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View Full Version : I feel like we're so close, we just need ONE more piece



LouisvilleCARDS
05-27-2009, 01:12 AM
The Nix/Gomes platoon in left seems like a great move, lets hope it stays that way. I feel like we just need ONE more move or something. Get a big bat, somehow, someway to put in this lineup. I don't know where or from who. Just some bullpen tuning (send Lincoln down), and a big bat, SOMETHING and I think we might have a team that can get over the hump and stay there. We're in the race now, but we just need that bump.

GOYA
05-27-2009, 01:14 AM
The one more piece needs to be Jay Bruce. And Lincoln has worn out his welcome. There are arms in Louisville that could help the Reds.

LouisvilleCARDS
05-27-2009, 01:19 AM
The one more piece needs to be Jay Bruce. And Lincoln has worn out his welcome. There are arms in Louisville that could help the Reds.

I agree completely. Bruce needs to turn it on like Votto has, and that could be the bump. Also, I don't see why the Reds don't bring Homer up to the pen. I mean, enough is enough, maybe its time to start thinking of converting this guy to relief, he's young but he's had so many chances to prove himself and he keeps blowing them. Sitting in the pen and just being on the team around veterans as the last man out of the pen and working on things each day is probably better for the guy at this point. I feel we need to make some shakeup moves before we wait for another 5 game losing streak to happen to force hands.

Dude Rock
05-27-2009, 01:32 AM
I agree completely. Bruce needs to turn it on like Votto has, and that could be the bump. Also, I don't see why the Reds don't bring Homer up to the pen. I mean, enough is enough, maybe its time to start thinking of converting this guy to relief, he's young but he's had so many chances to prove himself and he keeps blowing them. Sitting in the pen and just being on the team around veterans as the last man out of the pen and working on things each day is probably better for the guy at this point. I feel we need to make some shakeup moves before we wait for another 5 game losing streak to happen to force hands.

You had me until you mentioned Homer. Seriously. Can this message board forum grow up and realize that Homer IS NOT READY?????????? You Homer-fanatics are like "enablers to an alcoholic or drug addict". You think Homer is the answer and RIGHT NOW, he isn't. It seems like every time I check this message board the Homer-fanatics continue to pronounce Homer as the saviour. HE'S NOT READY PEOPLE!!!!!!! Maybe someday.

It is driving me crazy.

I do agree that the farm system has relievers ready to replace Lincoln. I'd DFA'd Lincoln tomorrow and give another guy a chance. If Burton has options, I'd send him down right now. I'm tired of his act too.

I grew up watching Sparky Andersen manage. He had a short leash. Dusty is so darn patient, it drives me crazy. As Marty said on the radio, the players cannot complain that Dusty didn't give them a chance because he has never seen a more patient manager.

I think the hitting on this team is fine. Why? Because I don't see a reasonably priced big bat out there I'd trade for. All these other teams want your farm system in trade, and I don't see anyone close to worth it.

I'd much rather have Peavy if I'm going to sell the farm. Seriously. I'd take my chances with this lineup and hope it continues to grow and blossom..........and I'd move Peavy into the starting rotation, scare the crap out of the rest of the national league, move Micah to long reliever....primary pinch hitter and possibly left field .........and see how we finish.

Peavy with this rotation and lineup would serve notice that the Reds are for real.

RedLakerFan24
05-27-2009, 01:36 AM
Delmon Young and Francisco Lariano for Homer Bailey, Drew Stubbs,
and Yonder Alonso

Dude Rock
05-27-2009, 01:43 AM
If Houston were willing to trade Carlos Lee, we'd have our RH LFer. But, I'm actually more interested in bolstering our starting rotation and replacing Micah. I love Micah's bat..........but I'm becoming alienated by his penchant to lose focus during starts and blow games. I think he should go the Rick Ankiel route.

LouisvilleCARDS
05-27-2009, 01:51 AM
You had me until you mentioned Homer. Seriously. Can this message board forum grow up and realize that Homer IS NOT READY?????????? You Homer-fanatics are like "enablers to an alcoholic or drug addict". You think Homer is the answer and RIGHT NOW, he isn't. It seems like every time I check this message board the Homer-fanatics continue to pronounce Homer as the saviour. HE'S NOT READY PEOPLE!!!!!!! Maybe someday.

It is driving me crazy.

I do agree that the farm system has relievers ready to replace Lincoln. I'd DFA'd Lincoln tomorrow and give another guy a chance. If Burton has options, I'd send him down right now. I'm tired of his act too.

