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GIDP
11-27-2009, 03:48 PM
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-bk-tiger-woods-accident,0,1369881.story


Professional golfer Tiger Woods was seriously injured in a car accident early this morning, the Florida Highway Patrol just reported.

Woods, 33, pulled out of his driveway in the Isleworth community about 2:25 a.m. when he struck a fire hydrant, and then drove into a tree at his neighbor's property, FHP reported.

JaxRed
11-27-2009, 04:06 PM
That's a weird one. Not alchohol related yet charges pending, serious injuries but less than 33 MPH.

GIDP
11-27-2009, 04:07 PM
Seriously what a weird story.

Reds4Life
11-27-2009, 04:08 PM
If alcohol wasn't involved, I wonder if he had some kind of medical issue. Like a seizure, or some type of heart problem.

I hope he makes a full recovery. :(

RFS62
11-27-2009, 04:13 PM
This being reported on several sites...


Tiger Woods in SUV crash near Florida home


Florida Highway Patrol is reporting Tiger Woods was transported the hospital early Friday after crashing his vehicle into a fire hydrant near his residence in Windermere, Fla., outside Orlando.

According to an official release from FHP and reported by Florida Today, Woods, had pulled out of his driveway in a Cadillac SUV.

As he began to drive .... (Woods) struck a fire hydrant," FHP reported. The front of Wood's vehicle "then struck a tree" located at a neighboring property.

Woods was transported to Health Central Hospital in Ocoee in serious condition, FHP reported, according to Orlando Sentinel. However, a hospital employee said at 2:30 p.m. ET that Woods was not a patient. A hospital operator would not say if Woods had been treated and released.

Florida Today says FHP is reporting the crash remains under investigation and that charges are pending. The extent of Woods' injuries are unknown.

The FHP report indicates alcohol was not a factor in the crash. It also indicates "unknown" on whether a seat belt was used.
http://blogs.usatoday.com/gameon/2009/11/tiger-woods-in-serious-condition-after-car-crash.html

Razor Shines
11-27-2009, 04:21 PM
Well, I'm glad his family wasn't with him and I'm glad alcohol wasn't involved. I hope he's ok.

Caseyfan21
11-27-2009, 04:23 PM
From a newscaster on Twitter:

darrenrovell1: Tiger Woods' agent on condition: "He is fine."

Dom Heffner
11-27-2009, 04:54 PM
Eyewitness accounts say he jumped out of the car and threw a tire iron into the crowd that gathered.

Reds4Life
11-27-2009, 04:56 PM
Eyewitness accounts say he jumped out of the car and threw a tire iron into the crowd that gathered.

For real?

Razor Shines
11-27-2009, 04:58 PM
Eyewitness accounts say he jumped out of the car and threw a tire iron into the crowd that gathered.

Can you blame him? He demands perfection from himself and he's been struggling to keep it in the middle lately. I bet someone took a picture during his turn.

Eric_the_Red
11-27-2009, 05:40 PM
Just saw on ESPN News that he was released from the hospital.

redsfan1966
11-27-2009, 05:52 PM
This is yet another case of how the media falls all over themselves overreacting to a story regarding a personality....first it was a "SERIOUS ACCIDENT", then it became a concern over his facial lacerations and now it is pretty much chalked up as a minor accident---come on ESPNNEWS, CNN, et al...dont you have anything else to report on?

Now, to get on my own "soap box"---it was reported that authorities said no alcohol was involved...but when someone pulls out of a driveway at 2:30 in the morning after Thanksgiving and takes out a hydrant and a tree...me thinks that person may be full of "Holiday Cheer" or he was just in a rush to get to the Doorbusters at Best Buy. :D

Reds4Life
11-27-2009, 05:59 PM
This is yet another case of how the media falls all over themselves overreacting to a story regarding a personality....first it was a "SERIOUS ACCIDENT", then it became a concern over his facial lacerations and now it is pretty much chalked up as a minor accident---come on ESPNNEWS, CNN, et al...dont you have anything else to report on?

Now, to get on my own "soap box"---it was reported that authorities said no alcohol was involved...but when someone pulls out of a driveway at 2:30 in the morning after Thanksgiving and takes out a hydrant and a tree...me thinks that person may be full of "Holiday Cheer" or he was just in a rush to get to the Doorbusters at Best Buy. :D

Most likely he was tanked. They showed a pic of his house, the neighbors house is next door and the driveways are linked. They probably couldn't charge him with DUI, since he was never on a public roadway or anything, always on private property.

Chip R
11-27-2009, 06:32 PM
I thought Tiger was a better driver than that. ;)

TC81190
11-27-2009, 08:41 PM
I thought Tiger was a better driver than that. ;)
Thread's over guys, you aren't topping this one.

RBA
11-27-2009, 10:32 PM
I didn't stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night and I'm not an attourney. But state laws for DWI/DUI apply on private property in most states, if not all.

Spring~Fields
11-27-2009, 11:16 PM
I thought Tiger was a better driver than that. ;)

Hydrant in one :dunno: How do you score that tree on the follow through though?

Seriously though I am glad that he is alright at this time.

macro
11-28-2009, 01:46 AM
...or he was just in a rush to get to the Doorbusters at Best Buy. :D

That was similar to my comment when I heard this happened at 2:30am. I said "I seriously doubt he was going to get in line at Walmart to save $3.00 on a toaster".

Boston Red
11-28-2009, 02:16 AM
TMZ always manages to make things interesting.

http://www.tmz.com/2009/11/28/tiger-woods-elin-nordegren-fight-accident-suv-lacerations/

reds44
11-28-2009, 02:18 AM
Brings a new meaning to Tiger drove one into the trees.

Razor Shines
11-28-2009, 06:07 AM
If you're on Twitter and don't follow the SklarBrothers you should.

Here's their tweet on the Tiger thing:


SklarBrothers Tiger woods hit a fire hydrant and then a tree. What's the big deal? That's how John Daly pulls out of his driveway every night.

GAC
11-28-2009, 07:23 AM
It's reported that his wife smashed out the back window with a club to help him get out, while Tiger was heard screaming "NOT THE ALPHA DRIVER! NOT THE ALPHA!"

that's their story and they're sticking with it. :p:

Redhook
11-28-2009, 08:07 AM
TMZ always manages to make things interesting.

http://www.tmz.com/2009/11/28/tiger-woods-elin-nordegren-fight-accident-suv-lacerations/

Hmmmm. Makes sense actually.

Bob Borkowski
11-28-2009, 08:31 AM
TMZ always manages to make things interesting.

http://www.tmz.com/2009/11/28/tiger-woods-elin-nordegren-fight-accident-suv-lacerations/

I buy this summary of events.

The police version is full of holes.

Red in Chicago
11-28-2009, 10:04 AM
hell hath no fury...

Reds4Life
11-28-2009, 10:33 AM
TMZ version makes a lot of sense. A lot more sense than the story released by the police.

George Foster
11-28-2009, 12:05 PM
TMZ version makes a lot of sense. A lot more sense than the story released by the police.

When I first heard the story I thought it was BS. I told my wife at lunch, that they were fighting, she hit him, he was getting out of dodge to avoid a bigger fight (smart), as he was leaving and driving off she smashed his rear window. She probably threw the golf club like a boomerang, that was what distracted him and he wrecked. ( IF they argue like me and my wife, it goes from room to room...so her having a chance to grab a club out of a closet, makes a lot more since in this scenario.)

My wife said, "How many people with little kids, keep golf glubs just laying around? The story of her hearing him wreck, and having the forethought to grab a golf club, just in case Tiger might not be able to get out of the car is ludacris.

Razor Shines
11-28-2009, 12:52 PM
When I first heard the story I thought it was BS. I told my wife at lunch, that they were fighting, she hit him, he was getting out of dodge to avoid a bigger fight (smart), as he was leaving and driving off she smashed his rear window. She probably threw the golf club like a boomerang, that was what distracted him and he wrecked. ( IF they argue like me and my wife, it goes from room to room...so her having a chance to grab a club out of a closet, makes a lot more since in this scenario.)

My wife said, "How many people with little kids, keep golf glubs just laying around? The story of her hearing him wreck, and having the forethought to grab a golf club, just in case Tiger might not be able to get out of the car is ludacris.

Yeah, "Oh no! Tiger's stuck in his car......I could run back inside and grab the extra set of keys, or I could go find one of his golf clubs and smash the rear window out..........Golf Club!"

REDblooded
11-28-2009, 01:28 PM
Best one-liner on this one came from another board I frequent...


"shortest drive of his life"

RedsManRick
11-28-2009, 01:34 PM
The TMZ report definitely seems the most complete of all the ones I've heard. I didn't quite buy that she had to use a club to rescue him from the car...

GIDP
11-28-2009, 02:51 PM
Pfft Women

RBA
11-28-2009, 03:30 PM
The only answer I can think of that might work is when hearing the crash she grabbed a gofl club for protection while going out to investigate. Afterall it's in the middle of the night.

But, I think the TMZ story is most likely.

cincinnati chili
11-28-2009, 03:33 PM
As sensational as it sounds, the TMZ account - a domestic dispute spilling into the driveway - is the most likely explanation next to a medical issue like sleepwalking or a seizure. I was skeptical that alcohol wasn't involved, but it would be a pretty big deal if police had ignored any signs of intoxication on a case like this, which they should know would draw international scrutiny.

SunDeck
11-28-2009, 03:45 PM
She took a tip from Tiger on how to hurl that club, is what I'm thinking.

cincinnati chili
11-28-2009, 05:50 PM
If your loved ones were in a locked car unconscious and you wanted to get them out, which window would you break? I think my LAST choice would be to break the back window.

update:

http://sports.espn.go.com/golf/news/story?id=4695680

Redhook
11-28-2009, 08:17 PM
Here's what I'm pondering:

If Tiger now has a Nike Swoosh symbol imprinted on his forehead, would Nike still pay him?

redsfan1966
11-28-2009, 08:33 PM
that TMZ report does make a lot of sense---as far as filling in the holes in the police report....the only question I have is that the police said Tiger was lying in the street...the TMZ report doesnt make mention of that..

fearofpopvol1
11-29-2009, 01:24 AM
Tiger and his wife were both supposed to be questioned today, but have asked for another day before answering questions.

If they had nothing to hide, why would they need another day?

Redhook
11-29-2009, 08:37 AM
The longer this goes, the uglier it's getting for Tiger. Right now, he probably wishes it was just an intoxication accident. Unfortunately, it appears it's much more serious than that which could cost him many endorsements and possibly his marriage.

Unassisted
11-29-2009, 10:28 AM
If TMZ is correct and there was domestic assault involved, I'm wondering why someone wasn't charged at the time of the accident. Doesn't Florida law have that requirement?

TeamSelig
11-29-2009, 03:31 PM
Sounds like Tiger needs a new driver

Razor Shines
11-29-2009, 03:46 PM
Tiger's Statement:


As you all know, I had a single-car accident earlier this week, and sustained some injuries. I have some cuts, bruising and right now I'm pretty sore.

This situation is my fault, and it's obviously embarrassing to my family and me. I'm human and I'm not perfect. I will certainly make sure this doesn't happen again.

This is a private matter and I want to keep it that way. Although I understand there is curiosity, the many false, unfounded and malicious rumors that are currently circulating about my family and me are irresponsible.

The only person responsible for the accident is me. My wife, Elin, acted courageously when she saw I was hurt and in trouble. She was the first person to help me. Any other assertion is absolutely false.

This incident has been stressful and very difficult for Elin, our family and me. I appreciate all the concern and well wishes that we have received. But, I would also ask for some understanding that my family and I deserve some privacy no matter how intrusive some people can be.

Chip R
11-29-2009, 03:52 PM
Tiger's Statement:

That's about the biggest bunch of horse hockey I've read for a long time.

Reds4Life
11-29-2009, 04:38 PM
Tiger also cancelled his meeting with the Florida Highway Patrol again today, for the third time.

That does nothing but make him look guilty of something. If nothing really happened, and it's all just some freak occurance, then he should have no problem explaining it to the police.

Chip R
11-29-2009, 04:48 PM
Nothing will happen. He's just going to stonewall the cops until they decide to just give up and leave it as an ordinary traffic accident. It's not that Tiger fears any charges. He just doesn't want anyone asking questions about his private life. He doesn't want people knowing why he was leaving his home at that time or why his wife bashed out the back windows with a golf club.

Reds4Life
11-29-2009, 04:56 PM
Nothing will happen. He's just going to stonewall the cops until they decide to just give up and leave it as an ordinary traffic accident. It's not that Tiger fears any charges. He just doesn't want anyone asking questions about his private life. He doesn't want people knowing why he was leaving his home at that time or why his wife bashed out the back windows with a golf club.

Yeah, he wants the story to drop. But there are other reasons, if it comes out his wife is the one who busted up his face, then she could be facing domestic violence charges.

MWM
11-29-2009, 05:54 PM
I don't see why everyone cares so much or think they're entitled to knowing the "real story." It's an accident that didn't affect anyone else and he wasn't driving drunk. So who cares if he's telling the truth or not here. They have every right to want to keep this private. This sounds an awful lot like folks wanting to feed their appetite for tearing down the rich and famous, one of america's pastimes.

I'll admit to being a big fan of Tiger. If alcohol would have been involved, I would have forever not been able to root for the guy any more. But otherwise, there's nothing here that appears to be something anyone is entitled to know. Some might WANT to know, but that does not mean they have a right. Unless something else comes out that shows why this is a public concern, I'm not going to care one way or the other what truly happened.

We're naive if we think the likes of Tiger Woods and others are somehow exempt from marital problems. It's also naive to think the majority of professional athletes, golfers included, aren't out there fooling around. I take it as a given.

kaldaniels
11-29-2009, 06:07 PM
Tiger is showing up the police right now...never a good idea.

GIDP
11-29-2009, 06:08 PM
Tiger Woods is doing the right thing because you know those cops are just dying to find something to charge someone with.

Screwball
11-29-2009, 06:10 PM
I don't see why everyone cares so much or think they're entitled to knowing the "real story." It's an accident that didn't affect anyone else and he wasn't driving drunk. So who cares if he's telling the truth or not here. They have every right to want to keep this private. This sounds an awful lot like folks wanting to feed their appetite for tearing down the rich and famous, one of america's pastimes.

