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View Full Version : Why does Dusty Baker refuse to make late inning defensive changes?



OnBaseMachine
04-20-2010, 09:55 PM
Why does Dusty Baker absolutely refuse to pull his bad defenders (Gomes, Cabrera) for better defenders late in games? It's a mystery I'm trying to figure out. With a 9-5 lead in the 8th inning tonight, Jonny Gomes was still out there in left field despite being an absolute horrible defender. And of course, a flyball was hit in his direction and he managed to turn it into a double which led to a big inning. Chris Dickerson and Laynce Nix were both available. Why aren't they in the game at that point? I simply do not understand it.

mbgrayson
04-20-2010, 10:21 PM
Dickerson in now playing left in the 9th tonight. Janish also in now at short I think....Dusty must be reading RedsZone.

KronoRed
04-20-2010, 10:21 PM
Can't hurt anyones feelings.

edabbs44
04-20-2010, 10:34 PM
This used to come up with Dunn a few years back where he would get replaced in the 8th or 9th and then the pen would blow it. And the mgr at the time would get shredded for taking him out.

Gomes was coming up in the 8th and if Dickerson replaced Gomes then that would have given LA the option of bringing in Sherrill to neutralize Bruce and Dickerson in a row. If the top of the inning unfolds the way it did then it could have been problematic in the bottom half.

I'm not sure that Gomes actually turned that ball into a double. That ball was smoked. But I would have agreed if Dickerson came out for the 8th in LF. It would have made sense to me.

Captain Hook
04-20-2010, 10:44 PM
I have no idea why Gomes was still in the game for the 8th.He's not Dunn and with a 4 run lead even if he was I'd like to see Dickerson in there.

As far as Janish not being inserted for Cabera, that made perfect sense.I'm sure Dusty knew that if the Reds did blow the 4 run lead the team would need the hot bat of Paul Janish to come in and win it.:D

nate
04-21-2010, 09:35 AM
I prefer to have no Gomes ("Gnomes") after the 7th with the lead.

bucksfan2
04-21-2010, 09:38 AM
Tony LaRussa double switched Matt Holliday out before the 9th inning of their 20 inning marathon game against the Mets. You don't think that Holliday could have made a difference getting 3-4 more at bats in that game?

Chip R
04-21-2010, 09:49 AM
Tony LaRussa double switched Matt Holliday out before the 9th inning of their 20 inning marathon game against the Mets. You don't think that Holliday could have made a difference getting 3-4 more at bats in that game?


I think he did that because Holliday was complaining of fatigue.

OnBaseMachine
04-21-2010, 12:04 PM
I think he did that because Holliday was complaining of fatigue.

Correct. Holliday missed the previous game with the flu and was running on fumes in the 20 inning game.

Brutus
04-21-2010, 12:11 PM
I think the late inning defensive replacement thing is overdone, truthfully. You don't know that it will save you anything, and if it doesn't or the other team ties the game or takes the lead, then you've hurt your chances to score runs later.

Gomes is a bad defender, obviously, but I actually prefer the less is more theory when it comes to late inning substitutions. Especially since this team has had enough problems scoring consistently as is.

flyer85
04-21-2010, 12:12 PM
as bad as Cabrera has been at SS there is no way that Dusty will start consistently replacing him for defensive reasons. If you are going to make a defensive substitution the SS one is a no brainer. Far more important than LF.

OnBaseMachine
04-22-2010, 09:58 PM
Again I ask, why does Dusty refuse to make defensive changes late in the game? His decision to keep Orlando Cabrera in the game in the 9th inning tonight almost came back to bite him in the butt. Russell Martin hit a routine grounder up the middle that Cabrera waved at as it rolled into CF. I counted three hits tonight that Cabrera gave away with his defense. Thankfully he contributed with the bat, though.

edabbs44
04-22-2010, 09:59 PM
Again I ask, why does Dusty refuse to make defensive changes late in the game? His decision to keep Orlando Cabrera in the game in the 9th inning tonight almost came back to bite him in the butt. Russell Martin hit a routine grounder up the middle that Cabrera waved at as it rolled into CF. I counted three hits tonight that Cabrera gave away with his defense. Thankfully he contributed with the bat, though.

