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nc redsfan
07-12-2009, 09:22 PM
I have been a reds fan for at least 39 years, so yes I've seen the good and the bad. What I'm sooo tired of is listening to people on this board complain about everything this team does. If this team makes a trade, the player isn't good enough, if they don't make a trade then walt's sitting on his wallet and doesn't have a clue. It's apparent to me that this team would have to go undefeated the rest of the season to please some of you. I hear people continually say how they aren't going to put a dime into this team but let them go on a 7 to 10 game win streak and they are the biggest reds fans that ever lived. I for one root for this team win or lose, it doesn't mean i don't get unhappy when they lose, but i don't give up on them when they do lose, and then pick them up again when they start winning. You people need to decide if you're true reds fans or not. As for Walt and Dusty, I do believe they are doing the best job they can. This team has desire, they now need the true reds fans to back them up.

sivman17
07-12-2009, 09:33 PM
amen

Captain Hook
07-12-2009, 10:02 PM
I have been a reds fan for at least 39 years, so yes I've seen the good and the bad. What I'm sooo tired of is listening to people on this board complain about everything this team does. If this team makes a trade, the player isn't good enough, if they don't make a trade then walt's sitting on his wallet and doesn't have a clue. It's apparent to me that this team would have to go undefeated the rest of the season to please some of you. I hear people continually say how they aren't going to put a dime into this team but let them go on a 7 to 10 game win streak and they are the biggest reds fans that ever lived. I for one root for this team win or lose, it doesn't mean i don't get unhappy when they lose, but i don't give up on them when they do lose, and then pick them up again when they start winning. You people need to decide if you're true reds fans or not. As for Walt and Dusty, I do believe they are doing the best job they can. This team has desire, they now need the true reds fans to back them up.

There is a big difference between a bandwagon fan and a disgruntled fan.Let me ask you this.Would a bandwagon fan still spend time posting on this web site or watching every game after the past week of garbage that we've witnessed from the Reds?I think not.

I'll tell you what I'm sick and tired of.I'm sick and tired of people being sick and tired of the complaining that goes on about this team.What are we supposed to say about them?That there doing a good job.Maybe that they sure are trying hard.Possibly that they really look like big league ball players in those fancy uniforms.I suppose that some loyal Reds fans have just accepted this type of play from their team and while they have accepted it they draw the line at letting others talk about what actually is going on out there.

jmac
07-12-2009, 10:04 PM
Here is my take. Checking out the ORG gamethreads lately, I have seen several posts saying the "the season is over" and people saying they are "done" etc.
I have been a baseball fan for a long time. Well since the late 70's. I have seen excellent Reds teams and terrible teams and some decent teams who didnt win (divisions ) but were fun to watch.
Every year I see people or fans say what they want the reds to do "to make the playoffs". Sure that is the ultimate goal of every ball player as well as manager and fan.
However...I just dont get some fans who if their team doesnt appear to be playoff caliber, they are ready for football season.
This team isnt very entertaining, I grant you that. Will they make changes or not, I dont know. Last night I thought how nice it would be after Votto & BP singled off Santana to have Rolen stepping in to hit.Still I do know that I love baseball. If it is evening and I am working outside, my radio is on and tuned to a reds game. Yeah, many times I get soooo disgusted I think I will not even bother to listen the next night. Guess what ? I do !
I am just saying it seems to me like it would lose alot of it's luster, if people say "it is over" and just at all-star break. Will the reds make the playoffs ? Probably not, but It's baseball !
Last season, I knew my basketball team wasnt going to win it because North Carolina looked like they could beat NBA teams some nights. I still watched though. I didnt declare the season over.
So this may not exactly be addressing bandwagon fans as much as fans who act like it is playoffs or bust. Maybe there needs to be a thread about What Will Make This Season A Success for You ?

Competitive ? 500 record ? Playoffs ? World Series ?

Captain Hook
07-12-2009, 10:21 PM
What Will Make This Season A Success for You ?

Competitive ? 500 record ? Playoffs ? World Series ?

At this point I don't believe this team will make the playoffs.If they could just make a nice run at it I would be happy.That however looks doubtful.I can live with being average or just below it if it means that we have a new manager leading this young and talented team next season.

