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View Full Version : Better Prospects: Devin Mesoraco or Yasmani Grandal?



dougdirt
06-30-2010, 11:40 PM
Grandal clearly hasn't signed yet, but from a pure prospect point of view, who is the better prospect between the two guys? Why?

aubashbrother
06-30-2010, 11:47 PM
Went with Meso. I like Grandal as a switch hitter but after dealing with some injuries Mez seems like hes taken the next step. He's producing now with the wood bat which I think Grandal can also but I guess what really put Mez on top for me is his D

bubbachunk
06-30-2010, 11:51 PM
Mez because the reports of his defense and the numbers he is putting up this year. Also he is doing this at a higher level of baseball but I can see how people would be Grandal.

fearofpopvol1
06-30-2010, 11:58 PM
I voted "not sure." We haven't see Grandal against similar competition yet.

Superdude
07-01-2010, 12:01 AM
I've said this before, but I'll take Mes over Grandal without thinking twice. Between injuries and adjusting to catching professionally, I don't see any reason to get hung up on Mesoraco's performance the past few years. Everything seems to be coming together for the guy, and he's starting to look like a potential masher with plus defense behind the plate...pretty rare stuff.

There seems to be differing opinions as far as Grandal goes, but slow bat and weak arm seem to come up a bit too much for my liking. Wait and see approach with him.

fearofpopvol1
07-01-2010, 12:12 AM
There seems to be differing opinions as far as Grandal goes, but slow bat and weak arm seem to come up a bit too much for my liking. Wait and see approach with him.

If this is the case, how can you say Mesoraco is better? You're simply going off of scouting reports and nothing else.

OesterPoster
07-01-2010, 12:18 AM
Mez is killing with a wooden bat, and we don't have a grasp on Grandal's wooden bat capabilities. Couple that with his improvements behind the plate...and I'd have a tough time believing Grandal is a better prospect.

Superdude
07-01-2010, 12:51 AM
If this is the case, how can you say Mesoraco is better? You're simply going off of scouting reports and nothing else.

What else do we have on Grandal besides scouting reports? Between aluminum bats and erratic competition, I'm skeptical to read too much into college stats. I guess you never know who's going to be better if you want to get technical, but as far as ranking them, I like Mesoraco's ceiling better than Grandal, and I feel much safer saying that he'll reach that ceiling based on what he's done this year.

mace
07-01-2010, 01:20 AM
Mesoraco. Because there's nothing more he could do. He's hitting for power, he's getting on base, he's throwing out runners, he's got great makeup, and he's young. If Grandal progresses well, we'll be able to say that about him in a year or two. But that sentence starts with "if".

RedsManRick
07-01-2010, 01:23 AM
Mez. A bird in the hand...

redsfandan
07-01-2010, 05:41 AM
Mes has a track record in the minors. Grandal doesn't.

Mes has started to show that he could be a good all around catcher. Grandal still has to show that the negative reports about his game are overblown.

scott91575
07-01-2010, 07:18 AM
Well, I am the dissenter. I think too many people look at Mesaraco and see him finally reaching a respectable number in the minors after some horrible years. Even then he is only above average in AA. I think Grandal has the ability to do more than that. I personally think Mesaraco is a future regular catcher in MLB, but Grandal has the ability to be a borderline all star.

GIDP
07-01-2010, 10:10 AM
I look at them and honestly see the same type of kid. Both have good swings, both have good bodies, and both seem to have the ability to D up.

As it stands right now though i think Mes has the better set of tools. I think hes a better hitter, I think hes a quicker player, and I think he has the better arm and better D.

I think Yas has all those abilities also but I really dont think hes better at any of them than Mes. Close, but I think Mes grades out better everywhere in my grading system.

medford
07-01-2010, 10:30 AM
This seems almost unfair for Grandal in that he has no chance of winning this poll. Few here have seen him as much as they may have seen Des in Dayton or spring training, plus as others have said, he's got legit minor league numbers, with a wooden bat and vs legit pitching and basestealing prospects in the minors, while Grandal's numbers come against inconsistant college pitching and inconsistant college base stealers, some legit prospects, some that will never sniff pro ball.

So a couple of questions. Is there a rough estimate on how Des' numbers this season would have transferred back to a high level college program like Miami? Or conversly, how Grandal's numbers would tranfer to High A/AA ball? My gut says their numbers would be pretty similar, if not favoring Des though I don't believe its an exact science comparing a college metal bat to a pro ball wood bat. Wouldn't Des be a college junior this season had he gone the college route? Seems like they would have been picked around the same point had Des gone to college and put his translated numbers from this season in his junior year of college.

