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OnBaseMachine
04-11-2010, 01:33 AM
Let's see your predictions for Mike Leake's major league debut Sunday afternoon against the Cubs.

My prediction:

6 IP, 7 H, 2 R, 1 BB, 3 K

Picks up his first major league win.

Deepred05
04-11-2010, 02:08 AM
5 IP, 3H, 4R, 3BB, 5K.
I think the kid has a bad first inning and then settles down from there.

Phhhl
04-11-2010, 02:56 AM
Let's see your predictions for Mike Leake's major league debut Sunday afternoon against the Cubs.

My prediction:

6 IP, 7 H, 2 R, 1 BB, 3 K

Picks up his first major league win.

I think he is going to look REALLY good tomorrow. I don't know how it will start or end, but I believe there will be a stretch of AB's at some point that make you wonder why Homer Bailey has needed five years to be where he is at. Doc Rogers may be overstating his case, but he is right to suggest that Leake is ahead of Chapman in his development. I cannot wait for 1:10 to see the future of my beloved Reds.

reds44
04-11-2010, 04:07 AM
5.2 ip, 4 h, 1 bb, 3 k, 1 er

GAC
04-11-2010, 04:18 AM
All I can say is that this team should score some runs vs Gorzelanny. This too is his first start of the season, and last year his ERA hovered just under 6. Though he does perform better in away games.

Tom Servo
04-11-2010, 04:52 AM
All I can say is that this team should score some runs vs Gorzelanny. This too is his first start of the season, and last year his ERA hovered just under 6. Though he does perform better in away games.
Reds have always had problems scoring runs against him, if I remember correctly.

mth123
04-11-2010, 05:25 AM
Reds have always had problems scoring runs against him, if I remember correctly.

Should be different now. The line-up has a lot of guys who are much better against lefty pitching (especially mediocre ones). Phillips, Gomes, Rolen and Hernandez should all be viable bats along with Votto. Bruce may struggle a bit and the bench with Dickerson, Nix and maybe Francisco if he's still here will probably need to sit until we get into the pen. Stubbs is a wild card. He should have a good game as well. Cabrera seems to be about the same vs either side.

The Reds should be able to score runs against this guy. I hope they get some early to help Leake relax. As to the original question. I'd expect a quality start with an exit after 6 IP.

If Leake is ok, Sunday should be a winning day for the Reds. The match-ups are right for the team.

_Sir_Charles_
04-11-2010, 10:14 AM
6 ip, 2 hits, 0 runs, 0 bb, 2 k's, a boat-load of groundballs

_Sir_Charles_
04-11-2010, 10:15 AM
All I can say is that this team should score some runs vs Gorzelanny. This too is his first start of the season, and last year his ERA hovered just under 6. Though he does perform better in away games.

I agree. But we "should" have scored some runs against Carlos Silva too. Just sayin'

Degenerate39
04-11-2010, 10:19 AM
7 IP, 7 k's, 4 hits, 1 BB, 0.00 ERA

Joseph
04-11-2010, 10:24 AM
6 innings 3r, 2er, 5k, 0bb
No decision

RedsManRick
04-11-2010, 10:26 AM
6 ip, 7 H, 4 ER, 2 BB, 5 K

Scrap Irony
04-11-2010, 10:34 AM
7 IP 5 H 1 BB 5 K 2 ER

Quality game.

Team Clark
04-11-2010, 10:38 AM
Let's see your predictions for Mike Leake's major league debut Sunday afternoon against the Cubs.

My prediction:

6 IP, 7 H, 2 R, 1 BB, 3 K

Picks up his first major league win.

I agree. Don't think I would change any of that. Hoping to get down there today to see his debut.

Az Red
04-11-2010, 11:00 AM
6 2/3 innings, 3ER, 6Ks, 2W

Good luck, Mike. I forgive you for going to ASWHO.

KoryMac5
04-11-2010, 11:08 AM
6ip 4er 1bb 2k's

lollipopcurve
04-11-2010, 11:09 AM
I think he'll get knocked around a little. No more than 5 and a third, Cubs will score at least 4 off him.

Leake's not going to get many borderline pitches against tough veteran hitters this year.

kaldaniels
04-11-2010, 11:15 AM
No one so far expecting the guy who has never thrown a professional pitch to get shelled?

Eh, me neither. 6 IP 3 ER. 3 K 3 BB.

