PDA

View Full Version : UC Basketball



Pages : 1 2 3 [4]

GIDP
03-10-2010, 09:51 AM
Vaughn should have his number retired considering how much crap he has dealt with on the team. This year hes been pretty bad at times but lets not forget how he was basically the only player on this team for 3 years.

bucksfan2
03-10-2010, 10:10 AM
Vaughn should have his number retired considering how much crap he has dealt with on the team. This year hes been pretty bad at times but lets not forget how he was basically the only player on this team for 3 years.

Couldn't disagree more. Vaughn has regressed this season. In fact I think he has regressed over the past 2 years. IIRC he was a 1st team BE his soph year, 3rd team his Jr. year, and nothing his Senior year.

I actually think this team will get better once Vaughn departs. I think the team has looked to him for leadership this season and he has failed. He hasn't scored this season very much this season and when he isn't scoring his D goes as well.

GIDP
03-10-2010, 10:33 AM
Couldn't disagree more. Vaughn has regressed this season. In fact I think he has regressed over the past 2 years. IIRC he was a 1st team BE his soph year, 3rd team his Jr. year, and nothing his Senior year.

I actually think this team will get better once Vaughn departs. I think the team has looked to him for leadership this season and he has failed. He hasn't scored this season very much this season and when he isn't scoring his D goes as well.
The guy hasnt had a good year its not like hes been a total failure this year. Hes just taken like 100+ less shots than the years before.

Vaughn never should have been the best player on the team thanks to everyone other than him.

The team will get better once Vaughn leaves also but it wont be because he left it will hopefully because better players come in.

GIDP
03-10-2010, 11:30 PM
What a great finish.

Sea Ray
03-10-2010, 11:36 PM
I fully expect Louisville to come up extremely flat so I was excited to see them paired with the Rutgers-UC winner.

Nice you were excited with their matchup. Lotta good it did them..

GIDP
03-10-2010, 11:39 PM
Cincy played pretty meh tonight. Hopefully they can string another win out. What ever helps the NCAA people put a little more stock into some of the close losses.

Sea Ray
03-10-2010, 11:45 PM
Cincy played pretty meh tonight. Hopefully they can string another win out. What ever helps the NCAA people put a little more stock into some of the close losses.

I thought they looked tons better than last night. They were going after loose balls and really giving it their all. They really took it to Louisville in the 2nd half

GIDP
03-10-2010, 11:47 PM
I thought they looked tons better than last night. They were going after loose balls and really giving it their all. They really took it to Louisville in the 2nd half

Their free throws are killing them so much.

paintmered
03-10-2010, 11:47 PM
I thought they looked tons better than last night. They were going after loose balls and really giving it their all. They really took it to Louisville in the 2nd half

They looked like the team that beat Maryland and Vandy out in Maui in the second half. They attacked the rim, won all the loose balls and rebounded like banshees on the offensive glass. If the effort continues (and their legs hold up), look out Mounties.

Also, Vaughn sat some serious pine in the second half. I just thought that was interesting.

Sea Ray
03-10-2010, 11:50 PM
They looked like the team that beat Maryland and Vandy out in Maui in the second half. They attacked the rim, won all the loose balls and rebounded like banshees on the offensive glass. If the effort continues (and their legs hold up), look out Mounties.

Also, Vaughn sat some serious pine in the second half. I just thought that was interesting.

I agree and you put it better than I...:thumbup:

GIDP
03-10-2010, 11:53 PM
Think a win over WV gets cincy in the tourny?

paintmered
03-10-2010, 11:54 PM
Think a win over WV gets cincy in the tourny?

Cats need to make the final, IMO. So two more wins and 20 overall. They dug themselves too deep a hole in February to be one game away from the tourney.

But I think tonight's win ensures them of a spot in the NIT. So they've got that going for them, which is nice.

Matt700wlw
03-10-2010, 11:54 PM
Maybe UC's had everybody fooled!

I think a win tomorrow may just be enough...2 more should lock it.

GIDP
03-10-2010, 11:55 PM
Cats need to make the final, IMO. So, two more wins.

a Win over WV would really really up their good wins.

I think if they can pull one off over WV a few of their close losses get looked at better they they currently do. Who knows.

NorrisHopper30
03-11-2010, 01:02 AM
Lunardi seems to thinks we can get in with a win over WVU...

joshnky
03-11-2010, 05:33 AM
Nice you were excited with their matchup. Lotta good it did them..

I still feel it was the best match-up for them. As always they came out flat after a big win, this time with poor effort on the boards. St Johns or Seton Hall would have also beaten them playing like that.

WMR
03-11-2010, 07:41 AM
damn can't wait to see 'em play wvu. Huggy Bear vs. BearCats... pretty sweet storyline. The Big East games today should be fun to watch.

