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Degenerate39
11-09-2009, 07:30 AM
Right now the Bengals are a 6-2 and they still have half a season to play. Out of those 8 games they have the Steelers 5-2, the Raiders 2-6,the Browns 1-7, the Lions 1-7, the Vikings 7-1, the Chargers 5-3, the Chiefs 1-7, and the Jets 4-4. So out of those 8 games half them have losing records, one a .500 team, and 3 teams with winning records. They could go 10-6 easily but is that enough to make the wild card?

Boss-Hog
11-09-2009, 08:21 AM
Right now the Bengals are a 6-2 and they still have half a season to play. Out of those 8 games they have the Steelers 5-2, the Raiders 2-6,the Browns 1-7, the Lions 1-7, the Vikings 7-1, the Chargers 5-3, the Chiefs 1-7, and the Jets 4-4. So out of those 8 games half them have losing records, one a .500 team, and 3 teams with winning records. They could go 10-6 easily but is that enough to make the wild card?
In most years, yes. They've set themselves up nicely for a playoff run in the first eight games; now it's a matter of taking care of business on the field in the second half of the season.

Redhook
11-09-2009, 08:27 AM
They have much more than a shot, they're in the driver's seat. 10 wins will get them in, but I believe they'll win 11 or 12.

Redsfan320
11-09-2009, 08:54 AM
Yeah, the Bengals are goin' to the playoffs. But what about the Superbowl.

The Operator
11-09-2009, 09:48 AM
They've got four games they SHOULD win (CLE, OAK, KC, DET) left.

They've got four games they CAN win (Pitt, SD, Minn, NYJ) left.

If they can take care of business in the four games they should win, and just manage to split the other four, that puts them at 12 wins and I can't imagine them not making the playoffs with 12 wins.

I also feel like I should say, I feel way better about this team's chances of making some noise in the playoffs then I did about the 2005 team. The '05 team was good, but I never had any faith in that defense. If the offense faltered, The Bengals couldn't win. That's not the case this year, and it really is exciting to watch a Bengals team that can beat an opponent from both lines of scrimmage.

GIDP
11-09-2009, 09:54 AM
They easily should win 10 games and thats going to get them in the playoffs unless some other team goes nuts here in the 2nd half.

DTCromer
11-09-2009, 11:26 AM
I said before the season that 8-8 would be awful with the schedule they've played. In fact, the schedule's even worse than I imagined.

This team should easily get 12 wins even if they lose to Pittsburgh.

Boss-Hog
11-09-2009, 11:31 AM
I said before the season that 8-8 would be awful with the schedule they've played. In fact, the schedule's even worse than I imagined.

This team should easily get 12 wins even if they lose to Pittsburgh.
How has the schedule been so bad when 7 of the 8 games they've played have teams currently with .500 records or better?

DTCromer
11-09-2009, 12:09 PM
How has the schedule been so bad when 7 of the 8 games they've played have teams currently with .500 records or better?

I said their schedule as a whole isn't very good. I figured the Bengals would split Bmore, beat Cleveland twice and probably get beat twice, at best a split with Pittsburgh.

The only game left on their schedule that I think the Bengals will most definitely lose is SD. They never play well on the left coast and SD is a bad matchup for them IMO.

Tony Cloninger
11-09-2009, 12:37 PM
IF they can avoid doing the stupid mistakes that teams seem to make when they play Pittsburgh...and I guess that is more a credit to the way the Steelers rise up when they need to and make the big play.. BUT i also blame the other team (like the Vikings) for stupidity as well.

Also while everyone loves Chad's fun and games...he is starting to grate on me and makes me start to wonder where his head is at. He seems to be on the border of losing control to me...overdoing it to the point of distraction.

I still worry about more injuries but not much control over that.

I worry that the Cleveland QB will have his usual big game against them beacuse he always seems to no matter how bad he is playing.

I worry that what happened to Cleveland in 07 when they went 10 and 6 ..and missed the playoffs..will happen to them. Heck... 11-5 NE missed the playoffs as well last year.

traderumor
11-09-2009, 12:44 PM
I don't think there is any merit to an argument about the Bengals schedule, esp. with road wins at GB and Baltimore. I don't even see how that enters the conversation at this point. The Bengals seem to have an overall fair schedule that turned out to be front loaded, but that is a function of hindsight as you see how tough a schedule is after the results are in. The NFL's rotation system ensures one of the fairer scheduling systems in professional sports.

As for the playoffs, yesterday was a barometer game for me. The Pittsburgh game next week now becomes icing on the cake. The remaining games that are toss ups are road games at Minny and San Diego.

The thing that makes this team less upset prone is the D, so letdowns against some of the weakest teams should not be an issue.

deltachi8
11-09-2009, 01:05 PM
(As A Steeler fan, I don't want to type this...) The Bengals should win the division. When they stay on their game, they are the most complete team.

WVRed
11-09-2009, 02:26 PM
(As A Steeler fan, I don't want to type this...) The Bengals should win the division. When they stay on their game, they are the most complete team.

The key word is "Should". I hate to say this, and I think anybody who calls themselves a true Bengals fan will back me up 100% on this, it is very difficult for me to get overly excited.

It's like getting together with a new girl after a failed relationship with your ex. You want to become attached but you are afraid of getting hurt or let down again because of what has happened in the past. This may be an extreme analogy, but I think you get the picture.

The game against Denver actually had me believing more of the same was going to happen this season. Houston I believe was a letdown more because I think the players and staff were still in mourning from the loss of Mrs. Zimmer. The funeral followed the Ravens game so I am willing to give the Bengals a pass there.

IMO the Steelers have an easier schedule past the Cincinnati game next week. Two games against the Ravens and one against Green Bay, the rest they should win. A lot depends on whether or not Baltimore does us any favors.

Brutus
11-09-2009, 05:58 PM
The Bengals, in reality, are 3 games ahead of Baltimore, so that helps. Essentially, five of the AFC's playoff spots are likely secured (New England, Indianapolis, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh and Denver). While there is still a lot of football to play, I see these five getting in. Really, it's New York, Houston, San Diego and Baltimore likely fighting over the last spot. Cincinnati is helped by the fact they essentially lead Baltimore by 3 games because of head-to-head and the division record.

I see Cincinnati going 5-3 the rest of the way (losses to Pitt, Minnesota and San Diego). This will put them 11-5, though I do think 10-6 gets them in too.

The good news is that would make them the division winner, assuming Pittsburgh lost at least three games along the way. The bad news is that it might not be enough for a bye.

Hoosier Red
11-09-2009, 06:25 PM
The Bengals, in reality, are 3 games ahead of Baltimore, so that helps. Essentially, five of the AFC's playoff spots are likely secured (New England, Indianapolis, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh and Denver). While there is still a lot of football to play, I see these five getting in. Really, it's New York, Houston, San Diego and Baltimore likely fighting over the last spot. Cincinnati is helped by the fact they essentially lead Baltimore by 3 games because of head-to-head and the division record.

I see Cincinnati going 5-3 the rest of the way (losses to Pitt, Minnesota and San Diego). This will put them 11-5, though I do think 10-6 gets them in too.

The good news is that would make them the division winner, assuming Pittsburgh lost at least three games along the way. The bad news is that it might not be enough for a bye.

The worse news is it probably means playing Pittsburgh in the 3-6 game.

GAC
11-09-2009, 06:41 PM
If Pitt can beat Minnesota, then the Bengals can too IMO. Minnesota's defense is bottom tier.

redsfandan
11-09-2009, 07:13 PM
You may as well start printing playoff tickets if the Bengals beat the Steelers next Sunday. The Bengals are known for late season let downs but I don't think that will happen to this team. The big concern to me is not losing anymore players to serious injuries.

Redsfaithful
11-09-2009, 08:02 PM
I really think they are going to finish 12-4, 11-5 at worst. It's a team that's built for cold weather also, barring injury I think they could go pretty deep in the playoffs.

traderumor
11-09-2009, 08:12 PM
I do not say this in support of anyone, but when there is absolutely no whining about Mike Brown and Marvin Lewis respective idiot status right now tells me all I need to know about those who are complaining in a down year. Not so easy to be a wag right now, I guess.

Mario-Rijo
11-09-2009, 08:36 PM
The Bengals, in reality, are 3 games ahead of Baltimore, so that helps. Essentially, five of the AFC's playoff spots are likely secured (New England, Indianapolis, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh and Denver). While there is still a lot of football to play, I see these five getting in. Really, it's New York, Houston, San Diego and Baltimore likely fighting over the last spot. Cincinnati is helped by the fact they essentially lead Baltimore by 3 games because of head-to-head and the division record.

I see Cincinnati going 5-3 the rest of the way (losses to Pitt, Minnesota and San Diego). This will put them 11-5, though I do think 10-6 gets them in too.

The good news is that would make them the division winner, assuming Pittsburgh lost at least three games along the way. The bad news is that it might not be enough for a bye.


I gotta say I don't know that Denver will make it. I know how absurd that sounds after that torrid 6-0 start and they do have the tie-breaker over us but I think San Diego eventually wins that division. After tonight the Chargers will only be a game back, at least I don't think Denver beats Pittsburgh.

NE
INDY

Pitt
SD
Cincy
???

I'm thinking Jets, Ravens or Broncos, maybe Houston (I consider them the longshot). We better play well hereon out we have already been beat by 2 of those 4 possible playoff teams and have the NYJ's to go. I don't think Denver makes it but I kinda hope they do. If Pitt wins our Division then I think we'd play at S.D. again in the 1st week and then off to probably INDY.

dsmith421
11-09-2009, 08:51 PM
I do not say this in support of anyone, but when there is absolutely no whining about Mike Brown and Marvin Lewis respective idiot status right now tells me all I need to know about those who are complaining in a down year. Not so easy to be a wag right now, I guess.

I love the job he's done motivating the team and game-planning but Lewis's clock management, use of time outs, and on-the-fly thinking in the endgame is no better than it's been in the past. He's been bailed out by a couple of miraculous fourth and long plays that turned the Pittsburgh and Cleveland games (after at least one boneheaded spike decision). I have a really tough time believing this won't bite us in the hindquarters down the road, but so far so good.

As for Mike Brown, there's not really much to complain about at this point. The Bengals had by far their best free agency and draft periods in recent memory. The team has taken proactive measures to court disaffected fans. All of this is a paradigm shift from previous seasons. It appears to me that the old dog has learned a new trick or two. I still think the guy is a complete moron, and these apparent changes don't excuse the prior 18 years of mismanagement, but I'm willing to give credit where credit is due.

KoryMac5
11-09-2009, 09:47 PM
This team is built a little different than some of the old Bengals teams of the last 5-10 yrs. They have some veterans on the team that work hard and come to play, while also having some young hungry kids wanting to make a name for themselves. This mix of players really drives each other and won't let some of the stuff that happened in the past surface this time. Plus this team is really emphasizing what wins games in the playoffs, running the ball and defense.

I think Carson summed it up best yesterday saying that "we expect to win every week and by more than we won today". This team is confident and confident teams are dangerous. Just ask the Patriots or other successful teams, they expect to win every week.

This team is built to go deep into the playoffs. Can you imagine trying to tackle Cedric Benson on a cold December day. Ball control and defense win playoff games. If the Bengals can weather the injury bug this team could go far in the playoffs. I would expect no less than 11 wins, but I also think Pitts will wind up with 12 wins.

It sure is fun talking Bengals football in November. Most of our conversations in the past have centered on who should we draft with the 4th pick.

George Foster
11-10-2009, 01:13 AM
I need someone to answer a question for me. The schedule really favors Pittsburgh. With a win over the Bengals on Sunday, they could run the table. They would have to be favored against the Ravens, Green Bay, and Miami.

We still have to play the Chargers, Jets, and Vikings all on the road...brutal.

My question is if we (the Bengals), have only 1 division loss (Pitt this Sunday),and lets say the Ravens win at home to the Steelers, do we still win the division? Or is it overall record? I don't see the Bengals having a better win-loss record at the end of the season...not with the remaining games that both teams have. Thanks

guttle11
11-10-2009, 01:20 AM
Overall record determines the division. Division record is the first tiebreaker. If the Bengals win they will hold the tiebreaker, same if they lose and Pitt splits with Baltimore. It's a nice little boost to the margin for error. It's a free half game in the standings.

Redsfaithful
11-10-2009, 01:28 AM
Never had a problem with Marvin Lewis.

Mike Brown will have to field a competitive team for quite a few years before I'll give him much credit. It's not impossible that he might have figured things out finally, but I think more likely is that he's stepped back a little behind the scenes.

Something seemed different with this year's draft, I don't remember them ever taking so many players where it seemed fairly clear they were taking the best player available. Seems like they always have a couple of weird reaches, and I've personally always had the feeling those were mostly Mike Brown picks (anyone remember Sean Brewer?).

Redsfaithful
11-10-2009, 01:33 AM
No NFL game is a gimme, and the Bengals are certainly capable of dropping any game they are favored in, but as far as the games where they will be underdogs I see no reason why they couldn't theoretically beat Pittsburgh, Minnesota, and San Diego.

I actually think the game this weekend is the toughest game left on the schedule. Pittsburgh scares me a lot more than a Vikings team that Baltimore would have beat if their kicker wasn't awful.

George Foster
11-10-2009, 01:36 AM
Overall record determines the division. Division record is the first tiebreaker. If the Bengals win they will hold the tiebreaker, same if they lose and Pitt splits with Baltimore. It's a nice little boost to the margin for error. It's a free half game in the standings.

Thanks...but with what you said, I think the Steelers are in the drivers seat for the division. It will be very difficult to beat them at home considering what they just did to Denver and their remaining schedule is pretty weak.

The Operator
11-10-2009, 01:42 AM
I don't put too much stock into Pitt beating up on Denver tonight. Any team with Kyle Orton at QB is bound to come crashing down to Earth at some point. I think SD ends up winning that division.

The Bengals have beat Pitt once already, no reason they can't again. For whatever reason they've actually fared better in Pittsburgh than at home the last few years. The Steelers are tough, but I don't think The Bengals will be intimidated. They aren't the young, scared team they used to be.

George Foster
11-10-2009, 01:52 AM
I don't put too much stock into Pitt beating up on Denver tonight. Any team with Kyle Orton at QB is bound to come crashing down to Earth at some point. I think SD ends up winning that division.

The Bengals have beat Pitt once already, no reason they can't again. For whatever reason they've actually fared better in Pittsburgh than at home the last few years. The Steelers are tough, but I don't think The Bengals will be intimidated. They aren't the young, scared team they used to be.

Don't get me wrong, I want the Bengals to win on Sunday. If they do, dare I say it would be the biggest win since the Ice Bowl win against the Chargers?
I think that was their last playoff win...right? Can you think of a bigger win since then? I can't. This game is huge. We could have a 2 game division lead. Hines Ward getting his jaw wired shut would be icing on the cake on Sunday.

traderumor
11-10-2009, 02:05 AM
Kyle Orton has got to be one of the worst QBs in the NFL. They were completely helpless in the second half, blood in the water with the Steelers playing the role of Jaws.

But what was worse than Orton's QBing was Ron Jaworski's slobbering all over the Steelers. The 2nd Half sounded like an infomercial.

