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M2
05-13-2009, 12:33 PM
With the draft coming up I thought it might be fun to re-do the past drafts with the benefit of hindsight. I figure we can pick a top 30 from each of the last 10 drafts. There's no formal picking order, whoever posts gets to make the next selection. Posters can make multiple picks, just don't make two selections in a row.

Anyone selected in the draft for the year in question is eligible. How he was rated prior to the draft should not be considered. The only considerations are how he has played to date and what kind of future you think he has.

Let's keep the current picks listed with each new pick and then just bold the new selection. For instance:

1. Dude A
2. Dude B
3. Dude C
4. Dude D
5. New Dude

I'll kick it off with the first pick from 1999.

1. Albert Pujols

dougdirt
05-13-2009, 12:47 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 12:49 PM
Sure, I'll play.

1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett

For those unfamiliar with the 99 draft, here are a few notables. Harang, Sheets, Victorino, Bedard, Putz, Zito, Hamilton, C. Crawford, H. Blalock, Mench, C. Ross, Morneau, Ludwick, B. Phillips, B. Roberts, A. Rios. All in all, one of the better drafts. Quite a few duds in the first round though.

Good call on Peavy...I completely overlooked him.

dougdirt
05-13-2009, 12:51 PM
Question... are we keeping it to only guys who signed from that draft? There were a few guys who were drafted, didn't sign and were later drafted again.

medford
05-13-2009, 12:53 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford

Tough pick there, do you go w/ the early success of Zito, the later success of Harang or the speed, power & defense of Crawford. I'll go w/ Crawford.

M2
05-13-2009, 12:56 PM
Question... are we keeping it to only guys who signed from that draft? There were a few guys who were drafted, didn't sign and were later drafted again.

I say make it anyone who was drafted. We can assume, knowing what you know now, you'd offer them enough cash to sign.

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 12:57 PM
Question... are we keeping it to only guys who signed from that draft? There were a few guys who were drafted, didn't sign and were later drafted again.

I went with this list. http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/history/draft/draft.jsp?year=1999

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 12:59 PM
I say make it anyone who was drafted. We can assume, knowing what you know now, you'd offer them enough cash to sign.

If we're allowed to assume, can we assume that we drafted Jerry Narron along with Hamilton? ;) Just kidding.

dougdirt
05-13-2009, 01:06 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton - Keep him off the drugs, since we get hindsight and all.

M2
05-13-2009, 01:09 PM
I went with this list. http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/history/draft/draft.jsp?year=1999

The BBR draft pages highlight the players who've made the majors, though you can only view one round at a time.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/draft/?query_type=year_round&year_ID=1999&draft_round=1&draft_type=junreg

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 01:13 PM
Ah, even better. Thanks M2.

1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau

texasdave
05-13-2009, 01:15 PM
I don't know how I did it but i got all the players from the 99 draft at baseball-reference.com.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/draft/?query_type=pos_year&pos=P&year_ID=1999&draft_type=junreg

Ok, on second look I did not. I got all the pitchers. You can get all the players by each position.

M2
05-13-2009, 01:16 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito

Barry's going to grade out as one of the best pitchers of the past decade.

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 01:25 PM
Barry's going to grade out as one of the best pitchers of the past decade.

You really think so? I'll agree that he was good early in his career, but since to move to SF...yikes. 10-17 with a 5.15 last year. While poor, it's this stat that stands out for me. 120 k's, 102 walks.

texasdave
05-13-2009, 01:32 PM
I am a little confused by the criteria. Are we going by who had the best career-to-date from the '99 draft? Or are we going by whom we would want today from the '99 draft? Because I would clearly rather see Aaron Harang on the mound today than Barry Zito. But Zito has put up better career numbers so far.

Javy Pornstache
05-13-2009, 01:42 PM
I like this thread idea.

1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios

BuckeyeRedleg
05-13-2009, 01:46 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick

M2
05-13-2009, 01:50 PM
You really think so? I'll agree that he was good early in his career, but since to move to SF...yikes. 10-17 with a 5.15 last year. While poor, it's this stat that stands out for me. 120 k's, 102 walks.

One bad year in a decade is forgivable. Beckett had an ugly 2006. But Barry's going to throw 2,000+ IP with a sub-4.00 ERA for the entire decade. That's a damn fine 10 years.