I'll admit to being a big fan of Tiger. If alcohol would have been involved, I would have forever not been able to root for the guy any more. But otherwise, there's nothing here that appears to be something anyone is entitled to know. Some might WANT to know, but that does not mean they have a right. Unless something else comes out that shows why this is a public concern, I'm not going to care one way or the other what truly happened.

We're naive if we think the likes of Tiger Woods and others are somehow exempt from marital problems. It's also naive to think the majority of professional athletes, golfers included, aren't out there fooling around. I take it as a given.

Tiger has been my hero and role model for over a decade now. He's arguably the most famous and recognizable sports figure in the world. He's the face of golf and has given inspiration to countless people around the globe. Sue me if I wanna know what happened during a bizarre incident involving him.

Joseph
11-29-2009, 06:14 PM
I think curiosity is fine. It's when it becomes a sense of entitlement that it bothers me. No one is entitled to know.

texasdave
11-29-2009, 06:26 PM
I think curiosity is fine. It's when it becomes a sense of entitlement that it bothers me. No one is entitled to know.

I agree with this statement wholeheartedly. If Tiger wishes for this to remain a private matter, so be it.

MWM
11-29-2009, 06:40 PM
Tiger has been my hero and role model for over a decade now. He's arguably the most famous and recognizable sports figure in the world. He's the face of golf and has given inspiration to countless people around the globe. Sue me if I wanna know what happened during a bizarre incident involving him.

Doesn't matter what you WANT to know. Being a fan does not entitle us to anything. If he gbroke the law, he should be held accountable. If this somehow impacted anyone other than Tiger and/or Elin, then that's also a different story. But it appears thus far that this is something that had nothing to do with anyone else but them. They have every right not to want to make it a public scene. Does the TMZ account seem plausible? Sure. Does that mean we should assume it's the truth? No. I'd be more surprised if a guy like Tiger Woods WASN'T having multiple flings as I would about any well-known professional athlete. But it's still none of our business.

westofyou
11-29-2009, 06:53 PM
Doesn't matter what you WANT to know. Being a fan does not entitle us to anything. If he gbroke the law, he should be held accountable. If this somehow impacted anyone other than Tiger and/or Elin, then that's also a different story. But it appears thus far that this is something that had nothing to do with anyone else but them. They have every right not to want to make it a public scene. Does the TMZ account seem plausible? Sure. Does that mean we should assume it's the truth? No. I'd be more surprised if a guy like Tiger Woods WASN'T having multiple flings as I would about any well-known professional athlete. But it's still none of our business.

Yep, Tiger Woods is a person, not a product that needs to ensure that those who use it are note being duped.

kaldaniels
11-29-2009, 07:03 PM
A couple people have posted that no one is entitled to know details...my question for the legal guys in here is what are we legally entitled to know? Cause I'd say the minute he hit the fire hydrant that is probably publically funded...it isn't a private matter anymore.

GIDP
11-29-2009, 07:06 PM
A couple people have posted that no one is entitled to know details...my question for the legal guys in here is what are we legally entitled to know? Cause I'd say the minute he hit the fire hydrant that is probably pubibally funded...it isn't a private matter anymore.

I'm pretty sure but its just a traffic accident. He doesn't have to say anything other than give his licensee and registration or what not. At least thats what I know. Im not a legal guy but he doesnt have to discuss anything.

RBA
11-29-2009, 07:07 PM
Tiger Woods is doing the right thing because you know those cops are just dying to find something to charge someone with.


Well, it looks like the cops were ready to play along with the story until the media got ahold of it. Now the cops don't want to be seen as giving a famous person a break. But the fact of the matter is that many domestic calls are swept under the rug regardless of the couples social standing; rightly or wrongly, it happens.

RFS62
11-29-2009, 07:14 PM
LEAVE TIGER ALONE!!!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qOW__TneAY

dabvu2498
11-29-2009, 07:22 PM
Well, it looks like the cops were ready to play along with the story until the media got ahold of it. Now the cops don't want to be seen as giving a famous person a break. But the fact of the matter is that many domestic calls are swept under the rug regardless of the couples social standing; rightly or wrongly, it happens. Not so much anymore. Law enforcement has had their pants sued off for ignoring dv or sweeping it under the rug as you say. Typically, if police get a call with even a hint of dv, they arrest everybody and let the courts sort it out. Sounds to me like the Woods' story on the scene passed the smell test and the officers let it ride. Now it has a life of its own. Btw, the Woods' also have some measure of spousal immunity in this case.

Chip R
11-29-2009, 07:26 PM
Well, it looks like the cops were ready to play along with the story until the media got ahold of it. Now the cops don't want to be seen as giving a famous person a break. But the fact of the matter is that many domestic calls are swept under the rug regardless of the couples social standing; rightly or wrongly, it happens.

I think you're right but I don't think they are going to want to make a federal case out of an accident like this. It's going to look like they are going after him because he's a celebrity. He'll get an army of lawyers in there and they tie that little police department up in knots.

I agree that we aren't entitled to know anything about this and if John Daly had done the same thing it wouldn't have been news since he does stuff like this all the time. When someone like Tiger does this, it's news because he's seen to be perfect. Good father, good husband, he never says or does anything controversial off the golf course. When something like this happens on the heels of an allegation that he may have a girlfriend, it's news.

What I think will be interesting is the way the news organizations will handle this. If they don't treat him with kid gloves, they could risk their relationship with him.

edabbs44
11-29-2009, 09:22 PM
Doesn't matter what you WANT to know. Being a fan does not entitle us to anything. If he gbroke the law, he should be held accountable. If this somehow impacted anyone other than Tiger and/or Elin, then that's also a different story. But it appears thus far that this is something that had nothing to do with anyone else but them. They have every right not to want to make it a public scene. Does the TMZ account seem plausible? Sure. Does that mean we should assume it's the truth? No. I'd be more surprised if a guy like Tiger Woods WASN'T having multiple flings as I would about any well-known professional athlete. But it's still none of our business.

Where I kind of agree, the fact is that when you become this big people are going to want to know what the story is when a big event like this takes place. Look at when his babies were born. Didn't he publish personal photos of his family shortly after? Is it OK to let fans into your lives when it is a positive time but those same fans need to butt out when something happens that might reflect on you in a negative manner? In a perfect world it would be yes but that is a difficult request.

Screwball
11-29-2009, 10:59 PM
Doesn't matter what you WANT to know. Being a fan does not entitle us to anything.

You (and a couple others) keep saying this as though anybody on the thread has demanded some sort of explanation, or has stated they're "entitled" to the truth. In fact, neither of those are true. Most posters on here, like most people I've talked to about it, are simply curious as to what's happened. It's human nature to wonder aloud when someone this prominent and held in such high regard is involved in a situation like this.

Look, I get it, he doesn't have to tell us. It's his private matter. Still doesn't make me wonder any less. And if somebody knows what happened, yeah, I'd like to hear it. If you want to villify me for that, go ahead, I won't object. But there's no need to argue against something nobody's defending.

Boston Red
11-30-2009, 12:57 AM
Whether we're entitled or not, the truth will come out. TMZ, et al, will see to that.

I bet a lot of Tiger's sponsors feel entitled to know the truth.

Unassisted
11-30-2009, 02:02 AM
Regardless of who in Tiger's household did what or whether any laws were broken, I doubt that any of us would have the luxury of being able to stiff-arm our local police when they're trying to interview us and investigate something we did. If he gets to play by different rules than we do, it'll drive a wedge into his relationship with the public.

kaldaniels
11-30-2009, 02:16 AM
This can be said...Tiger has gone all in with his statement. If anything in this accident turns out/is proven to be of the "sordid" type, his credibility is gone. That said, with the way he is handled, the only way I see him making a statement as he did today is if his story is airtight in regards to any leaks coming out to the public.

Dom Heffner
11-30-2009, 08:49 AM
Regardless of who in Tiger's household did what or whether any laws were broken, I doubt that any of us would have the luxury of being able to stiff-arm our local police when they're trying to interview us and investigate something we did. If he gets to play by different rules than we do, it'll drive a wedge into his relationship with the public.

I don't think any of us is required to give a statement to police.

westofyou
11-30-2009, 11:02 AM
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20091130/COL22/911300357/1319/If-its-not-about-golf-Tiger-owes-us-no-explanation&template=fullarticle

If it's not about golf, Tiger Woods owes us no explanation


This is not in the Bill of Rights, but I think all Americans have a right to screw up their own marriages. I don't know if Tiger Woods has exercised that right or not. We might never know. It is, frankly, not our business.

By now, you have surely heard the story: Woods backed out of his driveway late at night, hit a fire hydrant and a tree, and ended up in the hospital. He has facial lacerations that seem to be incongruous for a low-speed accident, unless Tiger is in the habit of shaving after 2 a.m. while backing out of his driveway. The National Enquirer is reporting that Woods has had some weekend pairings with a woman other than his wife Elin. Tiger and Elin have declined repeated requests to talk to the police.

Woods released a statement on his Web site -- his preferred method of communication, which read, in part: "This situation is my fault, and it's obviously embarrassing to my family and me. I'm human and I'm not perfect. I will certainly make sure this doesn't happen again."

It was a clever piece of writing by somebody -- a public-relations flak, a lawyer, maybe both. Woods never really said what the "situation" was. It was a pretty heavy apology for backing into a fire hydrant. Maybe Woods is implying that yes, he did indeed cheat on his wife ... or maybe he isn't. Maybe he hasn't decided what to say.

Let's face it: If you get into a one-car accident outside your house, and you were sober and nobody got seriously injured, there is no reason to avoid the police for three days and tell the world you are "not perfect" and "will certainly make sure this doesn't happen again."

It was half apology, half plea to butt out of his business. And really, it is all that Woods owes the public. Anything else he did (or didn't do) is between him and his family.

You can say that Tiger Woods owes the public an explanation and an apology, since he has sold himself as a family man. But has he, really? His wife never gives interviews. Once in a while, you'll see him give Elin a kiss after he wins a tournament, or you'll see his daughter run onto the 18th green.

Sometimes Tiger will release a family photo or two on his Web site, but he seems to do that mostly to keep the paparazzi at bay. He does not want to create an environment where pictures of his family are so rare that there is a tabloid bidding war for them.

He does not lecture the media about how family is more important than golf. He does not respond to criticism by saying, "Hey, I'm a wonderful father and husband -- why don't you write that?"

He does not tell anybody else how to live. Derek Jeter wrote an inspirational book called "The Life You Imagine." Rick Pitino wrote the self-help book "Success Is A Choice: Ten Steps To Overachieving in Business and Life."

Tiger Woods called his best-selling book "How I Play Golf."

Early in Tiger's career, his father Earl hinted that he was some sort of religious figure, chosen to change the world. But Tiger has never claimed to be anything besides a golfer.

I have followed Woods from inside the ropes for at least a dozen rounds in his career. (It's a tough job, but somebody has to do it.) People shout his name and he doesn't even twitch. They ask for autographs and he does not even shake his head no -- he just keeps walking.

If people have decided that Tiger Woods is a wonderful human being, it is mostly because he has given them no reason to think otherwise.

Mostly, Tiger Woods just wants to win every tournament he plays, make all the money that goes with it, then live as privately (and luxuriously) as he can. You can wonder if he is a good husband. You can wonder what happened in his house this weekend. You can wonder if the National Enquirer is right. Or you can think about the only thing that Tiger Woods has ever really cared to show the world: how he plays golf.

Chip R
11-30-2009, 12:30 PM
The cops have upped the ante. Now they are trying to get a subpoena for hospital records to see if the injuries Tiger suffered were from the wreck or his wife.

http://sports.espn.go.com/golf/news/story?id=4699907

Reds4Life
11-30-2009, 12:39 PM
The cops have upped the ante. Now they are trying to get a subpoena for hospital records to see if the injuries Tiger suffered were from the wreck or his wife.

http://sports.espn.go.com/golf/news/story?id=4699907

Not suprised. If Tiger wants to do things the hard way, they are going to play ball.

Hoosier Red
11-30-2009, 12:49 PM
Not suprised. If Tiger wants to do things the hard way, they are going to play ball.

This is idiotic. But I think like Plaxico Burress, Tiger's celebrity is going to work against him.

Basically the only law Tiger broke was running over the fire hydrant. He gets a ticket for reckless driving, maybe he has to go to Blockbuster and pick up one of those defensive driving classes(and pass the oh so hard test at the end) but basically this is not something the police need to investigate. But rather than look like they're intimidated by el Tigre, they feel like they have to now look into things further.

BRM
11-30-2009, 12:57 PM
This is idiotic. But I think like Plaxico Burress, Tiger's celebrity is going to work against him.

Basically the only law Tiger broke was running over the fire hydrant. He gets a ticket for reckless driving, maybe he has to go to Blockbuster and pick up one of those defensive driving classes(and pass the oh so hard test at the end) but basically this is not something the police need to investigate. But rather than look like they're intimidated by el Tigre, they feel like they have to now look into things further.

If they suspect domestic violence, don't they have to investigate?

Reds4Life
11-30-2009, 01:04 PM
If they suspect domestic violence, don't they have to investigate?

Yes. If they have probale cause, his wife can be arrested without Tiger pressing charges as well. Police have a lot of wiggle room in domestic cases.

He wouldn't get a reckless driving charge, if anything it would be failure to control.

Chip R
11-30-2009, 01:11 PM
Seems like Tiger shouldn't have cancelled his police interviews. A plausible story that was halfway true plus a nice donation to the policeman's ball probably would have put an end to it.

kaldaniels
11-30-2009, 01:20 PM
Entitled has been a key word in this thread. Does anyone think Tiger and his wife are entitled to cover up domestic violence? Not saying it happened, but if it did, is his stonewalling ok?

reds44
11-30-2009, 01:23 PM
Why does all of this seem to be coming with a negative connotation toward Tiger? So worst case his wife is nuts and beat the crap out of him? That's his fault?

savafan
11-30-2009, 01:31 PM
Why does all of this seem to be coming with a negative connotation toward Tiger? So worst case his wife is nuts and beat the crap out of him? That's his fault?

I think it would come down to what her reasons were for beating the crap out of him.

reds44
11-30-2009, 01:48 PM
Oh so if a girl beats the crap out of a guy for *alledgedly* cheating on them its ok?

Chip R
11-30-2009, 01:51 PM
Oh so if a girl beats the crap out of a guy for *alledgedly* cheating on them its ok?


