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chicoruiz
02-07-2011, 10:57 AM
Marty is apparently honing his Grumpy Old Man persona...


On Saturday night during Marshall University’s preseason baseball banquet and fundraiser at the Cam Henderson Center, Brennaman - the keynote speaker - determined that Marshall’s president must be “queer” for softball since the university managed to open a $2.5 million softball facility in March 2008, but baseball is still traveling for home games.

Think that’ll go over well with the guy - Marshall President Stephen Kopp - who is partly responsible for bringing a Herd baseball facility to Huntington?

...“They’ve (Pirates) probably improved themselves, which means they’ll probably lose 97 games,” said Brennaman of the Pirates, who were 57-105 in 2010. “There’s no light at the end of the tunnel for that franchise. There really isn’t.

“I don’t think it has great ownership, I don’t think it has great baseball expertise in its front office, and is strapped for finances, which is probably the single biggest problem. I feel bad for them. PNC Park is one of the fine ballparks in Major League Baseball.”

...Brennaman offered his assessment on the Cardinals, Cubs, Pirates and Brewers.

St. Louis Cardinals - “I’m not a big St. Louis fan, because I’m not a big Tony LaRussa fan. I refer to him as ‘Mr. Baseball’ on the radio, because he acts like he invented the game.”

Chicago Cubs - “The Chicago Cubs won’t be a factor because, no matter how much they add to their club, at the end of the day, they’ve got ‘Cubs’ across the front of their jerseys. That’s the reason why they won’t win.”

"The franchise we all have to be worried about is the Milwaukee Brewers. What they've done is mortgage their future for one shot. That's this season. They lose Prince Fielder, probably to free agency at the end of this year. They've traded away almost every good, young prospect in their organization in order to try to be better than the Reds and the Cardinals."

RedsManRick
02-07-2011, 11:11 AM
Remind me to stay off Marty's lawn. I know most people love the guy, but I'm not among them. The old-lefthander (RIP) really tempered him well. I don't need somebody to blow smoke, but Marty has really moved in to "get-off-my-lawn" territory.

When you listen to the likes of Jon Miller, Vin Scully, Bob Uecker -- they can be critical, but they bring a certain joy to it as well. Maybe Marty is a good fit for the city, with it's Napoleon complex underlying everything, but I'm ready for a fresh voice.

MartyFan
02-07-2011, 11:17 AM
I think Marty is probably an unhappy person...not sure why or what happened to make him that way but I think this is where he has landed. Is he stuck in "unhappy" the rest of his life? I hope not.

The one thing he said that I find ABSOLUTELY HILARIOUS and TRUE is


Chicago Cubs - “The Chicago Cubs won’t be a factor because, no matter how much they add to their club, at the end of the day, they’ve got ‘Cubs’ across the front of their jerseys. That’s the reason why they won’t win.”

:clap::beerme::clap:

camisadelgolf
02-07-2011, 11:18 AM
Wow. Marty, what were you thinking? Jeez. I love that he's proud of the Reds, but he just came off as egotistical imho. I hope this blows over because I really don't want to hear about all this stuff more than once.

dfs
02-07-2011, 11:54 AM
Just being an ambassador for the game in his own way....

That's our little "hall of famer."

lollipopcurve
02-07-2011, 12:02 PM
They're going to have to drag him kicking and screaming from the microphone.

GADawg
02-07-2011, 12:43 PM
yep he's kinda over the top alot of the time and if he were an announcer for another organization he'd surely tick me off but i do like the fact that you get his opinion and not the usual vanilla opinions that we hear so often...political correctness has run it's course with me. Having said all that I do get the fact that Marty seems to think he's bigger than Elvis.

Unassisted
02-07-2011, 12:43 PM
Maybe the bar was kept open a little too long before the keynote speech?

BearcatShane
02-07-2011, 12:43 PM
Haha. I mean, I think it's funny. Especially the comment about the Cubs.

dfs
02-07-2011, 01:08 PM
i do like the fact that you get his opinion and not the usual vanilla opinions that we hear so often...political correctness has run it's course with me.

I got no problem with his mentioning his views of the other team, but you don't keynote a university fundraiser and dog the president of the place. That's just stupid.

GADawg
02-07-2011, 01:30 PM
I got no problem with his mentioning his views of the other team, but you don't keynote a university fundraiser and dog the president of the place. That's just stupid.

oh yeah that part was pretty rude to say the least...even Elvis would've known better than that

reds1869
02-07-2011, 01:44 PM
I got no problem with his mentioning his views of the other team, but you don't keynote a university fundraiser and dog the president of the place. That's just stupid.

If you knew the situation you might understand. The Marshall President's office has been fairly hostile towards building a baseball facility. As it is the team has to drive 50 miles for their "home" games because no C-USA team will play at the Herd's home field. The baseball community in Huntingotn is getting pretty restless.

Strikes Out Looking
02-07-2011, 01:45 PM
Regardless of what he said about the University Prez, his baseball musings were pretty spot on.

Sea Ray
02-07-2011, 01:51 PM
Regardless of what he said about the University Prez, his baseball musings were pretty spot on.

I thought his quotes were quite accurate. I can't comment on his "queer" comment because that wasn't quoted. I'd love to see exactly what he said

Sea Ray
02-07-2011, 01:54 PM
Remind me to stay off Marty's lawn. I know most people love the guy, but I'm not among them. The old-lefthander (RIP) really tempered him well. I don't need somebody to blow smoke, but Marty has really moved in to "get-off-my-lawn" territory.

When you listen to the likes of Jon Miller, Vin Scully, Bob Uecker -- they can be critical, but they bring a certain joy to it as well. Maybe Marty is a good fit for the city, with it's Napoleon complex underlying everything, but I'm ready for a fresh voice.

What comment rubbed you the wrong way? The Cubs? Cardinals?

I'd much prefer a speaker to say those things than the customary "those Pirates will surprise some people this year."

Marty knows at his age he can say whatever he wants and I find that refreshing in this politically correct world

Chip R
02-07-2011, 04:28 PM
Except for the softball comments this doesn't sound like anything different he's said in the past.

Blitz Dorsey
02-07-2011, 06:03 PM
His breakdown of the NL Central was spot on. The Brewers are our biggest threat this year (Cards will be in the race as well) and they have basically an "all in" attitude this season. Marty is exactly right. ... But wait, what would Marty say about the Astros? Would he somehow get in a dig about how their ballpark used to be named after Enron? He mentioned every other team in the division except Houston.

C'mon, YOU are the one that needs to lighten up if you didn't find his comments about LaRussa and the Cubs funny. LaRussa is very high on my "dislike" list in the world of baseball. And the Cubs are a bunch of losers. Don't hate on Marty for calling a spade a spade!

hebroncougar
02-07-2011, 06:28 PM
A good friend of mine pointed out to me, after a Marty rant last year, that it bothers him that Brennaman is always announced as "a hall of famer", and pointed out to me that the broadcasters are winners of the Frick Award, are NOT members of the Hall of Fame, they are just an award winner. I looked it up,and it's true, I never knew that.

