8/15- Reds vs. Marlins, "Going for the sweep"

[WebScorpion]

5 - 1 Cubs 1st and 3rd no outs
Dempster drove in that run...I guess they're going to let Kyle take one for the team...brutal.

Oh, I take that back. They've mercifully pulled the guy.

[_Sir_Charles_]

He's bunting. Not sure why. If you're gonna use him...let him swing.

[SunDeck]

Hoping for the Cubs to win...leaves a really bad taste in my mouth.

[VR]

He's bunting. Not sure why. If you're gonna use him...let him swing.

Perhaps they are double switching hiim in to play 2nd.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Hoping for the Cubs to win...leaves a really bad taste in my mouth.

What?!? No, no, no, NO! Root for the cards to lose. The Cubs winning would be incidental. :O)

[TheBurn]

6-1 Cubs

[RBA]

Go CUBS!

[VR]

Hoping for the Cubs to win...leaves a really bad taste in my mouth.

it's an acquired taste.....you'll learn to savor it when you see the standings. :)

[_Sir_Charles_]

Leake with a soft liner to left. 1 down.

[WebScorpion]

Hoping for the Cubs to win...leaves a really bad taste in my mouth.
I'm just hoping for the Cards to lose...don't really care who they're playing. :D

[Kc61]

Leake pops out, swinging away.

Phillips, now is the time.

[NJReds]

With Cueto suspended and Francisco being sent down, Dusty's PH options are limited. Wasn't a bad move PHing Leake ... unfortunately he couldn't get the bunt down.

[BCubb2003]

it's an acquired taste.....you'll learn to savor it when you see the standings. :)

The enemy of our enemy is our friend.

[Kc61]

With Cueto suspended and Francisco being sent down, Dusty's PH options are limited. Wasn't a bad move PHing Leake ... unfortunately he couldn't get the bunt down.

Dusty has a full five man bench. It's just that most of the guys are outfielders.

Nix, Rolen, Heisey, Hernandez, all were available.

[TheBurn]

7-1 Cubs

[RBA]

Dempster scores on wild pitch.

[WebScorpion]

I'd like a few more runs...my tummy can't take another Rollercloser ride. :eek:

[_Sir_Charles_]

Phillips grounds out to third, but Janish was running on the play. Bruce up with Paul on 2nd.

Pitching change. Ohman I think.

[RedsMan3203]

Sullivan_Ranger

Rangers signing Wily Tavares to a Triple A contract for outfield depth

[BCubb2003]

Rollercloser

Nice.

[NJReds]

Dusty has a full five man bench. It's just that most of the guys are outfielders.

Nix, Rolen, Heisey, Hernandez, all were available.

He wouldn't use Hernandez this early ... backup catcher.

[VR]

The enemy of our enemy is our friend.

yesterday's Office rerun had Dwight's quoting this phrase. Quality stuff.


Dwight: Jim is my enemy. But it turns out that Jim is also his own worst enemy. And the enemy of my enemy is my friend. So Jim, is actually my friend. But, because he is his own worst enemy, the enemy of my friend is my enemy so actually Jim is my enemy. But-

[Brutus]

This apparently has been the Wily Taveras farewell tour this year. How many teams has that been since the offseason? 6?

[Kc61]

He wouldn't use Hernandez this early ... backup catcher.

Right. But Dusty had plenty of alternatives. The Reds bench is usually five guys, and it is currently five guys.

There was an extra position player with Francisco, who was sent down.

[Danny Serafini]

Will Ohman in for Badenhop

[mth123]

This apparently has been the Wily Taveras farewell tour this year. How many teams has that been since the offseason? 6?

You make it around to a lot of places as you're circling the drain.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Jay K's to end the inning.

[VR]

game thread poll.....

Homer Bailey

* Send him back down
* Keep him in the rotation
* Put him in the bullpen


?

[WebScorpion]

Jay K's to end the inning. Jay, if you want to learn to hit lefties, that was Will Ohman's slider. You got 4 shots at it, two swings and couldn't touch it. If you ever learn to hit that pitch, you're golden. :cool:

[_Sir_Charles_]

game thread poll.....

Homer Bailey

* Send him back down
* Keep him in the rotation
* Put him in the bullpen


?

