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View Full Version : Can Bruce play in center??



WVPacman
07-26-2010, 11:38 PM
I swear if I knew that Bruce could play center field I would take Stubbs out of the lineup so fast that it would'nt be funny.He is still a young player but im tired of watching him leave runners in scoring position.He goes up to the plate and does'nt have a clue how to have a quality at bat and knock in those runners thats in scoring position.I would put Nix in right Bruce at center and Gomes in left.
Anyword on Dickerson? man I would even put him out there when he is able to play again.

marcshoe
07-26-2010, 11:49 PM
At any rate, it wouldn't hurt the Reds at all to pick up another outfield bat at the deadline.

kaldaniels
07-26-2010, 11:57 PM
http://blogs.ajc.com/mark-bradley-blog/2010/07/26/his-name-is-nate-mclouth-as-in-get-him-outta-here/?cxntlid=sldr_hm

Scathing article trying to run McClouth out of ATL. Anyone think he could be ressurected?

kbrake
07-26-2010, 11:58 PM
Bruce is just as much a problem as Stubbs right now.

marcshoe
07-26-2010, 11:59 PM
http://blogs.ajc.com/mark-bradley-blog/2010/07/26/his-name-is-nate-mclouth-as-in-get-him-outta-here/?cxntlid=sldr_hm

Scathing article trying to run McClouth out of ATL. Anyone think he could be ressurected?

Maybe, but at this point, I don't think the reclamation route's the way to go. Too much at stake. I think the team could find room for Jayson Werth, then let Stubbs and Bruce fight over center.

WVPacman
07-27-2010, 12:02 AM
Bruce is just as much a problem as Stubbs right now.

He is a problem but not as big of a problem as Stubbs.Atleast he does come threw with some hits that score's from time to time.

kbrake
07-27-2010, 12:04 AM
Bruce is a problem right now. Get Werth and play Gomes/Bruce as a platoon having Werth play both left and right field. Stubbs can share more AB's with Heisey.

WMR
07-27-2010, 12:10 AM
Bruce in CF? Are you trying to make Dusty's head explode? ;)

marcshoe
07-27-2010, 12:17 AM
Bruce in CF? Are you trying to make Dusty's head explode? ;)

We West Virginians like to make things explode. Blow it up real good.:explode:

How 'bout prospects to Houston, Oswalt to Philly, and Werth to Cincy, A good old-fashioned three-way deal.

WVPacman
07-27-2010, 12:19 AM
Bruce in CF? Are you trying to make Dusty's head explode? ;)

LOL my head is going to explode if I have to watch Stubbs stink it up at the plate.:D

CTA513
07-27-2010, 12:22 AM
He is a problem but not as big of a problem as Stubbs.Atleast he does come threw with some hits that score's from time to time.

Stubbs has 10 more RBIs so I can't see how Bruce is doing any better.

WVPacman
07-27-2010, 12:23 AM
We West Virginians like to make things explode. Blow it up real good.:explode:

How 'bout prospects to Houston, Oswalt to Philly, and Werth to Cincy, A good old-fashioned three-way deal.

West Virginians don't explode stuff we just burn couchs!!;)

It would be great if we could get Werth somehow in a trade.

marcshoe
07-27-2010, 12:29 AM
West Virginians don't explode stuff we just burn couchs!!;)

It would be great if we could get Werth somehow in a trade.

I could tell you a story involving a Morgantown hotel parking lot, a cleaning agent, and an empty 2 liter bottle....

for what it's werth, I can't find any rumors involving the Reds and Jayson W., but I'm willing to start one...:cool:

WVPacman
07-27-2010, 12:39 AM
I could tell you a story involving a Morgantown hotel parking lot, a cleaning agent, and an empty 2 liter bottle....

for what it's werth, I can't find any rumors involving the Reds and Jayson W., but I'm willing to start one...:cool:

LOL Tixe,if you say that happened in Morgantown then I guarantee its probably the truth.You will have to PM me one of these days b/c im always up for a great West Virginia story.

Well guys and girls im out for tonight and I will talk to you all later.

