2011 WVU Football Thread

[WVRed]

Thought this was an interesting read by Bruce Feldman from ESPN.com on WVU possibly being in a national title chase this year:

http://insider.espn.go.com/ncf/blog?name=feldman_bruce&id=6522682&addata=2009_insdr_mod_ncf_xxx_xxx&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fncf %2fblog%3fname%3dfeldman_bruce%26id%3d6522682%26ad data%3d2009_insdr_mod_ncf_xxx_xxx

This is free material, but in summary, expect a big jump offensively under Holgorsen. What is going to be interesting is the WVU-LSU, with LSU a possible no 1 team if they can knock Oregon off to start the season.

Then again, I remember that while Holgorsen is in Morgantown, Bill Stewart is still the head coach for one more year.

[will5979]

Bill Stewart is still the head coach for one more year.

Ugh, after watching the Reds lose today and then reading this I just barfed in the back of my throat. :barf:

My early 2011 prediction, 11-1, they'll find a way to lose a game. Finish regular season winning the Big East being ranked in the top 10 and play in a BCS Bowl where they belong.

[WVRed]

Ugh, after watching the Reds lose today and then reading this I just barfed in the back of my throat. :barf:

My early 2011 prediction, 11-1, they'll find a way to lose a game. Finish regular season winning the Big East being ranked in the top 10 and play in a BCS Bowl where they belong.

I see the potential for them to go undefeated, but I am with you in that I think they will lose at least one game. Here's the schedule:

Sep. 3 Marshall 3:30pm

The only way WVU has any problem with the Herd is if they are still working out the kinks of the new offense. The game is in Morgantown so I'd say it will be more like two years ago, close game first half, WVU pulls away in the second when Marshall runs out of gas.

Sep. 10 Norfolk St. TBA

Should be getting everything straightened out before the real games begin. WVU wins easily.

Sep. 17 at Maryland 12:00pm

Probably one of the most difficult to gauge. Randy Edsall is the new coach at Maryland and he has given WVU fits the past two years, including winning one at Connecticut. WVU wins a close one.

Sep. 24 LSU TBA

Game of the year. LSU will be a top 3 team and could possibly be no 1 if they beat Oregon heading into Morgantown. This is a must win game for WVU to have any credibility to playing for a national championship.

Oct. 1 Bowling Green TBA

Don't know much about Bowling Green, but should be an easy win.

Oct. 8 Connecticut TBA

Revenge game for WVU at home, new coach for UConn. WVU wins.

Oct. 21 at Syracuse 8:00pm

Another revenge game. WVU lost last year thanks to Stewarts ineptitude. Won't happen with Holgorsen running the offense. WVU wins.

Oct. 29 at Rutgers TBA

Saw WVU play Rutgers last season and while WVU turned the ball over numerous times, they still outmanned Rutgers considerably. WVU wins.

Nov. 5 Louisville TBA

Potential upset game. Charlie Strong is in his second season and this will be a game where his defense tests Holgorsen's offense. WVU wins based on home field advantage.

Nov. 12 at Cincinnati TBA

Cincinnati is going in the wrong direction under Butch Jones. WVU wins easily.

Nov. 25 Pittsburgh TBA

New coach for Pitt as they screwed up twice. Shouldn't be a problem for WVU.

Dec. 1 at South Florida 8:00pm

This is the trap game of all trap games and if I had to call an upset, this would be it. Skip Holtz has had WVU's number ever since he has been at ECU and is starting to turn it around in South Beach. The game is at USF and WVU could have a lot to close out.

Maryland, LSU, Louisville, and South Florida would be the games to watch. If WVU wins those four, they should be in discussion for a national championship game. I have to think the overall quality of the Big East will have a say though, as this is the weakest the Big East has been in awhile.

[WVRed]

Looks like Holgoritaville (as someone I saw on facebook called it) is off to a good start:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6589966

[Homer Bailey]

If anyone thought "Holgorsen drunk, kicked out of casino" wasn't a possibility when he was hired, you were way off.

