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Benihana
07-09-2009, 06:08 PM
Courtesy of the SunDeck:

http://blogs.denverpost.com/rockies/2009/07/09/reds-express-interest-in-atkins/



Reds express interest in Atkins
by Troy Renck on July 9, 2009


DENVER — The Reds have talked to the Rockies about acquiring Garrett Atkins while the Red Sox’s interest is waning, multiple sources said today. The Reds have liked Atkins since last winter when they considered a swap for Atkins and Yorvit Torrealba.

The complication comes over money. Atkins is owed roughly $3.4 million for the remainder of this season. For the Rockies to receive a reliever back in the deal like Nick Masset, they would have to eat some of his contract since Masset is making only $418,000. A closer salary match could be found with David Weathers — he has roughly $1.6 million left — but it’s unclear if he’s available.

As reported in The Post earlier this week, the Red Sox have talked with the Rockies about Atkins. They need to be prepared to get a bat if Mike Lowell (hip injury) is out longterm. They have bullpen depth that makes Takashi Saito expendable. But in talking to people familar with their thinking, their interest level in Atkins seems minimal. It’s hard to see the Rockies sending Atkins to Boston in a deal unless it involves Manny Delcarmen. These teams have so much bad blood in botched trades, Boston remains a longshot.

It’s worth keeping an eye on Seattle and St. Louis regarding Atkins. Miguel Batista would be a salary match with the Mariners. St. Louis is prepared to make a push for Roy Halladay so their focus is elsewhere based on published reports.

Also, I continue to hear buzz that the Giants are prepared to make a strong play for the Pirates’ Freddy Sanchez. The teams have previously discussed Jonathan Sanchez for Freddy Sanchez. There has been chatter about the Rockies going after Freddy Sanchez in a deal involving Eric Young Jr. That makes no sense. If the Rockies go after a Pirate, it would likely be a reliever like Matt Capps.


I would do Weathers for Atkins in a second. Atkins struggled miserably to start the season but OPSed .903 in June, plus he's a FA at the end of the year. If he finishes strong he could be a Type B at least, and would have a better chance than Weathers of rejecting an arb offer. Move EE to LF for the rest of the season, and platoon Gomes with Bruce at least until Bruce finds his stroke.

I'd probably prefer this to the Rolen deal, although I know I'm in the minority on that one.

flyer85
07-09-2009, 06:13 PM
I don't get the fascination with guys that can't hit with the Rockies.

jojo
07-09-2009, 06:13 PM
Atkins is a more expensive version of EE. I don't really see the benefit unless EE is broke for the year.

Benihana
07-09-2009, 06:16 PM
At this point, I'd prefer seeing Atkins over Bruce in the lineup vs. lefties, and Atkins over Gomes vs. righties. In a swap for Weathers, the money is a wash.

RichRed
07-09-2009, 06:18 PM
I don't get the fascination with guys that can't hit with the Rockies.

Yep, .738 career OPS away from Coors and declining numbers since '06. The Reds need a bat but it would be nice if it could be a *good* bat.

OnBaseMachine
07-09-2009, 06:23 PM
No thanks.

Benihana
07-09-2009, 06:27 PM
Yep, .738 career OPS away from Coors and declining numbers since '06. The Reds need a bat but it would be nice if it could be a *good* bat.

I'll never understand this logic.

GAB plays very similar to Coors Field. If Atkins put up a career OPS of .817 with Coors as his home field, he would probably do very similarly with GAB as his home field. That would be an upgrade, especially with the lefty/righty splits that I mentioned.

If you're scared of declining numbers since '06, how in the world are you salivating over Scott Rolen??

Kc61
07-09-2009, 06:31 PM
No thanks.

I agree, no thanks.

I guess expecting the Reds to shell out the cash for a terrific player like Rolen was too much to ask.

Atkins for Massett? No way.

Brutus
07-09-2009, 06:31 PM
Yep, .738 career OPS away from Coors and declining numbers since '06. The Reds need a bat but it would be nice if it could be a *good* bat.

I would rather pass on Atkins as well, but his 3-year average (2006-2008) OPS on the road is .797.

RichRed
07-09-2009, 06:33 PM
If you're scared of declining numbers since '06, how in the world are you salivating over Scott Rolen??

You'll have to show me where I did that.

Brutus
07-09-2009, 06:35 PM
I agree.

I guess expecting the Reds to shell out the cash for a terrific player like Rolen was too much to ask.

Atkins for Massett? No way.

Since when are the two players mutually exclusive?

I imagine the Reds have shown interest in many players. It does not mean they favor one over the other. Because there's a report the Reds have been interested in Atkins that suddenly it means there is no potential for a Scott Rolen trade (or Matt Holliday or any other player we could think about)?