2) More importantly in my mind, if Des continues on the path he's set forth this season, what are the odds he breaks camp w/ the Reds next season? The safe path would seem to indicate that they pick up Ramon's option and go w/ the catching tandem they've used this year, w/ Des getting a full season in AAA. However, if Des can prove he belongs in the show, at least as a back up to Hannigan, perhaps in a similar role as hannigan and Ramon share this year, it could save the Reds a decent chunk of change, at least enough to help pick up some middle relief or pay Rhodes for 1 more season.

medford
07-01-2010, 10:34 AM
one more thing, I'm reminded of the considerable conversation redszone had on Texas' catching situation a couple of years ago. Seems like Texas had more catching prospects than they needed and seemed like a solid trading partner for the Reds to find their catcher of the future. Flash forward 1.5 seasons later and the Rangers are picking up Molina. Seems the moral would be to keep both in the fold and let time sort things out as to which one is the better long term option along w/ Hannigan. I think they'll find it easier to get better value out of a legit catching prospect the next several seasons than it will to get legit value out of a 1b prospect in a trade.

TRF
07-01-2010, 11:01 AM
IMO Grandal isn't a prospect until he signs.

camisadelgolf
07-01-2010, 12:34 PM
Grandal's biggest comp is Yadier Molina. Well, Molina was never much of a hitter in the minors (nor majors), and Mesoraco has destroyed minor league pitching so far this year. Mesoraco also seems to be doing quite well behind the plate in regards to handling pitchers, throwing out base runners, etc. (aside from possibly passed balls). I think it's a pretty easy decision, but a cold streak for Mez and a big debut for Grandal could swing me the other way.

dougdirt
07-01-2010, 02:32 PM
IMO Grandal isn't a prospect until he signs.

Well the term prospect in baseball applies to their prospects as a major leaguer, so the guy is a prospect.... just not for our team until he signs.

nemesis
07-01-2010, 03:00 PM
Mez. He has finally lived up to the draft postion and all of the perrophrials that Doug has pointed out time and time again. He got comfortible real quick in AA after having some issues at the plate early on. His walk rate dropped going up a level but his K rate has stayed the same. He might start the year out in AAA next year and that would be an excellent development. Grandel to me comps upside wise offensively to G. Soto. Mesorsco if he continues his development, McCann.

REDblooded
07-01-2010, 03:27 PM
I expect Grandal to be pretty solid... But have to go with Mes... I like the intangibles and the experience...

medford
07-01-2010, 04:33 PM
on a similar plane, how is Soto doing w/ his work converting to catcher? I haven't heard as much about him. It would be nice to have Des in AAA, Soto in AA and Grandal in High A to begin next year. I wonder if they'll target Soto for the Arizona Fall League to have him play a bunch of catcher this offseason?

dougdirt
07-01-2010, 05:05 PM
on a similar plane, how is Soto doing w/ his work converting to catcher? I haven't heard as much about him. It would be nice to have Des in AAA, Soto in AA and Grandal in High A to begin next year. I wonder if they'll target Soto for the Arizona Fall League to have him play a bunch of catcher this offseason?

Tools wise, Soto is still getting reports that he can stick there. Skill wise, he isn't close yet. From a pure defensive perspective, he should be in the AZL/Billings. But his bat is way too advanced for that of course. I expect Soto, if healthy, will be in instructs getting plenty of reps at catcher again.

muddie
07-01-2010, 09:39 PM
This thread would serve a better purpose about a year from now.

Hoosier Red
07-02-2010, 11:15 AM
Just curious, what are Mesoraco's stats since Grandal was drafted. I know he had a bit of a rough transition to Double A for a few weeks but it seems as though he's been tearing things up since the draft.

GIDP
07-02-2010, 02:30 PM
Am I wrong in saying that Mesoraco from the start was a better prospect? From a scouting POV Mes just seems like the better talent.

camisadelgolf
07-02-2010, 02:33 PM
Am I wrong in saying that Mesoraco from the start was a better prospect? From a scouting POV Mes just seems like the better talent.
Mesoraco has always had the higher ceiling, but he's also always had the longer odds. The big knock against Mesoraco is that history shows high school catchers from small towns don't have good baseball careers. Mesoraco was drafted for his tools, but Grandal was drafted for his polish.

Mario-Rijo
07-02-2010, 05:11 PM
Am I wrong in saying that Mesoraco from the start was a better prospect? From a scouting POV Mes just seems like the better talent.

Not at all, right on point IMO. He simply has better pure talent according to the scouting reports which I have no idea why we'd start questioning scouting reports at this juncture on Mes...or for that matter on anyone. I think Grandal has a shot to be the better bat if he eventually improves or cans hitting from the right side but to me that is secondary to his game behind the plate and that is where Mes should gain his worth.

Give me a good defender with an average offensive game all day everyday over the opposite. To me Hanigan is exactly what you want in a catcher if you can't have a Johnny Bench and I think Mes has a much fairer shot at being that guy assuming he keeps on improving his skills.

