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Redsfan320
01-28-2011, 09:54 AM
Per Fay. http://cincinnati.com/blogs/reds/2011/01/28/spring-training-invitees/

Everyone on the 40-man (http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/team/roster_40man.jsp?c_id=cin) plus:

RHP Scott Carroll,
RHP Jerry Gil,
LHP Jeremy Horst,
LHP Donnie Joseph,
RHP Matt Klinker,
RHP Justin Lehr,
RHP Chad Reineke,
LHP Dontrelle Willis,
C Chris Denove,
C Devin Mesoraco,
C Corky Miller,
OF Danny Dorn,
OF Jeremy Hermida,
OF Dave Sappelt.

I'll have #s as soon as I find them. Reds.com hasn't updated things yet, only Fay has anything so far.

320

NJReds
01-28-2011, 10:45 AM
I'd love to see Dorn and Frazier break through in ST.

lollipopcurve
01-28-2011, 10:48 AM
Curious about whether Gil will get any buzz. Supposedly has a very live arm.

Edd Roush
01-28-2011, 11:00 AM
Barton is the only name I am surprised is not on that list. I thought the Reds would give him a chance to join the left field competition.

Redsfan320
01-28-2011, 11:02 AM
http://cincinnati.com/blogs/reds/files/2011/01/Screen-shot-2011-01-28-at-10.09.00-AM.png

Per Fay.

320

OnBaseMachine
01-28-2011, 11:20 AM
LHP Donnie Joseph is a guy I could see having a great spring and making it tough on the Reds to send him out...but with so many lefties already in camp, it's unlikely he would make the Opening Day roster. He's got a filthy slider to go along with a fastball and dominated the minors last season with a 2.08 ERA and 25 BB/103 K (14.3 K/9) in 65 innings between A, A+, and AA. I suspect we'll see him in Cincinnati at some point this season.

RedsManRick
01-28-2011, 12:28 PM
Curious about whether Gil will get any buzz. Supposedly has a very live arm.

Was surprised to see him as well. Live arm, yes. But he also seems to have no control. I wonder if it was more about getting a chance for the major league staff (Price) to spend some time with him.

Also good to see Negron get the call. I assume this is his first?

Roy Tucker
01-28-2011, 12:35 PM
Ahhhh, the first hint of that spring air and the crack of a bat.

A nice thought on this cold and gray January day.

lollipopcurve
01-28-2011, 01:10 PM
Also good to see Negron get the call. I assume this is his first?

He's on the 40-man, so he was automatic. Yes, it's his 1st major league ST.

JaxRed
01-28-2011, 04:35 PM
I thought Gil was a Minor League FA this off-season. If so getting an invite is part of the deal to intice him back. Dorn is the one that suprises me. Wasn't a FA, so he "earned" his invite.

cinreds21
01-28-2011, 06:20 PM
Gil has a nice changeup. He's getting better as a pitcher. He's less than two years from being a hitter, remember.

camisadelgolf
01-28-2011, 06:26 PM
Does anyone else think it's funny that Renteria is listed a SS and Janish an INF?

Redsfan320
01-28-2011, 07:21 PM
Does anyone else think it's funny that Renteria is listed a SS and Janish an INF?

RR is the only infielder or outfielder who has a more specific position listed that "infield" or "outfield". Kinda irritating. Really no reason for it??

320

camisadelgolf
01-28-2011, 07:56 PM
To be fair, he has played only one inning of his baseball career away from shortstop. He's the only one in the infield group has spent that percentage of time at one position. Yonder Alonso hasn't played elsewhere in the infield, but he has played left field.

Redsfan320
01-28-2011, 08:01 PM
To be fair, he has played only one inning of his baseball career away from shortstop. He's the only one in the infield group has spent that percentage of time at one position. Yonder Alonso hasn't played elsewhere in the infield, but he has played left field.

Seriously? Scott Rolen has never even played a single inning away from third, yet he's listed as IF. And really, it's not safe to say that BP is a 2B, or JV is a 1B, when neither of them have played anywhere else since '07? Or that Bruce is RF, when he hasn't played anywhere else since '08? Never mind that all these guys are commonly known to be who the Reds are going with at their respective positions.