Ron Madden
04-11-2010, 11:17 AM
5IP 4ER 1BB 1K

Caveat Emperor
04-11-2010, 11:40 AM
4ip, 6er, 9h, 2bb, 2k

Jpup
04-11-2010, 11:50 AM
No-hitter.

pedro
04-11-2010, 11:51 AM
5IP 4ER 1BB 1K

That sounds about right to to me.

mbgrayson
04-11-2010, 11:54 AM
Using spring training stats as a guide (very questionable proposition that...), I would say:

6 IP, 4 Ks, 2 BB, 2 ER, and 5 hits.

westofyou
04-11-2010, 11:55 AM
Leaves the game with a blister in the 3rd inning.

I like long shot bets.

TheNext44
04-11-2010, 01:04 PM
5.3 ip 7h 3er 1bb 3k 1hr

OnBaseMachine
04-11-2010, 01:14 PM
Can I change my prediction? ;) This looks like a disaster waiting to happen. He looks nervous, and deservedly so.

Edit - there was that strong poise. Heck of a bounceback.

edabbs44
04-11-2010, 01:16 PM
He'll be fine.

reds44
04-11-2010, 01:19 PM
Can I change my prediction? This looks like a disaster waiting to happen. He looks nervous, and deservedly so.
You were saying? lol

Falls City Beer
04-11-2010, 01:33 PM
The Reds will lose because Gorzelanny's a highly underrated pitcher; but Leake won't figure in the decision.

Sea Ray
04-11-2010, 01:49 PM
I predict he'll start off with 3 shutout innings...

Falls City Beer
04-11-2010, 02:32 PM
In Leake's defense, he's getting the rookie hazing on balls and strikes. Umpires are giving him the business, IMO. And I'm not one to grouse about umps.

Caveat Emperor
04-11-2010, 02:52 PM
In Leake's defense, he's getting the rookie hazing on balls and strikes. Umpires are giving him the business, IMO. And I'm not one to grouse about umps.

Yeah -- it's not worth complaining about most of the time, but it's criminal the way young pitchers (even ones who turn out to be great starters down the road) get treated by umpires as part of their "unspoken code" about how games are called.

OnBaseMachine
04-11-2010, 02:56 PM
Mike Leake's final line in his major league debut: 6.2 IP, 4 H, 1 R, 7 BB, 5 K.

The seven walks are a shock, I thought it would would take him three starts to reach seven walks, but as others noted, he was around the plate today and wasn't getting the calls that veteran pitchers would probably get.

Oh, and he went 2-for-2 at the plate. He had the two best plate appearances of any Reds hitter today.

Too bad he's going to suffer a loss because of the Reds awful offense.

fearofpopvol1
04-11-2010, 03:00 PM
The Reds will lose because Gorzelanny's a highly underrated pitcher; but Leake won't figure in the decision.

Not sure a career ERA+ of 90 is "highly underrated," but ok.

Falls City Beer
04-11-2010, 03:18 PM
Not sure a career ERA+ of 90 is "highly underrated," but ok.

He's had a bad couple of shortened seasons, no doubt, but the fundamentals he showed early on portended a good pitcher (ability to throw three major league pitches for strikes, 92 MPH FB, lefty). I kind of cringed when the Cubs got him and not the Reds.

OnBaseMachine
04-11-2010, 03:22 PM
Tom Gorzelanny has been one of the worst pitchers in baseball the last couple seasons. The fact that he shut down the Reds tells you all you need to know about the Reds offense, or lack there of.

Falls City Beer
04-11-2010, 03:22 PM
The Reds will lose because Gorzelanny's a highly underrated pitcher; but Leake won't figure in the decision.

:eek:

My beer goggles work.

reds44
04-11-2010, 03:26 PM
So who had 7 walks and 1 run?

Joseph
04-11-2010, 03:34 PM
So who had 7 walks and 1 run?

Me, totally me. ;)

Topcat
04-11-2010, 04:55 PM
Leake has moxie and true guts. I loved how he did not let the umps squeeze zone dictate how he pitched to batters.

Will M
04-11-2010, 05:10 PM
IMO Dusty/Price almost ruined Mr Leake ML debut. the kid was clearly tiring late. he had already thrown a lot of pitches. when he walked Lee & Ramirez he was not near the plate. Dusty was likely trying to see if he could get out of the inning, the Reds come back & Leake get his first major league win. instead he added two walks to Leake's total & if Byrd gets a hold of one its 4-0 bad guys. IMO giving a guy like Harang or Arroyo some rope to see if they can grind out those last few outs is ok but a guy in his big league debut??? use some common sense. lets rip up the rookie's arm & destroy his confidence in one fell swoop!

those seven walks are not as bad as they look considering he got squeezed & was left in too long.

lollipopcurve
04-11-2010, 05:14 PM
Very impressive poise, as advertised. The kid's a winner.

