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View Full Version : Offer Stubbs and say Yonder?



brm7675
07-19-2010, 10:48 AM
Would Walt be willing to part with Drew Stubbs and Yonder in exchange for Dejesus? I would pull that deal today, then Dusty could go with:

DeJesus
Phillips
Hanigan
Votto
Rolen
Gomes
Bruce
Orlando
Pitcher

The Royals' steep asking price for David DeJesus: "a major league-ready prospect, along with at least one midlevel prospect or a pair of lower-level players."

KOBasinger
07-19-2010, 10:57 AM
Can I ask why you have Hanigan batting 3rd?

DocRed
07-19-2010, 11:01 AM
I would do Heisey and Yonder maybe...

Hillsdale87
07-19-2010, 11:11 AM
That seems like more than their asking price... Stubbs is already a major leaguer and Yonder is much more than a mid-level prospect. Maybe if we tossed in another guy and could get Soria, but there's no way I would trade DeJesus for those two

redlegs7089
07-19-2010, 11:12 AM
stubbs is starting to turn the corner id prefer having him over dejesus as it is right now

Pony Boy
07-19-2010, 11:13 AM
What does DeJesus' contract look like?

brm7675
07-19-2010, 11:52 AM
I bat hanigan 3rd because he is a good contact hitter and I think would get even better with Votto hitting behind him.

berryluther
07-19-2010, 11:55 AM
I bat hanigan 3rd because he is a good contact hitter and I think would get even better with Votto hitting behind him.

I think a lot of Zoners are fooled by the small sample size of Hannigan. IMO we don't have a catcher that would start on at least 20 teams in baseball.

brm7675
07-19-2010, 12:01 PM
I think a lot of Zoners are fooled by the small sample size of Hannigan. IMO we don't have a catcher that would start on at least 20 teams in baseball.

I would disagree, while not a All star, Hanigan is a very good serviceable catcher who makes contact and if had someone very good hitting behind (instead of the pitcher) he would produce even more. Add that it would get Orlando out of the top of the order would improve this offense incredibly.

Hey Meat
07-19-2010, 01:10 PM
I wouldn't let Stubbs go right now. He is turning it around and gives and occasional homer. Keep him.

brm7675
07-19-2010, 01:18 PM
I wouldn't let Stubbs go right now. He is turning it around and gives and occasional homer. Keep him.

True but the kid from KC would give us a better obp guy and a possible leadoff hitter. I like Stubbs, but would do it to get this kid from KC

Hey Meat
07-19-2010, 01:25 PM
True but the kid from KC would give us a better obp guy and a possible leadoff hitter. I like Stubbs, but would do it to get this kid from KC
Not trying to be rude, but I wouldn't call DeJesus a kid. He is already 30, will be 31 in December. Great Player, but I wouldn't give Stubbs for him-I would give Dickerson and Yonder and possibly Bailey, but not Stubbs.

Texas Pete
07-19-2010, 02:03 PM
I'd rather keep Stubbs myself.

brm7675
07-19-2010, 02:08 PM
Not trying to be rude, but I wouldn't call DeJesus a kid. He is already 30, will be 31 in December. Great Player, but I wouldn't give Stubbs for him-I would give Dickerson and Yonder and possibly Bailey, but not Stubbs.

Why would they take Dickerson? He is a 4th OF at best and has a history of injuries. I like Stubbs but like Heisey a little bit more, so IF I have to part with a major league talent I see more upside with Heisey thus i offer Stubbs.

GIDP
07-19-2010, 02:19 PM
I'd rather keep Stubbs myself.

Agreed, cheaper, better defender, and honestly Heisey and Dejesus seem like really similar players and we already have Heisey.

brm7675
07-19-2010, 04:06 PM
Agreed, cheaper, better defender, and honestly Heisey and Dejesus seem like really similar players and we already have Heisey.


Dejesus = experienced player
Heisey = rookie player

which type of player does Dusty prefer?