Fon Duc Tow
07-12-2009, 10:22 PM
I have been a reds fan for at least 39 years, so yes I've seen the good and the bad. What I'm sooo tired of is listening to people on this board complain about everything this team does. If this team makes a trade, the player isn't good enough, if they don't make a trade then walt's sitting on his wallet and doesn't have a clue. It's apparent to me that this team would have to go undefeated the rest of the season to please some of you. I hear people continually say how they aren't going to put a dime into this team but let them go on a 7 to 10 game win streak and they are the biggest reds fans that ever lived. I for one root for this team win or lose, it doesn't mean i don't get unhappy when they lose, but i don't give up on them when they do lose, and then pick them up again when they start winning. You people need to decide if you're true reds fans or not. As for Walt and Dusty, I do believe they are doing the best job they can. This team has desire, they now need the true reds fans to back them up.


Doesn't a team have to be at least remotely successful to warrant a bandwagon?

Did the Montreal Expos have a bandwagon?

Do the Kansas City Royals have a bandwagon?

"Bandwagon..." yeah right man. Try having a winning record first. Or a playoff game. Or some semblance of success. Something. Anything.

Until then, saying that a team like the Reds has anything close to a bandwagon is...ummm... have a nice day, I'll put it that way.

LouisvilleCARDS
07-12-2009, 10:29 PM
Doesn't a team have to be at least remotely successful to warrant a bandwagon?

Did the Montreal Expos have a bandwagon?

Do the Kansas City Royals have a bandwagon?

"Bandwagon..." yeah right man. Try having a winning record first. Or a playoff game. Or some semblance of success. Something. Anything.

Until then, saying that a team like the Reds has anything close to a bandwagon is...ummm... have a nice day, I'll put it that way.

:thumbup:

Good point, LOL.

It's more like being run over with the bandwagon following this team.

Krawhitham
07-12-2009, 11:00 PM
don't confuse *****ing with being a bandwagon fan, if they did not care they would not complain

mrherd05
07-12-2009, 11:19 PM
I have been a reds fan for at least 39 years, so yes I've seen the good and the bad. What I'm sooo tired of is listening to people on this board complain about everything this team does. If this team makes a trade, the player isn't good enough, if they don't make a trade then walt's sitting on his wallet and doesn't have a clue. It's apparent to me that this team would have to go undefeated the rest of the season to please some of you. I hear people continually say how they aren't going to put a dime into this team but let them go on a 7 to 10 game win streak and they are the biggest reds fans that ever lived. I for one root for this team win or lose, it doesn't mean i don't get unhappy when they lose, but i don't give up on them when they do lose, and then pick them up again when they start winning. You people need to decide if you're true reds fans or not. As for Walt and Dusty, I do believe they are doing the best job they can. This team has desire, they now need the true reds fans to back them up.


WOOO HOOO...I agree...

And to the "fan" who followed this up with a post trying to say there is a difference between a Bandwagon fan and a disgruntled fan...nice try...aint buyin it.

A fan is a fan through thick and thin...Period...end of story.

Betterread
07-12-2009, 11:26 PM
If large amounts of "bandwagon fans" brought bad fortune to an organization, then the Yankees and Redsox would be cursed forever. Unless you have spent time in the NE you have no idea how many Yankee and RedSox fans are bellwether fans - or at least they only like teams that win. The "quality" of the Reds' fans is irrelevant to the team. They require your money, not your informed support.

mrherd05
07-12-2009, 11:28 PM
ok....thanks for that nugget...I had absolutely no idea that the Yankees and Redsox had a large number of bandwagon fans.

nc redsfan
07-12-2009, 11:50 PM
to louisvilleCards,
How many world Series have the Chicago Cubs gone to? Zero to my knowledge, but yet even during their bad years they've had fan support at wrigly field. The Green Bay Packers, Chicago Bears, even in their bad years you could not find a seat in their stadiums. Players say it all the time, they feed off a full house. It would be nice to see what this team would do playing in front of 40,000 or so screaming fans, instead of 15,000 because we're unhappy.

fugowitribe
07-13-2009, 12:05 AM
I see both sides of the argument here.

-Some people are tired of reading about how horrible this team is and seeing predictions phoning it all in and getting ready for football season.

-I also see the disgruntled people arguing over their fanhood.

The way I see it is that we are all the bigest Reds fans that we all know. Some like to moan and groan about the bad weather, but some like to talk about nothing outside of what it is goiong to be like when the weather gets better.

I would like to see more positive posts too don't get me wrong, but the only way for that to happen is to give these guys something good to talk about. Until the Reds win more than they lose, expect to see these guys and a few of their friends making suggetions and letting us know about what they think. This isn't a "bashing" site, but it is a place to talk to guys who are just as passionate about Cincinnati baseball as you are, so take it for what it is and pray for better weather.