Ghosts of 1990
07-27-2010, 01:27 AM
As bad as Stubbs has been Bruce has been mre frustrating. They're both really hurting this team on a nightly basis and if we continually get no run production from these two former 1st round picks things are going to continue to deteriorate for our team. Bruce isn't even going to hit 15 HR or drive in 60 runs. He has been a colossal bust thus far. Stubbs just needs to make more frequent contact. When he has done that in spells he has displayed a lot more power and production then Jay Hype.

reds44
07-27-2010, 01:34 AM
I wish somebody would help Jay find his power.

Ron Madden
07-27-2010, 03:42 AM
As bad as Stubbs has been Bruce has been mre frustrating. They're both really hurting this team on a nightly basis and if we continually get no run production from these two former 1st round picks things are going to continue to deteriorate for our team. Bruce isn't even going to hit 15 HR or drive in 60 runs. He has been a colossal bust thus far. Stubbs just needs to make more frequent contact. When he has done that in spells he has displayed a lot more power and production then Jay Hype.

Have you ever thought about changing your user name?

TheNext44
07-27-2010, 04:18 AM
I have no problem with the production of Drew Stubbs or Jay Bruce so far this year. Do I wish it was larger? Of course, but I wish that of every player, including Joey Votto and Arthur Rhodes.

I also think the Reds would be in the playoffs every year if they got similar production from every first round draft pick.

RedFanAlways1966
07-27-2010, 07:20 AM
I have no problem with the production of Drew Stubbs or Jay Bruce so far this year. Do I wish it was larger? Of course, but I wish that of every player, including Joey Votto and Arthur Rhodes.


Spoken like the GM of a small-market team in MLB that has not sniffed the playoffs in 15 years. ;)

Two months to play and you are one game out of 1st place. A chance to make the playoffs for the 1st time in 15 years. You need to do something to help this team. CF and RF are two spots that need help. Both are young and can help in the future; therefore, you do not unload them. Try to get a decent bat that is available for one or two of your young arms. 15 YEARS! There are probably a lot fo people on this board that hardly/cannot remember the last playoff appearance. Stubbs and Bruce are hurting this team (there I said it).

Bruce and Stubbs have time to get better. I for one do not have many years left on this earth to wait for my fav team to make a post-season appearance.

cumberlandreds
07-27-2010, 07:27 AM
Bruce is just as much a problem as Stubbs right now.

Totally agree with that statement. Bruce is leaving as many runners on as Stubbs is. I just have to keep telling myself Bruce is only 23 and Stubbs is about that same age.

LoganBuck
07-27-2010, 07:59 AM
Bruce, could probably play center. Do I want him to? No. Just bring up Chris Dickerson mix him into the lineup. If Dickerson can get on base like a leadoff hitter it would certainly help.

hebroncougar
07-27-2010, 08:02 AM
I love when the Reds lose two game in a row, the whole team should be sent to AAA, and we should trade for other players. Don't get too high with the highs, or low with the lows people. Check out the winning %, and where we sit in the standings.

PuffyPig
07-27-2010, 08:06 AM
Bruce and Stubbs have time to get better. I for one do not have many years left on this earth to wait for my fav team to make a post-season appearance.

Bruce and Stubbs are extremely underrated.

Sure they aren't consitently tearing the cover off the ball, but their contribution to team defense is immense.

Our DER is in the top of the majors and is the main reason our pitching has improved so much from the start of the year.

Any improvement to those positions would have to be a substantially better hitter, to make up for the inevitable decline in defense.

I don't think many realize how good these players are playing defensively. And what a difference it makes.

pahster
07-27-2010, 08:08 AM
As bad as Stubbs has been Bruce has been mre frustrating. They're both really hurting this team on a nightly basis and if we continually get no run production from these two former 1st round picks things are going to continue to deteriorate for our team. Bruce isn't even going to hit 15 HR or drive in 60 runs. He has been a colossal bust thus far. Stubbs just needs to make more frequent contact. When he has done that in spells he has displayed a lot more power and production then Jay Hype.

Major league average bat + phenomenal defense in RF = hurting the team on a nightly basis?

Really?

Redsfan320
07-27-2010, 09:07 AM
When he first came, up Bruce split time in center with Patterson, as KGJ was in right. He plays fine there. However, if you want to replace Stubbs with Nix, Nix plays a fine CF too.