Griffey012
07-19-2010, 04:34 PM
Would Walt be willing to part with Drew Stubbs and Yonder in exchange for Dejesus? I would pull that deal today, then Dusty could go with:

DeJesus
Phillips
Hanigan
Votto
Rolen
Gomes
Bruce
Orlando
Pitcher

The Royals' steep asking price for David DeJesus: "a major league-ready prospect, along with at least one midlevel prospect or a pair of lower-level players."

Thankfully Jocketty and not you are the GM of the Reds. Alonso and Stubbs is a package you use to target guys like Cliff Lee or a big bat available like Holiday was last season. Not for guys like DeJesus. And Hanigan 3rd? Please pass whatever is it you are smoking.

Griffey012
07-19-2010, 04:37 PM
Agreed, cheaper, better defender, and honestly Heisey and Dejesus seem like really similar players and we already have Heisey.

Heisey's ceiling is probably very similar to a current DeJesus with a little more pop. However, I wouldn't yet call DeJesus and Heisey similar as DeJesus has amassed a .360 OBP across parts of 8 seasons.

I would love to have DeJesus for a reasonable price, but don't see for sure where he fits in right now. It would become a 3 man rotation between LF and CF I guess.

brm7675
07-19-2010, 04:38 PM
Thankfully Jocketty and not you are the GM of the Reds. Alonso and Stubbs is a package you use to target guys like Cliff Lee or a big bat available like Holiday was last season. Not for guys like DeJesus. And Hanigan 3rd? Please pass whatever is it you are smoking.

Why are you so high on Yonder? I mean he will never be on the Reds major league roster unless Votto dies, and other teams know this. As for Stubbs, he is still a work in progress and could be good or could be average. As for Hanigan, why wouldn't you bat him 3rd?

GIDP
07-19-2010, 04:56 PM
Heisey's ceiling is probably very similar to a current DeJesus with a little more pop. However, I wouldn't yet call DeJesus and Heisey similar as DeJesus has amassed a .360 OBP across parts of 8 seasons.

I would love to have DeJesus for a reasonable price, but don't see for sure where he fits in right now. It would become a 3 man rotation between LF and CF I guess.
Let me put it this way, if I was going after DeJesus I would make sure Heisey wasnt as good as him before I made a deal for him.

I think they would be similar players production wise, Heisey maybe having more power and a little less BA.

Griffey012
07-19-2010, 05:00 PM
Why are you so high on Yonder? I mean he will never be on the Reds major league roster unless Votto dies, and other teams know this. As for Stubbs, he is still a work in progress and could be good or could be average. As for Hanigan, why wouldn't you bat him 3rd?

I am actually not high at all on Yonder, but he carries a lot of value as being labeled a top prospect. Just because we don't and won't have room for him doesn't mean we sell him for less than he is worth.

Why wouldn't I bat Hanigan 3rd? Because we have a guy named Joey Votto and a guy named Scott Rolen. Hanigan hits for a solid average, gets on base at a good clip, but has 0 power. 0 power guys do not bat 3rd. He has 18 hr's in 1800 minor league AB's. And 7 hr's and 15 2b's in 430 major league AB's. He is just fine hitting 2nd, 7th, or 8th, but should be nowhere in between with the other guys we have.

TheBigLebowski
07-19-2010, 05:04 PM
I'd throw up all over my keyboard if Walt did that. WAAAY too much to give up for a league-avg CF.

JacobBrumfield
07-19-2010, 05:08 PM
I'd throw up all over my keyboard if Walt did that. WAAAY too much to give up for a league-avg CF.

Was kind of thinking the same thing, as I was assuming this was a projected offer for Haren when I clicked on it

brm7675
07-19-2010, 05:19 PM
I am actually not high at all on Yonder, but he carries a lot of value as being labeled a top prospect. Just because we don't and won't have room for him doesn't mean we sell him for less than he is worth.