Unassisted
02-07-2011, 06:30 PM
Except for the softball comments this doesn't sound like anything different he's said in the past.
IMO, the "queer for" phrase applied to anything is likely to come back to bite him. I can't imagine that going over well on any college campus. If the Reds ownership group is friendly with the university president, I imagine an apology will be forthcoming for the dig against him.

I doubt he's used that phrase on the air in this century.

RANDY IN INDY
02-07-2011, 06:33 PM
The fact that Marshall still does not have a place for its baseball team to play speaks volumes about the University and its leadership. Marty is pointing out the obvious. Still nothing more than a tired story about bringing a baseball facility to Marshall. I'll believe it when I see the Herd playing in a worthy facility in Huntington.

RedsManRick
02-07-2011, 06:39 PM
What comment rubbed you the wrong way? The Cubs? Cardinals?

I'd much prefer a speaker to say those things than the customary "those Pirates will surprise some people this year."

Marty knows at his age he can say whatever he wants and I find that refreshing in this politically correct world

It's less a specific comment and more the general hubris. But to his specific comments:

"Pirates have no light at the end of the tunnel?" Well, people were saying that about the Reds as recently as 3 years ago.

"The Chicago Cubs won’t be a factor because they’ve got ‘Cubs’ across the front of their jerseys?" If you honestly and truly believe they are cursed, fine. I think that's ridiculous, but to each his own mystic beliefs, I suppose. But if you don't think it's a curse, it's just plain, utter simplistic, vapid, anti-intellectualism. There is nothing about a jersey that causes a franchise to lose games. It's using a narrative because it's easy and makes you feel better about yourself instead of applying even a modicum of critical thought that leaves you exposed at being criticized yourself. At the risk of coming off as an elitist jerk, it's that sort of thing that gives Ohio and Ohioans a bad name.

The Operator
02-07-2011, 07:58 PM
RMR, I don't think Marty was trying to accomplish an intellectually stimulating analysis of The Cubs nor was he trying to imply they're cursed. In fact, I know of at least once when he's openly mocked Cubs fans for believing in the curse.

I think he was just trying to get in a good jab. Basically, they're The Cubs, they'll find a way to screw it up. It's not a view that's very different from some of the posters on this board. And the empirical evidence does back those people up.

RedsManRick
02-07-2011, 08:06 PM
RMR, I don't think Marty was trying to accomplish an intellectually stimulating analysis of The Cubs nor was he trying to imply they're cursed. In fact, I know of at least once when he's openly mocked Cubs fans for believing in the curse.

I think he was just trying to get in a good jab. Basically, they're The Cubs, they'll find a way to screw it up. It's not a view that's very different from some of the posters on this board. And the empirical evidence does back those people up.

I recognize it wasn't meant to be an intellectual exercise and that it was most likely all said in a light-hearted way. It's just really low-hanging fruit. It's like a comedian making ethnic jokes on tired stereotypes. Sure, you might get a slight chuckle, but who cares? You've added absolutely nothing to the conversation.

As for the bolded comment, that is precisely the point. No, the empirical evidence does not back up that statement. There is nothing intrinsic about the Cubs that will result in them finding a way to screw things up. Unfortunately, what starts as a light-hearted jab poking fun at a team's string of bad luck turns to in to a real belief. It's the same sort of thought process that leads to all sorts of stupid "analysis" from baseball announcers. The convenient nonsensical simplification ends up taking the place of actual thought.

WVRedsFan
02-07-2011, 08:39 PM
I talked to a couple of folks that were there, and they thought it was funny. They are baseball fanatics (and Reds fans) and have grown tired of Marshall's team having to drive to Charleston to play baseball. Marty is king in Huntington.

WVRedsFan
02-07-2011, 08:47 PM
http://www.herald-dispatch.com/sports/x1790413577/Record-crowd-for-Herd-baseball-banquet

HUNTINGTON -- Cincinnati Reds play-by-play announcer Marty Brennaman has seen plenty of baseball oddities during his illustrious career.

While Brennaman's travels in professional baseball scarcely segue into the college realm, he made it vividly clear -- as clear as his Hall of Fame voice -- that the situation with Marshall University's baseball team is one of the great enigmas that he has seen in his 40 years with professional baseball.

George Anderson
02-08-2011, 12:03 AM
A good friend of mine pointed out to me, after a Marty rant last year, that it bothers him that Brennaman is always announced as "a hall of famer", and pointed out to me that the broadcasters are winners of the Frick Award, are NOT members of the Hall of Fame, they are just an award winner. I looked it up,and it's true, I never knew that.

Marty always being announced as a Hall of Famer drives me nuts. I can't recall any other HOF announcer being referred to a HOF announcer as much as Marty.

While I am on my rant, Thom calling Marty "dad" like every ten seconds also drives me nuts. I have no problem with Thom referring to Marty as his dad but he uses the word way to much.

Blitz Dorsey
02-08-2011, 12:34 AM
C'mon, like you guys aren't "queer for" Marty. Quit denying it! ;-)

Ron Madden
02-08-2011, 04:30 AM
Here's Marty's side of the story. Take it for what it's worth I guess.

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20110207/SPT04/102080353/1062/SPT/Brennaman-No-offense-to-gays

RedFanAlways1966
02-08-2011, 06:48 AM
Here's Marty's side of the story. Take it for what it's worth I guess.

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20110207/SPT04/102080353/1062/SPT/Brennaman-No-offense-to-gays

Queer = obsessed. That is how Marty meant it. However, society has caused some people to believe there is only one definition for certain words. Words like queer and gay. 50 years ago those words were used daily and meant something other than homosexuality. Now if you use them to describe an obsession or happiness, you might get in trouble or questioned. Too bad some "older people" might still use these words for things other than the new definitions. Anyone with an ounce of common sense knows Marty did not mean anything relative to homosexuality with his use of words. But as tends to happen in our wonderful society, common sense goes right out the window in an attempt to paint the wrong picture. Some people are just queer for taking things out of context in order to flex their PC muscle/mouths.

redsmetz
02-08-2011, 08:12 AM
Queer = obsessed. That is how Marty meant it. However, society has caused some people to believe there is only one definition for certain words. Words like queer and gay. 50 years ago those words were used daily and meant something other than homosexuality. Now if you use them to describe an obsession or happiness, you might get in trouble or questioned. Too bad some "older people" might still use these words for things other than the new definitions. Anyone with an ounce of common sense knows Marty did not mean anything relative to homosexuality with his use of words. But as tends to happen in our wonderful society, common sense goes right out the window in an attempt to paint the wrong picture. Some people are just queer for taking things out of context in order to flex their PC muscle/mouths.

