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Brutus
06-03-2009, 03:09 PM
I've been hearing more and more about Michael Taylor the last few weeks. It's been especially prevalent in the idea of trading Aaron Harang or Bronson Arroyo to the Phillies if the Reds fall out of the race.

My question is: where did the buzz come from? I've seen his stat line, and clearly he's hitting. It seems, though, you don't usually see that kind of hype for a 24-year old in Double-A. I am not at all saying he's not worth the buzz, I'm just surprised at it's unusual and it's just all of the sudden been surfacing.

His line at Reading (.339/.398/.613/1.011) is impressive. I'm more impressed by the 0.71 BB/K ratio. He's got a .445 wOBA and a .332 GPA. Even making the jump from Double-A to Philadelphia, his MLE's project to a very solid .284/.331/.489/.820. That's a respectable .271 GPA.

His numbers pass the smell test. However, beyond being from Stanford, what's the book on this guy?

dougdirt
06-03-2009, 03:12 PM
Lots and lots of tools. He had to kind of revamp his swing, which is why he has really turned it on of late.

Brutus
06-03-2009, 03:16 PM
Lots and lots of tools. He had to kind of revamp his swing, which is why he has really turned it on of late.

Thanks. I wondered where the basis originated. I had heard very little about him until the last few weeks. Since then, it's exploded.

OesterPoster
06-03-2009, 03:23 PM
Looks like the Phillies have a ton of young guys worth trading for, and not even mentioned in the article is Lou Marson, their stud catcher moving up fast.

Corner Market

The Phillies are looking for starting pitching. They have some talent and depth in the minor leagues at corner outfield spots, and might consider using one of the following prospects in a trade:

John Mayberry Jr., 25 - He's back in triple A after hitting a home run in Yankee Stadium in his second big-league at-bat. At 6-foot-6, 230 pounds, Mayberry has excellent power but needs to make more contact to maximize it. He was hitting .277 with 8 homers, 25 RBIs, and an on-base plus slugging percentage of .887 in 37 games at triple A.

Michael Taylor, 23 - Like Mayberry, he is a Stanford product and has excellent size (6-6, 250) and power potential. Scouts believe his power numbers could improve if he incorporates more of his body into his swing. Contact is not a problem. His combined batting average last season in single A and this season in double A is .345. He was hitting .341 with 9 homers, 38 RBIs and a 1.001 OPS in 46 games at double-A Reading.

Dominic Brown, 21 - An excellent athlete, he passed on a chance to be a wide receiver at Miami. His whip-like lefthanded swing and 6-5 frame have prompted comparisons to Darryl Strawberry. He was hitting .317 with 6 homers, 33 RBIs and a .941 OPS in 44 games at single-A Clearwater. He has the raw ingredients to develop into a major-league all-star and may be an untouchable in trade talks.

- Jim Salisbury

http://www.philly.com/inquirer/sports/20090603_Phils__prospect_Taylor_bides_his_time.htm l

11larkin11
06-03-2009, 03:29 PM
I just did a lot of reading up on Taylor, and I really really like him. If we were to trade Arroyo/Harang, he's who I'd want back.

dougdirt
06-03-2009, 03:46 PM
If I am trading with the Phillies I want Dominic Brown back. Simple as that. He is their best prospect and I don't think its that close. Brown is one of the 3 best outfield prospects in baseball.

OesterPoster
06-03-2009, 03:55 PM
Would the Phillies really be willing to trade Brown for either Harang or Arroyo though? I just don't see it, from their point of view.

dougdirt
06-03-2009, 03:57 PM
Would the Phillies really be willing to trade Brown for either Harang or Arroyo though? I just don't see it, from their point of view.

Not sure, but that's what I would be asking for, especially for Harang. I don't think I would come off of it for Harang. Arroyo I would settle for a lesser player, but not Harang.

bellhead
06-03-2009, 04:16 PM
I think Harang at the trade deadline would bring an organizations best prospect + at least one other top 100 guy. During the last 4 years he is one of the top 10 pitchers in the game.