Hard hit ground ball up the middle. That was a base hit.

I guess there needs to be something to complain about on a daily basis now that Taveras is gone. Defense of Gomes and Cabrera, welcome to the microscope.

RedsManRick
04-22-2010, 10:03 PM
Hard hit ground ball up the middle. That was a base hit.

I guess there needs to be something to complain about on a daily basis now that Taveras is gone. Defense of Gomes and Cabrera, welcome to the microscope.

It certainly wasn't an error, but I'm fully confident Janish would have had it. Up 3 in the 9th, isn't it fairly standard practice to put in your defensive wizard?

Some people ask why sweat the small stuff. But it's all stuff. A bad lineup here, a failure to sub in good defenders there and suddenly you've given away a handful of games for no good reason.

Screwball
04-22-2010, 10:04 PM
Hard hit ground ball up the middle. That was a base hit.

I guess there needs to be something to complain about on a daily basis now that Taveras is gone. Defense of Gomes and Cabrera, welcome to the microscope.

If you can't see and admit that Cabrera has abysmal range (especially for shortstop), then I gotta think you have an extremely biased view on the matter.

OnBaseMachine
04-22-2010, 10:07 PM
It certainly wasn't an error, but I'm fully confident Janish would have had it. Up 3 in the 9th, isn't it fairly standard practice to put in your defensive wizard?


I don't think there's any doubt Janish would have had it. Even an average defender makes that play, IMO. I hate to pile on the guy but it's amazing how far his defense has fallen. I used to love watching him play when he was with Montreal and always wanted the Reds to acquire him, but he's not half the player now that he was back then.

OnBaseMachine
04-22-2010, 10:08 PM
If you can't see and admit that Cabrera has abysmal range (especially for shortstop), then I gotta think you have an extremely biased view on the matter.

Agreed.

edabbs44
04-22-2010, 10:22 PM
If you can't see and admit that Cabrera has abysmal range (especially for shortstop), then I gotta think you have an extremely biased view on the matter.

Did I say that? The ball was hit up the middle, over 2nd base. The whole defensive thing is getting completely overblown.

Screwball
04-22-2010, 10:36 PM
Did I say that? The ball was hit up the middle, over 2nd base. The whole defensive thing is getting completely overblown.

Um, no, no it isn't. You seem to want to play the "You just want to complain about something" card instead of acknowledging what just about every other Reds fan is seeing - the defense at a couple spots (namely, SS) is a growing problem for the Reds. If anything, defense is often overlooked, although that's becoming less the case in this day and age.

And BTW, the thread starter is hardly one to be an incessant cynic. I think he's got a great point about late inning defensive subsitutions, and at the very least it's worth discussing. It's not simply a topic brought up for us miserable grumps to complain about.

edabbs44
04-22-2010, 10:39 PM
It certainly wasn't an error, but I'm fully confident Janish would have had it. Up 3 in the 9th, isn't it fairly standard practice to put in your defensive wizard?

Some people ask why sweat the small stuff. But it's all stuff. A bad lineup here, a failure to sub in good defenders there and suddenly you've given away a handful of games for no good reason.

I'm not disagreeing with you at all, but since defense is the new hot button topic in baseball it just seems like we are heading towards 6 months worth of threads and comment after comment picking apart every defensive play by Cabrera and Gomes throughout each game.

Cabrera definitely hasn't looked spectacular out there and we may see Dusty start making moves like this in the future as he may not have a choice. But the guy has a nice night at the plate, the team gets a nice victory and here come the comments about the defense.

TheNext44
04-22-2010, 11:13 PM
I'm not disagreeing with you at all, but since defense is the new hot button topic in baseball it just seems like we are heading towards 6 months worth of threads and comment after comment picking apart every defensive play by Cabrera and Gomes throughout each game.

