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View Full Version : Adam Dunn, 1B, A Work in Progress



redsmetz
03-26-2010, 08:36 AM
Interesting article in this morning's Washington Post about Adam Dunn's transition to First Base. Here's a snippet from the article:


In his transition to first base this spring, progress has come more slowly than Dunn and the Washington Nationals hoped for. General Manager Mike Rizzo classified Dunn's defense as "a work in progress still." Dunn believes he will be a good first baseman. But he also knows, with less than two weeks remaining before opening day, it hasn't happened yet.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/25/AR2010032503544.html

RANDY IN INDY
03-26-2010, 08:38 AM
Would have been much further ahead if he would have worked on it more when he was a Red.

redsmetz
03-26-2010, 08:52 AM
I understand your point, but certainly with the arrival and growth of Joey Votto, the wouldn't have been Dunn's position had we somehow resigned him for last season. Of course, I'm not posting this to reopen that argument either.

I found it interesting to read about his thought process and the Nats outlook and expectations for the transition.

BCubb2003
03-26-2010, 04:23 PM
For a major-college quarterback, Dunn never seemed to have much of an arm or footwork.

Big Klu
03-26-2010, 04:51 PM
For a major-college quarterback, Dunn never seemed to have much of an arm or footwork.

It didn't take that major college long to decide to move him off QB, and to another position. (I think the Longhorns wanted to move him to TE, but I think he would have eventually been a DE.)

bucksfan2
03-26-2010, 04:55 PM
For a major-college quarterback, Dunn never seemed to have much of an arm or footwork.

To me Dunn always looked like a better athlete than he displayed on the field. I don't know why that is but I do agree with the footwork aspect. He seemed to be sloppy in the footwork aspect, which is surprising for a former college QB.

Johnny Footstool
03-27-2010, 01:19 AM
Dunn always seemed excellent at receiving the ball at 1B -- digging balls out of the dirt, corralling high throws, and generally turning potential throwing errors into outs. He was pretty bad at fielding, but I can tolerate that at 1B if a guy is a good receiver.

Ron Madden
03-27-2010, 04:03 AM
Dunn always seemed excellent at receiving the ball at 1B -- digging balls out of the dirt, corralling high throws, and generally turning potential throwing errors into outs. He was pretty bad at fielding, but I can tolerate that at 1B if a guy is a good receiver.

I agree. How well he receives throws out weighs how he fields bunts or shots down the line.

RANDY IN INDY
03-27-2010, 08:45 AM
The key to defense is consistently making the routine plays. The definition of routine plays at the major league level can be anything but routine. The expectations are high.

mth123
03-27-2010, 09:02 AM
I've said for a long time that Dunn would be more harmful to his team at 1B than in LF. Like much of the current "wisdom," generalities don't always apply at the micro level. The "defensive spectrum" just doesn't work with Dunn. I understand the mobility issues, but Dunn's primary problem isn't as much mobility as it is iron hands and crummy instincts. His best spot is in LF where there are only 3 or 4 plays per game and no long throws and not a spot where he has to touch the ball double digit times every game. Some guys are just better off in LF than at 1B. I wouldn't want to rely on Manny Ramirez as the guy to complete the out on every IF ground ball and I feel the same way about Dunn. Dunn is one of my favorite players, but he wouldn't be a 1B on my team.

jojo
03-27-2010, 09:31 AM
Dunn is a DH.

mth123
03-27-2010, 09:33 AM
Dunn is a DH.

Probably. But in the NL he's worse for his team at 1B.

lollipopcurve
03-27-2010, 10:25 AM
I was amazed to read that Dunn had to be taught to focus on the hitter instead of watching the pitcher deliver the ball to the hitter first.

Agree with jojo. DH.

Degenerate39
03-27-2010, 11:08 AM
I wanted to see Dunn become a full season DH for a team like the Rangers. I think he would be more dominate if he didn't have to play the field and he could just concentrate on hitting

Joseph
03-27-2010, 11:13 AM
I wanted to see Dunn become a full season DH for a team like the Rangers. I think he would be more dominate if he didn't have to play the field and he could just concentrate on hitting

You may be right, but I think there is just as much chance that he would be bored.

westofyou
03-27-2010, 12:52 PM
30 years old, outlier as one of the largest men in MLB history and perhaps playing his last season in the NL. He's not as lambasted there as he was here, and is revered for his size and power ala Frank Howard, in fact his experience there to date closely resembles Howard's own experience after leaving the Dodgers and landing in D.C.

RedsManRick
03-27-2010, 01:56 PM
Mo Vaughn, Cecil Fielder, Frank Thomas. Big dudes just don't play the field so well. It will be very interesting to see how FA treats Dunn. With Vlad on a 1 year deal, I could see him as a Ranger next year.

Ron Madden
03-27-2010, 04:09 PM
I think the Nationals will resign Dunn.

Brutus
03-27-2010, 04:36 PM
30 years old, outlier as one of the largest men in MLB history and perhaps playing his last season in the NL. He's not as lambasted there as he was here, and is revered for his size and power ala Frank Howard, in fact his experience there to date closely resembles Howard's own experience after leaving the Dodgers and landing in D.C.

How was he lambasted?

westofyou
03-27-2010, 04:43 PM
How was he lambasted?
You really have to ask?

It's all over this site, a simple search reveals anything I could parrot.

Tom Servo
03-27-2010, 04:45 PM
How was he lambasted?
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3249/2867253326_792146d6e7.jpg

KronoRed
03-27-2010, 04:54 PM
It's all over this site, a simple search reveals anything I could parrot.

Indeed 2 years gone now and still going strong.

