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reds44
08-24-2010, 12:20 AM
With two of our three lefty hitting OFs hurt, we need to get another lefty bat or two for the bench.
Oh the beauty of having Alosno and Francisco in AAA.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:20 AM
Torres moves to left. Ross in center.

BCubb2003
08-24-2010, 12:21 AM
Reds fans will always remember the Jim Edmonds/Russ Springer Era.

reds44
08-24-2010, 12:21 AM
Reds fans will always remember the Jim Edmonds/Russ Springer Era.
:thumbup:

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 12:21 AM
Reds fans will always remember the Jim Edmonds/Russ Springer Era.

That might be a trivia question some day.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:22 AM
Bruce strikes out swinging.

reds44
08-24-2010, 12:22 AM
I'll always remember Edmonds for that game in Arizona last week. Couldn't have done it without him.

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 12:22 AM
Reds fans will always remember the Jim Edmonds/Russ Springer Era.

See what happens when you get too many little b____s on your team?

RBA
08-24-2010, 12:22 AM
The Reds can start their comeback at any time now.

OesterPoster
08-24-2010, 12:22 AM
Reds fans will always remember the Jim Edmonds/Russ Springer Era.

Sure. When they bring back members of the 2010 World Champion Cincinnati Reds for an anniversary celebration in 2030...and Russ Springer is out there on the field, we can all say, "yes".

reds44
08-24-2010, 12:23 AM
See what happens when you get too many little b____s on your team?
My name is Brandon Phillips, and I approve this message.

That goes for Isringhausen too.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:23 AM
Reds fans will always remember the Jim Edmonds/Russ Springer Era.

Short era. Thank Goodness!

reds44
08-24-2010, 12:23 AM
I wonder what Sarge Jr is doing....

REDSEER
08-24-2010, 12:24 AM
105 pitches for Cain right now.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:24 AM
Hernandez strikes out swinging.

reds44
08-24-2010, 12:24 AM
Well we get two shots at their bullpen.

Mario-Rijo
08-24-2010, 12:25 AM
I wonder what Sarge Jr is doing....

Dealing with multiple injuries IIRC....hurt his foot kicking himself in the backside. ;)

kaldaniels
08-24-2010, 12:25 AM
Yeah piss and moan about Dickersons injury proneness and then go out and trade him for an already hurt 40 year old. Those guys are something.

Care to elaborate?

You state Edmonds was already hurt when the trade went down?
Edmonds will have played in more games than Dickerson this year.
Dickerson is OPSing .596 this year.
Who specifically ware "those guys".

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:26 AM
Janish strikes out looking. 7-2 Giants mid 7th

REDSEER
08-24-2010, 12:27 AM
Cain dealing in that last inning.

Janish K's looking. Cain at 113 pitches.

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 12:28 AM
Care to elaborate?

You state Edmonds was already hurt when the trade went down?
Edmonds will have played in more games than Dickerson this year.
Dickerson is OPSing .596 this year.
Who specifically ware "those guys".

Since the trade, Dickerson is hitting .304/.346/.435 for an OPS of .781 for the Brewers in 9 games played and 27 PAs. See http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/d/dickech01.shtml (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/d/dickech01.shtml).

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:28 AM
Care to elaborate?

You state Edmonds was already hurt when the trade went down?
Edmonds will have played in more games than Dickerson this year.
Dickerson is OPSing .596 this year.
Who specifically ware "those guys".

Yes, he's really tearing up the league.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:29 AM
Uribe strikes out swinging.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:31 AM
Sanchez lines a single to center.

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 12:31 AM
Joe Morgan in the TV booth with the Reds announcers.

REDSEER
08-24-2010, 12:31 AM
We can't get Freddy Sanchez out. Another single; he's 4-4

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:32 AM
Cain sacrifices the runner to 2nd.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:33 AM
Not good, Paul.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:34 AM
Infield hit for Torres.

BCubb2003
08-24-2010, 12:34 AM
The trajectory was off on his cannon.