SeeinRed
03-11-2010, 08:57 AM
Stressful, but fun game to watch last night. In the first half it looked like UC would just roll over. The second half was a cobination of not so good basketball by UofL and great effort by UC. Gates actually appeared to care and UC dominated the boards. Players were flying around and scrambling for loose balls. There was a lot more slashing to the basket and agressiveness that hasn't really shown up a whole lot this season. Wilks has had a couple good games now and just seems to be a spark plug for the team.

Shooting was still a concern last night, but you would hope that UC can gain some confidence and shoot better. They will definately have to shoot better against WVU. Should be a great game tonight.

bucksfan2
03-11-2010, 09:04 AM
Good win for UC.

But the same thing that concerns me about Cronin didn't go away. First of all Stephenson gets called for a carry around the 6 minute mark in the 1st half and sits the rest of the half. At around the 5 minute mark Mick put a lineup on the floor, for a couple of minutes, of Dixon-Davis-Wright-Thomas-McClain. You CAN'T do that in major college basketball. UC is lucky UL didn't rip off a 6-0 or 8-0 run and extend the half time lead to 18 and put the game away.

Some of my thoughts from the first half.

-Awful charge call on Gates.
-Jay Bilas quote of the night "Larry Davis hasn't made a shot in a long time"
-Lance is a play maker. He gets over excited at times but is the best UC has.
-Thomas has the worst hands I have ever seen.
-Edgar Sosa may be my most hated college player in a long, long time.
-Wilks had another good 1st half, don't know whether to be excited or afraid.

I realize that UC has to play in back to back to back nights, but these college players should be in tip top shape. What worries me is the amount of time Mick gives to either role players or non-Big East players.
Thomas - 17 min
Parker - 28 min
Davis - 9 min

In what college basketball world does Parker get the same amount of minutes as Stephenson?

Sea Ray
03-11-2010, 09:36 AM
I still feel it was the best match-up for them. As always they came out flat after a big win, this time with poor effort on the boards. St Johns or Seton Hall would have also beaten them playing like that.

I thought Louisville came out very nicely and earned a comfortable halftime lead. It was in the 2nd half when UC really started banging the boards that something changed

reds1869
03-11-2010, 09:49 AM
The time is at hand once more, one of the only times I ever cheer for the Bearcats: when they play WVU. Go get 'em, UC.

joshnky
03-11-2010, 11:30 AM
-Edgar Sosa may be my most hated college player in a long, long time.

Louisville fans feel the same way about Sosa. It is really humorous to hear national commentators rave about Sosa while the local guys who see him every game have very little to say that is positive. I realize that UofL is not a high profile team this year so most people around the nation don't watch them but describing Sosa as a great (or even good) player is laughable.

joshnky
03-11-2010, 11:34 AM
I thought Louisville came out very nicely and earned a comfortable halftime lead. It was in the 2nd half when UC really started banging the boards that something changed

Sosa and Delk were hot which enabled them to overcome a large rebounding deficit at the half. When those guys went cold UofL went for nearly 10 minutes without a field goal. When you look at the "effort" stats (rebounding, steals, etc), UofL was very lackadaisical for the entire game even though they shot a decent percentage.

In the end, it doesn't matter. Good luck with WVU.

Sea Ray
03-11-2010, 12:14 PM
In the end, it doesn't matter.

Pitino thinks it'll matter. He said it'll effect their seed. You disagree?

Boston Red
03-11-2010, 12:24 PM
I don't think it will matter. Louisville isn't very good this year, and it was going to take a pretty huge upset to get out of Round 2 anyway. The only difference is that they're going to have a little tougher time getting out of Round 1 now. Louisville wasn't/isn't a serious threat to make a deep run either way.

bucksfan2
03-11-2010, 12:31 PM
I don't think it will matter. Louisville isn't very good this year, and it was going to take a pretty huge upset to get out of Round 2 anyway. The only difference is that they're going to have a little tougher time getting out of Round 1 now. Louisville wasn't/isn't a serious threat to make a deep run either way.

UL is a team with a lot of finesse. From what I have seen they love the 3 pointer (Pitino's teams always have loved the 3) but don't have the play makers and post men to make a run in the tourney. Samuels is good, but is really their only option inside.

That said UL can be dangerous if they go nuts from the outside. All you have to do is look at the UL Syracuse game and see what CAN happen. Granted it would be one heck of a run to do it for more than 1 game in a row. I am assuming they will get a seed in which they will need to bring their A game from the start.

joshnky
03-11-2010, 01:27 PM
Pitino thinks it'll matter. He said it'll effect their seed. You disagree?

