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Sea Ray
03-07-2010, 02:57 PM
This morning's Enquirer has a somewhat scathing article on how Brandon Phillips refused an interview request from John Fay last week because as Phillips put it "I've been around here a week and now you're gonna try to talk to me?"

Fay went on to write:


...the larger issue here is why Phillips wouldn't talk to me. It was because he wasn't one of the first three position players I wrote about.

Fay goes on to speculate that Phillips is building a list of reasons why the Reds may be willing to part with him in the future and that's why folks like Frazier and Valaika are seeing increased time at 2nd base.

Phillips resume now includes this incident in addition to:

--not running out a fly ball on July 21, 2009

--Ignoring a take sign on a 3-0 pitch vs KC on June 14, 2009

--Saying on Aug 31 that he had a broken bone in his wrist only to say the following day that it was merely a bruise

Phillips can accept interviews at his own discretion but he invites criticism like this article when he does. I have to question his judgement in choosing to do this in early Spring Training.

Lack of leadership is a huge reason why they splurged and brought in Scott Roolen and maybe to a lesser extent Orlando Cabrera.

I thought this was a very well balanced article written by Fay.

Incidently you won't find this article on line until tomorrow. The Enquirer is making an effort to make certain stories exclusive only to print customers and this policy probably deserves a thread of its own.

TheNext44
03-07-2010, 03:02 PM
I know that Phillips refused to talk to C. Trent for awhile a few years ago, for very similar reasons. They made up and are fine terms now. I assume the same will happen eventually with BP and Fay.

RedsManRick
03-07-2010, 03:11 PM
Phillips continues to demonstrate his immaturity. I absolutely believe that Jocketty is not the type of GM who will pander to that. If the Reds are out of it this summer and the trade talks heat up, Phillips will be right there with Harang and Arroyo.

HokieRed
03-07-2010, 03:16 PM
Brandon Phillips out, Brandon Webb in. Better way to spend 11.5 next year.

Sea Ray
03-07-2010, 03:38 PM
I know that Phillips refused to talk to C. Trent for awhile a few years ago, for very similar reasons. They made up and are fine terms now. I assume the same will happen eventually with BP and Fay.

I don't give a flying leap whether Fay and Phillips make up. That's between the two of them. As a Reds fan I care about who will be on the field and if incidents like this don't sit well with management I may be looking at a new 2B playing for my favorite team

fearofpopvol1
03-07-2010, 04:08 PM
Yawn. That's SUCH a horrible resume there.

The guy isn't perfect and I'd agree he has some maturity/ego issues, but it's not so bad I would be trying to get rid of the guy. If the Reds do try to get rid of him, let's hope it's because they have a better solution in place.

Besides that, isn't Dusty's biggest strength he's good with the players? Shouldn't he be working to fix this?

Chip R
03-07-2010, 04:10 PM
I don't know if I'd want to talk to Fay either. He's the Eric Milton of sportswriters.

mth123
03-07-2010, 04:11 PM
Yawn. That's SUCH a horrible resume there.

The guy isn't perfect and I'd agree he has some maturity/ego issues, but it's not so bad I would be trying to get rid of the guy. If the Reds do try to get rid of him, let's hope it's because they have a better solution in place.

Besides that, isn't Dusty's biggest strength he's good with the players? Shouldn't he be working to fix this?

Not sure there is anything to fix. Phillips has an ego and thinks Fay waited too long to get around to him. Fay is put off by Phillips brushing him off.

So what?

Ron Madden
03-07-2010, 04:14 PM
I haven't read the article yet but since Fay has written something negative about Phillips it proves two things.

1. Fay is not a True Reds Fan.

2. Fay has to be a closet Adam Dunn Fan.

That's what I was accused of because I said Brandon shouldn't hit 4th against RHP.

;)

dsmith421
03-07-2010, 04:16 PM
Shorter John Fay:

Brandon Phillips was mean to me and is a butt head with a butt face who smells his own butt.

Seriously, that article is virtually indistinguishable from an 11-year-old girl's diary. I bet Fay dots his i's with little hearts.

Blitz Dorsey
03-07-2010, 04:16 PM
I think Phillips just has high journalistic standards and is refusing to talk to Fay because Fay averages about 30 errors per story.

"Fay is the Eric Milton of sportswriters." Well played, Chip.

BTW... these dates have not happened yet:

--not running out a fly ball on July 21, 2010

--Ignoring a take sign on a 3-0 pitch vs KC on June 14, 2010

(Wasn't sure if that was Fay or the thread-starter that messed up the years.)

Wittle 'ol Fay is upset that Phillips won't talk to him. Ha. He reacts to an immature act by being immature with his writing.

kpresidente
03-07-2010, 04:22 PM
Let's see....

Phillips doesn't want to talk to Fay, Fay writes scathing article full of garbage baseless speculation.

More likely, Fay is revealing some of his racial bias against Phillips in this piece. Probably what fuels the anti-Phillips attitude you see around Redszone at large as well.