Well, this one is a slam dunk for me. Rotation. Without a doubt. Harang too. Volquez & Leake out.

[RedsMan3203]

Keep him in the rotation. Move Leake to triple A

[TheBurn]

* Keep him in the rotation

[Kc61]

Top of the Marlins' order up. Masset pitching. Big inning for the Reds. One down.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Janish flashes the leather. Nice play. 1 down.

[VR]

Janish. Smooth.

[VR]

Morrison looks like he was up all night with a crack pipe. My goodness.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Morrison with a double past Gomes.

[TheBurn]

8-1 Cubs

[RBA]

8-1 Cubs

[VR]

Morrison with a double past Gomes.

Hope Bruce saw that hit.

[LoganBuck]

Gomes unsmooth

[VR]

Gomes unsmooth

Looked like an old man chasing a gopher out there.

[Kc61]

Well, this one is a slam dunk for me. Rotation. Without a doubt. Harang too. Volquez & Leake out.

Rotation could be Arroyo, Volquez, Bailey, Wood, Cueto.

Leake to long relief.

Fisher to AAA, returns when rosters expand.

Harang - rehab until September 1, comes up after rosters expand.

[_Sir_Charles_]

K!

[_Sir_Charles_]

Rotation could be Arroyo, Volquez, Bailey, Wood, Cueto.

Leake to long relief.

Fisher to AAA.

Harang - rehab until September 1, comes up after rosters expand.

Yeah, I meant once Harang came back. Now if there's a set back, leave Volquez in. I just don't want to overwork Edinson. He seemed rushed back.

[VR]

Boy, Masset is nasty. I wish he trusted that splitter more.

[Kc61]

Yeah, I meant once Harang came back. Now if there's a set back, leave Volquez in. I just don't want to overwork Edinson. He seemed rushed back.

Charles, I would be surprised if Harang ever returns to the Reds rotation - barring injury, of course.

[Ron Madden]

I really like Nick Masset

[Kc61]

I really like Nick Masset

He is really going strong right now.

[RedsMan3203]

I really like Nick Masset

:thumbup::thumbup:

After a shaky April, Masset has been nails...

[NDRed]

Cards are going to lose 2 out of 3 to the Cubs at home. WOW
I did not expect that. Cubs looked to be playing out the string when we saw them last week.

[Brutus]

:thumbup::thumbup:

After a shaky April, Masset has been nails...

His ERA is down to 3.90 now.

[VR]

that fastball was high and drifting inside, could have been ugly. That's the beauty of throwing it 96 mph.

[RBA]

Thanks Loshe and the Cardinal pitchers. Do to your efforts you burned a bases loaded image onto my plasma screen.

Lucky it's only temporary. ;)

[Brutus]

Ugh. Now this sobering fact: Cordero will lead off the 9th pitching to Stanton.

[_Sir_Charles_]

I sure wouldn't object to a few more runs here boys. Not at all.

[NDRed]

Masset should be saved to pitch the post-Cordero spot. What's that role called?

[Kc61]

Masset should be saved to pitch the post-Cordero spot. What's that role called?

Blown save bail out man. BSBOM.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Sanches pitching.

[RBA]

Ugh. Now this sobering fact: Cordero will lead off the 9th pitching to Stanton.

And he can't hit a two or three run homer.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Stubbs grounds out to third. 1 down.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Gomes....strikeout.

[RED VAN HOT]

I think that Stubbs needs to establish that he will bunt for a BH.

[VR]

:thumbup::thumbup:

After a shaky April, Masset has been nails...

2 runs given up over the last 2 months.....27 innings, 13 hits, 0.67 ERA.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Edmonds up. He's still o-fer the Reds.

[Brutus]

And he can't hit a two or three run homer.

No, but he's a prime candidate for the customary Cordero lead-off walk.

[_Sir_Charles_]

And he snaps it! Double off the wall!

And they save the ball? Was that a special number for Edmonds or something?

[Redsfan320]

Edmonds with his 1st hit as a Red!! And it's an extra-base one!

320

[RedsMan3203]

All aboard the CoCo Coaster

[_Sir_Charles_]

Cairo K's to end the inning. 2-0 heading to the ninth.

[Ron Madden]

Buckle your seat belts.

[Kc61]

Hard to imagine what to expect here.

Walks?