Here is to a great second half that leads us to the promise land.....No matter who is in charge and who is taking the orders. Go Reds! We are a lot closer to a winner than we've been in a while. :beerme:

TheBigLebowski
07-13-2009, 12:18 AM
Cincinnati Reds hats are selling like sno-cones down here in humid Gainesville, FL. Bandwagon is filling up.

FlyerFanatic
07-13-2009, 12:23 AM
Cincinnati Reds hats are selling like sno-cones down here in humid Gainesville, FL. Bandwagon is filling up.

what kills me is seeing people walk around with green or blue reds hats. i mean i understand that baseball caps can be a stylish thing, but really..a cincinnati reds cap blue or green? come onnn

Captain Hook
07-13-2009, 12:34 AM
WOOO HOOO...I agree...

And to the "fan" who followed this up with a post trying to say there is a difference between a Bandwagon fan and a disgruntled fan...nice try...aint buyin it.

A fan is a fan through thick and thin...Period...end of story.

There's nothing to buy.I'm not a fan of a winning team here.Do you even know what a bandwagon fan is?Maybe I'm the one confused because I thought a bandwagon fan was the one who went out and bought his Ryan Howard jersey last year after they won the WS and proclaimed himself a Phillies fan for the rest of his life only to bail on his favorite team as soon as they have a loosing season.Isn't that jumping on the bandwagon then jumping off?Isn't that what makes a bandwagon fan?I'm sure that people could come up with a lot of things to call someone that supports a team through so many consecutive loosing seasons but I'd guess a bandwagon fan wouldn't be one of them.Even if they do complain a little.

Red in Atl
07-13-2009, 12:41 AM
amen

Amen to Amen...but I gotta say, I am tired of losing...

Captain Hook
07-13-2009, 12:55 AM
to louisvilleCards,
How many world Series have the Chicago Cubs gone to? Zero to my knowledge, but yet even during their bad years they've had fan support at wrigly field. The Green Bay Packers, Chicago Bears, even in their bad years you could not find a seat in their stadiums. Players say it all the time, they feed off a full house. It would be nice to see what this team would do playing in front of 40,000 or so screaming fans, instead of 15,000 because we're unhappy.

What would happen is that team spending would go up and we would see more wins.Its too bad that the process usually needs to happen the other way around.

MJA
07-13-2009, 09:05 AM
As someone who lives in North New Jersey, but couldn't bring himself to root for either the Mets or Yankees because of the amount of bandwagon fans–My dad liked the Reds so I decided to follow them–it's painful to watch the contrast between the Reds and a team like the Yankees.

The Yankees do whatever it takes to make the playoffs every year and when they don't, like last year, they go berserk and sign everyone they can to get back. I know the Reds don't have the spending power of the Yankees, but I don't get a sense of urgency from the Reds management that making the playoffs is a necessity for being a draw. Right now if you are a reds fan, what do you have to look forward to the rest of the year? So far it looks like the Reds are going to be adding any real pieces and as we have saw already, above average pitching paired with a below mediocre offense leads to a below .500 rating.

Right now it's kind of a dark time to be a Reds fan, they have the potential to be good, but whether management is going to bust its ass and make the trades and signings that are necessary to get fans back this team or just accept the same old song and dance every year remains to be seen. Fans, I believe, will show up if you can put a consistent playoff team on the field, no one wants to watch a team player sub .500 ball every year with no light and the end of the tunnel.

will5979
07-13-2009, 09:52 AM
Right now it's kind of a dark time to be a Reds fan, they have the potential to be good, but whether management is going to bust its ass and make the trades and signings that are necessary to get fans back this team will do the same old song and dance every year. Fans, I believe, will show up if you can put a consistent playoff team on the field, no one wants to watch a team player sub .500 ball every year with no light and the end of the tunnel.

Unfortunately that has been the tune of this team since, well the whole decade, 2000-2009. 2000 was the only winning record and even then they were underachievers. 02, 04, 06, and 09 started well only to see a winning record flushed down the tubes. This has to be the gloomiest era of Reds baseball ever, PERIOD!

CRedsLarkin11
07-13-2009, 11:10 AM
It's hard to say any Reds fan is a bandwagon fan, there are now teenagers who have never seen the Reds make the playoffs...unless there is someone out there who loves the Phillies or Yankees right now and (if not when) the Reds are good again they suddenly say they are huge Reds fans

bgwilly31
07-13-2009, 12:04 PM
All hail the TRUE REDS fan.

So because we are realists were not real reds fans>? Were bandwagon fans>? Not quite. I talk reds all year around. Good or bad. I either talk about how good they are or how bad they are.

I would be more prone to call your style of fanship the Naive fans.

Pretty much blind to the facts. I would actually consider these style of fans the dumbest to the game of us all.