Sea Ray
03-07-2010, 04:27 PM
I think Phillips just has high journalistic standards and is refusing to talk to Fay because Fay averages about 30 errors per story.

"Fay is the Eric Milton of sportswriters." Well played, Chip.

BTW... these dates have not happened yet:

--not running out a fly ball on July 21, 2010

--Ignoring a take sign on a 3-0 pitch vs KC on June 14, 2010

(Wasn't sure if that was Fay or the thread-starter that messed up the years.)

Wittle 'ol Fay is upset that Phillips won't talk to him. Ha. He reacts to an immature act by being immature with his writing.


That would be the thread starter...My error, not Fay

RedsManRick
03-07-2010, 04:28 PM
Let's see....

Phillips doesn't want to talk to Fay, Fay writes scathing article full of garbage baseless speculation.

More likely, Fay is revealing some of his racial bias against Phillips in this piece.

Yeah, Phillips has no history of being an ego-maniac who thinks he's entitled. Oh wait, you mean that's how he landed on the Reds to begin with? You mean he openly declared himself a captain of the team?

Maybe Fay is being childish too, but let's not pretend that he's simply out to get Phillips. Phillips' reputation is well-founded in his past behavior, whether Fay reacted properly to it or not.

What I find sad is that you react to "baseless speculation" by engaging in some (as far as I'm aware) baseless speculation of your own regarding racial attitudes.

Sea Ray
03-07-2010, 04:31 PM
Phillips saying "I've been around here a week and now you're gonna try to talk to me?" has nothing to do with Fay. It has to do with who what order Fay interviewed Reds players. If Phillips has a deeper issue with Fay I'd like to know what it is

Chip R
03-07-2010, 04:32 PM
Let's see....

Phillips doesn't want to talk to Fay, Fay writes scathing article full of garbage baseless speculation.

More likely, Fay is revealing some of his racial bias against Phillips in this piece. Probably what fuels the anti-Phillips attitude you see around Redszone at large as well.

You are calling people on RedsZone racist? You might want to retract that, if you know what's good for you.

cincrazy
03-07-2010, 04:36 PM
Let's see....

Phillips doesn't want to talk to Fay, Fay writes scathing article full of garbage baseless speculation.

More likely, Fay is revealing some of his racial bias against Phillips in this piece. Probably what fuels the anti-Phillips attitude you see around Redszone at large as well.

That's absolutely absurd.

RedEye
03-07-2010, 04:44 PM
Sometimes the race card can be played. This isn't one of those times.

Eric_the_Red
03-07-2010, 04:52 PM
Can we trade BP AND Fay for another player and writer?

I(heart)Freel
03-07-2010, 04:58 PM
Fay's article mentions on a few occasions how Barry Larkin would never act like BPhil is right now.

I find it amusing that Barry's transgressions in those final few seasons are so quick to be swept under the rug. This is the guy that bolted during the final game early, right?

I have no problem with questioning Phillips' leadership skills and maturity. There are instances that beg those questions. But holding Barry up as the end-all, be-all of Reds leaderships seems off-base.

Plus - and this is just the journalism major in me - I HATE when the writer inserts himself in the story. A little egotistical for my taste. Save that for the full-time columnists. You can't use "I" on Sunday and then go back to writing objectively in the third-person on Monday.

REDblooded
03-07-2010, 05:01 PM
always a good idea to link the actual article in the first post...

Chip R
03-07-2010, 05:03 PM
always a good idea to link the actual article in the first post...

It hasn't been posted online yet. The Enquirer is starting to do that now. I believe it will be online tomorrow.

reds44
03-07-2010, 05:10 PM
Way to be the story Fay.

REDblooded
03-07-2010, 05:12 PM
Ahh... missed the last sentence about the article going online tomorrow... apologies... was trying to link it to a friend and was getting frustrated digging for it... makes sense now.

RedEye
03-07-2010, 05:18 PM
Can we trade BP AND Fay for another player and writer?

I think Fay might be an attractive WTBNL in a team hard-up for beat coverage.

Sea Ray
03-07-2010, 05:20 PM
always a good idea to link the actual article in the first post...

That's kinda out of my control. See my initial post if you don't get it...

mbgrayson
03-07-2010, 05:25 PM
It hasn't been posted online yet. The Enquirer is starting to do that now. I believe it will be online tomorrow.

If this is indeed a new Enquirer policy, it will only succeed in reducing traffic to their web site. I live out of state, and even if I wanted to subscribe to the Enquirer, it would come via U.S. Mail.

As for John Fay, to me he had been the 4th best beat writer covering the Reds (behind C.Trent, Sheldon, and McCoy). I am really bothered by him sowing seeds of controversy because of BP's personal slight to him. The arrogance of these media guys kills me. If BP had a good reason to slight Fay, do you think Fay would print it? It is a built-in conflict of interest for a beat writer to write a story that he is personally involved in. If that story really needs to be written, then another writer should do it.