Why wouldn't I bat Hanigan 3rd? Because we have a guy named Joey Votto and a guy named Scott Rolen. Hanigan hits for a solid average, gets on base at a good clip, but has 0 power. 0 power guys do not bat 3rd. He has 18 hr's in 1800 minor league AB's. And 7 hr's and 15 2b's in 430 major league AB's. He is just fine hitting 2nd, 7th, or 8th, but should be nowhere in between with the other guys we have.

A) If batter 1 and 2 get on base and Hanigan is a good contact hitter and can get them in, who cares how many homeruns he hits?

B) Why can't Votto bat 4th?

C) As we are seeing, the old guy Rolen is not a guarentee that he is going to be available that much in the second half.

Lockdwn11
07-19-2010, 06:06 PM
A) If batter 1 and 2 get on base and Hanigan is a good contact hitter and can get them in, who cares how many homeruns he hits?

B) Why can't Votto bat 4th?

C) As we are seeing, the old guy Rolen is not a guarentee that he is going to be available that much in the second half.

There is a reason you bat Votto 3rd it is because he is the best hitter on your team. You want the best hitter on your team batting 3rd because that is where he gets the most at bats with runners on. Votto could bat 4th but why take away at bats from your best hitter?

Gunner44
07-19-2010, 06:20 PM
Batting hanigan third is just plain stupid. Id bat votto, rolen, phillips, gomes, and bruce all before id ever bat hanigan third.

brm7675
07-19-2010, 06:36 PM
Batting hanigan third is just plain stupid. Id bat votto, rolen, phillips, gomes, and bruce all before id ever bat hanigan third.

So you bat a guy who is a good contact hitter 8th? Yep that is Dusty thinkin If I ever saw and reason why this team won't be there at the end. The idea is to score runs...

BLEEDS
07-19-2010, 06:49 PM
Would Walt be willing to part with Drew Stubbs and Yonder in exchange for Dejesus?
The Royals' steep asking price for David DeJesus: "a major league-ready prospect, along with at least one midlevel prospect or a pair of lower-level players."

NO!

That's highway robbery. AT MOST I'd part with Francisco, MAYBE Yonder if they threw in Gordon.

Stubbs' upside is too great, and his D is enough to make up for "only" a .750 OPS, for now. I think his bat comes around. No need to overpay for a minor upgrade.

PEACE

-BLEEDS

Vottomatic
07-19-2010, 09:02 PM
If Rolen IS out for the 2nd half, might as well trade for Hanley Ramirez. Move OCab to third and bat him 7th. Put Ramirez either in the 3 or 4 hole.

It will never happen.

markymark69
07-19-2010, 09:42 PM
Alonso I don't have a problem with moving, but why in the world would you trade a guy who is on pace to hit 20-23 home runs and drive in 78-82 runs this season? Two things that DeJesus has never done in his career.

Kiss the Baby00
07-19-2010, 10:43 PM
just to refute your point about hannigan being a good contact hitter. remember when he came up TWICE with runner on 3rd and less than 2 outs in Woods failed perfecto? and he struck out both times.

Lockdwn11
07-19-2010, 11:01 PM
Would Walt be willing to part with Drew Stubbs and Yonder in exchange for Dejesus? I would pull that deal today, then Dusty could go with:

DeJesus
Phillips
Hanigan
Votto
Rolen
Gomes
Bruce
Orlando
Pitcher

The Royals' steep asking price for David DeJesus: "a major league-ready prospect, along with at least one midlevel prospect or a pair of lower-level players."

What is funny about this is you would be the first one to dog Dusty for his lineup. Then you say Hanigan should bat third. WOW

bleedsred
07-20-2010, 12:34 AM
Sub Bruce for Stubbs.....OF of Dejesus, Bruce, and Heisey next season....a ball would not hit the grass! LOL

sabometrics
07-20-2010, 12:42 AM
just to refute your point about hannigan being a good contact hitter. remember when he came up TWICE with runner on 3rd and less than 2 outs in Woods failed perfecto? and he struck out both times.

