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View Full Version : Who Misses The Big Donkey?



Jones1
08-02-2009, 03:45 PM
With the Reds being the worst offense in all of baseball and needing high OBP guys and RBI producers how bad are they missing Adam Dunn's bat? Dunn is having a career year in Washington and would of helped this team in huge way this season! Yeah his D is awful but who wouldn't take his defense for the offensive numbers he's putting up this season? Heres his stats this year.

BA 275, R 51, HR 26, RBI 75, OBP 404, OPS 954.

GIDP
08-02-2009, 03:47 PM
I really dont. Hes having a good year but I really dont think hes as good as he has been all year either.

sivman17
08-02-2009, 03:49 PM
i don't miss him

FlyerFanatic
08-02-2009, 03:53 PM
hes not gonna help this team, we might win a few more games, thats about it

Jones1
08-02-2009, 03:53 PM
None of the outfielders we have right now are even close to giving you a 400 OBP 40 HRs and 100 Rs a season. In the off season everyone was saying how we'd replace Dunn with the garbage we have it hasnt even been close to that kind of production!

Jones1
08-02-2009, 03:55 PM
How many games has this team lost this season by 2 or 3 runs? Especially early in the year when we had very good pitching! I beg to differ!

Jones1
08-02-2009, 03:58 PM
Take for instance todays game. Dunns at least going to draw a walk maybe score from that or hit a HR and get some runs. These type games before this team fell apart were what killed this team, before it fell apart. Not defense!

Shawn_RedsFan
08-02-2009, 04:04 PM
I miss him too seems odd we were preaching about Defense but our D is pretty lousy right now.

Jones1
08-02-2009, 04:05 PM
Our D is league average

FlyerFanatic
08-02-2009, 04:13 PM
who needs dunn when you have nix?

sivman17
08-02-2009, 04:13 PM
Our D is league average

by league average do you mean 13th in the NL?

GIDP
08-02-2009, 04:16 PM
Dunn has always struck me as a player who will do his thing no matter the line up. Nothing really changes for him no matter the situation. Its not because hes selfish I just dont think he has certain abilities like Joey Votto for example. If I had a high payroll team I'd take him in a heart beat, but I wouldnt pay for him to be THE guy.

Jones1
08-02-2009, 04:40 PM
My sediments. Worse than league average. Which goes to prove my point more.

Shawn_RedsFan
08-02-2009, 04:47 PM
My sediments. Worse than league average. Which goes to prove my point more.

AND Gomes MIGHT be a tad bit better than Dunn defensively but Dunn makes up with that with the stick. ;) I don't see why we would rather have Gomes over Dunn..only reason would be $$

Jones1
08-02-2009, 04:49 PM
Actually people thought the gomes/nix, gomes/hairston, gomes/dickerson platoon would produce Dunns numbers lol.

BluegrassRedleg
08-02-2009, 04:55 PM
I do. He had his flaws, but I wish it had worked out for him to be with the Reds longer.

Dunn's "crime" was being only a very good player instead of an amazing player. People always held him to a higher standard based on the perceived potential and other star players in the league. When the dust settled, though, he would score you 100 and drive in 100 almost every year.

Make no mistake, the Reds miss that right now.

Shawn_RedsFan
08-02-2009, 04:56 PM
Actually people thought the gomes/nix, gomes/hairston, gomes/dickerson platoon would produce Dunns numbers lol.

.......................:bash:.....only on RedsZone would people think that ;)

Mutaman
08-02-2009, 05:06 PM
We lost with Dunn, we lose without Dunn. Except it cost 8 million per to lose with Dunn. Better we lose without Dunn.

JayBruce
08-02-2009, 05:16 PM
We lost with Dunn, we lose without Dunn. Except it cost 8 million per to lose with Dunn. Better we lose without Dunn.

Yeah, it's better that we use that money to sign Wily Tavares and bring in an over-the-hill third baseman with a bad back.