Sea Ray
03-07-2010, 05:27 PM
Fay's article mentions on a few occasions how Barry Larkin would never act like BPhil is right now.

I find it amusing that Barry's transgressions in those final few seasons are so quick to be swept under the rug. This is the guy that bolted during the final game early, right?

I have no problem with questioning Phillips' leadership skills and maturity. There are instances that beg those questions. But holding Barry up as the end-all, be-all of Reds leaderships seems off-base.

Plus - and this is just the journalism major in me - I HATE when the writer inserts himself in the story. A little egotistical for my taste. Save that for the full-time columnists. You can't use "I" on Sunday and then go back to writing objectively in the third-person on Monday.

That's fine and dandy but how 'bout addressing Fay's point and that is do you think Barry Larkin would blow off a writer because he interviewed three other position players first?

redsmetz
03-07-2010, 05:27 PM
Fay's article mentions on a few occasions how Barry Larkin would never act like BPhil is right now.

I find it amusing that Barry's transgressions in those final few seasons are so quick to be swept under the rug. This is the guy that bolted during the final game early, right?

I have no problem with questioning Phillips' leadership skills and maturity. There are instances that beg those questions. But holding Barry up as the end-all, be-all of Reds leaderships seems off-base.

Plus - and this is just the journalism major in me - I HATE when the writer inserts himself in the story. A little egotistical for my taste. Save that for the full-time columnists. You can't use "I" on Sunday and then go back to writing objectively in the third-person on Monday.

I thought the story was a bit over the top. It has struck me the last couple of years that Fay wants to assert himself as the "BMOC" and somehow makes himself the story (on occasion). Phillips, as others have noted, may need some maturing, but the word that struck me about Fay's "story" today was petulant, describing Fay.

Roy Tucker
03-07-2010, 05:35 PM
I read the article this AM and was struck by how lousy, non-factual, and unprofessional it was. Fay takes one thing and extrapolates a grassy knoll theory. BP must have peed in his corn flakes.

Roy Tucker
03-07-2010, 05:38 PM
And the Enquirer's new "first in print" policy...

http://nky.cincinnati.com/article/AB/20100305/COL26/3070301/+First+in+Print++shows+value+of+Enquirer+content

LoganBuck
03-07-2010, 05:40 PM
Fay was on WLW this morning. He said that Phillips was the one that brought this whole thing up.

My take is that Brandon is an attention seeker. He has a history of being this way. Remember the whole Josh Hamilton/Brandon Phillips beef. Phillips was jealous.

He anointed himself a team leader, and Bronson Arroyo laughed at the idea in an interview with Paul Daugherty on WLW.

My guess is that Brandon wants to be big time. Big time players get interviewed first.

Sea Ray
03-07-2010, 05:41 PM
One thing for sure, RZ doesn't much like John Fay.

As often happens on this site folks make it personal and talk about the writer rather than the action and I believe that's happening again here.

I don't know John Fay so I won't fathom a guess as to whether he's a tool or a great guy. I now wish I'd left the author out of it and said that a beat writer for the Reds wrote the following...

Let's look at it another way. Let's say you catch on the web that the Marlins second baseman blew off the Miami Herald baseball writer for the reasons Brandon Phillips gave. Would you still be saying that writer must have had it coming?

Again I'm just wondering whether this bothers the Reds brass to the point that they're not too excited about the prospect of paying this guy 8 figures?

OldXOhio
03-07-2010, 05:43 PM
Besides that, isn't Dusty's biggest strength he's good with the players? Shouldn't he be working to fix this?

To fix what? BP or the rift with Fay. This whole thing is a giant non-story.

bucksfan2
03-07-2010, 05:51 PM
Read the article and didn't quite understand the purpose of it. There was actually a teaser to it on the front page of the Sat Enquirer and I thought it would be an intersting article.

It sounded more like a pissing match between Fay and Phillips. BP didn't want to speak to Fay 3 days after he reported and Fay thought he was slighted by BP. Most spring training articles are positive to a fault, this one isn't exactly negative, but pretty stupid if you ask me.

Chip R
03-07-2010, 05:56 PM
Fay was on WLW this morning. He said that Phillips was the one that brought this whole thing up.

My take is that Brandon is an attention seeker. He has a history of being this way. Remember the whole Josh Hamilton/Brandon Phillips beef. Phillips was jealous.

He anointed himself a team leader, and Bronson Arroyo laughed at the idea in an interview with Paul Daugherty on WLW.

My guess is that Brandon wants to be big time. Big time players get interviewed first.

