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View Full Version : Is Bratkowski on his way out as Bengals OC?



Matt700wlw
01-18-2009, 06:33 PM
http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/blog/2009/01/ravens_coaches_in_demand.html

Ravens coaches in demand

If the Ravens lose today to Pittsburgh, don't be surprised if defensive coordinator Rex Ryan is named head coach of the New York Jets Monday or Tuesday. Ryan and the Jets are reportedly close to a deal, but nothing is definite.

If Ryan leaves, look for him to take several Ravens coaches with him, including linebackers coach Mike Pettine, who would become the Jets' defensive coordinator. Ryan also likes Ravens quarterbacks coach Hue Jackson, who would become the Jets' offensive coordinator. The only problem is that Jackson is also being approached by Bengals coach Marvin Lewis to become Cincinnati's offensive coordinator.

Jackson was once the Bengals' wide receivers coach, and tutored Bengals quarterback Carson Palmer in college.

-Mike Preston

UKFlounder
01-18-2009, 06:35 PM
That sounds too good to be true...

WVRed
01-18-2009, 07:47 PM
I'd think if the Bengals were going to dismiss Bratkowski, they would have done so by now.

highheat11
01-18-2009, 07:52 PM
I'd think if the Bengals were going to dismiss Bratkowski, they would have done so by now.

Its always possible that they're waiting to see who is available after the playoffs unfold. If they fire Bratkowski and are unable to find a better option and end up hiring a coach that doesn't deserve to be an OC then they're in even worse shape. Although some may say you couldn't possibly get worse than Brat.

WMR
01-18-2009, 08:10 PM
They really need to can Brat. His running schemes are particularly awful. The way he would send Perry up the gut when he was so much more effective running to the outside was an excellent microcosm of his overall horribleness.

camisadelgolf
01-19-2009, 03:58 AM
They really need to can Brat. His running schemes are particularly awful. The way he would send Perry up the gut when he was so much more effective running to the outside was an excellent microcosm of his overall horribleness.

I could only laugh at how often they sent Perry up the middle and Benson on the outside. I'd like to see the Bengals go in a different direction, but there's a big part of me that tells me Bratkowski has a lot of tricks up his sleeves that weren't used because the Bengals were out of the competition so early. If he were to return, I wouldn't have a problem with it. There's only so far you can go with an injured franchise QB, no starting HB or FB, a blocking TE, WRs battling injury, and a patchwork offensive line.

SunDeck
01-19-2009, 06:54 AM
Offense is garbage in garbage out. When you don't have a line that can create holes and move the defense around, it doesn't matter if you have Kreskin running the offense. It's going to suck. Bratkowski was the offensive coordinator a few years ago when the Bengals were actually capable of scoring in bunches.
It's not Bratkowski, people.

Newport Red
01-20-2009, 05:53 PM
Offense is garbage in garbage out. When you don't have a line that can create holes and move the defense around, it doesn't matter if you have Kreskin running the offense. It's going to suck. Bratkowski was the offensive coordinator a few years ago when the Bengals were actually capable of scoring in bunches.
It's not Bratkowski, people.

I agree. The offensive lines the last few years have really been coach killers.

No OC would look good having Perry as the featured back and last year's Plan B at quarterback if Carson goes down.

Their problems start at a higher payscale.

WMR
01-20-2009, 06:09 PM
I'm amazed that people want to give Bratkowski the benefit of the doubt. Time for new ideas.

Newport Red
01-20-2009, 06:25 PM
I'm amazed that people want to give Bratkowski the benefit of the doubt. Time for new ideas.

I have no problem with new ideas and a new OC.

I just don't know what new ideas will mask a terrible O-line.

WMR
01-20-2009, 06:26 PM
I have no problem with new ideas and a new OC.

I just don't know what new ideas will mask a terrible O-line.

I agree the O-line sucks and needs revamping... it's just that I'm just as sick of Brat and his play-calling.

WMR
01-20-2009, 06:27 PM
I'm not saying it's an exact parallel, but look at the defense: the D was definitely improved this season after getting rid of Bresnahan. Remember in season's past how we always blamed the personnel?

