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View Full Version : Where is Walt Headed ?



Ltlabner
12-10-2008, 09:05 PM
Based on the moves made already, and the players popping up in trade rumors (the ones that seem to have validity anyway) what direction is Walt trying to take the team?

Also, do you think a BCast inspired "win now" approach is being taken?

It's way to early to make any solid conclusions, just curious if you feel there's been any signals sent thus far.

corkedbat
12-10-2008, 09:20 PM
Based on the moves made already, and the players popping up in trade rumors (the ones that seem to have validity anyway) what direction is Walt trying to take the team?

Also, do you think a BCast inspired "win now" approach is being taken?

It's way to early to make any solid conclusions, just curious if you feel there's been any signals sent thus far.

I think that dealing for Hernandez instead of a younger catcher and the dance they're doing over Dye signals that they are at least gonna try to sell the fanbase that they're out to compete for the WC at least.


I think there are several avenues Jocketty could go and he will probably explore them all.

I think he came into this week believing that giving up talent for Dye might actually be cheaper than signing a Free Agent bat. I think that the events in Vegas this week, my have them believing that they may just get a decent Free Agent and hold onto the talent they would deal for Dye. If nothing else, it may have given them a little more negotiating leverage with the White Sox.

Homer Bailey
12-10-2008, 09:31 PM
I think he is starting to think that the Dye move really isn't worth it, and acquiring a cheaper RH bat may be his best option.

Homer Bailey
12-10-2008, 09:32 PM
I think that dealing for Hernandez instead of a younger catcher and the dance they're doing over Dye signals that they are at least gonna try to sell the fanbase that they're out to compete for the WC at least.


I think there are several avenues Jocketty could go and he will probably explore them all.

I think he came into this week believing that giving up talent for Dye might actually be cheaper than signing a Free Agent bat. I think that the events in Vegas this week, my have them believing that they may just get a decent Free Agent and hold onto the talent they would deal for Dye. If nothing else, it may have given them a little more negotiating leverage with the White Sox.

BOOM. There it is.

corkedbat
12-10-2008, 09:34 PM
BOOM. There it is.


BOOM goes the Dynamite! :D

RedsManRick
12-10-2008, 09:47 PM
I think he's got three basic rules:

1) Don't get worse anywhere
2) Get better where you can
3) Don't expose yourself your to big negative risks

If you look at his tenure in St. Louis, he was quite risk averse. His strength as a GM in St. Louis was building a solid floor while capitalizing on opportunities to raise it. The Cards were rarely a bad team under Jocketty and when things broke their way, Jocketty locked it in. McGwire and Edmonds were acquired on the cheap and kept in town. Rolen came with a pretty big discount and was flipped for a decent value in return when he declined. Chris Carpenter was signed for peanuts.

I think the description of the Dye scenario sounds quite likely.

OnBaseMachine
12-11-2008, 01:54 PM
Where is Walt Headed?

According to Fay's blog, Walt is at the airport and is headed back to Cincy. :p:

I think Walt is trying to build for the future while trying to win now at the same time. He's not going to trade Jay Bruce/Johnny Cueto or our top prospects for a quick fix, but at the same time he's not going to sit on his butt and watch this team lose 90 games next season. I think we'll see him make some moves that can help the team in 2009 but not jeopardize the future. Walt's a smart guy. I'm pleased with what he's did so far.

flyer85
12-11-2008, 01:59 PM
Also, do you think a BCast inspired "win now" approach is being taken?
Acquiring Henandez, Rhodes and being involved for Dye is a clear signal they aren't building for the future. It's "win now".

bucksfan2
12-11-2008, 02:00 PM
Chris Carpenter was signed for peanuts

Wasn't Carpenter acquired just after a major arm injury? RZ would blow up if the Reds acquired a pitcher coming off a major arm injury.

membengal
12-11-2008, 02:03 PM
Not if he was indeed acquired for "peanuts".

BRM
12-11-2008, 02:03 PM
Acquiring Henandez, Rhodes and being involved for Dye is a clear signal they aren't building for the future. It's "win now".

Agreed. Although I think OBM is sort of correct in the fact that he's not going to mortgage the future on a short-term fix. I don't think he's necessarily "building for the future" though. Signs so far point to "win now".

flyer85
12-11-2008, 02:09 PM
Wasn't Carpenter acquired just after a major arm injury? RZ would blow up if the Reds acquired a pitcher coming off a major arm injury.he sat out the 2003 season while under contract to the Cards

RedlegJake
12-11-2008, 02:14 PM
Acquiring Henandez, Rhodes and being involved for Dye is a clear signal they aren't building for the future. It's "win now".

Except that none of these moves lock up players long term, or got rid of key prospects. Its definitely OBM's take - Walt's trying to do some winning now and keep the future looking bright at the same time. If they were all out for 2009 don't you think he could move one of those young players to make a short term gain? Or a package of our best prospects for a stud veteran or two that would make the '09 team much better at the cost of the future?

To me its obvious he's trying to build an '09 squad that has fewer holes and a stronger nucleus overall without the kind of blockbuster deal that would harm the plans for later years. In short order he's re-populated the bullpen and it looks better, made the catching position stronger, eliminated a couple bad players, traded an oft injured salary weight. He still needs to add a solid hitter, beef up the outfield corps (which would now be helped by re-signing Hairston, which prior to Freel leaving was a redundancy), and if he can find a SS to stopgap AGon just in case, but more and more I'm thinking they're going to ride what they have at SS, with Kepp and Janish and Rosales as that stopgap. There could be a couple very good FAs at a better than normal price/term coming this year, too, due to economics in general. I like what's happened and think Walt's not even close to done yet.

jojo
12-11-2008, 02:18 PM
Here's my bullet point summarizing where he's headed: "He's got one foot on the now and one foot on the future but it's not apparent he'll end up going anywhere"

He seems to be trying to buy time for the farm to catch up a bit while trying to give his current 25 man roster a chance if "everything goes right". He's not having an "all in" Dombrowski moment (at least not yet).

flyer85
12-11-2008, 02:21 PM
Here's my bullet point summarizing where he's headed: "He's got one foot on the now and one foot on the future but it's not apparent he'll end up going anywhere"which is generally the case. Hasn't worked here in the last 10 years.

flyer85
12-11-2008, 02:23 PM
Its definitely OBM's take - Walt's trying to do some winning now and keep the future looking bright at the same time. which is generally a recipe for failure. If you are a small market team it seems to be an "or" proposition.

Personally I think the organization would be better off in the long term by targeting 2010 and beyond. They seem to lack the horses to win now unless the starting pitching turns out to be very good.

UKFlounder
12-11-2008, 02:24 PM
Win now, but not mortgage the future - isn't that pretty much what the Reds have tried to do in recent years? Hopefully Walt is more successful than his predecessors...

lollipopcurve
12-11-2008, 02:24 PM
"He's got one foot on the now and one foot on the future but it's not apparent he'll end up going anywhere"

This team needs to be non-pitiful. It's a business.

He's trying to make the best team he can for about 80 million bucks without sacrificing prime minor league talent that could allow the team to make important in-house adds to the major league roster in the near future.

flyer85
12-11-2008, 02:51 PM
Win now, but not mortgage the future - isn't that pretty much what the Reds have tried to do in recent years? yep