I grew up watching Sparky Andersen manage. He had a short leash. Dusty is so darn patient, it drives me crazy. As Marty said on the radio, the players cannot complain that Dusty didn't give them a chance because he has never seen a more patient manager.

I think the hitting on this team is fine. Why? Because I don't see a reasonably priced big bat out there I'd trade for. All these other teams want your farm system in trade, and I don't see anyone close to worth it.

I'd much rather have Peavy if I'm going to sell the farm. Seriously. I'd take my chances with this lineup and hope it continues to grow and blossom..........and I'd move Peavy into the starting rotation, scare the crap out of the rest of the national league, move Micah to long reliever....primary pinch hitter and possibly left field .........and see how we finish.

Peavy with this rotation and lineup would serve notice that the Reds are for real.

I'm not a Homer fanatic, but I think he could be a good reliever. The Bats aren't exactly in great shape bullpen wise, practically everyone on the team now has a 4 plus ERA. Being realistic, there's no clear answer from the pen in Louisville.

What drives me crazy is people throwing around trade names like Peavy, Holiday, or crap that like that won't happen in a MILLION years. Face it, we're never going to be buyers for guys like that, and guys like that don't want to come to Cincinnati, PERIOD. He just declined a trade to the White Sox, who have been a ton better than us in recent years and fill their stadium.

Some people need to realize, Cincinnati isn't even CLOSE on the national scene in baseball and in big trade discussions EVER. There's no sense in even discussing names like Peavy or Holiday, because they ain't comin'.

Dude Rock
05-27-2009, 02:17 AM
I'm not a Homer fanatic, but I think he could be a good reliever. The Bats aren't exactly in great shape bullpen wise, practically everyone on the team now has a 4 plus ERA. Being realistic, there's no clear answer from the pen in Louisville.

What drives me crazy is people throwing around trade names like Peavy, Holiday, or crap that like that won't happen in a MILLION years. Face it, we're never going to be buyers for guys like that, and guys like that don't want to come to Cincinnati, PERIOD. He just declined a trade to the White Sox, who have been a ton better than us in recent years and fill their stadium.

Some people need to realize, Cincinnati isn't even CLOSE on the national scene in baseball and in big trade discussions EVER. There's no sense in even discussing names like Peavy or Holiday, because they ain't comin'.

I disagree. Right now there are only 9 teams with better winning percentages than us.

Peavy didn't want to play for Ozzie. It was stated that it was his concern. Also, he wanted to stay in the NL.

I do think Peavy is holding out for the Dodgers to come after him..........and if they did..........write them down for the World Series.

But the Reds payroll is at $73 million. Peavy is making $11 million this year and whole lot more down the road, but I still think they could trade him down the road if they want to and someone will take him on. I know he has like a $18 million option somewhere down the road, but still I think you could trade him if it came down to one year. A $93 million payroll for the Reds is not unreasonable if they are contending. Management and the fans just continue to think small market. Personally, I"m getting ready to purchase some tickets for the rest of the season right now. I had a reserve belief early on.......but I'm really starting to believe now.

I don't want Holiday. In fact, I'd rather have a fearsome starting rotation and go with our position players than trade for some big bat that will cost us out the wazoo.

Dude Rock
05-27-2009, 02:24 AM
How long before those teams that are out of it come calling to make a deal?

Dude Rock
05-27-2009, 02:36 AM
Interesting thread on ORG discussing what they'd give if Berkman became available. Some posters even went so far to discuss obtaining Berkman and Oswalt. They are giving up the farm, and not really complaining about it.

BurgervilleBuck
05-27-2009, 06:57 AM
I love Micah's bat..........but I'm becoming alienated by his penchant to lose focus during starts and blow games. I think he should go the Rick Ankiel route.
That's going to take more time than I think any of us are going to want to deal with for a player like Owings, frankly. It's not something that you can do overnight.

The key right now is getting Bruce's hitting back on track.

Dude Rock
05-27-2009, 10:58 AM
That's going to take more time than I think any of us are going to want to deal with for a player like Owings, frankly. It's not something that you can do overnight.

The key right now is getting Bruce's hitting back on track.

Micah played third base at one point in his career. So many people want EE to move to LF, why can't Micah do it?

Here's a good article: http://www.danwashburn.com/micah.html

I think the dude should go to the bullpen but become an everyday player. He'd be the power bat the Reds have been looking for. He's right under their nose, and they've yet to realize it.