No one said it was OK.

dabvu2498
11-30-2009, 01:54 PM
He was just heading out to meet Billy Gillispie for their 3 am tee time.

fearofpopvol1
11-30-2009, 03:45 PM
Doesn't matter what you WANT to know. Being a fan does not entitle us to anything. If he gbroke the law, he should be held accountable. If this somehow impacted anyone other than Tiger and/or Elin, then that's also a different story. But it appears thus far that this is something that had nothing to do with anyone else but them. They have every right not to want to make it a public scene. Does the TMZ account seem plausible? Sure. Does that mean we should assume it's the truth? No. I'd be more surprised if a guy like Tiger Woods WASN'T having multiple flings as I would about any well-known professional athlete. But it's still none of our business.

If domestic violence was involved, then it is the duty of the police to find out this information and report it. And it looks like they are making a serious play to do so. Good on them.

I'm so sick and tired of these celebrities and athletes thinking THEY are ENTITLED to special treatment (families of the athletes too). Maybe domestic violence wasn't involved, but since he's refusing to meet with police and has cancelled the meeting 3 times and then ultimately refused to meet with them, I think speculation is fair and the probability he's guilty is quite high.

RBA
11-30-2009, 03:55 PM
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20091130/COL22/911300357/1319/If-its-not-about-golf-Tiger-owes-us-no-explanation&template=fullarticle

If it's not about golf, Tiger Woods owes us no explanation

I like how the article says Tiger Woods owes us no explanation and then goes on to rehash every rumor out there on what had happen.

GIDP
11-30-2009, 04:18 PM
If Tiger doesnt want to explain then he shouldn't get too upset at people reporting things.

Roy Tucker
11-30-2009, 04:32 PM
Sure seems like some kind of domestic shenanigans took place. Wife just happened to bring a golf club to an accident in the driveway at 2:45 AM and windows are broken out? That's always the first thing I bring to an accident scene. Yeah, uh-huh, OK.

Does Tiger owe an explanation to the public? No, he's always just been a golfer, nothing more.

Will he look bad if he doesn't? Most probably the way these kinds of media firestorms can get whipped up.

Is this fair? Probably not, but that's the life of a mega-star. Comes with the territory.

Hoosier Red
11-30-2009, 04:40 PM
If domestic violence was involved, then it is the duty of the police to find out this information and report it. And it looks like they are making a serious play to do so. Good on them.

I'm so sick and tired of these celebrities and athletes thinking THEY are ENTITLED to special treatment (families of the athletes too). Maybe domestic violence wasn't involved, but since he's refusing to meet with police and has cancelled the meeting 3 times and then ultimately refused to meet with them, I think speculation is fair and the probability he's guilty is quite high.

Can't wait till you're on a jury.

Just curious, what makes you say he's seeking "special" treatment? The police want to ask him questions, he doesn't want to let them, he's under no legal obligation to do so.

If they want to go hard on him it's their choice but based on what we know, is there anything they'd be able to arrest him for?

WMR
11-30-2009, 04:50 PM
If domestic violence was involved, then it is the duty of the police to find out this information and report it. And it looks like they are making a serious play to do so. Good on them.

I'm so sick and tired of these celebrities and athletes thinking THEY are ENTITLED to special treatment (families of the athletes too). Maybe domestic violence wasn't involved, but since he's refusing to meet with police and has cancelled the meeting 3 times and then ultimately refused to meet with them, I think speculation is fair and the probability he's guilty is quite high.

Can't wait till you're on a jury.

Just curious, what makes you say he's seeking "special" treatment? The police want to ask him questions, he doesn't want to let them, he's under no legal obligation to do so.

If they want to go hard on him it's their choice but based on what we know, is there anything they'd be able to arrest him for?

Getting whipped by your old lady, while embarrassing, doesn't rise to the level of criminality. :D

cincrazy
11-30-2009, 05:13 PM
Oh so if a girl beats the crap out of a guy for *alledgedly* cheating on them its ok?

Well, to the public it's "alleged." Maybe she found something out that led her to express her rage upside Tiger's head?

I think it's all silly to be honest. It's nobody's business. I watch Tiger because he's a great golfer, not because of the type of person he is. I know that sounds terrible, but I long ago gave up on the idea of public people being "role models." Most people in a position of power and prestige are going to be anything but.

Jack Burton
11-30-2009, 10:28 PM
So his wife found out he was having an affair and took a golf club to his face? She must have roughed him up pretty good if he couldn't even see well enough to get out of the driveway. That, or he was drunk.

Razor Shines
11-30-2009, 10:30 PM
So his wife found out he was having an affair and took a golf club to his face? She must have roughed him up pretty good if he couldn't even see well enough to get out of the driveway. That, or he was drunk.

If it was his wife, I had imagined that he was distracted by her bashing out the windows of his Escalade while he was trying to drive away.

fearofpopvol1
11-30-2009, 11:11 PM
If domestic violence was involved, then it is the duty of the police to find out this information and report it. And it looks like they are making a serious play to do so. Good on them.

I'm so sick and tired of these celebrities and athletes thinking THEY are ENTITLED to special treatment (families of the athletes too). Maybe domestic violence wasn't involved, but since he's refusing to meet with police and has cancelled the meeting 3 times and then ultimately refused to meet with them, I think speculation is fair and the probability he's guilty is quite high.

Can't wait till you're on a jury.

Just curious, what makes you say he's seeking "special" treatment? The police want to ask him questions, he doesn't want to let them, he's under no legal obligation to do so.

If they want to go hard on him it's their choice but based on what we know, is there anything they'd be able to arrest him for?

Let's be real about it...the court of public opinion is quite a bit different than the court of law.

I don't know that he's seeking "special treatment," but he's being arrogant about it. If he has nothing to hide, then why shouldn't he talk to police? If you didn't do anything wrong, wouldn't you want to clear your name?

He drove without shoes on. That's illegal in the state of Florida. Obviously not a serious offense, but if his wife did physically assault him, regardless of why, the police should absolutely investigate this. When Chris Brown beat up Rihanna, the police and the public at large absolutely wanted him prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. IF the same is true here, why should there be a double standard because she's a woman? It was the exact same thing...2 high profile people in a relationship with the person who got clocked and then tried to cover it up. His wife shouldn't get a pass for that if she did it.

If that chick assaulted Tiger, then she's crazy and she could assault anyone else. The crazies should be locked up. Good on the Police for investigating this further. I hope they unconver the truth.

reds44
11-30-2009, 11:58 PM
If it was his wife, I had imagined that he was distracted by her bashing out the windows of his Escalade while he was trying to drive away.
Either that or the crazy chick jumped in front of his car and he had to swerve to avoid her.

Hoosier Red
12-01-2009, 01:00 AM
[QUOTE=Hoosier Red;1996619]

Let's be real about it...the court of public opinion is quite a bit different than the court of law.

I don't know that he's seeking "special treatment," but he's being arrogant about it. If he has nothing to hide, then why shouldn't he talk to police? If you didn't do anything wrong, wouldn't you want to clear your name?

He drove without shoes on. That's illegal in the state of Florida. Obviously not a serious offense, but if his wife did physically assault him, regardless of why, the police should absolutely investigate this. When Chris Brown beat up Rihanna, the police and the public at large absolutely wanted him prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. IF the same is true here, why should there be a double standard because she's a woman? It was the exact same thing...2 high profile people in a relationship with the person who got clocked and then tried to cover it up. His wife shouldn't get a pass for that if she did it.

If that chick assaulted Tiger, then she's crazy and she could assault anyone else. The crazies should be locked up. Good on the Police for investigating this further. I hope they unconver the truth.

Fine. Two more points on his license for driving without shoes. Again if the police want to investigate go at it, but to act like he's just some spoiled celebrity is completely unfair. He's a US Citizen and fortunately the law doesn't act like you're insinuating.

If he has nothing to hide or something to hide it's his right not to talk to police. I've yet to hear any reason why he should talk to them.

jojo
12-01-2009, 01:09 AM
If Tiger doesnt want to explain then he shouldn't get too upset at people reporting things.

Unless of course it's a bunch of supposition and lies that slander him.

KronoRed
12-01-2009, 01:50 AM
What's the point with even wondering? it's pretty clear most people have already decided they "know" what happened and nothing Tiger says will change it.

GIDP
12-01-2009, 09:38 AM
Unless of course it's a bunch of supposition and lies that slander him.

It's medias job to report on things. When you are one of the the biggest sports star in the world you have to expect things to happen. Tiger is the reason for the rumors getting spread.

jojo
12-01-2009, 10:11 AM
It's medias job to report on things. When you are one of the the biggest sports star in the world you have to expect things to happen. Tiger is the reason for the rumors getting spread.

It's the media's job to report news.

Could Tiger have made this all go away with a press conference? Its a compelling argument until one realizes that its the National Inquirer and TMZ that is being cited as credible sources by the AP and CNN etc...

Tiger is well within his right to guard his privacy. There is no justification for rumor mongering. People want titillated by poking their noses in other people's business. There is nothing noble about enabling that for a profit.

The guy plays golf (super-humanly well) and is often criticized for not using his fame to take up social causes. There really isn't even a hypocritical "gotcha" moment here if all of the rumors are true.

Why have no right to know details about his family and personal life.

This is gossip column stuff.

Sea Ray
12-01-2009, 10:19 AM
What's the point with even wondering? it's pretty clear most people have already decided they "know" what happened and nothing Tiger says will change it.

I don't know about that. If Tiger has a more plausible explanation I'd love to hear it. He has a chance to explain it all away and he's chosen not to. Naturally this will lead to speculation.

This reminds me of Pete Rose who continually delayed his meeting with Bart Giamatti until finally he gave up his meeting altogether in lieu of signing the famous agreement.

Tiger has every right to refuse to speak to police but such a stance makes it look like he has a lot to hide.

Chip R
12-01-2009, 10:25 AM
Why have no right to know details about his family and personal life.

This is gossip column stuff.


When the cops get involved, it's no longer gossip column stuff. The reports of him having an affair with that girl are gossip column stuff. When property gets damaged and 911 is called and the police are subpoening for blood records then it's no longer gossip column stuff.

Sea Ray
12-01-2009, 10:29 AM
It's the media's job to report news.




Yep and when a famous family gives an implausible accounting for a 911 event, it is newsworthy.

It is not about Tiger's right to not speak nor our right to know. It's news because it interests the public.

TMZ and the National Enquirer were very accurate on the John Edwards story

GIDP
12-01-2009, 10:33 AM
It's the media's job to report news.

Could Tiger have made this all go away with a press conference? Its a compelling argument until one realizes that its the National Inquirer and TMZ that is being cited as credible sources by the AP and CNN etc...

Tiger is well within his right to guard his privacy. There is no justification for rumor mongering. People want titillated by poking their noses in other people's business. There is nothing noble about enabling that for a profit.

The guy plays golf (super-humanly well) and is often criticized for not using his fame to take up social causes. There really isn't even a hypocritical "gotcha" moment here if all of the rumors are true.

Why have no right to know details about his family and personal life.

This is gossip column stuff.

Gossip column stuff has also broke plenty of news stories.

jojo
12-01-2009, 10:53 AM
When the cops get involved, it's no longer gossip column stuff. The reports of him having an affair with that girl are gossip column stuff. When property gets damaged and 911 is called and the police are subpoening for blood records then it's no longer gossip column stuff.

It's a very minor traffic accident (the characterization of the police) in a gated community and the police report indicates the wreck was not alcohol-related. He has complied fully with his legal obligations to the police to the point he is no longer obligated to interact with them.

Is his behavior strange and suspicious? Sure, if he was one of us. Is it telling for a person of his public notoriety? Not really. He's obviously guarded his private life very closely as a professional. Anything he says to the police is almost guaranteed to end up twisted into TMZ's efforts to make a profit.

If he wants his private life to be private...that's his right.

While it might be understandable that we're curious, gossiping is gossiping.

GIDP
12-01-2009, 10:57 AM
If he wants his life to be private then maybe he should get out of being a pro golfer and doing commercials. I think people give tiger more than enough space. When you are making money off your fans the way he does outside of winning golf tournaments you expose yourself to extra scrutiny.

jojo
12-01-2009, 11:13 AM
If he wants his life to be private then maybe he should get out of being a pro golfer and doing commercials. I think people give tiger more than enough space. When you are making money off your fans the way he does outside of winning golf tournaments you expose yourself to extra scrutiny.

Saying buy Nike stuff because I use it on the golf course opens one up to extra scrutiny?

Sea Ray
12-01-2009, 11:15 AM
Anything he says to the police is almost guaranteed to end up twisted into TMZ's efforts to make a profit.

If he wants his private life to be private...that's his right.

While it might be understandable that we're curious, gossiping is gossiping.

TMZ will get a lot more mileage out of this if Tiger lets it fester.

GIDP
12-01-2009, 11:22 AM
Saying buy Nike stuff because I use it on the golf course opens one up to extra scrutiny?

Yes. You endorsing a product and telling people to buy it is built on trust. If your private image isnt what is perceived people would want to know. Hiding the negatives annoys people who support you and it opens yourself up to them wanting to know.

Chip R
12-01-2009, 11:29 AM
It's a very minor traffic accident (the characterization of the police) in a gated community and the police report indicates the wreck was not alcohol-related. He has complied fully with his legal obligations to the police to the point he is no longer obligated to interact with them.

Is his behavior strange and suspicious? Sure, if he was one of us. Is it telling for a person of his public notoriety? Not really. He's obviously guarded his private life very closely as a professional. Anything he says to the police is almost guaranteed to end up twisted into TMZ's efforts to make a profit.

If he wants his private life to be private...that's his right.

While it might be understandable that we're curious, gossiping is gossiping.

It's still a traffic accident whether it took place on the Interstate or a gated community. There is a suspicion of domestic violence. That's not gossip.

jojo
12-01-2009, 11:32 AM
There is a suspicion of domestic violence. That's not gossip.

Or is it gossip built upon initial gossip?

MWM
12-01-2009, 11:34 AM
I'm curious where the "suspicion" of domestic violence is coming from? I've not read anything that suggest the police have a suspicion. The only thing I can think of is the TMZ speculation.

GIDP
12-01-2009, 11:35 AM
Or is it gossip built upon initial gossip?