The Operator
11-10-2009, 02:09 AM
Don't get me wrong, I want the Bengals to win on Sunday. If they do, dare I say it would be the biggest win since the Ice Bowl win against the Chargers?
I think that was their last playoff win...right? Can you think of a bigger win since then? I can't. This game is huge. We could have a 2 game division lead. Hines Ward getting his jaw wired shut would be icing on the cake on Sunday.

It would certainly be a big win, that's for sure. And I would absolutely love to see Ward eat grass all day long. Same thing for Big Jen.

macro
11-10-2009, 03:23 AM
Don't get me wrong, I want the Bengals to win on Sunday. If they do, dare I say it would be the biggest win since the Ice Bowl win against the Chargers?
I think that was their last playoff win...right? Can you think of a bigger win since then? I can't. This game is huge. We could have a 2 game division lead. Hines Ward getting his jaw wired shut would be icing on the cake on Sunday.

Are you forgetting the two playoff wins in 1988 that sent them to Super Bowl 23? They also won a first-round playoff game against the Oilers following the 1990 season, their third win over a tough Oiler team that season, and second in consecutive weeks. The actually blew the Oilers out on back-to-back weekends, which was something I wasn't sure they were capable of. They lost in LA against the Raiders the next week in the game that, for all intents and purposes, ended Bo Jackson's NFL career.

As for the tie-breaker, the first one is actually head-to-head record. So if the Bengals lose, they will have split with Pittsburgh, and then division record would be the second tie-breaker. The one after that is either conference record or record against common opponents, I forget which.

The bottom line is, given the schedules the two teams have remaining, this game is more important for the Bengals than it is for the Stealers. As has been mentioned, Pittsburgh's schedule is pretty soft, so if they win and take a one-game lead, it will be tough for the Bengals to overtake them.

If the Bengals do win, they would have what amounts to a two-game lead with seven games to play. They would have a one-game lead in the standings and also the head-to-head tie-breaker in the event of a tie in the standings.

redsfandan
11-10-2009, 08:45 AM
Kyle Orton has got to be one of the worst QBs in the NFL. They were completely helpless in the second half, blood in the water with the Steelers playing the role of Jaws.

Orton is ok if you don't ask for too much. But Denver only had 27 yards rushing vs Pitt and if you include the loss vs the Ravens the week before the Broncos had a combined total of only 93 yards rushing in two games. Give Orton a running game and he has a shot but without one you need a Manning, Brady, Brees, etc.

Btw, thanks Macro. I thought head to head was the 1st tiebreaker.

DTCromer
11-10-2009, 08:52 AM
If you're a Bengals fan, I'd be more worried about playing the following week in Oakland than this Sunday's game vs Pittsburgh.

Eric_the_Red
11-10-2009, 09:03 AM
If you're a Bengals fan, I'd be more worried about playing the following week in Oakland than this Sunday's game vs Pittsburgh.

Why?
Oakland is terrible. Even after flying out to the west coast, the Bengals should win that game if they are (cue Dennis Green) "who we thought they were".

DTCromer
11-10-2009, 09:18 AM
Why?
Oakland is terrible. Even after flying out to the west coast, the Bengals should win that game if they are (cue Dennis Green) "who we thought they were".

Yeah, but after playing your most hated division rival, and you come back and fly all the way out west and try to win in the part of the country that you've had trouble winning at. It's a classic let-down game. Oakland isn't very good, but they're not as terrible as one might think.

Not to mention, the Bengals proved after their last "big" win @ BMore that they're not consistently beating teams they should beat.

traderumor
11-10-2009, 09:54 AM
Yeah, but after playing your most hated division rival, and you come back and fly all the way out west and try to win in the part of the country that you've had trouble winning at. It's a classic let-down game. Oakland isn't very good, but they're not as terrible as one might think.

Not to mention, the Bengals proved after their last "big" win @ BMore that they're not consistently beating teams they should beat.None of the players on this team have any history with the Bengals of West Coast blahs. When the Bengals have lost on the West Coast, it has generally not been an upset. But again, these histories that fans talk about have nothing to do with the current team. Oakland could be a tough game because it is an NFL road game, but these psychological issues you point to are nothing more than conjecture on your part.

As for the game following Baltimore, the Texans are not a slouch. They nearly kept it going last week, losing by a FG at Indy. I wonder if we are watching the same league that you are analyzing, because the facts are barely recognizable in your opinions.

bucksfan2
11-10-2009, 10:08 AM
I still think last weekends win was the biggest of the season. It moves the Bengals to 4-0 in the division, at least 1 game ahead of the Steelers in the division. I don't see the Steelers sweeping the Ravens. The Bengals should finish 5-1 in the division at worst. They also get the Steelers coming off a shot week because of the Monday Night Game.

The difference with the Bengals team as opposed to the ones in the past is the defense. They have the ability to stop you, have the players to hit you in the mouth, they have 2 shut down corners. The thing with defense is that defense travels.

I also don't remember if Rudi ran as hard as Benson does. I can't remember a RB running as hard as Benson since Dillon in his early days. I don't like the match up as much against the Steelers as I did the Ravens. But then again the Bengals have a good shot at winning this game. Hopefully Vegas makes them about a 10 point dog.

Eric_the_Red
11-10-2009, 10:32 AM
I still think last weekends win was the biggest of the season. It moves the Bengals to 4-0 in the division, at least 1 game ahead of the Steelers in the division. I don't see the Steelers sweeping the Ravens. The Bengals should finish 5-1 in the division at worst. They also get the Steelers coming off a shot week because of the Monday Night Game.

The difference with the Bengals team as opposed to the ones in the past is the defense. They have the ability to stop you, have the players to hit you in the mouth, they have 2 shut down corners. The thing with defense is that defense travels.

I also don't remember if Rudi ran as hard as Benson does. I can't remember a RB running as hard as Benson since Dillon in his early days. I don't like the match up as much against the Steelers as I did the Ravens. But then again the Bengals have a good shot at winning this game. Hopefully Vegas makes them about a 10 point dog.

Good point. There was one play near the goal line where Benson ran over Ed Reed. Benson hits defenders hard, which is great to see.

Sea Ray
11-10-2009, 10:44 AM
I don't think there is any merit to an argument about the Bengals schedule, esp. with road wins at GB and Baltimore. I don't even see how that enters the conversation at this point. The Bengals seem to have an overall fair schedule that turned out to be front loaded, but that is a function of hindsight as you see how tough a schedule is after the results are in. The NFL's rotation system ensures one of the fairer scheduling systems in professional sports.

As for the playoffs, yesterday was a barometer game for me. The Pittsburgh game next week now becomes icing on the cake. The remaining games that are toss ups are road games at Minny and San Diego.

The thing that makes this team less upset prone is the D, so letdowns against some of the weakest teams should not be an issue.

The Bengals have had an incredibly hard schedule. Name me any other team that's played more .500 or better teams this year. They still have 3 more against .500 or better and the AFC North is definitely the hardest division in football. That's a lot of tough games.

Sea Ray
11-10-2009, 10:49 AM
Btw, thanks Macro. I thought head to head was the 1st tiebreaker.

Head to head is the first tie breaker. Where's the confusion?

macro
11-10-2009, 01:18 PM
Head to head is the first tie breaker. Where's the confusion?

Someone had said earlier that division record was the first tie-breaker, so I think Dan was just saying that he had believed that it was instead head-to-head, and that my post confirmed that for him.

Mario-Rijo
11-10-2009, 01:36 PM
Kyle Orton has got to be one of the worst QBs in the NFL. They were completely helpless in the second half, blood in the water with the Steelers playing the role of Jaws.

But what was worse than Orton's QBing was Ron Jaworski's slobbering all over the Steelers. The 2nd Half sounded like an infomercial.

He's Kitna-esque. Just like Kitna in the playoff game vs. the Steelers (and any and all other games) they knew they could condense the field because of his lack of strong downfield arm. Once they do that you have to be razor sharp on your reads and accuracy. Even harder to do with any kind of blitz in your face.

And you must have missed the 1st half where he was slobbering all over the Broncos just like 3/4 of the ESPN panel. I was laughing at the fact the ESPN crew is supposed to have some degree of intelligence/insight yet only Keyshawn, Chris Carter and Ditka picked the Steelers and Carter acted a bit unsure about it. I was like really? I fully expected this to happen. What they don't know is if Carson and company hadn't been trying to get their feet under them we'd have blown Denver's doors off too which means Denver is who I thought they were, nobody.

GIDP
11-10-2009, 01:45 PM
Someone had said earlier that division record was the first tie-breaker, so I think Dan was just saying that he had believed that it was instead head-to-head, and that my post confirmed that for him.

Its head to head then division

cincrazy
11-10-2009, 05:46 PM
I think this team is a LOCK playoff team. However, in terms of how far we go in the playoffs, I have two big concerns right now:

1. Benson. The second leading ball carrier this season is Bernard Scott with 17. 17 carries!!!! That's simply horrific. That has to change. If Benson keeps up at this current pace, he might be shot by the end of the year. They have to find a way to spell the guy.

2. Defensive end. I don't know if we can get enough of a rush on opposing ELITE QB's (Manning, Brady, Big Ben, etc.) The defense is unquestionably very good. But the loss of Odom was huge. Fanene and Geathers are solid, along with Rucker, but that's clearly the weakness of the defense right now. They have been great against the run, but none of those guys can really get to the QB consistently, especially against top offensive linemen. We have to find a way to get to the QB without blitzing. I would love to see Michael Johnson step up the second half of the year and contribute a flurry of sacks.

This team is really, really good. Hardly a weakness in sight (I would label tight end as one). Whether it's Super Bowl good or not... remains to be seen. But this year, in contrast to 2005, I feel it's a possibility. The 2005 team wasn't tough, and it wasn't mature. This team is both.

redsfandan
11-10-2009, 06:59 PM
Someone had said earlier that division record was the first tie-breaker, so I think Dan was just saying that he had believed that it was instead head-to-head, and that my post confirmed that for him.
Right. That's why I said earlier that if the Bengals win they could just start printing playoff tickets. Obviously, it won't be a lock but I'd be at least a little bit surprised if they didn't make it in after another win vs Pitt.

I think this team is a LOCK playoff team. However, in terms of how far we go in the playoffs, I have two big concerns right now:

1. Benson. The second leading ball carrier this season is Bernard Scott with 17. 17 carries!!!! That's simply horrific. That has to change. If Benson keeps up at this current pace, he might be shot by the end of the year. They have to find a way to spell the guy.

2. Defensive end. I don't know if we can get enough of a rush on opposing ELITE QB's (Manning, Brady, Big Ben, etc.) The defense is unquestionably very good. But the loss of Odom was huge. Fanene and Geathers are solid, along with Rucker, but that's clearly the weakness of the defense right now. They have been great against the run, but none of those guys can really get to the QB consistently, especially against top offensive linemen. We have to find a way to get to the QB without blitzing. I would love to see Michael Johnson step up the second half of the year and contribute a flurry of sacks.

This team is really, really good. Hardly a weakness in sight (I would label tight end as one). Whether it's Super Bowl good or not... remains to be seen. But this year, in contrast to 2005, I feel it's a possibility. The 2005 team wasn't tough, and it wasn't mature. This team is both.

1. Yeah Benson has been a workhorse but I think he could get some rest, if they have to, vs Cleveland, Detroit, Oakland, and KC.

2. Losing Odom was big and Henry hurts too. Gradually working Andre Smith into the offensive line mix helps though. But they really can't afford more injuries like those.

Redsfan320
11-10-2009, 07:47 PM
Don't forget about Johnathan Joseph as a strong defensive player.

320

Redsfaithful
11-10-2009, 08:57 PM
Bengals are 7.5 point underdogs.

The Oakland game will be a win unless the Bengals turn the ball over a bunch, Cincinnati D isn't going to have much trouble with Jamarcus Russel.

Yachtzee
11-11-2009, 01:33 AM
The keys to the Steelers game is that the Bengals have to contain the run and keep Roethlisberger in the pocket. From what I've seen, he gets antsy when he can't move around on the field. The Bengals also have had experience upsetting the Steelers at Heinz Field.

bucksfan2
11-11-2009, 10:02 AM
I think this team is a LOCK playoff team. However, in terms of how far we go in the playoffs, I have two big concerns right now:

1. Benson. The second leading ball carrier this season is Bernard Scott with 17. 17 carries!!!! That's simply horrific. That has to change. If Benson keeps up at this current pace, he might be shot by the end of the year. They have to find a way to spell the guy.

2. Defensive end. I don't know if we can get enough of a rush on opposing ELITE QB's (Manning, Brady, Big Ben, etc.) The defense is unquestionably very good. But the loss of Odom was huge. Fanene and Geathers are solid, along with Rucker, but that's clearly the weakness of the defense right now. They have been great against the run, but none of those guys can really get to the QB consistently, especially against top offensive linemen. We have to find a way to get to the QB without blitzing. I would love to see Michael Johnson step up the second half of the year and contribute a flurry of sacks.

This team is really, really good. Hardly a weakness in sight (I would label tight end as one). Whether it's Super Bowl good or not... remains to be seen. But this year, in contrast to 2005, I feel it's a possibility. The 2005 team wasn't tough, and it wasn't mature. This team is both.

1. Scott was in line to get carries against Chicago but got hurt. When you look back, the Chicago game was really the only game he had a chance to get carries. They just haven't had a game where the back up rookie RB could get significant carries. Hopefully games against Oakland, Cleveland, Detroit, and KC will allow Scott to get carries.

2. I said the same thing about Oden tailgating before the Houston game. My friend pointed out that the majority of his sacks came in the GB game. It escalated when Clifton went out, but Aaron Rogers has been a tackling dummy this season. Im not saying that Oden isn't a good pass rusher, but he isn't elite. While he is a loss, I think the DE's have been doing a pretty good job of putting pressure on the QB. I really like what Johnson brings to the table, and he is one of the few Bengals pass rushers who will knock passes down. Oden may have been the best, but I don't think he was the best by all that much.

More than anything what worries me about this team is a letdown. Not holding serve. As GB saw last weekend, Philly saw out in Oakland, and the Bengals almost saw in Cleveland, if you don't bring your A game you can lose. The Bengals MUST hold serve, something they should do this season, but I have visions of Buffalo winning at home on Christmas eve years ago.

SeeinRed
11-11-2009, 11:34 AM
2. I said the same thing about Oden tailgating before the Houston game. My friend pointed out that the majority of his sacks came in the GB game. It escalated when Clifton went out, but Aaron Rogers has been a tackling dummy this season. Im not saying that Oden isn't a good pass rusher, but he isn't elite. While he is a loss, I think the DE's have been doing a pretty good job of putting pressure on the QB. I really like what Johnson brings to the table, and he is one of the few Bengals pass rushers who will knock passes down. Oden may have been the best, but I don't think he was the best by all that much.


To add to this, one big reason for the elevated sack numbers is the coverage in the secondary. Most notably Jonathan Joseph and Leon Hall have been very, very good. Give that defensive line time to reach the QB and they will be there. They may not be elite, but they are pressuring the QB quite well. I think the credit has to go to the whole defensive unit. Very nice to actually see them work as a team this year. I actually don't even worry about the defense, I worry about the offense staying consistent throughout the whole game. Quite a reversal from 2005.

cincrazy
11-11-2009, 11:47 PM
1. Scott was in line to get carries against Chicago but got hurt. When you look back, the Chicago game was really the only game he had a chance to get carries. They just haven't had a game where the back up rookie RB could get significant carries. Hopefully games against Oakland, Cleveland, Detroit, and KC will allow Scott to get carries.