Are you just trying to pick a fight? As Bostonred said, it doesn't matter because Louisville is awful this year. Yes it will affect their seed, although the difference between a 9 and 10 seed is minimal especially when you consider second round match-ups.

joshnky
03-11-2010, 01:32 PM
That said UL can be dangerous if they go nuts from the outside. All you have to do is look at the UL Syracuse game and see what CAN happen.

This has been the mantra of Louisville fans all year but when you look at potential tourney teams they've beaten it tells a different story. Aside from Syracuse, they've beaten Notre Dame without Harangody. That is only three wins against teams that will make the tournament as an at large. The Syracuse wins were great but I think that is more a sign of a good match-up for Louisville than it is a good team. Other than that they came close to beating WVU and Pitt while losing big to St. Johns, Georgetown, and Marquette.

bucksfan2
03-11-2010, 02:03 PM
This has been the mantra of Louisville fans all year but when you look at potential tourney teams they've beaten it tells a different story. Aside from Syracuse, they've beaten Notre Dame without Harangody. That is only three wins against teams that will make the tournament as an at large. The Syracuse wins were great but I think that is more a sign of a good match-up for Louisville than it is a good team. Other than that they came close to beating WVU and Pitt while losing big to St. Johns, Georgetown, and Marquette.

Oh believe me I don't think they are a good team and I wouldn't be too disappointed to see them bow out of the tourney early. I think any team that plays decent D and has the ability to make a lot of 3's is dangerous in the tourney.

joshnky
03-11-2010, 02:19 PM
any team that plays decent D and has the ability to make a lot of 3's is dangerous in the tourney.

I think this is where perception of ESPN and the national media fails to meet reality. While last years team was tenacious on defense, this years team is awful. They rank 77th in defensive efficiency and Pitino has changed the press this year to make it easier on the players which in turn results in fewer turnovers and more fast break points for their opponents. They rank 187th in 3 point field goal percentage at 33.9%.

Now, they are capable of putting it together for short stretches but poor defense and their love for 3 point shooting has been their achilles heel all year.

CTA513
03-11-2010, 11:34 PM
Pretty bad way to lose for UC tonight.

paintmered
03-11-2010, 11:35 PM
I feel sick.

dougdirt
03-11-2010, 11:39 PM
Everyone can thank Pete Rose once again for jinxing the city and its sports teams. How we looking since he was banned from the HOF in 1991? Way to ruin sports for Cincinnati Pete.

GIDP
03-11-2010, 11:40 PM
Wow what a loss. So many just like that this year. Its a shame you dont get half a win for games like those.

Anyone think that Cincy would have won or at least be an at large bid if they werent playing in the Big East? Every team in that conference is worthy of making the NCAA.

Cyclone792
03-11-2010, 11:43 PM
I've been up since 4am. I'm tired as crap. I have to get up again tomorrow morning by 5:30am.

And I stayed up to watch that.

A fitting way to end an overall sad season, I guess.

Hoosier Red
03-11-2010, 11:44 PM
Jay Bilas needs a nice warm glass of shut the hell up.

"It was way too easy for West Virginia to get the ball in here."

EASY?!?!?!? It was easy for them to take 3 1/2 seconds to inbound the ball to a guy going away from the basket so he can bank in an off balanced three from NBA range with a hand in his face? EASY? I'm not sure UC could have asked for a better inbounds defense.

GIDP
03-11-2010, 11:47 PM
Anyone else feel that Cincy wasnt getting many calls on their under the basket shots?

SeeinRed
03-11-2010, 11:48 PM
I feel sick also. I'll tell you one thing, they played with heart and even though they came up just short. In most cases I would have said that officiating may very well of cost them this game. In the end, Dixon's mistake was the killer. I hate to blame the guy because I'm sure he blames himself more than anyone. There was no need for him to push the ball like that against the sideline when he should've dumped back to Vaughn. Woulda, coulda, shoulda I guess. Hopefully UC can use this as a stepping stone.

GIDP
03-11-2010, 11:50 PM
Bright side Stephenson finally figured out that he can handle taking over the game if he needs to. I've been waiting for him to go Kobe Bryant all year.

Redlegs23
03-12-2010, 12:09 AM
Ouch. This one hurts. Bad.

Matt700wlw
03-12-2010, 12:16 AM
It's amazing what 3 seconds can do in college basketball.

I'm a UC fan, and always will be. This one stings.

I'll be pulling for Huggs in the tournament.

Roy Tucker
03-12-2010, 08:27 AM
First off, I'm a UC fan.

But I must say, UC plays the ugliest game of basketball I've seen in a long time. Plus they play just plain old stupid. If it wasn't for great athletes, they'd have no chance. Even the BE tourney games they won, I just shook my head that it was minor miracle they won those.