Cops want to know if it was domestic abuse. Safe to say they probably aren't basing their inquiries on gossip from TMZ.

dabvu2498
12-01-2009, 11:41 AM
I'm curious where the "suspicion" of domestic violence is coming from? I've not read anything that suggest the police have a suspicion. The only thing I can think of is the TMZ speculation. The police are trying to get his medical records.

jojo
12-01-2009, 11:41 AM
Cops want to know if it was domestic abuse. Safe to say they probably aren't basing their inquiries on gossip from TMZ.

I don't think it's safe to say anything. BTW, we don't really know what they want unless I've missed a presser where they've announced such concerns.

dabvu2498
12-01-2009, 11:52 AM
This will go no where in court. If law enforcement approaches from the domestic violence issue, unless there is some eyewitness to the events in their driveway, they would have no case. Tiger is not going to testify against his wife and wouldn't have to even if subpoeanaed. And there's not a doctor in the world that would testify that his injuries definitively resulted from domestic violence. So what are the cops trying to do? Make him look bad for standing them up? Which Tiger could have avoided in the 1st place.

Reds4Life
12-01-2009, 12:08 PM
This will go no where in court. If law enforcement approaches from the domestic violence issue, unless there is some eyewitness to the events in their driveway, they would have no case. Tiger is not going to testify against his wife and wouldn't have to even if subpoeanaed. And there's not a doctor in the world that would testify that his injuries definitively resulted from domestic violence. So what are the cops trying to do? Make him look bad for standing them up? Which Tiger could have avoided in the 1st place.

In the community where Woods lives, there is 24/7 video surveillance. The police have asked to see the tapes from that night, and have been told no. The police are now getting a warrant for the tapes.

If they get the tapes, and it shows Tigers wife bashing up the car, then he’s screwed in the media and his wife is likely going to be arrested for domestic violence.

Roy Tucker
12-01-2009, 12:21 PM
Legal issues aside, I feel a little bad for Tiger. A very private marital problem will probably get splattered all over the place. If it were me, I sure as heck wouldn't want it all public.

Marital discord knows no economic barriers. Stuff happens.

Chip R
12-01-2009, 12:22 PM
Or is it gossip built upon initial gossip?

As I said before, gossip was the rumor that Tiger was fooling around. We have no idea whether that's true or not.

What we know is that Tiger attempted to drive away in his SUV early in the morning and his wife smashed the back windows with a golf club. There was also an accident and Tiger was hurt seriously enough that he was lying on the ground and he had to go to the hospital. Then a statement comes out that his wife tried to rescue him from the SUV by smashing the back windows. That doesn't pass the smell test for me and a lot of other people. If she was rescuing him, why did she smash out the back windows? Are we to believe that she smashed out the back windows, climbed in through the back windows and pulled him out of the car to safety? Why was she so Johnny-on-the-spot? If I'm going out at 3 a.m. I doubt my wife's going to get up out of bed and follow me all the way outside onto the street to see me off.

You're right. It is his right not to talk to the police. But since he decided not to, it's our right to wonder why. He was also hurt enough that he withdrew from his own golf tournament (which I find amusing for some reason.) People who bought tickets to this to see him play are going to wonder why he did this. His sponsors are going to wonder why he isn't playing and if this accident is going to affect their products. And if Tiger isn't telling the truth here, the sponsors are going to wonder if people will buy their products that he endorses. If someone is seen as not believable, why would the public want to buy a product he endorses? If I'm in the market for some new golf clubs and I think Tiger's a lying sack of fertilizer, I think twice before I buy any Nike clubs. I wonder if he's lying about how good those clubs are. I realize that sounds somewhat silly but that is how advertisers and companies work. Even someone like A-Rod eventually told the truth - or enough of the truth to quell sponsors' fears.

As I said earlier, if Tiger had taken a day with his camp and come up with a story that had enough of the truth in it to satisy the cops, then it's just a big joke about how people hadn't seen Tiger drive that bad since the PGA Championship. In a couple of weeks, it's forgotten. Since he stonewalled the cops and put out this fable about how his wife heroically rescued him from his SUV, people are going to ask questions and wonder what the heck is going on and they are going to make up and/or believe all the rumors and gossip out there.

Sea Ray
12-01-2009, 12:25 PM
Legal issues aside, I feel a little bad for Tiger. A very private marital problem will probably get splattered all over the place. If it were me, I sure as heck wouldn't want it all public.

Marital discord knows no economic barriers. Stuff happens.

I see your point but I don't feel bad for him. It's not like this kind of thing happens to everyone. I've been in a couple marriages and nothing like this ever happened.

Tiger has received a lot of fame and fortune and it serves to reason that if something like this happens it'll be front page news. Small price to pay IMO.

Roy Tucker
12-01-2009, 12:43 PM
I see your point but I don't feel bad for him. It's not like this kind of thing happens to everyone. I've been in a couple marriages and nothing like this ever happened.

Tiger has received a lot of fame and fortune and it serves to reason that if something like this happens it'll be front page news. Small price to pay IMO.

I suppose. I've got a few pretty hair-raising stories I could tell about bricks through my front window, cop cars, punches thrown and received. It happens, at least to me. Maybe I'm just weird.

I just feel that Tiger has never made himself out to be anything more than a golfer. About all I know about his is that he promotes Nike and Buick, is a heckuva golfer, and has a gorgeous wife. Its not like he makes political stands, writes fawning books about himself, or puts himself in the public eye as a shining beacon of moral rectitude.

He just plays hellacious golf and makes a boatload of money. Not that anyone cares or that it matters, but I'll cut him a little slack.

fearofpopvol1
12-01-2009, 02:18 PM
I'm curious where the "suspicion" of domestic violence is coming from? I've not read anything that suggest the police have a suspicion. The only thing I can think of is the TMZ speculation.

How about his wife having a golf club in her hand at 245AM on the street as a good starting point? And the fact that Tiger's face was busted up?

fearofpopvol1
12-01-2009, 02:24 PM
Silence will only fuel speculation, fair or not.

Whether he's a private person or not, releasing some short statement about the incident (one that isn't very believable) on his website is not going to satisfy the media/fans/critics etc.

Tiger (and his PR person) do have the ability to contain the fire and put it out. They're just choosing to continue to let it burn.

Hoosier Red
12-01-2009, 02:34 PM
meh small fire burning is not a big deal, big fire exploding (when Tiger throws gas on it by commenting) is a big deal.

Tiger's smart, he doesn't owe us anything. We're free to speculate but we'll probably be distracted by a new rabbit in a week or so.

Unassisted
12-01-2009, 03:06 PM
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/12/01/taking_liberties/entry5845683.shtml


Tiger Woods' Problem And Why Not To Talk To Police


Posted by Declan McCullagh
news analysis

Whatever happened between Tiger Woods and his wife last Friday, by now they're probably wishing they never talked to the police.

The initial reports said Woods lost control of his Cadillac SUV outside of his home and hit a fire hydrant and tree in his neighbor's yard. His wife, Elin Nordegren, reportedly told local police that she was in the house and, according to the police chief, "came out and broke the back window with a golf club" to extricate her husband.

But TMZ.com reported on Monday that Woods' wife told a different story to Florida state troopers that involved her searching for him in a golf cart, and that there was no blood on the steering wheel. That opens the couple up to the possibility of an investigation of spousal abuse on the possibility that the injuries were suffered before his accident; TMZ claims the Florida Highway Patrol is seeking a search warrant after Woods turned them away from his home three times.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc&feature=player_embedded

(Here's Woods' statement (http://web.tigerwoods.com/news/article/200911297726222/news/), and a CBS News report (http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/11/30/crimesider/entry5838346.shtml) about an alleged other woman.)

Let Tiger and Elin's encounter with the local constabulary be a warning to you: Don't talk to the police without your lawyer present. Even if you're innocent. Just don't.

This advice may seem counter-intuitive. But before you convince yourself I'm wrong, it's worth watching this video (below) by James Duane, a professor at the Regent University School of Law in Virginia Beach and former criminal defense attorney, who makes precisely this point about your Fifth Amendment rights. (Here's a rebuttalrebuttal (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08fZQWjDVKE&feature=related) from a police officer who agrees.)

One reason is that the list of what is and what isn't a crime has grown so long that even lawyers can barely figure it out. The American Bar Association has only an estimate of how many crimes exist: Offhand, do you know what is and isn't legal? Another is that, if the police already have a sufficient reason to arrest you, you're not going to be able to talk your way out of it.

Plus, the recollection of police officers can be mistaken; they may say you acknowledged guilt of some sort. Who do you think a judge will believe? The Innocence Project reports that: "In about 25 percent of DNA exoneration cases, innocent defendants made incriminating statements, delivered outright confessions or pled guilty."

The folks at Flex Your Rights, a non-profit group, have put together a less lawyerly, more comprehensive video titled: "BUSTED: The Citizen's Guide to Surviving Police Encounters." And of course, when dealing with federal police, telling them any "materially false" statement is a federal crime.

It's one thing if you call the police if, say, your wallet is stolen. But when they initiate the conversation and you may be a suspect, it's rarely in your best interests to talk. Just don't.

Because Tiger Woods' wife chose to speak with police, now she and her husband have become (at least if you believe TMZ) the focus of an criminal investigation. Remember, you have the right to remain silent. Use it.

fearofpopvol1
12-01-2009, 04:05 PM
meh small fire burning is not a big deal, big fire exploding (when Tiger throws gas on it by commenting) is a big deal.

Tiger's smart, he doesn't owe us anything. We're free to speculate but we'll probably be distracted by a new rabbit in a week or so.

I highly doubt it. It's too big of a story to just go away. Media history has shown that those who come clean or at least provide some sort of explanation see the fire put out pretty quickly. Those who are quiet and act like nothing happened will continue to watch the fire burn and grow bigger.

flyer85
12-01-2009, 04:11 PM
Seems like he is in a lot more serious condition now ... women coming out of the woodwork to claim extra-marital affairs with Tiger.

I guess this is what can happen when you let the little head do the thinking for the big head.

Chip R
12-01-2009, 04:19 PM
Seems like he is in a lot more serious condition now ... women coming out of the woodwork to claim extra-marital affairs with Tiger.

I guess this is what can happen when you let the little head do the thinking for the big head.


There's more than one? I thought that first woman denied having a relationship with him. If there is more than the one, it might just be women trying to get their own reality show...errr, 15 minutes of fame.

flyer85
12-01-2009, 04:23 PM
http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2009/12/exclusive-tiger-woods-cheating-scandal-grows-other-woman-coming-forward

jojo
12-01-2009, 04:25 PM
The best news come from pink websites.

flyer85
12-01-2009, 04:27 PM
There's more than one? I thought that first woman denied having a relationship with him.
the woman who works in New York and somehow ended up in the same hotel that Tiger stayed in when he played in Australia a few weeks ago.

flyer85
12-01-2009, 04:29 PM
It would be shocking in this day and age to find out that a sports star was having affairs.

MWM
12-01-2009, 04:31 PM
None of the extra marital affairs would surprise me in the least. Actually, if he weren't out there screwing around, I'd have been more surprised. That stuff used to bother me, but for some reason it just doesn't any more. It's fairly common knowledge that even family man Ken Griffey Jr. has his "road family". Does not make them bad people. I used to judge and say that I'd never do it under any circumstances, but I think there are likely very few men who could just completely abstain when it's thrown right in front of them constantly. It's constanly at their fingertips that even the strongest of character men would most likely only be able to hold off for so long.

Like I said before, I always just assume that any guy who's rich and famous (especially athletes) are getting it from multiple sources on a regular basis. So when I find out about it (i.e. Letterman) it doesn't change my view of that person.

flyer85
12-01-2009, 04:42 PM
Does not make them bad people. Maybe not as long as you realize that if someone is willing to violate their marriage vows will probably break any other promise given the right condition.

Does Tiger have affairs make him unusual? No its the norm for today's celebrities.

Does it make it right? No. If you don't want to be faithful to your wife then get divorced and play around all you want instead of trampling all over your marriage vows again and again (or don't get married in the first place).

However, a lot of celebrities want to portray a certain image to appeal to a broad spectrum of the public even if they live their real life in a completely different fashion.

I have no animosity toward Tiger (I love to watch him golf). I just hope he realizes he has made mistakes and for the sake of his wife and children he makes better choices in the future.

I guess I am old fashioned in that I take my wedding vows seriously but I also realize that if I were to allow myself to get in a compromising situation I would very likely end up making a poor choice. The key is to choose to not put myself into a situation where I would be likely to make a mistake. A big part of the reason for my fidelity is that I simply would never want to be in a position of having to explain my infidelity to my daughters.

jojo
12-01-2009, 04:49 PM
Looks like Tiger is out of the woods....

"He faces a $164 fine and four points on his license, but no criminal charges, Florida Highway Patrol spokeswoman Sgt. Kim Montes said.There was insufficient evidence to request a subpoena for medical information in the case, Montes said, and no claims of domestic abuse." (http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/12/01/tiger.woods/index.html)

Reds4Life
12-01-2009, 04:50 PM
Florida Highway Parol is citing him for careless driving, and the investigation is closed.

flyer85
12-01-2009, 04:52 PM
Looks like Tiger is out of the woods....


The big issue has never been about criminal charges but more about how the public will react to possibly sordid details about his personal life.

IMO, stonewalling is probably not the best course of action as this is not likely to just fade away.

He is likely to followed everywhere by the paparazzi looking to get pictures of Tiger and the next woman. He is a marked man.

MWM
12-01-2009, 04:57 PM
I guess I am old fashioned in that I take my wedding vows seriously but I also realize that if I were to allow myself to get in a compromising situation I would very likely end up making a poor choice. The key is to choose to not put myself into a situation where I would be likely to make a mistake. A big part of the reason for my fidelity is that I simply would never want to be in a position of having to explain my infidelity to my daughters.

I take my wedding vows very seriously too. But I'm also realistic to know that if I was constantly bombarded with gorgeous women more than willing to jump my bones just because of who I was that it would be EXTREMELY difficult to turn it away forever. It's easy to sit here on a site like this and talk about how we'd never cheat on our spouse and how we're committed to our vows, but we're kidding ourselves if we think it's remotely the same for a guy like Tiger Woods.

jojo
12-01-2009, 04:58 PM
The big issue has never been about criminal charges but more about how the public will react to possibly sordid details about his personal life.

IMO, stonewalling is probably not the best course of action as this is not likely to just fade away.

He is likely to followed everywhere by the paparazzi looking to get pictures of Tiger and the next woman. He is a marked man.

I don't think any of that changes regardless of whether he decides to turn his life into a new reality series or remains very guarded about his private life.

