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View Full Version : Leake promoted, Fransisco Optioned, Viola DFA



RedsManRick
04-11-2010, 01:29 PM
Per Reds twitter.

Thoughts? Hard to believe you'd DFA a 26 year old lefty who can miss bats. Odds that Viola gets picked up on waivers?

OnBaseMachine
04-11-2010, 01:32 PM
I'd say there's a 90% chance Viola gets picked up by another team. A LHP that can throw 94/95 with a nice slider? I can't see him making it through waivers, control problems or not.

Me? I would've DFA'd Miguel Cairo, sent Francisco to the minors and recalled Drew Sutton.

Ron Madden
04-11-2010, 01:33 PM
Per Reds twitter.

Thoughts? Hard to believe you'd DFA a 26 year old lefty who can miss bats. Odds that Viola gets picked up on waivers?

Wow, I didn't see that coming.

mth123
04-11-2010, 01:37 PM
Viola walks the ballpark and will be 27 soon. He's fodder. I was hoping he could be useful as a throw-in to some team wanting to roll the dice on his fastball. Valiquette is the same guy but 5 years younger, Maloney and Wood (and maybe Horst, Smit, and Fairel) are lefty starters who probably have a future as a pen guy and Thurman and Joseph will be the lefties in a couple years anyway. If it wasn't Lincoln, Cairo or Nix, Viola was the most logical to go.

Can't complain about this at all.

reds1869
04-11-2010, 01:40 PM
Viola walks the ballpark and will be 27 soon. He's fodder. I was hoping he could be useful as a throw-in to some team wanting to roll the dice on his fastball. Valiquette is the same guy but 5 years younger, Maloney and Wood (and maybe Horst, Smit, and Fairel) are lefty starters who probably have a future as a pen guy and Thurman and Joseph will be the lefties in a couple years anyway. If it wasn't Lincoln, Cairo or Nix, Viola was the most logical to go.

Can't complain about this at all.

My thoughts exactly. I hope Viola can sneak through waivers but if he does not the organization will be just fine without him.

redsfandan
04-11-2010, 01:41 PM
I'd say there's a 90% chance Viola gets picked up by another team. A LHP that can throw 94/95 with a nice slider? I can't see him making it through waivers, control problems or not.

Me? I would've DFA'd Miguel Cairo, sent Francisco to the minors and recalled Drew Sutton.
That would've made more sense to me as well.

TheNext44
04-11-2010, 01:43 PM
The fact that he was lefty surprises me. There is always value in a lefty arm. Are the Reds allowed to deal him now? I'm not sure of the rules this time of year.

But the fact that he got worse as he moved up the chain, and gave up more and more hits to go along with his boatload of walks, did lower his value. It's also a sign that there's more to being a successful pitcher than striking people out.

I'm not a minor league expert, but I would have DFA's Lecure before Viola.

TheNext44
04-11-2010, 01:45 PM
And people have to get used to the fact that the Reds want Cairo on the team all season. They want a veteran utility guy.

reds44
04-11-2010, 01:50 PM
There was no way they were going to cut Cairo after a week. Why would you keep Cairo over Sutton out of camp, and then decide a week later to cut Cairo in favor of him? Wasn't happening.

Spring~Fields
04-11-2010, 01:56 PM
And people have to get used to the fact that the Reds want Cairo on the team all season. They want a veteran utility guy.

Some might argue, not me, not me. :pimp:

But some might argue that the Reds already have several of them fill in types in Rolen, Cabrera, Gomes, Cairo, Janish, Phillips, Gomes, Nix and Dickerson. :yikes:

edabbs44
04-11-2010, 01:57 PM
not a big deal. 1.5+ WHIPs in the minors in your mid 20s isn't much to get excited about.

Unassisted
04-11-2010, 01:57 PM
It's nice to see decisive action being taken after 1 week instead of a month or so. That's the advantage of having a veteran GM.

edabbs44
04-11-2010, 01:59 PM
interesting that the Redszone Top 40 had Viola at 27 and Ondrusek at 28.

GOYA
04-11-2010, 02:01 PM
Viola is a Jekyll and Hyde. He can be very effective and he can also have such poor control that all he can do is groove fastballs or walk batters. The comparison to Valiquette is valid. Moving Cisco to AAA is the right move.