Screwball
08-24-2010, 12:35 AM
We can't get Freddy Sanchez out. Another single; he's 4-4

He always feasts on our pitching staff. Doesn't matter who it is.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:35 AM
Posey strikes out swinging. 7-2 Giants after 7.

Brutus
08-24-2010, 12:35 AM
Though not a good throw by Janish, I kind of thought Votto's footwork on that was poor and should have still been able to keep his foot down.

RBA
08-24-2010, 12:35 AM
It been a while since a run was scored.

REDSEER
08-24-2010, 12:36 AM
Good work from Bray tonight. He strikes out Posey to end the 7th.

CTA513
08-24-2010, 12:36 AM
He always feasts on our pitching staff. Doesn't matter who it is.

He would be hitting near or over .300 if he was still in the NL central.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:36 AM
Many will howl, but having Joe Morgan in the booth would be a good move for the Reds.

Brutus
08-24-2010, 12:36 AM
Did someone slice up the Rally Onion?

Mario-Rijo
08-24-2010, 12:36 AM
Though not a good throw by Janish, I kind of thought Votto's footwork on that was poor and should have still been able to keep his foot down.

Seriously, I don't see how you could come to that conclusion he was a good foot in the air to reach that ball.

BCubb2003
08-24-2010, 12:37 AM
Reds 2, Giants 2, Volquez 5.

REDSEER
08-24-2010, 12:38 AM
Cain pitching another inning. Let's get to him this time.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:38 AM
Cairo hitting for Bray

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:39 AM
Reds 2, Giants 2, Volquez 5.Just about to mention this. Volquez jsut killed this game. Sorry, guys, but his body language and attitude just turns me completely off. That and his past of using illegal substances and his gun video makes me believe this loose cannon will never be anything but a flash in the pan. Prove me wrong EV.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:39 AM
Cairo grounds out to 3rd.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:40 AM
Phillips lines out to right.

REDSEER
08-24-2010, 12:40 AM
Another lineout for the Reds....this time it's Phillips to right.

CTA513
08-24-2010, 12:41 AM
Cain is still pitching even though he is well over 100 pitches and has a 7-2 lead.

Brutus
08-24-2010, 12:41 AM
Seriously, I don't see how you could come to that conclusion he was a good foot in the air to reach that ball.

It wasn't a foot in the air, it was kicked out in front of the bag because he got his body turned too far to the left. I played first base, I can't explain it very well on here without showing, but he didn't play the ball real well.

I'm not blaming that play on Votto, but just saying with better footwork, could have gotten that.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:41 AM
Cain has retired 13 batters in a row.

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 12:42 AM
An interesting note about our game threads. This is post 550 of tonight's thread, and it was a game that started very late for those of you in the eastern time zone. Last year, by late August, we were doing well to get to 250 posts on a game thread.

CTA513
08-24-2010, 12:42 AM
Just about to mention this. Volquez jsut killed this game. Sorry, guys, but his body language and attitude just turns me completely off. That and his past of using illegal substances and his gun video makes me believe this loose cannon will never be anything but a flash in the pan. Prove me wrong EV.

He would be getting in more trouble if he was a loose cannon.

Kc61
08-24-2010, 12:42 AM
I think we'll see Juan Francisco with the team tomorrow night. Cain is good.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:42 AM
Heisey strikes out swinging. 7-2 Giants mid 8th.

REDSEER
08-24-2010, 12:42 AM
Heisey K's on a good curveball. Cain did tonight what he is expected to do.

Tornon
08-24-2010, 12:43 AM
Alright, now I'm glad we got Volquez out of the way against Cain

pedro
08-24-2010, 12:43 AM
RZ would destroy dusty if he sent a starter back out to pitch the 8th after 113 pitches.

And for you folks whining about Volquez like he's some drug addict, jeez, give it a freaking rest.

CTA513
08-24-2010, 12:43 AM
125 pitches even though he has a 5 run lead.

Kc61
08-24-2010, 12:44 AM
125 pitches even though he has a 5 run lead.