OnBaseMachine
04-11-2010, 05:39 PM
Very impressive start by Mike Leake. Three batters into the game I thought, "here we go." But to his credit, he escaped a huge jam and went on to pitch an impressive game. The seven walks was very surprising but that's not something Mike Leake is going to do. I think you can chalk those walks up to a tight strikezone and nerves. I think he showed today he has the stuff to get major league hitters out. I'm looking forward to watching his next start,

RedEye
04-11-2010, 06:25 PM
Look like the Reds done got them a pitcher in the 2009 draft. I'm very impressed with this kid.

bucksfan2
04-11-2010, 06:31 PM
IMO Dusty/Price almost ruined Mr Leake ML debut. the kid was clearly tiring late. he had already thrown a lot of pitches. when he walked Lee & Ramirez he was not near the plate. Dusty was likely trying to see if he could get out of the inning, the Reds come back & Leake get his first major league win. instead he added two walks to Leake's total & if Byrd gets a hold of one its 4-0 bad guys. IMO giving a guy like Harang or Arroyo some rope to see if they can grind out those last few outs is ok but a guy in his big league debut??? use some common sense. lets rip up the rookie's arm & destroy his confidence in one fell swoop!

those seven walks are not as bad as they look considering he got squeezed & was left in too long.

Interesting some how its always Dusty's fault. Why not giving Dusty credit for giving Leake the chance to start the season in the rotation? Why not give Dusty credit for sticking with Leake after that awful start? Leake pitched very well today and his pitch count wasn't all that high. I think Dusty did Leake absolutly right.

fearofpopvol1
04-11-2010, 06:33 PM
Media bias?

On MLB.com, Leake's performance was the 4th story noted behind Halladay's complete game, Strasburg at AA and Chapman at AAA and nothing on espn.com (but Halladay and Strasburg are main headlines). Heck, Leake's story isn't even named as a top story on ESPN's MLB page: http://sports-ak.espn.go.com/mlb/index

Is this story underplayed?? I mean, only the 21st player since the draft to skip the minors? Some teams don't have any players that have ever made this jump. And to boot, he had a pretty awesome rookie debut, no? I know that Chapman and Strasburg are the sexier stories, but why those stories are bigger when they're facing minor league hitters doesn't make much sense to me.

Although yesterday, Zambrano and the Cubs winning was a main headline on espn.com!

bucksfan2
04-11-2010, 06:36 PM
Media bias?

On MLB.com, Leake's performance was the 4th story noted behind Halladay's complete game, Strasburg at AA and Chapman at AAA and nothing on espn.com (but Halladay and Strasburg are main headlines). Heck, Leake's story isn't even named as a top story on ESPN's MLB page: http://sports-ak.espn.go.com/mlb/index

Is this story underplayed?? I mean, only the 21st player since the draft to skip the minors? Some teams don't have any players that have ever made this jump. And to boot, he had a pretty awesome rookie debut, no? I know that Chapman and Strasburg are the sexier stories, but why those stories are bigger when they're facing minor league hitters doesn't make much sense to me.

Although yesterday, Zambrano and the Cubs winning was a main headline on espn.com!

He pitched well but he didn't win. Also people across baseball probably don't know who he is but they do know who Strasburg and Chapman are.

Will M
04-11-2010, 06:41 PM
Interesting some how its always Dusty's fault. Why not giving Dusty credit for giving Leake the chance to start the season in the rotation? Why not give Dusty credit for sticking with Leake after that awful start? Leake pitched very well today and his pitch count wasn't all that high. I think Dusty did Leake absolutly right.

i have never been a Dusty basher. i feel i have given him the benefit or the doubt more often than most here. however, so far this season i have been very unhappy with his choices. Cairo to PH with the game on the line. seriously? however these kind of Dusty moves just cost us games. what he did with Leake today could have had two effects. #1 confidence crush. #2 ruin the kids arm. he was tired. his mechanics were off. i feel that we need to watch Leake's pitch counts & innings very closely this year. if today was a microcosm of Leake's 2010 then we might as well schedule him for surgery in September.

fearofpopvol1
04-11-2010, 06:52 PM
He pitched well but he didn't win. Also people across baseball probably don't know who he is but they do know who Strasburg and Chapman are.

Chapman didn't win either.

You would think there would be a little bit better coverage, no? ESPN doesn't have any coverage of it, though not surprising.

TheNext44
04-11-2010, 07:24 PM
Leake performed better against MLB hitters in his debut than Strasburg did in his against minor league hitters.