Brilliant!:thumbup:

Mutaman
08-02-2009, 05:30 PM
Yeah, it's better that we use that money to sign Wily Tavares and bring in an over-the-hill third baseman with a bad back.

Brilliant!:thumbup:

Oh please. However you characterise Rolen, he was hitting over .300 in the best division in baseball, and even you would agree that he is still one of the premere defensive players in baseball. And, unlike Adam, he knows how to win.

So even if a reasonable man might feel that we gave up too much to get him, are you actually saying we were better off spending that money to keep Dunn? If so, there's simply no point in continuing this conversation.

mlh1981
08-02-2009, 05:44 PM
I sure as hell do. Wasn't his fault the Reds unfairly put him in a spot where they needed him to be "the guy." He's not that type of player. He's not a vocal leader, or a real "rah rah" guy. He just goes out there everyday, doesn't get hurt, and produces. He was one of the few Reds prospects in recent years who ever amounted to anything. Go blame all the busts, and the over the hill vets, not Dunn.

JayBruce
08-02-2009, 05:45 PM
Oh please. However you characterise Rolen, he was hitting over .300 in the best division in baseball, and even you would agree that he is still one of the premere defensive players in baseball. And, unlike Adam, he knows how to win.

So even if a reasonable man might feel that we gave up too much to get him, are you actually saying we were better off spending that money to keep Dunn? If so, there's simply no point in continuing this conversation.

Scott Rolen is a career .284 hitter. If he hits over .300 WITH THE REDS in either of the next two seasons, I'd be mildly shocked. He's 34 years old, he's injury prone, and his contract is ridiculous for a team like the Reds to take on, especially considering the other stupid contracts they're stuck with.

This team sucks right now, and it would suck with Dunn. But even if we didn't trade him and he accepted arbitration after this season, he'd be off the books after '09 and we'd get some comp draft picks. Rolen is making, what, 11 Mil next year? His contract further prevents the Reds from improving this off-season.

So yeah, I'd rather watch the Big Donkey hitting bombs while we finish in last place than watch Scott Rolen play good defense at third, provide "veteran leadership" and take up more payroll while we finish last.

Shawn_RedsFan
08-02-2009, 05:49 PM
This year and past years we suck but our lineup would look pretty darn good next year with Dunner in the lineup and with our pitching we'd probably win every game ;)

Mutaman
08-02-2009, 05:56 PM
So yeah, I'd rather watch the Big Donkey hitting bombs while we finish in last place than watch Scott Rolen play good defense at third, provide "veteran leadership" and take up more payroll while we finish last.

What you fail to recognize is that we already know we would finish last with Dunn hitting bombs- we did it for the last 7 years. We don't know what Rolen will add to this team, he just got here. Chances are that when you fill one of your weakest positions with one of the best players in the league at that position, you will improve.

By the way, if Rolen is a .280 hitter now hitting .300 against the likes of the Yankees, the Red Sox, and Tampa Bay how can you call him over the hill?

BurgervilleBuck
08-02-2009, 05:57 PM
To heck with the Big Dumbkey. I miss Klu.

JayBruce
08-02-2009, 06:20 PM
What you fail to recognize is that we already know we would finish last with Dunn hitting bombs- we did it for the last 7 years. We don't know what Rolen will add to this team, he just got here. Chances are that when you fill one of your weakest positions with one of the best players in the league at that position, you will improve.

By the way, if Rolen is a .280 hitter now hitting .300 against the likes of the Yankees, the Red Sox, and Tampa Bay how can you call him over the hill?

Geez, I guess you're right. Most players get BETTER when they enter their mid-30's, especially the ones who have trouble staying healthy.:rolleyes:

The guy has had a career half-season in one category at age 34. Sorry if I'm a little skeptical as to whether he'll keep it up. Although, the odds of him being a .300 hitter for the next 1.5 years are better than the odds of him not having an extended stay on the disabled-list, I'll give you that.

How does adding Scott Rolen, and more specifically adding Scott Rolen's contract to the handful of stupid contract's we're paying un-productive players that take up most of the payroll, improve this team in 2010? Do you really have faith that Walt can make the neccesary moves to improve this team with even less money to play with than he would've had already?

