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Brutus
07-03-2009, 05:01 PM
According to Dave O'Brien of the Atlanta-Journal Constitution, Yunel Escobar (and Javier Vasquez) are very serious candidates to be traded by the Braves.

O'Brien says Escobar is "a legit possibility to be moved."

This was just posted on MLB Trade Rumors a short time ago.

Folks... here is Cincinnati's answer to their shortstop woes, both short & long term IMHO.

jmcclain19
07-03-2009, 05:04 PM
A young, talented, cheap shortstop becomes available on a team that's in rebuilding mode.

You have to ask yourself why the Braves have interest in moving Escobar to a new location.

Mario-Rijo
07-03-2009, 05:06 PM
A young, talented, cheap shortstop becomes available on a team that's in rebuilding mode.

You have to ask yourself why the Braves have interest in moving Escobar to a new location.

The guy is a clown. Very immature which reveals itself in many different ways. But as good as he is you have to take a chance on him. They reportedly want a good bat for him. EE? I'd just about gaurantee they would consider that and stick EE in LF immediately.

Brutus
07-03-2009, 05:06 PM
A young, talented, cheap shortstop becomes available on a team that's in rebuilding mode.

You have to ask yourself why the Braves have interest in moving Escobar to a new location.

This was brought up in another thread (before this news, but rather when his name simply was talked about). I have heard several times he's in the Braves' doghouse for 'attitude' issues. I don't know for sure if this is the case, but while I'm a guy that does care about character, I have not heard enough bad things about him to do anything but take it with a grain of salt.

Offensively he's a clear upgrade and defensively he gets the job done. He's cheap and has some years left. I can't think of too many reasons why not to do it.

marcshoe
07-03-2009, 05:13 PM
I'd take them both. The Reds could certainly find room for Vasqluez in the rotation.

Yunel's the guy, though, that answers a big question and could be foundational. There's not going to be a comparable shortstop available this year.

westofyou
07-03-2009, 05:18 PM
Bobby Cox doesn't give up on quality players, there has to be something to him or his game that is pushing him towards the door.

Mario-Rijo
07-03-2009, 05:28 PM
Bobby Cox doesn't give up on quality players, there has to be something to him or his game that is pushing him towards the door.

It's been well chronicled that he is very immature. He complains, he sulks, and regarding his play it seems he'd rather be pretty 1st then good. He sounds a little bit like a more selfish and immature Felipe.

Here's a piece from the SD a few days back.


Cox won’t say when Escobar will return to lineup
By DAVID O'BRIEN

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Saturday, June 27, 2009

Shortstop Yunel Escobar was out of the lineup for the second consecutive game Saturday, and the official reason given by the Braves was a strained hip flexor that has bothered him off and on for the past month.

While no one doubted that Escobar was hurt, the consensus in and around the Braves clubhouse was that he would have played Saturday if it were up to him.

It was not up to him.

Manager Bobby Cox declined to comment, but the Braves are frustrated by Escobar’s immature behavior. Most recently, he mouthed an expletive toward the scorekeeper in the press box after being charged with an error in Thursday’s loss to the Yankees, an incident caught by the TV cameras on the game broadcast.

Escobar, 26, pouted in the aftermath of that play and appeared uninterested for the rest of the inning. Bench coach Chino Cadahia laid into him between innings, letting him know that the behavior was unacceptable.

Escobar played the rest of the game, but hasn’t played since. Cox wouldn’t say when he will be back in the lineup.

The Braves are unquestionably a lesser team without Escobar, a .300 career hitter with 88 extra-base hits (22 homers) and a .367 on-base percentage in 292 games since reaching the majors in June 2007.

He has batted .292 with seven homers and 39 RBIs this season, including .307 with 12 RBIs in his past 17 games. But he also has had some costly lapses in concentration and five errors in that 17-game span.

SirFelixCat
07-03-2009, 05:29 PM
I'm def. leary on why the Braves would punt a solid, young SS like this. Attitude isn't reason enough, imo.

That said, the Reds have to be salivating, no?