I don't think you are wrong. Brandon isn't the first nor will he be the last prima donna baseball player. I haven't read the story but from what has been posted here, this story isn't about Brandon's strengths and weaknesses as a baseball player, it's about John Fay being put out because Brandon didn't want to talk to him then. John Fay isn't exactly Jim Murray as a writer. He doesn't write a very good story nor is he a good technical writer. Perhaps instead of starting a vendetta, Fay could have chose - like thousands of writers before him - not to engage and talk to someone else.

mbgrayson
03-07-2010, 06:08 PM
One thing for sure, RZ doesn't much like John Fay.

As often happens on this site folks make it personal and talk about the writer rather than the action and I believe that's happening again here.

I don't know John Fay so I won't fathom a guess as to whether he's a tool or a great guy. I now wish I'd left the author out of it and said that a beat writer for the Reds wrote the following...

Let's look at it another way. Let's say you catch on the web that the Marlins second baseman blew off the Miami Herald baseball writer for the reasons Brandon Phillips gave. Would you still be saying that writer must have had it coming?

Again I'm just wondering whether this bothers the Reds brass to the point that they're not too excited about the prospect of paying this guy 8 figures?

Problem is, I'm not sure anyone BUT Fay would have written this kind of petty b.s. When a writer choses to use his pen to ream a star player, how can the writer NOT become personally involved? It is inevitable, and Fay brought it on himself. And RedsZone is no different in looking at things this way than anywhere else.

Take a look at the following canon of journalistic ethics:

Impartiality— Sound practice makes clear distinction between news reports and expressions of opinion. News reports should be free from opinion or bias of any kind. This rule does not apply to so-called special articles unmistakably devoted to advocacy or characterized by a signature authorizing the writer’s own conclusions and interpretations.

Does Fay follow this canon? Tomorrow, if BP is involved in a different controversy, would you view Fay as an impartial source of information?

The fact that everyone is more focused on Fay than BP should tell you something. It might not be what you want to hear, but while many of us are unimpressed with BP's public relations goofs, at least he can still do his job well, and that is what I care about. Fay, not so much....

gm
03-07-2010, 06:10 PM
The back of Fay's windbreaker reads "Loose Cannon"

John and Brandon are both shooting holes in their reputations. Is this grade school recess or a professional ballplayer and adult writer we're talking about?

Spring~Fields
03-07-2010, 06:11 PM
If Mr. Phillips wants to be interviewed, then he needs to be responsive and to give a good interview. If he has another agenda, perhaps he should handle it in a more effective manner. I will let Mr. Phillips determine what that is.

If Mr. Fay has an agenda with Mr. Phillips, he would have been more effective if he had not written anything. Let alone to bring this to the public forum of society.

To be more effective, Fay, should just honor Phillips and his implied wishes to not give an interview, and Fay simply not interview or write anything about him all season long, there is plenty of other Dusty comments to fill the space with, and the new player, Chapman‘s story, among many other potentialy interesting stories regarding Reds players.

Who are these two trying to kid, they have a mutualism that they share where the writer and the player feeds off of one another to contribute to their earning a living and so forth. The player needs his name out there for good reasons, and the writer needs to have something to write about, they have to have each other, and need each other, and they all need us to be interested or they might not be getting that higher pay scale with all the perks. Take the junior high mentality down the hall, unless Fay and Phillips wants to pay us for our time to read it. Reminds me of a “Bad Girls” or “Legally Blonde” movie scripts.

Neither of them can write or hit right handed pitching well enough, and neither can I.

I agree with the rest of you, I don't see anything constructive or good from either of the parties, Fay or Phillips.

westofyou
03-07-2010, 06:48 PM
Banal, sub par writers taking shots at players with an inflated sense of self worth, just another day in sports journalism.

redsmetz
03-07-2010, 07:09 PM
One thing for sure, RZ doesn't much like John Fay.

As often happens on this site folks make it personal and talk about the writer rather than the action and I believe that's happening again here.

I don't know John Fay so I won't fathom a guess as to whether he's a tool or a great guy. I now wish I'd left the author out of it and said that a beat writer for the Reds wrote the following...

Let's look at it another way. Let's say you catch on the web that the Marlins second baseman blew off the Miami Herald baseball writer for the reasons Brandon Phillips gave. Would you still be saying that writer must have had it coming?

Again I'm just wondering whether this bothers the Reds brass to the point that they're not too excited about the prospect of paying this guy 8 figures?

I'm not fan of Fay's, but my point wasn't that he had it coming but rather that it was a bit whiny and, as someone else noted, making himself the news. Again, my feeling is that Fay thinks he's the big dog now (really the only newspaper guy left standing, in fact) and he gets to mix it up being the big guy. It will be interesting to see how "new media" folks play out as reporters of the Reds. Sheldon is doing a decent job on the MLB.com post, Rosencrans is writing some very good stuff this spring and McCoy has found a new venue. Not sure why Fay felt it necessary to insert himself into the story.

red-in-la
03-07-2010, 07:56 PM
I have never much liked Fay.....and I am ready to send Brandon a thank you note for his behavior.

And while we are complaining about the Reds' writers.....collectively, their writing is becoming unintelligable.