OnBaseMachine
04-11-2010, 07:50 PM
Derrek Lee on Mike Leake:

"He knew what he was doing," said Lee of Leake. "He had a lot of different pitches. He competed. He didn't seem intimidated out there. He kept us off balance."

http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100411&content_id=9221752&vkey=recap&fext=.jsp&c_id=cin

Sea Ray
04-11-2010, 09:17 PM
Did anyone notice a FoxTrax strike being called a ball on Leake today? I thought the ump was right on the money.

I don't think Leake got squeezed. The ump was calling the strike zone as it reads in the rulebook. Pitchers don't like that but that's the way it is. Too many umps stretch the strike zone and when one calls it like it is they get accused of squeezing the pitcher. I think the 7 walks are due to rookie nerves and major league hitters working a pitcher. I'm sure PAC 10 hitters would have swung at a lot of those borderline pitches

fearofpopvol1
04-12-2010, 12:53 AM
Btw...watched all of SportsCenter. Not 1 mention of Leake. They didn't even mention Chapman's debut either...but they sure showed Strasburg's minor league debut!

pedro
04-12-2010, 12:59 AM
Btw...watched all of SportsCenter. Not 1 mention of Leake. They didn't even mention Chapman's debut either...but they sure showed Strasburg's minor league debut!

They spent a couple of minutes talking about him on baseball tonight.

Ron Madden
04-12-2010, 01:21 AM
5IP 4ER 1BB 1K

I'm glad I was wrong. :thumbup:

redsfandan
04-12-2010, 01:24 AM
Interesting some how its always Dusty's fault. Why not giving Dusty credit for giving Leake the chance to start the season in the rotation? Why not give Dusty credit for sticking with Leake after that awful start? Leake pitched very well today and his pitch count wasn't all that high. I think Dusty did Leake absolutly right.
I agree that Dusty does get his share of bashing and then some. BUT, and no offense to you, I just can't agree with anything else you said... except that Leake pitched well.

"Why not giving Dusty credit for giving Leake the chance to start the season in the rotation?"

Whether it was Dusty's call or Walt's I still don't agree with it. Even if you think it was the right call should Dusty get all the credit?

"Why not give Dusty credit for sticking with Leake after that awful start?"

Did anyone really think he'd pull him after only 1 inning?

"... his pitch count wasn't all that high."

Leake had next to no pro experience and still probably isn't used to pitching every 5 days. But 107 pitches in his 1st start "wasn't all that high"?? Would 120 pitches have been kinda high?

"I think Dusty did Leake absolutly right."

While I don't think Dusty is quite an "arm killer" I do hope that Dusty relies on Bryan Price alot and that Price plays a big part in pitching decisions. Wishful thinking maybe?

GAC
04-12-2010, 04:39 AM
Leake has moxie and true guts. I loved how he did not let the umps squeeze zone dictate how he pitched to batters.

Yep. And to me that is important. The kid really showed poise out there. And yeah, he was getting the treatment from that ump as a rookie. A vet pitcher would have gotten some of those calls. But he didn't let it rattle me.

mth123
04-12-2010, 06:34 AM
Leake's next outing will tell a lot. His first one on 5 days rest after a full start the time before. This is where we start worrying a bit about the workload hurting him. He goes out there and gets tired, gets into some bad habits, alters his motion, ....

Its why I wanted to make that conversion in AAA so his count could be managed for a while. 106 Pitches isn't too many, but in his situation, I'd have stopped sooner. Say at 85 or so. I hope he gets through it OK. If so, I think the Reds may have a pretty decent young pitcher on their hands. I just want it to be for the next several years and not just for the next couple months.

Wayne Simpson and Gary Nolan keep showing up in my dreams. Lets avoid cutting Leake's career short by piling too many innings/pitches on too quickly. That goes for Chapman, Bailey and Cueto too.

lollipopcurve
04-12-2010, 07:30 AM
Did anyone notice a FoxTrax strike being called a ball on Leake today? I thought the ump was right on the money.

I'm highly skeptical of FoxTrax. Pitches are delivered from different angles, different parts of the rubber, and some hitters have higher zones than others -- I doubt the graphic takes that stuff into account. But maybe someone with more knowledge of the technology can confirm what it's capable of...

edabbs44
04-12-2010, 07:45 AM
Btw...watched all of SportsCenter. Not 1 mention of Leake. They didn't even mention Chapman's debut either...but they sure showed Strasburg's minor league debut!

That vicious Red Sox, Yankee and Nationals bias.

edabbs44
04-12-2010, 08:00 AM
The whole pitching abuse thing is out of hand. Leake was not abused yesterday. But I guess some need something to complain about.

bucksfan2
04-12-2010, 08:38 AM
Whether it was Dusty's call or Walt's I still don't agree with it. Even if you think it was the right call should Dusty get all the credit?

