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View Full Version : Cards fan thoughts about losing Waino



Defacto
02-23-2011, 06:53 PM
I'm upset that he's likely for the season with TJS. But I honestly don't think it ruins the Cards chances at winning the division. He won't be easy to replace, that's for sure. But it probably took the Cards from a high eighties-low nineties win team to a mid to low eighties win team, which is where most of the division will be. It should be a fun season.

mroby85
02-23-2011, 07:08 PM
At this point i'm more concerned about the Brewers. I think they could be legit this year and losing Wainwright hurts you guys significantly because of the lack of depth that was already in your rotation. Wainwright and Carpenter were absolute studs, and Garcia is tough too, but dropping Garcia to 2, and 3 very weak spots in the rotation, I think it hurts big time, but thats just me.

Defacto
02-23-2011, 07:15 PM
At this point i'm more concerned about the Brewers. I think they could be legit this year and losing Wainwright hurts you guys significantly because of the lack of depth that was already in your rotation. Wainwright and Carpenter were absolute studs, and Garcia is tough too, but dropping Garcia to 2, and 3 very weak spots in the rotation, I think it hurts big time, but thats just me.

I agree to some extent. I'm worried about the Brewers, too, but we don't know how Greinke will be in the NL and if he will have another mental break down or not. The Cards rotation now looks like this:

1: Carpenter
2: Garcia/Westbrook
3: Westbrook/Garcia(I think the 2nd and 3rd spot is pretty even right now. I doubt Jaime has the season like he had in 2010, but it shouldn't be a big fall off)
4:Lohse
5:Lynn/McClellan/Walters

I feel pretty comfortable with the 1-3 spots, as long as Garcia doesn't have a huge sophomore slump. Lohse is the key, IMO, to Cards success or failure. He has to pitch better than he did the past 2 seasons for the Cards to have a chance. I think Lynn or McClellan will get the nod as the 5th starter, with Walters looking from the outside in. If they can post around a 10-10 record and a 4.00 ERA, that's a good thing for the Cards, once again IMO. Or Lynn could have a year like Garcia did. Anyways, it's too early to tell. All I know is that the division will be close.

New York Red
02-23-2011, 07:32 PM
I'm upset that he's likely for the season with TJS. But I honestly don't think it ruins the Cards chances at winning the division. He won't be easy to replace, that's for sure. But it probably took the Cards from a high eighties-low nineties win team to a mid to low eighties win team, which is where most of the division will be. It should be a fun season.
I seriously doubt 85 wins would be enough to win the division.

Stray
02-23-2011, 07:34 PM
I think it will take 91-93 wins to win the Central this year.

RedsLvr
02-23-2011, 07:42 PM
To be honest I'm seriously questioning the Cardinals ability to be a .500 team this year. Your only hope at being in contention is Chris Carpenter, and he's the most injury prone pitcher you have. Good luck, my friend.

mckbearcat48
02-23-2011, 08:03 PM
Well, Defacto said it well. Tough blow, but nobody's going to go unscathed. Good luck to everybody.

bellhead
02-23-2011, 08:37 PM
Would rather beat you at full strength. Tough break.

Nathan
02-23-2011, 11:14 PM
I honestly think this blow pretty much eliminates the Cards chances this year. The Reds and Brewers are really too strong to overcome this.

My prediction right now knowing Wainwrights injury:

Reds
Brewers
Cards
Cubs
'Stros
Buccos

It'll be between the Reds and Brewers this year. If the Brewers loose a pitcher for an extended amount of time, they will probably be out too.

Swampturkey
02-26-2011, 05:38 PM
Would rather beat you at full strength. Tough break.