Cabrera definitely hasn't looked spectacular out there and we may see Dusty start making moves like this in the future as he may not have a choice. But the guy has a nice night at the plate, the team gets a nice victory and here come the comments about the defense.

Thing is, defense is not new. It had been the cornerstone for good teams pretty much since the game has been played professionally until the Steroid ERA. I am sure Westofyou will point out a time in 1883-7 when it wasn't, but for the most of the history of baseball, defense has been essential to winning.

For a brief time after Moneyball came out, the Saber community downplayed the value of defense, but only because it could not be quantified. That coincided with Steroids Ball, when defense mattered a little less, since so many balls were being hit over the walls.

So for a brief time until the defensive stats were invented, defense wasn't stressed as much as it used to be, but now that the stats show how important it is, and home runs are down, teams are going back to where they were before Steroids.

It's not like this is a new, strange abstract move towards over-emphasizing defense, it's just a getting back to where the game has been for over a century.

edabbs44
04-23-2010, 06:01 AM
Thing is, defense is not new. It had been the cornerstone for good teams pretty much since the game has been played professionally until the Steroid ERA. I am sure Westofyou will point out a time in 1883-7 when it wasn't, but for the most of the history of baseball, defense has been essential to winning.

For a brief time after Moneyball came out, the Saber community downplayed the value of defense, but only because it could not be quantified. That coincided with Steroids Ball, when defense mattered a little less, since so many balls were being hit over the walls.

So for a brief time until the defensive stats were invented, defense wasn't stressed as much as it used to be, but now that the stats show how important it is, and home runs are down, teams are going back to where they were before Steroids.

It's not like this is a new, strange abstract move towards over-emphasizing defense, it's just a getting back to where the game has been for over a century.

Right, and defense is important. But what I am saying is that a few articles were written this year about defense, a few stats were constructed and analyzed asnd now everytime a ball is hit to LF or SS there is going to be a dissection of how that fielder should have had it and how the other guy would have. I was worried that there wouldn't be a subject to beat into the ground day after day since WT was gone, but it looks like we'll be ok.

nate
04-23-2010, 07:54 AM
I don't think there's any doubt Janish would have had it. Even an average defender makes that play, IMO. I hate to pile on the guy but it's amazing how far his defense has fallen. I used to love watching him play when he was with Montreal and always wanted the Reds to acquire him, but he's not half the player now that he was back then.

Honestly, there were a couple of other plays last night I think Janish would've had that Cabrera waved at.

And the two plays in left where Dickerson, 1. made the over the shoulder catch and 2. limited a sure extra base hit to a single were not something I'd expect Gomes to get.

Defense contributed a lot to last night's win.

bucksfan2
04-23-2010, 08:37 AM
Right, and defense is important. But what I am saying is that a few articles were written this year about defense, a few stats were constructed and analyzed asnd now everytime a ball is hit to LF or SS there is going to be a dissection of how that fielder should have had it and how the other guy would have. I was worried that there wouldn't be a subject to beat into the ground day after day since WT was gone, but it looks like we'll be ok.

I couldn't have said it better. Defense has become in vogue this season and it is getting a little annoying to hear all the complaints about Cabrera.

The play in question was a tough play to make. Janish may have gotten to the ball but another question is whether or not he would have been able to make an out. I also thought that when you are playing at DP depth you are a step or two in, which may have resulted in Cabrera not getting to that ball.

Good win and good night at the plate for Cabrera last night.

bucksfan2
04-23-2010, 08:42 AM
Honestly, there were a couple of other plays last night I think Janish would've had that Cabrera waved at.

And the two plays in left where Dickerson, 1. made the over the shoulder catch and 2. limited a sure extra base hit to a single were not something I'd expect Gomes to get.

Defense contributed a lot to last night's win.