320

Heath
07-27-2010, 09:09 AM
Jay Bruce reminds me of Paul O'Neill.

That ended well for the Reds.

flyer85
07-27-2010, 09:30 AM
at the moment the entire starting outfield is a problem. all have a sub .330 OBP.

Hoosier Red
07-27-2010, 09:30 AM
Jay Bruce reminds me of Paul O'Neill.

That ended well for the Reds.

What? Roberto Kelly was an all-star in his first year. Whatever happened to that O'Neill fellow anyway?

RichRed
07-27-2010, 09:44 AM
What? Roberto Kelly was an all-star in his first year. Whatever happened to that O'Neill fellow anyway?

He was on "Seinfeld" once but didn't do much otherwise.

Ghosts of 1990
07-27-2010, 10:07 AM
To answer the overall thread's question... I think if you slide Bruce over to center he instead of being the best right fielder in the national league is then in the middle of the pack to very good center fielder. He definitely has the range and arm to play the position but he just strikes me as a guy who grows old out in right field.

I've watched Stubbs in center quite a bit and he gets good jumps, and throws particularly well in center field. A lot of people talk about Bruce's arm and Stubbs' arm does not get enough talk. He is VERY underrated as a throwing CF.

So to answer the question, I think without a doubt if you need to; you can play Bruce in center. With the current make-up of this ballclub I would have trouble seeing a situation in which they'd move him from RF.

nate
07-27-2010, 10:31 AM
Bruce and Stubbs are the two most productive OF the Reds have. Impossibly high bars set by hopes and dreams notwithstanding. They're good young players. They contribute positively. Best of all, they're under the Reds control for years to come and inexpensive.

If Heisey played more instead of Gomes, the Reds would likely be a better team.

Ron Madden
07-27-2010, 10:44 AM
Bruce and Stubbs are the two most productive OF the Reds have. Impossibly high bars set by hopes and dreams notwithstanding. They're good young players. They contribute positively. Best of all, they're under the Reds control for years to come and inexpensive.

If Heisey played more instead of Gomes, the Reds would likely be a better team.

I agree, but when Marty blames Stubbs and Bruce a lot of fans will follow suite.

PuffyPig
07-27-2010, 11:02 AM
When he first came, up Bruce split time in center with Patterson, as KGJ was in right. He plays fine there. However, if you want to replace Stubbs with Nix, Nix plays a fine CF too.

320

Stubbs plays an exceptional CF, GG quality.

Nix plays an acceptable CF, likely below average but OK.

Nix should not be replacing Stubbs in CF.

REDREAD
07-27-2010, 02:15 PM
I don't know that much about the Phillies, but that won't stop me from making a comment :) I know Werth is a FA at the end of the year.

Why in the world would the Phils want to trade Werth to one of their opponents (like the Reds). Sure, he's a pending FA, but they aren't likely to trade him unless they get something that could really help them this year (which would likely cripple the Reds' chances if they gave it up).. the Phils are going for it too.

That's like a Phillie fan hoping the Reds trade Rhodes or Arroyo to their team, since they are near the end of their contracts.

The Voice of IH
07-27-2010, 02:27 PM
Article Here
(http://mlbcenter.com/articles/2010-mlb/reds-brewers-recap_072710.html)

As I mentioned earlier, Drew Stubbs has a ton of strikeouts. He latter record his 103rd which is good for 7th in the NL (8 th in all of MLB). That is a ton for a non homerun hitting player. Stubbs is one of (if not THE) faster player on the Reds ball club. He’s young and has shown to be clutch this season. Most reds insiders see him as the feature of the outfield, so it is understandable why the men in charge may look the other way. But it is essential that Stubbs is able to put the bat on the ball if the Reds hope to continue to compete for the Central crown this season. With all the speed, agility and talent the guy has, putting the ball in play could easily result in hits for him. Something that his average could use (.237).

nate
07-27-2010, 02:37 PM
Who is Parker Perry?

westofyou
07-27-2010, 02:41 PM
Who is Parker Perry?

Just another man with an internet connection and an opinion.

RedsManRick
07-27-2010, 02:48 PM
I do think Bruce can play center and was disappointed when they moved him to RF and then compounded it by signing Taveras. 2009 could have been so much better if they had pursued a corner OF instead of a CF -- I wanted Josh Willingham.