[reds1869]

If anyone thought "Holgorsen drunk, kicked out of casino" wasn't a possibility when he was hired, you were way off.

No doubt. If Morgantown likes Huggins, it should be right at home with Holgorsen.

[WVRed]

No doubt. If Morgantown likes Huggins, it should be right at home with Holgorsen.

With WVU fans, Huggins DUI is in the past because it happened at UC. If it had happened while he was coaching, I think the fan reaction would have been different. That's just me though.

It's like when we had Billy Gillispie at Kentucky. He had an incident similar to this when he first came to Lexington and was brought in and reminded that he is a popular figure in the state.

I've got a different view on Holgorsen than most. I believe he will either return WVU to prominence as a stepping stone or have them on probation within the next five years. There is no in-between. The reason I say that is the coaches that he comes from the Mike Leach-Hal Mumme family tree.

What burned WVU fans over Rich Rodriguez leaving in addition to how he left was that he was a West Virginia native. Holgorsen doesn't have those ties and is rooted in the Big 12 (notably in Texas). I could see him leaving WVU for a top tier Big 12 job if the right opportunity comes along.

[Homer Bailey]

Wow. @colin_dunlap dropped a major bomb on @937lateshift about @coachstewart. Stew called Dunlap asking for dirt on Holgorsen. #byebyestew

Oh. My. God.

[WVRed]

Oh. My. God.

I was about to post something about that last night. This is getting ugly real quick.

Here's a little bit more detailed article:

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/24156338/29855310

At first I thought the coach-in-waiting idea would work. Stewart is not a popular coach among WVU fans and attendance has suffered accordingly, but I do believe he genuinely loves the program (unlike Rich Rodriguez) and this would have worked.

At the same time, I'm not high on Holgorsen and the more that is coming out (You can shoot the messenger in Stewart), it's seeming like he is more of a liability.

There is even speculation that BOTH could be shown the door. Stewart for his smear tactics. Holgorsen for the alcohol.

[Homer Bailey]

I was about to post something about that last night. This is getting ugly real quick.

Here's a little bit more detailed article:

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/24156338/29855310

At first I thought the coach-in-waiting idea would work. Stewart is not a popular coach among WVU fans and attendance has suffered accordingly, but I do believe he genuinely loves the program (unlike Rich Rodriguez) and this would have worked.

At the same time, I'm not high on Holgorsen and the more that is coming out (You can shoot the messenger in Stewart), it's seeming like he is more of a liability.

There is even speculation that BOTH could be shown the door. Stewart for his smear tactics. Holgorsen for the alcohol.

I don't see how they could get rid of both. I think Stew is DONE-SO at some point this week, and Holgorsen will take over.

[WVRed]

I don't see how they could get rid of both. I think Stew is DONE-SO at some point this week, and Holgorsen will take over.

Agree on Stewart, I think he is gone regardless.

If there is any truth to the alcohol claims, and given the Mardi Gras incident a couple weeks ago, WVU might cut their losses on both. It's not entirely outside of the realm of possibility, especially if Holgorsen's a full blown alkie. Get rid of both, make Jeff Casteel the interim HC, and see who is available next offseason.

I know people like to point out Huggins past with the bottle, but that is exactly that. The Past. It's pretty damning in this case when Holgorsen is already creating negative publicity in the state before he has even coached in one game. If Holgorsen is retained and he ends up flaming out in three years, then Oliver Luck's job is on the line.

For some reason I keep thinking this situation belongs on a playground.

[IslandRed]

I don't see how they could get rid of both. I think Stew is DONE-SO at some point this week, and Holgorsen will take over.


Agree on Stewart, I think he is gone regardless.

If there is any truth to the alcohol claims, and given the Mardi Gras incident a couple weeks ago, WVU might cut their losses on both. It's not entirely outside of the realm of possibility, especially if Holgorsen's a full blown alkie. Get rid of both, make Jeff Casteel the interim HC, and see who is available next offseason.