Edit: And it's not like the offense has just been disappointing this season only. Brat's play-calling has been questionable for a couple seasons now (since after 2005 really).

camisadelgolf
01-20-2009, 09:44 PM
Bratkowski's unpredictable play calling is what got the Bengals from 3-13 to 8-8 in Marvin's first couple years. It was also a big factor in the Bengals' playoff season. However, his unpredictability has become way too predictable, and with the offensive line in such bad shape, I should be trying to get more creative. Rushing Perry up the gut and Benson around the edges may be unpredictable, but it's also stupid. I'm willing to give the guy one more chance just because I know he has the ability to do well, but if 2009 is just like 2006-8, I'll be calling for his head ASAP.

WVRed
01-20-2009, 09:45 PM
Offense is garbage in garbage out. When you don't have a line that can create holes and move the defense around, it doesn't matter if you have Kreskin running the offense. It's going to suck. Bratkowski was the offensive coordinator a few years ago when the Bengals were actually capable of scoring in bunches.
It's not Bratkowski, people.

If only it were that simple, although I credit 2005 with having a lot of toys to work with on offense and a respectable defense.

What will live in my mind was the first game of this season. The Bengals got a turnover on the Ravens first possession and were well within striking range. Any time you get a turnover like that, you go straight for the kill. Bratkowski ran the ball the first two times and Palmer was sacked on third down, knocking them out of field goal range.

Bratkowski is way too conservative, and that is really what has stifled the Bengals offense, especially the last two years.

BuckeyeRedleg
01-21-2009, 10:14 AM
It's what they get for letting Steinbach go.

Hey, let's franchise Stacy Andrews again. LOL. Brilliant.

Fire them all.

Mario-Rijo
01-21-2009, 12:28 PM
If only it were that simple, although I credit 2005 with having a lot of toys to work with on offense and a respectable defense.

What will live in my mind was the first game of this season. The Bengals got a turnover on the Ravens first possession and were well within striking range. Any time you get a turnover like that, you go straight for the kill. Bratkowski ran the ball the first two times and Palmer was sacked on third down, knocking them out of field goal range.

Bratkowski is way too conservative, and that is really what has stifled the Bengals offense, especially the last two years.

Brat conservative? I was with you guys until then. The guy might have been a tad conservative this year as he should have with the players he had to work with. But if you have ever truly paid attention to Brat he's far from conservative at least by my definition. I always felt he was way too pass happy.

WVRed
01-21-2009, 07:53 PM
Brat conservative? I was with you guys until then. The guy might have been a tad conservative this year as he should have with the players he had to work with. But if you have ever truly paid attention to Brat he's far from conservative at least by my definition. I always felt he was way too pass happy.

Pass happy by my definition is Okalahoma or Texas Tech in college football, so there may be a difference.

Of course, it is also situational as well. If you are playing catchup the entire game, as the Bengals did most of the season, of course you are going to be passing more.

IMO, im willing to give Bratkowski one more year, same with Marvin. You can't fault either one for some of the things that happened this year, the offensive line being reduced to nothing and Palmer's injury, for example.

Mario-Rijo
01-22-2009, 12:34 AM
Pass happy by my definition is Okalahoma or Texas Tech in college football, so there may be a difference.

Of course, it is also situational as well. If you are playing catchup the entire game, as the Bengals did most of the season, of course you are going to be passing more.

IMO, im willing to give Bratkowski one more year, same with Marvin. You can't fault either one for some of the things that happened this year, the offensive line being reduced to nothing and Palmer's injury, for example.

As far as pass happy goes in the NFL Brat is one of the leaders in the clubhouse. He's not Mike Martz bad but he's in the argument after that.

That said it's the head coaches responsibility to let the OC know that philosophically speaking running the ball has to be an actual priority and not just one talked about. Of course we have also never had a RB that fits Brats offense, Perry was the closest in theory but proved not to be good enough. Ricky Watters was thee back for this offense in Seattle and he was an excellent fit. I know the guy is old now but I would offer Edgerrin James a 1 yr deal to see what he has left, assuming clearly better options are off the table. Another guy who might fit is Giants RB Derrick Ward. Ward with Benson would be a pretty good 1-2 punch.