The excuse is supposed to be that sometimes they are blogging.....but, aren't they supposed to be professional writers.....as in WRITERS?

I read a paragraph written by Fay yesterday where the grammar was so poor, and there were so many MISSING words that I really couldn't get the meaning out of what he was writing.

Chip R
03-07-2010, 08:07 PM
And while we are complaining about the Reds' writers.....collectively, their writing is becoming unintelligable.

The excuse is supposed to be that sometimes they are blogging.....but, aren't they supposed to be professional writers.....as in WRITERS?

I read a paragraph written by Fay yesterday where the grammar was so poor, and there were so many MISSING words that I really couldn't get the meaning out of what he was writing.


Oh, they aren't just blogging, they are Tweeting or Twittering or whatever you call it. It doesn't matter if words are misspelled or omitted or even if the facts aren't checked. As long as the info gets out there as quickly as possible, that's the main thing. And it's not necessarily for the better.

reds44
03-07-2010, 08:43 PM
Honestly, does anybody care what John Fay has to say about Brandon Phillips?

Marc D
03-07-2010, 08:51 PM
I'm not going to draw conclusions about BP or Fay's character from this little tift but I have baseball related reasons I wouldn't mind seeing them trade BP. (well that and my seething hatred of black people :rolleyes:)



He's scheduled to make 11M next year
I subscribe to the Frazier can be a Jeff Kent type at 2B fantasy (or maybe that's just my poorly disguised racism shining through again)
I have never liked his Willie Mays Hayes hacktastic approach at the plate (man, now I hate Willie Mays and Wesley Snipes, I am a racist :()


BP's glove would be missed but if you could give me a cheaper alternative with better OBP skills and use the payflex wisely/bring in fresh prospects I am all for it.

klw
03-07-2010, 09:36 PM
Brandon blowing off reporter on tape. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6gndLnPbCo

reds44
03-07-2010, 09:42 PM
The awesomeness of that video can not be put into words.

klw
03-07-2010, 09:44 PM
Fay forgot to mention that he can't read a lineup

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nwIW7mqWbQ

And here he refused to give his baseball glove to a fan!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsRxmLguqsU&feature=related
And here he clearly admits that he failed to run out a flyball and syas some other stuff.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsVwF-gZ36c&feature=related

klw
03-07-2010, 09:58 PM
I was looking for the video that someone once posted of Brandon opening a little league ball field that he helped have built. Couldn't find it.

Instead remember Phillips has never done this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eAs7DM6u_Q&feature=related

WMR
03-07-2010, 10:41 PM
More likely, Fay is revealing some of his racial bias against Phillips in this piece. Probably what fuels the anti-Phillips attitude you see around Redszone at large as well.

This has to be a joke.

Chip R
03-07-2010, 10:47 PM
I was looking for the video that someone once posted of Brandon opening a little league ball field that he helped have built. Couldn't find it.

Instead remember Phillips has never done this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eAs7DM6u_Q&feature=related

He also never posed for an underwear ad like Pete did.

Nasty_Boy
03-07-2010, 10:50 PM
Fay may be a hack but BP is clearly an attention starved kid. He's had a beef like this with every beat reporter at one time or another. He wants tons of praise and headlines when all goes well, but he can't take criticism. He pouts when reporters say anything negative at all, even when it's just reporting that he's not hitting or playing well. I remember in San Fran two seasons ago, after a long early season slump, that he told reporters not to talk to him after a 2 HR game because they ignored him while he wasn't hitting. He's a talented player with great tools and a great smile... He just picked the wrong sport... He'd fit in much better at WR in the NFL.

Crosley68
03-07-2010, 11:11 PM
Let's see....

Phillips doesn't want to talk to Fay, Fay writes scathing article full of garbage baseless speculation.

More likely, Fay is revealing some of his racial bias against Phillips in this piece. Probably what fuels the anti-Phillips attitude you see around Redszone at large as well.

Really?

flyer85
03-07-2010, 11:17 PM
much ado about nothing

reds44
03-07-2010, 11:43 PM
So what exactly did Phillips do wrong here?

Blitz Dorsey
03-07-2010, 11:59 PM
Basically, the bottom line is in addition to knowing that John Fay is a terrible sportswriter, I now know he is also an immature, petty individual. I find it no coincidence that this happened to by far the worst guy on the Reds' beat. Fay only made it worse by writing a whining article in response. Way to take the high road you freakin' half-literate! (And I am not joking at all. From reading Fay's stuff, you would think he dropped out of school in the 4th grade.)

REDblooded
03-08-2010, 12:48 AM
When Brandon Phillips gives up his free time to do things like the Reds Caravan Tour, I think I can excuse him for not talking to Fay...

Blitz Dorsey
03-08-2010, 12:59 AM
Are we sure that Fay didn't just call Brandon by the wrong name or something -- and maybe mixed in some incorrect statements -- causing all the confusion? From his writing, I could imagine Fay saying something like, "Excuse me, Brendan Philberts, can I get a word with you some time on the hot start you had to the season last year? I was especially impressed with your OPS in April and your ability to avoid grounding into double plays."