That said, I still think LF is bigger problem than CF and would not be actively looking to replace Stubbs unless and until Gomes was already out.

nate
07-27-2010, 02:50 PM
Just another man with an internet connection and an opinion.

So it could be you?

Or me!

:cool:

The Voice of IH
07-27-2010, 03:05 PM
or me?

nate
07-27-2010, 03:13 PM
or me?

Is it?

The Voice of IH
07-27-2010, 03:32 PM
oh yea, check the sig.

and Stubbs has 104 strike outs, MLB.com was late in its reporting.

pedro
07-27-2010, 04:20 PM
Who is Parker Perry?

Spiderman's evil nemesis

Redsfan320
07-27-2010, 04:28 PM
Stubbs plays an exceptional CF, GG quality.

Nix plays an acceptable CF, likely below average but OK.

Nix should not be replacing Stubbs in CF.

I'm not sure I think so either. I was just saying if you want Nix in the lineup instead of Stubbs, I'd probably rather have Nix in CF and Bruce in RF, than vice-versa.

320

KronoRed
07-27-2010, 04:51 PM
Spiderman's evil nemesis

Spider-Man would make a great Center fielder.

GADawg
07-27-2010, 05:27 PM
Bruce and Stubbs are the two most productive OF the Reds have. Impossibly high bars set by hopes and dreams notwithstanding. They're good young players. They contribute positively. Best of all, they're under the Reds control for years to come and inexpensive.

If Heisey played more instead of Gomes, the Reds would likely be a better team.

Gomes must've ran over your dog 'cause you definitely have a jones on for running him down. There's no doubt that Bruce and Stubbs can "D" it up with any other tandem in the league BUT "the most productive"? gimme a break. The comparison is as far apart offensively and it is defensively. Offensively Gomes is superior in every cateogory to both of those guys(shouldn't Bruce have another run or two batted in at this point considering his total of ab's?) and is actually prone to getting a hit with runner's on which is something the Reds haven't had alot of the past several years.

Also I love the fact that everyone just throws out there how Jonny is killing the team defensively. If your LF defense is the difference in making the postseason or not then that is gonna be one hell of a race. I do agree with those of you who say that improved defense has led to improved pitching but I also believe better arms and a deeper supply of them could possibly have a little to do with it also. For all the chatter about Gomes and his defense I was glad to at least see some people switching gears and moving over to the Janish camp(which was a very small camp this offseason).

PuffyPig
07-27-2010, 06:01 PM
Gomes must've ran over your dog 'cause you definitely have a jones on for running him down. There's no doubt that Bruce and Stubbs can "D" it up with any other tandem in the league BUT "the most productive"? gimme a break. The comparison is as far apart offensively and it is defensively. Offensively Gomes is superior in every cateogory to both of those guys(shouldn't Bruce have another run or two batted in at this point considering his total of ab's?) and is actually prone to getting a hit with runner's on which is something the Reds haven't had alot of the past several years.

Also I love the fact that everyone just throws out there how Jonny is killing the team defensively. If your LF defense is the difference in making the postseason or not then that is gonna be one hell of a race. I do agree with those of you who say that improved defense has led to improved pitching but I also believe better arms and a deeper supply of them could possibly have a little to do with it also. For all the chatter about Gomes and his defense I was glad to at least see some people switching gears and moving over to the Janish camp(which was a very small camp this offseason).

I think most posters here believe that an OF of Heisey/Stubbs/Bruce is likely better than an OF where Gomes is the LF and Heisey replaces one of the other two guys.

Gomes OPS of .795 simply doesn't make up for the defensive and running downgrade he brings to the table.

When Gomes was OPS'ing .900 it was a different matter.

But he isn't; he's the weak link in the OF now.

nate
07-27-2010, 06:07 PM
I think most posters here believe that an OF of Heisey/Stubbs/Bruce is likely better than an OF where Gomes is the LF and Heisey replaces one of the other two guys.

Gomes OPS of .795 simply doesn't make up for the defensive and running downgrade he brings to the table.

When Gomes was OPS'ing .900 it was a different matter.

But he isn't; he's the weak link in the OF now.

Yep.