I would somewhat disagree. I don't think Marty meant it in a homophobic way. Reading his comments this morning, he clearly intended to disparage the university president. It was very poor choice of words and Marty's no dope. While it's understood he was there for a fundraiser for a WVU baseball facility, it's understandable that one might question how they can pay for a $2M+ softball facility and not come out to support a fundraiser for the baseball team. Then again, I think it's very likely that the money was available for the softball team due to Title IX issues (legitimate in my opinion), hence baseball has to come up with their own. Not to mention, who knows what other things required the university president to be elsewhere.

Marty seems to have kicked into his "cranky" mode, not uncommon these days, and spoke without thinking. Marty's smart enough to know better.

hebroncougar
02-08-2011, 08:14 AM
After reading the article, I realize Marty is very ignorant on Title IX regulations. The President doesn't choose to spend money of softball, it's the law. He should educate himself on issues if he is going to pop off on them. He really comes across as archaic to the current times.

PuffyPig
02-08-2011, 08:22 AM
Marty is an embarrassment to the City of Cincinnati.

And has been for years.

SunDeck
02-08-2011, 08:53 AM
If he doesn't understand how the word queer is going to be interpreted, he's had his head in a box for a generation. There are plenty of other ways to express a thought, which it sounds like he understands from the article in today's article; he "could have made a better choice of words".

Sea Ray
02-08-2011, 08:54 AM
"The Chicago Cubs won’t be a factor because they’ve got ‘Cubs’ across the front of their jerseys?" If you honestly and truly believe they are cursed, fine. I think that's ridiculous, but to each his own mystic beliefs, I suppose. But if you don't think it's a curse, it's just plain, utter simplistic, vapid, anti-intellectualism. There is nothing about a jersey that causes a franchise to lose games. It's using a narrative because it's easy and makes you feel better about yourself instead of applying even a modicum of critical thought that leaves you exposed at being criticized yourself. At the risk of coming off as an elitist jerk, it's that sort of thing that gives Ohio and Ohioans a bad name.

Horrors. Anti-intellectualism! I think Nuxy was the most anti-intellectual broadcaster ever but was that a problem? I don't need my broadcasters to be Ivy Leaguers.

I don't think Marty believes in a curse but what he's saying is everytime the Cubs get close, something happens. And I think he's right about that

Sea Ray
02-08-2011, 08:58 AM
A good friend of mine pointed out to me, after a Marty rant last year, that it bothers him that Brennaman is always announced as "a hall of famer", and pointed out to me that the broadcasters are winners of the Frick Award, are NOT members of the Hall of Fame, they are just an award winner. I looked it up,and it's true, I never knew that.

I was always under the impression that Ford Frick winners were in a separate wing of the Hall of fame but they are still in the Hall. They are considered Hall of Famers.

lollipopcurve
02-08-2011, 09:04 AM
I wonder how many times Ernie Harwell had to apologize for something he said. Wait, I guess I don't.

SunDeck
02-08-2011, 09:11 AM
I think it's picking an unnecessary nit to insist that Marty not be called a Hall of Famer. Sure, it's not technically correct to refer to Ford Frick honorees that way, but considering the award is for significant contributions to baseball, and since the plaque is hung at the HOF library (close enough to the Hall IMHO) and it is only awarded to very few number of of individuals who have all had an effect on our interpretation and memories of the game, it seems not so wrong to call them Hall of Famers. I'd have a hard time not calling Mel Allen or Red Barber hall of fame announcers.

dougdirt
02-08-2011, 09:12 AM
I was always under the impression that Ford Frick winners were in a separate wing of the Hall of fame but they are still in the Hall. They are considered Hall of Famers.

Lots of players have things in the Hall of Fame too, but aren't Hall of Famers. Winning the Ford Frick Award does not make you a Hall of Famer. With that said, Marty is a Hall of Famer somewhere, but its not in baseball's Hall of Fame (some broadcasting HOF).

RANDY IN INDY
02-08-2011, 10:00 AM
Queer = obsessed. That is how Marty meant it. However, society has caused some people to believe there is only one definition for certain words. Words like queer and gay. 50 years ago those words were used daily and meant something other than homosexuality. Now if you use them to describe an obsession or happiness, you might get in trouble or questioned. Too bad some "older people" might still use these words for things other than the new definitions. Anyone with an ounce of common sense knows Marty did not mean anything relative to homosexuality with his use of words. But as tends to happen in our wonderful society, common sense goes right out the window in an attempt to paint the wrong picture. Some people are just queer for taking things out of context in order to flex their PC muscle/mouths.

:beerme:

Spot on!

RANDY IN INDY
02-08-2011, 10:02 AM
While it's understood he was there for a fundraiser for a WVU baseball facility,

It's a Marshall baseball facility. Any time WVU needs anything, the state jumps.

Redsfan320
02-08-2011, 10:12 AM
Spot on!

Amen!

:beerme:

320

bucksfan2
02-08-2011, 10:17 AM
Marty is an embarrassment to the City of Cincinnati.

And has been for years.

No Pete Rose is an embarrassment to the City of Cincinnati but everyone hangs on to his every word.

Marty has a disdain for the Cubs and Tony LaRussa and its no secret. If you are in a pro-Reds environment (which I would imagine Huntington is) then there really should be no beef with his comments. I kind of like it when a teams announcer isn't lovey dovey towards everyone. I kind of like it when an announcer calls a spade a spade. It may irritate some folks but its refreshing to me.

Ron Madden
02-08-2011, 10:31 AM
Queer = obsessed. That is how Marty meant it. However, society has caused some people to believe there is only one definition for certain words. Words like queer and gay. 50 years ago those words were used daily and meant something other than homosexuality. Now if you use them to describe an obsession or happiness, you might get in trouble or questioned. Too bad some "older people" might still use these words for things other than the new definitions. Anyone with an ounce of common sense knows Marty did not mean anything relative to homosexuality with his use of words. But as tends to happen in our wonderful society, common sense goes right out the window in an attempt to paint the wrong picture. Some people are just queer for taking things out of context in order to flex their PC muscle/mouths.

I was just sharing an article, never gave my opinion or had any intention of flexing my PC muscle/mouth. :confused:

Ghosts of 1990
02-08-2011, 10:38 AM
That's our Marty!

That was my only thought when reading this. That and he just doesn't like Bruce all that much.

RedFanAlways1966
02-08-2011, 10:39 AM
I was just sharing an article, never gave my opinion or had any intention of flexing my PC muscle/mouth. :confused:

No offense meant to you, Ron! I was calling out the media who wrote this and those who will undoubtedly label Marty as anti-something-or-another. I appreciate you posting the article.

:)

bucksfan2
02-08-2011, 10:41 AM
That's our Marty!

That was my only thought when reading this. That and he just doesn't like Bruce all that much.

Say what?

redsmetz
02-08-2011, 11:05 AM
It's a Marshall baseball facility. Any time WVU needs anything, the state jumps.

I realized later that I had written WVU, but didn't see it when I went back to look at my remark. You're right, it was Marshall - my mistake. And you're probably correct that WVU gets whatever they want.

