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reds44
07-23-2009, 02:52 AM
66-96
78-84
69-93
76-86
73-89
80-82
72-90
74-88
44-50

632-758

I started following the Reds in 2001 at the age of 12. 9 years later, I have yet to see them have a winning season and there doesn't appear to be an end in site.

I can remember the first game I ever attended in Cincinnati. I had seen the Reds play at Wrigley before, but there was nothing like that first game at Riverfront. Sure, it was really half of Riverfront and it was named Cinergy, but it was like no other. Sean Casey hit a HR and they set off fireworks and the roof caught on fire. The Reds, and Bruce Chen, lost to Barry Zito with the help of a great play by Eric Byrnes.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CIN/CIN200206220.shtml

Out of all the losing seasons, this one may be the worst. The highlight of my Reds fandom is the 80-82 year. I remember at the beginning of the year I thought that offense was unstoppable, Dunn, Griffey, Kearns, Lopez, Phillips, Edwin, Ross, Freel, even as much crap as I gave him Aurilia produced for the Reds. We would run lineups out there that 1-8 could go deep on any pitch. Then we made the trade, then we went out West, and as George would say "you know the story."

This one is the worst. Lets be honest, the Reds are pretty bad. They can't hit, and they really can't pitch anymore either. Since sometime in May they are one of the 5 worst teams in baseball. Watching this team is giving me zero joy, it's just no fun anymore. There is no scoring, and the games are boring.

However, I found myself cheering like an idiot for the Astros tonight. Once they won, I had myself convinced if the Reds could just get 1 in LA and head into the off day tomorrow only 3 back in the loss column we still had a shot. I watched the game frusterated as ever. I was watching the game with my brother, and I literally didn't say a word for a good hour after the Manny slam. It's just frusterating. Part of me doesn't want to root for this team anymore.

But I digress. I just looked at the standings to see that the Reds, somehow, are still only 4 back in the loss column, despite having 4 teams ahead of them. By the time we play on Friday I'll have myself convinced a good series in Chicago will have them back in the race. And you can bet on Sunday I'll be in the bleachers with my Reds gear on.

I know there are other Reds fans feeling just as bad if not worse than I do (hi OBM), and you aren't alone. One day we'll be rewarded, I hope.

Go Reds

BCubb2003
07-23-2009, 03:16 AM
Well it's not Iowa.

Cleveland went 23 years without finishing above fourth. But they did have a winning record every once in awhile.

*BaseClogger*
07-23-2009, 03:31 AM
As a fellow youngster, 44, I share your pain.

My parents grew up in Cincinnati and saw the BRM in person many times. I was raised as a Reds fan. When I was little I went to a ton of games during the strike year ('94) -- I believe we were in first. My favorite player was Kevin Mitchell. My first major Reds memory was the day they traded for Griffey. I was so excited that my childhood team had traded for the icon of our generation! We continued to follow the team as best we could up here in Michigan, but I always longed for a way to talk Reds baseball! :eek:

Then I found this site one afternoon while screwing around in one of my high school classes. We had just hired Dusty Baker, and having just read Moneyball and other such books, I was pissed off. I grew to love this place because you are all just like me -- intelligent, diehard Reds fans who have long suffered through this generation. Some of you are even lucky enough to remember winning baseball.

But once again it's mid-summer and I am turning my attention to Buckeye football. The Reds are just too frustrating to invest myself or my money into right now. It's just the same old, embarrassing mentality that has plagued this franchise for years. I'm sure I'll be excited again over the offseason, but right now the only reason I visit this site is to interact with you all... :(

GO REDS

KronoRed
07-23-2009, 05:01 AM
Not having a team would be baseball hell.

This is punishment ..for something :D

Ron Madden
07-23-2009, 05:12 AM
Is this baseball hell?

Nah this is Cincinnati.

:(

redsfandan
07-23-2009, 07:28 AM
And I thought "baseball hell" was in Pittsburgh. Guess not

thatcoolguy_22
07-23-2009, 08:06 AM
I share a similar story to BaseClogger. I was raised in Ga but, my parents were from Indiana and diehard Reds fans leaving me no choice. My favorite Reds player of all time is Chris Sabo, due in large part to his game 3 heroics and goggles. My first Reds related memory was the 1990 world series. I wasn't old enough to enjoy the buildup of the season with a championship for a cap so, for me it doesn't count.