I still don't get why his private life is so interesting to so many. Certainly there isn't a compelling argument that we (the public) deserve to know details of his private life.

Frankly, it is a brilliant course of action to not add a single detail to this tabloid monster. It will have to feed itself (and it's pretty lazy so it prefers to not have to cook or even grocery shop for that matter).

flyer85
12-01-2009, 05:01 PM
I still don't get why his private life is so interesting to so many.I would say that about any celebrity. However, if that stuff didn't sell there wouldn't be people spending time and money looking for those kind of details.

flyer85
12-01-2009, 05:06 PM
but we're kidding ourselves if we think it's remotely the same for a guy like Tiger Woods.which is why he would have to hyper-vigilant to not get into compromising situations.

In the end it comes down to being either self-centered or selfless. If one keep others in the forefront of their mind (rather than focusing on their wants ) it is a lot easier to keep from making poor choices.

I have to tell myself everyday that it isn't all about me (maybe it should be :D).

Hoosier Red
12-01-2009, 05:14 PM
I still don't get why his private life is so interesting to so many. Certainly there isn't a compelling argument that we (the public) deserve to know details of his private life.



The very nature of gossip/tabloids is that you're learning/seeing something you shouldn't be able to. That's part of the appeal.

Think of the Erin Andrews peephole saga. You're telling me you couldn't find better things to look at on the internet than a grainy video of a sportscaster who is good looking but certainly not other worldly?

The fact that you shouldn't be seeing it is almost the entire fascination.

The fact that you have no right to know what is going on in Tiger Woods' marriage or with the neighbors' kid who's going to get caught smoking weed, or with your bosses ex-wife but yet because of (nosy neighbor or TMZ.com or the National Enquirer) you do get to find all of these things out.

Chip R
12-01-2009, 05:19 PM
I still don't get why his private life is so interesting to so many. Certainly there isn't a compelling argument that we (the public) deserve to know details of his private life.


We don't deserve to know anything. But we want to know about famous people whether they be politicians, entertainers, athletes or reality show performers. We want to know what they are like, what breakfast cereal they eat, what clothes they wear, what car they drive, who they date, etc. Tell me you don't want to know all about Raisor. ;)

jojo
12-01-2009, 05:24 PM
Here seems to be a summary:

1) The National Inquirer accused Woods of having an affair last week and since then, the woman said to be involved has categorically denied the accusation and has hired an attorney known for crucifying rags like TNI for their journalistic licenses....

2) Woods had a minor accident in his driveway.

3) Woods complied completely with the police concerning his legal obligations regarding the accident.

4) Alcohol (and presumably drugs) have been ruled out as a component of the accident.

5) There is no evidence to support domestic abuse or even to support further inquiry into that line of investigation.

6) Tiger Woods has to pay a fine and there is no longer any question as to whether he has a clean driving record or not.

jojo
12-01-2009, 05:26 PM
We don't deserve to know anything. But we want to know about famous people whether they be politicians, entertainers, athletes or reality show performers. We want to know what they are like, what breakfast cereal they eat, what clothes they wear, what car they drive, who they date, etc. Tell me you don't want to know all about Raisor. ;)

I keep waiting for the autobiography but earning nobel prizes seems to distract him from his memoirs.... :cool:

Chip R
12-01-2009, 05:29 PM
I keep waiting for the autobiography but earning nobel prizes seems to distract him from his memoirs.... :cool:


It's the price of greatness.

Raisor
12-01-2009, 05:35 PM
I keep waiting for the autobiography but earning nobel prizes seems to distract him from his memoirs.... :cool:



Now there's an idea.

WMR
12-01-2009, 05:45 PM
Here seems to be a summary:

1) The National Inquirer accused Woods of having an affair last week and since then, the woman said to be involved has categorically denied the accusation and has hired an attorney known for crucifying rags like TNI for their journalistic licenses....

2) Woods had a minor accident in his driveway.

3) Woods complied completely with the police concerning his legal obligations regarding the accident.

4) Alcohol (and presumably drugs) have been ruled out as a component of the accident.

5) There is no evidence to support domestic abuse or even to support further inquiry into that line of investigation.

6) Tiger Woods has to pay a fine and there is no longer any question as to whether he has a clean driving record or not.

A summary by Woods' publicist perhaps. The common sense summary would read a bit differently.

dabvu2498
12-01-2009, 05:48 PM
5) There is no evidence to support domestic abuse or even to support further inquiry into that line of investigation.


There is nothing but circumstantial evidence to support domestic abuse. There is some of that, but not a ton.

dabvu2498
12-01-2009, 05:50 PM
I take my wedding vows very seriously too. But I'm also realistic to know that if I was constantly bombarded with gorgeous women more than willing to jump my bones just because of who I was that it would be EXTREMELY difficult to turn it away forever. It's easy to sit here on a site like this and talk about how we'd never cheat on our spouse and how we're committed to our vows, but we're kidding ourselves if we think it's remotely the same for a guy like Tiger Woods.

But you must admit that he opened up his private life to the public when (if?) he opened up his bed to someone other than his wife.

Razor Shines
12-01-2009, 05:50 PM
Tiger Woods told his wife that she ruined their Thanksgiving
and stormed out of their house before crashing his car early Friday, RadarOnline.com is reporting exclusively.

I think I know what happened. Tiger was on the phone with Stevie and he was telling Stevie how thankful he was for all the booty he'd gotten this year and he didn't realize that Elin was listening in. He then tried to explain that he and Stevie were just pretending to be pirates, she didn't buy it and chased him out of the house with his 9-Iron. He ran to the Escalade yelling "You ruined Thanksgiving!!" and drove into the fire hydrant and tree.

westofyou
12-01-2009, 05:51 PM
http://joeposnanski.com/JoeBlog/2009/11/29/the-tiger-trail/



This is going to sound very, very wrong … because, well, it is very, very wrong. But I’m sorry. I’ll admit this straight out: I am fascinated by this Tiger Woods accident story. I’m fascinated, and I’m paying close attention, and I will read whatever stories come out about it. Sure, I know it’s wrong. I know it’s gossip. I know it’s rubbernecking on a highway. I know. Tiger Woods and his family deserve some privacy in their lives. They should have the right to go on without having to share the most personal details of their lives. They should not have to deal with reporters and photographers stalking them. And so on. I believe these things with all my heart.

And still … I’ll read every word. I cannot help myself. I’m dying to know. But I suppose I should clarify — I’m not dying to know what really happened that night. I have a pretty good guess at that. No, I’m dying to know how Tiger Woods and his people are going to handle all this.


See, here’s the thing: Someday, mankind will invent a robot that can make birdies on every hole. I have no doubt in my mind about this. I don’t believe it will ever be fun to watch robots play football or baseball or basketball — there’s something physical about those sports that craves humanity. But golf is different. Because in golf, reaching a robotic level of perfection is the ultimate goal (see Hogan, Ben). Can you repeat your swing under pressure? Can you read the wind? Can you read the greens? Can you drain all the emotions from your body and make the big putt on the 18th green? These are the traits of the super-robot — and even now now the mind can imagine a golf-playing robot that will repeat the perfect swing every time, calculate the wind perfectly and will be have the sensors necessary to read every blade of grass on the green.

I believe that golf robot will be built sometime in the next 20 years, I really do. And, beyond the initial curiosity, I know that won’t care about it. I won’t have any interest in watching that robot stripe drive after drive, hit perfect shot after perfect shot, make putt after putt — it seems to me that’s not the interesting part of watching golf. The interesting part is the human part. The interesting part is watching Jean van de Velde blow up on 18. The interesting part is Arnold Palmer charging on the back nine. The interesting part is Tom Watson coming to 18 with a chance to pull off the greatest triumph in golf history and hitting his approach shot TOO WELL (is there another sport where doing something too well hurts you?). The interesting part is a 10-year-old boy with a poster of Jack Nicklaus on his wall and a dream of one day winning more major championships than Jack did.

That 10-year-old became Tiger Woods, and he has made his life mission — at least his public life mission — to (1) Win those 19 professional major championships; (2) Make a billion dollars; (3) Make sure people know as little about him as possible.

These are all perfectly reasonable goals, though they can conflict. Golf, we are told, is the most illuminating of sports. Corporate types talk all the time about how they want to play golf with clients or business partners or employees or adversaries in order to measure them — golf (they say) can tell you about a person’s composure, a person’s decision making skills, a person’s level of daring and so on. Billions of people have watched Tiger Woods play golf under the most extreme pressures, so you would think we have learned some things. And we have. He’s damned good at golf. Also, he swears a lot.

Then, for an athlete like Tiger Woods to make billions of dollars he needs to be in the public eye, as a spokesman for a company, as a star of commercials, as a person people can believe in and even love. You would think the person would need to show a little bit of himself — even if it’s fake and just a persona. People who knew Johnny Carson would often say he was nothing at all like the person who hosted the Tonight Show. That was a character he played when the camera lights popped on, night after night after night.

But Woods — well, remarkably, he really has not even created a public character for himself. He is, instead, a blank slate. People talk about how Michael Jordan was the first to create that blank slate — the “I am whatever you want me to be” form of sports celebrity — but I never thought that was quite true. Jordan had a persona — as a wisecracking basketball player who was not trying to change the world but was instead perfectly content to joke around with Spike Lee, play in a movie with Bugs Bunny and cut your heart out with a big shot in the final seconds. Later, he had the weird baseball period of his career*, and the gambling stories emerged, and he could not walk away from basketball, and he had that sad Hall of Fame speech. But the sense in his prime was that people KNEW Michael Jordan, even if they didn’t really know him at all.

*I know people have made fun of Michael Jordan as baseball player — and others were wildly offended by it — but I always loved that Jordan tried it. I don’t know all the reasons he did … maybe some of the conspiracy theories about it are true. But it seems clear that he wanted to see if he was good enough to play ball at the highest level. I think that’s a very human thing. Jordan was not good enough, or he started too late, or whatever. But he tried. And when I think back on Michael Jordan’s career, it’s probably my favorite thing about him.

Tiger is different. I don’t think anyone beyond his close circle really feels like they know Tiger Woods. And maybe even those people don’t know. Is he funny? Some say yes, but I’ve never really heard him say anything especially funny. Does he like talking about politics? Movies? Sports? Can he tell a story? Is he a good listener? Does he have interesting thoughts about faith? Does he get on the floor and play with his kids? Which Austin Powers movie did he think was funniest? Any of them? Is he happy or unhappy with the direction they are taking Jim and Pam on The Office? Does he put money on Free Parking when he’s playing Monopoly? Does he park near the entrance or exit when going to a Target? Who does he think writes better, Delillo, McCarthy or McDermott?

We don’t know. We know he was raised to play golf. We know he plays it better than anyone in the world. We know that he does not like cameras clicking during his backswing, and he has a remarkable ability to get himself out of golf danger, and he does not miss many important putts. We know he married a Swedish model, and they have two cute kids and a couple of dogs. We know that he is friends with Roger Federer, though what this means is really anyone’s guess since Federer is not exactly an open book himself.

Beyond these few tidbits, you can go to Tiger’s Web site and go to the “Did you know” section to find out more juicy details such as:

– Tiger’s alarm clock is set up at 5 a.m. sharp.*

*Do we really need the word “sharp” there? Do people often set their alarm clocks at 5:03 a.m.? The other day, we bought some oranges in Florida, and the salesman told us they were “completely seedless.” Did I need the word completely? How useful would “almost completely seedless” oranges be?

– His inspirations are his parents and Nelson Mandela. Think about how much inspiration there will be in the air if he takes his mother to see the movie “Invictus?”

– His perfect day would be a day he surfed, skied, played golf and went spear fishing. All in one day. So in other words, Tiger Woods perfect day is … pretty much any day he wants.

– His biggest challenge is to become a better person tomorrow.

– His favorite soundtrack — and this is by far my favorite answer — is “anything from ‘80s and early ‘90s.” I mean, you’re not even trying now. Really? ANYTHING from the ‘80s or early ‘90s would be his favorite soundtrack. “Hey, what’s your favorite soundtrack?” “Oh, I don’t know, it’s like ‘Purple Rain’ or ‘Weird Science” or ‘Amadeus’ or ‘Electric Boogaloo’ or ‘Chariots of Fire’ or ‘Eddie and the Cruisers’ or ‘Schindler’s List,’ or, you know, the music from that one with the guy from that thing, you remember?” … Plus, what kind of question is that in the first place. Your favorite soundtrack?

Point is: Tiger’s life is not any of your business or my business or anyone else’s business. And that’s cool. That’s his right. But, here’s the thing: He plays golf. He does commercials. And people still want to know. We want to know because we are invested in him. We won’t spend hours and hours on weekends watching the birdie-making computer play golf. We won’t buy Cadillacs because the robot drives them. We won’t care if he uses the American Express card. We won’t point the robot out to our children. We won’t be put little furry robots on our drivers.

I suppose that Tiger Woods is as good at playing golf as anyone in the world is at doing what they do. He is as good at golf as Springsteen is at performing, as Auster is at writing, as Streep is at acting, as Jobs is at predicting the next big thing. But it’s the humanness behind all that that makes him interesting. How does someone get so good at something.

All of which brings us back to the beginning: Earlier this week, word spread that Tiger Woods was in a car accident. At first, I guess, there were all these rumors about it being serious and so on. Soon, though, it became apparent that it was not too serious. And then a few details leaked out. Nobody could be too sure about the details — but the reports said that Woods was out at 2:30 a.m., the one-car accident was near his house, there was no alcohol involved. Weird. Then, more details, apparently his wife Elin was the first to the scene — she heard the accident — and she saved him by pulling him from the car. And then, word emerged that she had pulled him from the car after breaking a back car window with a golf club. Maybe both back car windows. Reports conflicted.

And then, police were asked to come back to talk to Tiger later because he was sleeping. When they came back the next day, they were told to wait another day. When the came back the next day, they were told Tiger was not talking.

Oh yeah — this should probably be mentioned too: There was a report in the National Enquirer just two days earlier (and it’s the National Enquirer, so you can make your own judgments) — that Tiger Woods was caught cheating with Rachel Uchitel, who, the Enquirer so eloquently called “The New York City party girl.”* The party girl has denied it, but yeah, that is in the air too.

*I like this part too, from their follow up story: “The Enquirer’s blockbuster cover story was verified with polygraphs, multiple sources and an on-the-record interview with one of Rachel’s friends.” Polygraphs? Really?

To be honest, I don’t find much of this too interesting. I can probably piece together in my mind a version of what happened that night. Maybe it’s right, maybe it’s wrong, but I just tend to make presumptions about 2:30 a.m. car accidents with windows broken by wives swinging golf clubs shortly after the National Enquirer claims the husband had an affair. It’s one of my many flaws. Anyway, I try not to make judgments about how people I don’t know live their lives. I have enough work to do back home.

What I do find interesting — endlessly interesting — is how Tiger Woods handles this. He has always been able to so carefully control his image. And now, well, this is out of his control. And he knows it. Sure, he can ask for privacy — as he did in a statement on his Web site — but he must know that for this is public gruel now. This is the first time in a long time that something big about Tiger Woods has been revealed without Tiger Woods officially endorsing it. And when it comes to the world’s greatest golfer, people will grab for something real.

That’s the weird part of the media world today. There are voices attacking us from all sides. There is more coverage of sports and politics and entertainment and business and everything else than ever before. But so little of it is real. So little of it has any substance, any meaning. “What’s your favorite sountrack?” “Oh, anything from the ‘80s or early ‘90s.” Just like that.

Well, here was this moment in Tiger Woods’ life, a painful moment, an intensely private moment that ran naked into the public square. Something real. So now what? How will he handle this? What will we learn about him in the process? Will he stick with the wife-saved-him-with-golf-clubs story? Will he pretend it never happened? Will he sue the National Enquirer? Will he go on Oprah? What does Tiger Woods do when the story gets away from him?

I know I shouldn’t — but I’ll be following along.

fearofpopvol1
12-01-2009, 06:02 PM
Here seems to be a summary:

1) The National Inquirer accused Woods of having an affair last week and since then, the woman said to be involved has categorically denied the accusation and has hired an attorney known for crucifying rags like TNI for their journalistic licenses....

2) Woods had a minor accident in his driveway.

3) Woods complied completely with the police concerning his legal obligations regarding the accident.

4) Alcohol (and presumably drugs) have been ruled out as a component of the accident.

5) There is no evidence to support domestic abuse or even to support further inquiry into that line of investigation.

6) Tiger Woods has to pay a fine and there is no longer any question as to whether he has a clean driving record or not.

How many times has TMZ gotten their stories wrong?

MWM
12-01-2009, 06:04 PM
But you must admit that he opened up his private life to the public when (if?) he opened up his bed to someone other than his wife.

Sure. These guys know that there's a good chance the time will come when one of these women will come forward for and spill the beans. It's not that I feel bad for him if it happens, I don't. It's just that it doesn't change my perception of them and I can't judge them for something MOST men would find difficult avoiding.

Jack Burton
12-01-2009, 06:42 PM
Runs into a fire hydrant and a tree? Can't even make it out of your own driveway? Obviously there is more to this story. Were any sobriety tests done at the hospital? The Florida Highway Patrol comes out looking like fools on this one.

RBA
12-01-2009, 08:06 PM
Re-enactment

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7i5FlC1MpkE&feature=player_embedded#

jojo
12-01-2009, 09:07 PM
A summary by Woods' publicist perhaps. The common sense summary would read a bit differently.

Those are the facts as we know them. Moving in any direction from those facts makes it more likely that the conclusion is wrong (and thus the argument becomes weaker).

Chip R
12-01-2009, 09:17 PM
Re-enactment

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7i5FlC1MpkE&feature=player_embedded#

That was pretty good. I liked the reenactments. It looked like a video game. I also don't think that's too far from the truth.

Boston Red
12-01-2009, 11:19 PM
Those are the facts as we know them.

Well, there's also the fact that his wife bashed out the back window of his car with a golf club. I think that's a pretty interesting fact.

macro
12-02-2009, 12:04 AM
Has any statement been made regarding whether Tiger will be able to come up with the $164 for the fine?

jojo
12-02-2009, 12:14 AM
Has any statement been made regarding whether Tiger will be able to come up with the $164 for the fine?

I don't know but how long will it be before "the golf club that smashed his windows" will get listed on ebay by someone?

Razor Shines
12-02-2009, 12:24 AM
Has any statement been made regarding whether Tiger will be able to come up with the $164 for the fine?

They'll probably have to move out of Isleworth.

Razor Shines
12-02-2009, 03:38 AM
I bet Phil Mickelson has been laughing himself to sleep the past few nights.

WMR
12-02-2009, 05:15 AM
Those are the facts as we know them. Moving in any direction from those facts makes it more likely that the conclusion is wrong (and thus the argument becomes weaker).

Suuuure. Those are the 'facts.' Right.

WMR
12-02-2009, 05:16 AM
Well, there's also the fact that his wife bashed out the back window of his car with a golf club. I think that's a pretty interesting fact.

:lol:

She acted heroically and was merely trying to save Tiger's life.

Razor Shines
12-02-2009, 08:41 AM
http://www.usmagazine.com/celebritynews/news/hear-tiger-panic-to-mistress-my-wife-may-be-calling-you-2009212

There's your phone message. It's definitely Tiger. Pretty clear that what we thought happened did happen.

Redhook
12-02-2009, 09:04 AM
http://www.usmagazine.com/celebritynews/news/hear-tiger-panic-to-mistress-my-wife-may-be-calling-you-2009212

There's your phone message. It's definitely Tiger. Pretty clear that what we thought happened did happen.

Good find. Wow. This is crazy.

GIDP
12-02-2009, 09:19 AM
Darn tabloids making up their news again.

Roy Tucker
12-02-2009, 09:20 AM
"ruined Thanksgiving"? Seems that Thanksgiving family dysfunction also knows no boundaries.

Maybe she burned the turkey. Gravy was lumpy. Cranberry didn't jell. Forgot forks go on the left.

My wife forgot the stuffing this year. I cruised the neighborhood looking for fire hydrants.

jojo
12-02-2009, 09:23 AM
Darn tabloids making up their news again.

It's sad what some say is news.

GIDP
12-02-2009, 09:50 AM
It's sad what some say is news.

especially when its all made up

jojo
12-02-2009, 10:06 AM
especially when its all made up

If you want to grind an axe (and it's a weird one to grind in the first place as a TMZ blade really won't ever hold an edge), please do so via PM.

Unassisted
12-02-2009, 10:46 AM
How many times has TMZ gotten their stories wrong?TMZ had the scoop on Michael Jackson's death a couple of hours before any other journalism outlet did. A reporter is only as good as her/his sources and TMZ seems to have good sources.

Sea Ray
12-02-2009, 11:03 AM
I haven't found TMZ to be inaccurate in their reporting. I think Harvey Levin is running a tight ship. Anyone have a different opinion?

Unassisted
12-02-2009, 11:40 AM
http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/national_world/stories/2009/12/02/tiger-woods-regrets-transgressions.html?sid=101
Tiger Woods regrets 'transgressions'
Golfer says he's let family down

Wednesday, December 2, 2009 10:16 AM
Updated: Wednesday, December 2, 2009 10:30 AM

ASSOCIATED PRESS

Tiger Woods says he has let his family down and regrets "those transgressions with all of my heart."

In a statement today on his Web site, Woods says he has not been "true to my values and the behavior my family deserves."

He offered his "profound apology" to his supporters.

His comments came after Us Weekly magazine published a cover story alleging that a Los Angeles cocktail waitress had a 31-month affair with the world's No. 1 golfer.

Chip R
12-02-2009, 11:45 AM
TMZ had the scoop on Michael Jackson's death a couple of hours before any other journalism outlet did. A reporter is only as good as her/his sources and TMZ seems to have good sources.


Not to get political but even the National Enquirer broke the John Edwards mistress story. Now 90% of what they write is B.S. but it's that other 10% you have to watch out for. Like my grandfather used to say, even a blind hog finds an acorn every once in a while.

Reds4Life
12-02-2009, 11:52 AM
On the radio today they played a voicemail Tiger left for some woman a couple days before the accident.

He asked for this woman to take her name "off her phone" (whatever that means) because his wife went through his phone and she might be calling her. He was pretty much begging.

BRM
12-02-2009, 11:53 AM
More evidence that Tiger might have been unfaithful to his wife. I'm shocked.

Unassisted
12-02-2009, 12:02 PM
I subscribe to 4 breaking news email alert services because it's interesting to see the choices different media outlets make about what constitutes breaking news. Unless a story is really big, maybe once or twice a year, they don't send out the same alerts. All 4 of the services I subscribe to sent out the Tiger Woods "transgressions" announcement within 20 minutes of each other.

Anyone who thinks we shouldn't care about this can blame the media for making us want to care about it. The media thinks it's a big story.

flyer85
12-02-2009, 12:12 PM
he is the most well known athlete on the planet.

Sea Ray
12-02-2009, 12:30 PM
Not to get political but even the National Enquirer broke the John Edwards mistress story. Now 90% of what they write is B.S. but it's that other 10% you have to watch out for. Like my grandfather used to say, even a blind hog finds an acorn every once in a while.

The National Enquirer is not the 90% BS that they used to be. They've really got some some pretty good investigative reporters. They do stuff like this story which the main stream media feels is beneath them.

Unassisted
12-02-2009, 01:23 PM
he is the most well known athlete on the planet.And yet, we know so little about him (http://www.texnews.com/tiger/heir0718.html).

Chip R
12-02-2009, 01:31 PM
The National Enquirer is not the 90% BS that they used to be. They've really got some some pretty good investigative reporters. They do stuff like this story which the main stream media feels is beneath them.


That may be so but they are still like the boy who cried wolf.

Oxblood
12-02-2009, 02:23 PM
For Tiger, it has officially hit the fan.

Chip R
12-02-2009, 02:52 PM
I'm wondering why ESPN is continuing to report on this. Now that the ticket has been issued, it's a civil case.

15fan
12-02-2009, 03:22 PM
For Tiger, it has officially hit the fan.

It's gonna be good to be Elin on Christmas morning this year.

RichRed
12-02-2009, 03:53 PM
I'm wondering why ESPN is continuing to report on this. Now that the ticket has been issued, it's a civil case.

I see what you did there!

westofyou
12-02-2009, 04:10 PM
he is the most well known athlete on the planet.

Is he?

Christiano Ronaldo might be too.

Chip R
12-02-2009, 04:16 PM
It's gonna be good to be Elin on Christmas morning this year.

Tiger's probably calling Kobe right now and asking him who his jeweler is.

Not to make light of adultry but it reminds me of a joke I heard this morning:

A husband and wife were having dinner at a very fine restaurant when this absolutely stunning young woman comes over to their table, gives the husband a big open-mouthed kiss, says she'll see him later and walks away.

His wife glares at him and says, "Who the hell was that?"
"Oh," replies the husband, "she's my mistress."
"Well, that's the last straw," says the wife. "I've had enough, I want a divorce."
"I can understand that," replies her husband, "but remember, if we get a
divorce it will mean no more shopping trips to Paris, no more wintering in
Barbados, no more summers in Tuscany, no more Infinities and Lexuses in
the garage and no more yacht club. But the decision is yours."

Just then, a mutual friend enters the restaurant with a gorgeous babe on his arm.

"Who's that woman with Jim? " asks the wife.

"That's his mistress," says her husband.
"Ours is prettier," she replies. :)

Roy Tucker
12-02-2009, 04:19 PM
Tiger's probably calling Kobe right now and asking him who his jeweler is.



I had exactly the same thought.

Funny joke.

redsfanmia
12-02-2009, 04:23 PM
I must say that I laughed out loud when I heard the voice mail Tiger left Amy Grubb asking to change her voicemail greeting.

WMR
12-02-2009, 05:08 PM
http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm79/joe361/pic30145.jpg

MWM
12-02-2009, 05:34 PM
A lot of people out there seem genuinely surprised. Like I said before, I just assumed. Heck, if it came out tomorrow that the squeaky clean Peyton Manning has similar issues, it would not surprise me at all (please note: i'm not suggesting Manning is or ever would engage in extra-marital affairs. I use his name only because he's got about the most virtuous image of any athlete in the US and I think the masses would be floored to find out he was filandering. I would not be surprised is all I'm saying). I mean, just look at Elin. She is drop-dead gorgeous and it STILL wasn't enough for Tiger. These two women he's linked to are not in Elin's league, yet he still felt the need to pursue. Just shows that the male nature is just too much to overcome for most.

I also think it's still a leap to presume the rumors of the accident and Elin bashing in the window in rage are true simply because Tiger has admitted to getting some on the side.

Chip R
12-02-2009, 05:53 PM
I also think it's still a leap to presume the rumors of the accident and Elin bashing in the window in rage are true simply because Tiger has admitted to getting some on the side.


So you think she just did it for the heck of it?

Boston Red
12-02-2009, 05:53 PM
I also think it's still a leap to presume the rumors of the accident and Elin bashing in the window in rage are true simply because Tiger has admitted to getting some on the side.


What other reason would she have to bash in the back window?

GIDP
12-02-2009, 06:04 PM
What other reason would she have to bash in the back window?

tripped and fell while running to save his life

Chip R
12-02-2009, 06:16 PM
tripped and fell while running to save his life


With a golf club in her hands to make a tourniquet just in case he would get hurt, right? ;)

fearofpopvol1
12-02-2009, 06:20 PM
http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/national_world/stories/2009/12/02/tiger-woods-regrets-transgressions.html?sid=101

This is what I hate the most. Guy is caught red-handed with his hand in the cookie jar and refuses to actually acknowledge what he did wrong and tries to hide behind some words (that he posts on a website--not even in person). What a wussy.

RBA
12-02-2009, 06:26 PM
Is he?

Christiano Ronaldo might be too.

Never heard of him. But that doesn't prove anything. How many Chinese know who is Christiano Ronaldo? They know Tiger Woods.

westofyou
12-02-2009, 06:41 PM
Never heard of him. But that doesn't prove anything. How many Chinese know who is Christiano Ronaldo? They know Tiger Woods.

Do they?

All 1.3 Billion?

My guess is as famous as Tiger is Beckham or even Christine are pushing for that title.

BTW he plays soccer, a sport that most folks around the world pay more attention to than Golf.

We know more play it than those who golf, that's for sure.

Chip R
12-02-2009, 06:52 PM
Never heard of him. But that doesn't prove anything. How many Chinese know who is Christiano Ronaldo? They know Tiger Woods.


I'll bet more Chinese than Americans know who Ronaldo is. Of course there are a lot more Chinese.

Yachtzee
12-02-2009, 06:53 PM
Do they?

All 1.3 Billion?

My guess is as famous as Tiger is Beckham or even Christine are pushing for that title.

BTW he plays soccer, a sport that most folks around the world pay more attention to than Golf.

We know more play it than those who golf, that's for sure.

I would say Beckham or Ronaldo would definitely be up there on the global scale. I would hazard a guess that more people outside the US are familiar with LeBron James than they are Tiger. Basketball is pretty big outside the US (although no where close to soccer).

Jack Burton
12-02-2009, 07:47 PM
This is what I hate the most. Guy is caught red-handed with his hand in the cookie jar and refuses to actually acknowledge what he did wrong and tries to hide behind some words (that he posts on a website--not even in person). What a wussy.

Agreed 100%. The guy's a pompous jerk, the storm that's coming his way is well deserved.

Reds4Life
12-02-2009, 09:12 PM
Now that he's admitted it, I think it's over.

I have a hard time feeling sorry for his wife. Yeah, he cheated, but if he was Tiger Woods, a normal guy that makes $40k a year, would she have given him the time of day? Not likely. Most of the time they get married for one thing......$$$$$$$$$ and lots of it.

texasdave
12-02-2009, 10:11 PM
Most well-known athlete? Yao Ming.

texasdave
12-02-2009, 10:12 PM
Now that he's admitted it, I think it's over.

I have a hard time feeling sorry for his wife. Yeah, he cheated, but if he was Tiger Woods, a normal guy that makes $40k a year, would she have given him the time of day? Not likely. Most of the time they get married for one thing......$$$$$$$$$ and lots of it.

So she asked Tiger to get married? And Tiger said yes?

Redhook
12-02-2009, 10:32 PM
I have a hard time feeling sorry for his wife. Yeah, he cheated, but if he was Tiger Woods, a normal guy that makes $40k a year, would she have given him the time of day? Not likely. Most of the time they get married for one thing......$$$$$$$$$ and lots of it.

I understand what your saying, but man, that's a little harsh. I feel really bad for her.

George Foster
12-02-2009, 11:06 PM
the "after" photo

dabvu2498
12-03-2009, 12:31 AM
Just saw Jesper Parnevik on Sportscenter saying he would have to apologize to Elin for introducing her to Tiger. Seriously. That is harsh.

RBA
12-03-2009, 12:59 AM
I understand what your saying, but man, that's a little harsh. I feel really bad for her.


Apparently, she may of beat Tiger with a golf club. Would you feel bad for Tiger if he beat his wife with a golf club becuase she was having multiple affairs?

Boston Red
12-03-2009, 01:10 AM
Now that he's admitted it, I think it's over.

I have a hard time feeling sorry for his wife. Yeah, he cheated, but if he was Tiger Woods, a normal guy that makes $40k a year, would she have given him the time of day? Not likely. Most of the time they get married for one thing......$$$$$$$$$ and lots of it.

I think she made lots of money of her own.

Razor Shines
12-03-2009, 01:49 AM
Just saw Jesper Parnevik on Sportscenter saying he would have to apologize to Elin for introducing her to Tiger. Seriously. That is harsh.

His full statement was even worse than that.


By Bob Harig
ESPN.com
Archive
Jesper Parnevik, the Swedish golfer who along with his wife, Mia, introduced Elin Nordegren to Tiger Woods, is none too pleased with the world's No. 1 golfer.



Parnevik

Parnevik, 44, who is playing at the PGA Tour's qualifying tournament in West Palm Beach, Fla., told the Golf Channel on Wednesday that "I really feel sorry for Elin," in light of reports that Woods has been unfaithful.


Woods issued an apology on his Web site Wednesday for "transgressions," in the wake of a report that he had a 31-month affair with a Los Angeles woman.


Nordegren, 29, began working for the Parneviks as a nanny in 2000. She was first introduced to Woods at the 2001 British Open and they were married in 2004.

"I would be especially sad about it since I'm kind of -- I really feel sorry for Elin -- since me and my wife were at fault for hooking her up with him," Parnevik said. "We probably thought he was a better guy than he is. I would probably need to apologize to her and hope she uses a driver next time instead of the 3-iron."


In a statement issued Wednesday, Woods strongly denied any physical altercation between him and his wife. "The stories in particular that physical violence played any role in the car accident were utterly false and malicious."


According to Windermere (Fla.) police chief Daniel Saylor, Woods' wife of five years used a golf club to break the back window of Woods' SUV to get him out of the car after she heard the accident in the early hours of Saturday.



Parnevik, a five-time PGA Tour winner, said he has had no contact with Woods since the accident on Friday.


"It's a private thing of course," he said. "But when you are the guy he is, the world's best athlete, you should think more before you do stuff ... And maybe not just do it, like Nike says."

Is it just me or wouldn't a 3-Iron do more damage than a driver? Maybe if it was an old wood driver, but if I needed a weapon and had to choose between a modern driver and a 3-Iron, I'd probably go with the iron.

I wonder if Tiger will use that bulletin board material if he ever plays Parnevik in the matchplay tourney like he did with Ames.

Chip R
12-03-2009, 01:57 AM
From what I've heard, the Parneviks consider their nannys as a member of their family. It sounds like Elin is like a sister or a daughter to him so he is probably reacting like a father or brother would if his son in law or brother in law screwed around on his daughter.

As for Tiger using that as bulletin board material, I think Jesper has to get his Tour card back before something like that happens.

Razor Shines
12-03-2009, 01:58 AM
From what I've heard, the Parneviks consider their nannys as a member of their family. It sounds like Elin is like a sister or a daughter to him so he is probably reacting like a father or brother would if his son in law or brother in law screwed around on his daughter.

As for Tiger using that as bulletin board material, I think Jesper has to get his Tour card back before something like that happens.

Yeah, that's a good point, so he's probably not too worried about it.

macro
12-03-2009, 02:42 AM
the "after" photo

Yep, WMR shared that earlier...

http://www.redszone.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1997515&postcount=187

:D

reds44
12-03-2009, 03:57 AM
I get the feeling Tiger is going to go off next year on the tour.

TeamSelig
12-03-2009, 04:02 AM
Some blame needs to go to the ho in the story too IMO. She knew he was married.

reds44
12-03-2009, 04:11 AM
And how is that her problem? Never understood that.

Redhook
12-03-2009, 08:04 AM
Apparently, she may of beat Tiger with a golf club.

IMO, he deserved it. I hope she hit him hard.


Would you feel bad for Tiger if he beat his wife with a golf club becuase she was having multiple affairs?

Flipping the scenario really doesn't make any sense in this case considering his popularity and power.

Dom Heffner
12-03-2009, 08:38 AM
IMO, he deserved it. I hope she hit him hard.



Flipping the scenario really doesn't make any sense in this case considering his popularity and power.


I think even our worst actions deserve restraint, sympathy, forgiveness.

It's one thing to have someone cornered, it's another to squash them once you do.

That's not saying there isn't a price to pay here, but it shouldn't include being physically assaulted.

There's a difference in what people deserve and what actually happens to them.

If we all wrote the worst thing we did on our foreheads, we'd all wear hats.

Next time you wrong someone, ask yourself if you should be hit with a golf club for it.....

Roy Tucker
12-03-2009, 09:03 AM
I guess I'm surprised people are surprised by this.

None of us can even begin to conceive what the life of Tiger Woods is like. The guy is a media conglomerate, probably a Fortune 500 company unto himself, an international superstar, handsome as all get out, more money than anyone can dream of, and oh yeah, the best golfer on the planet and probably ever. Anything he wants, he can have and I mean *anything*. The life of the privileged is rarified atmosphere.

I think its remarkable he can retain his focus on his golf game and accomplish what he can. Look at John Daly. Arguably probably the same amount of talent and look where his life went. So Tiger gets a little on the side? So what. I for one am wholly unsurprised. And his wife, while gorgeous and sweet and I'm sure a wonderful person, has to know what she's getting into with him. When the gods wish to punish us, they answer our prayers.

redsfandan
12-03-2009, 09:05 AM
THE TIGER WOODS FAMILY CHRISTMAS ALBUM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jt35o866-XE

Dom Heffner
12-03-2009, 09:13 AM
I guess I'm surprised people are surprised by this.

None of us can even begin to conceive what the life of Tiger Woods is like. The guy is a media conglomerate, probably a Fortune 500 company unto himself, an international superstar, handsome as all get out, more money than anyone can dream of, and oh yeah, the best golfer on the planet and probably ever. Anything he wants, he can have and I mean *anything*. The life of the privileged is rarified atmosphere.

I think its remarkable he can retain his focus on his golf game and accomplish what he can. Look at John Daly. Arguably probably the same amount of talent and look where his life went. So Tiger gets a little on the side? So what. I for one am wholly unsurprised. And his wife, while gorgeous and sweet and I'm sure a wonderful person, has to know what she's getting into with him. When the gods wish to punish us, they answer our prayers.

I agree that none of us should be surprised, though I disagree that his wife deserves this or should expect it- I think she should expect someone to live up their their vows.

Anyone who has been deceived this way can tell you the hurt involved- it stinks.

But the shame here also rests with the public- we can't help ourselves, can we? The very idea that a magazine - one with absolutely no scruples, morals, etc.- can pay one of these women $100,000 because we will buy more magazines to read about it is just awful.

I don't need to roll around in someone else's shame to feel good about myself. I don't need to see this on television, just because he is a popular golfer.

The same people who would tell you this is wrong morally are there like little vultures, lapping this stuff up, passing judgment, when they haven't contributed one ounce of the good Tiger Woods has to this world.

Razor Shines
12-03-2009, 09:15 AM
I guess I'm surprised people are surprised by this.

None of us can even begin to conceive what the life of Tiger Woods is like. The guy is a media conglomerate, probably a Fortune 500 company unto himself, an international superstar, handsome as all get out, more money than anyone can dream of, and oh yeah, the best golfer on the planet and probably ever. Anything he wants, he can have and I mean *anything*. The life of the privileged is rarified atmosphere.

I think its remarkable he can retain his focus on his golf game and accomplish what he can. Look at John Daly. Arguably probably the same amount of talent and look where his life went. So Tiger gets a little on the side? So what. I for one am wholly unsurprised. And his wife, while gorgeous and sweet and I'm sure a wonderful person, has to know what she's getting into with him. When the gods wish to punish us, they answer our prayers.

Seems like Tiger gets A LOT on the side, but it probably doesn't change the point you were making.

Roy Tucker
12-03-2009, 09:33 AM
I agree that none of us should be surprised, though I disagree that his wife deserves this or should expect it- I think she should expect someone to live up their their vows.



I probably didn't express myself very well there. I don't think she deserved or expected it and, yes, one should live up to ones vows. Been there too.

I just don't think any of us can even begin to conceive what that kind of life is like. Its like a movie star, sports star, or rock star. Absolutely stunning women, like runway models or Playboy Bunnies, make themselves completely available. I'd like to think of myself as a fairly moral person, but I know if I were put in those kinds of situations, no matter how well-intentioned and devoted of a husband I was, I'm sure I'd have weak moments eventually.

Not that this is an excuse or a reason why it is OK to do. It may be a very human thing, but it is always wrong no matter how you look at it. But anyone getting themselves into relationships with those kinds of guys, be it NBA, NFL, MLB, PGA, whatever, they know that these kinds of issues will eventually come into play and they will have to deal with it. If it doesn't happen, then more power to them and I tip my cap to the strength of their relationships and character. But I think the former is more common than the latter.

Dom Heffner
12-03-2009, 09:38 AM
I probably didn't express myself very well there. I don't think she deserved or expected it and, yes, one should live up to ones vows. Been there too.

I just don't think any of us can even begin to conceive what that kind of life is like. Its like a movie star, sports star, or rock star. Absolutely stunning women, like runway models or Playboy Bunnies, make themselves completely available. I'd like to think of myself as a fairly moral person, but I know if I were put in those kinds of situations, no matter how well-intentioned and devoted of a husband I was, I'm sure I'd have weak moments eventually.

Not that this is an excuse or a reason why it is OK to do. It may be a very human thing, but it is always wrong no matter how you look at it. But anyone getting themselves into relationships with those kinds of guys, be it NBA, NFL, MLB, PGA, whatever, they know that these kinds of issues will eventually come into play and they will have to deal with it. If it doesn't happen, then more power to them and I tip my cap to the strength of their relationships and character. But I think the former is more common than the latter.

This is the point I was gong to raise with Sea Ray- I mean, I appreciate he's been married twice and never had an incident like this, but you know, he probably doesn't have the opportunity like Tiger does.

MWM
12-03-2009, 09:40 AM
I agree completely with what Roy is saying. I'll add to that I'm also surprised at the sweeping conclusions people are making regarding Tiger's character. I'm reading news stories where reporters are getting comments from golf fans and I can't believe what they're saying about him. You'd think he was the worst person in the world. Like Roy said, it in no way makes is less wrong, but these very people making these comments would almost certainly not be able to avoid making the same mistakes in the face of what he's constantly tempted with.

Our culture is increasingly getting into the habit of defining the whole of a person's character by their one or two weaknesses. That's just not fair and no one would dare to judge themselves by the same standards. And people are naive if they think their any of their favorite stars are the moral rocks they want to believe they are.

traderumor
12-03-2009, 09:55 AM
I agree completely with what Roy is saying. I'll add to that I'm also surprised at the sweeping conclusions people are making regarding Tiger's character. I'm reading news stories where reporters are getting comments from golf fans and I can't believe what they're saying about him. You'd think he was the worst person in the world. Like Roy said, it in no way makes is less wrong, but these very people making these comments would almost certainly not be able to avoid making the same mistakes in the face of what he's constantly tempted with.

Our culture is increasingly getting into the habit of defining the whole of a person's character by their one or two weaknesses. That's just not fair and no one would dare to judge themselves by the same standards. And people are naive if they think their any of their favorite stars are the moral rocks they want to believe they are.You are surprised by self-righteousness and hypocrisy? Welcome to Ah-merica, home of the free to do whatever you want.

jojo
12-03-2009, 10:11 AM
I agree completely with what Roy is saying. I'll add to that I'm also surprised at the sweeping conclusions people are making regarding Tiger's character. I'm reading news stories where reporters are getting comments from golf fans and I can't believe what they're saying about him. You'd think he was the worst person in the world. Like Roy said, it in no way makes is less wrong, but these very people making these comments would almost certainly not be able to avoid making the same mistakes in the face of what he's constantly tempted with.