I don't have a dog in the fight so feel free to disregard, but if I was a WVU fan, I have to admit I'd be concerned about Holgorsen. I don't question his cred as an offensive coordinator, but head coach is an entirely different job description, and this sort of thing doesn't bode well for making that transition.

Does Holgorsen's contract dictate that he takes over for Stewart whenever Stewart leaves, or does it not guarantee him the job until 2012? Wondering if it's contractually possible that Stewart hits the road but Casteel takes over as interim HC while Holgorsen remains OC and cools his heels as a punishment/probationary period of sorts.

[Homer Bailey]

I don't have a dog in the fight so feel free to disregard, but if I was a WVU fan, I have to admit I'd be concerned about Holgorsen. I don't question his cred as an offensive coordinator, but head coach is an entirely different job description, and this sort of thing doesn't bode well for making that transition.

Does Holgorsen's contract dictate that he takes over for Stewart whenever Stewart leaves, or does it not guarantee him the job until 2012? Wondering if it's contractually possible that Stewart hits the road but Casteel takes over as interim HC while Holgorsen remains OC and cools his heels as a punishment/probationary period of sorts.

If Holgorsen has a drinking problem, the severity is not known yet to the public, as its incredibly clear that Landon's "column" can not be trusted. We can only hope that Holgorsen has learned his lesson from the bad press he's gotten, and it hopefully it won't be a problem going forward.

[IslandRed]

If Holgorsen has a drinking problem, the severity is not known yet to the public, as its incredibly clear that Landon's "column" can not be trusted. We can only hope that Holgorsen has learned his lesson from the bad press he's gotten, and it hopefully it won't be a problem going forward.

Thanks. You'd hope so, for his sake if no one else's.

[WVRed]

This article pretty much sums it up:

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/15209538/if-nothing-else-stewarts-final-season-at-wvu-will-be-weird

Pretty bad when Mike Leach calls the move by Stewart "underhanded and hillbilly".

[WVRed]

Looks like they are trying to buy out Stew.

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/06/09/report-says-wvu-ready-to-buy-out-bill-stewarts-contract/related

Most WVU fans are getting what they want. Just hope they aren't counting on Holgorsen being around longer than five years.

[Homer Bailey]

Stewart’s attorney, David Hendrickson, has gone on the record to say he does not know of any contract negotiations with his client.

“There have been no negotiations,” Hendrickson told the Charleston Gazette Thursday evening. “I haven’t heard from the athletic department today.”

[WVRed]

And now this little gem from ESPN:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6647704


West Virginia football coach Bill Stewart's future with the university is in serious jeopardy, and the situation could come to a head as early as Friday, a source close to the program told ESPN's Joe Schad.

School leaders also are pondering whether terminating the coach-in-waiting scenario it created this year with offensive coordinator Dana Holgorsen would be in the best interests of the program, the source said. Holgorsen is scheduled to succeed Stewart after the coming season.

[will5979]

Its time for WVU to literally cut its loses with the moron. He should have never been hired in the first place, however a bunch of drunks at 3 am hired him after the Fiesta Bowl win over Oklahoma where they really didn't even need a HC to earn a victory with all the talent that team had.

I realize Holgerson won't be in Mo-Town forever, but I'm all for a 5 year fix of blowing teams out! Just like I would be willing for the Reds organization to trade prospects for a win now mentality. I live in the moment, tomorrow we may be dead.

[KronoRed]

Most WVU fans are getting what they want. Just hope they aren't counting on Holgorsen being around longer than five years.

I'll surprised if it's more then Two years, he does well he goes back to the big12-2, he does badly he'll scandal himself out of town.

This is 100 percent on the school, just fire the guy December and get it over with, the coach in waiting stuff was idiotic.

[Slyder]

Barney Fife is gone! He was in over his head the entire time he was at WVU.

[will5979]

Barney Fife is gone! He was in over his head the entire time he was at WVU.

Amen!

