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View Full Version : Who will have the better career...Alonso or Beckham?



fearofpopvol1
06-03-2009, 02:10 PM
I know...it's early to make such proclamations. But for fun, since the Reds did have the option of both and were rumored prior to be picking Gordon Beckham...do you think Alonso or Beckham will turn out to be more valuable?

It should be noted that Alonso started at A+ while Beckham started at AA. Alonso is now at AA while Beckham is now at AAA. It's also interesting to note that Beckham has been moved to 3B (since he was originally drafted as a SS).

Alonso: http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?n=Yonder%20Alonso&pos=1B&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=475174

Beckham: http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?n=Gordon%20Beckham&pos=3B&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=493596

dougdirt
06-03-2009, 02:14 PM
Alonso. He has much better plate discipline and more power. Beckham won't play SS in the majors, so his positional value over Alonso isn't much anymore.

nmculbreth
06-03-2009, 02:26 PM
I'd be willing to venture that Alonso ends up putting up better numbers than Beckham but Beckham ends up being the more valuable player.

As much as I love Alonso's bat, realistically speaking he is limited to playing 1B or DH, whereas Beckham could end up playing anywhere in the infield. If Beckham can stay at SS, his bat should be above average at a critical position. Obviously he becomes a bit less valuable if he has to move to 2B or 3B but even then he still profiles as above average to average. In order for Alonso to be considered an above average player he's going to have to OPS north of .850 and that's a pretty tall order.

cincy09
06-03-2009, 02:39 PM
Alonso for sure. His bat easily will play at first base. Beckham's true value was at short, but as predicted, he will not end up there.

JaxRed
06-03-2009, 02:47 PM
Probably Alonso..... but the guy I thought/think they should have taken at 1b is Smoak

Superdude
06-03-2009, 02:48 PM
I think a better question is Alonso or Smoak

princeton
06-03-2009, 02:52 PM
I'd be willing to venture that Alonso ends up putting up better numbers than Beckham but Beckham ends up being the more valuable player.

especially for the Reds, who already had a young lefty 1st baseman

it's interesting that Chris Buckley, who drafted a need leadoff CFer and a huge need catcher, talked about not drafting for need the year after he finally overlooked the need pick (Beckham) for the glut pick (Alonso when Reds had Dunn and Votto already). if there was one year when going for the need made sense...

dougdirt
06-03-2009, 02:53 PM
Smoak is currently being owned in AA by left handers. A scout I talked to said that he believes Smoak has a hard time picking up the ball against more advanced lefties. I think it will be interesting to see how Alonso does against them.

dougdirt
06-03-2009, 02:54 PM
Assumptions on your part that anyone of those guys were drafted based on 'need'.

Bumstead
06-03-2009, 03:17 PM
I think Alonso vs Smoak will be a lot more interesting than Alonso vs Beckham. Beckham is not going to play SS, so picking him based on 'need' is irrelevant. Smoak was hitting really well in AA until he strained his Oblique. Should be interesting to see how both players adjust against the lefties.

Bum

Mario-Rijo
06-03-2009, 03:48 PM
Smoak is currently being owned in AA by left handers. A scout I talked to said that he believes Smoak has a hard time picking up the ball against more advanced lefties. I think it will be interesting to see how Alonso does against them.

Smoak is a switch hitter isn't he?

dougdirt
06-03-2009, 03:55 PM
Smoak is a switch hitter isn't he?

Yes he is.

Mario-Rijo
06-03-2009, 04:26 PM
Yes he is.

And having trouble picking up LHP's? That's unusual.

dougdirt
06-03-2009, 04:47 PM
And having trouble picking up LHP's? That's unusual.

Might be a dominant eye kind of thing? :confused: Not sure, but I was talking to a guy about it two days ago actually and asked if he was concerned about how Smoak had hit lefties and his response was that he just doesn't seem to be picking up the ball at all against them.

osuceltic
06-03-2009, 05:23 PM
I'm holding off on the Alonso hype until he hits lefties. In my opinion, that's still a huge question mark.

And the better question might be will the return we get for Alonso (and subsequent major league outcome) be better than any of the three (Alonso, Smoak, Beckham). Because I still think Alonso is trade bait. I don't see Votto moving off first.

PuffyPig
06-03-2009, 05:36 PM
The Reds passed on Beckham becuase they believed (as many did) that he was not going to play SS in the majors.

It appears that was correct.

I belive that if Beckham was drafted as a 3rdbaseman, he would have fallen even further.

I agree that the Smoak/Alonso comparisons are more accurate.

DTCromer
06-03-2009, 05:38 PM
My favorite thread on this board was when RZ destroyed the Yonder pick last pick and then immediately hoping for Miami (Fl) to lose in the CWS so we could sign him earlier.

And then everyone wanted to trade him because we already have Joey at 1st base.

Good times.

SMcGavin
06-03-2009, 06:14 PM
My favorite thread on this board was when RZ destroyed the Yonder pick last pick and then immediately hoping for Miami (Fl) to lose in the CWS so we could sign him earlier.

And then everyone wanted to trade him because we already have Joey at 1st base.

Good times.

What? You must have been going to a different Redszone than I was.

nate
06-03-2009, 06:16 PM
My favorite thread on this board was when RZ destroyed the Yonder pick last pick and then immediately hoping for Miami (Fl) to lose in the CWS so we could sign him earlier.

And then everyone wanted to trade him because we already have Joey at 1st base.

Good times.

"RZ" and "everyone" always pal around saying the most outlandish things!

camisadelgolf
06-03-2009, 09:27 PM
What? You must have been going to a different Redszone than I was.

HokieRed
06-03-2009, 09:27 PM
I'm holding off on the Alonso hype until he hits lefties. In my opinion, that's still a huge question mark.

And the better question might be will the return we get for Alonso (and subsequent major league outcome) be better than any of the three (Alonso, Smoak, Beckham). Because I still think Alonso is trade bait. I don't see Votto moving off first.


In this case I see Votto playing first base by 2011 for another team.

dougdirt
06-04-2009, 12:19 AM
Gordon Beckham is being called up to the White Sox tomorrow.

fearofpopvol1
06-04-2009, 01:05 AM
Gordon Beckham is being called up to the White Sox tomorrow.

Don't you think that's rushing it?

dougdirt
06-04-2009, 01:38 AM
Don't you think that's rushing it?

Eh, I am not sure really. His plate approach is strong enough that I think he will not fall flat on his face. I would be surprised if he were to OPS .800 or better this season though.

indy_dave00
06-04-2009, 01:56 AM
Those who say Joey Votto won't play left field must have forgotten he has already played 6 games there when he was originally recalled in Sept. of 2007 . I watched him play there some vs Indy in late Aug 2007 and he did not appear to be lost there.

If Yonder hits well enough the Reds will find a place on the field for both he and Votto.

Plus Plus
06-04-2009, 02:05 AM
Makes one wonder if the timetable on Alonso might be the reason that no big LF bat was shopped for...

GIDP
06-04-2009, 02:41 AM
Beckham is being rushed but being rushed but I doubt its going to hurt him over all that much.

Kingspoint
06-04-2009, 09:18 PM
When I picked Beckham 2 days ago, I chose him with no reservations about what type of career Alonso's going to have. Certainly no one here has praised Alonso as much as I have from the beginning until now, but it's like picking between Jack Clark (Alonso) and Jeff Kent (Beckham). While Beckham (Kent) will probably play for the same team longer and not price himself onto another club as quickly as Alonso (Clark) will, the main difference I see between the two, and I saw them both play their last months in College, Alonso's most likely to be the star of a team whereever he goes, but Beckham will produce a better career just because he'll play for more years, have fewer injuries, have more overall stats, play better defense, and be thought of as the better player by the public. Alonso's more likely to get more MVP's, while Beckham's more likely to get more All-Star appearances. These are two great players.

11larkin11
06-04-2009, 09:21 PM
Beckham played third in his debut today. He went 0-3 with a K

Kingspoint
06-04-2009, 09:22 PM
Beckham is being rushed but being rushed but I doubt its going to hurt him over all that much.

1.100 OPS at AAA his first week while hitting over .400 might have been all they need to see.

Both players could have gone straight into the Majors. It's merely defensive seasoning that the two of them could have used time in the minors at all. They were both ready to hit in the Majors right out of college and have a normal rookie season, .250 AVG, with .330 OBP and .440 SLG.

Bumstead
06-05-2009, 01:14 PM
Dude

If memory serves me correctly, you said that Alonso was going to be a better player than Tony Perez. Beckham is going to be better than that??? Wow, I gotta watch this!

Just a good natured jab. You know I'm one of the Alonso supporters.

Bum

Kingspoint
06-08-2009, 03:04 PM
I do think he'll be better than Tony Perez. I think Jack Clark was better than Tony Perez, too, though not defensively, and Alonso will not be close defensively to how good Perez was, either. I thought about it more later and really see Jack Clark's career to be the closest I can think of to Alonso, where I think Alonso will be more consistent with his average than Clark was. Beckham better, though? It's really a matter of which type of player you want on your team, or need. I love both.

princeton
06-21-2009, 05:33 PM
especially for the Reds, who already had a young lefty 1st baseman

it's interesting that Chris Buckley, who drafted a need leadoff CFer and a huge need catcher, talked about not drafting for need the year after he finally overlooked the need pick (Beckham) for the glut pick (Alonso when Reds had Dunn and Votto already). if there was one year when going for the need made sense...

I'm still surprised over not picking Beckham, who'd be Reds' starting shortstop right now and would be a middle infielder who can actually hit high in the order.

Stubbs was a need, Mesoraco was a need, Leake's a need (after Arroyo/Harang salary dumps)... but Alonso over Beckham?

Reds would be interesting with Beckham and ADunn right now.