Reds made him the eighth overall selection in the 2006 draft. Stubbs' defense in center should ensure that he makes it as a regular, but nothing so far suggests that he'll be an above average hitter. He does draw some walks and show occasional power. However, he just doesn't seem to have a whole lot of upside.

TRF
11-14-2008, 01:51 PM
I'd imagine it's tougher playing in the AFL. Players have that nasty dry desert heat to deal with and most of the games are during the day. That's gotta be tough.

The high is averaging about 85 degrees, and it's a dry heat. Warm, but not too warm.

membengal
11-14-2008, 05:18 PM
Yes, let's just call this what it is w/ respect to Stubbs' AFL experience:

A full blown disaster.

dougdirt
11-14-2008, 06:44 PM
Yes, let's just call this what it is w/ respect to Stubbs' AFL experience:

A full blown disaster.

Except it likely isn't. He isn't injured, so really its not much of anything other than an eye sore on a stat sheet that doesn't really mean anything. Is it disappointing, sure, a little bit. It doesn't have any bearing on the likely future though.

mth123
11-14-2008, 07:46 PM
11/14

Stubbs 1 for 4 with an SB.
Turner 0 for 4.
Manuel 1.666 IP, 2H, 4K. Manuel looks to be passing Fisher for 2009 considersation. He did allow some inherited runners to score today so it looks better than it was.

OnBaseMachine
11-15-2008, 05:42 PM
11/15:

Henry: 1-for-4 walk, SB
Valaika: 2-for-4 double

TRF
11-16-2008, 11:40 AM
Except it likely isn't. He isn't injured, so really its not much of anything other than an eye sore on a stat sheet that doesn't really mean anything. Is it disappointing, sure, a little bit. It doesn't have any bearing on the likely future though.

But his time in Louisville was a success right? When he stunk in the FSL for 2 months it was due to the league, but when he was good for the first month there it was because of his talent?

Does the phrase cherry picking mean anything to you? It does to me, because I have done it myself. The truth probably lies in-between our opinions.

The problem with that is that isn't good enough for a top 10 pick.

RedlegJake
11-16-2008, 12:39 PM
Stubbs AFL problems get a big yawn from me. Much too short a season. He Ks a lot? Wow, another revelation.

AmarilloRed
11-16-2008, 01:03 PM
I don't think additional time in AA would hurt him any. I don't think he got enough time at AA last year, so start him out at Carolina.

mth123
11-16-2008, 01:27 PM
Stubbs AFL problems get a big yawn from me. Much too short a season. He Ks a lot? Wow, another revelation.

The real problem is that, right or wrong, a strong AFL showing creates a buzz about a player and given that the Reds are trying to fill a few holes on the major league roster, would have been very nice as Walt goes shopping while trying to not create any new holes on the roster.

I agree that there probably aren't any long term conclusions to be drawn from Stubbs' AFL season.

dougdirt
11-16-2008, 02:03 PM
The real problem is that, right or wrong, a strong AFL showing creates a buzz about a player and given that the Reds are trying to fill a few holes on the major league roster, would have been very nice as Walt goes shopping while trying to not create any new holes on the roster.

I agree that there probably aren't any long term conclusions to be drawn from Stubbs' AFL season.

If Stubbs goes out and has a great AFL you really think the Reds trade him given that one of their 3 big needs include Center Field? I don't.

mth123
11-16-2008, 02:12 PM
If Stubbs goes out and has a great AFL you really think the Reds trade him given that one of their 3 big needs include Center Field? I don't.

Probably right. But if you can backfill on the cheap with Dickerson and Heisey and flip Stubbs to fill a hole elsewhere, the team would be better off overall even if they take a small downgrade in CF.

I think the reason to deal Stubbs is that the difference in his market value over Dickerson and Heisey is probably a lot greater than the difference in their eventual performance will be and a strong AFL would have made the market difference even bigger. I'm not sure Walt is "out of the box" enough to act on it though.