At the very least, hasn't Heisey warranted more playing time? He's the one I want to see more of. Let Gomes thump one off the bench and start a couple times a week but get Hesiey more starts.

GADawg
07-27-2010, 06:20 PM
I think most posters here believe that an OF of Heisey/Stubbs/Bruce is likely better than an OF where Gomes is the LF and Heisey replaces one of the other two guys.

Gomes OPS of .795 simply doesn't make up for the defensive and running downgrade he brings to the table.

When Gomes was OPS'ing .900 it was a different matter.

But he isn't; he's the weak link in the OF now.


I don't doubt you on that at all...it's not cool to praise 'ole Jonny here....unfortunately I don't care about being cool. I'm guessing Gomes true OPS number lies somewhere between that .795 and .900. I'm a Jonny fan and even though I really haven't seen guys pitch around him any I'm still thinking he'd be closer to the high end with someone pulling their weight behind him.

GADawg
07-27-2010, 06:23 PM
btw...IMO finding someone to get on base at the top of the order is the biggest need this team has at the moment. Don't know if Dickerson can be that guy for any sustained period of time but I'm anxious to see him give it a shot.

Mario-Rijo
07-27-2010, 06:32 PM
This time last year I was in agreement about Heisey playing over Gomes and I still see some reasons to play Heisey. That said it's not as slam dunk as last year the gap has definitely shrunk in the offseason for me. Watching Heisey his swing doesn't seem conducive to being effective day in and day out right now (but hopefully soon), his selectivity isn't quite where I'd like to see it either which I didn't expect. Gomes OTOH I feel has actually improved in the offseason, could be a mirage I suppose but he looks like he has gotten to more balls than last season and his ineffectiveness vs. certain pitches isn't as extreme.

Heisey would still be a starter for me next season unless someone else was added in the offseason. But at this juncture I think I could be content with either of them starting but since we need offense I think Gomes is a slightly better fit right now. I could get behind swapping out Stubbs for Heisey/Dickerson for the month of August at least. With Stubbs taking some hacks in Louisville until the deadline for playoff rosters are set. I don't know Heisey would be more productive (I'm thinking he might be) than Stubbs but I'd like to find out.

Big Klu
07-27-2010, 07:08 PM
Who is Parker Perry?


Just another man with an internet connection and an opinion.


So it could be you?

Or me!

:cool:


or me?

http://www.vhinkle.com/rome/spartacus.jpg

PuffyPig
07-27-2010, 07:24 PM
I don't doubt you on that at all...it's not cool to praise 'ole Jonny here....unfortunately I don't care about being cool. I'm guessing Gomes true OPS number lies somewhere between that .795 and .900. I'm a Jonny fan and even though I really haven't seen guys pitch around him any I'm still thinking he'd be closer to the high end with someone pulling their weight behind him.

Jonny's OPS is .795 right in line with his career average. It's not like we've seen better before, we haven't.


One would think that if he was being "pitched around" he'd have the occasional walk.

But as you say, you haven't seen him pitched around so I'm guessing he hasn 't been.

Chip R
07-27-2010, 07:27 PM
Spider-Man would make a great Center fielder.

Lots of web gems from him.

nate
07-27-2010, 07:29 PM
http://www.vhinkle.com/rome/spartacus.jpg

I AM PARKER PERRY!

:cool:

nate
07-27-2010, 07:29 PM
Lots of web gems from him.

Dude...

CTA513
07-27-2010, 07:32 PM
Spider-Man would make a great Center fielder.

He would probably be considered lazy because all he would have to due is shoot a web to catch a ball.

The Voice of IH
07-27-2010, 07:36 PM
I AM PARKER PERRY!

:cool:

but if you are Parker Perry, does that make me Nate?

marcshoe
07-27-2010, 08:35 PM
I'm not down on any of these guys, really, but Bruce and Stubbs are both young, and, as good as the offense has been for the season, the number of shutouts is worrisome. The team's in a pennant race, and picking up another solid bat while rotating the kids would be a solid move, imho. If the goal's to win, there's no better time than now.

Falls City Beer
07-27-2010, 08:38 PM
I'm not down on any of these guys, really, but Bruce and Stubbs are both young, and, as good as the offense has been for the season, the number of shutouts is worrisome. The team's in a pennant race, and picking up another solid bat while rotating the kids would be a solid move, imho. If the goal's to win, there's no better time than now.