Let's say we had Dunn this season. We finish last, pick up two 1st round draft picks for him, take his money off the books, sign Adrian Beltre for about half of Rolen's price-tag, move Edwin and his 800 OPS bat to LF, and take the money you have left and acquire a SS and another starter, whether it's through a trade or FA signing. I like that hell of a lot more than having Rolen at 3rd and not having anything left in the payroll to add more pieces.

Mutaman
08-02-2009, 06:48 PM
Im obviously not saying Rolen will get better. Im saying that a guy playing like he is, is obviously not "over the hill". If Rolen hits .280 next year and plays great defense, sounds good to me. I'll sign for that right now.

Now let me get this straight, you want Andre Beltre (.259, 5 HR, ) at third base and EE in Left field?? Let's get serious. And for the money we're paying Rolen, you are going to sign Beltre, a quality shortstop and "annother starter"? Want to run that math by me.

GIDP
08-02-2009, 06:56 PM
Id rather sign Beltre and keep the guys we traded with Edwin over Rolen and not having those prospects.

I will be interesting to see how much 3rd baseman sign for in the off season.

Mutaman
08-02-2009, 07:03 PM
Id rather sign Beltre and keep the guys we traded with Edwin over Rolen and not having those prospects.

I will be interesting to see how much 3rd baseman sign for in the off season.


We are not going to win with Beltre at third, EE in left (just think about that, he might be worse than Dunn if thats possible), and Stewart/ Roeneke pitching. On the other hand, with Rolen at third, we might make a good start to changing things around. At least we know that we have added a serious playmaker which neither Dunn, EE, or Beltre qualify as.

GIDP
08-02-2009, 07:05 PM
I didnt say Edwin in left now did I?

JayBruce
08-02-2009, 07:06 PM
Im obviously not saying Rolen will get better. Im saying that a guy playing like he is, is obviously not "over the hill". If Rolen hits .280 next year and plays great defense, sounds good to me. I'll sign for that right now.

Now let me get this straight, you want Andre Beltre (.259, 5 HR, ) at third base and EE in Left field?? Let's get serious. And for the money we're paying Rolen, you are going to sign Beltre, a quality shortstop and "annother starter"? Want to run that math by me.

Way to skew the statistics to favor your argument RE: Beltre. He's been hurt this year. If healthy, he's probably a .260-.270 hitter with 25+ home runs in GABP. He's also a tremendous defensive third baseman. I'll take Beltre at his price over Rolen at his. Not to mention he's 5 years younger.

Why couldn't EE play left? It's not exactly as difficult as playing third, and his bat is absolutely worth having in the lineup.

JayBruce
08-02-2009, 07:12 PM
We are not going to win with Beltre at third, EE in left (just think about that, he might be worse than Dunn if thats possible), and Stewart/ Roeneke pitching. On the other hand, with Rolen at third, we might make a good start to changing things around. At least we know that we have added a serious playmaker which neither Dunn, EE, or Beltre qualify as.

Okay, so we have a 3rd baseman for 1 more season. How do you go about improving in LF, CF, SS and the starting rotation? Rolen's contract only makes that tougher.

It doesn't really matter, I guess. This team isn't competing any time soon, whether we have Adam in left, or Edwin Encarnacion at 3rd, or Scott Rolen at 3rd or Edwin Encarnacion in left. We're running around in circles here.

LouisvilleCARDS
08-02-2009, 08:13 PM
I miss anyone that isn't a minor league contract spring training signee, called up 4A player, or untradeable dead weight.