2. I said the same thing about Oden tailgating before the Houston game. My friend pointed out that the majority of his sacks came in the GB game. It escalated when Clifton went out, but Aaron Rogers has been a tackling dummy this season. Im not saying that Oden isn't a good pass rusher, but he isn't elite. While he is a loss, I think the DE's have been doing a pretty good job of putting pressure on the QB. I really like what Johnson brings to the table, and he is one of the few Bengals pass rushers who will knock passes down. Oden may have been the best, but I don't think he was the best by all that much.

More than anything what worries me about this team is a letdown. Not holding serve. As GB saw last weekend, Philly saw out in Oakland, and the Bengals almost saw in Cleveland, if you don't bring your A game you can lose. The Bengals MUST hold serve, something they should do this season, but I have visions of Buffalo winning at home on Christmas eve years ago.

I agree with you completely about Odom. I said when he got hurt that I didn't think it was a huge loss, because the guy was playing way over his head, and wasn't an 8 sack kind of guy after five or six games. But he was a presence nonetheless, a solid veteran. I was a little worried about the line before he got hurt. I think they're solid, and I'm not pushing the panic button about the situation at all, but I think it could be a factor at some point.

And I have visions of the Oakland game we lost in 2003. The Raiders were 3-13 that year I think, first year after their Super Bowl loss. We went in there and laid a stink bomb early in the season, and that game ended up being a big blow when we finished 8-8 at the beginning of the year.

But I don't see a letdown with this team. They are remarkably solid across the board.

Tony Cloninger
11-12-2009, 10:52 AM
That 2003 game was the 2nd game of the season...in the 1st season of Marvin Lewis tenure...after being blown out by Denver in the opener.

That they almost won that game was a sign that things were going to get a little better but I never expected them to win that game at all. This is completely different.

BTW.....How many times have the Bengals opened against Denver? It has to be about 10 at least.

traderumor
11-12-2009, 02:54 PM
That 2003 game was the 2nd game of the season...in the 1st season of Marvin Lewis tenure...after being blown out by Denver in the opener.

That they almost won that game was a sign that things were going to get a little better but I never expected them to win that game at all. This is completely different.

BTW.....How many times have the Bengals opened against Denver? It has to be about 10 at least.Also, I think Jeremi Johnson and Ochocinco are the only ones still on the team that played in that game.

Mario-Rijo
11-12-2009, 05:15 PM
I think this team is a LOCK playoff team. However, in terms of how far we go in the playoffs, I have two big concerns right now:

1. Benson. The second leading ball carrier this season is Bernard Scott with 17. 17 carries!!!! That's simply horrific. That has to change. If Benson keeps up at this current pace, he might be shot by the end of the year. They have to find a way to spell the guy.

2. Defensive end. I don't know if we can get enough of a rush on opposing ELITE QB's (Manning, Brady, Big Ben, etc.) The defense is unquestionably very good. But the loss of Odom was huge. Fanene and Geathers are solid, along with Rucker, but that's clearly the weakness of the defense right now. They have been great against the run, but none of those guys can really get to the QB consistently, especially against top offensive linemen. We have to find a way to get to the QB without blitzing. I would love to see Michael Johnson step up the second half of the year and contribute a flurry of sacks.

This team is really, really good. Hardly a weakness in sight (I would label tight end as one). Whether it's Super Bowl good or not... remains to be seen. But this year, in contrast to 2005, I feel it's a possibility. The 2005 team wasn't tough, and it wasn't mature. This team is both.

I agree especially with #2, Odom was playing unconscious those 1st few games and it helped everyone on the line/defense. And even though I agree that his sack numbers are/were a bit flukish due to the GB game he still was getting consistent pressure in every game on every team and that is all that truly matters, the sacks are secondary to the pressure itself. Now to some extent that was by design as Zimm was using him inside alot on 3rd down so he got a couple of sacks and quite a bit of pressure from a DT spot but it worked. They haven't been quite as good/consistent since he got injured at getting pressure but they are doing better than last year which I think means schematically we have learned a few ways to get to the QB which we can carry forward and work off of. I hope Rucker plays this weekend he is dinged up a bit but he seems to be picking up some of the slack lately.

Yachtzee
11-12-2009, 07:00 PM
I agree especially with #2, Odom was playing unconscious those 1st few games and it helped everyone on the line/defense. And even though I agree that his sack numbers are/were a bit flukish due to the GB game he still was getting consistent pressure in every game on every team and that is all that truly matters, the sacks are secondary to the pressure itself. Now to some extent that was by design as Zimm was using him inside alot on 3rd down so he got a couple of sacks and quite a bit of pressure from a DT spot but it worked. They haven't been quite as good/consistent since he got injured at getting pressure but they are doing better than last year which I think means schematically we have learned a few ways to get to the QB which we can carry forward and work off of. I hope Rucker plays this weekend he is dinged up a bit but he seems to be picking up some of the slack lately.

I don't know. I thought Flacco looked pressured much of last week's game.

WVRed
11-12-2009, 10:51 PM
Question regarding the RB situation-

Would you take a flyer on Larry Johnson right now? Mike Brown has been known to give players second chances, and LJ spelling Cedric Benson and alleviating the workload could only be beneficial in the short run.

I say sign him for the rest of the season to let him get himself back on track, let him leave as a FA, and hope that Scott comes back to form or we draft a complimentary back.

That being said, I think Dan Snyder will have a bigger say in this situation.

Chip R
11-12-2009, 11:09 PM
I wouldn't. If he comes in it becomes a mini-circus. Why mess up a good thing? It's like if a baseball team decided to bring in Milton Bradley for the stretch run.

WebScorpion
11-13-2009, 02:12 AM
Really, all you can say at this point is that yes, they have a good shot at the playoffs. There's a whole lot of football left to play and so many possibilities to get derailed. Any given Sunday, injuries, distractions, etc. I hope some of the young guys actually get better as the season progresses. Rookies Michael Johnson, Rey Maualuga, Andre Smith, Bernard Scott, and Quan Cosby as well as 2nd year guys Dennis Roland, Kyle Cook, Keith Rivers, Orien Harris, Pat Sims...this is a pretty young team. As these guys go through the season, they'll either improve or wear down...either way, I plan on enjoying the ride. :thumbup:

Mario-Rijo
11-13-2009, 04:22 PM
I don't know. I thought Flacco looked pressured much of last week's game.

Very true but I think part of that is the fact that their WR's IMHO are coverable, so I think alot of that pressure was of the coverage variety. This week will be a far better test with Hines and Holmes along with Wallace and Miller. Although I happen to think the Steelers O-line isn't a real good pass blocking unit. We should still get some pressure but Bens ability to scramble and make plays is what helps his WR's get open better than most teams.

WebScorpion
11-15-2009, 08:11 PM
I think their shot just got MUCH better. :D

If you'll recall, the last time we won the division we met the Steelers in the first round of the playoffs and they showed us why Kitna was a bad backup QB. :thumbdown

If this team can maintain their focus and work on small improvements every week, they have a very real chance at winning the Super Bowl. Cedric Benson's injury may be a good thing if it gives him a couple weeks of rest and allows Scott (and the rest of the RBs) to get some reps under their belt. They'll get better and he will be rested for the playoff run...all good. :beerme:

One game at a time.

Yachtzee
11-15-2009, 09:14 PM
If I could make one request, I would ask that the Bengals refrain from making any goofy music videos until after they make their playoff run. I seem to remember Bootsy Collins making a video with some of the Bengals' players in their 11-5 season that seemed a bit premature last time.

yab1112
11-16-2009, 03:12 AM
I seem to remember Bootsy Collins making a video with some of the Bengals' players in their 11-5 season that seemed a bit premature last time.

:barf:

DTCromer
11-23-2009, 08:48 AM
If you're a Bengals fan, I'd be more worried about playing the following week in Oakland than this Sunday's game vs Pittsburgh.

:rolleyes:

HeatherC1212
11-29-2009, 05:15 PM
Bengals beat the Browns this afternoon and go 6-0 in their division for the first time in franchise history. That sounds pretty darn awesome but they need to finish the job for the rest of the season against everyone else too. :jump:

BTW-Anyone else feel like this Bengals team plays to their opponent's level? When they play 'bad' teams, they don't play as well and either barely win or don't win, but when they play 'good' teams, they pretty much beat the snot out of them. This has been SUCH a weird NFL year, LOL :laugh:

traderumor
11-29-2009, 05:22 PM
It's official. The Bengals coaching staff has been attending Jim Tressel's coaching class. They have undoubtedly bought into that overall philosophy for this season.

Redhook
11-29-2009, 07:52 PM
Super Bowl bound the Bengals are!

sonny
11-29-2009, 08:12 PM
Super Bowl bound the Bengals are!

Yoda?

Tony Cloninger
11-30-2009, 12:26 PM
I could see them go 2 ways.... lose at MINN, SD and NYJ and go 10-6 and end up barely making the WC beacuse PITT goes 5-0 (DO NOT count that out with Ben and Troy getting healthy)...or beat NYJ and either MINN or SD...and get a first round bye.

This passing offense is not good at all...even with a good running game....which is really disturbing.

KoryMac5
11-30-2009, 12:37 PM
The passing offense can be fixed with a few tweaks of the O line and playbook. On the O line side of things Mathis should be coming back in a week or two which will help. The line just hasn't been the same since he went down. Also I would expect Andre Smith to take over in a week or two from Roland who has been manhandled the last few weeks. As far as the playbook goes we don't need a 50/50 run/pass split but how about some play action ever so often to open things up and keep defenses honest.

The biggest question that we need to ask ourselves as Bengals fans is this: Does Marvin want to fix the offense?

My answer would be no, he is an old school grind it out coach who feels that you win football games in December by running the ball and playing good defense. I think he is enjoying the run first offense.

traderumor
11-30-2009, 01:15 PM
As far as the playbook goes we don't need a 50/50 run/pass split but how about some play action ever so often to open things up and keep defenses honest.

I was screaming for play action yesterday. I recall once, and that came inside the 10. The only reason I have for not, since it is seemingly a no-brainer with a strong run game, is that it is hard to sell with Palmer handing off with the opposite hand these days.

bucksfan2
11-30-2009, 01:58 PM
I was screaming for play action yesterday. I recall once, and that came inside the 10. The only reason I have for not, since it is seemingly a no-brainer with a strong run game, is that it is hard to sell with Palmer handing off with the opposite hand these days.

I was wondering the same thing too. If Palmer's bum hand makes play action harder. I am also trying to remember if the Palmer has ever really used play action.

traderumor
11-30-2009, 02:54 PM
I was wondering the same thing too. If Palmer's bum hand makes play action harder. I am also trying to remember if the Palmer has ever really used play action.I think they used it quite a bit in Rudy's heyday. It seems silly not to use it now unless there is a practical reason for not doing so. Strategy wise, it makes perfect sense. Strong running game makes the D susceptible to play action, esp. as they start to cheat the back 7 toward the line more and more.

Another recent trend that I think needs to change is the depth of the routes. They are running almost everything in the short passing zones, and very little designed flat passing, and yesterday they did not go for the homerun once. They had one apparent designed underneath throw to Coles, which he busted for a big gain. More of that and the good old standby slants would seem to be a good plan to make the run nearly unstoppable. Make the linebackers stay in the flats instead of blitzing or cheating on the run and you could run at will even moreso than they are now.

Playadlc
11-30-2009, 02:56 PM
The passing offense can be fixed with a few tweaks of the O line and playbook. On the O line side of things Mathis should be coming back in a week or two which will help. The line just hasn't been the same since he went down. Also I would expect Andre Smith to take over in a week or two from Roland who has been manhandled the last few weeks. As far as the playbook goes we don't need a 50/50 run/pass split but how about some play action ever so often to open things up and keep defenses honest.

The biggest question that we need to ask ourselves as Bengals fans is this: Does Marvin want to fix the offense?

My answer would be no, he is an old school grind it out coach who feels that you win football games in December by running the ball and playing good defense. I think he is enjoying the run first offense.

Agree completely with this. Mathis is having a pro-bowl type season at LG and we desperately need him on the field. Livings just doesn't get the job done, IMO.

Hoosier Red
11-30-2009, 03:17 PM
Agree completely with this. Mathis is having a pro-bowl type season at LG and we desperately need him on the field. Livings just doesn't get the job done, IMO.
Raise your hand if you thought at the beginning of the season that the Bengals' post season success would hinge on Evan Mathis' health.

traderumor
11-30-2009, 03:23 PM
Raise your hand if you thought at the beginning of the season that the Bengals' post season success would hinge on Evan Mathis' health.Who's Evan Mathis? ;) The Oline can be comparable to a bullpen. They can be very good without any big studs as long as everyone is doing their job and understands their role. And they can go largely anonymous unless they screw up.

GIDP
11-30-2009, 04:38 PM
Bengals signed Mike Mickens today. Guy was lights out for UC but hurt his knee.

Sea Ray
11-30-2009, 06:27 PM
I think the problems yesterday were with the tackles, not the guards. The edge rushers were getting in to Carson. I thought Roland really struggled. Time for Andre to earn his bucks

bucksfan2
12-01-2009, 09:59 AM
I think the problems yesterday were with the tackles, not the guards. The edge rushers were getting in to Carson. I thought Roland really struggled. Time for Andre to earn his bucks

I thought it was more Rogers up the gut who created problems.

Sea Ray
12-01-2009, 10:55 AM
I thought it was more Rogers up the gut who created problems.

He is probably their best defensive player. The Bengals didn't handle him right. They got him hurt in the last minute of the game after they'd already beaten the Browns. All that did was remove him from the Browns remaining games, two of which will come vs the Steelers and the Ravens. I wish they had Rogers healthy

Mario-Rijo
12-01-2009, 04:01 PM
I thought it was more Rogers up the gut who created problems.

Wimbley sure was getting quite a bit of consistent pressure on the outside.

DTCromer
12-06-2009, 02:40 PM
Hey! At least we beat the Steelers/Ravens twice this year!

MWM
12-06-2009, 02:42 PM
If the Bengals lose to the Lions today I'm officially uninvesting from this team this year like I normally do by the 3rd week. I've also been a supporter of Marvin Lewis throughout the years even with the results of the previous few years. If this team loses to Detroit after barely beating Cleveland and losing to the Raiders it will be time for him to go as that can be nothing BUT coaching.

Tony Cloninger
12-06-2009, 02:52 PM
They just seemed to have been on cruise control since the game at Pittsburgh. They think the season is over?
Maybe the injuries are starting to take their toll.

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 03:12 PM
The game is 14-7 now Bengals. Looks like they are even using some play action passes as well. No worries vs. the Lions today.

cincrazy
12-06-2009, 03:15 PM
The thing that concerns me is the penalties. It's not getting corrected. Matter of fact, it seems to be getting worse. That simply can't continue.

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 03:30 PM
Delay of games and false starts, week in and week out. Marvin needs to do something anything to correct this.