Guacarock
04-11-2010, 06:52 PM
We're not going to miss Viola. Not with Bray and Jukich soon to come off the DL and the promising pack of southpaw hurlers (Cochran, Harang, Krebs, Valiquette and Smit) now assembled at Carolina. Someone amongst that group ought to soon be knocking on the door, ready to advance to Louisville.

I always liked Viola for his high heat, but questioned whether he could advance because of his control problems. When I saw him pitch in Arizona this spring, he was just as wild as ever. Lefty or not, it seemed about time to pull the plug on that experiment and move on.

fearofpopvol1
04-11-2010, 08:04 PM
I don't think most people deny that Viola had warts, I think people are questioning whether he had more warts than some of the others on the 40 man that ultimately stayed. Is he worse than Lincoln? Or Cairo? I don't know.

I think what's frustrating about it is one would think they could have packaged Viola and a couple others and gotten back something that may have been useful. You hate to just "give away" players that have potential, even if they never reach their potential.

bucksfan2
04-12-2010, 10:30 AM
I think what's frustrating about it is one would think they could have packaged Viola and a couple others and gotten back something that may have been useful. You hate to just "give away" players that have potential, even if they never reach their potential.

Who is to say that Walt didn't try to trade him? It appears that Viola had the least amount of value of anyone on the 40 man roster hence him being DFA'd.

TRF
04-12-2010, 10:36 AM
In 2008 Viola got 7 starts. He was very effective. He's LH. Why he was converted back to the pen after that never made sense to me.

fearofpopvol1
04-12-2010, 04:10 PM
Who is to say that Walt didn't try to trade him? It appears that Viola had the least amount of value of anyone on the 40 man roster hence him being DFA'd.

Who is to say that he did try? I don't think you know any more than I do about this.

TheNext44
04-12-2010, 04:23 PM
Who is to say that he did try? I don't think you know any more than I do about this.

If Jocketty (or one of his assistants) didn't spend a few hours one day calling up teams trying to find out what trade value all the guys on the bubble had, he should be fired. That's most of what they do. Gather info on the value of their players and players on other teams.

It's safe to assume that a GM with 17 years experience makes that basic effort.

fearofpopvol1
04-12-2010, 04:30 PM
If Jocketty (or one of his assistants) didn't spend a few hours one day calling up teams trying to find out what trade value all the guys on the bubble had, he should be fired. That's most of what they do. Gather info on the value of their players and players on other teams.

It's safe to assume that a GM with 17 years experience makes that basic effort.

I don't agree with that. It is entirely possible that he tried, but I think it's entirely possible he did not. I think that happens more often than most want to believe with fringe players.

bucksfan2
04-12-2010, 04:32 PM
I don't agree with that. It is entirely possible that he tried, but I think it's entirely possible he did not. I think that happens more often than most want to believe with fringe players.

Don't quite understand why many think that Walt is asleep at the wheel. Walt has been a successful GM in the major leagues. He knows what he is doing. I am sure that if Viola had value he would have traded him. And if the Reds thought that he was the odd man out to start the season then I am sure the trading options were being looked at from opening day.

To me its similar to the Danny Dorn situation prior to the Rule V draft. Many though the Reds were crazy for leaving him unprotected. They thought at least one team would take a flier on him. Never happened and the Reds were able to keep him in their organization without wasting a 40 man roster slot.

edabbs44
04-12-2010, 04:32 PM
I don't agree with that. It is entirely possible that he tried, but I think it's entirely possible he did not. I think that happens more often than most want to believe with fringe players.

So what's your argument? That the possibility exists that Walt didn't try and package a fringe guy who can't throw strikes in a bigger deal? And that there is also a possibility that he did do this?

Bumstead
04-12-2010, 04:35 PM
He can be traded during the 10-day Waiver period. Otherwise, it seemed pretty predictable. The Reds still aren't ready to dump Lincoln and they don't need pitchers that can't throw strikes no matter what arm they use.

Bum

fearofpopvol1
04-12-2010, 04:50 PM
So what's your argument? That the possibility exists that Walt didn't try and package a fringe guy who can't throw strikes in a bigger deal? And that there is also a possibility that he did do this?