BigJohn
05-27-2009, 11:34 AM
Well when does EE come back. He should be the Big RH bat that is needed. HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!:)

Hondo
05-27-2009, 12:00 PM
You had me until you mentioned Homer. Seriously. Can this message board forum grow up and realize that Homer IS NOT READY?????????? You Homer-fanatics are like "enablers to an alcoholic or drug addict". You think Homer is the answer and RIGHT NOW, he isn't. It seems like every time I check this message board the Homer-fanatics continue to pronounce Homer as the saviour. HE'S NOT READY PEOPLE!!!!!!! Maybe someday.

It is driving me crazy.

I do agree that the farm system has relievers ready to replace Lincoln. I'd DFA'd Lincoln tomorrow and give another guy a chance. If Burton has options, I'd send him down right now. I'm tired of his act too.

I grew up watching Sparky Andersen manage. He had a short leash. Dusty is so darn patient, it drives me crazy. As Marty said on the radio, the players cannot complain that Dusty didn't give them a chance because he has never seen a more patient manager.

I think the hitting on this team is fine. Why? Because I don't see a reasonably priced big bat out there I'd trade for. All these other teams want your farm system in trade, and I don't see anyone close to worth it.

I'd much rather have Peavy if I'm going to sell the farm. Seriously. I'd take my chances with this lineup and hope it continues to grow and blossom..........and I'd move Peavy into the starting rotation, scare the crap out of the rest of the national league, move Micah to long reliever....primary pinch hitter and possibly left field .........and see how we finish.

Peavy with this rotation and lineup would serve notice that the Reds are for real.


A totally agree...

Ya know... Why don't they try Homer as a Closer in the Minors... Guys got a good fastball...

On Peavy... That aquisition would show the Baseball WORLD the Reds are here for an October Run...

I would be willing to go with Gomes in left and add Peavy... Come on guys, he is young, a Cy Young Winner and going into his PRIME...

Walt is a Big Name Trader so hopefully he is working a Deal... Hell, Homer going to San Diego might be a Great Place for him...

BurgervilleBuck
05-27-2009, 02:08 PM
Micah played third base at one point in his career. So many people want EE to move to LF, why can't Micah do it?
You have a point.

Say, you know, Paul Janish used to pitch. How about we convert him to a middle reliever?

OesterPoster
05-27-2009, 02:16 PM
Delmon Young and Francisco Lariano for Homer Bailey, Drew Stubbs,
and Yonder Alonso

Alonso can't be traded prior to August.

GIDP
05-27-2009, 02:17 PM
The thing we are missing is another legit bat somewhere. It doesnt matter if its a RH or a LH bat right now.

the 2 places we need it from are 3rd, SS, or LF.

We need some slugging % because other than Bruce Phillips and Votto we really dont have much of it.

Kingspoint
05-27-2009, 02:44 PM
Pieces on their way....

Edwin=Right-handed Power
Phillips=Defense and Clutch Right-handed hitting
Volquez=Excellent Pitching
Votto=MVP (Votto on a daily basis)

GOYA
05-27-2009, 02:51 PM
Pieces on their way....

Edwin=Right-handed Power

EE is slugging at .190

Rosales has 9 RBIs. Edwin has 6.

edit: jeez... EE has only played in 19 games this year. It doesn't seem like he's been out that long.

Rockermann
05-27-2009, 02:54 PM
EE is slugging at .190

Rosales has 9 RBIs. Edwin has 6.

edit: jeez... EE has only played in 19 games this year. It doesn't seem like he's been out that long.

And he did all of that with a broken wrist. I think when he comes back, we'll see more typical numbers from him. If not better.

Hey Meat
05-27-2009, 03:03 PM
The Nix/Gomes platoon in left seems like a great move, lets hope it stays that way. I feel like we just need ONE more move or something. Get a big bat, somehow, someway to put in this lineup. I don't know where or from who. Just some bullpen tuning (send Lincoln down), and a big bat, SOMETHING and I think we might have a team that can get over the hump and stay there. We're in the race now, but we just need that bump.

The one more piece scares me. Remember 2006 when we gained a few pieces in exchange for Felipe and Austin Kearns. If we do get a piece hopefully it is not going to be at an opportunity cost that puts us out of contention again.

GIDP
05-27-2009, 03:14 PM
Edwin isnt going to be important enough if he doesnt start going the other way. Him pulling the ball is killing his average.

LouisvilleCARDS
05-27-2009, 03:38 PM
I disagree. Right now there are only 9 teams with better winning percentages than us.

Peavy didn't want to play for Ozzie. It was stated that it was his concern. Also, he wanted to stay in the NL.

I do think Peavy is holding out for the Dodgers to come after him..........and if they did..........write them down for the World Series.