Wright dribbles entirely too much, Stephenson goes one-on-one too much, there is no motion on offense, nobody sets picks, I have no idea why they don't pound the ball inside to Gates, and Vaughn seems to have forgotten how to play basketball. Their best play is to throw the ball up and crash the boards. They are good at getting balls in scrambles and making those shots.

I think the 3 ESPN announcers were fairly disgusted by what they saw. As a basketball fan, I was too. Plain old ugly.

Redlegs212
03-12-2010, 08:38 AM
I felt like the refs were not calling quite a few fouls on WVU, and called some questionable calls on Cincinnati. But I just don't understand why Dixon was in, you might as well by Eddie Tyree in since he is actually PG. (Not really but you get the point)

SeeinRed
03-12-2010, 08:43 AM
I think the 3 ESPN announcers were fairly disgusted by what they saw. As a basketball fan, I was too. Plain old ugly.


I think they were pretty impressed with how UC played effort wise these last three games. I don't think this team honestly has the ability to play pretty basketball. There just aren't many scorers. UC's best chance comes when they are in an ugly basketball game.

Honestly, the game last night was pretty terribly officiated. I think the announcers sounded more critical of the officiating than the style of play. The officials might be getting tired also. There were just too many missed calls and I really believe I've seen the worst officiating this year than I can remember. The whole charge/blocking call under the basket is called so inconsistently that it is almost criminal. I don't really blame the Refs for that since they haven't painted the semi-circle on floors yet. Traveling/carrying calls are terribly inconsistent also.

Just talking about last night, there are a few plays that I think were really badly called. Gates "foul" when denying the pass to the block was bad, the charge call on Vaughn for pushing off after the WVU player collided with him, and the hand in the face of Stephenson when he ended up coughing up the ball. Really though, that Stephenson play was just awful. Right in front of a ref and such an obvious call. I've never seen anything like that.

I also agree with the announcers that the whole double bye with all 16 teams playing should be eliminated. Its just not fair to a team like UC who has to play 3 nights in a row when they play a team that is playing their first game. I don't think they had their legs under them until about half way through the first half. Its just a terrible disadvantage.

All things considered, and even though it will be tough to forgive Dixon, I am proud as a fan with how they played last night. They seemingly kept in the game on pure will. Hopefully this is the stretch we can point to as when UC finally got some swagger back.

Hopefully UC plays some bonus basketball somewhere and they can get some home games.

SeeinRed
03-12-2010, 08:50 AM
I felt like the refs were not calling quite a few fouls on WVU, and called some questionable calls on Cincinnati. But I just don't understand why Dixon was in, you might as well by Eddie Tyree in since he is actually PG. (Not really but you get the point)


I can live with Dixon being in there, but he made a terrible decision to try and take it himself down the sideline. You have to get the ball back in the middle of the court. Honestly, I would've given it back to Deonta after the inbound and trusted him to take it down if you aren't going to try and get it to Stephenson, which would be my first choice.

bucksfan2
03-12-2010, 08:54 AM
UC played a gritty basketball game. I was impressed with both the effort and the coaching, yes the coaching.

I have been very critical of Wilks but I have come around to him. IMO he offers more than Bishop does and deserves to be on the court more. He brings a spark and can actually hit a 3. He needs to play within himself, but if he does he can become a very good player.

As for Bilas comments I do tend to agree about the inbound pass. To me it doesn't make sense not to guard the ball. When the player can't move a guy like Gates can cut off many passing lanes. While the banked in 3 was guarded, Butler was able to catch the ball cleanly.

I do think Wright pounds the ball into the floor too much. As said multiple times by Bilas, Stephenson needs to work without the ball. That, improving his shot, and defense will take him from a good player to an elite player. He likes the spotlight and came up big last night.

Didn't like the last inbound play. 2 TO's and a poorly designed play. I would have had Wilks come to the ball and then turn and throw an outlet pass to the in bounder. Too often teams panic when the clock is under 10 seconds, but 6 seconds is a long time, especially when going straight towards the basket.

Homer Bailey
03-12-2010, 10:14 AM
http://nbcsportsmedia2.msnbc.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photo_StoryLevel/080320/080320-West%20Virginia-vmed-928p.widec.jpg

:beerme:

Sea Ray
03-12-2010, 10:18 AM
You all make very good comments but at the end of the day the main thing UC needs to do better is shoot the ball through the hoop. They are just so challenged in that area. They struggle from the field and from the free throw line. That's the object of the game and UC doesn't do it too well.

I do think UC grew some in this tournament and if their performance gets them into another post season tourney that experience should be valuable as well. I don't know if they're good enough for the NIT but if they do go they can use the goal of getting back to New York to motivate them.

Hoosier Red
03-12-2010, 10:21 AM
I've said all along that at their best the Bearcats remind me of the mid 90's versions of the team. Lots of generally ugly play, no offensive flow, terrible free throw shooters(anyone remember Keith Legree) and a defense that looks like they'd just as soon knock you upside the head for trying to get in the lane.
What UC doesn't seem to have is the dynamic scorer who can bail them out when the half court offense stalls.