Oh and i think i hate these "stop the negative" "bandwagoners get out" threads the most. Probably more than the Votto is a lucky hitter thread. :laugh:

markymark69
07-13-2009, 12:30 PM
I have been a reds fan for at least 39 years, so yes I've seen the good and the bad. What I'm sooo tired of is listening to people on this board complain about everything this team does. If this team makes a trade, the player isn't good enough, if they don't make a trade then walt's sitting on his wallet and doesn't have a clue. It's apparent to me that this team would have to go undefeated the rest of the season to please some of you. I hear people continually say how they aren't going to put a dime into this team but let them go on a 7 to 10 game win streak and they are the biggest reds fans that ever lived. I for one root for this team win or lose, it doesn't mean i don't get unhappy when they lose, but i don't give up on them when they do lose, and then pick them up again when they start winning. You people need to decide if you're true reds fans or not. As for Walt and Dusty, I do believe they are doing the best job they can. This team has desire, they now need the true reds fans to back them up.

Amen and Amen. My thoughts exactly.

justincredible
07-13-2009, 12:44 PM
Bandwagon, per Merriam-Webster:


2 : a popular party, faction, or cause that attracts growing support —often used in such phrases as jump on the bandwagon
3 : a current or fashionable trend

There is no such thing as a Cincinnati Reds bandwagon fan. The team hasn't been relevant for a decade.

markymark69
07-13-2009, 12:49 PM
There is a big difference between a bandwagon fan and a disgruntled fan.Let me ask you this.Would a bandwagon fan still spend time posting on this web site or watching every game after the past week of garbage that we've witnessed from the Reds?I think not.

I'll tell you what I'm sick and tired of.I'm sick and tired of people being sick and tired of the complaining that goes on about this team.What are we supposed to say about them?That there doing a good job.Maybe that they sure are trying hard.Possibly that they really look like big league ball players in those fancy uniforms.I suppose that some loyal Reds fans have just accepted this type of play from their team and while they have accepted it they draw the line at letting others talk about what actually is going on out there.

The point is --- whatever the Reds do --- it will not be enough for some fans. The player will cost too much money, or it will be determined that he isn't good enough or we shouldn't have traded this player and that player for him, etc.

It's okay to be disgruntled, but every little move or non-move is scrutinized to the max on this board and the talk shows and we don't have all the facts alot of the time.

The fact is we don't know how many calls Walt fields or makes concerning trades. Depending on who you believe, the package that the Reds had for DeRosa was better or on par with what the Cardinals offered. That's not Walt's fault Cleveland thought the St. Louis' offer was better.

Oh, by the way, I just can imagine what this board would have looked like if the Reds had gotten DeRosa and he went 0-for-8 in his first two games and then went on the disabled list. This after the majority of the posters on this board wanted DeRosa (which would have conveniently been forgotten). The Cardinals have played better since the trade, but it's not because of Mark DeRosa.

That is what I take from the original post.

Also, many fans have clamored for a plan for years, years and years and the Reds have always gone away from that plan and the result has been eight losing seasons in a row. They have a plan in place that has them headed in the right direction. 2009 is just a step in the process. Are the Reds going to win this year? Not likely. But, we don't know what will happen in the second half, they are only five games out.

Hang in there and see what happens. I'm not saying that you have to accept it, but every little thing that happens with this team is not necessarily a bad move.

And by the way, to answer your question --- it's only one week. Bad weeks in baseball happen to all teams.

bgwilly31
07-13-2009, 12:59 PM
The point is --- whatever the Reds do --- it will not be enough for some fans. The player will cost too much money, or it will be determined that he isn't good enough or we shouldn't have traded this player and that player for him, etc.


And by the way, to answer your question --- it's only one week. Bad weeks in baseball happen to all teams.

Only one week>? :laugh:

What are you guys thinking>? You really think if the reds were leading the division by 6 games right now you guys would be starting this thread and this whole board would be posting about how this isnt good enough>?

No of course it wouldnt be like that. You guys keep saying this nothing will ever be good enough. It kind of explains to a T what type of fans you guys are. .500 is good enough i guess for you guys.

Well .500 is not good enough to win. And most fans like to see there team compete and make it the playoffs. And if they're not going to the playoffs than they are losing. And us REAL fans that know the game and how to critique it, like a place like this to go and vent and or talk about what needs to be done to make this team a WINNER.


Or would you be happy if this board was filled with threads like "We'll get em next" "Keep your heads up" " everything is going to be ok" "Were not that bad"

Captain Hook
07-13-2009, 01:24 PM
Only one week>? :laugh:

What are you guys thinking>? You really think if the reds were leading the division by 6 games right now you guys would be starting this thread and this whole board would be posting about how this isnt good enough>?