What I have experienced as a Reds fan is 1999 (phenomenal) and one dreadful season after another. I've talked to my friends about why Dave Williams could work out and said time and time again that this is the year KGJ stays healthy, only to be disappointed by another losing season. I argued that "The Trade" makes sense and Homer Bailey will be a top 3 pitcher in the league for years to come. I witnessed the demise of too many "prospects" to count and retread after retread pitching in the 3-4-5 spots. My birthday is the trading deadline and every year all I want is to see the Reds pull off a blockbuster that will have them set up for the stretch run.There is no other team in my life that I will root for with as much passion but, we can only pray to the baseball Gods that something gives. One team can only be so horrid for so long right?


As Reds fans we are still better off than anyone who roots for the Cubs or Pirates :) but, what is that really saying?

membengal
07-23-2009, 09:04 AM
Thanks for sharing Reds44.

For those of us who remember 1979, 1981, the mid-80s, 1990, 1995 and 1999 clearly, it is all too easy to forget the plight that youngers fans are in having no frame of reference for winning.

And at five and six, I have a passing memory of 1975 and 1976. The first year I clearly remember games is 1977, and there was plenty of winning that year too, not just enough.

So, no jokes, I am sorry that you have never seen a season marked by baseball competence. That is unfortunate. And it underscores the doldrums this franchise is in.

As Woy will point out, there were other fallow periods, but you have to go way back for those. I think RFS can regale us with tales...

Yeah, it's close to baseball hell. You can at least see it from here.

And it is so unnecessary. As the years have passed, GABP has moved from "nice park" to "mini-jewel". It is a ton of fun to go to that park, sit in different areas, see the river, enjoy the game. Great views of the game. Not really a bad seat in the house.

The various ownership groups in that span have not properly marketed the team, articulated a vision for their ownership (other than profit, I suppose), articulated a vision for their front office, or shown any semblance of having a plan that would produce consistent winning. It is full blown depressing.

I keep hoping for a bolt from the heavens to turn this franchise's fortunes, because I don't want to be a fan without hope. But, yeah, no minimizing what you have seen. It has been bad.

It didn't use to be. That's all I can say. It didn't use to be.

hebroncougar
07-23-2009, 09:24 AM
It's hard for me to fathom how the Reds have lost a whole generation of fans. Most of the high school kids I have in class have no interest, and if you were a kid, and the Reds had been this bad for this long, how can you blame them?

REDSEER
07-23-2009, 10:11 AM
Count me in as one of the few young Reds fans.

I was a "fan" from birth, as my mom's family is a large group of devoted Reds fans. And by "fan" I mean that I knew who Barry Larkin was, I knew how the team was doing, and so on. One of my favorite childhood memories is going over to my grandpa's house (HUGE Reds fan for a long time), and watching my favorite VHS tape: Wire to Wire: The Story of the 1990 Cincinnati Reds. To this day my older brother and I could still tell you more about that team than any other Reds team from 1991-2000 combined. At that point, I was a casual baseball fan.

But then my local TV provider picked up FSN Ohio before the 2003 season. At that point, I became a diehard. I watched every game that was on television (and even enjoyed George Grande and the Crafty Left Hander), and even if the game wasn't on, I found a way to either follow it or listen to it online.

This, unfortunately, leaves my main Reds memories as disappointments, including numerous KGJ injuries, the Cardinals' 7-run 9th, Albert Pujols bombs off of David Weathers, and brutal west-coast trips.

Not that it has all been negative. I'll also never forget KGJ's walk-off HR in his first game back from an injury against the Nationals, or Adam Dunn's walk-off grand slam against the Indians, or Dave Ross' walk-off against the Cards in 2006. Those are the memories that I try to hold onto during miserable weeks like this. When success comes (:pray: soon please :pray:), I'll be here just as I have during the bad times, rooting the Reds on. Losing baseball is still baseball, which is something magical.

flyer85
07-23-2009, 10:15 AM
that would be Pittsburgh but Cincinnati isn't far away.

Ltlabner
07-23-2009, 10:15 AM
Baseball hell is being the Pirates, Nationals and Royals without realizing it.

Highlifeman21
07-23-2009, 10:19 AM
Baseball hell is being the Pirates, Nationals and Royals without realizing it.

Or knowing it, and not admitting it.

cumberlandreds
07-23-2009, 10:43 AM
Baseball hell is being the Pirates, Nationals and Royals without realizing it.