NorrisHopper30
03-12-2010, 10:38 AM
Lance Stephenson said that Butler called bank when he shot it...

Homer Bailey
03-12-2010, 10:43 AM
Lance Stephenson said that Butler called bank when he shot it...

Yep.

"He called it,'' said Cincinnati's Lance Stephenson who was defending Butler. "He said, 'Bank.' I said, 'What?' I turned around and saw it go in. Oh man.''

http://espn.go.com/blog/Colleg...e-butler-did-it

Redlegs23
03-12-2010, 12:13 PM
I like Huggins but the West Virginia fans make it incredibly hard to pull for them. One of the most classless fan bases ever.

bucksfan2
03-12-2010, 01:44 PM
I like Huggins but the West Virginia fans make it incredibly hard to pull for them. One of the most classless fan bases ever.

Did you say classless or toothless :p:

Matt700wlw
03-12-2010, 02:39 PM
Remember this guy?

http://www.sportsbybrooks.com/ex-nba-player-busted-for-weed-between-buttocks-28027

SeeinRed
03-12-2010, 04:11 PM
Remember this guy?

http://www.sportsbybrooks.com/ex-nba-player-busted-for-weed-between-buttocks-28027


I can't remember exactly but isn't he the dude that played for UC and was dismissed before even finishing a year at UC. If it is, I have a heard a pretty funny story about him. It is actually the reason he was dismissed from the team.

will5979
03-12-2010, 06:00 PM
I like Huggins but the West Virginia fans make it incredibly hard to pull for them. One of the most classless fan bases ever.

We appreciate the compliments!

Homer Bailey
03-13-2010, 01:07 AM
We appreciate the compliments!

:beerme:

will5979
03-13-2010, 11:30 AM
Did you say classless or toothless :p:

A poster attacks West Virginia fans (many of whom bleeds Cincinnati Red like myself), I fire back and my post gets censored...elitism and bias at its best.:rolleyes:

Classless part, some are in the eyes of others to an extent, I'll be the first to admit that when sPitt is in town, we have ZERO respect for them, same when VT used to have the cajonies to play us. WV fans are tired of their team not receving any respect from the rest of the nation. We may have never won the MNC however we are 14th on the all time wins list. Sorry if we don't compare to the mighty Buckeyes, but to say that WV fans have no class is an ignorant comment made by someone who has no clue what occurs in Mo-Town.

Just this past season WV coaches and players embraced UCONN players before and after the game in the wake of Jasper Howard's tragic death, not to mention many people claimed that everyone was Huskies at Mountaineer Field on that October day. That victory over UCONN was bittersweet.

Toothless part, typical stereotypes of WV. WV was obviously the smartest part of VA during the 19th Century, abolishing slavery, supporting Abe Lincoln and the Union, and being the only state formed from the Civil War.

paintmered
03-13-2010, 12:01 PM
A poster attacks West Virginia fans (many of whom bleeds Cincinnati Red like myself), I fire back and my post gets censored...elitism and bias at its best.:rolleyes:

Classless part, some are in the eyes of others to an extent, I'll be the first to admit that when sPitt is in town, we have ZERO respect for them, same when VT used to have the cajonies to play us. WV fans are tired of their team not receving any respect from the rest of the nation. We may have never won the MNC however we are 14th on the all time wins list. Sorry if we don't compare to the mighty Buckeyes, but to say that WV fans have no class is an ignorant comment made by someone who has no clue what occurs in Mo-Town.

Just this past season WV coaches and players embraced UCONN players before and after the game in the wake of Jasper Howard's tragic death, not to mention many people claimed that everyone was Huskies at Mountaineer Field on that October day. That victory over UCONN was bittersweet.

Toothless part, typical stereotypes of WV. WV was obviously the smartest part of VA during the 19th Century, abolishing slavery, supporting Abe Lincoln and the Union, and being the only state formed from the Civil War.

You are incorrect to assume you were the only one to be admonished. Besides, there's a difference between insulting a fan base and insulting an individual poster. You did the latter. You should have left it alone.

And next time, PM me if you have a problem with what I did and leave it out of the forums.

GIDP
03-13-2010, 12:08 PM
Best to just ignore them since discussing a warning normally just gets you nothing but more negativity from them.

WVRed
03-14-2010, 09:13 AM
I'm starting to think Bob Huggins sold his soul to the devil after all the game winning shots this season.

will5979
03-14-2010, 11:58 AM
This is a good picture ain't it?

LoganBuck
03-14-2010, 12:01 PM
I'm starting to think Bob Huggins sold his soul to the devil after all the game winning shots this season.