Cozart is the only SS in the minors for the Reds...how far away is he from be ML ready?

sonny
07-03-2009, 05:30 PM
I'd give Maloney + Stubbs. I would also throw in the deal that Mario-Rijo would register at braveszone.com

reds44
07-03-2009, 05:31 PM
No better manager to get the best out of a player than Dusty....

jojo
07-03-2009, 05:35 PM
I'd give Maloney + Stubbs. I would also throw in the deal that Mario-Rijo would register at braveszone.com

I'm not sure the Braves would be looking for a CFer with their new guy and with Schafer really close too.....

Mario-Rijo
07-03-2009, 05:35 PM
I'd give Maloney + Stubbs. I would also throw in the deal that Mario-Rijo would register at braveszone.com

Why, Are my deals that bad that you'd figure it have to be good for the reds?

westofyou
07-03-2009, 05:36 PM
I'd give Maloney + Stubbs. I would also throw in the deal that Mario-Rijo would register at braveszone.com

They just got a CF from the Pirates and they have the guy that couldn't cut it this year and he's IIRC younger than Stubbs.

Getting a SS from outside your organization is perhaps the hardest thing to do in MLB, so you have to pay high 90% of the time or take something with a question mark looming over the horizon.

jojo
07-03-2009, 05:37 PM
And if the Braves are trying to get a bat, well, that takes the Reds out of the running.

sonny
07-03-2009, 05:41 PM
Why, Are my deals that bad that you'd figure it have to be good for the reds?

Oh quite the contrary, You would bring a wealth of insight to their discussions! :thumbup:

You are the cornerstone peice to this deal!

nate
07-03-2009, 05:44 PM
How about Jay Bruce? I know that might freak some folks out but outfielders we have, SS we don't.

Not saying I would, just throwing it out there.

reds44
07-03-2009, 05:46 PM
We have outfielders? We have Bruce and we have Dickerson, and then we have a lot of bad.

nate
07-03-2009, 05:48 PM
We have outfielders? We have Bruce and we have Dickerson, and then we have a lot of bad.

And the SS situation is?

Mario-Rijo
07-03-2009, 05:49 PM
Oh quite the contrary, You would bring a wealth of insight to their discussions! :thumbup:

You are the cornerstone peice to this deal!

Oh I see, just want to trade me off huh. Now I know how Yunel feels. :( :confused:

:cool:

westofyou
07-03-2009, 05:50 PM
How about Jay Bruce? I know that might freak some folks out but outfielders we have, SS we don't.

Not saying I would, just throwing it out there.

Nope, Bruce has a much higher ceiling and isn't likely to end up playing off his position for awhile.

kaldaniels
07-03-2009, 05:51 PM
How about Jay Bruce? I know that might freak some folks out but outfielders we have, SS we don't.

Not saying I would, just throwing it out there.

Well, come clean. Would you or wouldn't you (assuming each is the trade centerpiece for each club)? You did bring up the subject.

nate
07-03-2009, 05:54 PM
Well, come clean. Would you or wouldn't you (assuming each is the trade centerpiece for each club)? You did bring up the subject.

Just throwing it out there for discussion. I probably wouldn't but was interested in the thoughts of others.

TheNext44
07-03-2009, 05:57 PM
How about Alonso?

He's a hitter, not that far away, and he is somewhat redundant in the Reds organization.

Mario-Rijo
07-03-2009, 06:04 PM
How about Alonso?

He's a hitter, not that far away, and he is somewhat redundant in the Reds organization.

Certainly they wouldn't say no to Alonso most likely but I believe they do have a young 1st baseman about where Yonder is as well with a high ceiling.

I'm betting the Braves would ask for a guy like Frazier plus some, they are an extremely smart organization. Frazier has that fire in his belly they like and the skills to man 3B after Chipper hangs them up and could play LF in the meantime. I do not know if I could do that trade (I'm very partial to him) but I'm sure most everyone else here would.

klw
07-03-2009, 06:04 PM
• It's got to be Yunel: On another front, how willing are the Braves to deal Yunel Escobar now that he's journeyed deep into Bobby Cox's doghouse? Depends on whom you ask. An executive of one team reports: "They're not moving him. He still figures in their plans for next year, and they've got him for low dollars." But an official of another team that inquired says the response was "a very, very wobbly maybe." Realistically, though, the Braves have no other feasible options at shortstop. So an Escobar trade seems highly unlikely, no matter how unhappy the manager might be with him.