I would love to see some no huddle or hurry up from the Bengals as well as I think they are built to do this.

cincrazy
12-06-2009, 03:37 PM
Delay of games and false starts, week in and week out. Marvin needs to do something anything to correct this.

I would love to see some no huddle or hurry up from the Bengals as well as I think they are built to do this.

I agree. They are at their best with the no huddle.

And don't forget holding penalties :). This team finds a new way to set itself back on offense every week.

LoganBuck
12-06-2009, 03:41 PM
Andre Smith getting more reps today at right tackle, including some on passing downs. Looks big, but so far I haven't seen him make any big errors.

Tony Cloninger
12-06-2009, 03:43 PM
Yet here they are 17-7 at the half....and I was worried about being down 7-0.

Look at what WAS is doing with NO. Week in and out....if you are not on your game you can stumble but that does not mean you will lose.

I do not think this OL is that good in pass defense...as in run offense....but neither was the 85-90 Bengals either. They gave up more than a few sacks and would stumble passing the ball more than people remember.
Running the ball they were No. 1.

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 03:47 PM
I do love when Roland goes in motion setting up an unbalanced line for the Bengals. That play usually nets 6-7 yds each time for Cedric.

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 04:36 PM
23-7 now with the Bengals ahead comfortably. In other news Pitts is down to Oakland at home 13-10.

Degenerate39
12-06-2009, 04:43 PM
23-7 now with the Bengals ahead comfortably. In other news Pitts is down to Oakland at home 13-10.

Now Pitts down 20-17 to Oakland. Sounds a bit familiar

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 04:48 PM
I guess Tomlin's plan to unleash hell in December might have been delayed a week. If Oakland can get a good coach and a QB they might be pretty good.

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 04:51 PM
I am really starting to question the thought process of leaving Benson and Palmer in there with the game well in hand. AS I type this another false start 9 penalties today for the Bengals.

Degenerate39
12-06-2009, 04:51 PM
24-20 Pittsburgh now. We really need Oakland to win this game

Degenerate39
12-06-2009, 05:00 PM
Why is Carson still in the game?

Degenerate39
12-06-2009, 05:06 PM
Oakland takes the lead with 9 seconds left in the game!!!

CTA513
12-06-2009, 05:07 PM
Oakland takes the lead with 9 seconds left in the game!!!

:laugh:

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 05:08 PM
Love to see that, plus NE is down to Miami now as well. If the Browns beat SD it will be a perfect weekend.

CTA513
12-06-2009, 05:13 PM
Raiders win 27-24

This loss can't help that Steelers locker room.

redhawkfish
12-06-2009, 05:16 PM
Steelers lose to KC and Oakland in the same year!!

6-4-3
12-06-2009, 05:16 PM
How 'bout them Steelers?

DTCromer
12-06-2009, 05:17 PM
Well, this makes the Bengals look even worse. Right now, record-wise, Green Bay is the best team they've beaten.

Brutus
12-06-2009, 05:18 PM
Well, this makes the Bengals look even worse. Right now, record-wise, Green Bay is the best team they've beaten.

Fortunately, it's not a popularity contest and style points don't matter. I'd actually rather the Bengals get little love going into the playoffs. Just get that second bye and go take care of business as an underdog.

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 05:19 PM
Pitts drops down to 6-6 with that loss at home. If the Ravens win they will be sitting pretty for a wildcard spot. Looks like "Unleashing Hell in December" has been delayed a week.

BearcatShane
12-06-2009, 05:23 PM
Well, this makes the Bengals look even worse. Right now, record-wise, Green Bay is the best team they've beaten.


This aint college football! If the Steelers and Ravens both took care of the Bengals they would be 8-4.

GIDP
12-06-2009, 05:25 PM
Well, this makes the Bengals look even worse. Right now, record-wise, Green Bay is the best team they've beaten.

Your love for everything anti bengals is showing up a lot more lately.

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 05:26 PM
Well, this makes the Bengals look even worse. Right now, record-wise, Green Bay is the best team they've beaten.

First place in the AFC North is fine with me. I am not sure how being in the drivers seat for the division crown could make any team look bad. Especially one that was 1-9-1 last year.

DT it would be nice to know where your NFL allegience lies. Steelers fan perhaps?

Degenerate39
12-06-2009, 05:39 PM
Well, this makes the Bengals look even worse. Right now, record-wise, Green Bay is the best team they've beaten.

I think I speak for about every Bengals fan by saying who cares? We're in first place in the division and could very well get the 2nd seed for the playoffs.

DTCromer
12-06-2009, 05:45 PM
First place in the AFC North is fine with me. I am not sure how being in the drivers seat for the division crown could make any team look bad. Especially one that was 1-9-1 last year.

DT it would be nice to know where your NFL allegience lies. Steelers fan perhaps?

I have no allegiance anymore. I quit on the Bengals last year and I'm considering leaving the NFL entirely. It's so boring compared to the NCAA.

As for the Bengals, looking at their overall body of work, I don't see how any Bengals fan can think they'll do anything but lose their next 2 games on the road to 2 teams that are much, much better than the last 3 teams they've struggled to win (or lose) against. Their offense is terrible. Their special teams are prone to HUGE gaffes. Their defense won't beat SD and Minny alone. I mean, it's not like the Bengals have faced a Top 10 QB this year. Schaub is pretty good when healthy and the defense was awful that game. It'll be interesting to see how they do against Rivers and Favre.

I mean, everyone's giddy for leading by 3 games in the North. So what? What's the difference between missing the playoffs and playing 1 extra week in the season? All it means is that the Bengals get to play a 1st place schedule.

Here's how the schedule sets up next year if the season ended today.

Home
Pittsburgh
Cleveland
Baltimore
Tampa
New Orleans
Miami
Buffalo
Indy/SD

Away:
Pittsburgh
Cleveland
Baltimore
Carolina
Atlanta
New England
NJ Jets
Indy/SD

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 06:07 PM
I have no allegiance anymore. I quit on the Bengals last year and I'm considering leaving the NFL entirely. It's so boring compared to the NCAA.

As for the Bengals, looking at their overall body of work, I don't see how any Bengals fan can think they'll do anything but lose their next 2 games on the road to 2 teams that are much, much better than the last 3 teams they've struggled to win (or lose) against. Their offense is terrible. Their special teams are prone to HUGE gaffes. Their defense won't beat SD and Minny alone. I mean, it's not like the Bengals have faced a Top 10 QB this year. Schaub is pretty good when healthy and the defense was awful that game. It'll be interesting to see how they do against Rivers and Favre.

I mean, everyone's giddy for leading by 3 games in the North. So what? What's the difference between missing the playoffs and playing 1 extra week in the season? All it means is that the Bengals get to play a 1st place schedule.

Here's how the schedule sets up next year if the season ended today.

Home
Pittsburgh
Cleveland
Baltimore
Tampa
New Orleans
Miami
Buffalo
Indy/SD

Away:
Pittsburgh
Cleveland
Baltimore
Carolina
Atlanta
New England
NJ Jets
Indy/SD

So what your trying to say is that you have no allegience to any team and are considering leaving the NFL entirely. Yet you come back periodically to drop little nuggets of knowledge on us Bengals fans. Sounds like a severe case of sour grapes to me.

I honestly have looked at your arguments and they just don't hold water especially for someone who is trying to be an objective observer. I disagree with your assessments on QB and special teams. The Bengals have played both Big Ben and Flacco twice and beat them both times. we know how much ESPN loves those two QB's. Plus we beat Rodgers and Cutler who are often put in the next tier of QB's.

On special teams the problem with snapping the ball has been fixed and we have two good returners in Cosby and Scott now. Plus I can't remember any one team breaking a long one against us this season. With the addition of Huber to the punting game I would say special teams has been a strong point this year.

I do agree with your points about the offense but only in regards to the passing game. The running game continues to be effective in fact the Bengals are the first team this season to have three different backs rush for 100 yds in 3 straight weeks. It is a ball control offense that will do wonders for this team in the playoffs during the cold weather games.

Many of us worry about the penalties and mental lapses that have plagued this team yet we remain quietly optimistic about our chances this season. Nobdy expects to win both games vs. Minn and SD however we do expect to play well in both games.

I think all those years of losing and Mike Brown have jaded you DT to the point that you can no longer remain objective when talking about the Bengals. It's ok after the last 25 years of Bengal infidelity I can understand where you are coming from. There is still plenty of room aboard the Bengal bus if you want to hop aboard. :beerme:

traderumor
12-06-2009, 06:14 PM
Like Ken Broo told a caller, if you want to know how the Bengals will fare in the playoffs, watch the next two games. They are playing two playoff caliber teams in back to back weeks on the road. The Lions connected on one very well designed play and won a jump ball, otherwise were dominated as the Bengals should have. All DTCromer is doing is showing his bias with the comments he makes.

HeatherC1212
12-06-2009, 06:19 PM
I've been wanting to use this phrase all season and I finally get a chance: Child please. ;)

WHO DEY! :jump:

KoryMac5
12-06-2009, 06:24 PM
Heather just told someone to Kiss the Baby! :cool:

cincrazy
12-06-2009, 06:41 PM
I have no allegiance anymore. I quit on the Bengals last year and I'm considering leaving the NFL entirely. It's so boring compared to the NCAA.

As for the Bengals, looking at their overall body of work, I don't see how any Bengals fan can think they'll do anything but lose their next 2 games on the road to 2 teams that are much, much better than the last 3 teams they've struggled to win (or lose) against. Their offense is terrible. Their special teams are prone to HUGE gaffes. Their defense won't beat SD and Minny alone. I mean, it's not like the Bengals have faced a Top 10 QB this year. Schaub is pretty good when healthy and the defense was awful that game. It'll be interesting to see how they do against Rivers and Favre.

I mean, everyone's giddy for leading by 3 games in the North. So what? What's the difference between missing the playoffs and playing 1 extra week in the season? All it means is that the Bengals get to play a 1st place schedule.

Here's how the schedule sets up next year if the season ended today.

Home
Pittsburgh
Cleveland
Baltimore
Tampa
New Orleans
Miami
Buffalo
Indy/SD

Away:
Pittsburgh
Cleveland
Baltimore
Carolina
Atlanta
New England
NJ Jets
Indy/SD

Aaron Rodgers... Big Ben... Joe Flacco..... all chopped liver right?

Maybe the Ravens and Steelers have average records because the Bengals beat them?

It's the NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAGUE. I don't care who they've played. A win is a win. You win in the playoffs with defense and a running game. This team has both.

As far as the special teams comment, it's also capable of HUGE plays. Cosby is a good punt returner, and Scott a good kick returner. And the problems they had snapping the ball earlier in the year have been resolved, so making that comment is a stretch.

Not trying to upset you, but if you have given up on the Bengals why on earth do you still watch? Just to criticize? Should the Colts be taken to task for being 12-0? Is their division any tougher than our's? How about the Saints? With the Panters, Bucs, and Falcons?

Redsfaithful
12-06-2009, 10:52 PM
It's so boring compared to the NCAA.



I love college football and still can't understand how anyone can say this. Until college football settles things on the field it's just flat out second rate. The BCS is the stupidest thing in sports, nothing else even comes close.

I think literally every win in the NFL is impressive, you can't take anything for granted. Any team is capable any week of a win, over the course of the season teams definitely stand out, but week to week anything can happen. The Bengals should have beaten the Raiders, but they showed today again you can't take them lightly. I'll take 9-3 and a probable division championship in one of the toughest divisions in football.

The Bengals are winning the same way the Steelers and Ravens usually win, you can't complain that it's not pretty enough. I think most of the people worried about the offense just don't truly trust the defense, which I understand, but I really think it's ok. This defense isn't pretend, it really is elite. The defense has had one bad game all year, against Houston, and they had an excuse that week with Vicki Zimmer's funeral.

I think the Bengals will split the next two, and end up with 12 wins and a bye.

WMR
12-06-2009, 11:26 PM
ratbirds/lions/stealers/packers/etc.-->http://i50.tinypic.com/1e5u2a.gif<---- bengals

WHO DEY!! (gif courtesy of the new MTV Show 'Jersey Shore.' Do yourself a favor and watch it if you haven't seen it yet. :lol: )

Sea Ray
12-06-2009, 11:47 PM
By your standards DT the Bengals can't impress you. None of the teams they've lost to have better records than the Packers either. If not for the 4 losses to the Bengals, the Ravens and Steelers would be sittin' pretty for the playoffs. In fact the Steelers have given the Vikes their only loss and the Ravens should have.

I know this Bengal team has its holes and the injuries are starting to pile up, but after last year, only a whining (fill in the blank) would complain about a division championship.

MWM
12-07-2009, 12:02 AM
What concerns me is that other than the Chicago game, they haven't scored a whole lot of points. The offense is going to have to find a way to move the ball more consistently. They've gotten right back to being predictable. Benson barely averaged 3 yards per carry today.

KoryMac5
12-07-2009, 12:11 AM
Palmer did talk a bit about the passing game in the press conference today. Basically stating that the offense from a passing perspective was out of synch as they are a run first team now, and it has been hard getting a rhythym developed in the passing game.

I think it is time to go to work on making some adjustments to the offense. Maybe running some no huddle sets and using more play action might help.

redsfandan
12-07-2009, 09:37 AM
Benson averaged only 3.1 yards per carry. The team averaged only 2.7 yards per carry. Palmer had a passer rating of 65.3. And this was vs a team that has only won twice in their last 28 games. It's a good thing they have a good defense for once cuz the offense needs some work. I hate to say it but I think they're lucky that they'll play the Vikings after they just lost one of their linebackers. I just don't think the Bengals are ready yet to play one of the better teams like they'll see in the playoffs.

traderumor
12-07-2009, 10:28 AM
The complaining sounds an awful lot like the nitpicking I used to get in grade school from some "expert" from the Board of Education. I was a straight A student and didn't cause any trouble in class, so she would criticize the untraditional way that I hold a pencil. My mom heard about it and advised the school that if that is all they could find to "work" with me on, to leave me alone.

Moral of the story: the Bengals dominated the Lions yesterday. The outcome was in doubt during the first quarter. The same for the Browns game. Criticizing the offense for doing their job (ball control, avoiding turnovers, field position) is so much "well, we gotta find something to find fault, so yea, they're not scoring enough points."

Sure, there are things to find fault with, but this team is winning football games. Please realize that part of the "inefficiency" on offense is a result of being able to play a style of ball that depends on defensive stops and doesn't have to play high risk, high reward football to win games. Like force throws on 3rd down that result in picks (a rare bad decision by Palmer these days). That is the real story of the season.

I'm glad the team understands they haven't arrived yet, but this is a playoff contender who will give any opponent a run for their money and can beat anyone in the league.

Yachtzee
12-07-2009, 10:31 AM
The Ravens won a Super Bowl with a subpar offense and a great defense. The Bengals may not win games the way we want them to, but as long as they keep winning, I'm just going to enjoy the ride.

