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View Full Version : How do they stretch them all out



mth123
03-15-2010, 09:13 PM
Harang, Arroyo, Cueto, Bailey, Chapman, Leake, Maloney, Lecure, Lehr, Wells and maybe Owings, Lincoln and Smith are all guys in camp who could be in a rotation somewhere whether its Cincy, AAA or AA. These guys are all going to need to go 5 innings or so pretty soon in order to be ready for the season.

The top 4 are set and maybe Harang, Arroyo and possibly Cueto and Bailey pitch in minor league games (I'd have Bailey pitching to big leaguers) to get their work in while leaving innings on the big club for the others. Meanwhile the leaders prior to spring in the 5th starter race - Lincoln ('cause of the money), Lehr (Last year's audition) and Maloney (The next kid in line) are the least impressive and the guys who we thought would be early elims (Leake, Wood, Chapman and even Lecure) have all been pitching quite well. It will be hard to send the kids down when they've been pitching well and will be hard to get them all ready if they keep everybody around. How do they thin the ranks in time to get them all enough innings for the season? Some thoughts:

1. Owings and Lincoln become bullpen only options and stop working more than an inning or two freeing longer stints for the others.

2. Harang and Arroyo get their next two or three starts in minor league games.

3. Smith, Adkins and maybe Viola go down to thin the ranks just a little.

4. B Games galore.

I think the team may go deep into spring before making significant cuts if they all continue to pitch well. If so, I can't see how they can get them all ready for a starter's load. Its a nice problem I guess, but I hope it doesn't backfire and lead to an injury.

BoydsOfSummer
03-15-2010, 09:18 PM
Some will be reassigned to minor league camp soon.

mth123
03-15-2010, 09:22 PM
Some will be reassigned to minor league camp soon.

Obviously they have to. But based on who is throwing well and who isn't its not so obvious who goes down anytime soon. It might be in the reds best interest if Leake, Wood and Chapman get lit up a little. Then they can just send them down and let them prepare as starters with plenty of spring to go. It beats trying to sneak in a few innings later in games when the better hitters aren't in their anyway and they start the season not ready for a starters load. Keeping these guys healthy has to be top priority.

RedsManRick
03-15-2010, 09:27 PM
Lincoln seems to be pitching himself out of consideration. Leak, Chapman and Lecure and Smith probably have no chance regardless of how they pitch and will be sent down when the need arises comes. Owings will probably go back to the bullpen because he's a known quantity - a shift I could see occurring at any time. So it'll come down to Maloney, Lehr, and Wells and I'm guess that it's Maloney's to lose. I don't really see it being a problem.

mth123
03-15-2010, 09:29 PM
Lincoln seems to be pitching himself out of consideration. Leak, Chapman and Lecure and Smith probably have no chance regardless of how they pitch and will be sent down when the need arises comes. Owings will probably go back to the bullpen because he's a known quantity - a shift I could see occurring at any time. So it'll come down to Maloney, Lehr, and Wells and I'm guess that it's Maloney's to lose. I don't really see it being a problem.

I tend to agree, but I would have thought that some of these guys would be gone already. Not sure when minor league games start, but if these guys stay past then, they could be around for a while.

_Sir_Charles_
03-16-2010, 01:48 AM
Of all the guys in the 5th starter talks, I think Mike Leake is making the biggest impression. I know many here think he's destined for AA...but I firmly believe that he's got the stuff to succeed NOW. But for some reason, he seems to get consistently overlooked.

I know the popular choices are the group of Maloney, Lehr & Wells, but thus far...none of them have been very good. Not horrible, but far from impressive. I know it's just ST stats and such, but in a competition for one single slot...it's got to come down to something.

Mario-Rijo
03-16-2010, 03:26 AM
Of all the guys in the 5th starter talks, I think Mike Leake is making the biggest impression. I know many here think he's destined for AA...but I firmly believe that he's got the stuff to succeed NOW. But for some reason, he seems to get consistently overlooked.

I know the popular choices are the group of Maloney, Lehr & Wells, but thus far...none of them have been very good. Not horrible, but far from impressive. I know it's just ST stats and such, but in a competition for one single slot...it's got to come down to something.

He's being overlooked by most of us because I think people know that he can't do enough to get that spot. It's a darn shame because I doubt he really needs the minors but at least it can't hurt him to go there. Too many decisions nowadays based on money and some half foolish notion of having to go thru all levels to be ready. It's a good thing Pete Rose came up from single A ball in the 60's to make the team and not now or he wouldn't have a shot. Too much coddling these days in addition to the monetary issues.