Per Jayson Stark
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=stark_jayson&page=rumblings090703

Mario-Rijo
07-03-2009, 06:13 PM
• It's got to be Yunel: On another front, how willing are the Braves to deal Yunel Escobar now that he's journeyed deep into Bobby Cox's doghouse? Depends on whom you ask. An executive of one team reports: "They're not moving him. He still figures in their plans for next year, and they've got him for low dollars." But an official of another team that inquired says the response was "a very, very wobbly maybe." Realistically, though, the Braves have no other feasible options at shortstop. So an Escobar trade seems highly unlikely, no matter how unhappy the manager might be with him.


Add on a Janish or Valaika to a deal?

I got it!

Reds get Vazquez, Francouer & Escobar
Braves get EE, Micah Owings, Chris Valaika, Carlos Fisher and Arroyo

Reds then trade Francouer to S.D. for Kouzmanoff

jojo
07-03-2009, 06:25 PM
Add on a Janish or Valaika to a deal?

I got it!

Reds get Vazquez, Francouer & Escobar
Braves get EE, Micah Owings, Chris Valaika, Carlos Fisher and Arroyo

Reds then trade Francouer to S.D. for Kouzmanoff

I bet you're wearing leather pants aren't ya? :cool:

11larkin11
07-03-2009, 06:27 PM
Would they do a EE and Cozart/Valaika for Yunel? I'd throw in Arroyo and eat his contract...

reds44
07-03-2009, 06:29 PM
If you trade EE, you blow just as big of a hole in 3rd base as you currently have at SS. If the Reds are trading for somebody at the deadline this year, they aren't going to give up players currently on the major league roster. It's all going to be prospects.

And there's no way I would trade Bruce for Escobar anyways.

11larkin11
07-03-2009, 06:34 PM
If you trade EE, you blow just as big of a hole in 3rd base as you currently have at SS. If the Reds are trading for somebody at the deadline this year, they aren't going to give up players currently on the major league roster. It's all going to be prospects.

And there's no way I would trade Bruce for Escobar anyways.

See, I'm of the thinking that Todd Frazier could come up and be league average at third right now, which is better than we've had all year.

traderumor
07-03-2009, 06:35 PM
See if they take Rob Bell, Jung Bong, and Bubba Nelson.

Mario-Rijo
07-03-2009, 06:35 PM
I bet you're wearing leather pants aren't ya? :cool:

:p:

Benihana
07-03-2009, 07:03 PM
Alonso, Bailey and Valaika/Cozart for Vazquez, Escobar and Francoeur.

That's probably about what it would take.

--

I don't think this deal would happen. I'm not sure the Reds could take on Vazquez's contract without shedding Arroyo's. But that deal would put the Reds in a strong position for the playoffs this year and would solve the SS solution for years to come. It is, however, a pretty steep price to pay. Would you do it?

TheNext44
07-03-2009, 07:10 PM
Alonso, Bailey and Valaika/Cozart for Vazquez, Escobar and Francoeur.

That's probably about what it would take.

--

I don't think this deal would happen. I'm not sure the Reds could take on Vazquez's contract without shedding Arroyo's. But that deal would put the Reds in a strong position for the playoffs this year and would solve the SS solution for years to come. It is, however, a pretty steep price to pay. Would you do it?

How about the Reds give them both Valaika and Cozart and they keep Francoeur? ;)

Seriously, why would the Reds want him? So he can have a contest with Taveras to see who can go the longest without a walk?

wolfboy
07-03-2009, 07:52 PM
See if they take Rob Bell, Jung Bong, and Bubba Nelson.