No of course it wouldnt be like that. You guys keep saying this nothing will ever be good enough. It kind of explains to a T what type of fans you guys are. .500 is good enough i guess for you guys.

Well .500 is not good enough to win. And most fans like to see there team compete and make it the playoffs. And if they're not going to the playoffs than they are losing. And us REAL fans that know the game and how to critique it, like a place like this to go and vent and or talk about what needs to be done to make this team a WINNER.


Or would you be happy if this board was filled with threads like "We'll get em next" "Keep your heads up" " everything is going to be ok" "Were not that bad"

Thank you.Took the words right out of my mouth.

markymark69
07-13-2009, 02:21 PM
Only one week>? :laugh:

What are you guys thinking>? You really think if the reds were leading the division by 6 games right now you guys would be starting this thread and this whole board would be posting about how this isnt good enough>?

No of course it wouldnt be like that. You guys keep saying this nothing will ever be good enough. It kind of explains to a T what type of fans you guys are. .500 is good enough i guess for you guys.

Well .500 is not good enough to win. And most fans like to see there team compete and make it the playoffs. And if they're not going to the playoffs than they are losing. And us REAL fans that know the game and how to critique it, like a place like this to go and vent and or talk about what needs to be done to make this team a WINNER.


Or would you be happy if this board was filled with threads like "We'll get em next" "Keep your heads up" " everything is going to be ok" "Were not that bad"

What's your answer then? Spend like the Yankees. How many titles do they have the last five years? Spending the money doesn't necessarily translate to winning titles. Besides, you missed my point. My point was that the Reds are pretty much darned if they do and darned if they don't for the reasons I stated above.

By the way, if we were leading by six games, we would be getting threads like "We'll blow it or we'll still not that good or the division is terrible, etc."

Fon Duc Tow
07-13-2009, 02:32 PM
Spending the money doesn't necessarily translate to winning titles.

But NOT spending money certainly translates into NOT winning titles.




Besides, you missed my point. My point was that the Reds are pretty much darned if they do and darned if they don't for the reasons I stated above.

The Reds haven't been relevant in the 21st Century. I get the "darned if they don't" part, but when was this "darned if they do" part? It must have happened so fast that I missed it?




By the way, if we were leading by six games, we would be getting threads like "We'll blow it or we'll still not that good or the division is terrible, etc."

I doubt that VERY much. If the Reds were up by 6 games it would be a lovefest here.

Seriously...your argument belongs on a major-market professional team's fan board. "Darned if they do, darned if they don't" when talking about the Reds is the silliest thing I have ever heard.

Lemme guess... the Bengals are "darned if the do and darned if they don't" too, right? Darned bandwagon Bengals fans!! :all_cohol

Captain Hook
07-13-2009, 02:39 PM
What's your answer then? Spend like the Yankees. How many titles do they have the last five years?"

If the Yankees would have had just one season like any of the Reds last 8 the fans would have burned the city down.You really think we are bad compared to those fans?





My point was that the Reds are pretty much darned if they do and darned if they don't for the reasons I stated above."

You say that they are darned if they do.When have you seen the Reds have success and not had everyone here in redszone loving it.The answer would be never.The Reds have had just one winning season(the first year redszone existed)and no playoffs appearances since the site has been up and running.
For the record this is my first year here and I thought the optimism was very high going into this year until reality set in.

bgwilly31
07-13-2009, 03:28 PM
This thread is dumb. The opposing argument really isnt even worth the time.

Just let these guys pad their "Im a true fan egos" Because im ok with a .500 team attitude.

Hold up what am i saying. The reds are'nt a .500 team. :rolleyes:

markymark69
07-13-2009, 03:28 PM
But NOT spending money certainly translates into NOT winning titles.




The Reds haven't been relevant in the 21st Century. I get the "darned if they don't" part, but when was this "darned if they do" part? It must have happened so fast that I missed it?




I doubt that VERY much. If the Reds were up by 6 games it would be a lovefest here.

Seriously...your argument belongs on a major-market professional team's fan board. "Darned if they do, darned if they don't" when talking about the Reds is the silliest thing I have ever heard.

Lemme guess... the Bengals are "darned if the do and darned if they don't" too, right? Darned bandwagon Bengals fans!! :all_cohol

"The Darned if they do" means if they bring a player in (free agency, trades, etc.--- he's not good enough in the fans eyes. If they do something "they gave up too much or they overpaid for him," if they do nothing then it is "man
they need to sign Burrell or they need to trade for Holliday, etc.?" That is what was meant by darned if they do and darned if they don't.

