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Vottomatic
06-08-2010, 04:33 PM
According to mlbtraderumors.com they are: http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/06/white-sox-open-for-business.html

JJ Putz is a 33 year old righthander, former closer, who is making $3M this year. His stats: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/7205/career;_ylt=AjTQxg5RFvLpxGrLzzVodrSFCLcF

Matt Thornton is a 33 year old lefthander with pretty decent if not awesome numbers in '08, '09 and so far '10. Stats: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/7212/career;_ylt=AjTQxg5RFvLpxGrLzzVodrSFCLcF

I'd love to do some kind of reasonable blockbuster deal and get these two arms. I think I'd stop worrying about the bullpen and feel like leads are secure once again.

Vottomatic
06-08-2010, 04:37 PM
Putz is a FA after this season.
Thornton has either an option for another season at $2.25M or a $250,000 buyout. Dude's a lefty.

I think they should make this happen........before some other team does.

RedLakerFan24
06-08-2010, 04:40 PM
I Want Thornton so bad, he's really good when i seen him pitch on tv. The radar gun shows he throws in the high 90's

Vottomatic
06-08-2010, 04:53 PM
I'd love to re-sign Weathers (RH). Have Bill Bray (LH) get healthy and come up in a few weeks or so.

Then trade for Matt Thornton (LH) and JJ Putz (RH) with the willing White Sox.

Send Herrera, Ondrusek, Del Rosario, Fisher back to Louisville permanently. Release Lincoln after he comes off the DL.

Bullpen:
Cordero
Rhodes - LH
Weathers
Putz
Thornton - LH
Bray - LH
Masset
Owings?

That would make 13 pitchers, but Owings could be considered a pinch hitter....lol.

If we did all that, it would scare the crap out of St. Loser fans and their team.

Griffey012
06-08-2010, 05:33 PM
Let's trade them Gomes, Phillips, and Mesoraco for Putz,Thornton, Vizquel, Luis Rodriguez, and some A pitcher. That deal should shore up our bullpen and help out the club right. It worked for us a few years ago. :thumbup:

Griffey012
06-08-2010, 05:35 PM
But in all seriousness what about something along the lines of Dickerson, Wood/Maloney, and Ondrusek. Thornton is a proven stud, he would definitely be worth Maloney or probably Wood. Dickerson and Ondrusek, or maybe a bit more value for Putz seems fair.

brm7675
06-08-2010, 05:39 PM
Sorry I don't give up Wood. The others I am okay with, plus some others in the minors, but I think Wood has a good future


But in all seriousness what about something along the lines of Dickerson, Wood/Maloney, and Ondrusek. Thornton is a proven stud, he would definitely be worth Maloney or probably Wood. Dickerson and Ondrusek, or maybe a bit more value for Putz seems fair.

LetPeteIn
06-08-2010, 05:48 PM
.

Griffey012
06-08-2010, 05:50 PM
Sorry I don't give up Wood. The others I am okay with, plus some others in the minors, but I think Wood has a good future

I also think Wood has a chance to have a good career but doubt he is anything more than a #3 starter, and we have such pitching depth right now, Thornton would fit a big need right now, and could be a CoCo replacement. Whenever Thornton becomes a free agent, he will probably be a type A also, which is something to consider.

I would definitely prefer to do it without Wood though.

Vottomatic
06-08-2010, 06:27 PM
Sorry I don't give up Wood. The others I am okay with, plus some others in the minors, but I think Wood has a good future

Where's he gonna play and when?

Leake
Bailey
Cueto
Volquez
Chapman
Maloney
LeCure
Wood
Klinker :eek:

Vottomatic
06-09-2010, 05:28 PM
I also think Wood has a chance to have a good career but doubt he is anything more than a #3 starter, and we have such pitching depth right now, Thornton would fit a big need right now, and could be a CoCo replacement. Whenever Thornton becomes a free agent, he will probably be a type A also, which is something to consider.

I would definitely prefer to do it without Wood though.

Frankly, right now.......I'd be willing to trade Bailey or Cueto, but it would have to be a pretty good return. Because I think we have enough options to replace them. Cueto seems like a head case, with great stuff, that doesn't know how to pitch at times. Bailey seems so up and down, I'm beginning to wonder if he's ever going to consistently put it together.

I know it's a small sample size, but I watch LeCure pitch, and he actually seems to know how to pitch, like Leake, with not so overpowering stuff.

Some guys have the stuff, but poor command, and poor mental makeup. Other guys have mediocre stuff, but good command, and good mental makeup.