Guacarock
03-16-2010, 03:33 AM
Of all the guys in the 5th starter talks, I think Mike Leake is making the biggest impression. I know many here think he's destined for AA...but I firmly believe that he's got the stuff to succeed NOW. But for some reason, he seems to get consistently overlooked.

I know the popular choices are the group of Maloney, Lehr & Wells, but thus far...none of them have been very good. Not horrible, but far from impressive. I know it's just ST stats and such, but in a competition for one single slot...it's got to come down to something.

Leake is a special talent, potentially as phenomenal if not more so than Chapman. Wood and Lecure aren't that far behind our more hyped SP prospects. Maybe they don't have ceilings as high, but both of these kids who came through our system are poised, promising starters who could be just as deserving as Maloney of getting an extended ML tryout.

We've taken a quantum leap forward in the caliber of our pitching. Bailey, Cueto and Volquez aren't generating any ink this spring, and it's not because they aren't stellar in their own right. It's because there are so many relatively unknown, young guns challenging to break into what's looking like a vaunted rotation that the press is having to play catch-up and focus on the new faces.

What a far cry from the past decade -- a decade where we lost every year and where our woeful pitching staff inevitably had to shoulder much of the blame for the chronic shortfalls. With this many strong pitchers in the fold, more than we could ever legitimately use, it shouldn't be hard to acquire the few bats we need to put us into playoff contention for the foreseeable future.

It's getting near time for Jocketty to play his hand. We still have some wheeling and dealing to do to reach the top, but I do think we will get there. How sweet it will be!

Ron Madden
03-16-2010, 05:29 AM
Call me crazy but I think Sam LeCure will be able to help the Reds sometime this season.

Strikes Out Looking
03-16-2010, 12:08 PM
Once again, may I remind all my fellow long suffering fans that this is an excellent problem to have. Let us never have to go back to the days of hoping Paul Wilson, er Pete Harnisch, er Pete Schourek's arm didn't fall off (which they all eventually did--in a figurative sense of the word).

LincolnparkRed
03-16-2010, 01:11 PM
I think Dusty has to realize Lincoln isn't a starter but he did get through two innings without a hit yesterday. Past experience usually said he gets lit up in his second inning, so he is building up to 2 innings at least.

bucksfan2
03-16-2010, 01:28 PM
I think Dusty has to realize Lincoln isn't a starter but he did get through two innings without a hit yesterday. Past experience usually said he gets lit up in his second inning, so he is building up to 2 innings at least.

Last year Lincoln struggled when he was sent out for a second inning. With Massett and Cordero being the top to RH arms, and with Burton having more upside than Lincoln, the Reds need Lincoln to be able to pitch more than one inning. IMO that is why the Reds are starting Lincoln in ST. If he can't go more than one inning out of the pen he is dead weight to the Reds. If he can stretch it to 2 innings he adds value.

nate
03-16-2010, 01:42 PM
Last year Lincoln struggled.

Right on!

:cool:

TRF
03-16-2010, 01:53 PM
I've avoided replying to Lincoln based threads, as i didn't have much of an opinion on him one way or the other.

If the Reds can get his arm to where it was in 2008 pre ASB, Mike Lincoln has a lot of value. Strong arm, could dial it up to 95 on occasion.

But he was signed to a dumb contract, he'll be 35 a week into this season, and he's coming off a very poor year and another injury.

Regardless of whether he throws a pitch for the Reds or not, he's going to make 1.5 mil. I won't be too sad if it doesn't work out. After this season, and since 2002, Mike Lincoln has made over $3M playing baseball. That doesn't count his minor league salaries prior to 2002. Maybe he has a year or two in the tank. But if he isn't one of the best 11-12 pitchers after ST, I don't want him going northeast with the team.

nate
03-16-2010, 02:27 PM
I've avoided replying to Lincoln based threads, as i didn't have much of an opinion on him one way or the other.

If the Reds can get his arm to where it was in 2008 pre ASB, Mike Lincoln has a lot of value. Strong arm, could dial it up to 95 on occasion.

But he was signed to a dumb contract, he'll be 35 a week into this season, and he's coming off a very poor year and another injury.

Regardless of whether he throws a pitch for the Reds or not, he's going to make 1.5 mil. I won't be too sad if it doesn't work out. After this season, and since 2002, Mike Lincoln has made over $3M playing baseball. That doesn't count his minor league salaries prior to 2002. Maybe he has a year or two in the tank. But if he isn't one of the best 11-12 pitchers after ST, I don't want him going northeast with the team.

Don't forget that curveball he had in '08, that was a freaking hammer.