To play devils advocate while defense played a large role in the game Dickersons K with bases loaded and 1 out with the Reds down 1 could have been the deciding at bat in that game. It took an infield single by "No Defense" Cabrera to get a run across in that inning.

edabbs44
04-23-2010, 09:11 AM
Honestly, there were a couple of other plays last night I think Janish would've had that Cabrera waved at.

And the two plays in left where Dickerson, 1. made the over the shoulder catch and 2. limited a sure extra base hit to a single were not something I'd expect Gomes to get.

Defense contributed a lot to last night's win.

I have to say, Dickerson misplayed both of those balls (especially the first one) last night. He ended up catching them but they were not as difficult as they looked.

And we can continue to drone on about the defense, but I haven't heard much about Dickerson's .257/.278/.343 line (with a .409 Babip!!!) with zero HR, zero RBI and 13/1 K/BB ratio. If his name was Taveras I am sure that his defense wouldn't matter in the slightest and we would have had 50 threads requesting his ouster. Hell, if his name were Stubbs maybe he would be getting petitioned to go down to the minors.

Let's just try and look at things in perspective. The team had a good win last night and all some people want to point out are Cabrera's defensive issues and how Dickerson made plays that Gomes never would have. Which may or may not be true. I totally get if it is a critical play and Gomes lets one clang off his glove or if Cabrera lets one go through his legs. But I also don't remember threads popping up when Dickerson fanned with the bases juiced or when Gomes took Motte out of the yard to win the game.

By the way, the Reds won last night.

westofyou
04-23-2010, 09:14 AM
And we can continue to drone on about the defense, but I haven't heard much about Dickerson's .257/.278/.343 line (with a .409 Babip!!!) with zero HR, zero RBI and 13/1 K/BB ratio. If his name was Taveras I am sure that his defense wouldn't matter in the slightest and we would have had 50 threads requesting his ouster.


Etch it in stone, carry it down the mountain and show it to all... for it is the absolute truth.

nate
04-23-2010, 09:21 AM
To play devils advocate while defense played a large role in the game Dickersons K with bases loaded and 1 out with the Reds down 1 could have been the deciding at bat in that game. It took an infield single by "No Defense" Cabrera to get a run across in that inning.

We can play the "but if situation X were reversed, the outcome would've been different" on every play of the game. Cabrera didn't "win" the game with his infield single any more or any less than Jay Bruce's HR, Scott Rolen's double, Dickerson's nice defensive plays, BP's nice defensive plays, Hanigan throwing out Johnson at 3rd, and so on (the game was action packed) until we've covered every play of the game.

Team effort, team win, team game.

Cabrera's defense has not been as good as advertised so far. I don't really think there can be any disagreement with that statement. Like any measurement up to this point, that's not to say it can't change, but so far, it's not been what I expected. My concern is that he's going to live up atrocious defense of last year rather than the excellent defense of the two years prior.

I do know that defense matters as much in run prevention as pitching. I do know that "defense" is not a "new" concept and even if you and certain other posters continually poo-poo it's significance as some new-fangled "SABR" machination or "Moneyball" phenomena, the Reds most certainly do not as evidenced by their words, actions and signings over the past year.

Apologies for the logical fallacy contained in this post.

HokieRed
04-23-2010, 09:22 AM
It's a bit off thread, but I'll follow up. We now have OPSes of .566 and .621 competing for the CF job. What's particularly amazing about last night's win is that we somehow won with both in the lineup at the same time.

bucksfan2
04-23-2010, 09:44 AM
We can play the "but if situation X were reversed, the outcome would've been different" on every play of the game. Cabrera didn't "win" the game with his infield single any more or any less than Jay Bruce's HR, Scott Rolen's double, Dickerson's nice defensive plays, BP's nice defensive plays, Hanigan throwing out Johnson at 3rd, and so on (the game was action packed) until we've covered every play of the game.

Team effort, team win, team game.

Cabrera's defense has not been as good as advertised so far. I don't really think there can be any disagreement with that statement. Like any measurement up to this point, that's not to say it can't change, but so far, it's not been what I expected. My concern is that he's going to live up atrocious defense of last year rather than the excellent defense of the two years prior.

