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View Full Version : Hernandez to have surgery, out 4-6 weeks



CTA513
07-19-2009, 05:55 PM
From the Reds blog at cincinnati.com:


Hernandez to have surgery, out 4-6 weeks

Posted by TomGroeschen at 7/19/2009 4:43 PM EDT on Cincinnati.com

Postgame 5-1 win over Brewers, Reds announced that C Ramon Hernandez (knee) will have surgery Tuesday and miss 4-6 weeks. C Craig Tatum officially will be called up Monday, although Tatum already has arrived in the clubhouse to join team (his MLB debut) in L.A. Monday.

Also: P Jared Burton will be recalled from Louisville and P Robert Manuel will head back to Louisville.

Hernandez did not start the final 3 games of the Brewers series. His knee has bothered him for some time and finally became too much.

"It's been bothering me for two months," Hernandez said after today's game. "I tried to keep playing, but we've got to do something. I can't run. It's tough."

Manager Dusty Baker on Hernandez: "It's not good."

traderumor
07-19-2009, 06:07 PM
Here is Hanigan's chance to show if he is an everyday catcher.

Ron Madden
07-19-2009, 06:08 PM
Why do these guys keep playing hurting the team and themselves when they know they are injured?

Hope everything works out well for Hernandez.

redsmetz
07-19-2009, 06:08 PM
I can't recall a season where the Reds have had so many starting players go on the DL:
1B Votto, SS Gonzalez, 3B Encarnacion, RF Bruce and C Hernandez, plus two more who were off for a few days with an ailment (Phillips and Taveras - I don't think either went on the DL). Maybe I should put this in the "snake bit" thread.

Kc61
07-19-2009, 06:18 PM
I hope Hernandez has successful surgery and his career continues. He's a tough player, I like him. But I don't see the Reds picking up his option for next year. I could see them re-signing him for a lot less money with Hanigan getting most of the playing time next year.

Tatum is supposed to be excellent defensively, not that much of a hitter, hope he does well.

redsfandan
07-19-2009, 06:22 PM
I can't recall a season where the Reds have had so many starting players go on the DL:
1B Votto, SS Gonzalez, 3B Encarnacion, RF Bruce and C Hernandez, plus two more who were off for a few days with an ailment (Phillips and Taveras - I don't think either went on the DL). Maybe I should put this in the "snake bit" thread.
Can't forget Volquez. It's amazing how much bad luck the Reds have had and we're not even at 100 games. I honestly believe that if we had good luck instead of bad with injuries we would've had a shot in this division.

redsmetz
07-19-2009, 06:32 PM
Can't forget Volquez. It's amazing how much bad luck the Reds have had and we're not even at 100 games. I honestly believe that if we had good luck instead of bad with injuries we would've had a shot in this division.

You're right. I hadn't forgotten him, I was just amazed by how many of our starting eight have had time off. That's a lot.

I hope Hernandez comes through fine. I agree with others that it's doubtful we pick up his option.

RedsManRick
07-19-2009, 06:41 PM
So much for trading Hernandez to get something back. Oh well. Hopefully Hanigan can show he's an everyday guy and ensure the Reds don't pay to bring Hernandez back.

LvJ
07-19-2009, 06:45 PM
I don't want to sound like a jerk, but I'm glad Hanigan will now have a shot at catching everyday.

lollipopcurve
07-19-2009, 06:48 PM
Re-signing Hernandez at a lower number would make sense. I don't think he's been fully healthy for a lot of this year, yet he's been solid. I think we could expect better if he were healthy.

In the meantime, it will be interesting to see how Tatum does.

HeatherC1212
07-19-2009, 06:48 PM
Wow, what an insane year for this team with injuries. I think they said on the broadcast last night that we haven't had the intended starting lineup at all this year except for like ten games or something which is crazy. I'm very impressed that the guys have been pretty positive and upbeat for the most part because it would be really easy to let all this stuff get to you. Hopefully they keep fighting and have a good road trip. Best wishes to Ramon for a speedy recovery. He's a good guy and I think he handled the pitching staff pretty well overall. I'm also impressed that he played 1B for Votto so well considering it sounds like he's battled this knee thing for a while. :eek:

I'm excited to get a chance to see Tatum since I've only heard about him but haven't seen him play yet. I hope Hanigan makes the most of this opportunity and I'm very glad he's had a lot of time to work with the pitching staff all ready. That should help them out on the road.