Boss-Hog
12-07-2009, 10:35 AM
The Ravens won a Super Bowl with a subpar offense and a great defense. The Bengals may not win games the way we want them to, but as long as they keep winning, I'm just going to enjoy the ride.
The next two games should be telling. I really like our running game and defense, which is what this team is built on, but I think they're going to need to pass the ball better to beat the Minnesotas and San Diegos of the NFL.

redsfandan
12-07-2009, 11:31 AM
The complaining sounds an awful lot like the nitpicking I used to get in grade school from some "expert" from the Board of Education. I was a straight A student and didn't cause any trouble in class, so she would criticize the untraditional way that I hold a pencil. My mom heard about it and advised the school that if that is all they could find to "work" with me on, to leave me alone.

Moral of the story: the Bengals dominated the Lions yesterday. The outcome was in doubt during the first quarter. The same for the Browns game. Criticizing the offense for doing their job (ball control, avoiding turnovers, field position) is so much "well, we gotta find something to find fault, so yea, they're not scoring enough points."

Sure, there are things to find fault with, but this team is winning football games. Please realize that part of the "inefficiency" on offense is a result of being able to play a style of ball that depends on defensive stops and doesn't have to play high risk, high reward football to win games. Like force throws on 3rd down that result in picks (a rare bad decision by Palmer these days). That is the real story of the season.

I'm glad the team understands they haven't arrived yet, but this is a playoff contender who will give any opponent a run for their money and can beat anyone in the league.

Yes, ball control was a plus yesterday but that's really the only way they 'dominated' the lowly Lions. Controlling the clock is definitely a big plus and makes things easier for the defense. But they didn't shut out the Lions, or even limit them to less than 10 points, or score so much that the game really was over early. To me that would have been domination. There just needed to be one play, one turnover that the Lions took advantage of and the 4th qtr would've been a lot more tense. And the Bengals did have three turnovers so I wouldn't say they did their job avoiding turnovers. That's not domination. Maybe if they had held onto the ball better we could say that. But it is a win and they are virtually a lock now to play at least one playoff game. But keep in mind that, even if Baltimore wins tonight, the Bengals will still have only played two games against teams that would be in the playoffs if the season ended tomorrow. Yeah, it's great that they've won this many games. And it's great that we will most likely see a Bengals playoff game. Could they give any team a run for their money? Maybe. Can we really say that they could beat anyone though? I can't. The next two games will be really good indicators of what to expect in the playoffs. Hopefully the Bengals can iron out the kinks before a better team can take advantage of them.

traderumor
12-07-2009, 11:43 AM
Yes, ball control was a plus yesterday but that's really the only way they 'dominated' the lowly Lions. Controlling the clock is definitely a big plus and makes things easier for the defense. But they didn't shut out the Lions, or even limit them to less than 10 points, or score so much that the game really was over early. To me that would have been domination. There just needed to be one play, one turnover that the Lions took advantage of and the 4th qtr would've been a lot more tense. And the Bengals did have three turnovers so I wouldn't say they did their job avoiding turnovers. That's not domination. Maybe if they had held onto the ball better we could say that. But it is a win and they are virtually a lock now to play at least one playoff game. But keep in mind that, even if Baltimore wins tonight, the Bengals will still have only played two games against teams that would be in the playoffs if the season ended tomorrow. Yeah, it's great that they've won this many games. And it's great that we will most likely see a Bengals playoff game. Could they give any team a run for their money? Maybe. Can we really say that they could beat anyone though? I can't. The next two games will be really good indicators of what to expect in the playoffs. Hopefully the Bengals can iron out the kinks before a better team can take advantage of them.The Bengals had two turnovers, not three one did turn into a TD. Any game turns on "one play, one turnover that the Lions took advantage of." Fortunately, the D minimized the damage from turnovers. The last TD was a jump ball won by the Lions. From the Fanene int up until that last hail mary type pass, the Lions did nothing on offense. That is the domination I spoke of. And this is the NFL, not NCAA. The form of domination doesn't need to be a 35-3 total mismatch.

redsfandan
12-07-2009, 11:58 AM
I wasn't able to watch the game but the boxscores I've looked at list 3 turnovers. Someone has to be wrong right? Regardless, you said that "this is a playoff contender who will give any opponent a run for their money and can beat anyone in the league". I just can't say the same.

wolfboy
12-07-2009, 12:09 PM
I wasn't able to watch the game but the boxscores I've looked at list 3 turnovers. Someone has to be wrong right? Regardless, you said that "this is a playoff contender who will give any opponent a run for their money and can beat anyone in the league". I just can't say the same.

Two interceptions and a fumble by Palmer. IIRC, the fumble turned into a TD.

KoryMac5
12-07-2009, 12:29 PM
If Coats doesn't drop that ball in the endzone we are looking at 27-13 instead of 23-13. I do think that things will get ironed out for the offense this week. One way to help is to put Smith in there at RT, dude looked good and I like that the Bengals are working him in slowly. I have to imagine Smith will be starting vs. San Diego and play half the snaps vs. the Vikings.

The other thing that needs to change is the Bengals need that killer instict that the good teams have. Put teams away when you have a chance. Stop trying to let the air out of the ball and go for the kill. Take a shot down field when you have a team on the ropes. Coles is a deep threat and so are Chad and Andre take a shot every so often. Our third quarters have been terrible.

traderumor
12-07-2009, 12:43 PM
oops, forgot about the fumble.

wolfboy
12-07-2009, 12:49 PM
Coles is a deep threat and so are Chad and Andre take a shot every so often. Our third quarters have been terrible.

There is no doubt that Chad is a deep threat, but I have my doubts about Caldwell and Coles. I don't think the team would be lamenting the loss of Chris Henry and auditioning guys like Galloway if Coles and Caldwell could fill the void.

cincrazy
12-07-2009, 01:21 PM
The offense's main problem is that it repeatedly shoots itself in the foot. Stupid penalties set them back and put them in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd and long situations. That's hard for any offense to overcome.

Again, the good thing about this is, it's not a fatal flaw. In 2005, the defense was a fatal flaw. In 2009, offensive penalties are something to rue about. But that's certainly small potatoes.

GIDP
12-07-2009, 01:24 PM
Anyone want to reopen the discussion on how great Palmer is this year?

Sea Ray
12-07-2009, 01:32 PM
Anyone want to reopen the discussion on how great Palmer is this year?

Sure, he's awfully good but he's plagued by an O-line that is very shaky at pass blocking and a poor O-Coordinator. I think Bratkowski has under produced given the talent he has to work with. He's very predictable and his offense is very undisciplined. A perfectionist would not tolerate all these penalties. This offense routinely stops itself with penalties. We've seen this time and time again.

Let's talk about red zone issues. Is it any mystery why they're kicking FGs when they run it on 1st and 2nd down into stacked lines and pass on 3rd and long inside the 10? That's play calling

traderumor
12-07-2009, 01:32 PM
Anyone want to reopen the discussion on how great Palmer is this year?Maybe you and DT Cromer can PM a discussion. I doubt if anyone else is interested in hyper-critical, hobby horse subject type monologue.

KoryMac5
12-07-2009, 01:32 PM
Palmer has not done anything special this season except for his performance in the Chicago game. He has 16 TD's and 3 rushing TD's with a QB rating of 85 after this weeks performace. He has also thrown 10 picks as well. With this offense he is more of a game manager and I think for the most part he has done a good job especially late in games. I can understand the criticism coming from some folks out there in that he gets paid like a top 5 QB he should be throwing for more TD's and passing yds, however he is not needed to do that week after week. I can't blame the play calls on Palmer.

bucksfan2
12-07-2009, 01:36 PM
Palmer has not done anything special this season except for his performance in the Chicago game. He has 16 TD's and 3 rushing TD's with a QB rating of 85 after this weeks performace. He has also thrown 10 picks as well. With this offense he is more of a game manager and I think for the most part he has done a good job especially late in games. I can understand the criticism coming from some folks out there in that he gets paid like a top 5 QB he should be throwing for more TD's and passing yds, however he is not needed to do that week after week. I can't blame the play calls on Palmer.

Palmer has been average this season. But what I don't like is it seems he has gotten happy feet as of late. He hasn't thrown the ball well all year and its been over 20 games since he last had a 300 yard passing game. I do think we tend to blame the WR's on a bad route or poor read and give Palmer a pass. If the Bengals want to beat the better teams Palmer has got to play better.

GIDP
12-07-2009, 01:37 PM
Palmer has not done anything special this season except for his performance in the Chicago game. He has 16 TD's and 3 rushing TD's with a QB rating of 85 after this weeks performace. He has also thrown 10 picks as well. With this offense he is more of a game manager and I think for the most part he has done a good job especially late in games. I can understand the criticism coming from some folks out there in that he gets paid like a top 5 QB he should be throwing for more TD's and passing yds, however he is not needed to do that week after week. I can't blame the play calls on Palmer.

I just got crucified earlier in the year when people were claiming the guy was one of the best in the league. Hes been average all year and maybe its time people can echo my sentiments.

GIDP
12-07-2009, 01:38 PM
Maybe you and DT Cromer can PM a discussion. I doubt if anyone else is interested in hyper-critical, hobby horse subject type monologue.

Irony.

KoryMac5
12-07-2009, 01:39 PM
Palmer has been average this season. But what I don't like is it seems he has gotten happy feet as of late. He hasn't thrown the ball well all year and its been over 20 games since he last had a 300 yard passing game. I do think we tend to blame the WR's on a bad route or poor read and give Palmer a pass. If the Bengals want to beat the better teams Palmer has got to play better.

I noticed that as well in the Detroit game that Palmer has been forced to scramble a bit more in the pocket. However there were three or four times yesterday where the pocket collapsed on him. Hopefully the addition of Smith helps some.

KoryMac5
12-07-2009, 01:46 PM
I just got crucified earlier in the year when people were claiming the guy was one of the best in the league. Hes been average all year and maybe its time people can echo my sentiments.

Same Palmer different offense. He doesn't need to force it into double coverage any more or throw for 400 yds to keep us in games. We just aren't an air it out team anymore. Our run pass split is it 50/50 this season which means we are a run first team now, let the defense handle it if it isn't there. Palmer has turned into a game manager, who can throw the ball when necessary. His biggest goal during a game has become don't turn it over.

In looking at the great QB's you have Brady, P. Manning, Brees, Favre (this season), and Warner.

Than you have to put Palmer into the 2nd group of QB's with Big Ben, Flacco, Cutler etc...

Is Palmer still a good QB, yes. However with the amount of $$$ he is being paid I would like to see some better numbers. Besides with a few less drops he has 20 TD's this season.

cincrazy
12-07-2009, 01:47 PM
I just got crucified earlier in the year when people were claiming the guy was one of the best in the league. Hes been average all year and maybe its time people can echo my sentiments.

He has been average all year. But he's still a great QB. The guy is responsible for several of our wins this year, stats be damned.

Without Palmer, we lose to the Steelers, probably twice. We lose to the Ravens at least once. We lose to the Browns in Cleveland. He hasn't been consistently great, but he's been great when needed.

KoryMac5
12-07-2009, 01:49 PM
We could always bring Fitzpatrick back for another great 4-11-1 season.

GIDP
12-07-2009, 01:54 PM
He has been average all year. But he's still a great QB. The guy is responsible for several of our wins this year, stats be damned.

Without Palmer, we lose to the Steelers, probably twice. We lose to the Ravens at least once. We lose to the Browns in Cleveland. He hasn't been consistently great, but he's been great when needed.

You mean with a bad QB we lose more games? :)

If Palmer was playing like the Palmer of old we would probably be undefeated. Im not saying the guy is awful but he's been average all year and I dont know why people have so much trouble admitting that. Its always got a qualifier after. There is nothing wrong with admitting that Palmer has been a disappointment. I hope he turns into a top tier guy but as it stands right now he and the passing game which Ill put on him outside of the bad TE play is what stands between the SB appearance from my point of view.

I hope the guy gets it right but I havent seen much domination out of him other than the Bears game.

Mario-Rijo
12-07-2009, 02:24 PM
You mean with a bad QB we lose more games? :)

If Palmer was playing like the Palmer of old we would probably be undefeated. Im not saying the guy is awful but he's been average all year and I dont know why people have so much trouble admitting that. Its always got a qualifier after. There is nothing wrong with admitting that Palmer has been a disappointment. I hope he turns into a top tier guy but as it stands right now he and the passing game which Ill put on him outside of the bad TE play is what stands between the SB appearance from my point of view.

I hope the guy gets it right but I havent seen much domination out of him other than the Bears game.

Well here's the thing, people add the qualifier in some part due to the fact they aren't sure how much Palmer is responsible for the lack of domination as you put it. I'd suggest if you really want someone to agree with you point to something more tangible than statistics to prove your point. Numbers tell us that something is wrong but they don't tell us what that wrong is. If you want others to agree with you then don't imply Carson is the problem and then not give us evidence he is the problem. I think most are inclined to believe he is struggling due to a host of things which are not in his direct control (offensive line play, playcalling, his receivers not playing up to par yet, his own injury, fatigue after missing almost an entire season, etc) which takes him off the hook IMO.

Personally I just have a hard time being critical of a guy who has IMHO already proven he's capable of putting an offense/team on his back and carrying them to wins for many years now. You don't stop being that player just because things don't look great for a much smaller window of time. Now if there is something the rest of us are missing that proves Carson himself is the problem enlighten us.

Redsfaithful
12-07-2009, 02:31 PM
If the receivers aren't getting separation what is Palmer supposed to do? Throw it up for grabs? 85 is the only one getting open consistently.

traderumor
12-07-2009, 02:41 PM
Palmer as a throwing threat makes the run game work, and vice versa. There have not only been game winning drives where Palmer dials it up, but quick two-minute warning type drives where they get some points before the half. He has delivered when asked to this year. He has been executing the game plan. He even still throws to Coats, who has dropped at least two TDs this year with his meat hooks.

Just FYI, GIDP tries to interject a Palmer debate into any Bengals thread, thus my earlier comment.

The Operator
12-07-2009, 03:15 PM
I am worried about the passing game, I just don't know what the root cause is.

I'd say quite a bit of it is with the line. It's hard to make good throws when you've got pass rushers in your face. As for him developing "happy feet", that's actually been at the request of the team. IIRC, they asked him over the offseason to work on being able to leave the pocket and make more plays with his feet. He's just doing what they asked him to.

Part of it, I'm afraid, could be a hidden injury. The semi-deep TD to Chad yesterday looked pretty good but there were quite a few passes that looked like they really didn't have much at all on them. I don't know if that was from being hit as the threw or because maybe he tried to take some off of them since they were short, I don't know. I know the Palmer of old threw laser beams though and I was really worried when they didn't actually do arm surgery on him last year. I hope that doesn't comeback to haunt the team.

It also could be that none of them are used to this style of offense yet. It's got to be a big adjustment to go from a Colts-lite style offense to a Steelers style offense, where you're used to throwing the ball all the time to just turning around and handing it off 50% of the time.

Hopefully they get this stuff ironed out in time for Minnesota. They're gonna need the passing game to at least be functional if they want to go there and win. I'm hoping they've been holding some stuff back against the Oak-Cle-Det games so they can bust out the new tricks against Min and SD.

Eric_the_Red
12-07-2009, 03:30 PM
A guy like Marty Gilyard would do wonders for Carson, and the Bengals, right now. He can spread the field, and is a great kick returner. We'll see if those talents translate to the pro game, but you have to think he will be on the Bengals' radar come draft day.