Will he groove pitches to avoid walks?

The Coco of old?

A different closer?

[SunDeck]

Starting to like this team a lot. I really wondered what they'd do after the Cards sweep. These guys don't give up.

[RedsMan3203]

Over under 3 walks + hits this inning for CoCo

[_Sir_Charles_]

1st pitch strike.

Cue the sarcastic applause. :O)

[Red in Chicago]

Over under 3 walks + hits this inning for CoCo

i'll take the under today

[_Sir_Charles_]

Leadoff double for Stanton. Okay everybody...pile on!

Bruce made it VERY close at second.

[redsfaninbsg]

Here we go.

[Kc61]

0-2 pitch.

That was my concern, that Coco would be so concerned about walks that he would groove pitches ahead in the count.

[Brutus]

As predictable as the patterns of the sun.

[Kc61]

That's one.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Grounder up the middle. Phillips corrals it. 1 down.

Stanton heads to third.

[RedsMan3203]

So far, 1 hit and 1 out....

[WebScorpion]

Rollercloser...slow dow-own! :rolleyes:

[Brutus]

Rollercloser...slow dow-own! :rolleyes:

We're just going up the really big hill now.

[TheBurn]

There it is... nice K

[RBA]

Cody Ross do not haunt?

[Danny Serafini]

97 on the inside, nice pitch.

Ross to PH for Paulino

[Red in Chicago]

did keels say that coco was in his second season with the reds?

[_Sir_Charles_]

Quickly 0-2

[Kc61]

Coco airing it out, finally. Let's get this guy.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Full count. Close

[_Sir_Charles_]

Walk. Crud. He got squeezed some there.

[RedsMan3203]

# 2

[Danny Serafini]

Donnie Murphy to hit for the pitcher

[NDRed]

Fastball after fastball

[redsfaninbsg]

Of all the contenders, do the Reds have the worst closer?

[CTA513]

Cordero must be using those slick balls that some of the Cardinals pitchers complain about.

[RedsMan3203]

Of all the contenders, do the Reds have the worst closer?

Might be a tie between him and Franklin

[_Sir_Charles_]

Slider! I'm amazed.

[WMR]

Walk. Crud. He got squeezed some there.

He did?

Looked to me like he wanted to nibble nibble nibble after getting ahead 0-2.

Didn't see any squeezing by the ump.

[Ron Madden]

Of all the contenders, do the Reds have the worst closer?

I think so.

[RBA]

1st Place By Themselves!

[_Sir_Charles_]

K! And this one belongs to the Reds!

[redsfaninbsg]

I never doubted him for a minute. :)

[Red in Chicago]

coco's back :p:

[_Sir_Charles_]

He did?

Looked to me like he wanted to nibble nibble nibble after getting ahead 0-2.

Didn't see any squeezing by the ump.

I'm going by Gameday. Ball 3 was right on the black.

[RedsMan3203]

If you said under 3, you win! Go buy your self a piece of gum.

Thank goodness for a bad ump behind the plate....

[Danny Serafini]

http://128.32.18.189/w/images/thumb/2/2c/Broom_icon.svg/400px-Broom_icon.svg.png

[CTA513]

He didn't give up any runs so this is an improvement.

[Ron Madden]

I never doubted him for a minute. :)

I did.

[VR]

Bonus call on strike 3, a bit low. We'll take it.

[Gallen5862]

"And This One Belongs To The First Place Reds."

[NJReds]

Of all the contenders, do the Reds have the worst closer?

Bell, Wilson and Wagner are better.

I take Cordero over Franklin and Lidge.

[TheBurn]

CoCo with the K
Glad this one is over :D
That's how you bounce back from a 'crushing' sweep.... with a sweep of your own.
Way to step up fellas! :clap:

[jojo]

Bonus call on strike 3, a bit low. We'll take it.

I thought a picture of strike three should've been hung on his mom's fridge... :cool:

[NDRed]

His WHIP in the last 4-6 weeks has to be through the roof

[Brutus]

Coco therapy. It heals.

[Ron Madden]

Nice rebound by the Reds.

[NJReds]

Nice sweep. Hopefully the Cubs hold off the Cards. :beerme:

Being a contender is a great change.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Homer gets the W.

6 innings of 3 hit shutout ball. 4 k's and most importantly...0 walks.