[WVRed]

I'll surprised if it's more then Two years, he does well he goes back to the big12-2, he does badly he'll scandal himself out of town.

This is 100 percent on the school, just fire the guy December and get it over with, the coach in waiting stuff was idiotic.

Coach-in-waiting only works in one area, if the coach who is outgoing picks his replacement.

Barry Alvarez picked Bret Bielema at Wisconsin. Mike Belotti picked Chip Kelly at Oregon. Bobby Bowden picked Jimbo Fisher at FSU. It can and does work.

The only school I don't think it had success at before was Texas with Will Muschamp and Mack Brown, because Brown wasn't going to retire anytime soon.

I did think Stewart and Holgorsen could have made it work for one season, just because Stewart was a class act guy who would have done it for the school. Of course, that was before the smear campaign for Holgorsen.

Wouldn't be shocked if Stewart returns to coaching, possibly with the Steelers in some capacity. Mike Tomlin got his start under Bill Stewart at VMI. He might return the favor.

[RichRed]

What do you WVU fans think of the reported near-deal to play JMU at FedEx Field? We JMU fans are thrilled about it but it looks like the reaction from WVU folks is very mixed.

[Slyder]

What do you WVU fans think of the reported near-deal to play JMU at FedEx Field? We JMU fans are thrilled about it but it looks like the reaction from WVU folks is very mixed.

as in James Madison? If youre going to get a game there make it someone that screams guarentee tv like Penn State, Maryland, BYU, etc. I can't get that jazzed over James Madison, Coastal Carolina, etc.

[RichRed]

as in James Madison? If youre going to get a game there make it someone that screams guarentee tv like Penn State, Maryland, BYU, etc. I can't get that jazzed over James Madison, Coastal Carolina, etc.

Don't worry, neither could Va. Tech last year. :D

[Slyder]

Don't worry, neither could Va. Tech last year. :D

Stewart got canned so there went your best shot :lol: and I am not paid to gameplan.

[WVRed]

Stewart got canned so there went your best shot :lol: and I am not paid to gameplan.

Sad reality is, Frank Beamer >>>> Dana Holgorsen. And I'm pretty indifferent when it comes to Va Tech.

At this point, I would say Bud Foster would be an equal head coach as well if he had a gig.

That being said, I don't think JMU is going to be the college football equivalent of Butler anytime soon. If that game was played 9 times out of 10, VT would have still won.

[Homer Bailey]

Five short days away from the Dana Holgorsen era, and I can hardly wait.

Here (http://www.smokingmusket.com/2011/8/30/2392240/2011-wvu-football-season-preview-running-backs)is a little preview on the WVU RB situation this year:


At the running back spot, four are in the mix for playing time. Trey Johnson, Vernard Roberts, Andrew Buie, and Dustin Garrison will all see the field Sunday. Johnson is the only one to have seen game action and the other three running backs are all true freshman. The fact that the unit is so young should be a positive in that it's probably a lot easier to get them to buy into the "by committee" approach. No one's been around long enough to feel like they own that spot. But they all want it, and if that kind of competition lasts throughout the year it will be a positive when injuries occur.

I can't wait to see what Geno does in this offense. I think Stedman Bailey and Tavon Austin are in for some really big years. The defense worries me a lot more than the offense does. A lot of guys to replace back there, and they will probably be on the field quite a bit.

I think we roll Marshall about 41-21. Close around halftime like it always is, and WVU pulls away late.

[WVRed]

Five short days away from the Dana Holgorsen era, and I can hardly wait.

Here (http://www.smokingmusket.com/2011/8/30/2392240/2011-wvu-football-season-preview-running-backs)is a little preview on the WVU RB situation this year:



I can't wait to see what Geno does in this offense. I think Stedman Bailey and Tavon Austin are in for some really big years. The defense worries me a lot more than the offense does. A lot of guys to replace back there, and they will probably be on the field quite a bit.

I think we roll Marshall about 41-21. Close around halftime like it always is, and WVU pulls away late.