A QB like Carson isn't suited for the current roster of WRs, or I guess you could turn that around and say the WRs are suited for Carson. Carson needs people to get open downfield. I just don't think he is accurate enough in passes under 10 yards. If the Bengals want to run a ball control offense scheme (lots of rushes and short, quick passes) they need a very accurate QB. IMO, Carson is more accurate on passes over 10 yards.

cincrazy
12-07-2009, 04:17 PM
I am worried about the passing game, I just don't know what the root cause is.

I'd say quite a bit of it is with the line. It's hard to make good throws when you've got pass rushers in your face. As for him developing "happy feet", that's actually been at the request of the team. IIRC, they asked him over the offseason to work on being able to leave the pocket and make more plays with his feet. He's just doing what they asked him to.

Part of it, I'm afraid, could be a hidden injury. The semi-deep TD to Chad yesterday looked pretty good but there were quite a few passes that looked like they really didn't have much at all on them. I don't know if that was from being hit as the threw or because maybe he tried to take some off of them since they were short, I don't know. I know the Palmer of old threw laser beams though and I was really worried when they didn't actually do arm surgery on him last year. I hope that doesn't comeback to haunt the team.

It also could be that none of them are used to this style of offense yet. It's got to be a big adjustment to go from a Colts-lite style offense to a Steelers style offense, where you're used to throwing the ball all the time to just turning around and handing it off 50% of the time.

Hopefully they get this stuff ironed out in time for Minnesota. They're gonna need the passing game to at least be functional if they want to go there and win. I'm hoping they've been holding some stuff back against the Oak-Cle-Det games so they can bust out the new tricks against Min and SD.

I think that Carson is healthy. When he's missing with his throws, I don't see him missing because of lack of arm strength. His accuracy has been somewhat of an issue, but normally it's behind guys or over their heads, not short. And he does have happy feet in the pocket, but I don't attribute all of that to the coaching staff asking him to work on his mobility. When he drops back deep in the pocket to throw, he often has a man right in his face, and has to dump it off to a back, or take the sack. From my vantage point (granted, I'm not "expert") the line struggles with guys that can get by them on the edge. And I think the Vikings will be in Palmer's face all day, unfortunately. I don't know how they'll block Jared Allen.

And the point made right before mine is a good one. Gilyard, or someone similar, would be huge for this offense. I have to admit, I underestimated the loss of Henry. I think it has had an impact, although not a HUGE one, it's noticable IMO.

But again... this is nitpicking. We are 9-3. In firm control of the division, and we control our own destiny in regards to a first round bye. It's the best position the Bengals have found themselves in since I was 4, so I'll take it :).

traderumor
12-07-2009, 04:42 PM
A guy like Marty Gilyard would do wonders for Carson, and the Bengals, right now. He can spread the field, and is a great kick returner. We'll see if those talents translate to the pro game, but you have to think he will be on the Bengals' radar come draft day.

A QB like Carson isn't suited for the current roster of WRs, or I guess you could turn that around and say the WRs are suited for Carson. Carson needs people to get open downfield. I just don't think he is accurate enough in passes under 10 yards. If the Bengals want to run a ball control offense scheme (lots of rushes and short, quick passes) they need a very accurate QB. IMO, Carson is more accurate on passes over 10 yards.He looked fine on the two slants they ran yesterday. He's been airmailing receivers over the middle.

While I was happy to see the two slants and a few play actions yesterday, more of that is certainly in order as D's cheat on the run.

hebroncougar
12-07-2009, 08:18 PM
The Bengals line is huge........and not built to pass block.

Matt700wlw
12-07-2009, 10:59 PM
If the Packers win tonight (10-0 Packers at this point), the Bengals magic number becomes 1 to win the AFC North...

HeatherC1212
12-07-2009, 11:37 PM
If the Packers win tonight (10-0 Packers at this point), the Bengals magic number becomes 1 to win the AFC North...

That would be AWESOME and it's now 17-0 in the 3rd quarter just to keep people updated. :D

Matt700wlw
12-07-2009, 11:57 PM
Ravens get a TD.

17-7 Packers.

Matt700wlw
12-08-2009, 12:06 AM
They get another and score 14 points in 30 seconds.

17-14 Ravens

Matt700wlw
12-08-2009, 12:30 AM
Packers TD!

24-14 Green Bay

Matt700wlw
12-08-2009, 01:03 AM
27-14 Packers.

GAME OVER!

1 more Bengals win and the AFC North is in the books!

GIDP
12-08-2009, 01:07 AM
We know for sure 1 team out of Steelers or Ravens cant win the AFC north now since they have to play each other one more time still. Doesnt really mean much but still its pretty good feeling knowing that we have only 1 team to worry about the rest of the way.

that being said Ill feel much better clinching with a win over the possibly overrated Vikings.

Matt700wlw
12-08-2009, 01:46 AM
After the division clinch, which they still have to do, it comes down to seeding. They can't let up.....now is when they have to play with a purpose again. This time, it's outside of the division.

GAC
12-08-2009, 06:30 AM
The question, title, should read "Do The Bengals Have A Shot IN the Playoffs?", because they are gonna be in it.

Boss-Hog
12-08-2009, 07:54 AM
After the division clinch, which they still have to do, it comes down to seeding. They can't let up.....now is when they have to play with a purpose again. This time, it's outside of the division.
Though they're both big, the San Diego game is much important than the Minnesota game for this reason.

HeatherC1212
12-08-2009, 10:11 AM
Though they're both big, the San Diego game is much important than the Minnesota game for this reason.

I agree. I'll take a loss against Minnesota if it means we get a win against the Chargers. :beerme:

Wow, when was the last time anyone in Cincy actually talked about a magic number for the Bengals?! I guess it was back in 2005 but it still feels like eons ago, LOL ;)

macro
12-08-2009, 10:18 AM
After the division clinch, which they still have to do, it comes down to seeding. They can't let up.....now is when they have to play with a purpose again. This time, it's outside of the division.

And "let up" is exactly what the 2005 team did. They were 11-3 and had two very winnable games left, one at home to a 4-10 Buffalo team and another at Kansas City. Had they won those two games, they'd have had a shot at the #2 seed and first-round bye. Instead, they let Buffalo come to PBS and beat them, eliminating any shot at the #2 seed and making the KC game meaningless. As a result, they rested the starters at KC and lost.

We all know what happened the next week when they entered the playoffs as a #3 seed. To be fair, Denver ended up winning out and took the #2 seed at 13-3 anyway, but they were able to play their last game without any pressure.

joshnky
12-08-2009, 10:59 AM
They can't let up.....now is when they have to play with a purpose again. This time, it's outside of the division.

Hopefully, they will relish the underdog role the next two weeks after several weeks of being the heavy favorite. It would not surprise me if the Bengals win the next two but then drop the last two. KC will be a struggle after two brutal weeks on the road and then they might not have anything to play for in the finale. And I should point out that this thing happens to even the great teams. I seem to recall Indy struggling in recent years in the last two weeks after they locked up their playoff spot.

Chip R
12-08-2009, 11:08 AM
If the Packers win tonight (10-0 Packers at this point), the Bengals magic number becomes 1 to win the AFC North...


Since their magic number is now 1, which means a tie, and the Bengals hold the tiebreaker by beating BAL twice, they are officially division champs. :thumbup:

GIDP
12-08-2009, 11:10 AM
Since their magic number is now 1 which means a tie and the Bengals hold the tiebreaker by beating BAL twice, they are officially division champs. :thumbup:

No. There are 4 games left. If Cincy loses out they go 9-7. If Pitt or Balt wins out they go 10-6.

redsfandan
12-08-2009, 11:19 AM
The question, title, should read "Do The Bengals Have A Shot IN the Playoffs?", because they are gonna be in it.
Yeah I agree. Alot has changed in the last month. Maybe it can be changed after Sunday. I just hope my fears are unfounded and the Bengals can fix the problems areas.

No. There are 4 games left. If Cincy loses out they go 9-7. If Pitt or Balt wins out they go 10-6.
Yes and no. IF what you proposed happens then yes Cincy is in trouble but, like Chip said, the Bengals only need one win/tie or one loss/tie from Baltimore/Pitt. So, I think the Bengals are in pretty good shape as far as getting into the playoffs.

traderumor
12-08-2009, 11:28 AM
Though they're both big, the San Diego game is much important than the Minnesota game for this reason.Since they're tied in overall record and the Minny game's first, I would say it is more important ;):p:

traderumor
12-08-2009, 11:30 AM
No. There are 4 games left. If Cincy loses out they go 9-7. If Pitt or Balt wins out they go 10-6.True, one win by Bengals or loss by the others clinches a tie, which clinches the division.

Chip R
12-08-2009, 11:34 AM
No. There are 4 games left. If Cincy loses out they go 9-7. If Pitt or Balt wins out they go 10-6.


Then the magic number isn't 1 it's 2. Take the number of games left to play (4) add 1 (5) then subtract the number of games ahead in the loss column (3) and you get the magic number (2).

GIDP
12-08-2009, 11:36 AM
Yeah I agree. Alot has changed in the last month. Maybe it can be changed after Sunday. I just hope my fears are unfounded and the Bengals can fix the problems areas.

Yes and no. IF what you proposed happens then yes Cincy is in trouble but, like Chip said, the Bengals only need one win/tie or one loss/tie from Baltimore/Pitt. So, I think the Bengals are in pretty good shape as far as getting into the playoffs.

I read his post wrong or something. I thought he was trying to say 1 game meant that at worst we could tie.

GIDP
12-08-2009, 11:37 AM
Then the magic number isn't 1 it's 2. Take the number of games left to play (4) add 1 (5) then subtract the number of games ahead in the loss column (3) and you get the magic number (2).

Magic Number is 1 because we hold all the tie breakers. If we win 1 game or Pitt and Ravens lose 1 game the worst we can do is tie. Tie would mean we go to the playoffs.

GIDP
12-08-2009, 11:40 AM
Since they're tied in overall record and the Minny game's first, I would say it is more important ;):p:

Werd. We have to beat Minn and the Chargers just to be extra safe. After that we can sit players probably in week 17 and still probably have the bye.

redsfandan
12-08-2009, 11:41 AM
I read his post wrong or something. I thought he was trying to say 1 game meant that at worst we could tie.
Eh it happens. I just hope the Bengals don't take it easy now.

Chip R
12-08-2009, 11:44 AM
Magic Number is 1 because we hold all the tie breakers. If we win 1 game or Pitt and Ravens lose 1 game the worst we can do is tie. Tie would mean we go to the playoffs.

That's what I was saying but you were correct in saying that if the Bengals lose all their games and the Ravens win theirs, they finish 2nd.

Sea Ray
12-08-2009, 11:46 AM
Then the magic number isn't 1 it's 2. Take the number of games left to play (4) add 1 (5) then subtract the number of games ahead in the loss column (3) and you get the magic number (2).

You're confusing MLB with the NFL. In the NFL ties don't mean a one game playoff. In the NFL you can end the season in a tie for first place and still be crowned division champs. This is what happened to the Bengals four years ago.

Chip R
12-08-2009, 11:56 AM
You're confusing MLB with the NFL. In the NFL ties don't mean a one game playoff. In the NFL you can end the season in a tie for first place and still be crowned division champs. This is what happened to the Bengals four years ago.

The magic number is still the magic number whatever sport you're talking about. You're right. The Bengals can end the season in a tie and still be division champs. That's the point I was making in my original post before GIDP corrected me. The poster who said their magic number was 3 was incorrect. I assumed it was 3 without checking the standings. A magic number of 2 - which it is now - means they haven't clinched squat since they could still finish 2nd. A magic number of 1 means they tie for the division title but since they swept BAL, they are division champs. A magic number of 0 means they win it outright.

GIDP
12-08-2009, 12:15 PM
The magic number is still the magic number whatever sport you're talking about. You're right. The Bengals can end the season in a tie and still be division champs. That's the point I was making in my original post before GIDP corrected me. The poster who said their magic number was 3 was incorrect. I assumed it was 3 without checking the standings. A magic number of 2 - which it is now - means they haven't clinched squat since they could still finish 2nd. A magic number of 1 means they tie for the division title but since they swept BAL, they are division champs. A magic number of 0 means they win it outright.

So if the magic number is 1 bengals win or 1 ravens/steelers loss the magic number isnt 1?

You are thinking about this too much. The Magic number is 1. they dont have to win 2 games to win the division.

Sea Ray
12-08-2009, 12:24 PM
A magic number of 1 means they tie for the division title but since they swept BAL, they are division champs. A magic number of 0 means they win it outright.


I guess it comes down to how you define a magic number. In football there is no difference in winning a division outright or winning a tie breaker. In football you can win the division and still have the same record as the 2nd place team.

The Bengals magic number to win the division is 1. You are correct in saying their magic number to win it outright is two, if anyone cares about winning it outright.

Chip R
12-08-2009, 12:49 PM
So if the magic number is 1 bengals win or 1 ravens/steelers loss the magic number isnt 1?

The magic number would be 1 if that happened but it hasn't happened yet.


You are thinking about this too much. The Magic number is 1. they dont have to win 2 games to win the division.

As I said earlier, the magic number isn't 1, it's 2 and you pointed that out to me. As of right now, any number of Bengals wins and Ravens losses that equals 2 gives the Bengals the division championship outright. So if the Bengals don't win any more games and the Ravens don't lose any more games, the magic number stays at 2 and the Bengals finish 2nd. They may still make the playoffs but that's irrelevant to this discussion.

Now if the Bengals win just 1 game but lose the rest and if the Ravens win the rest of their games, the magic number goes down to 1 and the Bengals tie for the division title and win it since the first tiebreaker is head to head and they beat the Ravens twice. Same thing happens if the Ravens lose 1 game, win the rest and the Bengals lose the rest of their games. The magic number goes down to 1.

Now if the Bengals lose every game but one and the Ravins lose one game but win the others, the magic number is decreased by 2 which means the Bengals win outright. Same thing happens if the Bengals lose every game and the Ravens lose 2 more or the Bengals win 2 games and the Ravens win all theirs.

I know we're out of practice for calculating magic numbers since the Reds have been out of the running for so long but this is simple math.

bucksfan2
12-08-2009, 01:25 PM
As I said earlier, the magic number isn't 1, it's 2 and you pointed that out to me. As of right now, any number of Bengals wins and Ravens losses that equals 2 gives the Bengals the division championship outright. So if the Bengals don't win any more games and the Ravens don't lose any more games, the magic number stays at 2 and the Bengals finish 2nd. They may still make the playoffs but that's irrelevant to this discussion.

Now if the Bengals win just 1 game but lose the rest and if the Ravens win the rest of their games, the magic number goes down to 1 and the Bengals tie for the division title and win it since the first tiebreaker is head to head and they beat the Ravens twice. Same thing happens if the Ravens lose 1 game, win the rest and the Bengals lose the rest of their games. The magic number goes down to 1.

Now if the Bengals lose every game but one and the Ravins lose one game but win the others, the magic number is decreased by 2 which means the Bengals win outright. Same thing happens if the Bengals lose every game and the Ravens lose 2 more or the Bengals win 2 games and the Ravens win all theirs.

I know we're out of practice for calculating magic numbers since the Reds have been out of the running for so long but this is simple math.

