PDA

View Full Version : Your 2009 HOF Ballot



redsfandan
12-31-2008, 12:45 PM
The official ballots are due today with the results to be announced on Jan. 12th. I thought we may have some people with their own opinions on this and that they might like to debate the merits of the candidates. I was going to add bios/stats but I think we have people that can articulate the pros and cons of these players better than I can. ;)

Here are the candidates:

Jim Rice
Tommy John
Dave Parker
Harold Baines
Don Mattingly
Tim Raines
Lee Smith
Bert Blyleven
David Cone
Mo Vaughn
Matt Williams
Lee Smith
Alan Trammell
Greg Vaughn
Jay Bell
Andre Dawson
Ron Gant
Mark Grace
Rickey Henderson
Mark McGwire
Jack Morris
Dale Murphy
Jesse Orosco
Dan Plesac

reds77
12-31-2008, 01:05 PM
I'd say Rickey is getting in.

RedLegsToday
12-31-2008, 01:26 PM
Tim Raines - great player for the first half of his long career 808 sb with an 84.7% success rate
Bert Blyleven - 287 wins, just under 5000 ip, 60 shutouts, was 3rd on all-time strikeout list when he retired
Alan Trammell - excellent defensive and offensive shortstop. Plus, if he gets in, there's no way to not put Barry Larkin in!
Andre Dawson - 8 GG in centerfield, 438 homeruns, 1591 rbi. I think the Hall is starting to get too exclusive compared to its past elections, so, Dawson gets my vote even with the very low career ob% (.323)
Rickey Henderson - all time leader in runs scored, stolen bases, 2nd in walks, MVP, single season SB king, 3000+ hits
Mark McGwire - one of MLB's pioneers in chemical, physical enhancement. Without him we would never have gotten to see Barry Bonds 2001-2004, multiple 60 hr seasons, Roger Clemens winning a Cy Young in his 40's, etc, etc. Oh, he also smacked 583 hr at a higher rate than anyone in history. Won a GG, so, at least for the first half of his career he was decent defensively. Has the 12th best OPS+ of all-time (162). Plus, he hit the longest homerun in Riverfront Stadium history.

Bumstead
12-31-2008, 01:58 PM
Ricky Henderson is a no-brainer. Bert Blyleven should already be in the Hall of Fame; if he's not in, there's no point IMHO in discussing the other candidates, especially pitchers. Of course Dawson and Rice have their own merits. As much as I like Dave Parker, I think he is a bit of a fringe candidate unfortunately...

Of course Buster Olney would put a cheater (McGwire) in the Hall and leave Blyleven out...and he has a vote....:eek:

McGwire should be in the Steroid Hall of Shame with before and after photos, just sitting there waiting for Bonds, Sosa, Palmeiro and friends to join him....:p:

Bum

reds1869
12-31-2008, 02:41 PM
Ron Gant and Dan Plesac? Seriously?

redsfandan
12-31-2008, 03:51 PM
Ron Gant and Dan Plesac? Seriously?

Once it's been 5 years since the player retired they are automatically on the ballot. That doesn't mean they'll receive enough votes to STAY on the ballot, much less get in.

TheNext44
12-31-2008, 06:14 PM
My ballot would have:

Jim Rice
Tim Raines
Burt Blyleven
Rickey Henderson
Andre Dawson and
Dave Concepcion

I might put on Lee Smith just because he was better than Goose Gossage or Bruce Sutter, and they both are in, but I don't think any of the three should be in.

As for Rice, the big reason why people don't want him in is that he played much better at Fenway, which was even more hitter friendly back then, than he did on the road.

However, I just don’t see why where a guy played is relevant to whether or not he should be in the Hall Of Fame. The Hall of Fame is not for the players with the most talent or the most skills, or the players who put up the best stats, it is for the players who were the most valuable to their team over a long career. It is for the players who were the best at their position over a long career.
Rice clearly was that. He played for the Red Sox his whole career, and was one of their star players for over 10 years, and was one of the best left fielders in the game for over 10 years. From 1975 to 1986 he was the best LF in OPS in his league 7 times, and in the top 3 every other year.

Whether he might not have been as valuable if he played for other teams is irrelevant. Who knows, if he played in Dodger stadium, maybe he would have adjusted him game and put up similar numbers. Just because he didn’t do it on the road as a Red Sox does not mean that he wouldn’t have, if he had been playing his whole career at another stadium. If you think you can assume that he would not have, then you are making grand assumptions from stats that should not be made.