What was the language of a few years ago when the Reds led the Wildcard for the majority of the year? "It was we'll blow it, we can't hold on". It was almost like they were wishing the Reds would fail and of course when they did, it was "I told you so".

Bengals are a different story. You have salary cap and a completely different way of doing business. And to clarify on this post --- I did not say anyone was a bandwagon fan. I agreed with the poster on the negativity of most of the board, but I did not start the thread.

bgwilly31
07-13-2009, 03:30 PM
"The Darned if they do" means if they bring a player in (free agency, trades, etc.--- he's not good enough in the fans eyes. If they do something "they gave up too much or they overpaid for him," if they do nothing then it is "man
they need to sign Burrell or they need to trade for Holliday, etc.?" That is what was meant by darned if they do and darned if they don't.

What was the language of a few years ago when the Reds led the Wildcard for the majority of the year? "It was we'll blow it, we can't hold on". It was almost like they were wishing the Reds would fail and of course when they did, it was "I told you so".

Bengals are a different story. You have salary cap and a completely different way of doing business. And to clarify on this post --- I did not say anyone was a bandwagon fan. I agreed with the poster on the negativity of most of the board, but I did not start the thread.

Do you even read this forum>?

Did you not see the EE for S. rolen thread.

Just about everybody in there was praising that move and hoping that the reds did it.

Any team any where you will always have a select few that wont agree. That's LIFE> Not just sports. You can't please everyone.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

markymark69
07-13-2009, 03:39 PM
If the Yankees would have had just one season like any of the Reds last 8 the fans would have burned the city down.You really think we are bad compared to those fans?





You say that they are darned if they do.When have you seen the Reds have success and not had everyone here in redszone loving it.The answer would be never.The Reds have had just one winning season(the first year redszone existed)and no playoffs appearances since the site has been up and running.
For the record this is my first year here and I thought the optimism was very high going into this year until reality set in.


No we are not like Yankee fans, but you didn't answer my question. What's your solution. Spending money doesn't mean the Reds will win. They have a plan in place, the current regime has only been running things for a year and half, they are not responsible for the Bowden-Linder years. Sometimes it takes time. We are sick of hearing that, but if a plan is in place it has to have time to work.

It's a fine line with the Reds. Marge spent the money and the Reds had some success, but our farm system was dismantled in the process which has led to part of what we have today. Linder didn't spend the money and didn't do a great job of building, which further complicated matters. Castellini is trying to go about building and bringing a winner and perhaps is not sure the best way to go --- does he go for broke or does he build and continue to ask for patience? What say ye?

Your second question --- I go back to 3-4 years ago I believe it was when the Reds led the wildcard almost the whole season and all I remember is fans waiting for other shoe to drop, which is ultimately did and it was nothing but a bunch of "I told you so's."

Now, maybe you weren't a part of that --- but it went on.

markymark69
07-13-2009, 03:42 PM
Do you even read this forum>?

Did you not see the EE for S. rolen thread.

Just about everybody in there was praising that move and hoping that the reds did it.

Any team any where you will always have a select few that wont agree. That's LIFE> Not just sports. You can't please everyone.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

That's one time --- I concede that. But the vast majority of the posts are just as I have pointed out.

I realize that you aren't going to please everybody and I guess we all should be careful of making blanket statements, but more often than not --- it is more than just a few dissenters.

Captain Hook
07-13-2009, 05:32 PM
That's one time --- I concede that. But the vast majority of the posts are just as I have pointed out.

I realize that you aren't going to please everybody and I guess we all should be careful of making blanket statements, but more often than not --- it is more than just a few dissenters.

Where you reading post back in April or May when the team was actually doing well?Things were very positive with a few exceptions.Even with the way things have turned out most of us still have a positive post here and there.That fact that we complain about other things(I admit that there is a lot of it but rightfully so)doesn't make us any less of a fan.That is what it seems like this argument is about.The idea that a fan that complains about their team is a bandwagon fan is absurd.:bang:

Kingspoint
07-13-2009, 07:08 PM
As for Dusty, I do believe he is doing the best job he can.

Therein lies the problem.

MJA
07-13-2009, 07:24 PM
I also think most of the board hated the Taveras signing and Ta-Da! They were right!