But the Reds payroll is at $73 million. Peavy is making $11 million this year and whole lot more down the road, but I still think they could trade him down the road if they want to and someone will take him on. I know he has like a $18 million option somewhere down the road, but still I think you could trade him if it came down to one year. A $93 million payroll for the Reds is not unreasonable if they are contending. Management and the fans just continue to think small market. Personally, I"m getting ready to purchase some tickets for the rest of the season right now. I had a reserve belief early on.......but I'm really starting to believe now.

I don't want Holiday. In fact, I'd rather have a fearsome starting rotation and go with our position players than trade for some big bat that will cost us out the wazoo.

It doesn't have anything to do with winning percentage right now. It's more about the franchise itself and its luring power, the city, etc. Let me ask, when's the last time the Reds landed a monumental trade for a bonafide top of the line player. Yeah, thats right, its been NINE years, with Griffey. We're not getting Peavy. It's not even a topic of conversation. I could see a solid player kind of like Jermaine Dye being rumored before the season, but thats it.

Hondo
05-27-2009, 04:21 PM
It doesn't have anything to do with winning percentage right now. It's more about the franchise itself and its luring power, the city, etc. Let me ask, when's the last time the Reds landed a monumental trade for a bonafide top of the line player. Yeah, thats right, its been NINE years, with Griffey. We're not getting Peavy. It's not even a topic of conversation. I could see a solid player kind of like Jermaine Dye being rumored before the season, but thats it.


So a 35 year old Outfielder for 11.5 Million or an ACE Starting Pitcher who is in his PRIME in a contract that runs through 2011????

I will take the ACE Jake Peavy.

Jr's Boy
05-27-2009, 07:20 PM
I'll feel like we are close come end of June if we're still at 500 or better.

Shawn_RedsFan
05-27-2009, 08:03 PM
Delmon Young and Francisco Lariano for Homer Bailey, Drew Stubbs,
and Yonder Alonso

that would never happen

CincyRed44
05-29-2009, 02:03 PM
As a PTBNL Yonder Alonso most definitely could be traded, then on Aug. 15 or 16 they make the final announcement naming him as the PTBNL.

Alonso, Bailey and Stubbs for Young & Liriano is not going to happen. The Twins have a glut of OF so Stubbs would be out of the bartering game. The main reason to rid themselves of Young is to unclog the OF in Minny. Alonso would not be in the discussion either, unless they realize Morneau is not remaining in Minneapolis.

So what would be included likely; Bailey + a young bullpen arm, (Fisher or Masset) one of our 3b prospects (Francisco or Frazier) not Encarncion, then you name Liriano as the second acquisition in the deal go ahead and add one of our good MI prospects (Cozart or Valaika) and likely another arm like (Sulbaran, Travis Wood or Moloney).

I'm not a person willing to empty the coffers to receive players that marginally could help this team get the NL WC this year. Hold onto your young players and see if they can develop in the manner as Votto, Bruce and Cueto. Sustained success for a small market team like the Reds relies tremendously on a healthy farm system. For now we have a pretty good one.

If Peavy would agree to wave his NTC to come to Cincy then that's the only player I'd even consider dealing a package like the above mentioned for the Minny duo. That gives us a frightening rotation in a short series that could compete and win. Peavy, Cueto and Volquez is a very nice young core.

RedLakerFan24
05-29-2009, 02:09 PM
As a PTBNL Yonder Alonso most definitely could be traded, then on Aug. 15 or 16 they make the final announcement naming him as the PTBNL.

Alonso, Bailey and Stubbs for Young & Liriano is not going to happen. The Twins have a glut of OF so Stubbs would be out of the bartering game. The main reason to rid themselves of Young is to unclog the OF in Minny. Alonso would not be in the discussion either unless they realize Morneau is not remaining in Minneapolis.

So what would be included likely; Bailey + a young bullpen arm, (Fisher or Masset) one of our 3b prospects (Francisco or Frazier) not Encarncion, then you name Liriano as the second acquisition in the deal go ahead and add one of our good MI prospects (Cozart or Valaika) and likely another arm like (Sulbaran, Travis Wood or Moloney).

I'm not a person willing to empty the coffers to receive players that marginally could help this team get the NL WC this year. If Peavy wold agree to wave his NTC to come to Cincy then that's the only player I'd even consider dealing a package like the above mentioned for the Minny duo.