M2
05-13-2009, 02:03 PM
I am a little confused by the criteria. Are we going by who had the best career-to-date from the '99 draft? Or are we going by whom we would want today from the '99 draft? Because I would clearly rather see Aaron Harang on the mound today than Barry Zito. But Zito has put up better career numbers so far.

It's a balance of both. The premise is that you're going back to 1999 and restaging the draft, so what a player has done prior to today definitely counts as that's what you'd be getting (in this case for the past decade) if you drafted him. As we move to newer drafts in other threads, obviously the existing body of work will shrink.

M2
05-13-2009, 02:19 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang

Ben Sheets is a better pitcher than Harang in a vacuum, but Harang's far more durable. Showing up is a big part of the job.

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 02:19 PM
I think it's subjective on your part. It's who YOU want at that slot. Based on past career performance, future outlook, whatever. If you prefer Aaron over Zito...take him next.

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 02:21 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips

He may get bashed from time to time here, but I don't think anyone can question Phillips' skills.

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 02:24 PM
One bad year in a decade is forgivable. Beckett had an ugly 2006. But Barry's going to throw 2,000+ IP with a sub-4.00 ERA for the entire decade. That's a damn fine 10 years.

Fair enough. I don't, however, see him improving over the next few years though. But it's hard to argue with his first 5-7 years or so. Flat out solid. (I'd still take Harangatang though *grin*)

camisadelgolf
05-13-2009, 02:27 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts

I'm surprised that Phillips was taken before Roberts.

camisadelgolf
05-13-2009, 02:31 PM
Just so it's clear, are players who were drafted but didn't sign eligible?

OnBaseMachine
05-13-2009, 02:33 PM
Nice thread idea.

1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey

M2
05-13-2009, 02:35 PM
Just so it's clear, are players who were drafted but didn't sign eligible?

Aye, they are.

thatcoolguy_22
05-13-2009, 02:36 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard


It was a close call between Bedard and Rich Harden...

(even though somehow I think the Reds would have still screwed up that pick and went for the potential of Howington :) with that FO )

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 02:41 PM
I'm surprised that Phillips was taken before Roberts.

I liked Phillips' speed and glove better than Roberts. Plus I'm a homer. :O)

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 02:42 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz

osuceltic
05-13-2009, 02:50 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts

I'm surprised that Phillips was taken before Roberts.

I'm surprised Ludwick was taken before either of them.

OnBaseMachine
05-13-2009, 02:57 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets

Scrap Irony
05-13-2009, 02:57 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden

M2
05-13-2009, 03:00 PM
OBM wins for being milliseconds faster on the draw. Ben Sheets goes 16, Rich Harden goes 17.

1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden

On a side note, did you know Ben Sheets has the 5th best (for pitchers with 1,000+ IP) K/BB ratio ever?

BuckeyeRedleg
05-13-2009, 03:08 PM
Harden taken in the 38th round by Seattle. Wow. A steal for the A's the next year in the 17th round.

BuckeyeRedleg
05-13-2009, 03:16 PM
I'm surprised Ludwick was taken before either of them.

Why? Because Ludwick is a late-bloomer?

Last 738 plate appearances (2008 and 2009):

.950 OPS
45 HR
139 RBI

Redlegs212
05-13-2009, 03:21 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino

BuckeyeRedleg
05-13-2009, 03:25 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp

Kingspoint
05-13-2009, 03:31 PM
Use this for a reference:

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/draft/1999/June-Reg/38.shtml

Kingspoint
05-13-2009, 03:31 PM
I'll take Hank Blalock.

1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock

medford
05-13-2009, 03:36 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers

texasdave
05-13-2009, 03:45 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 04:12 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill

BearcatShane
05-13-2009, 04:44 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill
24. Chris Duncan

medford
05-13-2009, 04:45 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill
24. Chris Duncan
25. Reed Johnson

BuckeyeRedleg
05-13-2009, 04:47 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill
24. Chris Duncan
25. Reed Johnson
26. Scott Hairston

M2
05-13-2009, 04:50 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill
24. Chris Duncan
25. Reed Johnson
26. Scott Hairston
27. Mark Ellis

medford
05-13-2009, 04:50 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill
24. Chris Duncan
25. Reed Johnson
26. Scott Hairston
27. Mark Ellis
28. Bryan Bullington

Then I would have quickly traded him 3 seasons later when he was considered to have top of the draft talent.

M2
05-13-2009, 04:52 PM
28. Bryan Bullington

Then I would have quickly traded him 3 seasons later when he was considered to have top of the draft talent.