I hate to tell you but the Reds are very,very close to those three if not there already.
I do feel bad for the young Reds fans like Reds44 who have never seen any success by this team. Being an old guy I can fall back on the BRM days and even most of the 80's weren't so bad except for 82-84 seasons. I can't see how the Reds can keep these young people interested year after year with all the losing and just plain ole non competitiveness in the last decade. Two of those teams cited have had longer losing stretches than the Reds and their attendance has steadily declined. I don't know what the Reds attendance figures have been in recent years but I would think it would be starting to steadily decline. Fan apathy is worst kind of attitude a franchise can let happen. This has happened in KC and Pittsburgh and is well on the way to being present in Cincinnati.

Sea Ray
07-23-2009, 10:54 AM
Baseball hell is being the Pirates, Nationals and Royals without realizing it.

It is baseball hell and it all starts with money. The common denominator in all of those teams and our Reds is very limited finances. The way MLB is now setup the only way the Reds compete is if they build a killer minor league system. I do think they can at least finish .500 every now and then but given the financial structure in MLB these days, we'll always be chasing the Cubs and the Cards.

Ltlabner
07-23-2009, 10:56 AM
I hate to tell you but the Reds are very,very close to those three if not there already.

That's exactly what I was saying.

We're the Pirates, Nats and Royals but many, including the FO, don't realize it (or want to admit it).

That was posted a few years back and I argued with the poster vigorously. I thought he was a fool. Then I took the blue pill and realized that there is a Matrix-esque alternate reality that surrounds 1 Joe Nuxhall Way. Its a force-field of mediocrity that apparently effects all that enters. Those in the know understand we blow.

redsfandan
07-23-2009, 10:59 AM
It is baseball hell and it all starts with money. The common denominator in all of those teams and our Reds is very limited finances. The way MLB is now setup the only way the Reds compete is if they build a killer minor league system. I do think they can at least finish .500 every now and then but given the financial structure in MLB these days, we'll always be chasing the Cubs and the Cards.
Maybe but even those teams need to have their farm system help them. Chicago doesn't have much of one right now and that's part of why I could see us switching places with them in a year or two. Keeping the focus on the farm system and away from bad contracts can help the Reds achieve that.

CrackerJack
07-23-2009, 11:04 AM
But I thought MLB had more parity than any other sport because the Yankees didn't go to the post season last year and the Mets are out of it this year?

Yet it seems to me the Chicago, NY, LA, Philadelphia and Boston teams are in the thick of it more often than not every year. Small market teams can have an unexpected year with their controlled minor league prospects that make it every so often, until they can no longer afford to keep them, then they start over.

I do feel sorry for the young fans who have never experienced a post season run of any kind in professional sports, in this town. Hell I've forgotten what it was like the last 20 years. Thus my interest/enthusiasm for pro sports, and that of everyone I know, has severely declined.

westofyou
07-23-2009, 11:19 AM
Is this baseball hell?

Baseball Hell is football season.

That said most folks are connected to their teams in a geographic manner, or by the only game in town manner.

If The Reds are hell and you live somewhere else and really have no connection to the Reds other than some nebulous connection than chances are you're holding the keys to your own chains.

Free thyself, or learn to savor small rewards, that's the Reds fan in todays world.

Sea Ray
07-23-2009, 11:22 AM
Maybe but even those teams need to have their farm system help them. Chicago doesn't have much of one right now and that's part of why I could see us switching places with them in a year or two. Keeping the focus on the farm system and away from bad contracts can help the Reds achieve that.

The Cards and Cubs will always be able to pickup players like Harden, Aramis Ramirez, Derrick Lee, Mark McGwire and Scott Rolen...players dumped by the bottom feeders while the Reds will tend to be the dumpees. This means we're at a huge disadvantage. The "haves" get to acquire known talents while we have to bank on prospects. That's a big difference

Patrick Bateman
07-23-2009, 11:28 AM
To me, this is the worst season yet, because not only is the team crappy, but they also manage to play a completely uninteristing brand of baseball. Management makes dumb decisions, Baker makes dumb decisions, the players make dumb decisions. The hitters swing at everything and anything. The team has no power. They do a poor job of maximizing the low talent level they do have.