Dusty is the manager. If Dusty didn't want to run out Leake to start the season the Reds would not have. If Dusty wasn't on board and wanted a vet (his vet love) Wells or Lehr would have been the 5th starter.


"Why not give Dusty credit for sticking with Leake after that awful start?"

Did anyone really think he'd pull him after only 1 inning?

It was more of a confidence issue if you ask me. I was in the stands thinking "this is going to be a short day at the ball park" when Price walked out and said something to Leake to settle him down.


"... his pitch count wasn't all that high."

Leake had next to no pro experience and still probably isn't used to pitching every 5 days. But 107 pitches in his 1st start "wasn't all that high"?? Would 120 pitches have been kinda high?

What is it? Pitch count or inning count? I was at the game so I couldn't really tell if he was getting tired but Leake looks like a guy who has a rubber arm. He started the 7th inning with a mid 80's pitch count. Dusty sent him back out there and gave him one more inning. When he looked to be struggling he pulled him. At some point we have to give Dusty credit for knowing his players. Not thinking that he could ruin his confidence by letting Leake give up 2 runs in his last inning. Not thinking some magical 100 pitch number is the end all for pulling all pitchers.


"I think Dusty did Leake absolutly right."

While I don't think Dusty is quite an "arm killer" I do hope that Dusty relies on Bryan Price alot and that Price plays a big part in pitching decisions. Wishful thinking maybe?

I think Dusty does rely on the pitching coach quite a bit. Every pitching coach has a different philosophy. Could you imagine if Dusty and Nolan Ryan ever got together? Leake would have thrown 200 pitches.

Screwball
04-12-2010, 08:56 AM
What is it? Pitch count or inning count? I was at the game so I couldn't really tell if he was getting tired but Leake looks like a guy who has a rubber arm.


It really looked like he ran out of gas there in the 7th. Brantley noted Leake wasn't finishing his pitches, and that that's a sure sign that the pitcher is tiring.

OnBaseMachine
04-12-2010, 11:31 AM
I've seen Leake compared to Tim Hudson quite a bit, I've made the comparison too, and now Ramon Hernandez weighs in...


MORE LEAKE: Catcher Ramon Hernandez was asked to compare Leake to any others he had caught in their early days. Hernandez thought back to when he was in Oakland.

“Tim Hudson,” Hernandez said. “He’s a guy who knows where he’s at, knows where the strike zone is. (Leake) is like that. He’s not afraid of getting hit. Just relax and make them swing the bat.”


http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20100411/SPT04/304110021/1071/Dusty++Marlins+won+t+be+day+at+beach

kaldaniels
04-12-2010, 11:36 AM
I thought Leake's performance yesterday reminded me of many 2008 1st Half Edinson Volquez starts. He showed great ability to wiggle out of some situtations...but you can't do that and be sucessful long term. I'm not saying Leake will fail in the future...but I couldn't help but think as he got of of jams inning after inning...this reminds me of Volquez's games.

OnBaseMachine
04-12-2010, 11:45 AM
I would be shocked if I ever saw Mike Leake walk seven batters in a game again. Control is one of his strong points. I think we'll see him throw a lot more strikes in his next start.

dougdirt
04-12-2010, 12:26 PM
Today's Enquirer - Chapman has a large photo on the front page of the sports section. Leake has a 2inch by 2inch photo next to it. Even in Cincinnati the Bats had a bigger story than the Reds.

kaldaniels
04-12-2010, 12:46 PM
Today's Enquirer - Chapman has a large photo on the front page of the sports section. Leake has a 2inch by 2inch photo next to it. Even in Cincinnati the Bats had a bigger story than the Reds.

Its just the way it is regarding pitching styles and player's personal history when it comes to the press. A "boring" pitcher just isn't going to get the ink...the media will always take the easy way out and tell the sensational story. Think about Greg Maddux...his name was rarely in lights...but I'd take him over just about anyone in the past 25 years. Expect more of the same for the next 5 years if Chapman continues to throw in the triple digits...regardless of results.

dougdirt
04-12-2010, 12:55 PM
Its just the way it is regarding pitching styles and player's personal history when it comes to the press. A "boring" pitcher just isn't going to get the ink...the media will always take the easy way out and tell the sensational story. Think about Greg Maddux...his name was rarely in lights...but I'd take him over just about anyone in the past 25 years. Expect more of the same for the next 5 years if Chapman continues to throw in the triple digits...regardless of results.

One of 21 guys to ever do what Mike Leake did yesterday isn't a 'sensational story'?

edabbs44
04-12-2010, 01:04 PM
One of 21 guys to ever do what Mike Leake did yesterday isn't a 'sensational story'?