Yeah ... sample size ... he has shown throughout his extended MiLB and MLB experience that he is a great contact hitter.

GIDP
07-20-2010, 12:45 AM
Hanny looks just out of sync. He was probably rushed back a little earlier than they would have liked.

gilpdawg
07-20-2010, 01:17 AM
If Rolen IS out for the 2nd half, might as well trade for Hanley Ramirez. Move OCab to third and bat him 7th. Put Ramirez either in the 3 or 4 hole.

It will never happen.
Who said he'd be out for the whole second half? It's a 2 week injury at most, if it's even that.

Rijo's Ghost
07-20-2010, 03:50 AM
Hannigan batting 3rd is the funniest thing I've seen in awhile.

Krawhitham
07-20-2010, 04:06 AM
why does everyone have a hard on for Dejesus?

he has not been an everyday CF since 2007
he has no power.
he has no speed.
He hits for average (around .300) but does not walk plus he is batting .245 in July

webbbj
07-20-2010, 05:36 AM
gonna throw some OF names and chances any could be traded for and what you think the reds interest level is in them:

Chris young
Josh Willingham
Nick Markakis
Vernon Wells
David Dejesus

DocRed
07-20-2010, 09:12 AM
why does everyone have a hard on for Dejesus?

he has not been an everyday CF since 2007
he has no power.
he has no speed.
He hits for average (around .300) but does not walk plus he is batting .245 in July

He gets his share of walks and gets on base...not a ton but more than some on this team. Career 58 a year and a career .360 OBP

DocRed
07-20-2010, 09:17 AM
gonna throw some OF names and chances any could be traded for and what you think the reds interest level is in them:

Chris young
Josh Willingham
Nick Markakis
Vernon Wells
David Dejesus

Josh Willingham is better than almost any OF on the block right now, would take him for say Bruce and a mid level in a heartbeat. He makes $4.6 million tho and I believe is a free agent after the year, which are his negatives.

double21d
07-20-2010, 10:00 AM
Hanigan=Overrated.
One of the best things that ever happened to this team was bringing back Ramon Hernandez.
Hanigan is good defensively and does have a fine looking average but the fact that in 2 years he has 29 RBI makes me think he isn't an every day starter.
Good backup in my opinion...but not the Reds answer behind the plate going forward.

brm7675
07-20-2010, 10:36 AM
Who said he'd be out for the whole second half? It's a 2 week injury at most, if it's even that.


A) Rolen is no spring chicken and the body takes longer to heal when you are older

B) Remember how a 'hamstring" issue kept bugging Jr. when he was a red, this is a major conern injury.

brm7675
07-20-2010, 10:37 AM
Hanigan=Overrated.
One of the best things that ever happened to this team was bringing back Ramon Hernandez.
Hanigan is good defensively and does have a fine looking average but the fact that in 2 years he has 29 RBI makes me think he isn't an every day starter.
Good backup in my opinion...but not the Reds answer behind the plate going forward.


You do fully grasp that to have RBI's people have to be on base and given where Hanigan has hit (8th) I am willing to bet he would have more had the opportunities been there. Hanigan is a good choice behind the plate.:thumbup:

GIDP
07-20-2010, 10:56 AM
Josh Willingham is better than almost any OF on the block right now, would take him for say Bruce and a mid level in a heartbeat. He makes $4.6 million tho and I believe is a free agent after the year, which are his negatives.

Josh Willingham is a good player but hes not THAT good. Id go after him to replace Gomes but no way on earth you trade Bruce for Josh Willingham.

bgwilly31
07-20-2010, 11:17 AM
I think a lot of Zoners are fooled by the small sample size of Hannigan. IMO we don't have a catcher that would start on at least 20 teams in baseball.

i think your wrong.

The stats would say you are sooo.

Take last year into consideration as well.

GIDP
07-20-2010, 11:26 AM
Both Ramon and Ryan have a higher OPS than all but Mauer, Napoli, Doumit, and Mccann.