As bad as the pitching has been in recent years, I at least liked having a good offense that was capable of getting us back in games, makes even some losses potentially interesting. Now adays, we get down 2 runs and the game is beyond recovery. It's just becoming easier and easier to skip out on games and turn them off early.

redsfandan
07-23-2009, 11:30 AM
The Cards and Cubs will always be able to pickup players like Harden, Aramis Ramirez, Derrick Lee, Mark McGwire and Scott Rolen...players dumped by the bottom feeders while the Reds will tend to be the dumpees. This means we're at a huge disadvantage. The "haves" get to acquire known talents while we have to bank on prospects. That's a big difference
Yeah it is a big difference. You're also talking about players with big contracts that are also sometimes overpaid. Even the Cubs have limits financially. A bad contract like Bradleys can still have a negative effect on flexibility. Add in a subpar farm system and even a big market team can slip.

Well I have to get some sleep. Have fun everyone with that broken record of yours. cya

RichRed
07-23-2009, 11:35 AM
To me, this is the worst season yet, because not only is the team crappy, but they also manage to play a completely uninteristing brand of baseball.

And yet, Chris Welsh said just a few days ago that this year's team is a lot more fun to watch. And here I am wishing I could just fast forward through every disheartening Reds AB except for Votto, Phillips and maybe Dickerson.

paulrichjr
07-23-2009, 11:35 AM
The Cards and Cubs will always be able to pickup players like Harden, Aramis Ramirez, Derrick Lee, Mark McGwire and Scott Rolen...players dumped by the bottom feeders while the Reds will tend to be the dumpees. This means we're at a huge disadvantage. The "haves" get to acquire known talents while we have to bank on prospects. That's a big difference

Except who have we dumped over the past 10 years that really makes a difference like a Ramirez or Lee? Dunn sure.... Loshe but I would argue he wasn't worth a lot when he left us...Who else? It seems to me that this team makes trades and we think it's a dump of a good player only to watch him get "dumped" by his new team also because he just isn't very good.

My boys (14,10) are made fun of by their friends because they are Reds fans. I remember from 1977 until today. I remember 1990, 1999, 1979, and 1981 (disgusting). They remember, "Wait until next year." You are like them and yes this is baseball hell.

westofyou
07-23-2009, 11:37 AM
And yet, Chris Welsh said just a few days ago that this year's team is a lot more fun to watch. And here I am wishing I could just fast forward through every disheartening Reds AB except for Votto, Phillips and maybe Dickerson.

Chris also used to think the BRM should bunt more in the 70's, and when he asked Sparky why he didn't Sparky laughed.

Sea Ray
07-23-2009, 11:58 AM
Except who have we dumped over the past 10 years that really makes a difference like a Ramirez or Lee? Dunn sure.... Loshe but I would argue he wasn't worth a lot when he left us...Who else? It seems to me that this team makes trades and we think it's a dump of a good player only to watch him get "dumped" by his new team also because he just isn't very good.

My boys (14,10) are made fun of by their friends because they are Reds fans. I remember from 1977 until today. I remember 1990, 1999, 1979, and 1981 (disgusting). They remember, "Wait until next year." You are like them and yes this is baseball hell.

Our Reds have not done a good job trading veterans for prospects but my point is that we can't trade for the guys that the Cubs and Cards can. For example, when Peavy was available you heard that the Cards and Cubs were in the running but not a peep from the Reds. That's because we can't afford him. Ditto with Halladay.

Sea Ray
07-23-2009, 12:04 PM
Yeah it is a big difference. You're also talking about players with big contracts that are also sometimes overpaid. Even the Cubs have limits financially. A bad contract like Bradleys can still have a negative effect on flexibility. Add in a subpar farm system and even a big market team can slip.

Well I have to get some sleep. Have fun everyone with that broken record of yours. cya

Money is no guarantee of success but lack of money severely damages your ability to compete. Teams with money tend to compete every year and teams w/o compete every so often.

In the NFL teams like Green Bay and Pittsburgh can win Super Bowls and sustain success. Under MLB's current system you won't see similar success from the Pirates and Brewers.

Always Red
07-23-2009, 02:38 PM
Nah, baseball hell is located roughly 300 miles north of Cincinnati, hard by the shores of Lake Michigan.

Talk about frustration.

WMR
07-23-2009, 02:41 PM
To me, this is the worst season yet, because not only is the team crappy, but they also manage to play a completely uninteristing brand of baseball. Management makes dumb decisions, Baker makes dumb decisions, the players make dumb decisions. The hitters swing at everything and anything. The team has no power. They do a poor job of maximizing the low talent level they do have.