Welcome back Mr. Bailey!

Not counting the game he was pitching injured, Homer's last 3 starts....


IP H R ER HR BB SO GB FB PIT
6.0 3 0 0 0 0 4 7 3 102
7.0 4 2 2 1 2 4 12 8 110
9.0 4 0 0 0 0 6 10 13 90

[WebScorpion]

Meanwhile, the Cards are losing 8-1 in the 5th in the rubber match of a home series against the Scrubs. :eek: For a great team, they sure can suck against some pretty poor competition. That's what I like about this Reds team, while they still need to figure out how to step it up for a big series, they win the ones they're supposed to. :thumbup:

[Redsfan320]

What dooo you know- Reds win!

Once again, another typical Coco nail-biter.

320

[PuffyPig]

Bell, Wilson and Wagner are better.

I take Cordero over Franklin and Lidge.

FWIW, Wagner (surprisingly) has more blown saves.

[mth123]

game thread poll.....

Homer Bailey

* Send him back down
* Keep him in the rotation
* Put him in the bullpen


?

Rotation. Option Leake.

[Brutus]

Rotation. Option Leake.

What on earth is the point of optioning him? If he's so tired (and I maintain he's not there yet), just shut him down entirely.

[TeamBoone]

FWIW, Wagner (surprisingly) has more blown saves.

He doesn't have as good defense behind him.

[Ron Madden]

What on earth is the point of optioning him? If he's so tired (and I maintain he's not there yet), just shut him down entirely.

If you shut him down you have to option him to open up a roster spot for someone you can use.

[Brutus]

If you shut him down you have to option him to open upa roster spot for someone you can use.

But that's unnecessary... you place him on the DL for fatigue. Optioning him just to shut him down would be seen as a big no-no by the union as getting around service time and MLB pay rates. It's something the Reds may do, but it might be met with some hostility.

[Ron Madden]

No... you place him on the DL for fatigue. Optioning him just to shut him down would be seen as a big no-no by the union as getting around service time and MLB pay rates.

Good point. I thought you were sayin just shut him down and keephim around.

[Brutus]

Good point. I thought you were sayin just shut him down and keephim around.

Oh, no definitely not. I know you can't just leave the roster spot hanging around. If he's at a point where he needs shut down (which is something I still don't believe), then put 'em on the DL and be done with it. Sending him down isn't an option (or at least a very good one) because of the union complications.

[mth123]

What on earth is the point of optioning him? If he's so tired (and I maintain he's not there yet), just shut him down entirely.

1. Who says he's tired? He needs to push his IP up a little more in 2010 to extend him for 2011. Get him to 170 IP or so and let him get that work in AAA against weaker hitters.

2. His problems of late are from the league catching on. He's most successful when he gets ahead 0-1. Early in the year he did that by laying it in there as guys let it go by to get a read on him. Now after one time through the order he doesn't get away with it.

3. Optioning him stops his service time and delays free agency by a year and based on his last 2 plus months is totally justified.

4. The Reds have better guys to pitch out of the pen so why waste a roster spot on him if he's not in the rotation?

[mth123]

But that's unnecessary... you place him on the DL for fatigue. Optioning him just to shut him down would be seen as a big no-no by the union as getting around service time and MLB pay rates. It's something the Reds may do, but it might be met with some hostility.

How is it a no-no to option a guy who has had an ERA near 6 for the last two months?

No way te union can have a beef with sending down a guy who the league has caught-up with.

[Brutus]

1. Who says he's tired? He needs to push his IP up a little more in 2010 to extend him for 2011. Get him to 170 IP or so and let him get that work in AAA against weaker hitters.

2. His problems of late are from the league catching on. He's most successful when he gets ahead 0-1. Early in the year he did that by laying it in there as guys let it go by to get a read on him. Now after one time through the order he doesn't get away with it.

3. Optioning him stops his service time and delays free agency by a year and based on his last 2 plus months is totally justified.

4. The Reds have better guys to pitch out of the pen so why waste a roster spot on him if he's not in the rotation?

"Who says he's tired?"

Practically all of Redszone. That has certainly been the theme here the last two weeks. I can't believe you haven't seen the dozens of threads saying "it's time to shut him down. He's got nothing left."