:clap: Well done.

redsfandan
07-07-2009, 08:05 AM
Take it for what it's worth (from mlbtraderumors.com):

Braves Not Likely To Move Escobar By Drew Silva [July 6 at 5:15pm CST]

We've picked up on a few rumblings recently concerning the Braves' Yunel Escobar. From the Red Sox having interest to the Royals "coveting" the shortstop, the rumors have been flying. Well, MLB.com's Mark Bowman would like to set the record straight:

"Look I understand the entertainment value of the rumor market that will swirl over the next few weeks leading up to the trade deadline," Bowman wrote Monday evening. "But at the same time, I think it's time to take Yunel Escobar's name out of the mix.

Teams have certainly called to express interest in Escobar and with his stubborn personality the talented shortstop has given the Braves at least reason to ponder the possibility of moving him.

But from what I've gathered, the Braves have zero desire to move Escobar."

The 26-year-old shortstop is batting .405 with runners in scoring position this season and leads the Braves with 42 RBI. Oh, and he's costing the club just $425K this year.

PuffyPig
07-07-2009, 08:36 AM
The guy is a clown. Very immature which reveals itself in many different ways. But as good as he is you have to take a chance on him.

I beleive that everyone said the same thing about Brandon Phillips.

edabbs44
07-07-2009, 08:43 AM
I beleive that everyone said the same thing about Brandon Phillips.

Or Delmon Young.

OldXOhio
07-07-2009, 09:52 AM
This was brought up in another thread (before this news, but rather when his name simply was talked about). I have heard several times he's in the Braves' doghouse for 'attitude' issues. I don't know for sure if this is the case, but while I'm a guy that does care about character, I have not heard enough bad things about him to do anything but take it with a grain of salt.

Offensively he's a clear upgrade and defensively he gets the job done. He's cheap and has some years left. I can't think of too many reasons why not to do it.

Beat me to it Puffy

jojo
07-07-2009, 10:16 AM
When issues about work ethic "leak out" it's a serious thing because in baseball language, its a damning label. It's like calling a scientist intellectually incurious.

I'm surprised that people inside Atlanta's FO would use such language if they were trying to trade him.

Truthfully, given the struggles that Hicks is having, I'd be surprised if the Braves were trying to trade Escobar because they don't seem to have any answers to replace him anytime soon.

Homer Bailey
07-07-2009, 10:16 AM
MLBtraderumors says the Braves are NOT interested in dealing Escobar.

Brutus
07-07-2009, 10:20 AM
MLBtraderumors says the Braves are NOT interested in dealing Escobar.

I'm not saying it will happen, but Dave O'Brien at the AJC is usually pretty good on his Braves' beat. In this case, I am inclined to believe him when he says the Braves are open-minded about trading Escobar. Nothing against Mark Bowman, I just tend to deem O'Brien more credible on Braves' matters. I found him to be insightful having lived in Atlanta for a while.

redsfan4445
07-15-2009, 10:24 AM
well the Braves are taking calls on Escobar!! posted today on mlb traderumours:

Braves Rumors: Escobar, Soriano, Payroll
By Ben Nicholson-Smith [July 15 at 9:00am CST]
David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution has the latest on the Braves. Here are the details:

They're taking calls from teams interested in Yunel Escobar.
There's nothing to the suggestion that the Braves could send Escobar and prospects to Oakland for Matt Holliday and Orlando Cabrera, especially since Escobar's much cheaper than Holliday and hitting about as well.
The Cardinals are interested in Escobar, but they wouldn't trade Ryan Ludwick.
O'Brien hears that the Braves offered Rafael Soriano to the Cards for Joe Mather last winter but the Cards wouldn't make the move.
Braves GM Frank Wren repeated that he doesn't want to move prospects an
d can't afford to add much payroll.


what could the Reds offer to get him??

Benihana
07-15-2009, 10:31 AM
The Braves reportedly are fielding calls on Escobar, as reported today by their beat writer.

http://blogs.ajc.com/atlanta-braves-blog/2009/07/14/lincecum-duckwalks-and-an-nl-all-star-win/?cxntfid=blogs_atlanta_braves_blog

What would be your absolute best offer for Escobar? Keep in mind the Braves want offense that can help now/soon and can't afford to add much payroll, according to the article.