Spot-freaking-on. :laugh:

BuckeyeRedleg
07-23-2009, 02:54 PM
Nah, baseball hell is located roughly 300 miles north of Cincinnati, hard by the shores of Lake Michigan.

Detroit is currently in 1st place in the AL Central and could possibly win their 2nd division title in 4 years.

According to my Sporting News pre-season guide, the losingest franchises of the decade so far (records are prior to this season):

1. KC (607-851)
2. TB (610-845) with a WS appearance
3. PIT (619-837)
4. BAL (634-822)
5. DET (643-814) with a WS appearance
6. WAS (652-805)
7. MIL (661-796) 1 playoff appearance
8. CIN (673-785)
9. COL (677-782) with a WS appearance
10. TEX (689-769)

Factoring in playoff and WS appearances (by MIL, TB, DET, and COL), here's how I'd rank them this decade so far...by futility:

1. KC
2. PIT
3. BAL
4. WAS/MTL
5. CIN
6. TEX
7. MIL
8. TB
9. DET
10. COL

IslandRed
07-23-2009, 02:57 PM
Nah, baseball hell is located roughly 300 miles north of Cincinnati, hard by the shores of Lake Michigan.

Talk about frustration.


Detroit is currently in 1st place in the AL Central and could possibly win their 2nd division title in 4 years.

Check your map again. :p:

WMR
07-23-2009, 03:00 PM
Detroit is currently in 1st place in the AL Central and could possibly win their 2nd division title in 4 years.

According to my Sporting News pre-season guide, the losingest franchises of the decade so far (records are prior to this season):

1. KC (607-851)
2. TB (610-845) with a WS appearance
3. PIT (619-837)
4. BAL (634-822)
5. DET (643-814) with a WS appearance
6. WAS (652-805)
7. MIL (661-796) 1 playoff appearance
8. CIN (673-785)
9. COL (677-782) with a WS appearance
10. TEX (689-769)

Factoring in playoff and WS appearances (by MIL, TB, DET, and COL), here's how I'd rank them this decade so far...by futility:

1. KC
2. PIT
3. BAL
4. WAS/MTL
5. CIN
6. TEX
7. MIL
8. TB
9. DET
10. COL

Nice work. :thumbup:

Nestled comfortably between the Nats and the Rangers.

BuckeyeRedleg
07-23-2009, 03:03 PM
Check your map again. :p:

oops...lol.

I was thinking NORTH and didn't pay attention to the LAKE MICHIGAN part.

My map says Chi or Mil are NW anyway, but my bad for putting Detroit on Lake Michigan....lol.

My point stands though. Neither CHI or MIL have been as bad as Cincy for the past decade.

dsmith421
07-23-2009, 03:14 PM
In the period 2000-09 the Reds have finished a total of 169 games out of first place.

It's actually stunning when you think about how little interesting baseball the team has played in the past nine seasons. The only year I can remember the club being any kind of factor after the All-Star Break was 2006, and that was thanks to a historically bad NL.

Strikes Out Looking
07-23-2009, 06:24 PM
If it's not baseball hell it's baseball run by the 3 stooges--Dusty, Walt and Bob and the stooges that preceded them, Leatherpants, Narron, Miley, Linder, Marge, DanO, John Allen. (I probably left some off the list but it makes me want to cry).

Almost every decision made since about 1995 has been just bad. They way they built the stadium, moving to Arizona for Spring training (it will end up being a negative for most of the eastern time zone fan base), trading for jr., not spending any money this offseason in a winnable division, saying next year will be the year every year.

Maybe its just the frustration I feel right now but I feel like I'm in baseball hell.

Always Red
07-23-2009, 06:33 PM
oops...lol.

I was thinking NORTH and didn't pay attention to the LAKE MICHIGAN part.

My map says Chi or Mil are NW anyway, but my bad for putting Detroit on Lake Michigan....lol.

My point stands though. Neither CHI or MIL have been as bad as Cincy for the past decade.

Yes, I was talking about the Cubs- sorry I wasn't more clear!

I was taking a longer view...

They haven't even been to the World Series since 1945, and their last WS Championship was 1908.