The fact is that Jim Rice was a Hall of Fame player as a Red Sox. Would he have been playing for another team? We will never know and it doesn’t matter.

JayBruceFan
12-31-2008, 08:56 PM
Jim Rice
Don Mattingly
Lee Smith
Andre Dawson
Rickey Henderson
Mark McGwire
Jesse Orosco

reds1869
12-31-2008, 10:17 PM
Once it's been 5 years since the player retired they are automatically on the ballot. That doesn't mean they'll receive enough votes to STAY on the ballot, much less get in.

Not the case. Here is a list of players who are newly eligible who did not make the ballot, per the BBWA:

Steve Avery, Jason Bere, Mike Bordick, John Burkett, Omar Daal, Joe Girardi, Mark Guthrie, Joey Hamilton, Bill Haselman, Darren Holmes, Trenidad Hubbard, Todd Hundley, Brian L. Hunter, Félix José, Chad Kreuter, Graeme Lloyd, Keith Lockhart, Albie Lopez, Pat Mahomes, Al Martin, Orlando Merced, Charles Nagy, Denny Neagle, Troy O'Leary, Lance Painter, Dean Palmer, Craig Paquette, Tom Prince, Jeff Reboulet, Rick Reed, Rich Rodriguez, Terry Shumpert, Luis Sojo, Dave Veres, Matt Walbeck, Mike Williams and Kevin Young.

redsfandan
01-01-2009, 04:37 AM
Woops, That's egg on my face. :doh:It would make sense that more than just a couple players retired five years ago. :redface: Hopefully someone else has a more informed explanation. :help:

Hybrid
01-01-2009, 10:02 AM
I seriously hope McGwire never gets in.

My picks would be:
Ricky Henderson
Jim Rice
Don Mattingly

steig
01-01-2009, 10:03 AM
I would put in Ricky Henderson only. Although I think Tim Raines will be selected by the writers, but probably not until his 2nd year. And I think McGwire will get the exact same number of votes for the HOF this year as he did the previous two years.

BigREDSfaninKY
01-01-2009, 07:32 PM
Rice
Dawson
Henderson
Blyleven

Kingspoint
01-01-2009, 09:30 PM
Dale Murphy 1st
Jim Rice 2nd
Rickey Henderson 3rd

LexingtonLegend
01-01-2009, 10:58 PM
Although his numbers may not jump off the page when you look at them, I think Don Mattingly played the game the way it should always be played. I grew up with him as one of my favorite players, along with Cal Ripken Jr. I would definitely vote for him, along with Rickey Henderson, and possibly Andre Dawson

Handofdeath
01-02-2009, 01:08 AM
My ballot would be

Jim Rice
Rickey Henderson
Don Mattingly
Lee Smith
Tommy John
Bert Blyleven

dougflynn23
01-03-2009, 01:21 AM
Rickey Henderson
Bert Blyleven
Tim Raines
Jack Morris

Roush's socks
01-04-2009, 04:54 AM
Dave Parker has better credentials than any except Rickey. He was 1979 MVP and also finished 2nd once and 3rd twice. His OWP's are better than Dawson and as good as Jim Rice, and Parker was a Gold Glove RF was Rice was a weak LF. Parker had perhaps the best arm of his generation. His career totals are HOF caliber. The HOF monitor statistic has him at 124 with over 100 an everage HOF'er. He was the highest paid player of his time which alone is proof that he was regarded as the best player of the late 70's. Ritter & Honig in their classic book of the 100 greatest players listed him.

The HOF is getting too exclusive. It doesn't make sense to have so many players from the past like Chick Hafey, Travis Jackson, George Kell, Rizzuto, Jim Bottomley, and you could go on and on, in the HOF----- and then not put in a player like Dave Parker. Parker was THE BEST player in all baseball for a 5 year period, and a lot of past HOF'ers weren't even the best at their position or the best player on their team.

How can Pee Wee Reese and Phil Rizzuto be in and not Concepcion? They have the same credentials. Davey's are better actually.

Why is Dale Murphy not in the HOF? He won back to back MVP's and was the best player in all of baseball in the early to mid 80's. He compares favorably to many past HOF'ers.

Blyleven has HOF numbers, but IMO he doesn't compare to Murphy or Parker. Blyleven was never considered the best pitcher in baseball. He was top 10 for many years, but he was never a real dominant type player.

Herb Tarlek
01-04-2009, 04:59 AM
Henderson and Blyleven are my picks.

While Jim Rice had a good career and a stretch of dominance between 1978-1982, I believe that Andre Dawson is more deserving.