I would offer Alonso, Gomes, and any minor league pitcher other than Stewart or Wood.

Braves get offensive spark in LF for now and their 1B and run-producer of the future. Reds get the young, slick fielding SS that can also hit they so desperately need. While I would love to move one of the AAA CF's in this deal, the Braves would likely want something else with Jordan Schaefer, Jason Heyward, and Ryan Church in the organization.

TRF
07-15-2009, 10:34 AM
The Reds OF is thin right now, but I'd do that deal. Alonso's value to the Reds is likely what he can fetch. I wouldn't offer any pitching initially though.

REDREAD
07-15-2009, 10:36 AM
I don't think Gomes gets any interest. I also don't think they want Alonso.
I have not followed them this year, but if they are truly looking for a bat that would help them now, that narrows things down to Dickerson and Votto. IIRC, they are set at catcher.

Votto for Escobar and something else from Atl? That is an interesting proposition. I love Votto, but can the Reds patch 1b until Alonso is ready? I wouldn't do the trade straight up, but I'd consider it. It's going to hurt the team to get Escobar. He's going to be in high demand.. It's a lot easier to fill a hole at 1b than it is at SS.

bucksfan2
07-15-2009, 10:38 AM
The Braves reportedly are fielding calls on Escobar, as reported today by their beat writer.

http://blogs.ajc.com/atlanta-braves-blog/2009/07/14/lincecum-duckwalks-and-an-nl-all-star-win/?cxntfid=blogs_atlanta_braves_blog

What would be your absolute best offer for Escobar? Keep in mind the Braves want offense that can help now/soon and can't afford to add much payroll, according to the article.

I would offer Alonso, Gomes, and any minor league pitcher other than Stewart or Wood.

Braves get offensive spark in LF for now and their 1B and run-producer of the future. Reds get the young, slick fielding SS that can also hit they so desperately need. While I would love to move one of the AAA CF's in this deal, the Braves would likely want something else with Jordan Schaefer, Jason Heyward, and Ryan Church in the organization.

Gomes is a platoon player on the Reds, I don't see him getting any more PT in Atl. I would trade Yonder but I don't think the Braves would trade for him because he doesn't help now. The Reds really don't have much to offer that the Braves would want.

Johnny Footstool
07-15-2009, 10:39 AM
Escobar would be an excellent trade target, but the Braves won't move him for spare parts. It might have to be something like Escobar and a prospect (Schaefer?) for Harang.

Benihana
07-15-2009, 10:41 AM
I don't think Gomes gets any interest. I also don't think they want Alonso.
I have not followed them this year, but if they are truly looking for a bat that would help them now, that narrows things down to Dickerson and Votto. IIRC, they are set at catcher.

Votto for Escobar and something else from Atl? That is an interesting proposition. I love Votto, but can the Reds patch 1b until Alonso is ready? I wouldn't do the trade straight up, but I'd consider it. It's going to hurt the team to get Escobar. He's going to be in high demand.. It's a lot easier to fill a hole at 1b than it is at SS.

I wouldn't trade Votto for Escobar. IMO, Votto is the face of this team for years to come. While I really want Escobar, he is on the block now because of his character problems. For a team that wants to reshape its clubhouse, I don't think that would be a step in the right direction.

I would, however, be happy to give them Dickerson and another piece. What makes you think they wouldn't want Alonso?


Escobar would be an excellent trade target, but the Braves won't move him for spare parts. It might have to be something like Escobar and a prospect (Schaefer?) for Harang.

That will not be the trade. Braves can't take on payroll and are looking for hitting- not pitching. Before his injury, they were reportedly looking to deal Vazquez, so I can't imagine they'd have any interest in Harang.

Falls City Beer
07-15-2009, 11:13 AM
I would offer Alonso, Gomes, and any minor league pitcher other than Stewart or Wood.

Manny Ramirez for Felipe Lopez?

:rolleyes:

Jpup
07-15-2009, 11:20 AM
I don't think Gomes gets any interest. I also don't think they want Alonso.
I have not followed them this year, but if they are truly looking for a bat that would help them now, that narrows things down to Dickerson and Votto. IIRC, they are set at catcher.