Arroyo I would be happy with one of the top 4 and some minor league arms.

Eric_the_Red
06-03-2009, 04:32 PM
I think Harang at the trade deadline would bring an organizations best prospect + at least one other top 100 guy. During the last 4 years he is one of the top 10 pitchers in the game.

Arroyo I would be happy with one of the top 4 and some minor league arms.

Yes, but during the last 2 years he is definitely not. I don't know that 2009 Harang nets a blue-chip #1 prospect.

membengal
06-03-2009, 04:32 PM
Brutus, he's 23, won't turn 24 until December.

Briefly, from the post I did on ORG, my memory of reading up on him a few months back for a prospects draft I was in, is that he was highly touted coming out of HS, went to Stanford, and they messed up his swing. Big time. Apparently, and I don't know this other than from reading it, Stanford has a "Stanford approach" to swinging a bat and Taylor got messed up trying to adapt.

He got drafted in 2007 and went through a year in 2007 where the Phillies worked to help him find his original swing. Somewhere through there, a light came back on, and he exploded in 2008 and it has continued into 2009.

He is 6'6" 250 pounds, with some speed.

His current line after last night at Reading?

.339/.398/.613 for a 1.011 OPS 10 homeruns. 10 doubles. 8 stolen bases. 16 BBs. 23 Ks.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=taylor010mic

membengal
06-03-2009, 04:33 PM
Yes, but during the last 2 years he is definitely not. I don't know that 2009 Harang nets a blue-chip #1 prospect.

If not then the Phillies don't get Aaron Harang.

Eric_the_Red
06-03-2009, 04:34 PM
If not then the Phillies don't get Aaron Harang.

Point being that he may not net Brown, but may be able to get Taylor in return.

TC81190
06-03-2009, 04:38 PM
If Harang goes to Philly, then we should get no less than Brown/Taylor and Drabek in return. Throw in a Jared Burton or something if you have to.

That's how valuable Harang is to the Reds.

membengal
06-03-2009, 04:41 PM
Point being that he may not net Brown, but may be able to get Taylor in return.

I want the Reds to get whomever's "blue chip" player if they deal Harang. If you have Brown ahead of Taylor and you are the Reds front office, you demand Brown.

Yes, Harang still should merit that. If not, don't deal him.

mrpotamus
06-03-2009, 11:43 PM
Why would the Reds trade Harang for another outfielder? They have enough as it is and they have a guy in Heisey who is the same age, in the same level, and putting up better numbers all around. No thanks. If they are going to trade Harang, the return needs to be pitching or a short stop.

dougdirt
06-03-2009, 11:47 PM
Why would the Reds trade Harang for another outfielder? They have enough as it is and they have a guy in Heisey who is the same age, in the same level, and putting up better numbers all around. No thanks. If they are going to trade Harang, the return needs to be pitching or a short stop.

I like Chris Heisey, so lets not take this the wrong way... but he isn't in the same realm of prospect as Dominic Brown or Michael Taylor. Taylor also is a year younger than Heisey is.

mound_patrol
06-04-2009, 12:42 AM
Yes, but during the last 2 years he is definitely not. I don't know that 2009 Harang nets a blue-chip #1 prospect.

I agree with you. I don't see the Reds getting a true "Blue chip" player for Harang at this point in his career and contract. If they could get a player like Taylor I would jump at that.

11larkin11
06-04-2009, 12:49 AM
I agree with you. I don't see the Reds getting a true "Blue chip" player for Harang at this point in his career and contract. If they could get a player like Taylor I would jump at that.

We have no reason to trade Harang. The Phillies are the ones that are trading FOR something they desperately need. They need to give a little more if they want a workhorse

Eric_the_Red
06-04-2009, 07:39 AM
We have no reason to trade Harang. The Phillies are the ones that are trading FOR something they desperately need. They need to give a little more if they want a workhorse

I can think of 23.5 to 36.25 million reasons over the next 2-3 years why.