320

camisadelgolf
01-28-2011, 08:17 PM
Seriously? Scott Rolen has never even played a single inning away from third, yet he's listed as IF. And really, it's not safe to say that BP is a 2B, or JV is a 1B, when neither of them have played anywhere else since '07? Or that Bruce is RF, when he hasn't played anywhere else since '08? Never mind that all these guys are commonly known to be who the Reds are going with at their respective positions.

320
Oops. You're right. I had an ADD moment. Sorry about that.

GADawg
01-28-2011, 11:08 PM
Justin Lehr? didn't he go to Japan last year or something?

cinreds21
01-29-2011, 03:22 AM
Justin Lehr? didn't he go to Japan last year or something?

He was in Triple-A last year for the Reds.

Ron Madden
01-29-2011, 04:48 AM
Per Fay. http://cincinnati.com/blogs/reds/2011/01/28/spring-training-invitees/

Everyone on the 40-man (http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/team/roster_40man.jsp?c_id=cin) plus:

RHP Scott Carroll,
RHP Jerry Gil,
LHP Jeremy Horst,
LHP Donnie Joseph,
RHP Matt Klinker,
RHP Justin Lehr,
RHP Chad Reineke,
LHP Dontrelle Willis,
C Chris Denove,
C Devin Mesoraco,
C Corky Miller,
OF Danny Dorn,
OF Jeremy Hermida,
OF Dave Sappelt.

I'll have #s as soon as I find them. Reds.com hasn't updated things yet, only Fay has anything so far.

320


Thanks 320.

Reds.com does a very poor job of updating information, about the only reason I go there anymore is to check out Jamie Ramsey's BOR blog.

reds44
01-29-2011, 04:51 AM
Seriously? Scott Rolen has never even played a single inning away from third, yet he's listed as IF. And really, it's not safe to say that BP is a 2B, or JV is a 1B, when neither of them have played anywhere else since '07? Or that Bruce is RF, when he hasn't played anywhere else since '08? Never mind that all these guys are commonly known to be who the Reds are going with at their respective positions.

320
Does it really matter? lol

Ron Madden
01-29-2011, 05:04 AM
I'd love to see Dorn and Frazier break through in ST.

I agree, but I'd also love to see Sappelt push the envelope.

lollipopcurve
01-29-2011, 08:10 AM
I agree, but I'd also love to see Sappelt push the envelope.

Me too. Too soon for him to make the jump, but I'm hoping he makes a good impression.

GADawg
01-29-2011, 08:13 AM
He was in Triple-A last year for the Reds.

thanks...don't know who I was thinking of...the 4A types start running together after awhile

Redsfan320
01-29-2011, 09:36 AM
Thanks 320.

Reds.com does a very poor job of updating information, about the only reason I go there anymore is to check out Jamie Ramsey's BOR blog.

No problem. I had read something from Sheldon saying the ST roster was supposed to be released this week, and had been checking pretty often for it all week, so when I found it, I posted it. And yeah Reds.com isn't the greatest. For example, when you click on Jerry Gil's name in the non-roster invitees section, in his page he's listed as a shortstop when he's actually a pitcher. Also, Hermida's # is listed as 39 in some places on Reds.com and 26 in others.


Does it really matter? lol

Not really, I just wonder what chap is getting paid to do this, and doesn't feel a need to mark JV as 1B, BP as 2B, SR as 3B, JB as RF, DS as CF, etc...


thanks...don't know who I was thinking of...the 4A types start running together after awhile

Ben Jukich left for Korea earlier this off-season.

320

MartyFan
01-29-2011, 11:03 AM
I'd love to see Jose Arredondo pitch "lights out" during ST...imagine a BP with Chapman, Arrendondo coming in to set up the 7th and 8th inning and transitioning one of them to the closers role through the year...I am sure Coco is a really good guy...but he is my least favorite signing by the Reds over the last 10 years...yes, 10 years.

mth123
01-29-2011, 11:29 AM
I'd love to see Jose Arredondo pitch "lights out" during ST...imagine a BP with Chapman, Arrendondo coming in to set up the 7th and 8th inning and transitioning one of them to the closers role through the year...I am sure Coco is a really good guy...but he is my least favorite signing by the Reds over the last 10 years...yes, 10 years.

Wow. Overpaid? Yes, but he's been productive in general. Is he worse than Willy T? Is he worse than Milton? Worse than Mike Stanton? Cormier? Lincoln?

