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View Full Version : When does the Dusty Baker Era end in Cincinnati?



Caveat Emperor
08-04-2009, 12:22 PM
When will the Dusty Baker era end in Cincinnati? Not a lot of managers survive this kind of freefall, especially after playing .500 ball most of the season.

Vote and discuss.

fearofpopvol1
08-04-2009, 12:26 PM
Too tough to answer.

If BCast/Walt can grab LaRussa/Duncan, Dusty will be jettisoned in the offseason. If not, he will complete his contract.

Homer Bailey
08-04-2009, 12:26 PM
I would love if it ended yesterday, but I think he'll make it to next year, and when the Reds are out of it at the break, he'll get the can.

BRM
08-04-2009, 12:27 PM
He'll be there until mid 2010 at the earliest. He won't be fired any sooner.

Raisor
08-04-2009, 12:29 PM
Five year extension is coming.

George Anderson
08-04-2009, 12:30 PM
Too tough to answer.

If BCast/Walt can grab LaRussa/Duncan, Dusty will be jettisoned in the offseason. If not, he will complete his contract.

I agree but unless BCast is going to throw tons of Benjamins at LaRussa and Duncan I see no way in hell they would ever wanna come to Cincy.

Dusty stays till mid 2010 simply because of his contract.

Ltlabner
08-04-2009, 12:31 PM
He'll be here until the bitter end. He's a named manager and currently Bobby has no other options.

That said, if Tony LaBrilliant becomes available Dusty's could be on thin ice.

paulrichjr
08-04-2009, 12:33 PM
Too tough to answer.

If BCast/Walt can grab LaRussa/Duncan, Dusty will be jettisoned in the offseason. If not, he will complete his contract.

Not going to happen. LaRussa and Rolen don't mix.

savafan
08-04-2009, 12:34 PM
You know, Bobby Valentine is leaving Japan after this season. He's a guy I could see having success in Cincinnati.

To answer the poll question, not soon enough.

HokieRed
08-04-2009, 12:40 PM
Replaced at the end of his contract by a player manager?

Roy Tucker
08-04-2009, 12:41 PM
I think he's here through 2010.

Unless he resigns. I don't think managing a team like this is what he signed up for.

Tom Servo
08-04-2009, 12:41 PM
Replaced at the end of his contract by a player manager?
Willy?

savafan
08-04-2009, 12:42 PM
Replaced at the end of his contract by a player manager?

It would have to be a player not already on this roster.

BRM
08-04-2009, 12:43 PM
Willy?

Corky

Unassisted
08-04-2009, 12:45 PM
Replaced at the end of his contract by a player manager?
It would have to be a player not already on this roster.

I saw some speculation elsewhere that Rolen might be a good choice for this scenario.

Back to the topic. I say Castellini gets his fill of Dusty in mid-2010.

OnBaseMachine
08-04-2009, 12:45 PM
He'll complete his contract. This mess isn't his fault but he deserves some of the blame though.

cumberlandreds
08-04-2009, 12:49 PM
He'll get somewhat of a pass on this season because of all the injuries. He'll get the dreaded vote of confidence over the Winter and probably be fired by the July 4th 2010.

HokieRed
08-04-2009, 12:52 PM
It would have to be a player not already on this roster.

How about a player who's just come to this roster?

Chip R
08-04-2009, 02:03 PM
I was never a huge fan of Dusty being the manager but I'm not sure any available manager out there would have better results. Most managers are going to bat Taveras leadoff. Maybe some would bat Hanigan higher but is that going to make a 180 degree turnaround? When the starters pitch well they pitch just well enough to lose. Bruce is injured and when he wasn't he wasn't producing. Brandon Phillips is miscast as a cleanup hitter. But even if he were moved from that spot, would it be that much different? Maybe if LaRussa were the manager and Duncan the pitching coach, things would be different. But they aren't so it's going to be status quo no matter who makes out the lineup card.

oneupper
08-04-2009, 02:11 PM
I think he's here through 2010.

Unless he resigns. I don't think managing a team like this is what he signed up for.

He won't resign. No one gives up $3.5 million just like that. Dusty did not make that kind of money as a player or analyst and at 60 he needs to pad the retirement fund.

oneupper
08-04-2009, 02:13 PM
The option I was looking for was "not soon enough".

RichRed
08-04-2009, 02:19 PM
I think he'll be gone this offseason, a copy of his pink slip going in the "Losing Stops Now" file folder in Bobby C.'s office.

KronoRed
08-04-2009, 05:00 PM
The Reds won't fire him for a variety of reasons, he's hear until the end of 2010.

M2
08-04-2009, 06:02 PM
When did it begin?

Unassisted
08-04-2009, 06:08 PM
When did it begin?It's too bad it couldn't be as short as the Vern Rapp Era, although that one felt like it was longer. ;)

Highlifeman21
08-04-2009, 06:18 PM
He's gonna get canned in June of 2010 when this team continues to disappoint, and is below .500, and probably 10 games out of 1st place

redsmetz
08-04-2009, 06:34 PM
I don't think they'll fire Dusty. Frankly, as was noted, we've had no stability there and while many here have opined for his firing from day one, I don't see how all of the blame for this season can lay at his feet. This has been as tough an injury year as I've ever seen any club have. We couldn't even get Scott Rolen out of the gate without being "day to day" from getting beaned.

Reds4Life
08-04-2009, 06:37 PM
He'll complete his contract. Only way he doesn't is if LaRussa wants the job, which I doubt he does.

Raisor
08-04-2009, 07:19 PM
By the way, I was 100% serious up thread. He'll be extended. Maybe not five years, but he'll be extended.

RED VAN HOT
08-04-2009, 07:46 PM
I am surprised by the number of people who believe he will at least begin next season. I think Dusty would be great with a veteran club. I suspect that veterans appreciate that Dusty trusts them to know what to do. Unfortunately, this club needs active intervention. Admittedly, injuries have been a big part of the collapse. Still, he has not been able to do anything to turn the club around. The Reds continue to have bad at bats in crucial situations.

I think the Reds will start some new players next year and will want to put the last two years behind them....kind of like drawing a fence on your bowling score sheet to keep the open frames from carrying forward. To me, that means new coaches and... a new manager. Regrettably, next year does not shape up as a strong year. The Reds don't have much payroll flexibility. Next year will have to be the .500 year we hoped to have this year.

KoryMac5
08-04-2009, 07:53 PM
Not going to happen. LaRussa and Rolen don't mix.

Plus if you factor that in with the fact that he would be switching from Prince Albert and Matt Holliday to Willy Taveras and Adam Rosales. It becomes pretty easy to stay with the Cards.

Redlegs
08-04-2009, 07:59 PM
Dusty shouldn't take the fall for this team's demise. Votto misses extended period of time. Same for Bruce, Encarnarcion and Gonzalez. The team's all-star pitcher from a year ago; out. Harang hasn't pitched the way we expected. They didn't get him a left fielder. The signing of Tavares has been a flop.

These things aren't the fault of the manager.

KronoRed
08-04-2009, 09:13 PM
By the way, I was 100% serious up thread. He'll be extended. Maybe not five years, but he'll be extended.

I can see it, 1 or 2 games over .500 in June of next year and bam a 4 year extension.

Raisor
08-04-2009, 09:15 PM
I can see it, 1 or 2 games over .500 in June of next year and bam a 4 year extension.

Just because I'm paranoid, doesn't mean that they aren't out to get me.

M2
08-04-2009, 09:45 PM
I can see it, 1 or 2 games over .500 in June of next year and bam a 4 year extension.

Are you kidding? Dusty can't be expected to manage next season without an extension in hand. It would undermine his authority. He'll be extended this winter.

Raisor
08-04-2009, 09:46 PM
Are you kidding? Dusty can't be expected to manage next season without an extension in hand. It would undermine his authority. He'll be extended this winter.

that's exactly what I think is going to happen.

nate
08-04-2009, 09:47 PM
If that's the case, we're gonna need a lot of Mylanta.

KronoRed
08-04-2009, 10:01 PM
Are you kidding? Dusty can't be expected to manage next season without an extension in hand. It would undermine his authority. He'll be extended this winter.

At this point they may extend him the next time they win a game, such a feat it will be.

fearofpopvol1
08-05-2009, 12:34 AM
I agree but unless BCast is going to throw tons of Benjamins at LaRussa and Duncan I see no way in hell they would ever wanna come to Cincy.

Dusty stays till mid 2010 simply because of his contract.

I think one thing is true about bcast...if it's a guy or a player he really wants or likes, he'll pay for it. i think he would make that payment to those guys.

fearofpopvol1
08-05-2009, 12:35 AM
Not going to happen. LaRussa and Rolen don't mix.

I don't think it'll be Rolen's choice. And I think they'll put that past scuffle behind them.

WVRedsFan
08-05-2009, 01:46 AM
Dusty will be given the benefit of the doubt and be able to live out his contract. This year's injuries to Bruce, Hernandez, Volquez, Encarnacion, Votto's problems, and the total lack of any hitting from Gonzalez and Taveras will be taken into consideration. He'll be given 2010 to redeem himself, and if he does not, he's gone.

Topcat
08-05-2009, 05:57 AM
Not soon enough. I was against him from the start and will always be. To set in his ways and his in game management and lineup construction is awful.

bucksfan2
08-05-2009, 08:25 AM
Firing ol Dusty right now doesn't make sense to me. Normally a team experiences a bounce when a manager is fired, why do it now when the bounce won't mean anything. I can foresee Jocketty firing Dusty at some point before June next year. The one problem you will still have is Dick Pole as the pitching coach.

Kc61
08-05-2009, 08:42 AM
I like Dusty and hope he stays and gets a chance with a healthier team with some reinforcements by acquisition.

But I have always felt that ownership cannot sit idly by when a pro sports team collapses like this. This isn't a normal losing streak, this is a collapse which is due to injuries but also to structural deficiencies on the ballclub.

In particular, there are too many OBP challenged hitters on the team, too few baserunners, too few scoring opportunities. The batting order needs to emphasize OBP skills more than it does and Phillips needs to start hitting in a different spot in the lineup. Cueto and Harang, the TOR starters, have slipped badly. Watching these games -- to the extent anyone can watch them -- just repeatedly points up these issues.

The Reds need to focus intently on these things. They can't just chalk this losing streak up to injuries or bad luck. There are structural issues with the ballclub and they have contributed, with injuries, to this slump.

The Reds can learn from this and fix the team. They can try to fix any hidden issues of which fans aren't aware. Or it can just say all teams have slumps and go forward as usual.

This isn't a slump, it's a complete collapse and it should be a serious matter for ownership. I doubt that they fire Baker but they need to focus intently on their ballclub.

Roy Tucker
08-05-2009, 08:46 AM
My rational brain says he's here at least through next season unless he wants to leave.

But I'm starting to wonder. This current losing skein is getting some momentum. Losing 13 out of 14 is pretty bad. The Reds are headed out to SF where they have never done well. And then to St. Louis.

They come home having lost 19 out of 20, it may absolutely require a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody's part. Dusty's head may be that.

Kc61
08-05-2009, 08:54 AM
My rational brain says he's here at least through next season unless he wants to leave.

But I'm starting to wonder. This current losing skein is getting some momentum. Losing 13 out of 14 is pretty bad. The Reds are headed out to SF where they have never done well. And then to St. Louis.

They come home having lost 19 out of 20, it may absolutely require a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody's part. Dusty's head may be that.

I get the Animal House reference. Something does have to happen, even if it's just somebody taking a fresh and honest look at the flaws on the team.

I just hope the Reds don't give this "slump" a pass and say, well, there were injuries. The flaws in the ballclub are very evident for anyone who is really paying attention and being honest about it.

bucksfan2
08-05-2009, 09:01 AM
My rational brain says he's here at least through next season unless he wants to leave.

But I'm starting to wonder. This current losing skein is getting some momentum. Losing 13 out of 14 is pretty bad. The Reds are headed out to SF where they have never done well. And then to St. Louis.

They come home having lost 19 out of 20, it may absolutely require a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody's part. Dusty's head may be that.

IMO the bigger issue is that in all likelihood this will be the team that starts opening day 2010. With the exception of Scott Rolen, no one on this team has experienced winning at the major league level. This team needs to learn to play through adversity, play hard when things aren't going right, needs to learn how to win games. This team needs some form of success going down the stretch of the season to have a bounce into 2010.

This season is lost, 2010 isn't. Dusty needs to get his team together and get them playing better baseball.

Unassisted
08-05-2009, 09:42 AM
Are you kidding? Dusty can't be expected to manage next season without an extension in hand. It would undermine his authority. He'll be extended this winter.I agree completely that he'll ask for an extension. I'm not at all convinced that Walt and Bob will grant it.

LincolnparkRed
08-05-2009, 09:51 AM
I agree completely that he'll ask for an extension. I'm not at all convinced that Walt and Bob will grant it.

that is his MO, he started the extension talk in 2005 with the Cubs because he knew he was a lame duck manager in 2006, they didn't expect the train wreck that got him canned though

BRM
08-05-2009, 06:13 PM
Per Fay:


Reds CEO Bob Castellini said that manager Dusty Baker’s job is "absolutelyl" safe for the rest of the year, and that Baker will return for 2010. That's the final year of Baker's contract.

“Absolutely,” Castellini said.

The Reds have lost eight straight games and 14 of 15. They are tied for last place in the NL Central 12 1/2 games out.

But Castellini says the team has not quit.

“They are still playing hard,” he said

The Reds have had a spate of injuries to key players.

“That’s an easy cop-out,” Castellini said of the injuries. “We’ve had a lot of injuries. Things have not gone our way.”

Castellini spent some time on the field Wednesday talking to Cubs general manager Jim Hendry.

“They lost eight in a row at one point,” Castellini said. “Look at where they are now. We’re going to turn this thing around.”

M2
08-05-2009, 06:20 PM
"We’re going to turn this thing around.”

Of course the Reds specialize in the 360s, not 180s.

BRM
08-05-2009, 06:26 PM
Does spinning in circles count as turning it around? And it's only fitting that on the very day Bob gives Dusty a big vote of confidence, he pencils in the absolute worst 1-2 combo in all of baseball. As usual.

Always Red
08-05-2009, 06:27 PM
uh-oh

the dreaded "vote of confidence"

KronoRed
08-05-2009, 06:51 PM
Are we going to be hearing "we're turning this around" in the last week of September?

TheNext44
08-05-2009, 06:52 PM
Per Fay:

Awesome. Most votes of confidences I have seen are quickly followed by a pink slip. :pray:

cincyinco
08-07-2009, 03:14 AM
Cast gave dusty the kiss of death! We've seen the acknowledged public vote of confidence for others before, shortly followed by their release.

The don has spoken.