I'm hoping Marty left a check of his own (I'm guessing maybe he did, or didn't take an honorarium). Hopefully he brought a check from the Reds. We're closer to Huntington than Pittsburgh is - that's clearly Reds country and hopefully we can support the university's baseball program.

Razor Shines
02-08-2011, 11:27 AM
No Pete Rose is an embarrassment to the City of Cincinnati but everyone hangs on to his every word.

Marty has a disdain for the Cubs and Tony LaRussa and its no secret. If you are in a pro-Reds environment (which I would imagine Huntington is) then there really should be no beef with his comments. I kind of like it when a teams announcer isn't lovey dovey towards everyone. I kind of like it when an announcer calls a spade a spade. It may irritate some folks but its refreshing to me.

I think a lot people just want a happy medium. Not many liked Grande mainly because of his "lovey dovey" attitude with other teams and their players. Seems like some of the same people don't like Marty for going to far the other way.

Me? Oh, thanks for asking. I didn't hate Grande and I mostly like Marty. I think Marty goes too far some times, but I'd prefer an announcer closer to Marty than to GG.

bucksfan2
02-08-2011, 11:41 AM
I think a lot people just want a happy medium. Not many liked Grande mainly because of his "lovey dovey" attitude with other teams and their players. Seems like some of the same people don't like Marty for going to far the other way.

Me? Oh, thanks for asking. I didn't hate Grande and I mostly like Marty. I think Marty goes too far some times, but I'd prefer an announcer closer to Marty than to GG.

I think there are separate kinds of announcers, you local guy and your national guy.

The national guy has to be impartial. He has to root for the story instead of the teams playing the game. Nothing is more embarrassing for a national guy to be an obvious shill for one team or the other. A perfect example of this was when Dan Dierdorf was doing the Bengals Steelers game. He was gushing over Big Ben and it was embarrassing to hear because the guy needed to be impartial.

Then you have the local guy. The guy who is hired to do a particular team all season (or career) long. This guy needs to be more of a shill. He is announcing the game to the local fans of the team. The local fans don't want to hear how good Jim Edmonds (George Grande) is. They want to hear someone go Gus Johnson when their team hits a walk off HR, but also show some irritation when the pitching staff looks like Eric Milton.

I guess with Marty he knows the audience he is speaking to. If it were national he would have been more unbiased and less antagonistic towards the divisional rivals. At the same time if it were at a Reds sponsored or Reds area event you wouldn't want him gushing over the opponents or rivals. IMO Marty has spoken at enough functions that he knows which audience he is speaking towards. IIRC Huntington is in Reds country and that is why Marty took the tone he did.

WVRedsFan
02-08-2011, 11:54 AM
I realized later that I had written WVU, but didn't see it when I went back to look at my remark. You're right, it was Marshall - my mistake. And you're probably correct that WVU gets whatever they want.

I'm hoping Marty left a check of his own (I'm guessing maybe he did, or didn't take an honorarium). Hopefully he brought a check from the Reds. We're closer to Huntington than Pittsburgh is - that's clearly Reds country and hopefully we can support the university's baseball program.Marshall's situation is horrible, but WVU plays in a dump too. This is a football state, something that drives West Virginia baseball fans nuts. WVU has Milan Puskar Stadium, a state of the art facility and it's basketball and baseball facilities are less than desirable (even though the Coliseum is 40 years old, it needs some updating). Marshall's basketball facility needs help too, but they have a super nice stadium for football and no baseball facilities that are worth mentioning. I hope Marty/the Reds did contribute and this does nothing but draw attention to it which is good.

I know football is the cash cow for universities, but what is happening down in Huntington is a shame as far as the baseball situation (and that could be said for WVU also). Let's hope this pushes some contributors to ante up.

TRF
02-08-2011, 12:06 PM
I think there are separate kinds of announcers, you local guy and your national guy.

The national guy has to be impartial. He has to root for the story instead of the teams playing the game. Nothing is more embarrassing for a national guy to be an obvious shill for one team or the other. A perfect example of this was when Dan Dierdorf was doing the Bengals Steelers game. He was gushing over Big Ben and it was embarrassing to hear because the guy needed to be impartial.

Then you have the local guy. The guy who is hired to do a particular team all season (or career) long. This guy needs to be more of a shill. He is announcing the game to the local fans of the team. The local fans don't want to hear how good Jim Edmonds (George Grande) is. They want to hear someone go Gus Johnson when their team hits a walk off HR, but also show some irritation when the pitching staff looks like Eric Milton.

I guess with Marty he knows the audience he is speaking to. If it were national he would have been more unbiased and less antagonistic towards the divisional rivals. At the same time if it were at a Reds sponsored or Reds area event you wouldn't want him gushing over the opponents or rivals. IMO Marty has spoken at enough functions that he knows which audience he is speaking towards. IIRC Huntington is in Reds country and that is why Marty took the tone he did.

IMO the local guy is the voice of the team. He's PR as much as he is announcer. For 10 years Marty was basically saying "stay home, this team sucks."

Now, a winning season may revive him a bit, but IMO he likes being cranky Marty the Untouchable far too much. And it is rubbing off on Thom.

hebroncougar
02-08-2011, 12:12 PM
I was always under the impression that Ford Frick winners were in a separate wing of the Hall of fame but they are still in the Hall. They are considered Hall of Famers.

Nope, they are not considered to be members of the baseball Hall of Fame.

TRF
02-08-2011, 12:15 PM
They get an induction ceremony right?

Semantics.

hebroncougar
02-08-2011, 12:18 PM
They get an induction ceremony right?

Semantics.

No, they get an award. They don't get an "induction ceremony". Go to the hall of fame website..........click on "hall of famers", you won't find them. Because they've never been inducted into the hall of fame. It's even on the wikipedia page for the Ford Frick Award, it states they are sometimes referred to as "hall of famers", but they are not.

hebroncougar
02-08-2011, 12:21 PM
Here is a blurb from the hall of fame website:

The Ford C. Frick Award is presented annually during the Hall of Fame Weekend. Each award recipient (not to be confused with an inductee) is presented with a calligraphy of the award and is recognized in the "Scribes & Mikemen" exhibit in the Library of the National Baseball Hall of Fame

RedsBaron
02-08-2011, 12:24 PM
Nope, they are not considered to be members of the baseball Hall of Fame.

You are correct. The Hall of Fame's web site describes the "Ford C. Frick Award" as being exactly that, an "award" that is "presented annually to a broadcaster for major contributions to baseball." The web site expressly states that "Each award recipient (not to be confused with an inductee) is presented with a calligraphy of the award and is recognized in the 'Scribes & Mikemen" exhibit in the Library of the National Baseball Hall of Fame."
Marty is a winner of the Ford C. Frick award. He is not a member of the Hall of Fame. His name does not appear on the official list of members of the Hall of Fame. He is an "award recipient" which is "not to be confused with an inductee."

redsmetz
02-08-2011, 12:47 PM
No, they get an award. They don't get an "induction ceremony". Go to the hall of fame website..........click on "hall of famers", you won't find them. Because they've never been inducted into the hall of fame. It's even on the wikipedia page for the Ford Frick Award, it states they are sometimes referred to as "hall of famers", but they are not.