Tom Servo
07-19-2009, 06:50 PM
Damn, I liked Razor Ramon.

Ron Madden
07-19-2009, 06:51 PM
I don't want to sound like a jerk, but I'm glad Hanigan will now have a shot at catching everyday.

That doesn't make you a jerk.

I'm glad Hanigan will get the chance to prove himself, let's hope he does.

;)

redsfandan
07-19-2009, 07:10 PM
I don't want to sound like a jerk, but I'm glad Hanigan will now have a shot at catching everyday.
Yeah I didn't think you sounded like a jerk either. I just hoped the reason Hanigan received more abs was due to common sense.

redsmetz
07-19-2009, 07:23 PM
Yeah I didn't think you sounded like a jerk either. I just hoped the reason Hanigan received more abs was due to common sense.

I don't think Hernandez got an at bats that he didn't deserve. Frankly I think the handling of the catchers has been very good this year. I hope that Hanigan rises to the occasion. I think he can.

LvJ
07-19-2009, 07:25 PM
Yeah I didn't think you sounded like a jerk either. I just hoped the reason Hanigan received more abs was due to common sense.

Yeah, well.. lets just say I run things a lot differently in OOTP. :beerme:

redsfandan
07-19-2009, 07:57 PM
I don't think Hernandez got an at bats that he didn't deserve. Frankly I think the handling of the catchers has been very good this year. I hope that Hanigan rises to the occasion. I think he can.
I think that's debatable. It could be argued that Hanigan has been better and he's the likely starter in 2010/2011. But if it weren't for Votto, and now Hernandez, missing time Hanigan would probably be looking at less than 200 abs by the end of the season.

MrCinatit
07-19-2009, 08:03 PM
Considering all of the injuries, three games under .500 is kind of bearable.

mth123
07-19-2009, 08:31 PM
Now I'll sound like a jerk. This is could be a helpful injury. I like Ramon, but Hanigan is an upgrade. Add this to the upgrade in RF that Bruce's injury created and things are moving in the right drection. If the team would make the obvious upgrade in CF, then three eights of the positions will have been improved without making a single deal. A-Gon coming back is probably a wash at SS with the possibilty of improvement there as well.

Team Clark
07-19-2009, 09:01 PM
I can't recall a season where the Reds have had so many starting players go on the DL:
1B Votto, SS Gonzalez, 3B Encarnacion, RF Bruce and C Hernandez, plus two more who were off for a few days with an ailment (Phillips and Taveras - I don't think either went on the DL). Maybe I should put this in the "snake bit" thread.

1991-92 rings a bell

Falls City Beer
07-19-2009, 09:18 PM
I hope Burton isn't back just because. Because he was terrible. I hope he's actually ready, not just ready to walk the bases loaded then having them cleared by a double.

Big Klu
07-19-2009, 09:32 PM
The Reds will now have six players on the 15-day DL (Volquez, Lincoln, Hernandez, Richar, Gonzalez, and Bruce), and four players from the 40-man roster on the minor-league DL (Bray, LeCure, Thompson, and Alonso). This means that they have only 30 active players on the 40-man roster--the 25 players currently with the club, and minor-leaguers Maloney, Manuel, Ramirez, Roenicke, and Francisco.

Raisor
07-19-2009, 09:41 PM
He's in his 30's and is having knee troubles with a sub 700 OPS, sure let's bring him back next year, that's actually a step up from last year.

Hannigan needs to play 5 times a week until the end of the season.

Jpup
07-19-2009, 10:14 PM
He's in his 30's and is having knee troubles with a sub 700 OPS, sure let's bring him back next year, that's actually a step up from last year.

Hannigan needs to play 5 times a week until the end of the season.

I would send a pitcher to Texas for Teagarden.

Edskin
07-19-2009, 10:36 PM
I echo the sentiments of others-- I'm not "glad" Ramon is injured because I do like him and the way he's played this year. But I've been trumpeting Hanigan for awhile and I am very happy that he gets his shot here. He may very well prove that with more AB's, he's nothing more than AAAA catcher or back-up material, but he deserves the chance, and he simply wasn't going to get it with Ramon sitting (or squatting I guess) there.