We suck, period. And those complaining about Rolen's contract, at least he's a legit player. People act as if the management is suddenly going to make a good free agent signing with any money left over in the offseason. This is the same organization who's "big" offseason signings over some of the past several years include Willy Taveras, Eric Milton, Mike Stanton, and John Vander Wal. We don't have ownership competent enough to sign anyone for one, and number two, no one wants to sign with this craphole.

sivman17
08-03-2009, 02:45 AM
you guys DO realize that while dunn was here no one appreciated him and we all wanted him gone. and that was for a reason. he batted sub .250, hit only solo HR when the game was already over, and was simply the worst fielder in the league. yeah, he's having a career season in Wash, but that doesn't mean he would have done that here. no one wanted him while he was here, so quit acting like you want him back. he was no good, he is no good, we don't need him, we don't need his salary, and without a doubt i'd rather have nix/gomes, or even gomes by himself, esp with the salary difference

JayBruce
08-03-2009, 11:31 AM
you guys DO realize that while dunn was here no one appreciated him and we all wanted him gone. and that was for a reason. he batted sub .250, hit only solo HR when the game was already over, and was simply the worst fielder in the league. yeah, he's having a career season in Wash, but that doesn't mean he would have done that here. no one wanted him while he was here, so quit acting like you want him back. he was no good, he is no good, we don't need him, we don't need his salary, and without a doubt i'd rather have nix/gomes, or even gomes by himself, esp with the salary difference

Yeah, who needs 40 home runs, 100 RBI's and 100 runs scored every year? He STUNK!!!

:rolleyes:

He wasn't a good fit in the long-run for this franchise, but please don't act like he was some worthless AAAA player like Gomes.

BuckeyeRed27
08-03-2009, 02:07 PM
Part of this teams problem is that they don't have enough home run threats and it is very hard to come back when we get behind. Adam Dunn would help this team in that area. Having a legimate home run threat in any line up makes the whole team better.

mroby85
08-03-2009, 02:27 PM
I don't really miss Dunn, but this teams outfield absolutely sucks! Doesn't mean I want Dunn back, but i'd prefer some major league talent out there instead of Gomes/Taveras/Nix, which is absolutely pathetic.

I think they should go for a LF power bat in the offseason, and go with a LF Bat/Dickerson/Bruce outfield.

that along with a Rolen/new SS/ Phillips/Votto/Hanigan infield could be very competitive.

sivman17
08-03-2009, 03:09 PM
i love how in the off-season they acted like this team was going to be great at small ball. willy would get 70 sbs, we would hit and run, sacrifice, run and hit, all those things. obviously we are terrible at small ball. we have had to rely on the long ball this year just as much as we had the previous 8 years. the only problem is that we don't hit home runs.

gilpdawg
08-03-2009, 05:04 PM
who needs dunn when you have nix?
I hope that's sarcasm. Nix is a 4th or 5th outfielder at best. He will never be a regular on a playoff team. His OBP is almost as bad as Willy T now.

FlyerFanatic
08-03-2009, 05:05 PM
I hope that's sarcasm. Nix is a 4th or 5th outfielder at best. He will never be a regular on a playoff team. His OBP is almost as bad as Willy T now.

haha of course it was sarcasm, nix is trash. needs to be let go, as does rosales, gonzo, taveras, all have no business being in the majors

gilpdawg
08-03-2009, 05:06 PM
you guys DO realize that while dunn was here no one appreciated him and we all wanted him gone.
Because those people aren't smart.

Ghosts of 1990
08-03-2009, 06:37 PM
Always have, always will. He's gonna continue to carve out a Hall of Fame career for himself while we continue to be a 5th and 6th place organization. He's the last guy in almost a decade to come through this system and really become something as a Red and we let him walk when all he wanted was a fair offer...... typical Reds.

Mutaman
08-03-2009, 07:51 PM
Adam Dunn has as much chance of getting to the Hall of Fame as I do.

BuckeyeRed27
08-03-2009, 08:03 PM
Adam Dunn has as much chance of getting to the Hall of Fame as I do.

Are you going to hit 500 or even perhaps 600 home runs too?

Mutaman
08-03-2009, 09:03 PM
Are you going to hit 500 or even perhaps 600 home runs too?

Nope. And like Adam, I'll probably never play on a winning ballclub.

gilpdawg
08-03-2009, 10:47 PM
Nope. And like Adam, I'll probably never play on a winning ballclub.