Before I saw your post, I went to the Hall's website and looked.

http://baseballhall.org/museum/awards/ford-c-frick

They are quite clear that these are award winners and clearly not "inductees" (their word). It would be appropriate to identify Marty (and others) as "award winning" or "the honored" or even "the poofy haired fancy boy," but not technically the Hall of Famer. The same holds true for the winners of the J.G. Taylor Spink award for writers (again, the same clarification as with the Ford Frick award.

Brennaman was inducted into the Radio Hall of Fame though, so he can rightfully be call a Hall of Famer for that.

RANDY IN INDY
02-08-2011, 12:53 PM
The Ford Frick award is the Hall of Fame for announcers. Pretty distinguished crowd and a very select group.

Eric_the_Red
02-08-2011, 01:20 PM
I find it interesting to contrast this thread with the thread after Votto expressed his disdain for the Cubs (or their fans) or the BP/Cardinals thread.

I don't mind for hometown announcers to openly root for the home team and against their rivals. That's why each team has their own announcing crew, IMO. If it a national game, then an unbiased viewpoint is required. But try telling me the Pete Rose call of 4192 would as good if not for Marty's excitement and Joe screaming in the background.

Redsfan320
02-08-2011, 01:33 PM
But try telling me the Pete Rose call of 4192 would as good if not for Marty's excitement and Joe screaming in the background.

It isn't. The call that's usually played is not Marty and Joe's but rather, some national dude who was broadcasting it on TV. I don't for the life of me know why that's the more popular call of it.

320

TRF
02-08-2011, 02:12 PM
So, Steinbrenner is eligible for the HOF, but Marty isn't?

I don't much care for Marty overall, but that's kinda ridiculous. The HOF should recognize the Frick winners as members of the HOF. In fact, Executives should have a separate designation as well.

In fact, Ford Frick is in the HOF. Now is that ironic?

RedsBaron
02-08-2011, 02:35 PM
I find it interesting to contrast this thread with the thread after Votto expressed his disdain for the Cubs (or their fans) or the BP/Cardinals thread.

I don't mind for hometown announcers to openly root for the home team and against their rivals. That's why each team has their own announcing crew, IMO. If it a national game, then an unbiased viewpoint is required. But try telling me the Pete Rose call of 4192 would as good if not for Marty's excitement and Joe screaming in the background.

I agree.

RedsBaron
02-08-2011, 02:36 PM
So, Steinbrenner is eligible for the HOF, but Marty isn't?

I don't much care for Marty overall, but that's kinda ridiculous. The HOF should recognize the Frick winners as members of the HOF. In fact, Executives should have a separate designation as well.

In fact, Ford Frick is in the HOF. Now is that ironic?

Bowie Kuhn is in the Hall of Fame too, and Bud Selig probably will be in the HOF one day. :barf:

westofyou
02-08-2011, 02:40 PM
In fact, Ford Frick is in the HOF. Now is that ironic?

Famous sportswriter, President of a league, Commissioner of baseball.

The man contributed to the game and was there as it grew into a large business.

Nothing odd about his presence there.

Redsfan320
02-08-2011, 02:49 PM
Bowie Kuhn is in the Hall of Fame too, and Bud Selig probably will be in the HOF one day.

Why is Bud so highly regarded? What the heck did he do for the game?

320

Dom Heffner
02-08-2011, 02:53 PM
As a professional broadcaster, someone who makes a living solely on their words, he has to know that a word that is considered to be offensive slang shouldn't be used.

There are probaly 7 different meanings for the word, but if you don't want to be taken the wrong way, don't use a word like that.

It's not like he's a plumber - he is a broadcaster, he should know better.

Especially, you know, since he makes his politics no secret during a baseball game of all things.

camisadelgolf
02-08-2011, 03:04 PM
Why is Bud so highly regarded? What the heck did he do for the game?

320
Extended the length of the playoffs, which created PROFIT!!!!!!!!!

TRF
02-08-2011, 03:07 PM
Famous sportswriter, President of a league, Commissioner of baseball.

The man contributed to the game and was there as it grew into a large business.

Nothing odd about his presence there.

didn't say there was, just that people given an award named in his honor are not. There is no provision for announcers other than this award. IMO they should be considered members of the HOF.

Unassisted
02-08-2011, 03:14 PM
Why is Bud so highly regarded? What the heck did he do for the game?

320Increased revenue for the owners from less than 2 to more than 6 Billion dollars a year. They kinda like him for doing that. ;)

RedsBaron
02-08-2011, 03:16 PM
Why is Bud so highly regarded? What the heck did he do for the game?

320

I don't believe that Bud Selig should be in the Hall of Fame, nor do I believe that Bowie Kuhn should have been inducted. However, Kuhn was inducted and Selig probably will be. I make an exception for Branch Rickey, but for the most part I believe that the members of the Hall of Fame should be guys who were pictured on baseball cards, i.e., players and managers.

Unassisted
02-08-2011, 03:19 PM
As a professional broadcaster, someone who makes a living solely on their words, he has to know that a word that is considered to be offensive slang shouldn't be used.

There are probaly 7 different meanings for the word, but if you don't want to be taken the wrong way, don't use a word like that.

It's not like he's a plumber - he is a broadcaster, he should know better.Dom has it right. It matters more that Marty should know better than to have said what he did than it does that he said what he did.

Jimmy the Greek and Ron Franklin didn't get that, either.

westofyou
02-08-2011, 03:20 PM
didn't say there was, just that people given an award named in his honor are not. There is no provision for announcers other than this award. IMO they should be considered members of the HOF.

It's named for him because he pioneered the scoring rundown format on radio as well as the dissemination of information about the game on the radio. His name connected with the award is not why he's in the HOF (an institution he had a heavy hand in creating) it's more connected to his work prior to being a baseball executive.

Redsfan320
02-08-2011, 03:29 PM
It's named for him because he pioneered the scoring rundown format on radio as well as the dissemination of information about the game on the radio. His name connected with the award is not why he's in the HOF (an institution he had a heavy hand in creating) it's more connected to his work prior to being a baseball executive.

Please explain.

320

westofyou
02-08-2011, 03:34 PM
Please explain.

320

Like ESPN, today scores were.... Blah, Blah, Blah, Blank hit 2 HR's for Blah and Fill in the Name threw a 2 hitter versus the Blanks in You Where.

Stuff we take for granted today at one time had to have someone who said... hey let's do a show on the scores for the day and run down the high and low points.

RedFanAlways1966
02-08-2011, 03:36 PM
Jimmy the Greek and Ron Franklin didn't get that, either.

Not anywhere near the same... oranges vs. apples.

(1) To the NFL fans: "Black athletes are more athletic b/c slave owners bred them that way."
(2) To female sideline reporter: "Let me tell you something Sweet Baby. Don't like me calling you that... let me tell you something a-hole."