I agree. The offense has been good, but it's impossible to deny that they're both struggling terribly. Add in the struggles of vets like Phillips and Rolen and the regression of Hanigan, and they're going to need reinforcements. But, of course, they're going to need pitching reinforcements too. That fact hasn't changed either.

edabbs44
07-27-2010, 08:48 PM
I think most posters here believe that an OF of Heisey/Stubbs/Bruce is likely better than an OF where Gomes is the LF and Heisey replaces one of the other two guys.

Gomes OPS of .795 simply doesn't make up for the defensive and running downgrade he brings to the table.

When Gomes was OPS'ing .900 it was a different matter.

But he isn't; he's the weak link in the OF now.

It really wasn't. When Gomes was at his peak this season he had a WAR in the Janish range. There were quite a few discussions on it that his defense took away most of his offensive value.

dougdirt
07-27-2010, 08:49 PM
I agree. The offense has been good, but it's impossible to deny that they're both struggling terribly. Add in the struggles of vets like Phillips and Rolen and the regression of Hanigan, and they're going to need reinforcements. But, of course, they're going to need pitching reinforcements too. That fact hasn't changed either.

Stubbs has been in a slump for a week. Prior to that, the guy had an .840 OPS over his last 45 games.

Falls City Beer
07-27-2010, 08:50 PM
Stubbs has been in a slump for a week. Prior to that, the guy had an .840 OPS over his last 45 games.

You can cut his numbers any way you wish, the guy is incredibly streaky. His season OPS is .708.

edabbs44
07-27-2010, 09:05 PM
I guess I'm not surprised, but shouldn't we want to see the youngsters make or break this season? A lot of fans treat seasons now like fantasy redraft leagues. Bench Bruce, sit Stubbs, jettison Joey (just kidding). To me, if these are the guys that we will be seeing for the foreseeable future, these are the guys who should be in the lineup day in and day out. Maybe the team ends up missing the postseason, but I'm not sure that I want to see Cincy start screwing with the young guys just because they are treating this like the last season of their lives.

If the Reds see Stubbs as being the future CF of this franchise, I want to see him get exposure to this atmosphere.

Falls City Beer
07-27-2010, 09:08 PM
I guess I'm not surprised, but shouldn't we want to see the youngsters make or break this season? A lot of fans treat seasons now like fantasy redraft leagues. Bench Bruce, sit Stubbs, jettison Joey (just kidding). To me, if these are the guys that we will be seeing for the foreseeable future, these are the guys who should be in the lineup day in and day out. Maybe the team ends up missing the postseason, but I'm not sure that I want to see Cincy start screwing with the young guys just because they are treating this like the last season of their lives.

If the Reds see Stubbs as being the future CF of this franchise, I want to see him get exposure to this atmosphere.

Just like Volquez, these guys will get all the starts they need to sink the season. No worries on that front. And then they'll be all battle-scarred next season and ready to...ah who cares? By the time they're any good, Rolen and Votto will be gone anyway.

nate
07-27-2010, 09:12 PM
but if you are Parker Perry, does that make me Nate?

Sure!

edabbs44
07-27-2010, 09:15 PM
Just like Volquez, these guys will get all the starts they need to sink the season. No worries on that front. And then they'll be all battle-scarred next season and ready to...ah who cares? By the time they're any good, Rolen and Votto will be gone anyway.

You don't see many young position players with any sort of talent getting replaced at the deadline if they are in a playoff chase. Plus, I'm curious as to what kind of upgrade we expect to be able to realistically acquire right now. What OFer is on the block, reasonably paid and available for a decent price? The popular answer might be Heisey and I could see him start to get some time, but something tells me that he'll leave us wanting more.

Falls City Beer
07-27-2010, 09:17 PM
You don't see many young position players with any sort of talent getting replaced at the deadline if they are in a playoff chase. Plus, I'm curious as to what kind of upgrade we expect to be able to realistically acquire right now. What OFer is on the block, reasonably paid and available for a decent price? The popular answer might be Heisey and I could see him start to get some time, but something tells me that he'll leave us wanting more.