Giants are fighting to save their playoff chances. This is a huge series for them.

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 12:44 AM
125 pitches even though he has a 5 run lead.

And Cain got 7 Ks, 1 BB, and gave up only 5 hits in 8 innings.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:44 AM
Giants are fighting to save their playoff chances. This is a huge series for them.Yes. They are fighting for their lives.

Captain Hook
08-24-2010, 12:44 AM
The Reds haven't had any huge 9th inning comebacks this year.Tonight would be a good night to have one.But they need 6.Extra inning would be brutal for the BP.

Brutus
08-24-2010, 12:45 AM
125 pitches even though he has a 5 run lead.

The pitch count police would crucify Dusty if he did that. Of course, I respect the Giants for it. I don't think it has the dire consequences that people make it out to be.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:45 AM
Cairo in at 2nd. Ondrusek in to pitch

Tornon
08-24-2010, 12:45 AM
I think the home plate ump wants to go home

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:45 AM
Huff homers to right. 8-2 Giants.

Brutus
08-24-2010, 12:45 AM
I think the home plate ump wants to go home

So does Ondrusek. lol

CTA513
08-24-2010, 12:46 AM
Giants are fighting to save their playoff chances. This is a huge series for them.

If the Giants bullpen can't hold a 5 run lead then they have problems.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:47 AM
Ross singles to center.

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 12:47 AM
If the Giants bullpen can't hold a 5 run lead then they have problems.

Umm, it's a six run lead after the Huff homer.

Tornon
08-24-2010, 12:47 AM
If Logan was going to have an off-night, this is a nice time to do it

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:47 AM
RZ would destroy dusty if he sent a starter back out to pitch the 8th after 113 pitches.

And for you folks whining about Volquez like he's some drug addict, jeez, give it a freaking rest.Pedro, it's a pattern of behavior, not him being a drug addict. He's obviously not. But there was a reason Texas let him go. I can imagine the wide-eyed GM down there when we offered Josh Hamilton for Volquez. He probably had an orgasm on the spot. Hamilton was a risk, but so was Volquez. They won and the future is not certain, but so far we have lost.

And as Cody Ross singles, I am reminded we will never get rid of the curse of bad moves. You just never know.

Brutus
08-24-2010, 12:48 AM
If the Giants bullpen can't hold a 5 run lead then they have problems.

Matt Cain seems to think he's fully capable of pulling it off without problems. Why should anyone question what he's physically capable of?

kaldaniels
08-24-2010, 12:49 AM
Matt Cain seems to think he's fully capable of pulling it off without problems. Why should anyone question what he's physically capable of?

Arbitrary numbers Brutus...get with the program. :cool:

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:49 AM
Schierholtz doubles to right. 2nd and 3rd.

Kc61
08-24-2010, 12:49 AM
Ondrusek about to destroy a pretty good ERA.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:50 AM
Logan getting blitzed

REDSEER
08-24-2010, 12:50 AM
This game could end any time now. Just get Ondrusek through the inning.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:50 AM
They need to keep Ondrusek in no matter how bad this gets. No use wasting any more pitchers tonight.

Brutus
08-24-2010, 12:50 AM
Arbitrary numbers Brutus...get with the program. :cool:

Arbitrary indeed. Yessiree Bob.

CTA513
08-24-2010, 12:50 AM
Pedro, it's a pattern of behavior, not him being a drug addict. He's obviously not. But there was a reason Texas let him go. I can imagine the wide-eyed GM down there when we offered Josh Hamilton for Volquez. He probably had an orgasm on the spot. Hamilton was a risk, but so was Volquez. They won and the future is not certain, but so far we have lost.

And as Cody Ross singles, I am reminded we will never get rid of the curse of bad moves. You just never know.