TRF
11-16-2008, 02:16 PM
If Stubbs goes out and has a great AFL you really think the Reds trade him given that one of their 3 big needs include Center Field? I don't.

But he didn't, and I don't think there is a compelling argument for him starting at AAA.

Over the last couple of months, I have started to revise my opinion of a prospect's value. I Stubbs can go out and have a great AA season, then he has value. Clearly there is no vidence that he is ready for AAA. He had a nice 3 weeks at the end of the season. But guys like Dickerson and even Roenicke have shown me that an older prospect can contribute

Stubbs' bat has not caught up to his defensive talent. That isn't to say it can't, just that it hasn't. Placing him at AAA at the start of 2009 may be doing him a disservice. He's Not Adam Dunn, he's not Jay Bruce. and his talent at the plate put's him behind both Dorn and Valaika, guys drafted long after him in the same year. That doesn't even mention Frazier and Alonzo.

But it's time to stop looking for excuses as to why he hasn't succeeded, and maybe possible changes that will allow him to.

dougdirt
11-16-2008, 02:21 PM
But he didn't, and I don't think there is a compelling argument for him starting at AAA.

Over the last couple of months, I have started to revise my opinion of a prospect's value. I Stubbs can go out and have a great AA season, then he has value. Clearly there is no vidence that he is ready for AAA. He had a nice 3 weeks at the end of the season. But guys like Dickerson and even Roenicke have shown me that an older prospect can contribute

Stubbs' bat has not caught up to his defensive talent. That isn't to say it can't, just that it hasn't. Placing him at AAA at the start of 2009 may be doing him a disservice. He's Not Adam Dunn, he's not Jay Bruce. and his talent at the plate put's him behind both Dorn and Valaika, guys drafted long after him in the same year. That doesn't even mention Frazier and Alonzo.

But it's time to stop looking for excuses as to why he hasn't succeeded, and maybe possible changes that will allow him to.

I have a compelling argument that he should start in AAA next year. In the final month of the season he hit .293/.345/.480 in AAA last season. Regardless of what I think about where he should start (I would leave it up to his ST honestly, if he does well, AAA, if he struggles, AA), what he did in AA/AAA last year is a compelling argument for why he will start in AAA next year.

TRF
11-16-2008, 02:26 PM
I have a compelling argument that he should start in AAA next year. In the final month of the season he hit .293/.345/.480 in AAA last season. Regardless of what I think about where he should start (I would leave it up to his ST honestly, if he does well, AAA, if he struggles, AA), what he did in AA/AAA last year is a compelling argument for why he will start in AAA next year.

19 AAA games. that screams small sample. Did his FSL stats warrant a promotion to AA? No, but the excuse was the FSL was a pitcher's league. However he didn't hit better at AA. That's the problem with evaluating Stubbs to date. He didn't dominate like a top prospect, but he was promoted like one.

dougdirt
11-16-2008, 02:50 PM
19 AAA games. that screams small sample. Did his FSL stats warrant a promotion to AA? No, but the excuse was the FSL was a pitcher's league. However he didn't hit better at AA. That's the problem with evaluating Stubbs to date. He didn't dominate like a top prospect, but he was promoted like one.

Stubbs has never been promoted like a top prospect. He started in Billings. He spent an entire season in Dayton. He spent half a season in Sarasota and was only promoted to AAA because of injuries and the need for someone to play CF at a top level because they were fighting for the playoffs at the time still. Toward the end of last year I guess you can say he was promoted like a top prospect, but I think it was more of an injuries thing than a Drew Stubbs thing.

TRF
11-16-2008, 03:17 PM
in 2008 he was most certainly promoted like one. Dorn was far more deserving of that AAA spot than Stubbs.

dougdirt
11-16-2008, 03:19 PM
in 2008 he was most certainly promoted like one. Dorn was far more deserving of that AAA spot than Stubbs.

Dorn can't play CF, which is what Louisville needed.

TRF
11-16-2008, 03:22 PM
Cumberland can, so no, it wasn't. maybe not to the degree of Stubbs, but Dorn outhits stubbs by a country mile.