Once again Marty used queer to mean obsessed. Nowadays certain words are off-limits b/c they have been associated with certain people? I am not on-board with this at all. Especially for people who are seniors.

Even Marty admits that he might have chosen better words. However, he chose a word that means exactly what he meant to say. And that had nothing to do with sexuality/racism. The other two people chose words/topics that were way different than Marty's use of one word.

lollipopcurve
02-08-2011, 03:37 PM
Honestly, I don't consider MBrennaman a very good ambassador for baseball. Not easy for me to see what his credentials for the FF Award are, other than that he's seen a lot of games. Seen 'em, and, in a lot of cases, didn't find them all that pleasant to be at.

Unassisted
02-08-2011, 03:43 PM
Once again Marty used queer to mean obsessed.
I've read this semantic argument up-thread and I didn't buy it, because I've never heard of these two words being synonyms. Since you trotted it out as a counterpoint to my point, I'm going to challenge it. :p:

If it was truly meant to be a synonym for "obsessed," then why didn't Marty say the university president was "queer with" softball just as one fixated on softball would be described as being "obsessed with" it? I've never heard of being "obsessed for" something.

These are the other definitions for "queer" and I can't see a way to make any of them apply to his description of the university president. Please do enlighten me.



thwart: hinder or prevent (the efforts, plans, or desires) of; "What ultimately frustrated every challenger was Ruth's amazing September surge"; "foil your opponent"
curious: beyond or deviating from the usual or expected; "a curious hybrid accent"; "her speech has a funny twang"; "they have some funny ideas about war"; "had an odd name"; "the peculiar aromatic odor of cloves"; "something definitely queer about this town"; "what a rum fellow"; "singular ...
put in a dangerous, disadvantageous, or difficult position

RedFanAlways1966
02-08-2011, 04:09 PM
I had to look it up before my 1st post to make sure, Unassisted. From Merriam-Webster and I was using 2c below (as I believe Marty was doing)...

Definition of QUEER
1a : worthless, counterfeit <queer money>
b : questionable, suspicious
2a : differing in some odd way from what is usual or normal
b (1) : eccentric, unconventional (2) : mildly insane : touched
c : absorbed or interested to an extreme or unreasonable degree : obsessed
d (1) often disparaging : homosexual (2) sometimes offensive : gay 4b
3: not quite well

Of course softball is a women's sport and the Univ. President is male. Therefore, I can see how some people might view this. Marty might not be enlightened enough to know how the PC police rule, but I like to think he is smart enough and been around long enough to know better than to call someone a disparaging name in public.

redsmetz
02-08-2011, 04:10 PM
I've read this semantic argument up-thread and I didn't buy it, because I've never heard of these two words being synonyms. Since you trotted it out as a counterpoint to my point, I'm going to challenge it. :p:

If it was truly meant to be a synonym for "obsessed," then why didn't Marty say the university president was "queer with" softball just as one fixated on softball would be described as being "obsessed with" it? I've never heard of being "obsessed for" something.

These are the other definitions for "queer" and I can't see a way to make any of them apply to his description of the university president. Please do enlighten me.

I finally found an Idiom dictionary that showed a definition similar to Brennaman's useage

http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/queer+for

Inf. in the mood for something; desiring something. (Old.) I'm queer for a beer right now. She's queer for him because of his money.

Clearly, as the first person noted, it's an old useage, I'd even go so far to label it "archaic". Language evolves, whether one likes it or not, but Marty's not some 90 year old guy innocently uses a phrase from his childhood. It's much like the what are now called flip-flops, you don't call them what we did when we were kids. Marty should have known better.

It was boneheaded on his part and he could have made a greater pitch for the need at hand had he decided to not berate the university president over something that likely was not in his control in the first place. He missed an opportunity because he wanted to be a blowhard (IMO).

Unassisted
02-08-2011, 04:16 PM
I finally found an Idiom dictionary that showed a definition similar to Brennaman's useage

http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/queer+for (http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/queer+for)

Inf. in the mood for something; desiring something. (Old.) I'm queer for a beer right now. She's queer for him because of his money.

Clearly, as the first person noted, it's an old useage, I'd even go so far to label it "archaic". Language evolves, whether one likes it or not, but Marty's not some 90 year old guy innocently uses a phrase from his childhood. It's much like the what are now called flip-flops, you don't call them what we did when we were kids. Marty should have known better.
I'll buy that. Thanks for the legwork. :beerme:

My late grandmother probably knew of and used that phrase at some point, since it's archaic. She would occasionally floor us with some doozies that were even shocking back in the 70s and 80s. She and my grandfather loved the Reds.

camisadelgolf
02-08-2011, 04:23 PM
Clearly, as the first person noted, it's an old useage, I'd even go so far to label it "archaic". Language evolves, whether one likes it or not, but Marty's not some 90 year old guy innocently uses a phrase from his childhood. It's much like the what are now called flip-flops, you don't call them what we did when we were kids. Marty should have known better.

It was boneheaded on his part and he could have made a greater pitch for the need at hand had he decided to not berate the university president over something that likely was not in his control in the first place. He missed an opportunity because he wanted to be a blowhard (IMO).
I can't say I completely agree with that. Why should Marty be the one to change? Why can't we say the public should have known better and call the public boneheaded for not knowing the other uses of the word? You mentioned that the language evolves, which is obviously true, but it all has to start somewhere.

TheNext44
02-08-2011, 04:43 PM
I can't say I completely agree with that. Why should Marty be the one to change? Why can't we say the public should have known better and call the public boneheaded for not knowing the other uses of the word? You mentioned that the language evolves, which is obviously true, but it all has to start somewhere.

Because it has already evolved and of course Marty knew what it means today. It's silly to assume anything else.

My grandfather, who died at age 82 in 1984 used "queer" far too often as a derogatory word for homosexual. If my uneducated grandfather knew what it really meant in 1984, surely Marty knows it now.

I love Marty, but he's never been progessive minded on these issues before, so I'm not surprised and this doesn't change my view of him one bit.

camisadelgolf
02-08-2011, 04:59 PM
Because it has already evolved and of course Marty knew what it means today. It's silly to assume anything else.

My grandfather, who died at age 82 in 1984 used "queer" far too often as a derogatory word for homosexual. If my uneducated grandfather knew what it really meant in 1984, surely Marty knows it now.

I love Marty, but he's never been progessive minded on these issues before, so I'm not surprised and this doesn't change my view of him one bit.
What came first: Marty's usage, or the meaning with homosexual connotations? Marty is one of very few people who uses the word how he did, but if it starts gaining traction, then he helped the cause of getting rid of the profane connotations, am I right?

gonelong
02-08-2011, 05:01 PM
Clearly, as the first person noted, it's an old useage, I'd even go so far to label it "archaic". Language evolves, whether one likes it or not, but Marty's not some 90 year old guy innocently uses a phrase from his childhood. It's much like the what are now called flip-flops, you don't call them what we did when we were kids. Marty should have known better.