Hamilton was the bigger risk because he really was a drug addict.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:51 AM
They need to keep Ondrusek in no matter how bad this gets. No use wasting any more pitchers tonight.Absolutely. This game is over. In fact, it was over in the first inning. Let him finish this one out.

pedro
08-24-2010, 12:51 AM
Pedro, it's a pattern of behavior, not him being a drug addict. He's obviously not. But there was a reason Texas let him go. I can imagine the wide-eyed GM down there when we offered Josh Hamilton for Volquez. He probably had an orgasm on the spot. Hamilton was a risk, but so was Volquez. They won and the future is not certain, but so far we have lost.

And as Cody Ross singles, I am reminded we will never get rid of the curse of bad moves. You just never know.

Pitchers get hurt. Happens all the time. When he was healthy he was very good.

As for Hamilton, where were all his proponents when he was sucking last year? He's a nice player but he's plays in a great hitters park and has been very very very BABIP lucky. He's having a great year, but don't expect this level of performance as a norm.

Reds Fanatic
08-24-2010, 12:52 AM
Time to go to bed. 10-2 Giants.

CTA513
08-24-2010, 12:52 AM
Matt Cain seems to think he's fully capable of pulling it off without problems. Why should anyone question what he's physically capable of?

Let him pitch the 9th then.

Tornon
08-24-2010, 12:53 AM
In fact, it was over in the first inning.

I dunno about that, we could have easily scored 6 runs

CTA513
08-24-2010, 12:54 AM
Bray goes 2 scoreless and Ondrusek has already given up 3 runs with 0 outs.

Kc61
08-24-2010, 12:54 AM
Logan really having trouble tonight.

Reds look like a team that's been on the road too long. They need to win at least one this series, they'd better be ready to go tomorrow.

reds44
08-24-2010, 12:55 AM
The pitch count police would crucify Dusty if he did that. Of course, I respect the Giants for it. I don't think it has the dire consequences that people make it out to be.
And deservedly so. With a 5 run lead in the 8th inning in a huge ballpark, there was no reason to send him back out there.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 12:57 AM
Pitchers get hurt. Happens all the time. When he was healthy he was very good.

As for Hamilton, where were all his proponents when he was sucking last year? He's a nice player but he's plays in a great hitters park and has been very very very BABIP lucky. He's having a great year, but don't expect this level of performance as a norm.Last year he played 89 games and hit better than 3/4 of our outfield. His replacements were Corey Patterson and Willy Taveras, neither of which could match his 54 RBI's in the year he played in Cincy.

Yeah, he sucked but not as bad as what we replaced him with.

reds44
08-24-2010, 12:58 AM
Pedro, it's a pattern of behavior, not him being a drug addict. He's obviously not. But there was a reason Texas let him go. I can imagine the wide-eyed GM down there when we offered Josh Hamilton for Volquez. He probably had an orgasm on the spot. Hamilton was a risk, but so was Volquez. They won and the future is not certain, but so far we have lost.

And as Cody Ross singles, I am reminded we will never get rid of the curse of bad moves. You just never know.
Honestly, this is painful to read. Volquez got back from TJ ahead of schedule. You think that was by accident? Did he fall out of bed one morning and all of a sudden he was ahead of schedule?

The pattern of behavior line is absolutely bogus. Volquez has had no behavior problems since coming to Cincinnati, and anybody who says anything else is flat out lying.

pedro
08-24-2010, 01:01 AM
Honestly, this is painful to read. Volquez got back from TJ ahead of schedule. You think that was by accident?

The pattern of behavior line is absolutely bogus. Volquez has had no behavior problems since coming to Cincinnati, and anybody who says anything else is flat out lying.

Exactly.

Plus if he's guilty of anything substance related it's because he was trying to recover from his injury. Completely bogus attack IMO.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 01:01 AM
Honestly, this is painful to read. Volquez got back from TJ ahead of schedule. You think that was by accident?

The pattern of behavior line is absolutely bogus. Volquez has had no behavior problems since coming to Cincinnati, and anybody who says anything else is flat out lying.It's well documented, but drink the Kool Aid. I don't care one way or the other. He was forced back with the use of drug enhanced medication and an organization that needed him back. And then he lied and said he was trying to have children (or at least that's what was reported). Truth is, after the AS game two years ago, he has been less than an average pitcher. Makes no difference either way. He's prolbably a good kid, but I expect nothing from him here. That's jsut my opinion. I do not worship any player that wears the Reds uniform. Sometimes they fail.

reds44
08-24-2010, 01:02 AM
Exactly.