Really? Really?? Really?!?

I might even consider that this Arroyo extension with its $15 Million deferred time bomb might be worse.

camisadelgolf
01-29-2011, 11:37 AM
Justin Lehr? didn't he go to Japan last year or something?
He had TJ surgery back around May or June, I believe. He won't be threatening anyone's roster spot this spring.

Danny Serafini
01-29-2011, 12:34 PM
Justin Lehr? didn't he go to Japan last year or something?

He spent part of 2008 in South Korea.

redsfandan
01-29-2011, 01:11 PM
Wow. Overpaid? Yes, but he's been productive in general. Is he worse than Willy T? Is he worse than Milton? Worse than Mike Stanton? Cormier? Lincoln?

Really? Really?? Really?!?

All of those guys were overpaid. Has Cordero been productive? Sure. But, his contract was also the most expensive overpaid contract. Personally, I think Milton was the worst signing of the bunch. But, when a contract is as big as Cordero's it can make it a little harder financially for the Reds than some of those other guys.

I might even consider that this Arroyo extension with its $15 Million deferred time bomb might be worse.
Time bomb huh. lol That statement looks like the definition of hyperbole to me. :rolleyes:

mth123
01-29-2011, 01:28 PM
All of those guys were overpaid. Has Cordero been productive? Sure. But, his contract was also the most expensive overpaid contract. Personally, I think Milton was the worst signing of the bunch. But, when a contract is as big as Cordero's it can make it a little harder financially for the Reds than some of those other guys.

Time bomb huh. lol That statement looks like the definition of hyperbole to me. :rolleyes:

Looks like a time bomb to me. In three years, the Reds will owe him $15 Million to be a member of somebody else's team. Its ticking down to right when the core will be getting really expensive and the Reds are going to need that money the most. So yeah, I think that's a time bomb.

redsfandan
01-29-2011, 01:53 PM
Looks like a time bomb to me. In three years, the Reds will owe him $15 Million to be a member of somebody else's team. Its ticking down to right when the core will be getting really expensive and the Reds are going to need that money the most. So yeah, I think that's a time bomb.
Yeah, I don't think so:


$15M deferred without interest, paid through 2021, reducing present-day AAV to $28.9M

On a totally unrelated note, do you have any swamp land you'd like to sell me?

mth123
01-29-2011, 02:37 PM
Yeah, I don't think so:



On a totally unrelated note, do you have any swamp land you'd like to sell me?

So because they're going to be continue paying him 8 years after his contract ends I'm supposed to believe its a good thing? Most teams fund those deals during the life of the contract by putting the cash into an annuity. It probably means that it won't cost them $15 Million, but it probably means it comes out of the budget in 2012 and 2013. They may pay some of it in later years, but I think that's a bad thing too.

TheNext44
01-29-2011, 03:12 PM
So because they're going to be continue paying him 8 years after his contract ends I'm supposed to believe its a good thing? Most teams fund those deals during the life of the contract by putting the cash into an annuity. It probably means that it won't cost them $15 Million, but it probably means it comes out of the budget in 2012 and 2013. They may pay some of it in later years, but I think that's a bad thing too.

Who knows how they are doing it, but considering the return most annuities are getting these days, I personally would just pay directly.

But why would it come out of the payroll for 2012 and 2013? To be honest, I don't know much about how these things work.

mth123
01-29-2011, 03:57 PM
Who knows how they are doing it, but considering the return most annuities are getting these days, I personally would just pay directly.

But why would it come out of the payroll for 2012 and 2013? To be honest, I don't know much about how these things work.

If they fund the annuity in 2012 and 2013 then the annuity pays out over time. That allows the team to fund it with present value dollars of say $13 Million and the earnings from the annuity ensure that the pay-out is made for say $15 Million and allows the team to discount the actual cash cost of the deal.

I don't know what the Reds debt situation is, but MLB put limits on the amount of debt a team could accumulate. Funding these in advance keeps the debt ratio within those guidelines. The Reds have deferrels to Griffey and Chapman that I know of in addition to Arroyo's, I've seen multiple times where Griffey's is fully funded, but I don't know about the others. You may be right about the team just paying as they go based on the low returns made by annuities these days, but it depends upon the Reds debt ratio whether or not that is an option. There must be a little savings since the blurb that Dan posted mentioned the lower present value cost of the deal.