Phillips for Kendrick and Wood???

[Spitball]

Or if the Angels see Wood as a replacement for Figgins, substitute Izturis in there...anyway, the Reds unload some dollars and add some offense at shortstop. Kendrick seems to have fallen out of favor with the Angels but could blossom into an offensive threat in the NL and in GABP. Would Kendrick at second and Wood/Izturis at short would be an improvement over Phillips and Janish at short?

The Angels might be willing to add a Phillips and his contract in order to take a step toward improving their elite team. The Reds could benefit from reducing payroll at second and adding depth/offense at short.

[Mario-Rijo]

Or if the Angels see Wood as a replacement for Figgins, substitute Izturis in there...anyway, the Reds unload some dollars and add some offense at shortstop. Kendrick seems to have fallen out of favor with the Angels but could blossom into an offensive threat in the NL and in GABP. Would Kendrick at second and Wood/Izturis at short would be an improvement over Phillips and Janish at short?

The Angels might be willing to add a Phillips and his contract in order to take a step toward improving their elite team. The Reds could benefit from reducing payroll at second and adding depth/offense at short.

I actually thought of this same thing (Kendrick and Izturis) a few weeks back. Don't know if LAA would be interested but it would be a way to improve a little overall and save some dollars in the short term. Wood I just have no interest in I think he's likely a bust. I think Francisco would also interest them to some extent. In fact we match up so well with LAA in so many ways it would be in our best interest to explore that further.

Izturis SS
Kendrick 2B
Votto 1B
Bruce RF
??? LF
Rolen 3B
Dickerson/Stubbs CF
Hanigan C

A much more consistent offense and fluid lineup with no completely incompetent performers. Would the money saved allow us to pursue a big bat (Dye) to bat 5th if so it's a brilliant move.

[mth123]

Kendrick is a downgrade from Phillips and Izturis is a one year rental. I prefer the Cordero for Fuentes and Izturis or Wood idea.

[Mario-Rijo]

Kendrick is a downgrade from Phillips and Izturis is a one year rental. I prefer the Cordero for Fuentes and Izturis or Wood idea.

Fuentes isn't a downgrade from Cordero? Either way we go we are getting a lesser productive player. At least with a Phillips for Izturis and Kendrick deal we save so much more that we may have enough to afford that big bat in LF.

[Spitball]

Kendrick is a downgrade from Phillips and Izturis is a one year rental. I prefer the Cordero for Fuentes and Izturis or Wood idea.

Defensively, Kendrick is a downgrade. Offensively, he has great potential. Monetarilry, he is very affordable at this point. Overall, he is a worthy gamble.

Izturis is a free agent after next year, but why would he necessarily be priced out of Cincinnati? Would he command greater than Phillips-type money?

[Mario-Rijo]

Defensively, Kendrick is a downgrade. Offensively, he has great potential. Monetarilry, he is very affordable at this point. Overall, he is a worthy gamble.

Izturis is a free agent after next year, but why would he necessarily be priced out of Cincinnati? Would he command greater than Phillips-type money?

Absolutely not but he would cost more than most would probably care to pay him due to his position. I'm guessing here but I'm sure if he did well after a full season he could get somewhere in the 5 million per for 3 years or more range. Not a whole lot but he'll be 30 and he's not "special enough" in any one area where many would want to pay him. He'll keep you well above replacement level in every aspect but he's not the type of guy who you'd want to commit a lot of money too.

[Guacarock]

I also prefer swinging a deal around Cordero-Fuentes that could be expanded to net us Izturis at SS. Why I would "key" it around closers instead of second basemen?

1. We've got many potential closer candidates knocking at the door (Masset, Burton, Bray, Ondrusek, Del Rosario), but no obvious heir apparents to succeed Phillips, or Kendrick for that matter, at 2B.

2. Reports suggest the Angels are looking to upgrade at closer and have begun to focus on that as an off-season priority, so if we want to swing a deal, we best be talking their language.

3. For a small-market team that hasn't made the playoffs in a decade, we're allocating too great a share of our limited resources for a closer. Cordero is among the elite closers working today. He's highly valuable to us, but potentially far more valuable to a team like the Angels. While we would take an undeniable hit giving up Cordero for Fuentes, that's a sacrifice we can endure if the return includes Izturis. He's not only a legitimate lead-off threat, but also a better all-around SS than the parade of talents -- Gonzalez, Hairston, Janish, Keppinger, Rosales, Sutton -- we've seen the past two years.