Plus if he's guilty of anything substance related it's because he was trying to recover from his injury. Completely bogus attack IMO.
Yup. Testing positive for HGH while coming back from TJ surgery is not a pattern of behavior.

Getting yourself suspended multiple times (once for an entire season and having to apply to be reinstated into baseball) for beign a crackhead, is a pattern of behavior.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 01:03 AM
Exactly.

Plus if he's guilty of anything substance related it's because he was trying to recover from his injury. Completely bogus attack IMO.Not an attack, Pedro. I just don't have faith that he'll be anything more than what he is now and I hope you prove me wrong. His suspension and all that is well documented and nothing else needs to be said on that.

reds44
08-24-2010, 01:04 AM
It's well documented, but drink the Kool Aid. I don't care one way or the other. He was forced back with the use of drug enhanced medication and an organization that needed him back. And then he lied and said he was trying to have children (or at least that's what was reported). Truth is, after the AS game two years ago, he has been less than an average pitcher. Makes no difference either way. He's prolbably a good kid, but I expect nothing from him here. That's jsut my opinion. I do not worship any player that wears the Reds uniform. Sometimes they fail.
Nothing is well documented. Nothing at all. Show me what you're talking about. It's not there.

He took HGH and then lied about what he did? Yeah, nobody has ever done that before. Andy Pettitie and A-Rod did the exact same thing, is that a pattern of behavior?

If you think he's pitching bad, fine, but don't just make stuff up.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 01:05 AM
Mercifly, it's over.

And for those that think I was attacking EV, no. What is well documented is the suspension and then the gun video which everyone is willing to just forgive. That is NOT made up and if you think it is, then your're making things up.

Brutus
08-24-2010, 01:07 AM
And deservedly so. With a 5 run lead in the 8th inning in a huge ballpark, there was no reason to send him back out there.

Based on what? The idea that's been drilled into your head that the arbitrary 100 pitches is the dropdead point for pitchers?

kaldaniels
08-24-2010, 01:08 AM
Exactly.

Plus if he's guilty of anything substance related it's because he was trying to recover from his injury. Completely bogus attack IMO.

Edinson said he tested postitive because he was trying to start a family. So either you are wrong or Edinson was lying. Pick one.

I only add this because we don't know the details of his failed drug test.

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 01:08 AM
EV was suspended for taking a banned female fertility drug, not HGH. I'm just thankful the drug didn't work: no player in MLB history has ever gone on the DL for being pregnant, and we don't want EV to be the 1st. ;)

pedro
08-24-2010, 01:10 AM
Mercifly, it's over.

And for those that think I was attacking EV, no. What is well documented is the suspension and then the gun video which everyone is willing to just forgive. That is NOT made up and if you think it is, then your're making things up.

Oh give it a rest.

The only one with a "pattern of behavior" was Josh Hamilton and the Reds decided it was too big a risk so they cashed in their chips. I'm super glad that Josh has only relapsed once since the trade and has seemed to hold it together. Good for him and Texas. It's a hard hard road. But it wasn't a bad trade then and it's not a bad trade now, no matter how uncomfortable hip hop videos make you.

reds44
08-24-2010, 01:10 AM
Mercifly, it's over.

And for those that think I was attacking EV, no. What is well documented is the suspension and then the gun video which everyone is willing to just forgive. That is NOT made up and if you think it is, then your're making things up.
Neither have anything to do with each other. Is taking HGH some new gang banger thing that I've been missing out on?

Has Volquez been in trouble with the law ever? Ever? Anywhere?

The fact that you're mentioning this when talking about Josh Hamilton makes it even worse.

Just because Volquez has a baggy uniform and wierd hair does not make him a thug or mean he's lazy or has a bad attitude. Nor does taking HGH. Does anybody even care about the gun thing? Since when was that an issues?