I can tell you right now that when I tell people I'm a Reds fan they laugh at me, actually laugh at the prospect that I would root for such a terrible franchise. This team needs to spend money if they want fans to come back, no wants to root for a consistently sub .500 baseball team. If you don't want to spend, sell the team and let someone else do it.

markymark69
07-14-2009, 10:27 AM
Where you reading post back in April or May when the team was actually doing well?Things were very positive with a few exceptions.Even with the way things have turned out most of us still have a positive post here and there.That fact that we complain about other things(I admit that there is a lot of it but rightfully so)doesn't make us any less of a fan.That is what it seems like this argument is about.The idea that a fan that complains about their team is a bandwagon fan is absurd.:bang:

I'm not saying that you can't complain, but every thing little bad thing that happens is not Dusty's fault. He has who has on the roster. Who is he supposed to pitch? When all he has is most of the same group that he was calling upon when things were going well. He didn't get any credit for putting them in May, but now he is an idiot for putting those same players in the same position in July when they aren't executing.

Sometimes, the players are at fault. They are still expected to perform when put on the field, whether they have bad stats or good stats. Let's remember baseball is a game of failure. Playersh have to execute. Case in point, Roenicke fails to cover first base in Philly and the floodgates opened. Everyone complains about Pujols hitting the grand slam off Weathers (and by the way I would have walked him), but that isn't why they lost the game. They battled back to tie the game. I haven't seen or heard alot of complaining about Paul Janish's error (again lack of execution) that extended the inning and ultimately led to three Cardinal runs.

There are some things that Dusty does that I question, but I also do not have all the facts as to why he plays so and so and why he bats so and so in the order.

The criticism of Dusty is over the top. He deserves some, but it doesn't make him stupid or a wrong fit, etc. I guess that's where I'm coming from in my defense of the original poster.

I know that I will get blasted for this, but how many times have the Reds been counted out this year and they, at least to this point, despite all the adversity, have still found a way to stay alive and a .500 season or better is still possible. To me, that's a credit to the manager.

markymark69
07-14-2009, 10:34 AM
I also think most of the board hated the Taveras signing and Ta-Da! They were right!

I can tell you right now that when I tell people I'm a Reds fan they laugh at me, actually laugh at the prospect that I would root for such a terrible franchise. This team needs to spend money if they want fans to come back, no wants to root for a consistently sub .500 baseball team. If you don't want to spend, sell the team and let someone else do it.


I guess the question is, will the fans come back if the Reds do spend the money?

One question? I know the economy is bad, but why does the team have to win for fans to go to the games? The Cubs have always sold out, and they been bad a lot more than they've been good. The same with St. Louis. Jeesh, the Bengals sold out 44 straight games and I do not even have down that road. Baseball tickets are still fairly cheap.

I want to see the Reds win as bad as anyone, but I would go more than I do if I lived closer and didn't have the job constraints that I have. I just love baseball and the experience of the game.

bounty37h
07-14-2009, 10:48 AM
WOOO HOOO...I agree...

And to the "fan" who followed this up with a post trying to say there is a difference between a Bandwagon fan and a disgruntled fan...nice try...aint buyin it.

A fan is a fan through thick and thin...Period...end of story.

I am not buying your post either; a bandwagon fan is already gone (or as someone pointed out above has to have reason to jump on to be a bandwagon fan in the firstplace, then jumps when times get down, so doubt the Reds have any bandwagon fans anywhere). A disgruntled fan is a true fan year in and year out, but may be upset and discuss that with other fans, and is still around through thick and thin. If the Reds won the World Series this year, you would see Reds hats across the country-those are banddwagon fans, and will be gone next year when the next winner rolls through. Big difference, dont know how to explain it any simpler then that.

bounty37h
07-14-2009, 10:52 AM
I have been a reds fan for at least 39 years, so yes I've seen the good and the bad. What I'm sooo tired of is listening to people on this board complain about everything this team does. If this team makes a trade, the player isn't good enough, if they don't make a trade then walt's sitting on his wallet and doesn't have a clue. It's apparent to me that this team would have to go undefeated the rest of the season to please some of you. I hear people continually say how they aren't going to put a dime into this team but let them go on a 7 to 10 game win streak and they are the biggest reds fans that ever lived. I for one root for this team win or lose, it doesn't mean i don't get unhappy when they lose, but i don't give up on them when they do lose, and then pick them up again when they start winning. You people need to decide if you're true reds fans or not. As for Walt and Dusty, I do believe they are doing the best job they can. This team has desire, they now need the true reds fans to back them up.