I'm not saying that I think the Reds need to trade Harang or Arroyo right now, but for the right deal, I'd listen. Both are making quite a bit of money and are on the downside of their career. I think you'd get much, much more for them this year than 2 years down the road.

11larkin11
06-04-2009, 05:51 PM
I can think of 23.5 to 36.25 million reasons over the next 2-3 years why.

I'm not saying that I think the Reds need to trade Harang or Arroyo right now, but for the right deal, I'd listen. Both are making quite a bit of money and are on the downside of their career. I think you'd get much, much more for them this year than 2 years down the road.

I'm not saying I wouldn't trade him. I'm just saying that they are they ones that are initating the trade. We can sit still and keep Harang and be fine, but they NEED a SP or two. They are in need, so they need to give up a little more

jojo
06-04-2009, 06:03 PM
Here's the "Philly problem".... Want to drive a hard bargain with Harang? Ok. They'll inquire about Bedard/Washburn.

dougdirt
06-04-2009, 06:05 PM
Here's the "Philly problem".... Want to drive a hard bargain with Harang? Ok. They'll inquire about Bedard/Washburn.

That's fine by me. I will keep Harang in that case.

jojo
06-04-2009, 06:09 PM
That's fine by me. I will keep Harang in that case.

I agree. I was just suggesting that Harang's trade value might be mitigated by the other arms that could get floated.

HokieRed
06-04-2009, 07:46 PM
I think this team has a real chance--not this year's faux chance--to be a serious contender in 2010, but I suspect it will take all 7 of our starting and potential starting pitchers to do that: Cueto, Harang, Arroyo, Volquez, Owings, Bailey, and Maloney. So here's the question: Can we really, conceivably contend without Aaron Harang in 2010? I think the answer to that question is no, and I suspect I'd have to give a reluctant no if the question was about Arroyo.

membengal
06-04-2009, 09:18 PM
I agree. I was just suggesting that Harang's trade value might be mitigated by the other arms that could get floated.

So be it. Either the Reds get value, or don't make the deal.

RedlegJake
06-05-2009, 09:54 AM
I think this team has a real chance--not this year's faux chance--to be a serious contender in 2010, but I suspect it will take all 7 of our starting and potential starting pitchers to do that: Cueto, Harang, Arroyo, Volquez, Owings, Bailey, and Maloney. So here's the question: Can we really, conceivably contend without Aaron Harang in 2010? I think the answer to that question is no, and I suspect I'd have to give a reluctant no if the question was about Arroyo.

Well, I'd agree with you if the Reds got nobody of value in return. BUT, the right trade package could make the Reds better all around in 2010. The whole key is who do we get in return? If you can get a Brown or Taylor plus a couple prospects you have to go for it. Plus it frees up a lot of future cash for possible FA contracts or to keep our own from becoming FAs. If you can't get a serious return for them then yes, you keep them.

HokieRed
06-05-2009, 11:08 AM
Well, I'd agree with you if the Reds got nobody of value in return. BUT, the right trade package could make the Reds better all around in 2010. The whole key is who do we get in return? If you can get a Brown or Taylor plus a couple prospects you have to go for it. Plus it frees up a lot of future cash for possible FA contracts or to keep our own from becoming FAs. If you can't get a serious return for them then yes, you keep them.

How often have the Reds been able to get a pitcher of Harang's quality? How many of those have been available in recent free agent markets? Of the perhaps one or two available each year (a high estimate), how likely is one to come to Cinti rather than one of the other clubs who will inevitably be pursuing a pitcher of that caliber? I think the only realistic way we can trade Harang and still be near the top of the Central next year is if Edinson Volquez becomes much more reliable than he has shown thus far and if everybody else on the staff stays completely healthy. Those are very large "ifs."