Because one guy can make a difference. :rolleyes: Pujols could be on the Nats and they would still suck.

Mutaman
08-03-2009, 10:57 PM
Because one guy can make a difference. :rolleyes: Pujols could be on the Nats and they would still suck.

Of course you're right. But I suspect that if Pujols or any big time money player had been on the Reds in August/September 2006, they would have done what was necessary to keep the team in contention. A good player would have risen to the occasion. Remember how Adam performed during that period. It was pretty dismal. You don't win with one dimensional ballplayers.

Shawn_RedsFan
08-03-2009, 11:35 PM
Of course you're right. But I suspect that if Pujols or any big time money player had been on the Reds in August/September 2006, they would have done what was necessary to keep the team in contention. A good player would have risen to the occasion. Remember how Adam performed during that period. It was pretty dismal. You don't win with one dimensional ballplayers.

Adam Dunn isnt a type the type of player your offense relies on....if Adam Dunn was on this team Joey Votto would still be our Offensive MVP, Dunn just plays a supporting role

GIDP
08-03-2009, 11:41 PM
Adam Dunn isnt a type the type of player your offense relies on....if Adam Dunn was on this team Joey Votto would still be our Offensive MVP, Dunn just plays a supporting role

I kinda feel the same way. Dunn doesnt seem to have very many ways to beat you. He has great power, and has a pretty decent eye, but as much as people will probably get on me for this he just doesnt get enough hits to be "THE" guy for a ball club. If I had a bigger payroll id jump to have him on my roster and being the 2nd or 3rd bat on the team every day all year long. He brings something to the table that is hard to replace and thats decently consistant numbers yearly, but like I said I dont know if the teams like the Reds can be successful with him being the main guy.

Shawn_RedsFan
08-03-2009, 11:43 PM
I kinda feel the same way. Dunn doesnt seem to have very many ways to beat you. He has great power, and has a pretty decent eye, but as much as people will probably get on me for this he just doesnt get enough hits to be "THE" guy for a ball club. If I had a bigger payroll id jump to have him on my roster and being the 2nd or 3rd bat on the team every day all year long. He brings something to the table that is hard to replace and thats decently consistant numbers yearly, but like I said I dont know if the teams like the Reds can be successful with him being the main guy.

Yep these 4 guys would work together pretty well IMO

No order:
DUNN
BP
VOTTO
BRUCE

GIDP
08-03-2009, 11:47 PM
Dunn for 10 million? Sign me up. Dunn for the 16 or what ever we were paying him no thanks.

sivman17
08-04-2009, 03:48 AM
dunn hit solo home runs. he hit them when we were losing 9-2, or 7-1, or 8-0, or 5-0, or if we were winning 8-1, 9-0, 7-1. he didn't hit meaningful home runs. he struck out over 170 times a season. he hits 40 home runs a season, big deal. please quit talking about him.

CySeymour
08-04-2009, 09:57 AM
he didn't hit meaningful home runs.

Bob Wickman would beg to differ with you...

bounty37h
08-04-2009, 11:13 AM
With the Reds being the worst offense in all of baseball and needing high OBP guys and RBI producers how bad are they missing Adam Dunn's bat? Dunn is having a career year in Washington and would of helped this team in huge way this season! Yeah his D is awful but who wouldn't take his defense for the offensive numbers he's putting up this season? Heres his stats this year.

BA 275, R 51, HR 26, RBI 75, OBP 404, OPS 954.

How can you miss one donkey with all the jackazzes we have around here.

CySeymour
08-04-2009, 11:18 AM
How can you miss one donkey with all the jackazzes we have around here.

ha hahahahahahahahah Can't argue with this.

bounty37h
08-04-2009, 11:38 AM
Part of this teams problem is that they don't have enough home run threats and it is very hard to come back when we get behind. Adam Dunn would help this team in that area. Having a legimate home run threat in any line up makes the whole team better.

Part of this teams problem is both they are behind too often, and dont have any offense of any kind.