I suspect that somewhere around the old ballyard, locker room, and/or diamond that Marty has heard and absorbed the gist of the more comtemporary usage of the word.

I'd wager he said what he meant to say, in the manner he meant to say it.

GL

redsmetz
02-08-2011, 06:30 PM
What came first: Marty's usage, or the meaning with homosexual connotations? Marty is one of very few people who uses the word how he did, but if it starts gaining traction, then he helped the cause of getting rid of the profane connotations, am I right?

Since the first use for the current meaning predates Marty (1922 - http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=queer&searchmode=none), it's been around a while. Again, works take on new meaning. "Colored" was once an acceptable term for African Americans, certainly better than the bigoted word commonly used, but it isn't anymore. Another more benign example is that my grandmother called a car "the machine," such as "Gloria's out by the machine listening to her radio." No one would consider that an understandable name for a car, etc. Again, Marty knows better. He wanted to get a dig in and chose to be snide about it.

Jpup
02-08-2011, 06:39 PM
I think some folks are making a mountain out of a molehill. Can't wait until next week. Marty is Marty and he isn't going to change nor should he. He's been very successful at his job for nearly 40 years. Why would he change? I don't agree with everything he does, but I do believe the Reds are very lucky to have someone as good as he is at his job.

George Anderson
02-08-2011, 07:19 PM
I think some folks are making a mountain out of a molehill. .

:beerme:

Pitchers and catchers reporting to camp can't come soon enough for me.

Eric_the_Red
02-08-2011, 07:45 PM
:beerme:

Pitchers and catchers reporting to camp can't come soon enough for me.

Then we get to debate how terrible/wonderful the selection for the 25th man was. :p:

Ron Madden
02-09-2011, 02:58 AM
No offense meant to you, Ron! I was calling out the media who wrote this and those who will undoubtedly label Marty as anti-something-or-another. I appreciate you posting the article.

:)

At first glance I was a bit confused. I understand your post after reading it a second time, I'm sorry about the lack of comprehension on my part. :doh:

That said...

I do believe Marty's ego will cause his mouth to get him into hot water one of these days.

RANDY IN INDY
02-09-2011, 08:39 AM
I think some folks are making a mountain out of a molehill. Can't wait until next week. Marty is Marty and he isn't going to change nor should he. He's been very successful at his job for nearly 40 years. Why would he change? I don't agree with everything he does, but I do believe the Reds are very lucky to have someone as good as he is at his job.

Anyone with a lick of sense, that can read in context, knows that Marty was not making a derogatory comment toward gay people. But again, people have to try to make something out of nothing and as RFA66 said, "Flex the PC muscles." This is the kind of stuff that makes me crazy.

hebroncougar
02-09-2011, 09:08 AM
Anyone with a lick of sense, that can read in context, knows that Marty was not making a derogatory comment toward gay people. But again, people have to try to make something out of nothing and as RFA66 said, "Flex the PC muscles." This is the kind of stuff that makes me crazy.

Sorry, but I disagree, and I've said nothing about his statement. When he refers to a university president as "queer for softball", and he's saying it in a derogatory way (which he clearly was), and he's comparing it to baseball, it's darn clear what he meant. The university president is feminine, because he favors softball over baseball. In my mind, there's no ifs, ands, ors, or buts, that is clearly what he meant. Now, is that derogatory towards homosexual people in my mind? Absolutely not. Should he have said it? Nope. It just opens up a whole can of worms.

SunDeck
02-09-2011, 09:16 AM
Sorry, but I disagree, and I've said nothing about his statement. When he refers to a university president as "queer for softball", and he's saying it in a derogatory way (which he clearly was), and he's comparing it to baseball, it's darn clear what he meant. The university president is feminine, because he favors softball over baseball. In my mind, there's no ifs, ands, ors, or buts, that is clearly what he meant. Now, is that derogatory towards homosexual people in my mind? Absolutely not. Should he have said it? Nope. It just opens up a whole can of worms.

He may have truly been using the word as he said he was- to imply an obsession. Only Marty really knows for sure, but just from the perspective of being a public figure and representing a major league franchise, and being a guy whose career is in using language to describe things for people who can't see it happening, one would think he's not so out of tough as to think the word "queer" would not be considered offensive.

RANDY IN INDY
02-09-2011, 09:55 AM
I don't disagree that Marty could have used a different word, but sometimes when people want to bring attention to a bad situation, they use "language" to express their true sentiments. It's a shame that most people cannot get past the negative connotation that has been put on a single word to leave it useless of its original or other meanings. Most people would be well warned to just keep their mouths shut today. You're going to offend somebody and heaven knows, that just can't be.

What a society we live in. My son came home from school yesterday and told me that they had been playing volleyball in PE class. I asked him if it was fun. He told me that it was not fun because they weren't allowed to use a real volleyball. They have to use some type of silly sponge ball because they are afraid someone might get hurt. He said that they always have to use some type of sponge ball in every sport that they play. I find that amazing and ridiculous.

RedsBaron
02-09-2011, 10:41 AM
As a parent of teen age boys I have heard some kids use the phrase "that is so gay" as derogatory slang which, I gather, doesn't necessarily refer to someone's sexual preference but just means that something is not cool. I have tried, in no uncertain terms, to discourage my own kids from using the phrase.
I did see a "public service announcement" on TV last weekend condemning the use of the phrase and thought at the time "good luck with that." If you tell kids not to do something that may only cause them to want to do it.
Words do change their meaning through the years. Bing Crosby sang a song entitled "Gay Love" decades ago that did not quite carry the same meaning then as it would have more recently. To say that something was "bad" meant just that until more recently when calling something "bad" might actually mean it was "good."
As for the word "queer"-that word does have several meanings. In the Robert Frost poem "Stopping By Woods On A Snowy Evening" I do not think Frost meant something derogatory when he wrote that his horse thought it "queer" when he stopped. That said, the context in which Marty reportedly used the term does seem to me to have been intended to be derogatory.
I rather doubt Marty will be invited back to speak at a Marshall function.

Dom Heffner
02-09-2011, 11:21 AM
If you have to search the entire world wide web to find one example of an obscure usage of a word- you should have used a different word.

I don't have a lie detector or a usage detector. I have no idea what he meant.

And that's why you don't use a word like that.

If he were talking about a beer, we could have drawn a better conclusion, but he was talking about a guy and girls softball.

I think it is pretty safe to say it was a bad choice of words, especialy coming from a guy who makes no bones about hiding his feelings.

You can't be the brash, opinionated broadcaster and not expect to have people critique what you say.

My guess is he wasn't being homophobic, he just used the wrong word.

Dom Heffner
02-09-2011, 11:24 AM
I don't disagree that Marty could have used a different word, but sometimes when people want to bring attention to a bad situation, they use "language" to express their true sentiments. It's a shame that most people cannot get past the negative connotation that has been put on a single word to leave it useless of its original or other meanings. Most people would be well warned to just keep their mouths shut today. You're going to offend somebody and heaven knows, that just can't be.