I'm glad to read someone who feels as I do. I was always taught that to be the best, you have to beat the best.

ezluke
02-26-2011, 06:54 PM
[QUOTE=Defacto;2327285]I agree to some extent. I'm worried about the Brewers, too, but we don't know how Greinke will be in the NL and if he will have another mental break down or not. The Cards rotation now looks like this:

I think the chances of Carpenter getting hurt again are far, far greater than Greinke having another mental breakdown

Vottomatic
02-27-2011, 03:23 AM
I'm just simply enjoying watching the Cardinals fall apart. Watching King Albert leave for the Cubs after the season will be reason for celebration.

goreds2
02-27-2011, 11:10 AM
I'm glad to read someone who feels as I do. I was always taught that to be the best, you have to beat the best.

We will save that slogan for the playoffs.

OfficerRodFarva
02-27-2011, 11:56 AM
I still think it will be a dogfight between the Reds and Cards for the Central. I'm just not comfortable putting Milwaukee up there. I really think they are #3

UCBrownsfan
02-28-2011, 12:41 PM
It wouldn't suprise me to see St Louis 4 or 5 this year without Wainwright.

Milwaukee added a lot, Houston played great down the stretch and you never know what Chicago is capable of.

Carpenter is 35 and has only once followed a 200+ inning season successfully, they very well could be down 2 players. I think Garcia is vastly overrated, he was protected by home stat-keeping giving him a ton of home unearned runs, and got a quick hook. I personally think losing Pujols would have hurt them less than Wainwright - Berkman could have been plugged in at 1B instead of the OF.

Carpenter and Garcia combined for 30 Unearned runs, while Wainwright had 6. further seperating their ERA's when you account the R's scored against. Losing Wainwright will overload Carpenter to rest the St Louis bullpen. The other factor is, it's not just plugging in averages up in the rotation, Wainwright threw for 230 inns last year, that's a lot to make up for. Whenever Garcia pitched last year he had a very rest bullpen following Wainwright and Carpenter, the Cardinals could pull him at any sign of trouble.

Vottomatic
02-28-2011, 04:54 PM
It wouldn't suprise me to see St Louis 4 or 5 this year without Wainwright.

Milwaukee added a lot, Houston played great down the stretch and you never know what Chicago is capable of.

Carpenter is 35 and has only once followed a 200+ inning season successfully, they very well could be down 2 players. I think Garcia is vastly overrated, he was protected by home stat-keeping giving him a ton of home unearned runs, and got a quick hook. I personally think losing Pujols would have hurt them less than Wainwright - Berkman could have been plugged in at 1B instead of the OF.

Carpenter and Garcia combined for 30 Unearned runs, while Wainwright had 6. further seperating their ERA's when you account the R's scored against. Losing Wainwright will overload Carpenter to rest the St Louis bullpen. The other factor is, it's not just plugging in averages up in the rotation, Wainwright threw for 230 inns last year, that's a lot to make up for. Whenever Garcia pitched last year he had a very rest bullpen following Wainwright and Carpenter, the Cardinals could pull him at any sign of trouble.

If the Cards are out of it, come July, the best thing they can do is tank the season and hope King Albert changes his mind about being traded at the deadline, to a contender. I wouldn't put it past him.

In the second half of '09, the Reds were one of the hottest teams in the NL. In '10, Houston was the hottest team in the second half. I think you're analogy has some merit.

It wouldn't surprise me to see Wainwright's injury and Pujols at the end of his Cardinals career, be enough to take the wind out of the Cardinals sails.

OGB
02-28-2011, 05:20 PM
I hadn't even thought about this until Marty and Jim brought it up during Sunday's game, but Wainwright may have played his last game in a Cardinal uniform. He has an option for 2012, but in all likelihood, he won't be able to pitch in the big leagues until August of 2012 at the earliest.

It doesn't seem like a prudent move to pick up an expensive option in the offseson on the off chance that 7 months later, he'll be ready to help you for 6-7 weeks.

If it works out that way, the Cards will have lost Wainwright and not even gotten any young players in return for him. That's a huge blow to that franchise, considering Wainwright has been one of the top 5 pitchers in the NL over the past few seasons.



Edited to add: I just looked at his contract situation and the Cardinals have a $9 million option for 2012 and a $13 million dollar option for 2013, so maybe the chances of him leaving St. Louis aren't as great as Marty made them out to be.