His body sure isn't worth much.

texasdave
03-14-2010, 09:55 PM
The pairings have been announced for the NIT tournament. UC hosts Weber State in the first round. The game will be on ESPN2 at 700 on 3/17 (Wednesday). If the 'Cats prevail they will be home against the winner of the Dayton/Illinois State matchup.

Here is the Bearcat bracket:

NIT Bracket 1 (upper lefthand):

#1 Illinois vs. #8 Stony Brook
#4 Kent St. vs. #5 Tulsa
#3 Dayton vs. #6 Illinois St.
#2 Cincinnati vs. #7 Weber St.

And here is the link to the entire article:http://mcstylin.com/nit-basketball-tournament-2010-selections/

Boston Red
03-23-2010, 01:21 PM
Every time Mick Cronin loses to an A-10 team, an angel gets its wings.

texasdave
03-23-2010, 01:25 PM
The Bearcats never seem to have a clue about what they are doing on the offensive end.

Chip R
03-23-2010, 01:44 PM
The Bearcats never seem to have a clue about what they are doing on the offensive end.


I've only seen them play a few times but I'd have to agree. Cohesive is not a word I'd use to describe their offense.

Roy Tucker
03-23-2010, 03:59 PM
I've only seen them play a few times but I'd have to agree. Cohesive is not a word I'd use to describe their offense.

7 minutes is a long time not to score. Between Stephenson, Vaughn, Gates, and Wright, you'd think they could get a decent shot off.

Speaking of which, where did Gates go last night? Admittedly, I only watched bits and pieces of the game, but he never seemed to in the game.

paintmered
03-23-2010, 04:23 PM
I was at the game last night. It was complete anguish watching an unprepared and uninspired team get dominated on its home court by a team that UC has completely dominated for the last half century.

I will be crafting a letter to Mike Thomas this evening regarding my experiences, expectations and future support as a UCATS member.

Reds4Life
03-23-2010, 04:34 PM
I was at the game last night. It was complete anguish watching an unprepared and uninspired team get dominated on its home court by a team that UC has completely dominated for the last half century.

I will be crafting a letter to Mike Thomas this evening regarding my experiences, expectations and future support as a UCATS member.

The athletic department is living on borrowed time at the moment. They can't afford to have a losing basketball program. The BCS payouts are the only thing that has kept them from a total collapse the last couple years. Being realistic, you can't keep expecting the football program to get a BCS game year after year, they have done great things but in reality it's not sustainable every season.

The more I look back, the more I dispise Nancy Zimpher. She destroyed this program, and now I'd say rebuilding it back to the level it once was is going to be nearly impossible.

The whole thing is very sad. :(

guttle11
03-23-2010, 05:38 PM
I was at the game last night. It was complete anguish watching an unprepared and uninspired team get dominated on its home court by a team that UC has completely dominated for the last half century.

I will be crafting a letter to Mike Thomas this evening regarding my experiences, expectations and future support as a UCATS member.

As a Dayton fan, my eyes popped a bit when I read Stephenson's quote about not expecting Dayton to be that athletic and aggressive. What? UD is 50 miles away and always gets up to play Big East schools. The Flyers are something like 6-2 in the last 8 vs the BE. There is hour after hour of film on UD. Everyone that watches UD knows they out work nearly every opponent, but lose because pressure causes their guards to make bad choices.

How in the world could a team be so unprepared to play a Dayton team that does the same thing every game? It's either bad coaching, bad players, or a combination of the two. The UC program of today is a laughing stock compared to what it was 5-7 years ago.

IMO, the quicker Gates and Stephenson leave the program, the better off it will be. Gates gave one of the most ridiculous efforts I have ever seen last night, and from what I see watching UC it's nothing new with him. He may have talent, but he is the kind of guy winning programs don't recruit.

Definitely felt good to see UD stomp the Bearcats. Cronin (King of excuses, Mr Every Game is Huge for the Opponent, Mr. "Are you telling me 'insert middling BE team here' wouldn't win the A10?") looked foolish and completely lost. That program needs a few bars of metaphorical C-4. Blow it up. Hire an energetic young coach like Brad Stevens, Ben Jacobsen, John Groce or a proven winner like Brad Brownell that won't makes excuses, just build a first class program that wins games the right way. The status quo gives them absolutely no chance to improve.

dabvu2498
03-23-2010, 05:55 PM
Re: Cashmere Wright. I just don't see it. I realize the injury may have hurt his explosiveness, but still...

I was there last night as well. UC was completely unprepared for UD's transition speed. There were several times when UD beat them down the floor AFTER MAKES.

Stephenson get hurt a couple times and guys on the bench were barely clapping for him when he got up, much less helping him off the floor or patting him on the butt or anything a good teammate might do.