What a society we live in. My son came home from school yesterday and told me that they had been playing volleyball in PE class. I asked him if it was fun. He told me that it was not fun because they weren't allowed to use a real volleyball. They have to use some type of silly sponge ball because they are afraid someone might get hurt. He said that they always have to use some type of sponge ball in every sport that they play. I find that amazing and ridiculous.

I personally think this is long overdue. Some families can't afford health insurance and the parents really don't send their kids to school to become better volleyball players.

I realize you can get hurt anywhere, but the odds significantly increase when a ball is flying around at 30 miles per hour in a room full of people.

This reminds me of the thread where GAC couldn't understand why Jarts were taken off the market ;)

camisadelgolf
02-09-2011, 11:59 AM
If you have to search the entire world wide web to find one example of an obscure usage of a word- you should have used a different word.
I agree that it wasn't a good choice of words, but I don't think it has anything to do with the frequency of that particular definition being used. People use words I've never heard of all the time. Instead of saying a different word should be used, I reference other documents and try to find the meaning that was intended.

Dom Heffner
02-09-2011, 12:11 PM
I agree that it wasn't a good choice of words, but I don't think it has anything to do with the frequency of that particular definition being used. People use words I've never heard of all the time. Instead of saying a different word should be used, I reference other documents and try to find the meaning that was intended.

I'm confused. You say it was a bad choice of words, but then you say we shouldn't tell someone to use a different word because we should all research it on our own to find what they truly meant.

You may be making a distinction between yourself and everyone else, I don't mean to question you in bad way, but you seem to contradict yourslef there.

You agree it was a bad choice yet you don't think it was a bad choice because you go research and find out for yoruslef the context.

Which truthfully makes the point even clearer: don't use words that people can confuse the context on, if you are going to use an obscure use of the term.

I'm 42 years old and never heard the term used that way.

camisadelgolf
02-09-2011, 12:25 PM
I'm confused. You say it was a bad choice of words, but then you say we shouldn't tell someone to use a different word because we should all research it on our own to find what they truly meant.

You may be making a distinction between yourself and everyone else, I don't mean to question you in bad way, but you seem to contradict yourslef there.

You agree it was a bad choice yet you don't think it was a bad choice because you go research and find out for yoruslef the context.

Which truthfully makes the point even clearer: don't use words that people can confuse the context on, if you are going to use an obscure use of the term.

I'm 42 years old and never heard the term used that way.
I understand why you see it that way. I apologize for not being clear. I agree that it was a bad choice of words because--well, just look at the discussion occurring in this thread right now. When you're a public speaker, you have to pay close attention to your audience's demographic and the context of everything you're saying. It appears Marty didn't do that.

But the fact that an obscure definition of a word was used isn't the issue--it was just this particular word. If it's a day-to-day conversation with a friend, it wouldn't be an issue at all.

Then again, if his choice of wording brings more attention to the issue, maybe it wasn't a bad choice of words at all.

REDREAD
02-09-2011, 01:44 PM
Once again, Marty embarrasses the city and Reds fans..

Think about it.. What if it was Marge that said "queer" at a simliar function?She'd be crucified in the media.
Marty gets a free pass because he used to be a good announcer. Or maybe because no writer wants to criticize Marty and then be berated on every game for the rest of Marty's broadcasting career.

Ok Marty, you hate LaRussa (and Showalter).. We get it.. Why keep on dwelling on it?
It's kind of hypocritical for Marty to hate LaRussa for his attitude, when Marty is such an arrogant Mr Know It All. In fact, I think of that Bullwinkle character every time Marty opens his mouth and says something stupid.

Marty can't retire soon enough.

REDREAD
02-09-2011, 02:11 PM
Sorry, but I disagree, and I've said nothing about his statement. When he refers to a university president as "queer for softball", and he's saying it in a derogatory way (which he clearly was), and he's comparing it to baseball, it's darn clear what he meant. The university president is feminine, because he favors softball over baseball. In my mind, there's no ifs, ands, ors, or buts, that is clearly what he meant. Now, is that derogatory towards homosexual people in my mind? Absolutely not. Should he have said it? Nope. It just opens up a whole can of worms.

I agree completely.. Marty clearly meant to insult the president.
There's no question of the true intent of the comment.
We can look up what the word meant 100 years ago, but that does not change what Marty meant. Marty has had far too much freedom to say whatever is on his mind with no consequences, to doting fans. He has no self control and doesn't care if he offends anyone, as he sees himself as some kind of BroadCasting God that is essential to the survival of the franchise.
We've seen plenty of evidence where Marty thinks he's more important than the players :lol:

In reality, Marty has done more harm than good to this franchise.

And the other poster was right. Marty hates Bruce. Bruce is the next Adam Dunn for Marty, unless Bruce can pull off an MVP season every year.
I will remember Marty berating Bruce for asking to play on the division clinching game.. Bruce made 3 outs his first three times up, and Marty kept berating him "If you are going to demand to play, you better produce".
Then Bruce hits the HR to finally shut up Marty.

Sea Ray
02-09-2011, 02:38 PM
Marty has admitted that it wasn't a good choice of words. I think that should be the end of it. Anyone disagree with me?

RedFanAlways1966
02-09-2011, 02:43 PM
I agree completely.. Marty clearly meant to insult the president.
There's no question of the true intent of the comment.
We can look up what the word meant 100 years ago, but that does not change what Marty meant.

I see you are a mind-reader. Send me a PM with the winning PowerBall numbers for the next drawing. Please send it before the drawing so I can believe what you wrote. Then I will admit (from my new laptop on my personal beachfront propoerty in Tahiti or Hawaii) that you are correct. If not, I ain't buyin' (your comments or the beach property!).

Jpup
02-09-2011, 02:43 PM
Marty has admitted that it wasn't a good choice of words. I think that should be the end of it. Anyone disagree with me?

Ought to be the end of the thread as well. It's way too political for the baseball forum. JMHO.

RedFanAlways1966
02-09-2011, 02:45 PM
Ought to be the end of the thread as well. It's way too political for the baseball forum. JMHO.

I do not agree. I think the conversation has been civil and all have played fair. And I'd like to thank all for an enjoyable conversation and read.

RANDY IN INDY
02-09-2011, 03:32 PM
I do not agree. I think the conversation has been civil and all have played fair. And I'd like to thank all for an enjoyable conversation and read.

Agreed!:beerme: This thread too political? Just a sign of the times.

REDREAD
02-10-2011, 10:36 AM
I see you are a mind-reader. Send me a PM with the winning PowerBall numbers for the next drawing. Please send it before the drawing so I can believe what you wrote. Then I will admit (from my new laptop on my personal beachfront propoerty in Tahiti or Hawaii) that you are correct. If not, I ain't buyin' (your comments or the beach property!).

LOL..
If you believe Marty said that without trying to insult the president, I guess I don't know what to say.

I mean, Marty has never had an ax to grind with anyone, and has never let his personal feelings toward someone influence what he says :lol: