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CySeymour
04-01-2011, 09:57 AM
I am not sure if others had this same thought, but I was very disappointed in Dusty's use of the bullpen yesterday. Now first off, I am ecstatic they won! The job of the GM is to give the manager as deep a team as he can, in some ways to protect the manager from himself. However, with the game still winnable late, why was Dusty going to at best his 4th, 5th, 6th best relievers? It was the first game of the season, so everyone was rested PLUS today is an off day. I just found it very odd, and moves like this during the season could cost the Reds some games. Yes, for the most part the bullpen did it's job, but that is hindsight.

Captain13
04-01-2011, 10:08 AM
I understand what you are saying about today being an off day and having a rested bullpen, but you are not going to use Chapman and Cordero when you are down. The bullpen threw a combined three innings giving up one run (which could have been ruled unearned). I think Dusty should have confidence in every pitcher's ability to get guys out and Bray, LeCure and Ondrusek all did their jobs very well. Sure, Burton struggled but he sure did have some help from Gomes.

Spazzrico
04-01-2011, 10:09 AM
I think it was pretty standard managing. Conversely, what if he goes with the big dogs, you still get blown out and the next three days you have leads late in the game? Then your bullpen has already been spent needlessly and you wind up blowing leads.

Seriously, no need to criticize this early for something 95% of managers would have done.

DaytonFlyer
04-01-2011, 10:13 AM
Yeah, I had no problem with this. You don't bring out your big dogs down 4 runs in the late innings.

CySeymour
04-01-2011, 10:26 AM
I understand what each of you are saying, and the bottom line is those who pitched today did the job. But, with the team that is very capable of coming back (which they did), I think Dusty's job is to, as a matter of rule, slam the door on the other team with the best pitchers in that situation he has. But, hey, it worked, so I guess who am I :)

DaytonFlyer
04-01-2011, 10:40 AM
Well if you do that, then Chapman and Masset will be pitching in 120 games this year. It's just not realistic. I agree with you in principle, but just thought that yesterday he acted exactly as I thought he should've.

webbbj
04-01-2011, 11:02 AM
I understand what each of you are saying, and the bottom line is those who pitched today did the job. But, with the team that is very capable of coming back (which they did), I think Dusty's job is to, as a matter of rule, slam the door on the other team with the best pitchers in that situation he has. But, hey, it worked, so I guess who am I :)

then by that token theres basically no reason to have ondrusek, bray, lecure, burton, etc on the team as ur top guys would pitch every game essentially.

Chapman, Masset, and cordero are the lead holders, or guys who come in tie games or 1 run deficits.

those other guys are early game relievers, specialists, or extra innings inning eaters or guys that pitch in 3+ run games.

CySeymour
04-01-2011, 11:12 AM
then by that token theres basically no reason to have ondrusek, bray, lecure, burton, etc on the team as ur top guys would pitch every game essentially.

Chapman, Masset, and cordero are the lead holders, or guys who come in tie games or 1 run deficits.

those other guys are early game relievers, specialists, or extra innings inning eaters or guys that pitch in 3+ run games.

I get that, don't get me wrong. My only point was, it was game number 1 and you had an off day the next day. The starter got you through six innings, and you were within striking distance, so why in the late innings trot out the bottem part of the bullpen?

But as I said, they did the job and the team won, so who am I to second guess it?

Who Dey Time
04-01-2011, 11:30 AM
I am not sure if others had this same thought, but I was very disappointed in Dusty's use of the bullpen yesterday. Now first off, I am ecstatic they won! The job of the GM is to give the manager as deep a team as he can, in some ways to protect the manager from himself. However, with the game still winnable late, why was Dusty going to at best his 4th, 5th, 6th best relievers? It was the first game of the season, so everyone was rested PLUS today is an off day. I just found it very odd, and moves like this during the season could cost the Reds some games. Yes, for the most part the bullpen did it's job, but that is hindsight.

95% of the time you are going to use your set-up man and closer in hold/save situations. Obviously, yesterday's game presented neither opportunity. Makes no sense, IMO, to bring those two in down 4-runs when I'm sure there will be more than enough situations in the coming days, weeks, and months to bring them in to do what they are asked to do.

BigJohn
04-01-2011, 11:43 AM
I was just glad to see Ondrusek get the win, I had seats right by the pen and he threw about 100 warm up pitches. He was ready when he got the call!
It is really neat to sit where you can watch all the neat activity out there near the bullpen!

brm7675
04-01-2011, 12:25 PM
How did he go to his 4th or 5th or 6th best guy?

defender
04-01-2011, 01:56 PM
I am not sure if others had this same thought, but I was very disappointed in Dusty's use of the bullpen yesterday. Now first off, I am ecstatic they won! The job of the GM is to give the manager as deep a team as he can, in some ways to protect the manager from himself. However, with the game still winnable late, why was Dusty going to at best his 4th, 5th, 6th best relievers? It was the first game of the season, so everyone was rested PLUS today is an off day. I just found it very odd, and moves like this during the season could cost the Reds some games. Yes, for the most part the bullpen did it's job, but that is hindsight.

In another thread you posted that Baker is good at getting the players to embrace thier roles. Players respond to what Baker says, because he backs it up with action. He gives the players roles, and uses them in those roles.

CySeymour
04-01-2011, 01:57 PM
In another thread you posted that Baker is good at getting the players to embrace thier roles. Players respond to what Baker says, because he backs it up with action. He gives the players roles, and uses them in those roles.

Correct, I did say that. I was pointing out that is a strength of Baker. But hey, you folks have shown that me I was over thinking the game yesterday. No worries.

RedsLvr
04-01-2011, 07:04 PM
I get the impression that Ondrusek will be one of our better relievers this year..

Mutaman
04-02-2011, 12:38 AM
A season is 162 games long. You cannot use the same pitchers in every game. Thats why there are 10 guys on a pitching staff. You do not bring in your big set up men in the middle of a game in March, down by 3 runs in 50 degree weather. If you do, you won't have a bullpen by August.

markymark69
04-02-2011, 10:30 AM
I think it was pretty standard managing. Conversely, what if he goes with the big dogs, you still get blown out and the next three days you have leads late in the game? Then your bullpen has already been spent needlessly and you wind up blowing leads.

Seriously, no need to criticize this early for something 95% of managers would have done.

Exactly. Boy are we off to a great start - the Reds win in dramatic fashion and Dutsy gets banged on - thank you RedsZone fans - at least you're consistent.

R_Webb18
04-02-2011, 01:49 PM
no matter what dusty does its never the right move. give me a break people he did the right thing