But like you I believe the health of the O-Line or the lack thereof is what caused the downfall of a once mighty offense. Get that line what it needs and we are right back on track, assuming Carson doesn't get hurt yet again (someone please knock on wood).

Sea Ray
01-22-2009, 09:06 AM
Since 2005 the execution of the offense has slipped quite a bit and Brat has to take the blame for that. They also cannot execute a decent play action pass and that should not be a difficult chore for an NFL offense. He always runs the ball on 2nd and long. There are a lot of reasons for Brat to go that don't have anything to do with the O-line and Carson's injury

Mario-Rijo
01-22-2009, 03:56 PM
Since 2005 the execution of the offense has slipped quite a bit and Brat has to take the blame for that. They also cannot execute a decent play action pass and that should not be a difficult chore for an NFL offense. He always runs the ball on 2nd and long. There are a lot of reasons for Brat to go that don't have anything to do with the O-line and Carson's injury

You are right, I think of many reasons for him to go. That said you give me a healthy Carson, a stout O-Line, Ocho, TJ and Henry (all on the same page with Carson and physically up to speed) & a solid RB and Foghorn Leghorn can call the plays it won't matter one bit.

Newport Red
01-22-2009, 04:00 PM
Since 2005 the execution of the offense has slipped quite a bit and Brat has to take the blame for that. They also cannot execute a decent play action pass and that should not be a difficult chore for an NFL offense. He always runs the ball on 2nd and long. There are a lot of reasons for Brat to go that don't have anything to do with the O-line and Carson's injury

They were 29th in the league in rushing. Who would they be fooling with a play action pass? They shouldn't even bother to run play action. For Fitzpatrick's sake, his back should never be towards the defense. He should be going through his progressions FAST 'cause the pocket, if it ever existed, is closing fast.

Whether it is Bratkowski or another OC runing the offence, if the offensive line isn't upgraded, the offense will continue to struggle. A new OC will just get a pass for a year.

I have no problem with a change of philosophy at OC but Brat didn't fail with an abundance of talent.

His offensive line consisted of two adequate guards, a center that would re-estsblish the line of scrimmage two yards in the backfield, a shell of his former self in Levi and, for reasons beyond my intelligence, a tackle they farnchised who couldn't win a starting job if it weren't for injuries. That's the starting line the personnel people wanted to begin the season with.

Their starting fullback was a tight end. That'll help the running game. The featured running back couldn't hold on to the ball. The starting receivers took the preseason off. We've all witnessed their choice for backup quarterback.

Talent wins in the NFL. The Bengals haven't gotten the memo.

I'm supprised fights didn't breakout the the opposing team's defensive huddles. "Let's do this. My guy sucks." "No, let's do it this way. My guy sucks more." Let's hash it out over the quarterback.

This season, in hindsight, was over after the 3rd preseason game. That wasn't Brat's fault. That's the people running personnel.

A new scheme isn't so new after the first game. Even by halftime the defense knows who sucks and can be exploited. The Bengals offense compensated one weakness by having many more.

Sea Ray
01-22-2009, 11:56 PM
That said you give me a healthy Carson, a stout O-Line, Ocho, TJ and Henry (all on the same page with Carson and physically up to speed) & a solid RB and Foghorn Leghorn can call the plays it won't matter one bit.


You pretty well had all of that for the 2nd half of 2006 and 2007 and the results weren't too good.

Mario-Rijo
01-23-2009, 03:43 AM
You pretty well had all of that for the 2nd half of 2006 and 2007 and the results weren't too good.

The lack of Chris Henry is a major issue when you really don't run the ball all that well and we didn't run the ball all that well. It allows for the defense to simply dbl cover Chad and TJ and Blitz the crap out of us. Sure Henry came back but took quite some time to get on the same page. Yet we still managed to score plenty of points in both seasons.