Votto for Escobar and something else from Atl? That is an interesting proposition. I love Votto, but can the Reds patch 1b until Alonso is ready? I wouldn't do the trade straight up, but I'd consider it. It's going to hurt the team to get Escobar. He's going to be in high demand.. It's a lot easier to fill a hole at 1b than it is at SS.

The Reds aren't going to trade Votto for anything IMO. They would not sell another ticket this year if they did. He's the face of the franchise. I would guess that he is about as untouchable as anyone in the game right now.

jojo
07-15-2009, 11:23 AM
Braves get offensive spark in LF for now

Matt Diaz is a better player than Gomes.

Benihana
07-15-2009, 11:44 AM
Manny Ramirez for Felipe Lopez?

:rolleyes:

Actually, no.

It's giving up a Top 15 Prospect in all of baseball at a position where they are currently trotting out Casey Kotchman.

It's also giving up a LF with a .958 OPS and at least one other season of OPSing > .900 in the major leagues. He is two years younger and has a current OPS over 100 points higher than Atlanta's incumbent at the position.

It's potentially giving up a 19 year old RHP that has already starred in both the Futures Game and the WBC.

Yep, sounds about the same to me.

Falls City Beer
07-15-2009, 11:49 AM
Actually, no.

It's giving up a Top 15 Prospect in all of baseball at a position where they are currently trotting out Casey Kotchman.

It's also giving up a LF with a .958 OPS and at least one other season of OPSing > .900 in the major leagues. He is two years younger and has a current OPS over 100 points higher than Atlanta's incumbent at the position.

It's potentially giving up a 19 year old RHP that has already starred in both the Futures Game and the WBC.

Yep, sounds about the same to me.


Escobar = FeLo.

No more uncoachables.

Jpup
07-15-2009, 11:50 AM
Escobar = FeLo.

No more uncoachables.

Maybe it was the coach. Same thing was said about Homer, but he then grew up. FeLo has played very well for St. Louis and Arizona. I would love to have him on this Reds team. He's about what the Reds need or a piece of what they need.

edabbs44
07-15-2009, 11:51 AM
I would offer Alonso, Gomes, and any minor league pitcher other than Stewart or Wood.

Braves get offensive spark in LF for now and their 1B and run-producer of the future. Reds get the young, slick fielding SS that can also hit they so desperately need. While I would love to move one of the AAA CF's in this deal, the Braves would likely want something else with Jordan Schaefer, Jason Heyward, and Ryan Church in the organization.

Too much. Alonso shouldn't be going anywhere for a guy like Escobar.

TRF
07-15-2009, 12:12 PM
Too much. Alonso shouldn't be going anywhere for a guy like Escobar.

The Reds are going nowhere with Janish/Hairston/AGon at SS.

edabbs44
07-15-2009, 12:15 PM
The Reds are going nowhere with Janish/Hairston/AGon at SS.

I agree wholeheartedly. But it doesn't mean you should deal a top prospect for a problem child. I would take a shot on Escobar, but not for Alonso+.

TRF
07-15-2009, 12:17 PM
Well, honestly I prefer Brandon Wood to Escobar. Lesser defense but at least average, and a MUCH better bat.

Benihana
07-15-2009, 12:19 PM
Alonso has no place to play in Cincinnati.

If the right opportunity surfaces to trade him for an equally young, exciting player at a position of need, the Reds need to pounce. IMO this is that opportunity. 0-2 SS with Escobar's skills don't become available everyday. We've been discussing that problem for months on this board. It's put up or shut up time.

Mario-Rijo
07-15-2009, 12:21 PM
Well, honestly I prefer Brandon Wood to Escobar. Lesser defense but at least average, and a MUCH better bat.

I disagree with that, Escobar is and likely will always be the better hitter. Brandon Wood cannot stick/hit at the major league level for a reason and that reason is a long swing that apparently he hasn't found a way to shorten. Until he does and we see the effects I gotta go with Escobar who is a fine hitter.

Benihana
07-15-2009, 12:21 PM
Well, honestly I prefer Brandon Wood to Escobar. Lesser defense but at least average, and a MUCH better bat.