I do know that defense matters as much in run prevention as pitching. I do know that "defense" is not a "new" concept and even if you and certain other posters continually poo-poo it's significance as some new-fangled "SABR" machination or "Moneyball" phenomena, the Reds most certainly do not as evidenced by their words, actions and signings over the past year.

Apologies for the logical fallacy contained in this post.

I agree with pretty much everything you have said. There were a lot of big outs, big hits, and big moments in last nights game. In the game of baseball all 9 players on the diamond have a say in the game. But when you break it down even further there are several important moments that decide a game.

Defense isn't a new issue, it has been around ever since Abner Doubleday. But the focus on defense has reached an apex this off season. Many experts extolled the Red Sox signing of a 38 year old Mike Cameron. The Mariners were the trendy team this season because they had a great defense. While defense is nice, it takes balance to win baseball games. It takes defense, pitching, and offense to win baseball games. We can harp all we want about Cabrera's defense (which I agree has been less than stellar so far) but there is a reason the Reds went out and got Cabrera. They didn't feel that Janish could hit enough to warrant playing every day. This is coming from a front office who had made a commitment to pitching and defense.

We can applaud Dickerson's defensive prowess out in LF last night. Many people wanted Dickerson to start almost every game and lead off. Well as a poster above has posted he is putting up Taveras-esque numbers with a grand total of 1 walk. For some reason he has gotten a pass from many Reds fans, especially when he has struggled mightily at the beginning of the past two seasons.

I guess the main point of all my rambling is if you want to win games in baseball, get balance. Defense and Pitching alone won't win you games. If it would then then Seattle and San Francisco would be the two dominant teams in baseball.

_Sir_Charles_
04-23-2010, 10:51 AM
I have to say, Dickerson misplayed both of those balls (especially the first one) last night. He ended up catching them but they were not as difficult as they looked.

And we can continue to drone on about the defense, but I haven't heard much about Dickerson's .257/.278/.343 line (with a .409 Babip!!!) with zero HR, zero RBI and 13/1 K/BB ratio. If his name was Taveras I am sure that his defense wouldn't matter in the slightest and we would have had 50 threads requesting his ouster. Hell, if his name were Stubbs maybe he would be getting petitioned to go down to the minors.

Let's just try and look at things in perspective. The team had a good win last night and all some people want to point out are Cabrera's defensive issues and how Dickerson made plays that Gomes never would have. Which may or may not be true. I totally get if it is a critical play and Gomes lets one clang off his glove or if Cabrera lets one go through his legs. But I also don't remember threads popping up when Dickerson fanned with the bases juiced or when Gomes took Motte out of the yard to win the game.

By the way, the Reds won last night.

Nicely put. I'm as critical of defense as anybody, but the last thing you want to hear after a nice win is fans complaining about that win. But that's just me.

For all the cynical & depressing posts made here over the past 2 weeks...this club is still only 2 games below .500, the pitching still hasn't come close to it's projected ability, and the bats are just now waking up (25 runs in that 3 game series...overlooked by many due to the pitching of the Reds). For as many things that have gone wrong...we're still right in the mix of things. Lighten up guys.

nate
04-23-2010, 10:53 AM
I agree with pretty much everything you have said. There were a lot of big outs, big hits, and big moments in last nights game. In the game of baseball all 9 players on the diamond have a say in the game. But when you break it down even further there are several important moments that decide a game.

I think there are several "exciting" moments that decide a game and a lot of little noticed "foundation" that make them possible.


Defense isn't a new issue, it has been around ever since Abner Doubleday. But the focus on defense has reached an apex this off season.

This is incorrect. I think defense had been rediscovered as a market inefficiency several years ago. That this is just dawning on the Reds isn't surprising. However, it his heartening to see signings like Aroldis Chapman; it indicates they're not entirely asleep at the wheel when it comes to finding new ways to be competitive.