Our culture is increasingly getting into the habit of defining the whole of a person's character by their one or two weaknesses. That's just not fair and no one would dare to judge themselves by the same standards. And people are naive if they think their any of their favorite stars are the moral rocks they want to believe they are.

The secret to achieving absolute moral clarity is to focus only on examining others.

If he (Tiger) cheated on his family, his actions were clearly wrong IMHO. If I were a friend or business partner, I'd have to reevaluate his character.

As just a regular schmuck, spending time contemplating the sordid details of this gossip is basically just time that I can't get back.

If this glimpse into Tiger's personal business factors into someone's choice of golf balls, well, I applaud them for living their values but in the end, it's an awful lot of motion (the media attention) for such a minuscule effect on the practical living of our own lives.

SunDeck
12-03-2009, 10:14 AM
I probably didn't express myself very well there. I don't think she deserved or expected it and, yes, one should live up to ones vows. Been there too.

I just don't think any of us can even begin to conceive what that kind of life is like. Its like a movie star, sports star, or rock star. Absolutely stunning women, like runway models or Playboy Bunnies, make themselves completely available. I'd like to think of myself as a fairly moral person, but I know if I were put in those kinds of situations, no matter how well-intentioned and devoted of a husband I was, I'm sure I'd have weak moments eventually.

Not that this is an excuse or a reason why it is OK to do. It may be a very human thing, but it is always wrong no matter how you look at it. But anyone getting themselves into relationships with those kinds of guys, be it NBA, NFL, MLB, PGA, whatever, they know that these kinds of issues will eventually come into play and they will have to deal with it. If it doesn't happen, then more power to them and I tip my cap to the strength of their relationships and character. But I think the former is more common than the latter.

I don't know about you Roy, but the ladies coming into the library day in and day out are awfully hot. And they throw themselves at me pretty much constantly. I don't bite because, well, I doubt I'm clever enough to pull it off for more than about six minutes. And that's my point, really. Can any guy actually pull off having affairs without the little lady getting a whiff? If anything surprises me it's that Tiger is no different from other dumb, rich celebrities who have unlimited access to pretty women in that he too thought he could keep it all under control. He just seemed like a smarter guy than that.

RedsBaron
12-03-2009, 10:16 AM
, when they haven't contributed one ounce of the good Tiger Woods has to this world.

Dom:
I am fairly apathetic when it comes to golf in general and Tiger Woods. I am honestly curious though about your comment. Other than thrill a lot of people by playing golf perhaps better than anyone else ever has, and making a countless amount of money in the process, what is the "good" that Tiger Woods has provided to this world?

MWM
12-03-2009, 10:22 AM
I don't know about you Roy, but the ladies coming into the library day in and day out are awfully hot. And they throw themselves at me pretty much constantly. I don't bite because, well, I doubt I'm clever enough to pull it off for more than about six minutes. And that's my point, really. Can any guy actually pull off having affairs without the little lady getting a whiff? If anything surprises me it's that Tiger is no different from other dumb, rich celebrities who have unlimited access to pretty women in that he too thought he could keep it all under control. He just seemed like a smarter guy than that.

Well, Bill Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar and by all accounts an extremely intelligent person (note: not commenting either way on his politics or Presidency, just his brains). That did not stop him.

Fact is, the upper brain being over-ruled by the lower one is not a matter of intelligence. Sometimes brains is not enough to overcome natural instinct.

SunDeck
12-03-2009, 10:22 AM
Dom:
I am fairly apathetic when it comes to golf in general and Tiger Woods. I am honestly curious though about your comment. Other than thrill a lot of people by playing golf perhaps better than anyone else ever has, and making a countless amount of money in the process, what is the "good" that Tiger Woods has provided to this world?

Here's a statement from his foundation. (http://www.tigerwoodsfoundation.org/tigers_action_plan.php) I think he's established pretty well an interest into being larger than golf.

Sea Ray
12-03-2009, 10:24 AM
Now that he's admitted it, I think it's over.




I'm not so sure it's over. He still hasn't explained what happened in his accident. Until he comes clean on that, he leaves the door open for rampant speculation and gossip

Dom Heffner
12-03-2009, 10:25 AM
I'm not so sure it's over. He still hasn't explained what happened in his accident. Until he comes clean on that, he leaves the door open for rampant speculation and gossip

And due to that pesky thing called the Constitution, he doesn't have to.

Looks like we'll all just have to get over it and get back to our own perfect lives.

Sea Ray
12-03-2009, 10:26 AM
I understand what your saying, but man, that's a little harsh. I feel really bad for her.

It's interesting how different people view this. My wife's reaction was "she must really be a witch if he's cheating on her already."

Dom Heffner
12-03-2009, 10:28 AM
I don't know about you Roy, but the ladies coming into the library day in and day out are awfully hot. And they throw themselves at me pretty much constantly. I don't bite because, well, I doubt I'm clever enough to pull it off for more than about six minutes. And that's my point, really. Can any guy actually pull off having affairs without the little lady getting a whiff? If anything surprises me it's that Tiger is no different from other dumb, rich celebrities who have unlimited access to pretty women in that he too thought he could keep it all under control. He just seemed like a smarter guy than that.

I love ya, SD, but this isn't even in the same realm as what Tiger deals with. It isn't even close, in any, way, shape, or form.

Comparing chicks from the library to the smorgasboard celebrities have access to- I hope you didn't write that with a straight face.

Sea Ray
12-03-2009, 10:32 AM
This is the point I was gong to raise with Sea Ray- I mean, I appreciate he's been married twice and never had an incident like this, but you know, he probably doesn't have the opportunity like Tiger does.

What does opportunity have to do with it? Infidelity happened and there was no golf club through the windshield incident

Sea Ray
12-03-2009, 10:34 AM
And due to that pesky thing called the Constitution, he doesn't have to.

Looks like we'll all just have to get over it and get back to our own perfect lives.

The Constitution has nothing to do with this case. There are no crimes here. In fact the Constitution gives TMZ the right to continue to report on this

Sea Ray
12-03-2009, 10:47 AM
Well, Bill Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar and by all accounts an extremely intelligent person (note: not commenting either way on his politics or Presidency, just his brains). That did not stop him.

Fact is, the upper brain being over-ruled by the lower one is not a matter of intelligence. Sometimes brains is not enough to overcome natural instinct.

Your second paragraph explains the trysts but not his dumbest moves.

His dumbest moves were sending racy texts and voice messages to his bimbos. He should know that those things are worth big bucks in today's world and for that reason would be cashed in after these affairs ran their course.

It wasn't until his voicemail hit the internet that he came clean on his transgressions.

Very stupid :nono:

Chip R
12-03-2009, 10:50 AM
If anything surprises me it's that Tiger is no different from other dumb, rich celebrities who have unlimited access to pretty women in that he too thought he could keep it all under control. He just seemed like a smarter guy than that.


I don't think you have to limit it to celebrities though. Most guys who cheat think they are smart enough to keep it from their wife. Most get caught.

Unassisted
12-03-2009, 11:10 AM
One of my Facebook friends lives in the same city as Tiger. He says it was common knowledge around town for years that Tiger had girlfriends on the side, so he's amazed that Elin seemed to have no inkling before last week that any infidelity was happening.

Hoosier Red
12-03-2009, 11:35 AM
I love ya, SD, but this isn't even in the same realm as what Tiger deals with. It isn't even close, in any, way, shape, or form.

Comparing chicks from the library to the smorgasboard celebrities have access to- I hope you didn't write that with a straight face.

I think he was kidding.

Chip R
12-03-2009, 11:40 AM
One of my Facebook friends lives in the same city as Tiger. He says it was common knowledge around town for years that Tiger had girlfriends on the side, so he's amazed that Elin seemed to have no inkling before last week that any infidelity was happening.


Well, maybe she did know but she didn't like it when it became public and she was embarrassed.

redsfandan
12-03-2009, 11:51 AM
Maybe she heard stuff but didn't want to believe it. Denial can be pretty powerful.

Chip R
12-03-2009, 12:01 PM
Maybe she heard stuff but didn't want to believe it. Denial can be pretty powerful.


That could be too.

Dom Heffner
12-03-2009, 01:09 PM
The Constitution has nothing to do with this case. There are no crimes here. In fact the Constitution gives TMZ the right to continue to report on this

The Constitution has everything to do with it. We don't know if crimes were committed or not- perhaps she hit him with the club- the thing is, the only two witnesses have a right not to say a word.

That's the only point I was making.

SunDeck
12-03-2009, 01:24 PM
I love ya, SD, but this isn't even in the same realm as what Tiger deals with. It isn't even close, in any, way, shape, or form.

Comparing chicks from the library to the smorgasboard celebrities have access to- I hope you didn't write that with a straight face.

You doubt me? ;)


Well, Bill Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar and by all accounts an extremely intelligent person (note: not commenting either way on his politics or Presidency, just his brains). That did not stop him.

Fact is, the upper brain being over-ruled by the lower one is not a matter of intelligence. Sometimes brains is not enough to overcome natural instinct.

Touché

Sea Ray
12-03-2009, 04:45 PM
This story claims that Tiger may be prepared to pay this bimbo $1mill to stay quiet

http://backporch.fanhouse.com/2009/12/03/report-tigers-people-desperate-to-keep-rachel-uchitel-quiet/?icid=main|htmlws-main-n|dl1|link4|http%3A%2F%2Fbackporch.fanhouse.com%2F 2009%2F12%2F03%2Freport-tigers-people-desperate-to-keep-rachel-uchitel-quiet%2F

This is the nightclub hostess from NY. Apparently she's hired an expensive attorney to represent her or in other words secure a nice payday, and they were going to have a pesser yesterday to announce the revelations. But they postponed it, apparently so as to give them more time to hold up Tiger for more money.

Why in the world would Tiger pay her to stay silent now? She's the third bimbo in this mess, who cares if she joins the crowd? Why would Tiger want to set a precedent for future mistresses that they will get paid handsomely for staying silent? I doubt his wife will take kindly to his behavior hitting her family in the pocketbook.

I don't care how many mistresses Tiger has had but payoff stories like this are what drives these things.

Highlifeman21
12-03-2009, 04:54 PM
This story claims that Tiger may be prepared to pay this bimbo $1mill to stay quiet

http://backporch.fanhouse.com/2009/12/03/report-tigers-people-desperate-to-keep-rachel-uchitel-quiet/?icid=main|htmlws-main-n|dl1|link4|http%3A%2F%2Fbackporch.fanhouse.com%2F 2009%2F12%2F03%2Freport-tigers-people-desperate-to-keep-rachel-uchitel-quiet%2F

This is the nightclub hostess from NY. Apparently she's hired an expensive attorney to represent her or in other words secure a nice payday, and they were going to have a pesser yesterday to announce the revelations. But they postponed it, apparently so as to give them more time to hold up Tiger for more money.

Why in the world would Tiger pay her to stay silent now? She's the third bimbo in this mess, who cares if she joins the crowd? Why would Tiger want to set a precedent for future mistresses that they will get paid handsomely for staying silent? I doubt his wife will take kindly to his behavior hitting her family in the pocketbook.

I don't care how many mistresses Tiger has had but payoff stories like this are what drives these things.

C'mon, if you're a woman and you can get into Tiger's checkbook, it's a no-brainer.

Tiger's the stupid one to have done something to warrant the hush money.

Dom Heffner
12-03-2009, 05:05 PM
C'mon, if you're a woman and you can get into Tiger's checkbook, it's a no-brainer.

Tiger's the stupid one to have done something to warrant the hush money.


The story on NBC this morning was $5 million, with a moving of the fully vested day from 10 years to 7, at which I believe she is eligible for a $20 million dollar payout.

I think she's fine either way she chooses to go.

What is weird that Tiger is paying the money because it's better for his image to be married.

I tell you, rich people live in a different world.

Chip R
12-03-2009, 05:12 PM
This is the nightclub hostess from NY. Apparently she's hired an expensive attorney to represent her or in other words secure a nice payday, and they were going to have a pesser yesterday to announce the revelations. But they postponed it, apparently so as to give them more time to hold up Tiger for more money.

Why in the world would Tiger pay her to stay silent now? She's the third bimbo in this mess, who cares if she joins the crowd? Why would Tiger want to set a precedent for future mistresses that they will get paid handsomely for staying silent? I doubt his wife will take kindly to his behavior hitting her family in the pocketbook.

I don't care how many mistresses Tiger has had but payoff stories like this are what drives these things.

That's a good point. Everybody who is anybody knows he screwed around on his wife. The cat's out of the bag. The only reason I could see for him to pay her off is that he values his privacy so much that he doesn't want these women talking about him any more than they already have.

It also looks like Elin has $55M reasons to stay married to Tiger for at least another 2 years. $80M if it's for 7 more years. Plus she is getting a $5M bonus for signing this new agreement.

http://tristatehomepage.com/content/fulltext/?cid=114512

Sea Ray
12-03-2009, 10:29 PM
Wow. This bimbo explosion is costing Tiger some big bucks...

fearofpopvol1
12-04-2009, 01:48 AM
Our culture is increasingly getting into the habit of defining the whole of a person's character by their one or two weaknesses. That's just not fair and no one would dare to judge themselves by the same standards. And people are naive if they think their any of their favorite stars are the moral rocks they want to believe they are.

I disagree completely. If anything, our culture has been too forgiving for this sort of thing. Has Tiger lost any of his sponsors yet? I see tons of people saying things like, "It's not our business, leave him alone" and "everyone makes mistakes" etc. I don't think celebrities/athletes should be held to higher standards than anyone else, but it doesn't mean they should get a pass for their mistakes either.

fearofpopvol1
12-04-2009, 01:52 AM
Well, Bill Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar and by all accounts an extremely intelligent person (note: not commenting either way on his politics or Presidency, just his brains). That did not stop him.

Fact is, the upper brain being over-ruled by the lower one is not a matter of intelligence. Sometimes brains is not enough to overcome natural instinct.

I completely disagree with this logic. It's just an excuse and a poor one at that.

The answer here is...don't get married to begin with! And certainly don't have children. And if you discover during your marriage that you'd rather sleep around instead of be faithful to your wife, then get a divorce! Why do that? Cheating on your wife, wrecking your family and paying off bimbos with hush money is certainly not noble by most people's standards.