Kingspoint
07-02-2010, 08:52 PM
Would like to see Grandel first.

gedred69
07-03-2010, 02:54 AM
This seems almost unfair for Grandal in that he has no chance of winning this poll. Few here have seen him as much as they may have seen Des in Dayton or spring training, plus as others have said, he's got legit minor league numbers, with a wooden bat and vs legit pitching and basestealing prospects in the minors, while Grandal's numbers come against inconsistant college pitching and inconsistant college base stealers, some legit prospects, some that will never sniff pro ball.

So a couple of questions. Is there a rough estimate on how Des' numbers this season would have transferred back to a high level college program like Miami? Or conversly, how Grandal's numbers would tranfer to High A/AA ball? My gut says their numbers would be pretty similar, if not favoring Des though I don't believe its an exact science comparing a college metal bat to a pro ball wood bat. Wouldn't Des be a college junior this season had he gone the college route? Seems like they would have been picked around the same point had Des gone to college and put his translated numbers from this season in his junior year of college.

2) More importantly in my mind, if Des continues on the path he's set forth this season, what are the odds he breaks camp w/ the Reds next season? The safe path would seem to indicate that they pick up Ramon's option and go w/ the catching tandem they've used this year, w/ Des getting a full season in AAA. However, if Des can prove he belongs in the show, at least as a back up to Hannigan, perhaps in a similar role as hannigan and Ramon share this year, it could save the Reds a decent chunk of change, at least enough to help pick up some middle relief or pay Rhodes for 1 more season.

Mesoraco was barely mediocre at Dayton. (Saw him several times).And, he was marginal for a good portion of last season. Slowly to some, he started showing promise. One thing obvious, he wanted to be good and worked very hard on that. This year he went monster at High A, started slow after promo to AA, and like any hard determined athlete has turned very positive of late. I'm on his bandwagon. I have no idea what to expect from Grandal, sounds like he wasn't much early on but kinda' figured it out lately as well. Look up and down the Reds system, and it may very well be Catcher-rich. That could be some powerful trade bait down the road. (just keep the right guy)!

membengal
07-03-2010, 06:32 AM
Grandal will have to be a catcher prospect of some note to rank higher than a 22-year-old OPSing .975 between A and AA...

Degenerate39
07-03-2010, 06:52 PM
I think Devin will be the better of the two but I'd love to see Yas signed. Mes and Yas would be a pretty good duo behind the plate IMO

corkedbat
07-03-2010, 08:51 PM
This seems almost unfair for Grandal in that he has no chance of winning this poll. Few here have seen him as much as they may have seen Des in Dayton or spring training, plus as others have said, he's got legit minor league numbers, with a wooden bat and vs legit pitching and basestealing prospects in the minors, while Grandal's numbers come against inconsistant college pitching and inconsistant college base stealers, some legit prospects, some that will never sniff pro ball.

So a couple of questions. Is there a rough estimate on how Des' numbers this season would have transferred back to a high level college program like Miami? Or conversly, how Grandal's numbers would transfer to High A/AA ball? My gut says their numbers would be pretty similar, if not favoring Des though I don't believe its an exact science comparing a college metal bat to a pro ball wood bat. Wouldn't Des be a college junior this season had he gone the college route? Seems like they would have been picked around the same point had Des gone to college and put his translated numbers from this season in his junior year of college.

2) More importantly in my mind, if Des continues on the path he's set forth this season, what are the odds he breaks camp w/ the Reds next season? The safe path would seem to indicate that they pick up Ramon's option and go w/ the catching tandem they've used this year, w/ Des getting a full season in AAA. However, if Des can prove he belongs in the show, at least as a back up to Hannigan, perhaps in a similar role as hannigan and Ramon share this year, it could save the Reds a decent chunk of change, at least enough to help pick up some middle relief or pay Rhodes for 1 more season.

I'd pretty much agree. I have no problem with the Reds current tandem for one more season with Mes getting a full year in AAA, although if Mes is adjusting nicely, I might consider him for Miller's role as injury replacement by the second half.

If they can come to terms with Grandal in time to get his feet wet at high A and holds his own., I might have him in AA by Mid-May/Early-June next year.

Mes' offense improvement is evident and I know he has done a better job of throwing out runners, but how are his receving and game-calling skills and how do Grandal's tools compare to his?

Vottomatic
07-04-2010, 06:21 PM
Grandal hasn't played a lick in professional baseball yet, so how can anyone know who will be better?

:thumbdown

camisadelgolf
07-04-2010, 06:43 PM
Grandal hasn't played a lick in professional baseball yet, so how can anyone know who will be better?

:thumbdown
Even if Grandal has an OPS of 1.100 in AAA, it's still impossible to know that he'll be a better major leaguer.

dougdirt
07-05-2010, 02:30 PM
Grandal hasn't played a lick in professional baseball yet, so how can anyone know who will be better?

:thumbdown

The same reason we think a player drafted 4th is going to be better than the guy drafted 44th. Educated guess based on performance and tools.