So, of course Phillips would refuse the interview after being approached like that.

RFS62
03-08-2010, 01:25 AM
John Fay is a tool.

Brandon is a prima donna.

Water is wet.

Slyder
03-08-2010, 01:29 AM
I can just see Duhhhsty getting in the middle of them and saying "You go to that corner and you go to that corner, and neither of you come out until you can act like grownups".

Brandon thinks he's the big shot fine. Just dont tell him the truth...

RedsManRick
03-08-2010, 01:41 AM
John Fay is a tool.

Brandon is a prima donna.

Water is wet.

And... thread won. Might as well close 'er down.

icehole3
03-08-2010, 05:55 AM
I was looking for the video that someone once posted of Brandon opening a little league ball field that he helped have built. Couldn't find it.

Instead remember Phillips has never done this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eAs7DM6u_Q&feature=related


cvGVz3EuqNw

I can handle Brandon acting like a big baby over other former Reds being selfish and refusing to change positions to help the team better or leaving the dugout and showing up a manager so they can catch a flight home to their mansions

mbgrayson
03-08-2010, 09:07 AM
If anyone hasn't seen this 'piece' by John Fay, it is on the Enquirer web site this morning HERE (http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20100308/COL09/3070389/1071/SPT04/Silence+speaks+volumes).

You can see that it is a hatchet job all the way through. In the end, Fay goes out of his way to mention BP's mistakes from the past. Of course, he doesn't mention the good things, like paying for little league baseball fields, donating time to charity, signing thousands of autographs. Those things would undercut his thesis, that BP is immature. He selectively pulls out a couple small mistakes, and off to the races....

How do we know that Brandon wasn't just having a bad day? Or that Fay slighted him first, and literally didn't say hello or speak to Brandon at all for the first week? We don't. This is NOT news, and has no business being published. Shame on you John Fay.

lollipopcurve
03-08-2010, 09:33 AM
Phillips is good for the team. Good for the organization. Great for the fans. The fact he's a pain for the beat writers on occasion means nothing, by comparison.

bucksfan2
03-08-2010, 09:38 AM
Reminds me of the tiff that Hal McCoy had with HoBail a season or so ago. He was hard on him and even wrote a column explaining why.

I don't hate Fay as much as many on here. He isn't the best, but I think he does a decent job in covering the Reds. Remember he isn't writing to RZ, rather Enquirer subscribers. I agree that his blog has a ton of grammatical errors, but you should see my RZ spell check before I go back through and correct it.

I think the editor should have pulled this article before it went to print but I think they decided to write about BP in the Sunday Enquirer. In all honesty that may have been why Fay waited to interview BP, because he was putting the story in the first Sunday article since ST began.

RichRed
03-08-2010, 11:18 AM
I agree that his blog has a ton of grammatical errors, but you should see my RZ spell check before I go back through and correct it.


But you don't write for a living (I'm assuming) so you're forgiven. Standards are, or at least should be, a little higher for someone who does.

RichRed
03-08-2010, 11:21 AM
Banal, sub par writers taking shots at players with an inflated sense of self worth, just another day in sports journalism.

That's about the size of it, right there. This and RFS62's comment summed it up pretty well.

HokieRed
03-08-2010, 11:29 AM
Phillips is good for the team. Good for the organization. Great for the fans. The fact he's a pain for the beat writers on occasion means nothing, by comparison.


Agree. If we want to raise more serious questions about Phillips, one would be whether he is good for the team at next year's salary, to the possible exclusion of Frazier from the starting lineup, as the #4 hitter against right-handed pitchers etc.

westofyou
03-08-2010, 11:31 AM
Earl Lawson used to have it out with the Reds in the 50's much like this, basically drove Luke Sewell nuts. Also got Lawson a punch in the jaw by.. I want to say Temple?

redsmetz
03-08-2010, 11:33 AM
Earl Lawson used to have it out with the Reds in the 50's much like this, basically drove Luke Sewell nuts. Also got Lawson a punch in the jaw by.. I want to say Temple?

Johnny Temple in '56, Vada Pinson in '62:

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2206&dat=19620621&id=tZAyAAAAIBAJ&sjid=hOkFAAAAIBAJ&pg=4286,1969708

lollipopcurve
03-08-2010, 11:34 AM
Agree. If we want to raise more serious questions about Phillips, one would be whether he is good for the team at next year's salary, to the possible exclusion of Frazier from the starting lineup, as the #4 hitter against right-handed pitchers etc.

I'd be very surprised if Phillips is not traded within a year.

redsmetz
03-08-2010, 11:38 AM
Here's a bit more on the Lawson-Pinson fracas from a piece Joe Posnanski wrote in 2008. Sounds like Fay and Phillips are little league.