Peavy doesnt want to pitch in a hitters ballpark thats why he doesnt want to got to philly, and GABP is a hitters one so i cant see peavy in a reds Uni, how about we go for Adrian Beltre and Eric Bedard, we fix our line up a bit and fix our Pitching Rotation, Homer Bailey, Drew Stubbs, Todd Frazier, Matt Moloney for Adrian Beltre and Eric Bedard

Dude Rock
05-29-2009, 06:22 PM
Peavy doesnt want to pitch in a hitters ballpark thats why he doesnt want to got to philly, and GABP is a hitters one so i cant see peavy in a reds Uni, how about we go for Adrian Beltre and Eric Bedard, we fix our line up a bit and fix our Pitching Rotation, Homer Bailey, Drew Stubbs, Todd Frazier, Matt Moloney for Adrian Beltre and Eric Bedard

Isn't Bedard injury prone? Isn't Beltre overhyped and overpaid?

Dude Rock
05-29-2009, 06:30 PM
Here's Beltre's season so far and career averages:

2009
47 games
189 at-bats
11 doubles
3 HR's
.211
.245 OBP
.317 SLG

Career averages:
23.5 HR's per full season
.269 batting average
.324 OBP
.779 OPS
.956 fielding percentage

Bedard has appeared to be pretty healthy every season but last one when he only made 15 starts. He has made 9 starts this season so far and his numbers are impressive. Both Bedard and Beltre are 30 years old.

Beltre signed a 5 year deal worth $64 million with Seattle in 2004, and this is the last year of that contract.........so you're not locked into anything, but you are getting a rent-a-player, which shouldn't merit much in return, IMHO.

Seattle might be willing to trade Bedard. He is also in the last year of his contract. We'd be getting another rent-a-player, but it would be low risk.

I might actually do this deal depending on what they want in return. If they're willing to accept they might get nothing in return if they don't trade them, they might take a little less to get like a Homer Bailey and Drew Stubbs. I'd throw in Roenicke, Darryl Thompson, and possibly a one more guy. They could get 5 or 6 prospects (but not all top prospects) for these guys when the Reds would basically be renting them, I think Seattle would do pretty well making that deal. The key piece would obviously be Bedard. He's a solid lefty.......something we're currently missing in the rotation. Beltre is in a contract year and might improve with a change of scenery. But he's not what I'm really after. But you might catch lightning in a bottle and actually improve this team without giving up much. I'm not a big Homer fan anyway.

Dude Rock
05-29-2009, 06:42 PM
Peavy doesnt want to pitch in a hitters ballpark thats why he doesnt want to got to philly, and GABP is a hitters one so i cant see peavy in a reds Uni, how about we go for Adrian Beltre and Eric Bedard, we fix our line up a bit and fix our Pitching Rotation, Homer Bailey, Drew Stubbs, Todd Frazier, Matt Moloney for Adrian Beltre and Eric Bedard

Alright, I know it's my third post about this subject, but after doing some research, I just wanted to say I think it's a good trade idea. I kinda hate parting with Frazier though. And we haven't seen what Maloney could do in the majors, but maybe it's better that his triple AAA numbers look so good to improve his value in a trade?

I also realize Beltre and Bedard are like rent-a-players, but there's good and bad to that. It is low risk on the Reds part, but they deplete their farm system to make a run at a pennant.

ChatterRed
05-30-2009, 03:51 AM
Alright, I know it's my third post about this subject, but after doing some research, I just wanted to say I think it's a good trade idea. I kinda hate parting with Frazier though. And we haven't seen what Maloney could do in the majors, but maybe it's better that his triple AAA numbers look so good to improve his value in a trade?

I also realize Beltre and Bedard are like rent-a-players, but there's good and bad to that. It is low risk on the Reds part, but they deplete their farm system to make a run at a pennant.

Good work. :thumbup:

BEETTLEBUG
05-30-2009, 09:55 AM
I for one do not like that trade idea.

Ghosts of 1990
05-30-2009, 12:04 PM
Here's another idea. See what Baltimore would want for Brian Roberts. I think Bailey and another prospect might get that deal done. Play Roberts at second base and Phillips at shortstop. Hit Roberts second. That allows Hairston to play 3B and outfield when needed. Roberts is a switch hitter. I think this guy could be a force at GABP and Baltimore will be looking to move him.

Dude Rock
05-30-2009, 04:39 PM
Here's another idea. See what Baltimore would want for Brian Roberts. I think Bailey and another prospect might get that deal done. Play Roberts at second base and Phillips at shortstop. Hit Roberts second. That allows Hairston to play 3B and outfield when needed. Roberts is a switch hitter. I think this guy could be a force at GABP and Baltimore will be looking to move him.

It won't happen. Management will continue to run AGon out to SS, and Phillips ain't moving from 2B. The more likely scenario is picking up a third baseman.