I see both sides and am curious, I posted last week that if the Reds sell off the season and dump players at this point, I am done with them for the year (and admitted it was mostly tongue in cheek, more venting my frustrations of them giving up/in). Does that make me a bandwagon fan then in your book, cause I want them to try and hang in and compete? Wouldnt that make ownership bandwagon owners then if they threw in the towel on this year, saying looking to next year already, the same story they said last year, and the year before, and the year before......

texasdave
07-14-2009, 10:57 AM
Complaining about the manager when things are going poorly is as American as apple pie.

bounty37h
07-14-2009, 10:59 AM
to louisvilleCards,
How many world Series have the Chicago Cubs gone to? Zero to my knowledge, but yet even during their bad years they've had fan support at wrigly field. The Green Bay Packers, Chicago Bears, even in their bad years you could not find a seat in their stadiums. Players say it all the time, they feed off a full house. It would be nice to see what this team would do playing in front of 40,000 or so screaming fans, instead of 15,000 because we're unhappy.

I do agree with that, but also want to point out the Cubs at least go and spend money to get big name players to try and be competetive, are in the big name talks every year, and that gives fans hope, even if always proves to be false hope. Also seems to show their FO gets it, and makes me wonder what they do to make the game day atmosphere better as well for the fans and makes them want to be there even in bad times, without having to resort to only bobble ehads to get fans excited.

texasdave
07-14-2009, 11:06 AM
Chicago is just a tad bit bigger city than Cincinnati. That might play a part.

bounty37h
07-14-2009, 11:08 AM
What's your answer then? Spend like the Yankees. How many titles do they have the last five years? Spending the money doesn't necessarily translate to winning titles. Besides, you missed my point. My point was that the Reds are pretty much darned if they do and darned if they don't for the reasons I stated above.

By the way, if we were leading by six games, we would be getting threads like "We'll blow it or we'll still not that good or the division is terrible, etc."

I think those are the fans you need to be addressing then, and think they are in the very, very minority, and likely just jerks who are bitter and simply like to argue at that point. I would like us to have htat problem, to see us get a 6 game lead first, don think that has ever happened since Redszone (or even internet) has been around to back up your statement.

markymark69
07-14-2009, 12:41 PM
Chicago is just a tad bit bigger city than Cincinnati. That might play a part.

But they also two teams and alot more things to do as well.

tobttr
07-14-2009, 04:22 PM
Maybe I'm missing the point, but I also see the "bandwagon" mindset as a prestige thing. "Dude, I'm a Broncos fan" (or a Red Sox fan or something) to gain approval from casual sports enthusiasts.
If that is true, then by definition a Reds fan could not be a bandwagon fan. Now if they win 12 in a row after the break and we see 150 new posters here, then I would be suspicious. But otherwise, especially if you don't live near Cincy, how is it trendy or hip to be a Reds fan?
I for one have actually tried to give them up. In 1982 after many successful years, they took a huge tumble and lost 101 games. Honestly I felt bad for abandoning them and have to some degree followed them more closely since then.
A bandwagon Reds fan is kinda like a Senate ethics committee, an oxymoron.

TC81190
07-14-2009, 05:09 PM
If I may, with all due respect, this is one of the stupider threads I've encountered in my time on this board.

Captain Hook
07-14-2009, 05:54 PM
If I may, with all due respect, this is one of the stupider threads I've encountered in my time on this board.

I agree.I've posted in this thread enough now that I am officially dumber because of it.I just couldn't stand someone saying that a Reds fan(especially one that post frequently hear)could be a bandwagon fan and then have people praise his post and defend his argument.I will try to avoid this thread from now on for the sake of my family and everyone else that cares about me.

bgwilly31
07-14-2009, 06:13 PM
I agree.I've posted in this thread enough now that I am officially dumber because of it..

+3

MJA
07-14-2009, 06:13 PM
Trust me as a Bronco fan, after this offseason no one is jumping on this bandwagon. :(

CWRed
07-14-2009, 08:20 PM
As for Walt and Dusty, I do believe they are doing the best job they can. This team has desire, they now need the true reds fans to back them up.

And that, my friend, is true I believe about Dusty. He's not capable of doing any better. Because he's a moron.

Jocketty...the jury's still out.

mlh1981
07-14-2009, 08:41 PM
No matter how upset I am with the Reds, I still manage to get deliriously excited during spring training and the night before opening day, I can't sleep. It never fails. Every year, I feel like, it's the year. No matter how much bad press/bad vibes that surround the team, I never have given up or have lost my enthusiasm. Going to/watching Reds baseball is a total treat, and if we don't get 'em today, by golly..............tomorrow is a brand new day. I love baseball. It's by far my favorite sport, and my enthusiasm for the game and for the Cincinnati Reds will never die.

That's just the way I am. I am over the top with my enthusiasm for this team and for this sport.