It was quite startling to me to see what UD was able to do with them and how much UC looked like they were glad it was over.

Classy move by Jim Burr at the end of the game when they took Vaughn out. I don't care for Burr at all, but he got some points in my book last night.

texasdave
03-23-2010, 06:22 PM
As much as it would have been nice for the local kid (Cronin) to resurrect this program, I don't foresee that happening. Time to pull the plug on Mick's coaching career at UC.

SeeinRed
03-23-2010, 08:27 PM
I've supported Mick from the start, but I also said this would be his year to prove he is the guy for UC. Simply put, he didn't. Mick has built the program back to mediocrity, but the next step was elusive. To be 100% honest, I'm not sure if the next step can be taken any time soon. UC has some nice players, but they just aren't making a very good team.

While I don't like the idea of "blowing things up," I do think that something needs to be done. UC needs to step forward, not backward. They only step forward if one of two things happen IMO. 1. Mick somehow gets the team over the hump next year. 2. UC hires a coach that would be able to keep the team largely intact. The first one seems more and more unlikely every year and the second would require a big contract for a big name or a fast rising coach, which also seems unlikely.

The sad truth is it will take a lot to get this program back to where it used to be. Zimpher and the BOD have a lot of blood on their hands right now. I'm sure they thought their legacy would be one of improving the image and academics of the University. Instead it will be one of ruining a once great program. What a catastrophe this has turned out to be. Especially considering that a lot of the problems probably had more to do with personal vendettas than anything else.

texasdave
04-07-2010, 01:34 PM
So long, Lance, we hardly knew ye. Puts a crimp in the dancing plans for next season.


CINCINNATI (AP) -- Cincinnati freshman Lance Stephenson plans to enter the NBA draft.

The school said Wednesday that the Big East rookie of the year said he will hire an agent, which means he can not withdraw from the draft. It is scheduled for June 24.


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/basketball/ncaa/04/07/stephenson.nba.ap/index.html?eref=sihp

WMR
04-07-2010, 01:37 PM
Becoming a lasting player in the NBA as a 2nd round choice is an uphill battle.

Caveat Emperor
04-07-2010, 02:00 PM
Becoming a lasting player in the NBA as a 2nd round choice is an uphill battle.

Probably going through the NBDL or Europe -- either way, he's getting paid something. Money is money, I suppose.

dabvu2498
04-07-2010, 03:14 PM
The NBDL guys don't make much. Less than 50k unless they're under contract and sent down. Europe money is nothing to sneeze at, however. But, a lot of foreign teams pay very incentive-based contracts. There's a guy from Middletown and Wright State named Bill Edwards who had one great year and it happened to coincide with a year his team won a Euro championship and he said he made enough that one season to retire on. And he lives quite nicely nowadays.

Newport Red
04-07-2010, 03:22 PM
It's probably easier than transferring. I don't see how staying an extra year or two under Cronin's coaching staff benefits him.

GIDP
04-07-2010, 03:55 PM
Yea big blow to UC.

Reds4Life
04-07-2010, 06:39 PM
Yea big blow to UC.

Huge blow. More or less removes any chance for UC to make the NCAA next year (unless it's expanded to 96).

Looking more and more like UC should have just gotten it over with, and fired Cronin after this season.

Roy Tucker
04-08-2010, 11:23 AM
Big mistake by Lance Stephenson. He was nowhere the player his press made him out to be. Playing for Cronin didn't help.

And a bigger mistake to hire an agent. He should go through the draft process and see where he lands and then make a decision.

Sea Ray
04-08-2010, 11:32 PM
Kind of makes you wonder is he has the grades to stay in school. Dontonio Wingfield had to go pro because he wasn't going to class. When these kids come to school thinking it's one and done, they don't care about passing classes

NorrisHopper30
04-09-2010, 01:30 AM
Kind of makes you wonder is he has the grades to stay in school. Dontonio Wingfield had to go pro because he wasn't going to class. When these kids come to school thinking it's one and done, they don't care about passing classes

Lance had a 3.6 last quarter.

Sea Ray
04-09-2010, 08:18 AM
Lance had a 3.6 last quarter.

Good for him. I hope he continued his bookwork

SeeinRed
04-09-2010, 09:04 AM
Hard for me to get upset at Lance for leaving at this point. He has said that having a young daughter (2 yrs. old) was a big factor in wanting to get paid while developing instead of playing college basketball. He may only make a little next season, but he will make more than he gets playing at UC. Hope he has a great career wherever he ends up. Hopefully Mick can pull in some good players for next season because he is gonna need them.

dsmith421
04-09-2010, 09:31 AM
Hard for me to get upset at Lance for leaving at this point. He has said that having a young daughter (2 yrs. old) was a big factor in wanting to get paid while developing instead of playing college basketball. He may only make a little next season, but he will more than he gets playing at UC. Hope he has a great career wherever he ends up.