Point taken about the last 10 years though.

paulrichjr
07-23-2009, 06:42 PM
If it's not baseball hell it's baseball run by the 3 stooges--Dusty, Walt and Bob and the stooges that preceded them, Leatherpants, Narron, Miley, Linder, Marge, DanO, John Allen. (I probably left some off the list but it makes me want to cry).

Almost every decision made since about 1995 has been just bad. They way they built the stadium, moving to Arizona for Spring training (it will end up being a negative for most of the eastern time zone fan base), trading for jr., not spending any money this offseason in a winnable division, saying next year will be the year every year.

Maybe its just the frustration I feel right now but I feel like I'm in baseball hell.

And who came up with this idea? John Allen. I blame him for everything bad that has happened to the Reds. I believe I can even find a way to blame him for the Manny grand slam. The man was just awful at running the Reds and so they put him in charge of the Spring Training site also. It might turn out to be great but somehow I doubt it with Allen's fingerprints on it.

redsfandan
07-23-2009, 07:09 PM
Money is no guarantee of success but lack of money severely damages your ability to compete. Teams with money tend to compete every year and teams w/o compete every so often.

In the NFL teams like Green Bay and Pittsburgh can win Super Bowls and sustain success. Under MLB's current system you won't see similar success from the Pirates and Brewers.
Hey I'm not saying the current system isn't screwed up and unfair. It is. In baseball you can see teams with payrolls that are 2, 3, 4, and even 5x the size of other teams payrolls. Of course that's messed up. Noone is saying it isn't. So what? This is what teams like the Reds have to work with. Now if you want to start a petition of fans of small market teams to complain about the system and send it to Bud sign me up. But that doesn't mean they'll change it. This just means that the farm system is even more important to teams like the Reds. If we're going to compete that will be the biggest reason.

Yes, I was talking about the Cubs- sorry I wasn't more clear!

I was taking a longer view...

They haven't even been to the World Series since 1945, and their last WS Championship was 1908.

Point taken about the last 10 years though.
Until recently the Cubs also went 30+ years without back to back winning seasons. It's great to have a winning season but I don't want just one. I want the Reds to be able to compete every season. But without one of the best farms systems that probably won't happen.

macro
07-23-2009, 11:55 PM
According to my Sporting News pre-season guide, the losingest franchises of the decade so far (records are prior to this season):

1. KC (607-851)
2. TB (610-845) with a WS appearance
3. PIT (619-837)
4. BAL (634-822)
5. DET (643-814) with a WS appearance
6. WAS (652-805)
7. MIL (661-796) 1 playoff appearance
8. CIN (673-785)
9. COL (677-782) with a WS appearance
10. TEX (689-769)

What's sad about that list is that Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, Baltimore, and Kansas City were four of the strongest franchises in MLB when I was growing up in the 70s.

M2
07-24-2009, 12:09 AM
If you're age 22 or younger and you're a Reds fan, more power to you. You deserve some good times in the future.

And a warning: I know a lot of folks who grew up Mets fans in the 1970s. If they're any indication, you're never going to be quite right in the head.

WVRedsFan
07-24-2009, 01:44 AM
I feel for the younger guys who follow the Reds. I can still remember the championships in 1961, 1970, 1975, 1976, and 1990, and other years. I can remember good teams in 1962, 1964, and many more. These guys have never seen it. All they've seen is garbage can players and limited budgets because (wait for it), "we are a small market team." Obtain winning players, and not everyone else's castoffs. and you might win some games and fill the stadium? Anyone ever heard of that?

It took the Reds from 1940 to 1961 to win a pennant. It took them from 1940 to 1975 to win a World Series (that's 21 and 35 years). It's been 14 years since the last pennant and 19 years since the last World Series championship. It's not as bad as it has been, but it's getting daggone close. And you get used to it. Except this year. This team cannot hit and the pitching is becoming brutal to watch. And nothing is being done ("we're on the right track"). Just explain that to me, Walt. How so?

At least I've got my memories. You younger guys don't even have that.

Patrick Bateman
07-24-2009, 02:54 AM
If you're age 22 or younger and you're a Reds fan, more power to you. You deserve some good times in the future.

And a warning: I know a lot of folks who grew up Mets fans in the 1970s. If they're any indication, you're never going to be quite right in the head.

I'm just glad the Blackhawks started to turn it around.