"His problems of late are from the league catching on."

I agree. I think you posted in the thread I started this week echoing those sentiments. So we're in agreement there.

"Optioning him stops his service time and delays free agency by a year and based on his last 2 plus months is totally justified."

The union has filed many grievances in the past for that sort of thing. If they're optioning him to actually pitch, there's nothing wrong with it. If they option him just to shut him down by putting him on the inactive list or 7-day DL, there's a whole lot wrong with it. It not only hurts his service, as you mentioned, but also pays him significantly less (i.e. prorated $65k instead of prorated $400k) by being there.

Again, if he is actually pitching, I would say it's not as egregious. But as long as he can continue to help, I personally leave him here.

"The Reds have better guys to pitch out of the pen so why waste a roster spot on him if he's not in the rotation?"

It seems the issue is shutting him down or not. I don't see any talk of moving him to the pen for the rest of the season, so I don't think that's even remotely something the Reds are thinking about.

[Brutus]

How is it a no-no to option a guy who has had an ERA near 6 for the last two months?

No way te union can have a beef with sending down a guy who the league has caught-up with.

Because of the typical response around here lately, I was under the impression you meant optioning him so he could be shut down. I agree it's kosher to option someone for poor performance... but most people haven't been on that bandwagon.

[mth123]

"Who says he's tired?"

Practically all of Redszone. That has certainly been the theme here the last two weeks. I can't believe you haven't seen the dozens of threads saying "it's time to shut him down. He's got nothing left."

"His problems of late are from the league catching on."

I agree. I think you posted in the thread I started this week echoing those sentiments. So we're in agreement there.

"Optioning him stops his service time and delays free agency by a year and based on his last 2 plus months is totally justified."

The union has filed many grievances in the past for that sort of thing. If they're optioning him to actually pitch, there's nothing wrong with it. If they option him just to shut him down by putting him on the inactive list or 7-day DL, there's a whole lot wrong with it. It not only hurts his service, as you mentioned, but also pays him significantly less (i.e. prorated $65k instead of prorated $400k) by being there.

Again, if he is actually pitching, I would say it's not as egregious. But as long as he can continue to help, I personally leave him here.

"The Reds have better guys to pitch out of the pen so why waste a roster spot on him if he's not in the rotation?"

It seems the issue is shutting him down or not. I don't see any talk of moving him to the pen for the rest of the season, so I don't think that's even remotely something the Reds are thinking about.

I never said he's tired. No way do I shut hom down now. He's not even at 140 IP. When he gets to 170, that's a different matter.

[Brutus]

I never said he's tired. No way do I shut hom down now. He's not even at 140 IP. When he gets to 170, that's a different matter.

I know you didn't... I'm just so accustomed to hearing people around here say "send him down and shut him down," that I made the mistake of assuming that was your intent. It was just my assumption that I based my comments from.

[_Sir_Charles_]

2. His problems of late are from the league catching on. He's most successful when he gets ahead 0-1. Early in the year he did that by laying it in there as guys let it go by to get a read on him. Now after one time through the order he doesn't get away with it.

I'm not sure if you guys saw this quote from Leake from yesterday. I can't recall the last rookie I saw that put this much thought into his pitching. It's quite refreshing. I also think he's right.


Leake pitched six innings and won for the first time since July 20. Leake in his last three starts had been 0-3 with a 6.00 ERA, and he since decided his control almost was too good. Thus, instead of pounding the zone and consistently being hit, Leake deliberately threw more pitches off the plate Saturday.

“I was trying to be effectively wild instead of being in the zone so much,” Leake said. “I wanted to get early swings, early strikes. I wanted them not knowing when a strike would come.”

[Redsfan320]

http://www.theoriginof.com/images/daily-use-stuff/broom/broom.jpg

http://constructionandmasonrysupply.com/images/straw%20broom.jpg

Forgot these until now.

320

[RedsMan3203]

And more about the Votto ejection...


Votto, the NL’s top hitter at .322, was ejected by plate umpire D.J. Reyburn after disagreeing with a called strike—his fourth ejection in the last two seasons for arguing balls-and-strikes. Baker said Votto had complained about a strike call to Jay Bruce(notes) when he was on deck.

[jojo]

And more about the Votto ejection...

I guess he's getting a reputation.