LoganBuck
07-19-2009, 11:04 PM
I am not wild about Craig Tatum or Corky Miller filling the backup catcher position. The 1-2 starts a week caught by the backup catcher, will be a significant downgrade from the situation that existed before Ramon's injury.

AmarilloRed
07-19-2009, 11:05 PM
I wish nothing but the best for Hanigan-am looking forward to seeing what he can do the rest of the year. He's got the ability to hit and good on-base skills; not much power though.

Degenerate39
07-20-2009, 01:25 AM
Have they put anyone on the 60 day-DL yet? Could really use the room on the 40 man roster with the way things are going

WVRedsFan
07-20-2009, 02:28 AM
I was so excited that we had a good MLB catcher in Hernandez on the team and he proved it time after time. Competence is something we haven't had at that position for a long, long time. He hit well, but he was a slow runner. Now, we know why. I hope he comes back and does well. Picking up his option is very important. Here's why:

We've seen Hannigan in limited playing time. The more pitchers see him, I fear we'll see a dropoff from his performance. That .360+ average has constantly gone down as the season has gone along (perfectly predictable), and playing every day will just magnify that. I hope for the best, but fear the worst.

As for the injuries, it has been brutal. Votto was the worst--mental or otherwise. Gonzo was bad in that we ever had any confidence he'd not get injured (how many games has he played here?). Edwin was a freak thing. Bruce got a break (no pun intended) because he was trotted out there every day and was totally lost. The time off will do him good, but what did the club do for a backup? AAAA players. If the starting 8 had stayed healthy, it might have been better, but I don't know. Eveyone stays healthy and I might see a couple more wins, nothing more. It's time to overhaul the offense and hope the pitching gets back to what it was early on.

redsfandan
07-20-2009, 07:10 AM
Ya know right now I'm a little tempted to sound like a jerk too. I'll pass. Some good music and a few cold ones will have to do instead.

The Reds will now have six players on the 15-day DL (Volquez, Lincoln, Hernandez, Richar, Gonzalez, and Bruce), and four players from the 40-man roster on the minor-league DL (Bray, LeCure, Thompson, and Alonso). This means that they have only 30 active players on the 40-man roster--the 25 players currently with the club, and minor-leaguers Maloney, Manuel, Ramirez, Roenicke, and Francisco.
Thanks Big Klu, I knew the Reds have had some bad luck this season but that really kinda cheers me up. Can we have some good luck for a change now??

I am not wild about Craig Tatum or Corky Miller filling the backup catcher position. The 1-2 starts a week caught by the backup catcher, will be a significant downgrade from the situation that existed before Ramon's injury.
I look at it like this: Instead of the lesser, possibly injured, catcher getting most of the abs over the catcher who has been better we'll have, arguably, that same better catcher get most of the abs now and lesser production from behind the plate only once a week. Even if the stats from Hanigan slip, which is realistic, it could very well be a wash overall.

Have they put anyone on the 60 day-DL yet? Could really use the room on the 40 man roster with the way things are goingSee Big Klu's post. At this rate it could happen soon enough.


I was so excited that we had a good MLB catcher in Hernandez on the team and he proved it time after time. Competence is something we haven't had at that position for a long, long time. He hit well, but he was a slow runner. Now, we know why. I hope he comes back and does well. Picking up his option is very important. Here's why: ...
I don't think I'm alone that I wouldn't mind having the Hernandez/Hanigan tandem back for an encore. But not by picking up the option of Hernandez. His option is for $8.5 million. $8.5 million!! He's not worth that much and I doubt he'd get that much as a FA. Let him know there's NOWAY we would pick up the option at that price but that we'd be open to something with a lower base w/incentives. Playing time could be a sticking point but what the heck. I threw out this "strategy" in the thread "Low cost options at SS!" about AGon but that time I was just playing devils advocate. Hernandez is different. Why not see if he'd be open to it?



As for the injuries, it has been brutal. Votto was the worst--mental or otherwise. Gonzo was bad in that we ever had any confidence he'd not get injured (how many games has he played here?). ...
Forgive me for going off-topic but... out of a possible 415 games (start of '07 through 7/19 of this year) he's been the starter at ss in a whopping 147 games (with another 12 games as a sub). Noway to predict that but, again, can we have some good luck for a change now?

Hap
07-20-2009, 09:53 AM
I haven't read every word of every post in this thread, so I apologize in advance if this has been mentioned.....

If the Orioles knew of the ailments and provided full disclosure to Jocketty's team, then maybe that explains how we got him so cheap (a DL'd surgery-rehabbing Freel).

But what I can't figure out is why they would give him the bulk of the playing time, knowing that the injuries were being aggravated only further.

bucksfan2
07-20-2009, 10:08 AM
I haven't read every word of every post in this thread, so I apologize in advance if this has been mentioned.....

If the Orioles knew of the ailments and provided full disclosure to Jocketty's team, then maybe that explains how we got him so cheap (a DL'd surgery-rehabbing Freel).

But what I can't figure out is why they would give him the bulk of the playing time, knowing that the injuries were being aggravated only further.

Having knee surgery isn't an easy thing. Most of the times people use surgery as the last resort, apparently the Reds tried that method with Hernandez, it worked for half a season but it finally became too much.

This may be a blessing to see Hanigan get full time duty. He will be given a chance to show if he is a full time catcher or not. I hope he can do that but his numbers are trending in the wrong direction.

traderumor
07-20-2009, 11:27 AM
I'm guessing that the non-slide on Thursday was a related event. I wonder if that wasn't the last straw.

Az Red
07-20-2009, 11:39 AM
Good observation, TradeRumor. Wouldn't surprise.

Big Klu
07-20-2009, 12:20 PM
Have they put anyone on the 60 day-DL yet? Could really use the room on the 40 man roster with the way things are going


See Big Klu's post. At this rate it could happen soon enough.

Actually, Wilkin Castillo is on the 60-day DL. I did not list him in my previous post because he is technically not on the 40-man roster.

So to recap:
Wilkin Castillo -- 60-day DL
Edinson Volquez -- 15-day DL
Mike Lincoln -- 15-day DL
Ramon Hernandez -- 15-day DL
Danny Richar -- 15-day DL
Alex Gonzalez -- 15-day DL
Jay Bruce -- 15-day DL
Bill Bray -- minor-league 7-day DL
Sam LeCure -- minor-league 7-day DL
Daryl Thompson -- minor-league 7-day DL
Yonder Alonso -- minor-league 7-day DL

Mario-Rijo
07-20-2009, 12:33 PM
I'm guessing that the non-slide on Thursday was a related event. I wonder if that wasn't the last straw.

According to Hal on the radio it was related in that he couldn't do it because of the knee. Said he slid on another occassion recently vs. the Mets and it hurt him bad.

traderumor
07-20-2009, 12:54 PM
According to Hal on the radio it was related in that he couldn't do it because of the knee. Said he slid on another occassion recently vs. the Mets and it hurt him bad.I thought of another couple of instances where he clearly should have slid and did not. I guess we now know why.

Mario-Rijo
07-20-2009, 01:10 PM
Now I'll sound like a jerk. This is could be a helpful injury. I like Ramon, but Hanigan is an upgrade. Add this to the upgrade in RF that Bruce's injury created and things are moving in the right drection. If the team would make the obvious upgrade in CF, then three eights of the positions will have been improved without making a single deal. A-Gon coming back is probably a wash at SS with the possibilty of improvement there as well.

I'd disagree with Gomes/Dickerson being an upgrade in RF. They may be swinging the bat better but Bruce's defense out there this season has been excellent and his arm saved this staff a bunch of runs both directly and indirectly by gunning guys out and keeping them from advancing alot. Add his power numbers and IMO it's a downgrade there overall. Gonzo may help improve the defense a bit but his offense does drag it down too much, I don't think his defense his is so good over others to have to endure his offense.

However I do agree Hanigan is an improvement overall over Hernandez. Let's just hope Hanigan can maintain his offense to some acceptable level while playing everyday from here on out.

redsmetz
07-21-2009, 05:00 PM
From Twitter:


C Ramon Hernandez had arthroscopic surgery to clean out his left knee today in Cincinnati and is expected to miss about 4 weeks.