Doing what Josh Hamilton did is a patteron of behavior.

Tornon
08-24-2010, 01:11 AM
Get today out of the way, I really like our pitching matchup tomorrow and then Wednesday should be a good ol' 2-1 game, just a matter of what side we'll be on

reds44
08-24-2010, 01:12 AM
Oh give it a rest.

The only one with a "pattern of behavior" was Josh Hamilton and the Reds decided it was too big a risk so they cashed in their chips. I'm super glad that Josh has only relapsed once since the trade and has seemed to hold it together. Good for him and Texas. It's a hard hard road. But it wasn't a bad trade then and it's not a bad trade now, no matter how uncomfortable hip hop videos make you.
There's such a GIGANTIC elephant on redszone that I'm not going to open up.

But with the way SOME reds fan talk about Phillips and now Volquez it just makes you think. I've even see people bring it up with Cueto.

pedro
08-24-2010, 01:12 AM
Edinson said he tested postitive because he was trying to start a family. So either you are wrong or Edinson was lying. Pick one.

I only add this because we don't know the details of his failed drug test.

That's my point, if he wasn't trying to do it to start a family and was lying then he was doing it to recover faster. Just not a big deal either way IMO.

reds44
08-24-2010, 01:13 AM
That's my point, if he wasn't trying to do it to start a family and was lying then he was doing it to recover faster. Just not a big deal either way IMO.
Both are which signs of being a bad guy and/or being lazy.

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 01:14 AM
And we know it wasn't HGH. There is a new test for HGH that they are just now starting to use on minor leaguers (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/23/sports/baseball/23doping.html). Up till now, HGH could not be detected.

kaldaniels
08-24-2010, 01:14 AM
There's such a GIGANTIC elephant on redszone that I'm not going to open up.

But with the way SOME reds fan talk about Phillips and now Volquez it just makes you think.

I'm gonna call it a night after this one folks, but for crying out loud you did just drop the race card.

Tornon
08-24-2010, 01:15 AM
There's such a GIGANTIC elephant on redszone that I'm not going to open up.



I'm slightly curious.. how do you open an elephant?

mbgrayson
08-24-2010, 01:16 AM
I'm slightly curious.. how do you open an elephant?

I forget.....

reds44
08-24-2010, 01:17 AM
I'm slightly curious.. how do you open an elephant?
I mixed up the elephant one with the can of worms, it's late.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 01:20 AM
Neither have anything to do with each other. Is taking HGH some new gang banger thing that I've been missing out on?

Has Volquez been in trouble with the law ever? Ever? Anywhere?

The fact that you're mentioning this when talking about Josh Hamilton makes it even worse.

Just because Volquez has a baggy uniform and wierd hair does not make him a thug or mean he's lazy or has a bad attitude. Nor does taking HGH. Does anybody even care about the gun thing? Since when was that an issues?

Doing what Josh Hamilton did is a patteron of behavior.

Totally agree on Hamilton, but there is something wrong here. I'm not trying to crucify EV--for some reason it morphed into that. Truth is I think it was a bad trade. I always will. As I've said over and over, I don't expect much from him. That's just me. As for the "pattern of behavior," you're young. I've been taught to watch body language and that coupled with some other things give me a bad feeling. That's all. I certainly hope I'm wrong, but I fear I am not.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 01:24 AM
I'm gonna call it a night after this one folks, but for crying out loud you did just drop the race card.I hope not, because that's not the case here and never will be. Even to bring that up is simply ludicrous. Time to skip the game threads for awhile. Holy Crap. Attitude is attitude and it has nothing to do with that.

pedro
08-24-2010, 01:25 AM
Totally agree on Hamilton, but there is something wrong here. I'm not trying to crucify EV--for some reason it morphed into that. Truth is I think it was a bad trade. I always will. As I've said over and over, I don't expect much from him. That's just me. As for the "pattern of behavior," you're young. I've been taught to watch body language and that coupled with some other things give me a bad feeling. That's all. I certainly hope I'm wrong, but I fear I am not.

Well I'm not young and in my life I've had the misfortune to know a number of junkies. So no, it was not a bad trade, even if doesn't work out. Josh Hamilton stole from his grandmother to buy drugs. This is documented fact. Don't tell me about freaking "body language".

reds44
08-24-2010, 01:32 AM
I just don't get why people are looking for stuff on Volquez that's just not there. It's just not. You're stretching stuff way out and I don't get why. Volquez managed to have a great season, bad body language and all.

Manny Ramirez has about the worst body language ever, and he's one of the greatest hitters ever and has a World Series ring. Ever watch Eli Manning play QB?

Look, there's a reason Brandon Phillips is the whipping boy of Reds fans. There's a reason why he gets bagged for not hustling and I watched Gomes not hustle on back to back plays on the bases and hardly anything is said about it. There's a reason people liked Votto's comments and Phillips was made out to be a scapegoat for us getting swept.

There's a reason why this is being brought up with Volquez.

There was a game thread earlier this year were posters were getting on Volquez and Cueto for their hair and the uniforms and saying they looked like "dirt bags" and somebody brought up Arroyo and the posters didn't have a problem with it.

It is what it is.

Just stick to how people are preforming on the field and everything is fine. Don't try to read into body language or how people wear their uniforms or how they look. That's where people start crossing lines, and none of that has anything to do with baseball.

And just to be clear WV, I'm not talking about you. I'm talking about the attitude of Reds fans as a whole. I've seen it on redszone and I've seen it on twitter.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 01:36 AM
Well I'm not young and in my life I've had the misfortune to know a number of junkies. So no, it was not a bad trade, even if doesn't work out. Josh Hamilton stole from his grandmother to buy drugs. This is documented fact. Don't tell me about freaking "body language".No, the body language has nothing to do with drugs, but I'm a trained professional in such things, and I do not like what I see. And I agree with the sins of Josh Hamilton, but I'd like to have his bat in this lineup. Regardless, it is not going to happen and that's over. If Josh Hamilton wins the triple crown, plays tremendous defense and dominates his league and EV continues to flourish, is it still a good trade? I don't think so, but minds are made up and there is no use to continue this argument. We'll just have to agree to disagree, but I resent the race card being brought up, That cuts me to the bone,

reds44
08-24-2010, 01:42 AM
I just don't think you can go back now because Volquez got hurt and Hamilton stayed clean and called it a bad trade.

Volquez was a REALLY GOOD starting pitcher before he blew his arm out. It's not like Volquez never showed his potential, he did for an entire season.

There's no doubt that the trade is working out better for the Rangers right now, but that doesn't make it a bad trade, IMO.

pedro
08-24-2010, 01:44 AM
No, the body language has nothing to do with drugs, but I'm a trained professional in such things, and I do not like what I see. And I agree with the sins of Josh Hamilton, but I'd like to have his bat in this lineup. Regardless, it is not going to happen and that's over. If Josh Hamilton wins the triple crown, plays tremendous defense and dominates his league and EV continues to flourish, is it still a good trade? I don't think so, but minds are made up and there is no use to continue this argument. We'll just have to agree to disagree, but I resent the race card being brought up, That cuts me to the bone,

It was a good trade because the chances of any one who had sunk to the depths that Josh Hamilton had of ever staying clean was and still is remarkably small. It has nothing to do with his talent. I truly hope he has a long a great career, but honestly, he's still just as likely to fall off the wagon this offseason and be thrown out of baseball forever. I have plentiful and direct experience with people with similar behavior problems and falling off the wagon is a huge huge risk and always will be for the rest of Josh's life. That's just a fact.

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 01:46 AM
I just don't get why people are looking for stuff on Volquez that's just not there. It's just not. You're stretching stuff way out and I don't get why. Volquez managed to have a great season, bad body language and all.

Manny Ramirez has about the worst body language ever, and he's one of the greatest hitters ever and has a World Series ring. Ever watch Eli Manning play QB?