I'd be fine with that too, mainly because he would cost significantly less in terms of talent.

Problem is, I'm not sure if he can stick at SS (not saying he can't, I just don't know) and I'm also not sure Walt even knows who he is. I could see the Angels taking Arroyo and some money for Wood. They've never been shy to take on a contract, and they are reportedly looking for pitching. I hope Arroyo can string together a couple more nice outings before the deadline...

Chip R
07-15-2009, 12:26 PM
Nobody is going to trade for Alonso while he's on the DL.

edabbs44
07-15-2009, 12:28 PM
I'd be fine with that too, mainly because he would cost significantly less in terms of talent.

Problem is, I'm not sure if he can stick at SS (not saying he can't, I just don't know) and I'm also not sure Walt even knows who he is. I could see the Angels taking Arroyo and some money for Wood. They've never been shy to take on a contract, and they are reportedly looking for pitching. I hope Arroyo can string together a couple more nice outings before the deadline...

We better send some Angels some hallucenogens before making that offer.

Benihana
07-15-2009, 12:28 PM
Nobody is going to trade for Alonso while he's on the DL.

He can be a PTBNL. If for some reason he suffers a serious setback with his injury, there can be a contingency plan (Frazier+, etc.) Remember the Micah Owings trade?

Benihana
07-15-2009, 12:30 PM
We better send some Angels some hallucenogens before making that offer.

You never know, especially if he throws together a few nice starts before the deadline. Teams like the Angels can get desperate for pitching (see the Mets in 2004). After all, you are talking about the same team that gave Gary Matthews Jr. that contract.

redsfan4445
07-15-2009, 02:22 PM
He can be a PTBNL. If for some reason he suffers a serious setback with his injury, there can be a contingency plan (Frazier+, etc.) Remember the Micah Owings trade?

Hey Benihana! Do you have any inside info on the chances the Reds are going after Escobar? they also just posted on mlbtraderumours the reds are still looking for outfielders.. hmmm any news? thanks in advance:beerme:

15fan
07-15-2009, 02:35 PM
Yunel Escobar:Shortstop::Brett Tomko:Pitcher

15fan
07-15-2009, 02:35 PM
Delete

Benihana
07-15-2009, 02:36 PM
Hey Benihana! Do you have any inside info on the chances the Reds are going after Escobar? they also just posted on mlbtraderumours the reds are still looking for outfielders.. hmmm any news? thanks in advance:beerme:

Unfortunately it's not likely, given what the Reds have and what the Braves want. You never know though...

Highlifeman21
07-15-2009, 09:17 PM
The Reds are going nowhere with Janish/Hairston/AGon at SS.

And within 2 years, we can't have both Votto and Alonso play 1B, and why on Earth would we put one of them in LF?

REDREAD
07-16-2009, 01:02 AM
I would, however, be happy to give them Dickerson and another piece. What makes you think they wouldn't want Alonso?

I am assume the Braves only trade Escobar if they get something in return that helps them now. IMO, if the Reds truely have faith in Alonso, they will deal Votto and be patient for Alonso. As fans, we hate to see Votto go and want to push the prospect away in a trade.

Getting Escobar is going to cost us a steep price. Votto is a great player, but I think it's easier to find a 1b than a SS.

Homer Bailey
07-16-2009, 01:03 AM
I am assume the Braves only trade Escobar if they get something in return that helps them now. IMO, if the Reds truely have faith in Alonso, they will deal Votto and be patient for Alonso. As fans, we hate to see Votto go and want to push the prospect away in a trade.

Getting Escobar is going to cost us a steep price. Votto is a great player, but I think it's easier to find a 1b than a SS.

Votto is not getting traded. Period.

cincrazy
07-16-2009, 01:04 AM
You never know, especially if he throws together a few nice starts before the deadline. Teams like the Angels can get desperate for pitching (see the Mets in 2004). After all, you are talking about the same team that gave Gary Matthews Jr. that contract.