I have to share with you quickly the story of how legendary Cincinnati sportswriter Earl Lawson got punched by Pinson and actually put out a warrant to have him arrested for assault. I run across these stories in research (DId I mention I’m writing a book about the 1975 Cincinnati Reds) and I have no place for them in the book.

It began in 1962, and Lawson wrote a scathing column about the Reds. I know it’s popular to say that decorum has really fallen off, but I’ll tell you I think sportswriters could be plenty vicious long before Al invented the Internets and John came up with the Blackberry. From Lawson’s column — this section is about Gordy Coleman.

“The way first baseman Gordy Coleman is fielding his position he might just as well be wearing the glove on his foot. Then again, more balls might wind up in it if he had id dangling from the back of his belt. Coleman doesn’t figure to pick up any ”shiners“ from bad hops, but he may wind up with a few knots on the back of the head.

”And the way he shies away from fences going after pop fouls balls, you’d think they were rigged with high tension wire.“

It is worth pointing out here that Gordy Coleman was NOT the one who hit Lawson. It was Vada Pinson.

”Pinson, gifted with extraordinary speed, should be one of the loops standout defensive players. He’s far from it. The Red centerfielder, first looking over toward Frank Robinson in right field, as if awaiting an OK to chase the ball, permitted a towering fifth inning drive by Sievers to drop into right center for a triple. Result — another Philly run.“

Apparently, Coleman took it hard and did consider going after Lawson — at least according to Lawson’s own account in ”Cincinnati Seasons“ — but he decided to move on. Pinson did not.

”You gutless bleep-bleeper,“ he said to Lawson.

”Vada, if you want a piece of me, then come and get it. I’m not going to run from you,“ Lawson replied.

Again, this is Lawson’s account. Still, nobody really denies what happened after that. In the clubhouse, Pinson said to Lawson: ”That story you wrote, were you kidding or were you series (sic)?“

Lawson said: ”Of course I was serious.“

And Pinson clocked him. Lawson then got up and went after Pinson, though he was not entirely sure what he could do when he got there, but the whole thing got broken up. Lawson went upstairs to write a column which led:

”I got punched again.“

Yeah. Again. Johnny Temple had hit Lawson five years earlier. Popular guy. But believe it or not we STILL have not gotten to the part where Pinson got arrested. That happened late in 1963, when Lawson wrote a column saying, ”Bunts could make champ of Pinson.“ It’s hard to imagine that there was much to complain about Vada Pinson in 1963, his best year. Still, Lawson wrote that Pinson’s ”stubborn refusal to capitalize on his tremendous speed by dragging an occasional bunt probably would cost him the National League batting crown.“

Pinson was so upset — though really, in Lawson terms, that seems pretty tame — that he grabbed Lawson the next day, cocked his fist, ripped his shirt. Lawson burst into the managers office, asked to use the phone, and called the police while, he says, Frank Robinson and Leo Cardenas screamed obscenities at him.

I cannot believe I had never heard this story. The case actually went to trial, and a hung jury was declared. It was going to trial again when Lawson, figuring he had proved his point, dropped the charges.

westofyou
03-08-2010, 11:41 AM
Mid 50's saw the change in the press from the prior years, this change gave us great writers, but a load of angry hacks too. the Philles in 1964 had more than few tagging along. They were brutal.

TRF
03-08-2010, 11:57 AM
If Fay wanted to take the high road, he could have by simply going along with Phillips request... for the rest of ST and the 2010 season. And when there are no stories in the Enquirer about BP, Fay could have said, "you told me not to talk to you."

Instead, he took the low road and made the story about him.

Just once, I'd like to read something written about the reds and be amazed at how it was written, not stunned that it was so bad.

membengal
03-08-2010, 11:59 AM
If Fay wanted to take the high road, he could have by simply going along with Phillips request... for the rest of ST and the 2010 season. And when there are no stories in the Enquirer about BP, Fay could have said, "you told me not to talk to you."

Instead, he took the low road and made the story about him.

Just once, I'd like to read something written about the reds and be amazed at how it was written, not stunned that it was so bad.

Word.

What's John Erardi up to?

klw
03-08-2010, 12:04 PM
now that I have read the piece a few things stand out
1. Phillips went up and put his arm around Fay 5 minutes later and says to him something along the lines of "you don't talk to me the first week of camp and now you want to talk to me?" It doesn't say he then refused to talk with him. (Though this simply moay not have made it in) This staement by Phillips makes it seen that Fay hasn't been speaking with Phillips casually, not even for the purpose of an article, during the week. He should have been laying a foundation.
2. Fay does mention briefly some good things about Phillips off the field and has a nice Baker quote so the content isn't entirely negative.
3. He was doing this interview request a few minutes before the workout. It was a rain day why not wait until after Brandon got his work in?

Sea Ray
03-08-2010, 12:24 PM
If anyone hasn't seen this 'piece' by John Fay, it is on the Enquirer web site this morning HERE (http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20100308/COL09/3070389/1071/SPT04/Silence+speaks+volumes).