The reason fans get so bent out of shape over what the Reds do or don't do is because they allow themselves to take these newspaper reports and rumors too seriously, so when they don't materialize, they demonize the Reds front office for it not getting done without considering that perhaps they were never going that direction, could not agree on suitable players or salaries or simply had something else hold a deal up.

I'm not saying the organization should get a free pass. Sometimes though, they're criticized because the media says something might happen and it raises the bar higher than perhaps was possible in the first place.

Benihana
07-09-2009, 06:39 PM
You'll have to show me where I did that.

Not saying you specifically, but several others are.

Kc61
07-09-2009, 06:42 PM
Since when are the two players mutually exclusive?

The reason fans get so bent out of shape over what the Reds do or don't do is because they allow themselves to take these newspaper reports and rumors too seriously, so when they don't materialize, they demonize the Reds front office for it not getting done without considering that perhaps they were never going that direction, could not agree on suitable players or salaries or simply had something else hold a deal up.

I'm not saying the organization should get a free pass. Sometimes though, they're criticized because the media says something might happen and it raises the bar higher than perhaps was possible in the first place.

Just my assumption that this organization won't spring for two guys. So I view them as mutually exclusive. And if the Rolen rumor was false, so be it, but I don't see Atkins as a substitute.

As for raising the bar and what is "possible" I think I've been clear that the bar should be high, the Reds never replaced Adam Dunn, and that they should be in the market for a very high caliber guy or two. And if that's not possible, I think they should issue a statement to their fans suggesting that the fans make other use of their time.

TRF
07-09-2009, 06:44 PM
Not saying you specifically, but several others are.

Actually, that's what you did when you quoted him.

And I wouldn't trade for either of them. I wouldn't trade Masset for both.

Benihana
07-09-2009, 06:44 PM
Just my assumption that this organization won't spring for two guys. So I view them as mutually exclusive. And if the Rolen rumor was false, so be it, but I don't see Atkins as a substitute.

As for raising the bar and what is "possible" I think I've been clear that the bar should be high, the Reds never replaced Adam Dunn, and that they should be in the market for a very high caliber guy or two. And if that's not possible, I think they should issue a statement to their fans suggesting that the fans make other use of their time.

C'mon Kc you've been around this board for too long to get caught up in a rumor like that.

When's the last time one of these Redszone-rumored blockbuster trades actually happened?

Benihana
07-09-2009, 06:45 PM
Actually, that's what you did when you quoted him.

And I wouldn't trade for either of them. I wouldn't trade Masset for both.

I was saying "you" in the general sense, not RichRed specifically. But thanks for chiming in.

Kc61
07-09-2009, 06:46 PM
C'mon Kc you've been around this board for too long to get caught up in a rumor like that.

When's the last time one of these Redszone-rumored blockbuster trades actually happened?

Never, because the Reds don't make any blockbuster trades. You're right.

Brutus
07-09-2009, 06:51 PM
Just my assumption that this organization won't spring for two guys. So I view them as mutually exclusive. And if the Rolen rumor was false, so be it, but I don't see Atkins as a substitute.

As for raising the bar and what is "possible" I think I've been clear that the bar should be high, the Reds never replaced Adam Dunn, and that they should be in the market for a very high caliber guy or two. And if that's not possible, I think they should issue a statement to their fans suggesting that the fans make other use of their time.

They didn't replace Dunn but yet the offense, statistically, is pretty close to last season. The team BA and team OBP is virtually the same. Slugging has taken a small hit, but it's actually not been drastic. Before the season, people were beside themselves over not 'replacing' Dunn but we sit here and find that other than HR%, the team is almost in an identical state to last year's offense (with better pitching). Point is, even despite having the team's starting 1B and 3B combine on missing over 80 games, the team is in striking distance of first and still in the running to acquire a bat.

To this point, Jocketty has said several times he would call the Reds buyers. We already know from Cleveland that the Reds were hot after Mark DeRosa. Several reports have indicated the Reds have asked around about other hitters. There's still 22 days before the deadline. Give things a chance to evolve before we start demanding apologies.

TRF
07-09-2009, 07:00 PM
I was saying "you" in the general sense, not RichRed specifically. But thanks for chiming in.

Any time. always glad to help.

savafan
07-09-2009, 07:14 PM
I honestly believe we haven't even heard the names of the players who will end up getting traded yet.

RedEye
07-09-2009, 07:20 PM
I think the Reds + Atkins would be quite similar to the Reds + EdE. Not sure what this sort of deal gains the team.

SirFelixCat
07-09-2009, 07:38 PM
Massett, while not untouchable by any means, is NOT the guy the Reds should be looking to unload. He should be one of the future anchors of the BP, imo. Ugh.

OnBaseMachine
07-09-2009, 08:08 PM
On the Garrett Atkins report
Posted by JohnFay at 7/9/2009 6:37 PM EDT on Cincinnati.com

Just spoke to someone from the Reds about the Garrett Atkins report from the Denver Post.