Cagey. Me likey.

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 04:55 PM
What? No Ty Howington yet? I'm stunned by the revelation. :O)

medford
05-13-2009, 04:58 PM
credit to you M2, great thread idea and the link to baseball cube actually it easy enough to find players in each round that reached the show. Although honestly, was 99 considered a down draft? I would have thought you could have easily pulled out more impact (or at least quality major leaguers for 2-3 rounds). At this point, it seems like Jason Jennings, Mike Jacobs and Adam LaRoche are about all that are left aside from some cup of coffee types (I'm sure I've missed a name or 2). Of course I've also passed over names that were once thrown around as the next big thing, like Reggi Abercombie, who never really amounted to much w/ the Braves. Bringing back the Stubbs conversation, I think it shows just how valuable that pick is in actuallity, should Stubbs put together a solid 5 year major league career. Of course that's still a big if, but It shows just how hard it is to have a great draft. Heck, getting just 1 5 year quality major leaguer each draft probably puts you right about in the middle of the curve.

medford
05-13-2009, 05:00 PM
also just noted that Bender came out of that draft. He was certainly a favorite of a certain Redszoner or 2.

BuckeyeRedleg
05-13-2009, 05:06 PM
Ironic that 1999 was first year in a 3-year span of probably the worst drafts in Reds franchise history, but through the trade of Jose Guillen (for Harang) and the fleecing of Cleveland (for Phillips) the Reds now possess arguably two of the top 10 players from that draft.

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 05:09 PM
I still think the kid Chris Sampson with the Astros has a bright future. It could be because the 3 times I've seen him in person he was really impressive, but he's got nice stuff.

osuceltic
05-13-2009, 05:25 PM
Why? Because Ludwick is a late-bloomer?

Last 738 plate appearances (2008 and 2009):

.950 OPS
45 HR
139 RBI

Late-bloomer, limited track record (can he sustain?), plays less of a premium position and doesn't bring the defensive or baserunning value of Phillips (or Roberts, although I'm not as comfortable evaluating his defense because I don't see him play all the time).

M2
05-13-2009, 05:43 PM
Although honestly, was 99 considered a down draft? I would have thought you could have easily pulled out more impact (or at least quality major leaguers for 2-3 rounds).

I don't think it was. Wait until we do 2000 (tomorrow). We'll be running dry in the top 10.

It should be interesting to see how the lists stack up against one another. My guess is '99 will stack up pretty well.

camisadelgolf
05-13-2009, 05:55 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill
24. Chris Duncan
25. Reed Johnson
26. Scott Hairston
27. Mark Ellis
28. Bryan Bullington
29. Adam LaRoche

Javy Pornstache
05-13-2009, 05:57 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill
24. Chris Duncan
25. Reed Johnson
26. Scott Hairston
27. Mark Ellis
28. Bryan Bullington
29. Adam LaRoche
30. Ryan Doumit

medford
05-13-2009, 05:59 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill
24. Chris Duncan
25. Reed Johnson
26. Scott Hairston
27. Mark Ellis
28. Bryan Bullington
29. Adam LaRoche
30. Ryan Doumit
31. John Lackey

Can I put the cap on this at 31, or are we moving on till no one else is added?

Yeah, I looked ahead to 2000 out of interest after posting that, and there is very little to write home about. Heck Keymastur is might make that top 30 legimately, not just for his Redszone minor league forum fame.

camisadelgolf
05-13-2009, 06:00 PM
Lackey is already taken, medford.

OnBaseMachine
05-13-2009, 06:09 PM
I still think the kid Chris Sampson with the Astros has a bright future. It could be because the 3 times I've seen him in person he was really impressive, but he's got nice stuff.

Sampson will turn 31 years old in less than two weeks.

OnBaseMachine
05-13-2009, 06:12 PM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Rich Harden
18. Shane Victorino
19. Coco Crisp
20. Hank Blalock
21. Brett Meyers
22. Lyle Overbay
23. Rich Hill
24. Chris Duncan
25. Reed Johnson
26. Scott Hairston
27. Mark Ellis
28. Bryan Bullington
29. Adam LaRoche
30. Ryan Doumit

I can't believe no one took Ryan Doumit sooner. I'd take him over everyone listed from 21-30.

_Sir_Charles_
05-13-2009, 06:14 PM
Sampson will turn 31 years old in less than two weeks.