Yes, Izturis would only be a one-year rental, but if his play warrants it, we can pony up what it will take to keep him in the fold for 2011. There's a level of uncertainty attached to that, but there are also worse scenarios -- like plugging Patterson, Taveras or Hairston atop the order and thinking we had our offense set as far as fielding credible tablesetters.

Our bullpen is a strength, we have a solid if not stunning rotation, we have coalescing offensive power, but our tablesetters still seem to have trouble getting to first base. Time to rob Peter to pay Paul.

[mth123]

Fuentes isn't a downgrade from Cordero? Either way we go we are getting a lesser productive player. At least with a Phillips for Izturis and Kendrick deal we save so much more that we may have enough to afford that big bat in LF.

Fuentes is a downgrade, but moving Cordero's contract to upgrade the position player side is a step in the right direction. Not sure how much it helps to downgrade 2B to upgrade SS for one year. Both Phillips and Janish are better defensively than Kendrick and Izturis. Downgrading to adequate on defense is fine when its turning an overall hole into a contributing spot like the the Izturis/Janish switch would be, but I don't like the idea of dealing off Phillips for Kendrick. It weakens the positional side. Phillips plays every day and is an elite defender with power while Kendrick hasn't had a season topping 400 PAs. The offense is similar though I think Kendrick might end up outproducing Phillips in GABP, but Kendrick is only 2 years younger and is heading to the point in his career where his cost will also soar with arbitration. I do think that dealing Phillips contract might be something that the team will want to do at some point, but I don't get it when the primary return is an offense first guy at 2B who doesn't put up elite production and doesn't play every day. I'd need to know a bit more about Kendrick's defense, but my impression is that he's a Todd Walker type who can hit with a decent (but not great) OPS in the .750 to .825 range, but is only adequate at best at 2B. It seems the Reds already have a couple of those in Sutton, Frazier and Valaika. Why deal Phillips for one when the only kicker is one year of Izturis? If Kendrick is a better defender than that, I might be willing to re-think, but I don't really like the Todd Walker type at 2B. I think its still a defense first position. The trick is to get a defender who can hit a little like the Reds already have.

As for the money, there is some decent savings in 2011 and 2012, but in 2010, Phillips is signed for $6.75 Million while Kendrick will make $2 to $3 Million in Arbitration. The difference will pay for Izturis and little else, which is similar to what the difference between Cordero and Fuentes will provide.

[Dom Heffner]

Kendrick has an OBP .002 points higher than his batting average. He never met a pitch he didn't like.

[nate]

Kendrick has an OBP .002 points higher than his batting average. He never met a pitch he didn't like.

Brandon Phillips isn't exactly selective up there.

It's a pretty interesting comparison:

Kendrick

Year Age Tm Lg G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS OPS+ TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB Pos Awards
2006 22 LAA AL 72 283 267 25 76 21 1 4 30 6 0 9 44 .285 .314 .416 .730 87 111 5 4 0 3 2 34/D5
2007 23 LAA AL 88 353 338 55 109 24 2 5 39 5 4 9 61 .322 .347 .450 .796 108 152 15 4 1 1 2 4/D
2008 24 LAA AL 92 361 340 43 104 26 2 3 37 11 4 12 58 .306 .333 .421 .754 97 143 8 4 1 4 3 4
2009 25 LAA AL 105 400 374 61 109 21 3 10 61 11 4 20 71 .291 .334 .444 .778 100 166 8 4 2 0 1 4/D
4 Seasons 4 Seasons 4 Seasons 4 Seasons 357 1397 1319 184 398 92 8 22 167 33 12 50 234 .302 .333 .434 .767 99 572 36 16 4 8 8
162 Game Avg. 162 Game Avg. 162 Game Avg. 162 Game Avg. 162 634 599 83 181 42 4 10 76 15 5 23 106 .302 .333 .434 .767 99 260 16 7 2 4 4
Phillips