Sounds like the Rockies called to see if the Reds were interested. They aren't for two reasons: a) Atkins is owed $3.4 million for the rest of the year; b) he plays first or third.

The Reds might added salary for the right guy, like they were with Mark DeRosa. But Atkins is hitting .226 with six homers and 25 RBI and isn't as versatile at DeRosa. Atkins is also a free agent after the season.

The Reds have enough depth in the bullpen to move a reliever. But the chances of trading Nick Masset are about zero.

http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/section?category=blog07&plckController=Blog&plckScript=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest&plckBlogPage=BlogViewPost&plckPostId=Blog%3ae57bcc87-152a-4f72-96fb-cc08b1f396efPost%3a69ba47f0-e410-40ea-a5be-eb2775e14dcd&sid=sitelife.cincinnati.com

M2
07-09-2009, 08:17 PM
The Reds? Atkins? So no carbs? That won't help in landing advertising from Skyline and Goldstar.

Reds1
07-09-2009, 08:18 PM
Courtesy of the SunDeck:

http://blogs.denverpost.com/rockies/2009/07/09/reds-express-interest-in-atkins/



I would do Weathers for Atkins in a second. Atkins struggled miserably to start the season but OPSed .903 in June, plus he's a FA at the end of the year. If he finishes strong he could be a Type B at least, and would have a better chance than Weathers of rejecting an arb offer. Move EE to LF for the rest of the season, and platoon Gomes with Bruce at least until Bruce finds his stroke.

I'd probably prefer this to the Rolen deal, although I know I'm in the minority on that one.

You mean EE to the bench ;)

*BaseClogger*
07-10-2009, 01:59 AM
I'll never understand this logic.

GAB plays very similar to Coors Field. If Atkins put up a career OPS of .817 with Coors as his home field, he would probably do very similarly with GAB as his home field. That would be an upgrade, especially with the lefty/righty splits that I mentioned.

If you're scared of declining numbers since '06, how in the world are you salivating over Scott Rolen??

The logic is that a player's true skill level can be muddied by his home environment. It's considered overpayment for a guy like Atkins who is expected to be a good hitter when you could get a guy with numbers perhaps worse than Atkins but produced in a much tougher hitter's environment...

Reds/Flyers Fan
07-10-2009, 02:17 AM
I don't get the fascination with guys that can't hit with the Rockies.

I don't get the hatred for all things Rockies. They must be doing something right that we can only dream of.

dfs
07-10-2009, 10:59 AM
Masset for Atkins? .....ha ha ha....no really. That is not happening.

traderumor
07-10-2009, 11:54 AM
We need an impact bat and have already flushed enough money down the toilet on a lineup full of what should be 6-8 place hitters, so why would we give up something of value (Weathers) for more of what we already have? This is a terrible idea.

traderumor
07-10-2009, 11:55 AM
I don't get the hatred for all things Rockies. They must be doing something right that we can only dream of.

I thinks its a hatred for bad Rockies hitters.

corkedbat
07-10-2009, 01:31 PM
* Atkins = Middle-of-the-order WillyT
* Absolutely no way should this be the type of player they should acquire - especially for young guy like Massett
* Had Walt done this deal, I would have given up on him entirely (I'm still close).

flyer85
07-10-2009, 02:38 PM
I don't get the hatred for all things Rockies. They must be doing something right that we can only dream of.
I'd love some of their pitchers (Jimenez, Morales, Cook, Corpas, Francis).

BTW, ex-Rockie hitters have a history of not producing anywhere near the same numbers once they no longer get to play half their games at Coors field. Willy T is just a wonderful daily reminder of the phenomenon.

Benihana
07-10-2009, 02:43 PM
BTW, ex-Rockie hitters have a history of not producing anywhere near the same numbers once they no longer get to play half their games at Coors field. Willy T is just a wonderful daily reminder of the phenomenon.

Hard as it may be to believe, Willy's production hasn't dropped off at all since he left Coors. In fact, he's slugging an identical .296 to his 2008 performance.

flyer85
07-10-2009, 02:46 PM
Hard as it may be to believe, Willy's production hasn't dropped off at all since he left Coors. In fact he's slugging an identical .296 to his 2008 performance.When he was acquired there was a lot of talk that 2008 was just a down year and he(with the help of Quirk) could get back to 2007 numbers ... which obviously is not going to happen and was not ever likely to happen anywhere but Coors.

jojo
07-10-2009, 03:25 PM
When he was acquired there was a lot of talk that 2008 was just a down year and he(with the help of Quirk) could get back to 2007 numbers ... which obviously is not going to happen and was not ever likely to happen anywhere but Coors.

There are many hitters who did not experience a drop off after leaving Denver or whose "drop off" occurred in their mid thirties.