You can see that it is a hatchet job all the way through. In the end, Fay goes out of his way to mention BP's mistakes from the past. Of course, he doesn't mention the good things, like paying for little league baseball fields, donating time to charity, signing thousands of autographs. Those things would undercut his thesis, that BP is immature. He selectively pulls out a couple small mistakes, and off to the races....

How do we know that Brandon wasn't just having a bad day? Or that Fay slighted him first, and literally didn't say hello or speak to Brandon at all for the first week? We don't. This is NOT news, and has no business being published. Shame on you John Fay.

I don't think you are being fair to John Fay. He covers those very issues when he said this:


...And I want to make it clear that it is perfectly within Phillips' rights to blow me off. No player is obligated to talk to the media. It's nice if they do, but it's their choice...

Phillips does most everything right. It's hard to argue with his numbers. He hit .276 with 20 home runs, 98 RBI and 25 stolen bases last year. His defense is top-notch.

He's great with the fans. He's a regular on the Winter Caravan and at Redsfest. The marketing department loves him...

His article was balanced in my opinion. Of course the main point he was reporting was that Phillips refused an interview. Some of you may think that Fay should not have reported this at all and that's fine. But once he made the decision to report it, he did do it fairly

Spring~Fields
03-08-2010, 12:53 PM
If anyone hasn't seen this 'piece' by John Fay, it is on the Enquirer web site this morning HERE (http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20100308/COL09/3070389/1071/SPT04/Silence+speaks+volumes).

You can see that it is a hatchet job all the way through. In the end, Fay goes out of his way to mention BP's mistakes from the past. Of course, he doesn't mention the good things, like paying for little league baseball fields, donating time to charity, signing thousands of autographs. Those things would undercut his thesis, that BP is immature. He selectively pulls out a couple small mistakes, and off to the races....

How do we know that Brandon wasn't just having a bad day? Or that Fay slighted him first, and literally didn't say hello or speak to Brandon at all for the first week? We don't. This is NOT news, and has no business being published. Shame on you John Fay.

Oh well. If they get thick, they will get thin. If they get mad, they will get glad.

What time are the soap operas on, on CBS today? :sleep::sleep:

RFS62
03-08-2010, 12:54 PM
Just read the article and now I think Fay is an even bigger tool.

Listing past transgressions again to support his case that he's been "wronged" is beyond immature.

He's a writer. He's supposed to be able to keep his childish emotions in check.

So what that Brandon is difficult for him to deal with. Do your job and lay off the cheap shots and personal attacks.

Did Brandon call him out in public? No. He told him in private what his problem was and Fay spreads it all over the paper and internet for no other reason than to hurt his image.

Grow up, Fay.

membengal
03-08-2010, 12:55 PM
Worst part is McAllister on WLW will run with this and fan whatever flames he can tonite. Making a non-story an even bigger deal.

klw
03-08-2010, 01:26 PM
I will say that while Fay is often criticized for editorial, grammar, and spelling issues that I do appreciate the blog and the updates that he provides.

bucksfan2
03-08-2010, 01:31 PM
I will say that while Fay is often criticized for editorial, grammar, and spelling issues that I do appreciate the blog and the updates that he provides.

I care much more about the information on a blog than I do for grammar or spelling issues.

TheNext44
03-08-2010, 02:39 PM
About Fay and his grammer/spelling issues.

It's a blog that he is usually transmitting via his cellphone. The purpose of the blog in addition to the stories he writes for the paper, is to give us fans immediate updates on what is happening with the Reds.

It is not to provide actual journalistic articles. For that, there are the stories that are printed in the Enquirer and on it's webpage. Notice that the blog is not on the Enquirer's webpage, but has a webpage of its own.

I have no problem with his "freestyle" blogs, and am glad that he is working extra hard to keep us fans updated as quickly as possible. I think it's fair to criticize him for any content issues in the blog , but completely unfair to criticize him for typos, considering the situation.

Chip R
03-08-2010, 02:55 PM
About Fay and his grammer/spelling issues.

It's a blog that he is usually transmitting via his cellphone. The purpose of the blog in addition to the stories he writes for the paper, is to give us fans immediate updates on what is happening with the Reds.

It is not to provide actual journalistic articles. For that, there are the stories that are printed in the Enquirer and on it's webpage. Notice that the blog is not on the Enquirer's webpage, but has a webpage of its own.

I have no problem with his "freestyle" blogs, and am glad that he is working extra hard to keep us fans updated as quickly as possible. I think it's fair to criticize him for any content issues in the blog , but completely unfair to criticize him for typos, considering the situation.


So, what's his excuse in his actual stories he "writes" for the Enquirer?

GAC
03-08-2010, 05:38 PM
Gee - a player who might have a slight ego and attitude problem when it comes to certain media.

Never seen that before.