Many experts extolled the Red Sox signing of a 38 year old Mike Cameron.

What point are you trying to make? Cameron had a history as a great defender and the Red Sox were looking to improve their defense. Based on historical data, it was a good signing.


The Mariners were the trendy team this season because they had a great defense.

What does "trendy" have to do with it? Was I part of the "trend?" That would be a first!


While defense is nice, it takes balance to win baseball games. It takes defense, pitching, and offense to win baseball games. We can harp all we want about Cabrera's defense (which I agree has been less than stellar so far) but there is a reason the Reds went out and got Cabrera. They didn't feel that Janish could hit enough to warrant playing every day. This is coming from a front office who had made a commitment to pitching and defense.

I don't see where the argument against me pointing out that Cabrera has looked poor on defense so far is. He has. He got an exciting hit in last night's game...great! His slash line is only below average now. I hope he hits like he has in his career and his defense gets better because so far on the season, he's a liability rather than an asset.


We can applaud Dickerson's defensive prowess out in LF last night. Many people wanted Dickerson to start almost every game and lead off. Well as a poster above has posted he is putting up Taveras-esque numbers with a grand total of 1 walk.

I didn't read that post but I disagree on several levels.

Let's analyze each!

1. Dickerson isn't making $6mm

2. Dickerson isn't the starter

3. Dickseron has 32 PAs on the year. I would wager that I could find players with hundreds, if not thousands of 32 PA stretches where only a single walk was earned. It hardly seems like a unique situation if one understands sample sizes and randomness.

4. Dickerson is fast and can actually play good defense as opposed to just being fast.

5. Dickerson over his career has a good walk rate. That it hasn't manifested in a tiny 32 PA makes me no nevermind.

Side note, if there is a desire to stop talking about Willy Taveras, it would seem reasonable to...I dunno...stop talking about Willy Taveras. I certainly didn't bring him up and had garnered nary a passing thought about him other than some odd mention on another site I frequent.


For some reason he has gotten a pass from many Reds fans, especially when he has struggled mightily at the beginning of the past two seasons.

I have no idea what point you're trying to convince me of here. "Many Reds fans" don't say anything about a non-starter having one walk in 32 PAs, who "struggled mightily" in larger but still small sample sizes even though the rest of the time, his numbers are quite good and said player has somehow gotten a "pass."

I hope I can convince a couple of those fans to complain so I can get a few of the "passes" they otherwise would've given to Dickerson/Bruce/et al.

If you're saying "Nate, I haven't heard you say anything about Dickerson's 'slow start,'" I say, see the numbered points above. I think Dickerson's more valuable to the team than Gomes. I think he's probably more valuable than Stubbs too. Finally, I think the Reds can and should do better than ANY of Gomes, Stubbs or Dickerson.


I guess the main point of all my rambling is if you want to win games in baseball, get balance.

High five!


Defense and Pitching alone won't win you games.

But no one is making that argument. A single thread on defense isn't evidence that _I_ think that and I don't really care to argue over the perception of what the nebulous "Redszone" thinks.


If it would then then Seattle and San Francisco would be the two dominant teams in baseball.

Not that I agree with the point you're trying to make in any way but it is amusing that the best team in baseball right now (Rays) leads league in defense.

Now can someone complain about Dickerson and give me a pass? I'm a little light on passes.

:cool:

flyer85
04-23-2010, 10:58 AM
It's a bit off thread, but I'll follow up. We now have OPSes of .566 and .621 competing for the CF job. What's particularly amazing about last night's win is that we somehow won with both in the lineup at the same time.OBP in the starting lineups. Last night 6 of the Dodger 8 were over 400, 7 over 350. For the Reds 0 of 8 over 400 and 2 over 350.

bucksfan2
04-23-2010, 11:00 AM
OBP in the starting lineups. Last night 6 of the Dodger 8 were over 400, 7 over 350. For the Reds 0 of 8 over 400 and 2 over 350.