There's a difference between doing something rare based on what you did versus it being based on the decision of the front office. I am sure if he threw a no-no he would have ended up on the front page.

jojo
04-12-2010, 01:13 PM
Chapman and Strasburg had previous PR name recognition and clearly mlb was trying to leverage it. They are super easy stories to tell especially if reported on as a pair and given that mlb essentially gift-wrapped the story.... Leake is a guy who beat out another guy named Wood for the Reds 5th spot...

Not saying it's right but 30 second sound bites are what they are...

kaldaniels
04-12-2010, 02:15 PM
One of 21 guys to ever do what Mike Leake did yesterday isn't a 'sensational story'?

It's baseball Doug...everyday you can find a player accomplishing a rare feat. You must distinguish between what is sensational to you and I (Leake) and what sells papers to John Q. Public.

Brutus
04-12-2010, 02:21 PM
It's baseball Doug...everyday you can find a player accomplishing a rare feat. You must distinguish between what is sensational to you and I (Leake) and what sells papers to John Q. Public.

You know though, leading up to the game, Leake actually got quite a bit of hype. ESPN, CBS and MLB all had something big stories on it during the week. But when the Strasburg/Chapman things happened, all of the sudden it was buried like it was no longer a big deal.

I'm kind of in the middle on this, but it went from getting a lot of hype early in the week to becoming nothing more than a secondary story after the fact. It was rather bizarre.

lollipopcurve
04-12-2010, 02:36 PM
Not sure it's worth complaining about which of two sub-23 Reds pitching prospects has received more national coverage....

_Sir_Charles_
04-12-2010, 03:46 PM
Not sure if this has been posted or not yet, but this kind of struck me as a bit silly.


Leake became the first Reds pitcher to get two hits in his Major League debut since Benny Frey did it in September 1929. Leake -- who was also just the 21st player in the Draft era to skip the Minors and make his pro debut in the Majors -- sent his cap to the Hall of Fame

To the Hall of Fame? Really?

fearofpopvol1
04-12-2010, 03:52 PM
And the media and some at RZ are downplaying Leake's start yesterday.

BCubb2003
04-12-2010, 03:58 PM
It can only help the Reds to have everyone talking about Chapman in Louisville while you send Leake to the mound as your fifth starter and say, "Him? That's our other phenom."

redsfandan
04-12-2010, 05:55 PM
Dusty is the manager. If Dusty didn't want to run out Leake to start the season the Reds would not have. If Dusty wasn't on board and wanted a vet (his vet love) Wells or Lehr would have been the 5th starter.
You maybe right that it was 100% Dusty's call. Doesn't mean I'm going to agree that it was the right call. But what's done is done. ...

What is it? Pitch count or inning count? I was at the game so I couldn't really tell if he was getting tired but Leake looks like a guy who has a rubber arm. He started the 7th inning with a mid 80's pitch count. Dusty sent him back out there and gave him one more inning. When he looked to be struggling he pulled him. At some point we have to give Dusty credit for knowing his players. Not thinking that he could ruin his confidence by letting Leake give up 2 runs in his last inning. Not thinking some magical 100 pitch number is the end all for pulling all pitchers.

I'm not sure I understand this but are you actually defending Dusty's ability to handle pitchers? That's kind of a stretch if you are.

Personally, I'd prefer that Leake didn't throw 105+ pitches a game until he's at least used to pitching every 5 days.

I think Dusty does rely on the pitching coach quite a bit. Every pitching coach has a different philosophy. Could you imagine if Dusty and Nolan Ryan ever got together? Leake would have thrown 200 pitches.
I hope so. I really do.

dougdirt
04-12-2010, 06:03 PM
Not sure if this has been posted or not yet, but this kind of struck me as a bit silly.



To the Hall of Fame? Really?

When you are just the 21st player ever to do something, the HOF wants a part of it.

11larkin11
04-12-2010, 06:08 PM
One of 21 guys to ever do what Mike Leake did yesterday isn't a 'sensational story'?

Not sensational enough to be on SportsCenter.

westofyou
04-12-2010, 06:09 PM
And the media and some at RZ are downplaying Leake's start yesterday.

How does one up play his apperance anymore than it has been?

He didn't get the decision, he walked 7 guys and only K'd 5, he started on the day the two biggest ML pitchers pitched for the 1st time as pros.

Looks to me like Leake got as much press as he could have gotten without having actually dominating.

The fact is skipping ML and starting in MLB is the story, his performance wasn't.

BearcatShane
04-12-2010, 06:10 PM
When you are just the 21st player ever to do something, the HOF wants a part of it.

I thought I saw somewhere that the first player to play from the draft they were drafted in always gives the HOF a piece of material. I could be wrong.

_Sir_Charles_
04-12-2010, 06:13 PM
When you are just the 21st player ever to do something, the HOF wants a part of it.

I get that, but the way the article is phrased made it sound like Leake just sent it to them. Not that they asked him for it. It just sounded strange.

_Sir_Charles_
04-12-2010, 06:14 PM
Not Red Sox'ian or Yankee'ish enough to be on SportsCenter.

Fixed it for you. :O)

fearofpopvol1
04-12-2010, 06:28 PM
How does one up play his apperance anymore than it has been?

He didn't get the decision, he walked 7 guys and only K'd 5, he started on the day the two biggest ML pitchers pitched for the 1st time as pros.

Looks to me like Leake got as much press as he could have gotten without having actually dominating.

The fact is skipping ML and starting in MLB is the story, his performance wasn't.

Does getting the decision really mean that much? I guess for the lamestream media it does. Also, you're cherrypicking information, in fairness. 1 ER, almost 7 innings pitched, loading the bases in the 1st inning and getting 3 outs without giving up any runs in his first professional inning, it was against a good lineup, 2 hits from the plate. He didn't dominate, I'll grant you that. But he had a very good debut, especially when you consider the circumstances of him skipping the minors and becoming the 21st person in history to make the jump and an even rarer offensive performance for a pitcher's debut.

I think anyway you cut the cake, the Leake story was downplayed. I wouldn't have expected Strasburg or Chapman to be ignored, but I did expect more coverage than it received.

westofyou
04-12-2010, 06:40 PM
Does getting the decision really mean that much? I guess for the lamestream media it does. Also, you're cherrypicking information, in fairness. 1 ER, almost 7 innings pitched, loading the bases in the 1st inning and getting 3 outs without giving up any runs in his first professional inning, it was against a good lineup, 2 hits from the plate. He didn't dominate, I'll grant you that. But he had a very good debut, especially when you consider the circumstances of him skipping the minors and becoming the 21st person in history to make the jump and an even rarer offensive performance for a pitcher's debut.

I think anyway you cut the cake, the Leake story was downplayed. I wouldn't have expected Strasburg or Chapman to be ignored, but I did expect more coverage than it received.

That's the 21st guy since the DRAFT, not history.

As for ESPN I wouldn't know ho wthey cover it I don't watch that channel much, but MLB TV covered it and amazingly enough they didn't over drool either.

fearofpopvol1
04-12-2010, 06:42 PM
That's the 21st guy since the DRAFT, not history.

As for ESPN I wouldn't know ho wthey cover it I don't watch that channel much, but MLB TV covered it and amazingly enough they didn't over drool either.

21st person in the last 45 years is still a big deal. Especially considering how rare it's been in this era.

westofyou
04-12-2010, 06:45 PM
21st person in the last 45 years is still a big deal. Especially considering how rare it's been in this era.

It's rare because of service time more often than talent. That said it's a nice feather in the cap but David Clyde has it too and it didn't get him anything but a good story.

I'll wait until I declare it the greatest thing since sliced bread.

GAC
04-13-2010, 04:34 AM
I don't think Baker did anything wrong in Leake's debut, as far as the way he handled him.

Contributing to ruining his arm? Possibly crushing his confidence?

Do you think if Baker had jerked him after he loaded the bases in the 1st, or after he got into a similar situation an inning or two later, that would have been a confidence boaster?

When he got himself out of that 1st inning jam without giving up a run, and showed such poise, IMO, that kid deserved every chance he needed to show what he's got.

It was one start. Small window. There was good and bad in that first start; but overall, not a bad outing for a kid who jumps from college directing into the pros. Lets see how the season progresses.

And I'm sure Leake doesn't mind Chapman getting all the attention and hype. Who needs anymore added pressure?

Hoosier Red
04-13-2010, 09:48 AM
I think Dusty has shown more than anything in the time as a Red that when someone starts an inning, he's going to give them an opportunity to end it. Unfortunately that often ends up meaning an extra 10 pitches or so, even if they don't finish the inning.
Now what's the difference between 97 and 107 pitches? Probably not much as long as it evens itself out with some starts where a guy has 87 pitches to start the say 7th inning and Dusty takes him out ahead of time.

Unfortunately the second scenario doesn't play itself out very often.

Mario-Rijo
04-13-2010, 10:09 AM
The kid was fine at the beginning of the final inning although I think it was the last pitch or so to the 1st batter where you could see the fatigue starting to show. So if anything he was in for maybe about a hitter or 2 too many at most. Not a big deal IMO. They do need to err on the side of caution more often than not with him though.

OnBaseMachine
04-15-2010, 11:33 PM
MIAMI – Mike Leake takes everything in his laid-back, California way.

But he admits his first start got to him a little bit.

“The first start, I had a little jitters,” he said. “That’s out of the way now. I’ll try to go out there and make my pitches.”


http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20100415/SPT04/304150030/1071/Reds%20%20Leake%20admits%20first-start%20jitters?GID=+Jhcs3axKqbtN7c7r/gb+5w+FW9uz1ojdXfZzKqofgY%3D

Ron Madden
04-16-2010, 03:09 AM
I expected him to do worse than he did due to nerves.

I thought he did fine and wish him nothing but the best from here on out.

OnBaseMachine
04-16-2010, 03:21 AM
Article from Mark Sheldon:


MIAMI -- Pitcher Mike Leake wasn't just admitted through the velvet ropes of a Major League clubhouse on Sunday when he debuted for the Reds. Leake was ushered straight into an even more exclusive group.

Call it the "21 club," for the number of drafted players that skipped the Minor Leagues since the First-Year Player Draft began in 1965. If anyone could best relate to what Leake is experiencing in


http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100415&content_id=9330916&vkey=news_cin&fext=.jsp&c_id=cin

OnBaseMachine
04-19-2010, 11:27 PM
Gammons: Leake's jump rarely seen


Aroldis Chapman never did pitch on Friday night because of rain. Stephen Strasburg did, making his Harrisburg home debut through hours of rain delays and the kettle drums of unlimited expectations.

Chapman may turn out to be the Cuban Tim Lincecum, Strasburg the next Justin Verlander. Each has to live in the public stocks of unlimited dissection, scrutiny and analysis, which Mike Leake avoided as he jumped from Arizona State to his first two professional appearances with the Cincinnati Reds. Nor did David Price or Lincecum or Verlander.


http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100417&content_id=9370438&vkey=news_cin&fext=.jsp&c_id=cin

HeatherC1212
04-19-2010, 11:52 PM
Wow, nice of Gammons to eventually mention Leake at least one more time in that article. I'm still not entirely sure what he was talking about there but I guess that's normal for Gammons. :eek:

Redsfan320
04-21-2010, 10:07 PM
I'm going to the game tomorrow night. Hope to see the Leakester do well. And maybe hit his first HR. ;)

320

Will M
04-22-2010, 11:25 PM
tonight is was able to see just a tiny bit of the game.
the two runs in the first were a 'hit' due to Cabrera's nonexistent range & a pop fly that somehow carried out. however, later in the game i saw Garret Anderson come to home plate with the assistance of a medicare scooter & just crush a homer to right field.

i was also not able to see Leake's first two starts.

so my question for those who have seen Leake:
how does he look overall after 3 starts?
are you encouraged? does he look like he belongs?

HeatherC1212
04-22-2010, 11:40 PM
I've seen just about all the innings that Mike Leake has pitched so far (missed a little bit tonight) and even though I'm not a pitcher or even a baseball player myself, he sure looks to me like he's been on a mound in the major leagues all his life. He never gets rattled out there, he seems to know what he wants to do when he's pitching, he battles through when he gets in trouble, he cut down the walks tonight (only one tonight against a tough lineup), and he fields his position very well (a ton of ground ball outs to the pitcher tonight). He sure seems like the real deal to me. I'm sure he'll have some struggles at some point but dang it all if he hasn't been very impressive so far. :)

VR
04-23-2010, 12:02 AM
The guy is a baseball player, I love that. Good hitting, good baserunning, exceptional fielding.

On the mound...very good poise, quick worker, great movement on his pitches, not afraid of anyone up there.


I was concerned after seeing him get lit up in the CWS right after the Reds drafted him....but I like him more and more every time I've seen him.

oregonred
04-23-2010, 12:15 AM
The Reds could have/should have won every one of Leake's starts this season. A bright spot on an otherwise horrendously underperforming pitching staff.

Caveat Emperor
04-23-2010, 12:26 AM
At least he got his walks under control.

OnBaseMachine
04-23-2010, 03:41 AM
Leake also worked quickly and helped notch the only sub-three-hour game of the series at two hours, 47 minutes.

"He goes out there and wants to be out there. You can see that right away," Rolen said. "I was talking to [Dodgers coach] Larry Bowa at third base at the beginning of the game. Leake threw about three pitches and [Bowa] says, 'I like this kid. He gets the ball and throws it.' Which is true. He gets the ball and he's throwing it. He keeps the defense right there. He keeps you in the game. It's good to go out there behind him."


http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100422&content_id=9502384&vkey=recap&fext=.jsp&c_id=cin