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scott91575
07-10-2010, 09:30 AM
The Reds are the first team in major-league history to lose two games in one season in which they led by six or more runs entering the bottom of the ninth inning. Rookie Mike Leake, who started both of those games, is the first pitcher in major-league history to start more than one game in his entire career in which his team lost after leading by at least six runs heading into the bottom of the ninth inning.

http://espn.go.com/espn/elias

Girevik
07-10-2010, 09:37 AM
Yay, way to go team!

texasdave
07-10-2010, 11:10 AM
And neither one of these historic meltdowns were the fault of our manager. Just ask around. There are plenty of people that will tell you exactly that.

scott91575
07-10-2010, 11:16 AM
And neither one of these historic meltdowns were the fault of our manager. Just ask around. There are plenty of people that will tell you exactly that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Of course I am not even sure that is straw man since that normally indicates thre is some original argument. What is it called when you refute a position that is not even made?

texasdave
07-10-2010, 11:20 AM
It is not a strawman. You stated a fact. I stated an opinion. If you disagree with my opinion fine. I wasn't trying to refute anything you said. End of story.

scott91575
07-10-2010, 11:21 AM
It is not a strawman. You stated a fact. I stated an opinion. If you disagree with my opinion fine. I wasn't trying to refute anything you said. End of story.

No, you created an opinion out of thin air and tried to refute it.

scott91575
07-10-2010, 11:24 AM
Alright, I will go with the Dustydave discussion...

Those losses were not Barack Obama's fault. Just ask around. There are plenty of people that will tell you exactly that.

In other words....what is the point when no one is blaming him or Dusty in this thread? I simply pointed out it's the first time in the history of baseball it has happened.

sivman17
07-10-2010, 11:26 AM
I blame it on our 46 milion dollar closer who can't complete a two-out, two-run save. That should be a piece of cake, unless you're a no-talent ass clown.

arkimadee
07-10-2010, 11:35 AM
woke up and am still fuming. i just wanna play another game to get this taste out of my mouth. that's what i get for talking trash about the cards this week..

texasdave
07-10-2010, 11:36 AM
No, you created an opinion out of thin air and tried to refute it.

Wrong.

texasdave
07-10-2010, 11:36 AM
Alright, I will go with the Dustydave discussion...

Those losses were not Barack Obama's fault. Just ask around. There are plenty of people that will tell you exactly that.

In other words....what is the point when no one is blaming him or Dusty in this thread? I simply pointed out it's the first time in the history of baseball it has happened.

And for the third time - wrong.

FlightRick
07-10-2010, 05:55 PM
On May 20, Dusty sent Lincoln out for a 3rd inning of work (something Lincoln had only done once before in his entire career), all in the name of letting his guy pick up the rare three-inning save. Implosion occurs.

On July 9, Dusty sent Leake out there for a 9th inning of work (something Leake had never done before in his career), all in the name of letting his guy pick up the rare Complete Game. Implosion occurs.

I'm glad Dusty is such a fan of managing the game so that his players can accrue personal stats. Who needs to win the game when you can notch another stat in the ol' record books? I mean, I'm sure Mike Leake is grateful as hell to Dusty for giving him the chance to set an all-time baseball record as the only pitcher ever to start two games in which his team ended up losing after leading by 6 or more runs in the bottom of the 9th. What an honor to have that personal stat forever etched on the back of his baseball card!

He's only half-way through his rookie season and he's already done something that no pitcher in the history of the multiverse has accomplished. I hope Leake does the right thing and buys Dusty a nice steak dinner for giving him such a wonderful opportunity.


Rick


PS: more seriously, I have no problem with Dusty sending Leake out to start the 9th. I do, however, have a problem with him sticking with Leake past the first two baserunners allowed just so the guy can feel good about finishing what he started. If this were a one-time aberration, I wouldn't mind. But it's not. May 20 is right there as an obvious example, and there are a handful of other games where I think Dusty's desire to let his guys accrue certain stats or save face or whatever have cost us at least 2 or 3 other games this year, too. And that doesn't even count when Dusty does something like this and we still win in spite of him. Like this past week when he left Wood in well past the point of him being obviously gassed (and this was the day Wood was on short rest, so they should have been even MORE sensitive to him tiring early, but nope: not Dusty), just so he could complete the 5th inning and be eligible for the win. Instead, Wood implodes, and leaves the game after 4.2 innings, and with his team no longer in the lead. Luckily, we rallied to win, and forgot about the managerial brainfart....

Kingspoint
07-10-2010, 05:57 PM
Dusty Baker is the only Manager to lose two 6-run 9th-inning leads, not only in the same season, but in his entire career.

Kingspoint
07-10-2010, 05:58 PM
Managers don't win games.

They do their best to not lose games.

Some are better at it than others.

bleedsred
07-10-2010, 07:09 PM
If the Reds do implode...who will be the manager next season? Or, will Dusty be sent on his way if the Reds fall out of contention? I know the reds are still in 1st, but the guy does make poor in-game decisions that do seem based on "hunches" or getting a guy his stats. I'm not going to bash him for "the Closer" yet, many managers stick with guys until they choke the life out of a team.

One last point, with Cincy up 6-1 why push Leake more innings when they are worried about end of year numbers? It is not like Owings doesn't need any work or Bray has been overused.

bleedsred
07-10-2010, 07:10 PM
And if Bray was unavailable because he pitched the day before than he should still be in L'ville.

Vottomatic
07-10-2010, 07:15 PM
On May 20, Dusty sent Lincoln out for a 3rd inning of work (something Lincoln had only done once before in his entire career), all in the name of letting his guy pick up the rare three-inning save. Implosion occurs.

On July 9, Dusty sent Leake out there for a 9th inning of work (something Leake had never done before in his career), all in the name of letting his guy pick up the rare Complete Game. Implosion occurs.

There's a first time for everything. :D


I'm glad Dusty is such a fan of managing the game so that his players can accrue personal stats. Who needs to win the game when you can notch another stat in the ol' record books? I mean, I'm sure Mike Leake is grateful as hell to Dusty for giving him the chance to set an all-time baseball record as the only pitcher ever to start two games in which his team ended up losing after leading by 6 or more runs in the bottom of the 9th. What an honor to have that personal stat forever etched on the back of his baseball card!

He's only half-way through his rookie season and he's already done something that no pitcher in the history of the multiverse has accomplished. I hope Leake does the right thing and buys Dusty a nice steak dinner for giving him such a wonderful opportunity.


I read somewhere that Mike Leake will be announced from here on out as "The record setting Mike Leake".





PS: more seriously, I have no problem with Dusty sending Leake out to start the 9th. I do, however, have a problem with him sticking with Leake past the first two baserunners allowed just so the guy can feel good about finishing what he started. If this were a one-time aberration, I wouldn't mind. But it's not. May 20 is right there as an obvious example, and there are a handful of other games where I think Dusty's desire to let his guys accrue certain stats or save face or whatever have cost us at least 2 or 3 other games this year, too. And that doesn't even count when Dusty does something like this and we still win in spite of him. Like this past week when he left Wood in well past the point of him being obviously gassed (and this was the day Wood was on short rest, so they should have been even MORE sensitive to him tiring early, but nope: not Dusty), just so he could complete the 5th inning and be eligible for the win. Instead, Wood implodes, and leaves the game after 4.2 innings, and with his team no longer in the lead. Luckily, we rallied to win, and forgot about the managerial brainfart....

Dusty is a players manager. Definitely not a fans manager. He makes decisions in the interest of his players and not in the best interest of winning games.