Orenda
03-27-2010, 05:13 PM
the nationals just need to sign Scott Hatteberg to stop-gap at 1st until AD is comfortable.

The Dunn to first move should have happened about 4-5 years ago IMO

Raisor
03-27-2010, 10:46 PM
Dunn has just 1431.2 professional innings at first, roughly 159 full games worth. Not a big sample size really.

Captain Hook
03-28-2010, 03:38 AM
Dunn has just 1431.2 professional innings at first, roughly 159 full games worth. Not a big sample size really.

Regardless of sample size it's getting more and more obvious that teams are very uninterested in guys that show any tendency to be a defensive liability.I'm convinced that Dunn will either spend the next half of his MLB career loosing on bad NL teams or else as a DH in the AL.

RFS62
03-28-2010, 12:21 PM
Regardless of sample size it's getting more and more obvious that teams are very uninterested in guys that show any tendency to be a defensive liability.I'm convinced that Dunn will either spend the next half of his MLB career loosing on bad NL teams or else as a DH in the AL.


I have to agree.

Sea Ray
03-29-2010, 01:03 PM
Dunn has just 1431.2 professional innings at first, roughly 159 full games worth. Not a big sample size really.

I disagree. That's a big enough sample size to get a read on the guy's chances of playing a position. If a guy isn't showing you much after 159 games at a position they won't likely give you another 159.

TRF
03-29-2010, 03:48 PM
I disagree. That's a big enough sample size to get a read on the guy's chances of playing a position. If a guy isn't showing you much after 159 games at a position they won't likely give you another 159.

159 games over 9 years isn't a whole lot, what.. 17 games a year?

meh.

nate
03-29-2010, 03:55 PM
I disagree. That's a big enough sample size to get a read on the guy's chances of playing a position. If a guy isn't showing you much after 159 games at a position they won't likely give you another 159.

Is the guy a poor defender? Yes. However, let's not fool ourselves into thinking that less than 20 games worth of defensive data is definitive.

Sea Ray
03-29-2010, 04:30 PM
Is the guy a poor defender? Yes. However, let's not fool ourselves into thinking that less than 20 games worth of defensive data is definitive.

Who mentioned anything about 20 games? Where'd you pull that number out of?

The truth is he's played 1B more than any other position since he left the Reds, including LF and DH.

As for your comment above, Nate, I agree with your first sentence and I also agree that 20 games isn't enough, but that's not where I'm coming from. I'm taking into account his regular season in addition to Spring Training

Always Red
03-29-2010, 04:51 PM
159 games over 9 years isn't a whole lot, what.. 17 games a year?

meh.

or....159 games is nearly an entire season, or another way to look at it is that 159 games for Dunn at 1B is more games than EITHER Chris Dickerson or Drew Stubbs have played in MLB.

nate
03-29-2010, 04:51 PM
Who mentioned anything about 20 games? Where'd you pull that number out of?

I somehow transposed games into innings. Quadragenarian here!

Sea Ray
03-29-2010, 04:55 PM
I somehow transposed games into innings. Quadragenarian here!

:D

:beerme:

TRF
03-29-2010, 05:11 PM
or....159 games is nearly an entire season, or another way to look at it is that 159 games for Dunn at 1B is more games than EITHER Chris Dickerson or Drew Stubbs have played in MLB.

Except Dickerson and Stubbs have over a thousand minor league innings at the position. How many does Dunn have?

strawman argument.

Captain Hook
03-29-2010, 05:37 PM
Jonny Gomes has 155.89 more innings(a little over 17 games)in the OF then what Dunn has at 1B yet he will forever be labeled a poor defender.I think that's a fair judgment I'm just saying that maybe Dunn should also share that label regardless of where he plays.

TRF
03-29-2010, 05:46 PM
Gomes was a bad defender in the minors, has almost never been healthy, and his bat wasn't good enough to warrant a fulltime job at any point in his major league career.

jojo
03-29-2010, 05:57 PM
The problem with believing Dunn can have defensive value is that he's shown next to no reason to believe that he could....

IslandRed
03-29-2010, 06:42 PM
Except Dickerson and Stubbs have over a thousand minor league innings at the position. How many does Dunn have?

Dunn's also 30 years old and not getting any nimbler. I don't think the Nationals are betting with the odds if they're banking on improvement. I think they'll live with it for now and decide later in the year if they're willing to put him in the field going forward, which will determine if they try to re-sign him or if they trade him to the AL or just let him walk.

RFS62
03-29-2010, 08:16 PM
It didn't take seeing Dunn 159 times at first base to decide he was indifferent at best and pathetic at worst.

I don't care what numbers you pull up, he was an abomination at first base. It's not as easy a position as everyone seems to think.

His footwork and his mental game there were atrocious.

Always Red
03-29-2010, 08:26 PM
Except Dickerson and Stubbs have over a thousand minor league innings at the position. How many does Dunn have?

strawman argument.

Dunn has nearly 1500 innings at the major league level, at the position.

Strawman or not, he's not going to get any better.

mth123
03-29-2010, 09:17 PM
It didn't take seeing Dunn 159 times at first base to decide he was indifferent at best and pathetic at worst.

I don't care what numbers you pull up, he was an abomination at first base. It's not as easy a position as everyone seems to think.

His footwork and his mental game there were atrocious.

:thumbup:

Sea Ray
03-29-2010, 09:50 PM
Whoever mentioned that Dunn was less of a detriment in LF than 1B was on the money. If I'm the Nats I'd just as soon put him in LF.

I fear we'll be in the same boat with Francisco and Alonso. Tremendously talented offensive player but no position in the field where he can't hurt you.