Dodgers have an amazing offense. The problem is as we saw the Dodgers pitching staff is awful.

Chip R
04-23-2010, 11:49 AM
I have to say, Dickerson misplayed both of those balls (especially the first one) last night. He ended up catching them but they were not as difficult as they looked.

And we can continue to drone on about the defense, but I haven't heard much about Dickerson's .257/.278/.343 line (with a .409 Babip!!!) with zero HR, zero RBI and 13/1 K/BB ratio. If his name was Taveras I am sure that his defense wouldn't matter in the slightest and we would have had 50 threads requesting his ouster. Hell, if his name were Stubbs maybe he would be getting petitioned to go down to the minors.

Let's just try and look at things in perspective. The team had a good win last night and all some people want to point out are Cabrera's defensive issues and how Dickerson made plays that Gomes never would have. Which may or may not be true. I totally get if it is a critical play and Gomes lets one clang off his glove or if Cabrera lets one go through his legs. But I also don't remember threads popping up when Dickerson fanned with the bases juiced or when Gomes took Motte out of the yard to win the game.

By the way, the Reds won last night.

The differences between Dickerson and Willy T. are that Dickerson is being paid close to the minimum, is basically on a 1 year deal and Dusty's not running him out there every day. Also, Dickerson has a history of being able to get on base at a decent clip while Willy T never did. Dickerson isn't exactly making me giddy every time he comes up to the plate but he's not Tavaras horrible. But let's not let the facts get in the way of a good rant.

nate
04-23-2010, 11:59 AM
Dodgers have an amazing offense. The problem is as we saw the Dodgers pitching staff is awful.

And their defense, to date, has been worse than their pitching.

TheNext44
04-23-2010, 01:14 PM
I have to say, Dickerson misplayed both of those balls (especially the first one) last night. He ended up catching them but they were not as difficult as they looked.

And we can continue to drone on about the defense, but I haven't heard much about Dickerson's .257/.278/.343 line (with a .409 Babip!!!) with zero HR, zero RBI and 13/1 K/BB ratio. If his name was Taveras I am sure that his defense wouldn't matter in the slightest and we would have had 50 threads requesting his ouster. Hell, if his name were Stubbs maybe he would be getting petitioned to go down to the minors.

Let's just try and look at things in perspective. The team had a good win last night and all some people want to point out are Cabrera's defensive issues and how Dickerson made plays that Gomes never would have. Which may or may not be true. I totally get if it is a critical play and Gomes lets one clang off his glove or if Cabrera lets one go through his legs. But I also don't remember threads popping up when Dickerson fanned with the bases juiced or when Gomes took Motte out of the yard to win the game.

By the way, the Reds won last night.

All good points. But just because Dickerson may not be the answer in LF, doesn't mean that Gomes is.

Ltlabner
04-23-2010, 02:45 PM
I couldn't have said it better. Defense has become in vogue this season and it is getting a little annoying to hear all the complaints about Cabrera.


When the team is allegedly built around pitching and defense doesn't it make some sense that those topics would get a lot of airtime?

If they've pinned their hopes to those two skillsets it'd be a bit daft to not discuss them.

Ghosts of 1990
04-23-2010, 03:22 PM
I don't like Chris Dickerson as a hitter. I don't think he's ever going to amount to much. But right now I think he's definitely the better option between Drew Stubbs and himself. Unless Stubbs develops into something in this season or next week need to keep looking because right now he looks like a AAAA player and despite a nice speed tool and nice build he doesn't look like a lead off hitter. He's 25 so he's not really that young either.

KronoRed
04-23-2010, 03:56 PM
The differences between Dickerson and Willy T. are that Dickerson is being paid close to the minimum, is basically on a 1 year deal and Dusty's not running him out there every day. Also, Dickerson has a history of being able to get on base at a decent clip while Willy T never did. Dickerson isn't exactly making me giddy every time he comes up to the plate but he's not Tavaras horrible. But let's not let the facts get in the way of a good rant.

Nicely put :clap: