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View Full Version : The #1 guy the Reds should target this off season is?



fewfirstchoice
11-27-2010, 10:13 AM
Jacoby Ellsbury of the Red Sox.

The team and player have a strained relationship and the Sox would to restock the roster according to MLTR. So id pony up a decent package for him. Hes only 27 and he isnt a free agent until after 2014.

mattfeet
11-27-2010, 11:58 AM
Id be on board with this.

-Matt

Natty Redlocks
11-27-2010, 01:02 PM
I don't know, he really only had the one great year where his high OBP was average-driven. He really seems like another Juan Pierre to me. I'd rather have Figgins.

Vottomatic
11-27-2010, 04:53 PM
My wish list:

1. I'd love to pry Choo from Cleveland. Stick him LF or CF and make him the leadoff guy.
2. I'd love to swap big contracts with the Mets. Either Cordero for Beltran and Ca$h from the Mets, or some other big contract swap for Beltran. Beltran is going to be in a contract year and we all saw what Beltre (Red Sox) did last season to rebuild his career. Beltran is only 32 right now. Stick him behind Votto. Beltran is a switch hitter, I believe.
3. Or swap Cordero and Phillips for Beltran and Reyes and prospects. All 4 main players are in the last year of their contracts. Basically a change of scenery/positions of need trade, where the Mets pick up some future prospects too.

If I could obtain Beltran AND Choo, I would. I'd keep Stubbs for the season after and as insurance if Beltran got hurt. Make Stubbs an occasional starter, pinch runner, and late inning defensive substitute. When Beltran has a big year and we can't afford him the next season, Stubbs goes back as the CF starter. And hopefully Bruce or someone else emerges as Beltran's replacement in the batting order.

RedLakerFan24
11-27-2010, 05:26 PM
My Wish List

1. Choo
2. Jose Reyes
3. Jacoby Ellsbury

Vottomatic
11-27-2010, 05:49 PM
My Wish List

1. Choo
2. Jose Reyes
3. Jacoby Ellsbury

Yeah, I meant to add Ellsbury to the list. Either he or Choo would be fine for leadoff.

Hondo
11-27-2010, 07:01 PM
Well my list is simple.

Sign Free Agent Left Fielder Carl Crawford to a 5 year 90 Million Dollar Deal.

This solves the Left Field Defense Problem. This solves the Lead Off Hitter Problem which will trickle down all the way through the Line Up. More people on Base for Votto, Rolen, Phillips, Bruce to drive in...

I know everyone will say the team cannot afford him. Well with Cabrera & Harang coming off the Books, and even with the raises going to Bruce & Company... This team needs to sign Crawford, and then Trade Cordero to whoever needs a closer who will take the Salary.

The team got playoff revenues and should Invest that money along with Harangs salary into Carl Crawford.

krm1580
11-29-2010, 02:02 PM
I don't know, he really only had the one great year where his high OBP was average-driven. He really seems like another Juan Pierre to me. I'd rather have Figgins.

I don't really get all the interest in Ellsbury either. The guy became a name because he had a good Sept/Oct in 2007 and hit .438 in the WS.

Outside of stealing bases I don't see much. He does not have much power, does not walk much, his OBP is not real great. Everybody kills Gomes, but his OPS this year was .012 lower than Ellsbury's career high.

If the Reds can get him for dirt cheap I have no issues with it, but I certainly do not see enough to warrant trading top prospects for him.

757690
11-29-2010, 08:05 PM
I don't really get all the interest in Ellsbury either. The guy became a name because he had a good Sept/Oct in 2007 and hit .438 in the WS.

Outside of stealing bases I don't see much. He does not have much power, does not walk much, his OBP is not real great. Everybody kills Gomes, but his OPS this year was .012 lower than Ellsbury's career high.

If the Reds can get him for dirt cheap I have no issues with it, but I certainly do not see enough to warrant trading top prospects for him.

Ellsbury is an above average defensive CF. Those are rare. Those that can OPS close to what Gomes can, are rarer.

Defense included, Ellsbury is about a league average CF, Gomes is tick above a replacement level LF.

Ellsbury also fits a Reds need of a leadoff hitter. He can OBP around .350, and steal bases. He's no Rickey Henderson, or even a Carl Crawford, but he is a big upgrade over Gomes and whoever the Reds would leadoff next season.