Look, there's a reason Brandon Phillips is the whipping boy of Reds fans. There's a reason why he gets bagged for not hustling and I watched Gomes not hustle on back to back plays on the bases and hardly anything is said about it. There's a reason people liked Votto's comments and Phillips was made out to be a scapegoat for us getting swept.

There's a reason why this is being brought up with Volquez.

There was a game thread earlier this year were posters were getting on Volquez and Cueto for their hair and the uniforms and saying they looked like "dirt bags" and somebody brought up Arroyo and the posters didn't have a problem with it.

It is what it is.

Just stick to how people are preforming on the field and everything is fine. Don't try to read into body language or how people wear their uniforms or how they look. That's where people start crossing lines, and none of that has anything to do with baseball.

And just to be clear WV, I'm not talking about you. I'm talking about the attitude of Reds fans as a whole. I've seen it on redszone and I've seen it on twitter.

That's not me and never will be. I hope you know that. My only concern is that I see some toubling traits in Edinson. His performance after the 2008 AS game has been less than stellar and his performane after his TJ problems is the fault of the Reds management who brought him back too early IMHO.

As a Reds fan, no one wants him to be successful more than me. I want him to dominate, but I don't see this young man with all the ability in the world being be mentally able to reach that level and that's why I fear for his future. I can't see him being the dominator he should be. Like I've said over and over, I hope i'm wrong. Like Johnny Cueto, there is a lack of maturity here. Cueto and EV have a chance to overcome this and I hope they do. I guess we just have to watch them grow and hopefully they will grow into what we want them to be.

Peace.

reds44
08-24-2010, 01:47 AM
That's not me and never will be. I hope you know that. My only concern is that I see some toubling traits in Edinson. His performance after the 2008 AS game has been less than stellar and his performane after his TJ problems is the fault of the Reds management who brought him back too early IMHO.

As a Reds fan, no one wants him to be successful more than me. I want him to dominate, but I don't see this young man with all the ability in the world being be mentally able to reach that level and that's why I fear for his future. I can't see him being the dominator he should be. Like I've said over and over, I hope i'm wrong. Like Johnny Cueto, there is a lack of maturity here. Cueto and EV have a chance to overcome this and I hope they do. I guess we just have to watch them grow and hopefully they will grow into what we want them to be.

Peace.
Fair enough. No problem with any of this lol

WVRedsFan
08-24-2010, 01:51 AM
It was a good trade because the chances of any one who had sunk to the depths that Josh Hamilton had of ever staying clean was and still is remarkably small. It has nothing to do with his talent. I truly hope he has a long a great career, but honestly, he's still just as likely to fall off the wagon this offseason and be thrown out of baseball forever. I have plentiful and direct experience with people with similar behavior problems and falling off the wagon is a huge huge risk and always will be for the rest of Josh's life. That's just a fact.

I have some of the same experience and i agree. But I just believe that EV will never reach his potential. And I never meant to relate JH's drug use to EV's use of fertility drugs. Just the problem of internet boards. I still stand by my beliefs, but maybe I'm wrong. I just don't like what I see.

Slyder
08-24-2010, 02:37 AM
Can we please take Volquez out of the rotation and use him out of the pen once September 1 rolls around? Its clear he's not "back" yet. Instead of beating our collective heads against the wall let him go to the pen then if he's off yank him quickly without taxing the rest of the pen for 8 innings.

Said it since the season started any contribution we get from Volquez this year is gravy, the goal should be getting him to spring training 2011 strong and healthy.

BuckeyeRedleg
08-24-2010, 08:15 AM
This game reminded me of the first game of the Cards series.

Hopefully games two and three are different.

Red in Chicago
08-24-2010, 12:58 PM
If you wish to continue discussing the merits of the EV / JH trade, please start another thread in ORG.


This game reminded me of the first game of the Cards series.

Hopefully games two and three are different.

I tried politely to have the EV for JH trade discussions stopped about halfway through the game thread. Unfortunately, 3 or 4 posters chose to ignore this and pretty much take the game thread hostage with their opinions.