Year Age Tm Lg G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS OPS+ TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB Pos Awards
2002 21 CLE AL 11 36 31 5 8 3 1 0 4 0 0 3 6 .258 .343 .419 .762 105 13 0 1 1 0 0 4
2003 22 CLE AL 112 393 370 36 77 18 1 6 33 4 5 14 77 .208 .242 .311 .553 48 115 12 3 5 1 0 *4
2004 23 CLE AL 6 24 22 1 4 2 0 0 1 0 2 2 5 .182 .250 .273 .523 40 6 1 0 0 0 0 /4
2005 24 CLE AL 6 9 9 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 .000 .000 .000 .000 -100 0 0 0 0 0 0 /4D6
2006 25 CIN NL 149 587 536 65 148 28 1 17 75 25 2 35 88 .276 .324 .427 .751 88 229 19 6 4 6 3 *4/6
2007 26 CIN NL 158 702 650 107 187 26 6 30 94 32 8 33 109 .288 .331 .485 .816 105 315 26 12 2 5 4 *4/6 MVP-22
2008 27 CIN NL 141 609 559 80 146 24 7 21 78 23 10 39 93 .261 .312 .442 .754 92 247 13 5 0 6 6 *4 GG
2009 28 CIN NL 153 644 584 78 161 30 5 20 98 25 9 44 75 .276 .329 .447 .776 100 261 21 6 2 8 3 *4
8 Seasons 8 Seasons 8 Seasons 8 Seasons 736 3004 2761 373 731 131 21 94 383 109 36 170 457 .265 .312 .430 .742 89 1186 92 33 14 26 16
162 Game Avg. 162 Game Avg. 162 Game Avg. 162 Game Avg. 162 661 608 82 161 29 5 21 84 24 8 37 101 .265 .312 .430 .742 89 261 20 7 3 6 4
Kendrick seems to make more contact and hit for more power than BP. He'd probably hit for even more power at GABP. Kendrick's never gotten a full season of ABs and his glove isn't going to be as good as BP's so those are chances one takes. However, I'm guessing he's still "cheap" for a couple of years and would be productive for the Reds "as-is."

For me, it's a lot more enticing than I thought it would be at first glance, especially if it can also solve for SS.

[Scrap Irony]

If it solves SS for 2010, the drop-off between Kendrick and Phillips is negligible. The problem is leather, in that Phillips flashes a gold glove and Kendrick's is more of the garden variety. Izturis plays about the same as well and isn't getting any younger.

Both are more willing to take a walk and have good contact bats, which should translate well to Cincinnati's home park. But, with Figgins a free agent, I doubt the Angels would make this move unless they're sold on Wood at SS (which doesn't appear to be the case) or want someone else for that position.

[Guacarock]

The Angels are covered at SS with Aybar, but a departure by free-agent Figgins would leave them short-handed at 3B. Wood can play either SS or 3B, but if he can't get his MLB batting average above the Mendoza Line, he'll wash out soon enough.

[Mario-Rijo]

Fuentes is a downgrade, but moving Cordero's contract to upgrade the position player side is a step in the right direction. Not sure how much it helps to downgrade 2B to upgrade SS for one year. Both Phillips and Janish are better defensively than Kendrick and Izturis. Downgrading to adequate on defense is fine when its turning an overall hole into a contributing spot like the the Izturis/Janish switch would be, but I don't like the idea of dealing off Phillips for Kendrick. It weakens the positional side. Phillips plays every day and is an elite defender with power while Kendrick hasn't had a season topping 400 PAs. The offense is similar though I think Kendrick might end up outproducing Phillips in GABP, but Kendrick is only 2 years younger and is heading to the point in his career where his cost will also soar with arbitration. I do think that dealing Phillips contract might be something that the team will want to do at some point, but I don't get it when the primary return is an offense first guy at 2B who doesn't put up elite production and doesn't play every day. I'd need to know a bit more about Kendrick's defense, but my impression is that he's a Todd Walker type who can hit with a decent (but not great) OPS in the .750 to .825 range, but is only adequate at best at 2B. It seems the Reds already have a couple of those in Sutton, Frazier and Valaika. Why deal Phillips for one when the only kicker is one year of Izturis? If Kendrick is a better defender than that, I might be willing to re-think, but I don't really like the Todd Walker type at 2B. I think its still a defense first position. The trick is to get a defender who can hit a little like the Reds already have.

As for the money, there is some decent savings in 2011 and 2012, but in 2010, Phillips is signed for $6.75 Million while Kendrick will make $2 to $3 Million in Arbitration. The difference will pay for Izturis and little else, which is similar to what the difference between Cordero and Fuentes will provide.

Touche' I guess I thought BP's deal jumped up higher than that this coming season. And I agree with you on the whole thing if we have to have mediocre defense there also. I wasn't sure about Kendrick's glove so I took a look at Tango's fan report from the end of last season and he does seem to be rather mediocre there, granted it's just a fans perception but I trust the fans to get in the general neighborhood of ones skills and he doesn't really seem to have much defensive worth.

Tango fan report (http://www.tangotiger.net/scouting/scoutResults2008.html)

[Scrap Irony]

The Angels are covered at SS with Aybar, but a departure by free-agent Figgins would leave them short-handed at 3B. Wood can play either SS or 3B, but if he can't get his MLB batting average above the Mendoza Line, he'll wash out soon enough.

Duh. I meant 2B or 3B (which could open the door for either Frazier or Francisco as an attractive trading chit.