757690
11-29-2010, 08:08 PM
I don't know, he really only had the one great year where his high OBP was average-driven. He really seems like another Juan Pierre to me. I'd rather have Figgins.

Just for the record, Juan Pierre, in his prime would be a solid option for the Reds in LF. His problems was that he was way overpaid, not that he wasn't any good. He was at least a league average LF during his best years.

Hondo
11-29-2010, 08:43 PM
Just for the record, Juan Pierre, in his prime would be a solid option for the Reds in LF. His problems was that he was way overpaid, not that he wasn't any good. He was at least a league average LF during his best years.

This team just needs to take the savings from Harangs Salary and Cabrera's Salary and the Revenue from the Playoffs into Carl Crawford and Give him a 5 Year Contract for $90 Million. This team has control of Joey Votto for 3 more years and Jay Bruce for 3 more years so by the time the Reds are in the 4th year for Crawfords Contract, Arroyo will be off the Books and Hernandez will be off the Books so the Reds can give Joey a LTC at that time...

Carl Crawford is left handed hitting and the Lead Off Hitter this team needs and will probably be a 25 Homerun Lead Off Hitter in GAB

If this team wants to Improve. Sign Crawford. Don't give me the Payroll debate. Aaron Harangs Salary is no more and even with Payroll Raises for Votto, Bruce, etc... This team can work Carl Crawford and $15 Million into the 2011 Season Payroll... Give him a Bonus and back load it.

lonewolf371
11-29-2010, 11:27 PM
The Reds aren't going to sign Crawford. Or Werth, for that matter.

webbbj
11-30-2010, 12:02 AM
as sweet is may be to have the reds offer 5/90 to crawford, the yanks, sox, angels or who ever just will increase the bid somemore.

the reds best chance to get a decent upgrade is through trade. we can find a platoon in FA maybe a diamond in the ruff but we just aint signing a bonafide perrennial allstar.

Vottomatic
11-30-2010, 01:51 AM
Jose Guillen

He could get our whole team jacked up on HGH and even Janish could hit 30 HR's. Hehehe.

krm1580
11-30-2010, 11:59 AM
Ellsbury is an above average defensive CF. Those are rare. Those that can OPS close to what Gomes can, are rarer.

Defense included, Ellsbury is about a league average CF, Gomes is tick above a replacement level LF.

Ellsbury also fits a Reds need of a leadoff hitter. He can OBP around .350, and steal bases. He's no Rickey Henderson, or even a Carl Crawford, but he is a big upgrade over Gomes and whoever the Reds would leadoff next season.

If the Reds did not currently have an above average CF you would make a valid point. The problem is they do and you have to look at Ellsbury as a LF, not a CF.

As a LF, Ellsbury is not a whole lot better than what the Reds have. As a leadoff hitter his best full season was pretty much Brandon Phillips this year so again I don't see much of an upgrade other than SBs.

I am not saying I don't like him. I am not saying I would not want him. What I am saying is I would not trade away a top prospect, much less multiple top prospects as some people have proposed for a guy that does not improve the team all that much.

Girevik
11-30-2010, 01:49 PM
I'm not sure sur $90M for 5 would get it done for Crawford. I'd guess he's sign for closer to $20M a year, and may well get 6 years to boot.

757690
11-30-2010, 02:09 PM
If the Reds did not currently have an above average CF you would make a valid point. The problem is they do and you have to look at Ellsbury as a LF, not a CF.

As a LF, Ellsbury is not a whole lot better than what the Reds have. As a leadoff hitter his best full season was pretty much Brandon Phillips this year so again I don't see much of an upgrade other than SBs.

I am not saying I don't like him. I am not saying I would not want him. What I am saying is I would not trade away a top prospect, much less multiple top prospects as some people have proposed for a guy that does not improve the team all that much.

.244 .306 .378 .684

That what the Reds leadoff hitters did last season.

.251 .302 .394 .695

That's what Phillips did as the leadoff hitter last season.

.291 .344 .405 .749

This is Ellsbury's career slash line.

That's a big upgrade, imo, and well worth a top prospect. I would think that Ellsbury could add 3 wins to the Reds next season if playing LF and leading off. That's big for one player.

krm1580
11-30-2010, 03:22 PM
.244 .306 .378 .684

That what the Reds leadoff hitters did last season.

.251 .302 .394 .695

That's what Phillips did as the leadoff hitter last season.

.291 .344 .405 .749

This is Ellsbury's career slash line.

That's a big upgrade, imo, and well worth a top prospect. I would think that Ellsbury could add 3 wins to the Reds next season if playing LF and leading off. That's big for one player.

I guess that is one way to look at it.

I see it as replacing a guy who OPSd .758 last year with a guy who's career OPS is .749 which does not seem like enough of an upgrade that I would move top prospects for.

We just have a difference of opinion

Hondo
11-30-2010, 06:10 PM
The Reds have 48.29 Million committed to 8 players next year with $1 Million of Ramon Hernandez contract deferred.

So that means Francisco Cordero ($12 million), Bronson Arroyo ($11.5 million), Brandon Phillips ($11 million) Scott Rolen ($6.5 million), Hernandez ($3 million, with $1 million deferred) Jonny Gomes ($1.75 million), Nick Masset ($1.54 million) and Aroldis Chapman ($1 million).

So that is 47.29 Million committed to those 8 players.

Arbitration cases are Joey Votto, Jay Bruce, Edinson Volquez and Johnny Cueto which will probably be another 15-16 Million.

The Payroll was 76 Million last year and they have already said there will be a slight increase so if you go with even 10% that gives you around 84 Million for 2011.

So that puts you at 63.29 Million towards 12 players.

Having 21 Million left to spend on 13 players.

Bailey, Leake, Wood, Ondrusek, Hanigan, Janish, Stubbs are all going to be in the 425,000 range give or take. So that is about 3 Million on those 7 players.

So that puts you at 66.29 Basically on 20 players for 2010

Having 18 Million left on 5 Players.

Now you put 15 Million Base Salary for Carl Crawford for the 2010 Season Alone, knowing that he will probably be around 18 Million per year for the life of the Contract.

Everyone knows I think 5 years/90 Million gets it done. Close to Tori Hunter/Jason Bay Dollars and years.

That would leave you with 3 Million for 4 players left.

Bringing back Cairo for around $500,000 leaves you with 2.5 Million for 3 players.

This Adds a Lead off Hitter and this team Pummels the opponent in Runs more times than not.

Now I would still like the Reds to Trade Edinson Volquez and get back Zach Greinke by throwing another 3 prospects at the Royals. Greinke makes 13.5 Million Next year but you will be around 11 Million difference after the Trade.

Now the Reds Trade Cordero as a Salary Dump and this team is stronger for 2011 and beyond.

Thanks for your time in reading my ideas.

Kingspoint
11-30-2010, 08:50 PM
Id be on board with this.

-MattMe, too.

smixsell
12-01-2010, 06:40 PM
My Wish List

1. Choo
2. Jose Reyes
3. Jacoby Ellsbury


Choo would be a dream sighning. He has ALL the tools and seems to have a great attitude: a real pro and a "gamer." Kind of like a Korean Matsui, only younger. :)

Speaking of Matsui, wouldn't mind having him, but I doubt he'd want to leave the west coast.

Vottomatic
12-01-2010, 11:41 PM
CF Choo
2B Phillips
1B Votto
LF Beltran
RF Bruce
3B Rolen
SS Janish
C Hernanigan

RedLakerFan24
12-02-2010, 05:37 AM
What about Span???, the twins would most likely lose Pavano to FA, so what about a trade Volquez for Span, he could be a real good lead off hitter for us, Move Span or Stubbs to Left.

Vottomatic
12-02-2010, 02:48 PM
What about Span???, the twins would most likely lose Pavano to FA, so what about a trade Volquez for Span, he could be a real good lead off hitter for us, Move Span or Stubbs to Left.

Span hit .310 in 2009, but dropped to .264 last season. His OPS is under .700. Not good.

Not impressed. I'd rather have Choo.

WillRich
12-02-2010, 11:14 PM
What about Ian Desmond. He is a good shortstop with a lot of upside. The Nationals would more than likely part ways with him for maybe Mike Leake or another pitcher. The 25 year old hit 269/.308/.392 in his first season of work, he had a few problems in the field but a guy with this kind of potential could really blossom in this environment. If not Desmond I would personally be interested in a deal for Stephen Drew and or Chris Young, the price tag for the combo may be a little high, but if it comes down to it. I'll take Drew alone