I know. Just sayin. Despite numbers and such, I like his chances. I just came across his name in the draft list and I felt like I'd comment. With the astros pitching situation, it wouldn't surprise me for him to get quite a few innings this year and next. 31 is still way too young to close the book.

medford
05-13-2009, 06:21 PM
Lackey is already taken, medford.

whoops:confused:

thatcoolguy_22
05-13-2009, 06:22 PM
I vote we stop at 30 until we reach 2004 or so where a lot of players still have potential written on their tags.

Doumit would have to be higher than 30. I would put him before Ludwick or JJ Putz. Probably somewhere around 16.

Mario-Rijo
05-13-2009, 06:39 PM
Pretty cool idea, wish I'd gotten here sooner.

M2
05-13-2009, 06:53 PM
Pretty cool idea, wish I'd gotten here sooner.

I'll kick off the 2000 list tomorrow.

30 struck me as the reasonable stopping point, though people should feel free to list all the people who got robbed. Jason Jennings and Jon Rauch are none too pleased, let me tell you.

BearcatShane
05-13-2009, 06:54 PM
Just made my mock for 2000. When we kickin this thing off tomorrow?

Kingspoint
05-13-2009, 06:56 PM
I don't think it was. Wait until we do 2000 (tomorrow). We'll be running dry in the top 10.

It should be interesting to see how the lists stack up against one another. My guess is '99 will stack up pretty well.


Not much after Round 31 in 2000 other than maybe Luke Scott. Chris Dickerson in Round 32 might get a vote. Actually, you're right. Not much after round 10 or so, other than Jason Bay. Adam LaRoche can be taken again.

M2
05-13-2009, 07:00 PM
Just made my mock for 2000. When we kickin this thing off tomorrow?

Sometime in the a.m.

Kingspoint
05-13-2009, 07:27 PM
If you're wondering if the guy who signed Albert Pujols (13th Round of this draft) was some super-genious, or something, it turns out that he just got lucky.

Players signed by Dave Karaff

Player Name Position High Level Signed Year Signing Team Region

Keith Helton P AAA 1987 Seattle Mariners Arkansas
John Nelson SS MLB 2001 St. Louis Cardinals Kansas
Albert Pujols 1B-LF MLB 1999 St. Louis Cardinals Missouri
Scott Taylor P MLB 1988 Seattle Mariners Kansas
Les Walrond P MLB 1998 St. Louis Cardinals Kansas

lollipopcurve
05-13-2009, 08:21 PM
Just wanted to break these out by round -- of the 30, 8 are 1st rounders. Only half are 1st-3rd rounders.

1. Albert Pujols 13th

2. Jake Peavy 8th

3. Josh Beckett 1st/2

4. Carl Crawford 2nd

5. Josh Hamilton 1st/1

6. Justin Morneau 3rd (catcher in HS)

7. Barry Zito 1st/9

8. Alexis Rios 1st/19

9. Ryan Ludwick 2nd

10. Aaron Harang 6th

11. Brandon Phillips 2nd

12. Brian Roberts 1st/supp/50

13. John Lackey 2nd

14. Eric Bedard 6th

15. J.J. Putz 6th

16. Ben Sheets 1st/10

17. Rich Harden 38th (unsigned)

18. Shane Victorino 6th

19. Coco Crisp 7th

20. Hank Blalock 3rd

21. Brett Myers 1st/12

22. Lyle Overbay 18th

23. Rich Hill 36th (unsigned -- Reds)

24. Chris Duncan 1st/supp/46

25. Reed Johnson 17th

26. Scott Hairston 18th (unsigned)

27. Mark Ellis 9th

28. Bryan Bullington 37th (unsigned)

29. Adam LaRoche

30. Ryan Doumit 2nd

M2
05-13-2009, 08:53 PM
Just wanted to break these out by round -- of the 30, 8 are 1st rounders.

It really underscores the crapshoot nature of the draft. Only 4 of the top 10, only two 11-30 picks and only two supplemental 1st rounders made the list.

Kingspoint
05-13-2009, 08:57 PM
It really underscores the crapshoot nature of the draft. Only 4 of the top 10, only two 11-30 picks and only two supplemental 1st rounders made the list.



Which also goes to show on draft day that there are no reaches.

If someone was projected as a 2nd Rounder or 3rd Rounder and you take him in the middle of the 1st, no one can really say that he's a reach. It's not like the NFL draft, where 95% of your All-Pros come from the 1st and 2nd Rounds and the first 7 picks of the 3rd Round.

thatcoolguy_22
05-13-2009, 09:21 PM
Which also goes to show on draft day that there are no reaches.

If someone was projected as a 2nd Rounder or 3rd Rounder and you take him in the middle of the 1st, no one can really say that he's a reach. It's not like the NFL draft, where 95% of your All-Pros come from the 1st and 2nd Rounds and the first 7 picks of the 3rd Round.

good point.

It also illustrates why moving prospects for proven talent will work out more often than not. It may be embarrassing to trade a young Aaron Harang or Tom Seaver but, more often than not its trading Zach Ward for Kyle Lohse.

BuckeyeRedleg
05-13-2009, 11:30 PM
If you remove the five that eventually did not sign as part of the 1999 draft class (Harden/SEA, Hill/CIN, Hairston/CHW, Bullington/KC, and LaRoche/FLA), the list is wittled down to:

1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Shane Victorino
18. Coco Crisp
19. Hank Blalock
20. Brett Meyers
21. Lyle Overbay
22. Chris Duncan
23. Reed Johnson
24. Mark Ellis
25. Ryan Doumit

A glaring omission from the first list was Mike Jacobs (NYM, 38-1156).

A couple others that could be added towards the bottom of this list are Brandon Lyon (TOR, 14-433), Marlon Byrd (PHI, 10-306), John Rauch (CHW, 3-99), Kevin Mench (TEX, 4-118), Chris Campuano (ARI, 7-238), and Jason Frasor (DET, 33-987). Let's also not forget Cody Ross (DET, 4-117), Jeff Baker (CLE, 4-137), and Jason Lane (HOU, 6-203).

According to The Baseball Cube, of the 1474 players drafted, 85 made it to the majors and 246 are still active in some form.

The hindsight winners............

St. Louis
-Pujols (13-402)
-Crisp (7-222)
-Duncan (1-46)

Texas
-Harang (6-195)
-Blalock (3-105
-Mench (4-118)

Oakland
-Zito (1-9)
-Ludwick (2-60)

Toronto
-Rios (1-19)
-Johnson (17-523)
-Lyon (14-433)

Tampa Bay
-Hamilton (1-1)
-Crawford (2-52)

Baltimore
-Roberts (1-50)
-Bedard (6-187)

Arizona
-Lyle Overbay (18-538)
-Chris Campuano (7-238)

San Diego
-Jake Peavy (15-472)

Mario-Rijo
05-14-2009, 03:11 AM
If you remove the five that eventually did not sign as part of the 1999 draft class (Harden/SEA, Hill/CIN, Hairston/CHW, Bullington/KC, and LaRoche/FLA), the list is wittled down to:

1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Shane Victorino
18. Coco Crisp
19. Hank Blalock
20. Brett Meyers
21. Lyle Overbay
22. Chris Duncan
23. Reed Johnson
24. Mark Ellis
25. Ryan Doumit

A glaring omission from the first list was Mike Jacobs (NYM, 38-1156).

A couple others that could be added towards the bottom of this list are Brandon Lyon (TOR, 14-433), Marlon Byrd (PHI, 10-306), John Rauch (CHW, 3-99), Kevin Mench (TEX, 4-118), Chris Campuano (ARI, 7-238), and Jason Frasor (DET, 33-987). Let's also not forget Cody Ross (DET, 4-117), Jeff Baker (CLE, 4-137), and Jason Lane (HOU, 6-203).

According to The Baseball Cube, of the 1474 players drafted, 85 made it to the majors and 246 are still active in some form.

The hindsight winners............

St. Louis
-Pujols (13-402)
-Crisp (7-222)
-Duncan (1-46)

Texas
-Harang (6-195)
-Blalock (3-105
-Mench (4-118)

Oakland
-Zito (1-9)
-Ludwick (2-60)

Toronto
-Rios (1-19)
-Johnson (17-523)
-Lyon (14-433)

Tampa Bay
-Hamilton (1-1)
-Crawford (2-52)

Baltimore
-Roberts (1-50)
-Bedard (6-187)

Arizona
-Lyle Overbay (18-538)
-Chris Campuano (7-238)

San Diego
-Jake Peavy (15-472)

Interesting. Since it is hindsight and we do know the potential pitfalls the question is this.

Take St. Louis' Draft or Tampa Bay Draft again using your hindsight.

M2
05-14-2009, 03:39 AM
Which also goes to show on draft day that there are no reaches.

If someone was projected as a 2nd Rounder or 3rd Rounder and you take him in the middle of the 1st, no one can really say that he's a reach. It's not like the NFL draft, where 95% of your All-Pros come from the 1st and 2nd Rounds and the first 7 picks of the 3rd Round.

That's why I took Logan Forsythe with pick #30 in the Redszone mock draft last year. Instead of trying to figure who the "best" guy on the board was (which is nebulous at best after you get past the top of the first round) I started asking myself, who do you really think can be a player?

M2
05-14-2009, 03:40 AM
If you remove the five that eventually did not sign as part of the 1999 draft class (Harden/SEA, Hill/CIN, Hairston/CHW, Bullington/KC, and LaRoche/FLA), the list is wittled down to:

1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito
8. Alexis Rios
9. Ryan Ludwick
10. Aaron Harang
11. Brandon Phillips
12. Brian Roberts
13. John Lackey
14. Eric Bedard
15. J.J. Putz
16. Ben Sheets
17. Shane Victorino
18. Coco Crisp
19. Hank Blalock
20. Brett Meyers
21. Lyle Overbay
22. Chris Duncan
23. Reed Johnson
24. Mark Ellis
25. Ryan Doumit

A glaring omission from the first list was Mike Jacobs (NYM, 38-1156).

A couple others that could be added towards the bottom of this list are Brandon Lyon (TOR, 14-433), Marlon Byrd (PHI, 10-306), John Rauch (CHW, 3-99), Kevin Mench (TEX, 4-118), Chris Campuano (ARI, 7-238), and Jason Frasor (DET, 33-987). Let's also not forget Cody Ross (DET, 4-117), Jeff Baker (CLE, 4-137), and Jason Lane (HOU, 6-203).

According to The Baseball Cube, of the 1474 players drafted, 85 made it to the majors and 246 are still active in some form.

The hindsight winners............

St. Louis
-Pujols (13-402)
-Crisp (7-222)
-Duncan (1-46)

Texas
-Harang (6-195)
-Blalock (3-105
-Mench (4-118)

Oakland
-Zito (1-9)
-Ludwick (2-60)

Toronto
-Rios (1-19)
-Johnson (17-523)
-Lyon (14-433)

Tampa Bay
-Hamilton (1-1)
-Crawford (2-52)

Baltimore
-Roberts (1-50)
-Bedard (6-187)

Arizona
-Lyle Overbay (18-538)
-Chris Campuano (7-238)

San Diego
-Jake Peavy (15-472)

Great stuff.

redsmetz
05-14-2009, 12:06 PM
I'm late to the conversation, but it makes me realize how young Albert Pujols still is seeing he was taken the same year as Josh Hamilton (although I think Pujols had some college experience, IIRC).

HermW
05-14-2009, 12:35 PM
I don't have time to do this, but it would be nice to add HS/College (and even projected position drafted to play) to the players in addition to the round they were actually selected, since that is a frequent draft debate.

Kingspoint
05-14-2009, 07:52 PM
Great stuff. Agree. I like how buckeyeredleg posted the "winners" of that draft.

Kingspoint
05-14-2009, 07:53 PM
I think after the "miss" on Pujols, that the scouting departments of most of the franchises took a major shift into the direction of outside the United States. I know the REDS did when O'Brien got here.

edabbs44
05-14-2009, 07:55 PM
I think after the "miss" on Pujols, that the scouting departments of most of the franchises took a major shift into the direction of outside the United States. I know the REDS did when O'Brien got here.

But Pujols was a JUCO guy, I think.

Kingspoint
05-14-2009, 07:59 PM
But Pujols was a JUCO guy, I think.


I didn't know that.


I do remember the shift of scouting going into Latin America heavily after about 2001.

PuffyPig
05-15-2009, 12:39 AM
1. Albert Pujols
2. Jake Peavy
3. Josh Beckett
4. Carl Crawford
5. Josh Hamilton
6. Justin Morneau
7. Barry Zito

Barry's going to grade out as one of the best pitchers of the past decade.


No problem with that, we'll trade him just before he crashes for Dan Haren.

PuffyPig
05-15-2009, 12:40 AM
I'm late to the conversation, but it makes me realize how young Albert Pujols still is seeing he was taken the same year as Josh Hamilton (although I think Pujols had some college experience, IIRC).

I think Pujols was actually 35 when he was drafted.

redsmetz
05-15-2009, 06:03 AM
But Pujols was a JUCO guy, I think.

Baseball Cube shows he was drafted out of a community college. He was 19 and is just now 29. Like I said, it always surprises me how young he is.