Chip I don't quite get your point. The magic number is 1. They don't need to win the division outright because they already own the tie breaker. So if the Bengals win 1 more game they are going to the playoffs. Hence 1 being the magic number.

Boss-Hog
12-08-2009, 02:29 PM
Chip I don't quite get your point. The magic number is 1. They don't need to win the division outright because they already own the tie breaker. So if the Bengals win 1 more game they are going to the playoffs. Hence 1 being the magic number.
That is definitely my understanding, as well.

Chip R
12-08-2009, 02:35 PM
Chip I don't quite get your point. The magic number is 1. They don't need to win the division outright because they already own the tie breaker. So if the Bengals win 1 more game they are going to the playoffs. Hence 1 being the magic number.


That is definitely my understanding, as well.


SeaRay's got it. To win outright, the magic number is 2. To tie - and win by tiebreaker - the magic number is 1.

Boss-Hog
12-08-2009, 02:39 PM
SeaRay's got it. To win outright, the magic number is 2. To tie - and win by tiebreaker - the magic number is 1.
Correct...and not like it will come down to this, but just about any Bengals fan will tell you they'd be happy winning the division via tiebreaker (magic number one) vs. not winning it at all, which is why you hear the number one thrown out instead the number two. Even in 2005, the Bengals and Steelers finished tied at 11-5, but most people don't recall that because the Bengals had the tiebreaker that year, too (not to mention the Steelers won the SB that year* :)). Winning outright in the NFL isn't as big a deal as say, college (just MO).

Sea Ray
12-08-2009, 03:16 PM
To win outright, the magic number is 2. To tie - and win by tiebreaker - the magic number is 1.


By George I think we've got it! Well put...:thumbup:

traderumor
12-08-2009, 03:18 PM
The question for this team now is "are they hungry to win the Super Bowl?" Again, the next two games and how they perform (not so much whether or not they win the games since they are on the road) should answer that question.

I know folks will freak out if they lose both Minny and SD, but really, if they play well and lose in a close game that could have gone either way, then I think we evaluate that they are a contender for the SB.

GIDP
12-08-2009, 04:36 PM
The magic number would be 1 if that happened but it hasn't happened yet.



As I said earlier, the magic number isn't 1, it's 2 and you pointed that out to me. As of right now, any number of Bengals wins and Ravens losses that equals 2 gives the Bengals the division championship outright. So if the Bengals don't win any more games and the Ravens don't lose any more games, the magic number stays at 2 and the Bengals finish 2nd. They may still make the playoffs but that's irrelevant to this discussion.

Now if the Bengals win just 1 game but lose the rest and if the Ravens win the rest of their games, the magic number goes down to 1 and the Bengals tie for the division title and win it since the first tiebreaker is head to head and they beat the Ravens twice. Same thing happens if the Ravens lose 1 game, win the rest and the Bengals lose the rest of their games. The magic number goes down to 1.

Now if the Bengals lose every game but one and the Ravins lose one game but win the others, the magic number is decreased by 2 which means the Bengals win outright. Same thing happens if the Bengals lose every game and the Ravens lose 2 more or the Bengals win 2 games and the Ravens win all theirs.

I know we're out of practice for calculating magic numbers since the Reds have been out of the running for so long but this is simple math.

Bengals win the division with 1 game. If they win they are in. Its not this complicated.

KoryMac5
12-08-2009, 04:42 PM
According to Bengals.com Peko is out again this week and could be lost until the Jets game. Scott will also be out as well. MRI was negative on Crocker's ankle as well, he should be ready to play on Sunday.

traderumor
12-08-2009, 04:57 PM
Bengals win the division with 1 game. If they win they are in. Its not this complicated.Or if the Ravens/Steelers each lose a game. See, it is more complicated ;)

traderumor
12-08-2009, 04:59 PM
According to Bengals.com Peko is out again this week and could be lost until the Jets game. Scott will also be out as well. MRI was negative on Crocker's ankle as well, he should be ready to play on Sunday.Peko is missed, but this has been a place of depth this year. Crocker is preferred over Nelson, but the latter acquitted himself quite well last week. The D is as deep as I can recall.

cincrazy
12-08-2009, 05:20 PM
According to Bengals.com Peko is out again this week and could be lost until the Jets game. Scott will also be out as well. MRI was negative on Crocker's ankle as well, he should be ready to play on Sunday.

I think losing Peko is a big deal these next two weeks. With Adrian Peterson tomorrow, and LT the following week, now's not the time for us to be losing interior guys.

Is Tank Johnson ok? I seem to recall him getting shaken up this past Sunday.

GIDP
12-08-2009, 05:23 PM
Or if the Ravens/Steelers each lose a game. See, it is more complicated ;)

Yea its more complicated if you want to be a jerk about it. Either way the magic number is 1.

Chip R
12-08-2009, 05:43 PM
Yea its more complicated if you want to be a jerk about it. Either way the magic number is 1.


Gee, I hope you're not calling me a jerk. :nono:

GIDP
12-08-2009, 05:46 PM
Gee, I hope you're not calling me a jerk. :nono:

I wasnt and it was sarcastic. Magic number = 1 though.

traderumor
12-08-2009, 06:16 PM
Yea its more complicated if you want to be a jerk about it. Either way the magic number is 1.The goal was accuracy. Your statement was inaccurate in an attempt to tell others they were making something simple complicated. How about any combination of Bengals win or Steelers and Ravens loss makes the Bengals division champs is about as simple as it gets and we move on.

Sea Ray
12-08-2009, 06:31 PM
I think losing Peko is a big deal these next two weeks. With Adrian Peterson tomorrow, and LT the following week, now's not the time for us to be losing interior guys.

Is Tank Johnson ok? I seem to recall him getting shaken up this past Sunday.

We're not playing Peterson tomorrow are we?

As for Tank I guess we'll find out more tomorrow when we see who practiced and how much

GIDP
12-08-2009, 06:51 PM
The goal was accuracy. Your statement was inaccurate in an attempt to tell others they were making something simple complicated. How about any combination of Bengals win or Steelers and Ravens loss makes the Bengals division champs is about as simple as it gets and we move on.

You trolling me or something?

traderumor
12-08-2009, 07:27 PM
You trolling me or something?I usually respond to inaccuracies, esp. those coming from someone in the middle of being a smart alec.

Now, you have managed to call me a jerk, then a troll for responding to that? That's certainly an interesting take on the exchange.

GIDP
12-08-2009, 07:30 PM
I usually respond to inaccuracies, esp. those coming from someone in the middle of being a smart alec.

Now, you have managed to call me a jerk, then a troll for responding to that? That's certainly an interesting take on the exchange.

I was being sarcastic I even posted that I was. The magic number is 1. If the Bengals win 1 game they are in. The whole conversation is about the magic number being 1.

I think I am being trolled. I cant tell though. If you are kidding please let me know because im honestly confused on what is going on here.

traderumor
12-08-2009, 07:54 PM
I was being sarcastic I even posted that I was. The magic number is 1. If the Bengals win 1 game they are in. The whole conversation is about the magic number being 1.

I think I am being trolled. I cant tell though. If you are kidding please let me know because im honestly confused on what is going on here.The sarcasm was certainly missed. As for "being trolled," I am merely responding to what you posted. As I suggested earlier, its time to move on. Nothing but personal stuff going on here now.

GIDP
12-08-2009, 07:57 PM
fair enough

cincrazy
12-08-2009, 08:28 PM
We're not playing Peterson tomorrow are we?

As for Tank I guess we'll find out more tomorrow when we see who practiced and how much

Haha, wow. Really, I swear, I haven't been liquored up all week, although it may seem that way.

Tony Cloninger
12-09-2009, 10:26 AM
Old Steelers never die...they just go on TV shows and espouse how the Bengals will always fold beacuse when they played them back when they were terrible before 2005....they always folded.

I just heard Jerome on Mike and Mike in the morning and he said he is not a believer in the Bengals beacuse he knows them by playing against them and they always fold. You mean like in 2005 when they lost there starting QB? Beacuse that would have NEVER happened to the Steelers if they had lost Ben and had to play Maddox....right?

Just to shut people like this up is reason enough to win out here in MINN and any questions.

Hoosier Red
12-09-2009, 10:36 AM
Old Steelers never die...they just go on TV shows and espouse how the Bengals will always fold beacuse when they played them back when they were terrible before 2005....they always folded.

I just heard Jerome on Mike and Mike in the morning and he said he is not a believer in the Bengals beacuse he knows them by playing against them and they always fold. You mean like in 2005 when they lost there starting QB? Beacuse that would have NEVER happened to the Steelers if they had lost Ben and had to play Maddox....right?

Just to shut people like this up is reason enough to win out here in MINN and any questions.


I can't wait until Chris Henry is on ESPN 9 15 years from now and talks about how they know the Steelers always fold like they did whenever they lost their Free Safety in 2009.

traderumor
12-09-2009, 11:05 AM
I can't wait until Chris Henry is on ESPN 9 15 years from now and talks about how they know the Steelers always fold like they did whenever they lost their Free Safety in 2009.I don't think there is much threat of Chris Henry being sought after for comments after his career is over.

Tony Cloninger
12-09-2009, 11:17 AM
I think Carson or Chad (too obvious?) would be the choice of bringing someone on TV to do that. ;)

Heck..Chad will probably have his own talk show "Child Please!"

yab1112
12-09-2009, 12:31 PM
I think Carson or Chad (too obvious?) would be the choice of bringing someone on TV to do that. ;)

Chad definitely wants it more than anyone else but my money is on Dhani Jones. I mean, he's already tackled the globe so studio analyst should be no problem :cool:

Hoosier Red
12-09-2009, 01:31 PM
I don't think there is much threat of Chris Henry being sought after for comments after his career is over.

Oh no, ESPN 9 will have to be edgy so they'll have to have a cast of former NFL ne'er do wells like Chris Henry, Michael Vick, Jamal Lewis as their analysts.
Henry will get beaten up because he didn't serve real time like Vick and Lewis.

Once a year they'll go over to the regular ESPN set and light it on fire.

traderumor
12-09-2009, 01:50 PM
Oh no, ESPN 9 will have to be edgy so they'll have to have a cast of former NFL ne'er do wells like Chris Henry, Michael Vick, Jamal Lewis as their analysts.
Henry will get beaten up because he didn't serve real time like Vick and Lewis.

Once a year they'll go over to the regular ESPN set and light it on fire.Don't forget Jim Brown. He fits the bill on all accounts ;)

RichRed
12-09-2009, 03:01 PM
Old Steelers never die...they just go on TV shows and espouse how the Bengals will always fold beacuse when they played them back when they were terrible before 2005....they always folded.

I just heard Jerome on Mike and Mike in the morning and he said he is not a believer in the Bengals beacuse he knows them by playing against them and they always fold. You mean like in 2005 when they lost there starting QB? Beacuse that would have NEVER happened to the Steelers if they had lost Ben and had to play Maddox....right?

Just to shut people like this up is reason enough to win out here in MINN and any questions.

Jerome should watch all the "fold" talk. If it weren't for Nick Harper recovering his fumble and running right into Ben Roethlisberger, he'd just be a fatter Earnest Byner.

Redsfaithful
12-09-2009, 05:32 PM
Wasn't that pretty much because Harper's wife/gf had cut his knee or something the week before?

I love the NFL so much.

redsfandan
12-20-2009, 08:51 PM
It's a good thing the Bengals beat Baltimore both times cuz they might need that tiebreaker.

BuckeyeRedleg
12-20-2009, 08:55 PM
The Bengals will limp in and regret they couldn't take care of business today as they now will not get a bye and in all likelihood have to travel to SD again (IF they can even get past their WC game).

The road just got tougher, to say the least.

GIDP
12-20-2009, 08:57 PM
And the doom and gloomers start to come out.

cue DTcromer saying something awesome

Oxilon
12-20-2009, 09:02 PM
We're beating Kansas City next week and Pitt's going to beat Baltimore. We're going to the playoffs, but we're going to be limping into it.

BuckeyeRedleg
12-20-2009, 10:18 PM
And the sunshine-pumping pollyannas start to come out.

Redsfaithful
12-20-2009, 10:40 PM
I'd like to see the Bengals get another shot in San Diego. If you weren't encouraged by that game then I dunno what to tell you, San Diego is an awfully good team. So long as the Bengals get some guys healthy (Peko, Crocker, maybe Scott) I think they can do some things in the playoffs. I was getting worried about the passing game, but I feel better after today.

HeatherC1212
12-21-2009, 12:19 AM
I'd like to see the Bengals get another shot in San Diego. If you weren't encouraged by that game then I dunno what to tell you, San Diego is an awfully good team. So long as the Bengals get some guys healthy (Peko, Crocker, maybe Scott) I think they can do some things in the playoffs. I was getting worried about the passing game, but I feel better after today.

I agree. I honestly wasn't sure how well the defense was going to do containing cocky Rivers and that SD offense but they didn't really do too bad overall. I'm encouraged that the guys made this a close game after such extenuating and exhausting circumstances this week. I think that the hardships and heartaches that the guys have endured this season have made them stronger as a team and I think that's going to help them in the long run. I'm not horribly worried about the guys anymore. There's still a fire there and I think it's burning even brighter now. My gut says they beat KC this weekend here at home to clinch the AFC North in front of their own fans (and hopefully a bunch of them come out to cheer the guys on).

macro
12-21-2009, 12:53 AM
And the sunshine-pumping pollyannas start to come out.

The media has spent the entire week declaring the Chargers to be unbeatable, and perhaps even on their way to the Super Bowl. They've won nine straight games, and are 17-0 in December since Rivers became QB. They were playing on their home field with a crowd that was apparently as charged up and loud as any NFL crowd anywhere.

Despite all that, the Bengals went in there and came with a last-second FG of playing them to overtime. I don't see what's pollyanna about people being encouraged by the team's showing today. And I don't wear orange-colored glasses. I have been very down on them for the past four weeks, despite their winning two of those weeks.

GIDP
12-21-2009, 01:01 AM
If anything I saw a bengal team who looks as complete as they have since some earlier wins.

dougdirt
12-21-2009, 02:41 AM
The media has spent the entire week declaring the Chargers to be unbeatable, and perhaps even on their way to the Super Bowl. They've won nine straight games, and are 17-0 in December since Rivers became QB. They were playing on their home field with a crowd that was apparently as charged up and loud as any NFL crowd anywhere.

Despite all that, the Bengals went in there and came with a last-second FG of playing them to overtime. I don't see what's pollyanna about people being encouraged by the team's showing today. And I don't wear orange-colored glasses. I have been very down on them for the past four weeks, despite their winning two of those weeks.

As a Bengals fan, there was one team in the AFC that concerned me. The Chargers. I think the team can win in Indy. I don't think they will, but I think they could. Going into this week, I didn't think we could win in San Diego... now, I think we can win anywhere if we step up.

GAC
12-21-2009, 05:38 AM
It's a good thing the Bengals beat Baltimore both times cuz they might need that tiebreaker.

I don't think so.

The Bengals have KC and Jets remaining, while Baltimore has to travel to Pittsburgh, and then Oakland.

KC's run defense is simply atrocious. Look what the Brown's Harrison did to them yesterday, and a majority in the 2nd half. Their special teams is pretty dismal too.