Between the Bengals, Reds, and Hawks, which are about the only 3 teams I feel strongly about, I've watched basically nothing but pathetic sports for my entire life. But it kind of makes you appreciate the success more.

oregonred
07-24-2009, 03:22 AM
Another sad thought is that it has been since the mid-80's since any Red was on the field that would go into Cooperstown wearing the wishbone-C. And those guys were in their prime a decade before (Doggie, Pete, Davie and Johnny).

I hang onto the BRM memories (although I was born in 1970) and especially the great '84/'85 comeback for the franchise with Pete returning. The late 80s were good baseball, but 5 straight seconds (damn it that we didn't get the WC in 1985).

1990 was the greatest. I went to 30+ games and almost all of the playoffs. I remember a bunch of us drove down for a DH against the Pirates on a Friday Night. 52K, full-house at riverfront. Place was nuts. Turned out to be the NLCS preview

I also really enjoyed the '94 and '95 versions. That '95 team was really a good one that unfirtunately hit a Braves Playoff pitching juggernaut. Although the ill-timed strike made that feel empty.

Then we had '99 and the hope of KGJ.

I feel bad for any of the younger fans that only remember the Lost Decade. But, then again I wish I was in my 20s again so life ain't all bad for ya :)

redsfandan
07-24-2009, 06:07 AM
I hang onto the BRM memories (although I was born in 1970) and especially the great '84/'85 comeback for the franchise with Pete returning. The late 80s were good baseball, but 5 straight seconds (damn it that we didn't get the WC in 1985).

It was 4 straight second place finishes but I agree that was a hell of a tease. Not sure what you meant by the WC.

redsfandan
08-01-2009, 03:51 AM
If the latest on Volquez is true and he does need TJ then I just have to wonder is this really baseball hell or purgatory? Does it matter? This is just beyond frustrating.

GAC
08-01-2009, 09:38 AM
Well, since I'm an old fart, and started following the Reds as a youngster back around the early parts of the 60's... and that's the 1960's.... (still remember this young kid named Rose when he was called up), I've seen far more losing teams in those 45+ years then winning ones.

Here's the Red's team history.....http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CIN/

Pretty spotty when it comes to post-season appearances.

As a child of the 60's, there were some darn good ballplayers on those 60's Reds teams. And while those teams weren't that bad during that decade (.536 winning % overall), they didn't win any division titles or make any post-season appearances, other then in 1961.

And if you're old enough to have been a child during the decades of the 1940s and 1950s, you didn't have much to root for, as far as division crowns and post-season appearances. Pretty dismal.

The decade of the 70's was a special and very unique time in Red's history. Glad to have been alive then to have witnessed it all too. But it will never happen again. The economics of the game, and relationship between the owner-player has evolved and changed so much since the advent of free agency and the player's union. It use to be that owners were OWNERS. They owned those players who had very little say or rights. Players, throughout the history of the game were always money-conscious. They just couldn't do much about it. An owner was able to build a dynasty and hold it together because of that stranglehold control they had.

It's just not so now. Owners are now renters or leasers of players. If the BRM existed today they wouldn't be able to hold it together because those players (Rose, Bench, Morgan, Perez, whoever) would be doing the exact same thing today's players are doing.... showing no loyalty at all; but either pay me or lose me. I'm off to the highest bidder.

And I'm not saying that the way it was was good, or that we need to go back to that. Only revealing the reality of the situation and the way it was.

The only teams that have dynasties today are those that can afford to pay to hold it together. Or hope that those young players you've drafted, and hold control over until they get the ML years of service, somehow gel together (like a TB) and strike gold, and you're able to take advantage until you can no longer afford them. It's like playing the lottery.

And growing up, fans got attached to, and really acquainted with ballplayers... they were really fans.... because of that player(s) many years spent with their organization. Look how long a Rose, Perez, Bench, Morgan, and others, were with the Reds? And one can see that all around MLB. Look at some of the great ballplayers that spent their prime productive years (and even beyond) with teams like the Pirates, Dodgers, Royals, Cardinals, and so many others.

Nowadays, you might still be a fan of a particular player, because of their performance/talent, but it would be in several different uniforms because they jump teams so much anymore.

The game just ain't the same. You no longer attempt to build a dynasty and hold a team together for the most part. Your goal, as an owner/GM is to simply try to find those "pieces" to give yourself a shot in that particular year. And then next year you do it all over again; but with different pieces. And it's hard putting that puzzle together since it's a continuing process.