Griffey012
06-09-2010, 06:05 PM
Frankly, right now.......I'd be willing to trade Bailey or Cueto, but it would have to be a pretty good return. Because I think we have enough options to replace them. Cueto seems like a head case, with great stuff, that doesn't know how to pitch at times. Bailey seems so up and down, I'm beginning to wonder if he's ever going to consistently put it together.

I know it's a small sample size, but I watch LeCure pitch, and he actually seems to know how to pitch, like Leake, with not so overpowering stuff.

Some guys have the stuff, but poor command, and poor mental makeup. Other guys have mediocre stuff, but good command, and good mental makeup.

I wouldn't be opposed to it either, I would definitely trade Bailey before Cueto though, at least Cueto has shown some extended flashes of brilliance early on in season. And managed to put together a respectable showing last year. Bailey has a respectable 8 or 9 start stretch to his credit in his career, and thats about it.

vottofan4life
06-09-2010, 06:51 PM
If anything I would want Matt Thorton, AJ Pierzynski, and Mark Buehrle...
Put a package around Homer Bailey or Aaron Harang for the 3

Vottomatic
06-09-2010, 07:18 PM
If anything I would want Matt Thorton, AJ Pierzynski, and Mark Buehrle...
Put a package around Homer Bailey or Aaron Harang for the 3

Won't happen, and here's why.

Buerhle is signed through '11 with a $14M per year price tag. Reds looking to unload salary after this season. That's why they won't re-sign Harang and Arroyo. Arroyo only possibly at a discount rate if he would do it. But otherwise, they aren't looking for high priced starters unless they are a reasonably priced #1, which is doubtful they exist. With Buerhle, you're also talking about a guy who is getting hit at a clip of .305 right now, has a 5.40 ERA, and has given up 85 hits in 70 innings, and is 3-6. Not interested.

Pierzynski is a 34 year old catcher who did bat .300 last season, but is batting only .213 this year. On the decline? He is a FA at the end of the season and is making $6.5M this season. We have a cheaper and more productive catching tandem in Hernandez/Hanigan that is making about half of that. Not interested.

Thornton is making $2.25M this season and has a club option at the same amount for next season. Plus he's a LHer who has solid career numbers as a reliever. I'd do it in a heartbeat.

They are having a good discussion on the ORG about trading with the White Sox. One suggestion is Alonso for Thornton and Putz ($3M this season, FA next season). I think it takes more than Alonso. We'd have to throw in some young triple A relievers to get the deal done, IMHO. They've also cited that the White Sox aren't looking to move Thornton, so you'd have to overwhelm them. They're looking to unload their junk relievers with big contracts such as their closer Bobby Jenks ($7.5M this year, arbitration next) and his 5.14 ERA, .307 BAA, 1.81 WHIP. Or 34 year old Scott Linebrink and his 5.55 ERA and his $5M ('10) and $5.5M ('11) overpriced contract.

Again, I think you overwhelm them with Alonso and a nice package of quality triple A relievers who just need some grooming like Del Rosario, Ondrusek, etc. or even Herrera. You might have to throw in one of the triple A starters such as Maloney. Or is that too much? You're helping them unload $5.25M or the remaining part of it for this year. And we could probably re-sign Putz reasonably and look to make him or Thornton the closer after next season when Cordero's contract is up.

But if they could get those two relievers, I really think it solidifies the bullpen.

Cordero
Rhodes (LH)
Thornton (LH)
Putz
Weathers?
Masset
Owings - long relief

MrMcConnell
06-10-2010, 12:01 PM
I'd love to have some of those BP guys. But I think the Reds will wait and see how healthy we'll be around the AS break and decide how much they could/should trade for. I'd like to put Volquez in the bullpen to save his arm after coming off major surgery and then have an entire offseason to become a starter again. . .plus we need the help there. If and when Bray ever becomes healthy, he could become a surprising option, but I'm not holding my breath. Lecure may be a good BP option as well. The Reds just need to be patient. Our needs are mainly BP which is the cheapest position to trade for around the deadline.

gedred69
06-10-2010, 09:48 PM
I'd love to have some of those BP guys. But I think the Reds will wait and see how healthy we'll be around the AS break and decide how much they could/should trade for. I'd like to put Volquez in the bullpen to save his arm after coming off major surgery and then have an entire offseason to become a starter again. . .plus we need the help there. If and when Bray ever becomes healthy, he could become a surprising option, but I'm not holding my breath. Lecure may be a good BP option as well. The Reds just need to be patient. Our needs are mainly BP which is the cheapest position to trade for around the deadline.

Good points and, thought train. Patience is the key. Let's see if Reds hang in there, until we know whether Burton or Bray show to be go or no go. But can't afford to wait too long. There are always decent relievers available as a season progresses, and teams start to visualize they aren't going anywhere and start thinking about building their future. Then BP guys the Reds could use will become easier to extract.