The Jets game "might" be a test simply because they have the #1 rushing offense in the NFL. If Edwards can hang onto the ball (which he did yesterday), and Sanchez doesn't throw picks (which he did yesterday, three times), then they could give the Bengals a game of it.

But I don't see Baltimore winning out any way.

traderumor
12-21-2009, 08:43 AM
The Bengals will win against KC, making the Jets game meaningless as they will be unable to improve their lot. But then, watching half of the Jets/Falcons game, that is a winnable game, but I'm not sure we won't sit regulars for most of it.

Eric_the_Red
12-21-2009, 08:52 AM
I'd sure like to see the Bengals win next week, wrap up a WC round home game and rest the starters in NY.

The Bengals are neither a poor team nor a great team. They are good, playoff-worthy, but not a next-level team yet. Too many holes in the offense and mental errors. But, the good news is that the playoffs don't start for 3 weeks so there is still time to get on a roll.

KoryMac5
12-21-2009, 08:57 AM
Arizona Cardinals last 6 games 2-4

Loss Giants 37-29
Loss Eagles 48-20
Win St Louis 34-10
Loss Vikings 35-14
Loss Patriots 47-7
Win Seattle 34-21

Not a team looking ready for the playoffs if you ask me judging by these scores. However the team that owns these scores went pretty far in the playoffs and made it all the way to the Super Bowl. The Bengals need to use these last two weeks to find some consistency in their offense.

macro
12-21-2009, 11:29 AM
the team that owns these scores went pretty far in the playoffs and made it all the way to the Super Bowl...

...and came within a heartbeat of winning it.

traderumor
12-21-2009, 12:30 PM
...and came within a heartbeat of winning it.or a toe tap...;)

BuckeyeRedleg
12-21-2009, 01:06 PM
The media has spent the entire week declaring the Chargers to be unbeatable, and perhaps even on their way to the Super Bowl. They've won nine straight games, and are 17-0 in December since Rivers became QB. They were playing on their home field with a crowd that was apparently as charged up and loud as any NFL crowd anywhere.

Despite all that, the Bengals went in there and came with a last-second FG of playing them to overtime. I don't see what's pollyanna about people being encouraged by the team's showing today. And I don't wear orange-colored glasses. I have been very down on them for the past four weeks, despite their winning two of those weeks.

Macro, my post wasn't in response to people having hope or being encouraged.

I posted:


The Bengals will limp in and regret they couldn't take care of business today as they now will not get a bye and in all likelihood have to travel to SD again (IF they can even get past their WC game).

The road just got tougher, to say the least.

Nothing wrong about that post, but it was followed by "now all the doom-gloomers come out." That's why I mentioned "pollyannas". To make a point.

vottofan4life
12-21-2009, 02:31 PM
Once Peko is back we'll be closing games better and with Bernard Scott making a comeback maybe just maybe we'll make it to the 2nd round this time

I predict either dolphins or ravens in the first round

TeamSelig
12-21-2009, 05:03 PM
Just think if we still had Odom

macro
12-21-2009, 05:06 PM
Macro, my post wasn't in response to people having hope or being encouraged.

I posted:



Nothing wrong about that post, but it was followed by "now all the doom-gloomers come out." That's why I mentioned "pollyannas". To make a point.

Ahh, okay, gotcha. I see it in context now.

joshnky
12-21-2009, 05:09 PM
Just think if we still had Odom

Its more "just think if we still had Peko". Fanene has filled in well for Odom but the loss of Peko and Crocker the last few weeks has been really difficult.

HeatherC1212
12-21-2009, 05:49 PM
Shouldn't Peko and Crocker be back soon? I thought they were only supposed to be out a couple of weeks but I may have heard that wrong. At the very least we should have them back for the playoffs which is really the most important thing and hopefully they're both ready to go by then.

BTW-Over on the Orioles message board some of the Ravens fans don't want their guys to come to Cincy for a playoff game because they think they have a better shot at winning in New England. Did we just go into the Twilight Zone?! That just sounds so weird (good weird though!), LOL :laugh:

TeamSelig
12-21-2009, 06:03 PM
Its more "just think if we still had Peko". Fanene has filled in well for Odom but the loss of Peko and Crocker the last few weeks has been really difficult.

Someone had mentioned Peko already. I agree regarding Fanene, but Odom was a dominating force... it sure would be nice to have all of our guys back, then again, I'm sure a lot of teams can say that.

Mario-Rijo
12-23-2009, 12:50 AM
If I'm not mistaken all we have to do is win vs. the Chiefs and we have locked up the division, that makes the Jets game just a tune up/rest week.

Who makes the playoffs beyond that?

Indy - 1 seed sewed up and sitting pretty

Remaining Opponents: Home vs. NYJ, @ Buffalo

Chargers - should end up 2 seed but if they slip up in their remaining 2 games and NE wins both it could get dicey. NE would then hold the next tie-breaker after conference win % (both would be 8-4) which is winning % in like games (max 4 games). I suspect the 'Skins won't muster enough to beat them even if Tenn is able to upset them however.

Remaining Opponents: @ Tenn. (7-7), Home vs. the Skins (4-10)

Bengals - We're pretty much all aware of their situation but it'll all be explained in further breakdowns. Bottom line win out and hope for a NE loss and they are the #3 seed which would also keep us from seeing Indy until the Conf. Championship. Personally I think I'd rather face the Chargers again before the Colts because it's also possible the Pats could take them and then the Pats would have to go on the road to us, as opposed to us going to Indy. However losing both coupled with 2 Ravens wins could hypothetically put us out of the playoffs, good luck with that KC.

Remaining Opponents: Home vs. Chiefs (3-11), @ NYJ (7-7)

NE - Could still end up the #2 seed but probably won't so a toss up with Cincy for the #3 seed could be in the offing. Should they both win out the Pats get the edge with the 4th tie-breaker strength of victory which I'm assuming is PF-PA margin and they are way ahead there. I'm hoping though that Matt Schaub and company takes them in week 16 (I think it's a good match up for the Texans) so we need to win out.

Remaining Opponents: @ Jax (7-7) and @ Houston (7-7)

Wild Card teams:

Denver: (8-6) They are in regardless assuming they win out. They hold the Tie Breaker over us so I'll be rooting against them the next 2 weeks. However they play at Philly (10-4) this coming weekend so nothing is certain for them, but they should still win 7 with KC (3-11) their last game.

Baltimore: (8-6) Also hold their own destiny in their hands should they win out. But they go to Pittsburgh (7-7) where I think they end up ambushed and then on the road in week 16 to Oakland (5-9) where we and Philly both know it's no picnic. Baltimore does however have the tie breaker with Denver head to head and also owns a better current in conference record than Denver plus has the division record over Pittsburgh no matter what.

The rest in the hunt:


Jax - (7-7) If they can beat NE this week at NE they have as good a shot as any but I don't see it happening a loss likely puts them out. They have Cleveland the final week at Cleveland.

Miami - (7-7) They have the next best chance record wise but face the Texans and Steelers 2 other 7-7 teams who could knock them off. They do get both at home however.

Pittsburgh - (7-7) Wins over Baltimore (8-6) and Miami (7-7) at the end could propel them into the last spot, I can still see them doing this very thing. Baltimore and Miami are both run 1st teams with below average secondaries which falls right in line with Pittsburgh's strengths. Also Pittsburgh holds a tie-breaker over Denver.

In the hunt technically speaking but probably too much to overcome:

NYJ - (7-7) Better conference record than Pittsburgh but when you close the season with @ the Colts and at home vs. Cincy it doesn't look good. One loss and their out. They could win out as they are a great match up problem for the Colts and we aren't exactly world beaters lately especially if we beat the Chiefs as expected and are already in. But I don't see them beating these odds.

Tennessee - (7-7) With already 7 conference losses and S.D. coming in this week it doesn't look good for the Titans. But if they can pull of the upset vs. visiting S.D. they then have to trek all the way to Seattle the last week and win just to have a shot.

Texans - (7-7) They have NE in the final week at home and Miami this week on the road I like their chances of making it to 9-7. But I'm waffling on whether they beat NE or not, that game is critical to us in so many ways whatever the outcome.


The way I see it you can scratch 4 teams right away the Jags, Titans, Jets and Dolphins. Tough matchups give them an 8th loss in the next 2 weeks. Which leaves Baltimore, Denver, Pitt and Houston. I think all these teams could finish 9-7 (although the Texans are a stretch) and since Baltimore holds a tiebreaker over both Pitt and Denver they make it in as the 1st wildcard and because Pitt has already beaten Denver they too make it in even though Denver will have the better conference record (which is only good after the head to head). Houston has the toughest road because even if they won out which isn't easy they still have to hope for help.

So I see it like so:

Indy - 1 seed and gets a bye
S.D. - 2 seed and gets a bye
NE - 3 seed and plays at home vs. Pittsburgh.
Cin - 4 seed and plays at home vs. Baltimore.

Redsfan320
12-23-2009, 09:36 AM
Nice job putting all that together, M-R. :thumbup:

320

Mario-Rijo
12-23-2009, 06:15 PM
Nice job putting all that together, M-R. :thumbup:

320

No problem, thanks for reading that mouthful. ;)

KoryMac5
12-23-2009, 06:35 PM
Shouldn't Peko and Crocker be back soon? I thought they were only supposed to be out a couple of weeks but I may have heard that wrong. At the very least we should have them back for the playoffs which is really the most important thing and hopefully they're both ready to go by then.

BTW-Over on the Orioles message board some of the Ravens fans don't want their guys to come to Cincy for a playoff game because they think they have a better shot at winning in New England. Did we just go into the Twilight Zone?! That just sounds so weird (good weird though!), LOL :laugh:

Peko and Crocker are going to try and give it a go at practice this week so we may get those two back for Sunday.

Mario-Rijo
12-28-2009, 02:43 AM
Apparently in my breakdown of potential playoff teams I must have overlooked a scenario. Evidently I hear when more than 2 teams are tied it's a totally different set of tiebreakers. I don't know what they are but right now if Baltimore and the Jets win next week they are in with the Jets making it as the 5th seed and the Ravens the 6 seed and probably coming to PBS (assuming NE wins, if not they could get reversed). If either loses who knows what happens. Personally I think I'd rather face the Ravens again, the Jets are better defensively and I think better offensively.

traderumor
12-28-2009, 08:16 AM
Apparently in my breakdown of potential playoff teams I must have overlooked a scenario. Evidently I hear when more than 2 teams are tied it's a totally different set of tiebreakers. I don't know what they are but right now if Baltimore and the Jets win next week they are in with the Jets making it as the 5th seed and the Ravens the 6 seed and probably coming to PBS (assuming NE wins, if not they could get reversed). If either loses who knows what happens. Personally I think I'd rather face the Ravens again, the Jets are better defensively and I think better offensively.The Jets are probably better defensively than the Ravens, but not offensively.

Redsfaithful
12-28-2009, 09:43 AM
I think the Bengals can beat the Jets or Ravens honestly, so I'm fine with whatever happens. The Ravens are really banged up, and the Bengals have matched up well with them for years anyway. Carson owns that team.

The Jets would worry me if it were a road game, but at home I'd feel pretty comfortable playing Mark Sanchez.

traderumor
12-28-2009, 10:39 AM
Something that strikes me about this year's playoffs is that there does not appear to be that team that is on a roll entering the playoffs that has a mediocre record in either conference, which is highly unusual. Could make for a predictable postseason.

Sea Ray
12-28-2009, 10:48 AM
Apparently in my breakdown of potential playoff teams I must have overlooked a scenario. Evidently I hear when more than 2 teams are tied it's a totally different set of tiebreakers. I don't know what they are but right now if Baltimore and the Jets win next week they are in with the Jets making it as the 5th seed and the Ravens the 6 seed and probably coming to PBS (assuming NE wins, if not they could get reversed). If either loses who knows what happens. Personally I think I'd rather face the Ravens again, the Jets are better defensively and I think better offensively.

If the Jets make it then the Bengals would be the #4 seed regardless of what NE does. As the #4 seed they'd play the #5 seed, not the #6 seed. So if your scenario plays out and the Jets are #5 then they'd come to Cincinnati in two weeks, not the #6 seed Balt. I want any team other than an AFC North team. I don't want to have to beat them three times. I look for the Bengals not to play their starters for 4 qtrs next week, thus a Jets win. Look for a lot of JT Sullivan, Jerome Simpson and Andre Smith

traderumor
12-28-2009, 10:54 AM
If the Jets make it then the Bengals would be the #4 seed regardless of what NE does. As the #4 seed they'd play the #5 seed, not the #6 seed. So if your scenario plays out and the Jets are #5 then they'd come to Cincinnati in two weeks, not the #6 seed Balt. I want any team other than an AFC North team. I don't want to have to beat them three times. I look for the Bengals not to play their starters for 4 qtrs next week, thus a Jets win. Look for a lot of JT Sullivan, Jerome Simpson and Andre Smithand Larry Johnson. That is a WC that makes me wonder if the Bengals might pull off the "upset" with their second stringers.

BuckeyeRedleg
12-28-2009, 11:21 AM
I can't believe I'm saying this, but rest and lose to the Jets. They will then get to play them again at home in 1st round of playoffs.

By losing, it prevents us from having to play the Ravens in the 1st round (if the Ravens win @Oak) and if Ravens lose it keeps Pittsburgh from the playoffs if they win. In that scenario, Denver and NYJ get in. Ha ha.

No reason to win next week. Rest up.

traderumor
12-28-2009, 12:23 PM
I can't believe I'm saying this, but rest and lose to the Jets. They will then get to play them again at home in 1st round of playoffs.

By losing, it prevents us from having to play the Ravens in the 1st round (if the Ravens win @Oak) and if Ravens lose it keeps Pittsburgh from the playoffs if they win. In that scenario, Denver and NYJ get in. Ha ha.

No reason to win next week. Rest up.I agree. No reason for Palmer, Benson, Chad to even play a down on O. Question is, who do you sit on D? Both starting corners? Dhani Jones? Play all second stringers on D? On this team, I think anyone on 1st string D is as important as our offensive key players.

bucksfan2
12-28-2009, 01:23 PM
I agree. No reason for Palmer, Benson, Chad to even play a down on O. Question is, who do you sit on D? Both starting corners? Dhani Jones? Play all second stringers on D? On this team, I think anyone on 1st string D is as important as our offensive key players.

I think Palmer and Chad should get their fair share of snaps. Lets assume that NE wins and the Bengals have little to gain from winning. Why not trot Palmer out there, use several different formations, and let him see how the defense reacts? The Jets have to win that game, they need to roll out all the stops in order to win. The Bengals could use that to their advantage on Sunday night. See what the D does different formations. See what Sanchez does when blitz is show, cover 2 is shown, press coverage is shown, etc.

BuckeyeRedleg
12-28-2009, 01:43 PM
I think Palmer and Chad should get their fair share of snaps. Lets assume that NE wins and the Bengals have little to gain from winning. Why not trot Palmer out there, use several different formations, and let him see how the defense reacts? The Jets have to win that game, they need to roll out all the stops in order to win. The Bengals could use that to their advantage on Sunday night. See what the D does different formations. See what Sanchez does when blitz is show, cover 2 is shown, press coverage is shown, etc.

Good point.