PDA

View Full Version : Find the RH bat



osuceltic
12-10-2008, 11:08 AM
Save the debate about whether or not they need a RH bat. Walt clearly believes they do. He wants a RH bat for the middle of the order. It would seem that player would need to play either LF or CF (unlikely, but let's not eliminate the idea), or, conceivably, SS or third base (if they move Encarnacion to LF, for example).

So ... who will it be? We know the usual suspects:

Jermaine Dye
Magglio Ordonez
Pat Burrell
Garrett Atkins
Adrien Beltre

Who else? Guys I'm thinking about:

Xavier Nady (unfortunately, the Yanks probably don't want anything we'd be willing to offer)
Melvin Mora (not sure if he's available, but would be an interesting option)

Others have mentioned Alex Rios. Is he available?

They could roll the dice with Jeff Francouer.

So let's find the guy.

OnBaseMachine
12-10-2008, 11:10 AM
I'd like to see Walt go get a young shortstop that can play defense.

As for the outfield bat, Juan Rivera on a 2-year deal would be a solid option.

Sea Ray
12-10-2008, 11:14 AM
Kind of ironic that after stating the need for a RH hitting OF bat, they trade Ryan Freel.

I have to assume that trade means they're confident they can re-sign Hairston. Now they really need a couple outfielders at least. My guess is it'll end up being Jermaine Dye.

RedEye
12-10-2008, 11:17 AM
Save the debate about whether or not they need a RH bat. Walt clearly believes they do. He wants a RH bat for the middle of the order. It would seem that player would need to play either LF or CF (unlikely, but let's not eliminate the idea), or, conceivably, SS or third base (if they move Encarnacion to LF, for example).

So ... who will it be? We know the usual suspects:

Jermaine Dye
Magglio Ordonez
Pat Burrell
Garrett Atkins
Adrien Beltre

Who else? Guys I'm thinking about:

Xavier Nady (unfortunately, the Yanks probably don't want anything we'd be willing to offer)
Melvin Mora (not sure if he's available, but would be an interesting option)

Others have mentioned Alex Rios. Is he available?

They could roll the dice with Jeff Francouer.

So let's find the guy.

If all else is equal, I'd prefer Beltre, Dye, Rios or Rivera. Rivera might make the most sense because he would cost the least in terms of cash and prospects.

osuceltic
12-10-2008, 11:48 AM
I'd like to see Walt go get a young shortstop that can play defense.

As for the outfield bat, Juan Rivera on a 2-year deal would be a solid option.

I don't get the Rivera thing. Other than maybe coming cheap, I don't see how he helps at all. If he's your bat between Votto and Bruce, you're in trouble. What am I missing?

lollipopcurve
12-10-2008, 11:54 AM
I'd look into Miggy Tejada. I know he's about half the player he used to be, but he appears to still play decent defense (looking at UZR), and, like the offensive upgrade just made at catcher, he'll be a better hitter than current/past SS options.

Idea being, modest upgrades at more positions is equal to, perhaps better than, a big upgrade at 1 position.

The question, of course, is how much $$$ would Houston kick in. Something tells me they'd be interested in homegrown Homer Bailey. (Not to mention the fact they drafted Drew Stubbs out of HS and nearly signed him.)

Throw in that Tejada is good buddies with EdE and I think you have a very interesting proposition for the Reds.

TRF
12-10-2008, 11:55 AM
Elija Dukes. Yes, I'm hyping him to death, but the Nats have a big OF glut and need pitching. Stubbs and Maloney would do the trick.

edabbs44
12-10-2008, 11:56 AM
Kind of ironic that after stating the need for a RH hitting OF bat, they trade Ryan Freel.

I have to assume that trade means they're confident they can re-sign Hairston. Now they really need a couple outfielders at least. My guess is it'll end up being Jermaine Dye.

While Ryan Freel fits the standard definition of someone who hits from the right side of the plate, he isn't the type of RH bat that this team needs.

OnBaseMachine
12-10-2008, 11:58 AM
I don't get the Rivera thing. Other than maybe coming cheap, I don't see how he helps at all. If he's your bat between Votto and Bruce, you're in trouble. What am I missing?

In this case, Edwin would be my cleanup hitter. I think he's ready to step his game up.

Rivera is obviously no sure thing, but he's got potential. In his career as a starter he's put up a solid line of .289/.335/.474 - .809 OPS (compared to just a .656 OPS off the bench). Rivera's got the skills to hit between .290 to .310 because of his above average power and good contact skills. He'll never be a high OBP guy because of his aggressive approach but if he hits around .300 like expected then he could put up an .840 to .850ish OPS while playing good outfield defense. As an added bonus, he won't cost the Reds any prospects.

hebroncougar
12-10-2008, 11:58 AM
I'd like to see Walt go get a young shortstop that can play defense.

As for the outfield bat, Juan Rivera on a 2-year deal would be a solid option.

+1, Rivera would be cheap, and costs you nothing other than money. If he turned out not to be a good option, his contract doesn't hamstring you.

osuceltic
12-10-2008, 12:10 PM
I'm wondering if they'll wait it out and see if they can get Burrell for cheap -- something like three years, $21 million. If Dunn is struggling to get big money, I can't imagine Burrell is finding it any different.

I'm not a Burrell fan, but I could see them trying to go that direction.

lollipopcurve
12-10-2008, 12:16 PM
I'm wondering if they'll wait it out and see if they can get Burrell for cheap

I'd be stunned if anything happens soon. If it does, I think it will be Dye. Trades are slow in coming together, and the undeveloped market for FA hitters has a chance to get soft, it seems.

Kc61
12-10-2008, 12:54 PM
I'd like to see Walt go get a young shortstop that can play defense.

As for the outfield bat, Juan Rivera on a 2-year deal would be a solid option.


My guess is that the shortstop acquisition ain't happening this off-season, unless it is a minor leaguer who is part of a bigger deal.

With Gonzo, Keppinger, and Janish, the Reds at least have guys who can play shortstop. If they sign Hairston they have another. Gonzo, if healthy, and Janish play good defense. And Keppinger isn't a bad shortstop when healthy. He lacks range but is sure handed. I think his injury last year hurt his play in all facets, including fielding. (I know, around here, he's viewed as awful.)

And Valaika will be at AAA getting ready for his shot at short.

While the position needs improvement, my guess is that it's not the highest priority.

Right now the team literally has three outfielders on the roster, only one of whom is a clear starter. That has to be the priority, along with lefty relief.

It doesn't look to me like, in this environment, a major restructuring of the team is happening. I think they want two more outfielders, one a major hitter, and a lefty reliever. And maybe some new backups.

membengal
12-10-2008, 01:18 PM
Elija Dukes. Yes, I'm hyping him to death, but the Nats have a big OF glut and need pitching. Stubbs and Maloney would do the trick.

I like your hyping of him. Big risk/big reward. Might be the kind of volatile player that Dusty would actually be really good for. Him and Bruce at the corners in the OF is a REALLY nice cornerstone.

Course, he could come here and kill someone, which would harm all of that. Hence the risk.

Still, I think it makes sense, TRF, and that price you have listed would likely be enough to intrigue Bowden...

OnBaseMachine
12-10-2008, 01:20 PM
With Gonzo, Keppinger, and Janish, the Reds at least have guys who can play shortstop. If they sign Hairston they have another. Gonzo, if healthy, and Janish play good defense. And Keppinger isn't a bad shortstop when healthy. He lacks range but is sure handed. I think his injury last year hurt his play in all facets, including fielding. (I know, around here, he's viewed as awful.)


When I think of shortstop defense, range is the first thing that comes to mind. I don't care about sure handed if the guy only has fall-down range like Keppinger has. Janish is the only solid defender in the group you listed but he'd be lucky to OPS .600 in the majors. IMO shortstop is the biggest need for the organization right now.

dfs
12-10-2008, 01:36 PM
Kind of ironic that after stating the need for a RH hitting OF bat, they trade Ryan Freel.
While nominally right handed, Freel doesn't show any kind of platoon split.
I believe when most folks here talk about wanting a right handed bat in the lineup, they mean somebody with some power to split Votto and Bruce.

For my money, I would rather have somebody who gets on base. This team needs baserunners far more than it need power, but that's me.

Guacarock
12-10-2008, 02:13 PM
How about bringing back Cody Ross, who we sent off to the Marlins after a cup of coffee as a Red? He strikes out a bit too much and his OBP could be better, but he has power, some defensive ability, can play all three OF positions, is hitting his potential peak age-wise and shouldn't cost us an arm and leg to acquire.

Also, I kinda like the idea of getting someone who could stick around and help for a few years, not just a rapidly aging vet who might only be a stopgap for 2009.

Mario-Rijo
12-10-2008, 05:03 PM
So let's if we got this complete yet. In no particular order.

Dye
Atkins
Rivera
Ordonez
Burrell
Beltre
Rios
Francouer
Nady
Tejada
Dukes
C. Ross
Milledge
Blake
ManRam
Lee
Delmon Young

I'll add Lastings Milledge and Casey Blake (although he may get 3 yrs from Minny or L.A.). And hey there's always Manny! I'd also add Carlos Lee seeing as how he likely could be had although his contract isn't really ideal to take on.

Kc61
12-10-2008, 05:25 PM
IMO shortstop is the biggest need for the organization right now.


Thing is, Walt may be thinking more about the team right now, and less about the "organization." Like, being able to field a Cincinnati Reds team in 2009.

So his priority has to be the outfield. Because Bruce is a young phenom, but still a diamond in the rough --

Dickerson should make the team but is a question mark as a starter --

Hopper is coming off injury and is strictly a backup --

And there is nobody else to play out there.

I think they will cobble together a shortstop from Gonzo, Keppinger, Janish, and later in the year Valaika.

Mario-Rijo
12-10-2008, 07:35 PM
So let's if we got this complete yet. In no particular order.

Dye
Atkins
Rivera
Ordonez
Burrell
Beltre
Rios
Francouer
Nady
Tejada
Dukes
C. Ross
Milledge
Blake
ManRam
Lee
Delmon Young

I'll add Lastings Milledge and Casey Blake (although he may get 3 yrs from Minny or L.A.). And hey there's always Manny! I'd also add Carlos Lee seeing as how he likely could be had although his contract isn't really ideal to take on.

I guess Blake was re-signed by L.A. to a 3 yr deal so scratch him, which I imagine most had done already just out of disinterest.

Sea Ray
12-10-2008, 07:40 PM
While nominally right handed, Freel doesn't show any kind of platoon split.
I believe when most folks here talk about wanting a right handed bat in the lineup, they mean somebody with some power to split Votto and Bruce.

For my money, I would rather have somebody who gets on base. This team needs baserunners far more than it need power, but that's me.

The first part of your post states that Freel doesn't meet the Reds' needs, which I agree with. But then you stated that you don't care so much about power, you want OBP. Well that does sound like Freel. He has a career OBP of .357. Does Freel meet your criteria of a RH bat with decent OBP?

M2
12-10-2008, 08:31 PM
If you believe in the upside of Franklin Gutierrez or Ben Francisco (not so sure I do), then they'd fit the profile.

Austin Kearns, as mentioned in other threads, might be worth a flyer.

Nelson Cruz has gotten some mention too.

schroomytunes
12-10-2008, 09:45 PM
If I'm Walt I go out and offer Juan Rivera the LF job! I think he could put up respectable numbers in GABP like (.280-.300avg) (18-23hrs) (75-90rbi) and (.320-.350OBP) for @ 4-5million a year over 3 years. This allows us time for our youngsters to be ready and it allows us to go after a platoon CF(Hairston) and SS/bench depth.

GADawg
12-10-2008, 10:19 PM
what about throwing your resources towards a guy like Derek Lowe and trying to pitch the division to death....ala the braves era.

Move EE to left, Kepp to 3rd, and if you re-sign Hairston and Gonzo comes back(this is all hypothetical ya know) then maybe you scratch across more runs than you give up....of course the bench would have to be improved as well.

Just thinking out loud.

WVPacman
12-11-2008, 12:54 AM
Im probably wrong but I thought I seen somewhere that Mike Cameron was a FA?

Tom Servo
12-11-2008, 01:11 AM
Im probably wrong but I thought I seen somewhere that Mike Cameron was a FA?
No, the Brewers picked up his option.

Krusty
12-11-2008, 07:40 AM
Frankly I think they should screw it in regards to a righthand hitter especially if they can get a better hitter that hits from the left side.

If a Bobby Abreu or other lefty outfielder can hit lefthanded pitching just as good as a righthand hitter, what's the difference? Get the best hitter available.