I agree with this. Paul Dehner's cnati.com story on Deonta Vaughn earlier this year really brought home the off-the-court challenges a lot of these guys face. Someone like Jordan Crawford or Chris Wright can be more deliberate in this decision because they have no immediate financial worries.

I'm an XU fan but watched a lot of UC down the stretch. When Cronin unleashed Stephenson at MSG and basically ran the LeBron offense at the end of the UofL and WVU games there was no one on the court that could keep him from getting to the rim. But during the NIT it looked like he was switched off. Hopefully the dude can get his head in the right place this offseason and, if he's not drafted into a good situation, go overseas, bank some money, and build up a reputation for a return to the States in a few years.

bucksfan2
04-09-2010, 10:28 AM
Hard for me to get upset at Lance for leaving at this point. He has said that having a young daughter (2 yrs. old) was a big factor in wanting to get paid while developing instead of playing college basketball. He may only make a little next season, but he will make more than he gets playing at UC. Hope he has a great career wherever he ends up. Hopefully Mick can pull in some good players for next season because he is gonna need them.

It is a very, very shortsighted decision. I grew up middle class and I can say that money has never been an issue with me. I really have no insight on Lance's life and don't know how to relate to his life. But I do know this, in watching Lance's game he isn't ready. He is no where near close to being ready. He is making this decision a short term monetarily gain without looking at the entire picture. He is a guy who doesn't have an outside shot, doesn't handle the ball all that well, and was taken out of the college game for long periods of time. If he would have stayed, worked on his game, especially his outside shot and mid range shot he could have been maybe a lottery pick, probably a top 20 pick, and pretty much guaranteed a 1st rounder. Instead he is likely to go in the 2nd or undrafted. He is bypassing a couple of million dollars to make money now.

SeeinRed
04-09-2010, 04:23 PM
It is a very, very shortsighted decision. I grew up middle class and I can say that money has never been an issue with me. I really have no insight on Lance's life and don't know how to relate to his life. But I do know this, in watching Lance's game he isn't ready. He is no where near close to being ready. He is making this decision a short term monetarily gain without looking at the entire picture. He is a guy who doesn't have an outside shot, doesn't handle the ball all that well, and was taken out of the college game for long periods of time. If he would have stayed, worked on his game, especially his outside shot and mid range shot he could have been maybe a lottery pick, probably a top 20 pick, and pretty much guaranteed a 1st rounder. Instead he is likely to go in the 2nd or undrafted. He is bypassing a couple of million dollars to make money now.

I do agree that one more year of college basketball could pay of huge for him in the future. He will be drafted, however not as high as he could be given another year to develope in college. He has NBA ability, but hasn't been able to harness it quite yet. He could be in a long struggle to get to the NBA and never realise his dream.

However, I do not think I can say he is making a mistake. Like you I don't know the circumstances he is under. As fans we can say he shouldn't go and he isn't ready, but we can't say he is making the wrong decision IMO because we just don't know. I respect the decision he made, especially if it is made because he feels the responsibility to support his young daughter. Lance seemed like a good kid and I wish him nothing but the best. Thats all I'm saying.

Reds4Life
04-10-2010, 02:49 PM
It is a very, very shortsighted decision. I grew up middle class and I can say that money has never been an issue with me. I really have no insight on Lance's life and don't know how to relate to his life. But I do know this, in watching Lance's game he isn't ready. He is no where near close to being ready. He is making this decision a short term monetarily gain without looking at the entire picture. He is a guy who doesn't have an outside shot, doesn't handle the ball all that well, and was taken out of the college game for long periods of time. If he would have stayed, worked on his game, especially his outside shot and mid range shot he could have been maybe a lottery pick, probably a top 20 pick, and pretty much guaranteed a 1st rounder. Instead he is likely to go in the 2nd or undrafted. He is bypassing a couple of million dollars to make money now.

You have to wonder if he would really benefit from another year though. Cronin's track record of developing players is absymal. If next season was just another repeat of this one, he wouldn't improve his draft status all that much.

Cronin's offense, if you want to call it that, doesn't really favor Lance's style of play either. Half the time when he started to play well, Cronin would bench him for some stupid reason.

I'm a UC fan, so I wanted to say, but I get why he didn't. Cronin probably gets fired after next year, the incoming recruiting class is pretty pathetic for Big East standards. As the team stands now, they will be lucky to in 5 Big East games next season, if that.

Caveat Emperor
04-10-2010, 11:04 PM
The only thing saving Cronin's job right now is the economy, IMO.

The University has dropped a lot of coin on the football side of things recently, and I imagine they're too tapped out to pay off Cronin and hire another coach.