That's the spirit! Cross our fingers and hope for the best.

edabbs44
07-27-2010, 09:27 PM
That's the spirit! Cross our fingers and hope for the best.

Again, this isn't a one year redraft league. The core of this team is back next year. It's ok to show improvement without winning it all. It isn't ok to act like you haven't been here before and start offering up the future for a short term solution.

Then again, I guess Walt just needs to go on Amazon and order that TOR arm and stud OF/SS that are on sale this week.

Falls City Beer
07-27-2010, 09:30 PM
Again, this isn't a one year redraft league. The core of this team is back next year. It's ok to show improvement without winning it all. It isn't ok to act like you haven't been here before and start offering up the future for a short term solution.

Then again, I guess Walt just needs to go on Amazon and order that TOR arm and stud OF/SS that are on sale this week.

Parts of this team will be here next year; parts won't. They could find themselves in an identical position next year, or worse. Unlikely they'll be in a better position. So next year, you'd advise not adding talent?

edabbs44
07-27-2010, 09:33 PM
Parts of this team will be here next year; parts won't. They could find themselves in an identical position next year, or worse. Unlikely they'll be in a better position. So next year, you'd advise not adding talent?

There's a difference btw adding talent at the deadline and adding talent in the offseason. You are more apt to deal a part of the starting lineup in the offseason than right now.

This week I would think that, barring Walt getting a Godfather type offer, he should get some help for the bench and bullpen. This offseason, I think we see some moves being made. They will hopefully have some money to spend and they have some minor league depth available.

Big Klu
07-27-2010, 10:11 PM
but if you are Parker Perry, does that make me Nate?

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_3A41cw14sOg/Rc8uzuBeeEI/AAAAAAAAAJQ/i25a_glJSRk/s320/Spartacus43.jpg

Ron Madden
07-28-2010, 04:03 AM
I guess I'm not surprised, but shouldn't we want to see the youngsters make or break this season? A lot of fans treat seasons now like fantasy redraft leagues. Bench Bruce, sit Stubbs, jettison Joey (just kidding). To me, if these are the guys that we will be seeing for the foreseeable future, these are the guys who should be in the lineup day in and day out. Maybe the team ends up missing the postseason, but I'm not sure that I want to see Cincy start screwing with the young guys just because they are treating this like the last season of their lives.If the Reds see Stubbs as being the future CF of this franchise, I want to see him get exposure to this atmosphere.


I'm in full agreement with edabbs here. (although I was in favor of Dickerson over Stubbs to play CF)

After all don't we all want the Reds to have a long range plan and to stick to that plan for more than half a season?

TheNext44
07-28-2010, 04:41 AM
Parts of this team will be here next year; parts won't. They could find themselves in an identical position next year, or worse. Unlikely they'll be in a better position. So next year, you'd advise not adding talent?

Chapman + recovered Volquez + Leake w/ more innings + full season of Wood + more mature Cueto + full season of more mature Ondrusek, Smith, Bray, and Fisher + more mature Bruce, Stubbs, and Heisey + likely contributions from Cozart, Alonso, Frazier, Francisco, Valaika, Boxberger and Meseraco + around $12M in payflex = likely better position in 2011.

That combined surely outweighs the probable decline from Cordero, Rolen and Phillips + the lose of Arroyo, Harang and Rhodes.

Not all of the top stuff will happen, but even if half of it does, the Reds will be in a better position than this season, or at the very least, will not be worse.

mth123
07-28-2010, 05:07 AM
Chapman + recovered Volquez + Leake w/ more innings + full season of Wood + more mature Cueto + full season of more mature Ondrusek, Smith, Bray, and Fisher + more mature Bruce, Stubbs, and Heisey + likely contributions from Cozart, Alonso, Frazier, Francisco, Valaika, Boxberger and Meseraco + around $12M in payflex = likely better position in 2011.

That combined surely outweighs the probable decline from Cordero, Rolen and Phillips + the lose of Arroyo, Harang and Rhodes.

Not all of the top stuff will happen, but even if half of it does, the Reds will be in a better position than this season, or at the very least, will not be worse.

I'm not sure I agree at all. Other than RF, I don't really see a lot of places where this tean will improve. I see many spots where this team will go backwards.