Well, the Mets were an ignorant franchise in 2004. The Angels are a smart organization, and I don't think they're prone to panic. I don't think Arroyo translates to the AL right now, not one bit. Maybe the Angels would take him, but we surely wouldn't get Brandon Wood in return.

REDREAD
07-16-2009, 01:07 AM
Votto is not getting traded. Period.

Ok, then Escobar is not going to be traded to the Reds, period. :)
I am saying that in a joking matter. But take the Braves' side. If you are a contender looking to add offense but not a lot of salary, Votto is the only attractive player on the Reds' team.

If the Braves are trying to win now, why would they trade their starting SS for prospects? Does not make sense at all (although I could insert a joke about an ex Reds GM here :lol: )

Mario-Rijo
07-16-2009, 01:44 AM
Ok, then Escobar is not going to be traded to the Reds, period. :)
I am saying that in a joking matter. But take the Braves' side. If you are a contender looking to add offense but not a lot of salary, Votto is the only attractive player on the Reds' team.

If the Braves are trying to win now, why would they trade their starting SS for prospects? Does not make sense at all (although I could insert a joke about an ex Reds GM here :lol: )

How about a 3 way trade?

Matt Holliday & Orlando Cabrera to Atlanta
Yunel Escobar & Scott Hairston to Cincy
Edwin Encarnacion, Jo-Jo Reyes, Chris Valaika & Matt Maloney to Oakland

Or something along those lines. Then the Reds flip prospects to the Padres for Kouzmanoff, let's clear this thing out and play some real ball.

Dickerson CF
Escobar SS
Votto 1B
BP 2B
S. Hairston RF
Nix/Gomes LF
Kouzmanoff 3B
Hernandez/Hanigan C

When/If Bruce comes back S. Hairston platoons in LF with Nix.

Stephenk29
07-16-2009, 03:55 AM
How about a 3 way trade?

Matt Holliday & Orlando Cabrera to Atlanta
Yunel Escobar & Scott Hairston to Cincy
Edwin Encarnacion, Jo-Jo Reyes, Chris Valaika & Matt Maloney to Oakland

Or something along those lines. Then the Reds flip prospects to the Padres for Kouzmanoff, let's clear this thing out and play some real ball.

Dickerson CF
Escobar SS
Votto 1B
BP 2B
S. Hairston RF
Nix/Gomes LF
Kouzmanoff 3B
Hernandez/Hanigan C

When/If Bruce comes back S. Hairston platoons in LF with Nix.

That trade actually makes some sense. But, that's a perfect world, doubt it happens. I don't see big Hairston platooning though. Nix would be banished to the pinch hitting role.

edabbs44
07-16-2009, 07:52 AM
How about a 3 way trade?

Matt Holliday & Orlando Cabrera to Atlanta
Yunel Escobar & Scott Hairston to Cincy
Edwin Encarnacion, Jo-Jo Reyes, Chris Valaika & Matt Maloney to Oakland

Or something along those lines. Then the Reds flip prospects to the Padres for Kouzmanoff, let's clear this thing out and play some real ball.

Dickerson CF
Escobar SS
Votto 1B
BP 2B
S. Hairston RF
Nix/Gomes LF
Kouzmanoff 3B
Hernandez/Hanigan C

When/If Bruce comes back S. Hairston platoons in LF with Nix.

Oakland would need a lot more than that.

REDREAD
07-16-2009, 04:47 PM
How about a 3 way trade?

Matt Holliday & Orlando Cabrera to Atlanta
Yunel Escobar & Scott Hairston to Cincy
Edwin Encarnacion, Jo-Jo Reyes, Chris Valaika & Matt Maloney to Oakland

Or something along those lines. Then the Reds flip prospects to the Padres for Kouzmanoff, let's clear this thing out and play some real ball.

.

That would be awesome, to just give up EdE, Valiaka and Maloney for Escobar and Hairston. Heck, I'd give up those three players for just Escobar, because I think Maloney is pretty much useless. EdE is ok, but I think he's as good as he's going to get.. Don't know as much about Valiaka, but given how often he is in trade proposals, I kind of doubt he is that well thought of. In all honesty though, I'd suspect we'd have to give up a lot more.