My argument is, plain and simple, we do not know what Walt did or didn't do. And unless you're a Reds employee, you don't either.

edabbs44
04-12-2010, 05:57 PM
My argument is, plain and simple, we do not know what Walt did or didn't do. And unless you're a Reds employee, you don't either.

I think we are all in agreement about that, but you kicked this off by insinuating that they didn't try and deal him for a return.

jojo
04-12-2010, 06:08 PM
Viola is the kind of arm the Ms like to pick up and play with...

TheNext44
04-12-2010, 06:29 PM
My argument is, plain and simple, we do not know what Walt did or didn't do. And unless you're a Reds employee, you don't either.

We don't know anything, just as Decartes. :p:

But I know that Walt tried to trade Viola, or at least did the necessary research to determine his value, as much as I know that he processed the proper paperwork to DFA Viola.

Both are part of the job of being a baseball team's GM. This is what they do. Maybe Walt didn't file the proper paperwork, maybe he forgot to sign a form, but if he did something like that, it was by mistake, and something he intended to do. And he should be heavily criticized if he made such a mistake, since it means he failed at his job. Maybe he didn't try to trade Viola, but the same holds true if he didn't. That is his job.

It's insulting to Jocketty to insinuate that he is so inept that he can't do the most basic functions of his job, which is to maintain a scouting report on each and every players in the majors, including their trade value. Trust me, if you were to ask Jocketty what the trade value of Jordan Smith, or Gil Meche, or Garrett Jones, or A-Rod, or Cliff Lee was right now, he could give you a detailed answer in minutes. This is what GM's and their staff spend the majority of their time doing. Evaluating players.

Gallen5862
04-19-2010, 08:21 PM
Any word on if Viola has cleared waivers? It would be great if he could get sent to Louisville.

camisadelgolf
04-19-2010, 11:07 PM
Any word on if Viola has cleared waivers? It would be great if he could get sent to Louisville.
We'll find out no later than Wednesday.

dougdirt
04-20-2010, 12:04 AM
In 2008 Viola got 7 starts. He was very effective. He's LH. Why he was converted back to the pen after that never made sense to me.

Because he almost made the Reds bullpen in 2009 out of ST, and then when he didn't, it was too late to begin stretching him out for the minor league season and so he headed back to the bullpen. Still, the guy can't throw strikes out of the pen, why would he do so as a starter?

membengal
04-20-2010, 07:59 AM
All I know, is that if he clears waivers, it is further proof of Jocketty's genius...

Always Red
04-20-2010, 08:08 AM
nm

edabbs44
04-20-2010, 09:49 AM
All I know, is that if he clears waivers, it is further proof of Jocketty's genius...

If Viola clears waivers, Jocketty should quit baseball and go into rocket science or brain surgery. Maybe even rocket surgery. That's how much of a genius he would be.

TRF
04-20-2010, 11:30 AM
Because he almost made the Reds bullpen in 2009 out of ST, and then when he didn't, it was too late to begin stretching him out for the minor league season and so he headed back to the bullpen. Still, the guy can't throw strikes out of the pen, why would he do so as a starter?

um, because he did?

Some guys are suited to starting. some to relieving. I think Viola found a comfort zone in the pace of a SP. At least for a while.

Benihana
04-21-2010, 04:11 PM
Orioles claim Viola

VR
04-21-2010, 04:21 PM
Orioles claim Viola

BJ Ryan redux :)

Benihana
04-21-2010, 04:42 PM
BJ Ryan redux :)

More like Craig Tatum redux ;)

Hoosier Red
04-21-2010, 04:53 PM
Wait Craig Tatum's gone? huh.

Edd Roush
04-21-2010, 04:53 PM
And then they option him to AAA. Is this allowed for them because he is still included on their 40 man roster?

Tom Servo
04-21-2010, 04:55 PM
And then they option him to AAA. Is this allowed for them because he is still included on their 40 man roster?
He's not out of options, I believe. The Reds DFA'ed him to get him off the 40 man, not because they couldn't option him.

camisadelgolf
04-21-2010, 04:56 PM
And then they option him to AAA. Is this allowed for them because he is still included on their 40 man roster?
Yes. They can option him all they want this year (and any one year after that) as long as he stays on their 40-man roster.

Jpup
04-23-2010, 06:45 PM
Wayne Krivsky gets Viola back.