I talked to a friend of mine who is a Marshall alum. He predicted at halftime that Marshall would blow the game in the 4th quarter last year. We both agree on the final score (35-17), just a difference in how they get there. He thinks WVU coasts, I'm more in agreement with you in that its close at halftime.

I think WVU will sputter on offense the first half. Rookie head coach running a new system and Marshall ALWAYS plays a good first half against the Mountaineers. Ultimately, fatigue sets in for the Herd, WVU will pass more than Marshall can defend (Holliday dismissed two starting senior CB's for drugs), and it's over.

I'm predicting 10-2 or 11-1, depends on LSU and how long their players are sidelined. I see them dropping one game, likely Maryland with Randy Edsall, on the road, and the Terps have a week off to prepare. It will culminate in a BCS game against a Big 12, Va Tech, or SEC team in which WVU will get slaughtered.

[Homer Bailey]

I'm predicting 10-2 or 11-1, depends on LSU and how long their players are sidelined. I see them dropping one game, likely Maryland with Randy Edsall, on the road, and the Terps have a week off to prepare. It will culminate in a BCS game against a Big 12, Va Tech, or SEC team in which WVU will get slaughtered.

Wheeeeere have I heard this before?

West Virginia vs. Georgia - The 2006 Sugar Bowl - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79t0DIGvUss)

West Virginia Makes Lee Corso Go Beserk by Beating Oklahoma - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHb5E1BPNQ4)

Against All Odds - WVU Football 2008 - Fiesta Bowl (vs. Oklahoma) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VpMxuBYIsk)

In all seriousness, I feel like WVU can play with anyone, and lose to anyone. I won't have a good grasp on this team until at least after week one.

[Slyder]

Still one of my favorite video clips is of the Run Away Beer Truck Owen Schmitt. And I love seeing Corso getting taken behind the woodshed. I would love to see him up in Morgantown with a "How about Oklahoma, Lee?" sign in the immediate background.

[will5979]

35-17...you may be right but I think too many people are giving Marshall entirely too much credit this year...now we have a coach with zero connections to the state, loves offense, and will not mind to run up the score (which I will thoroughly enjoy and have greatly missed during the Good Golly Gee Bill Stewart era).

Im sticking to my original prediction for the Friends of Joe Bowl.

WVU-55
Marshla-6

[WVRed]

Wheeeeere have I heard this before?

In all seriousness, I feel like WVU can play with anyone, and lose to anyone. I won't have a good grasp on this team until at least after week one.

I don't disagree, but that was then under Rich Rodriguez and the emotional high of him leaving that they beat Oklahoma.

It's more a testament to how weak the Big East is. Louisville and UC were competitive at the time and they have went through coaching changes and fallen completely off (although Louisville is on the way back). UConn and Pitt are both going through changes and won't be in discussion.

Outside of Maryland and maybe LSU depending on suspensions, I think WVU runs the table on a crappy Big East conference. They will be the least battletested team in the BCS and that is what I think will cost them.

[WVRed]

35-17...you may be right but I think too many people are giving Marshall entirely too much credit this year...now we have a coach with zero connections to the state, loves offense, and will not mind to run up the score (which I will thoroughly enjoy and have greatly missed during the Good Golly Gee Bill Stewart era).

Im sticking to my original prediction for the Friends of Joe Bowl.

WVU-55
Marshla-6

Not giving Marshall credit at all. WVU is going to pass more than Marshall can defend but this is still the first game of the season and the first time executing a new offense in something other than practice. By the third quarter WVU will be rolling, but before then it will probably be sloppy.

Next year (assuming the Friends of Joe Bowl is still intact, not sure when it runs out), I would predict a blowout unless Geno leaves for the NFL (doubt it).

[Slyder]

I don't disagree, but that was then under Rich Rodriguez and the emotional high of him leaving that they beat Oklahoma.

It's more a testament to how weak the Big East is. Louisville and UC were competitive at the time and they have went through coaching changes and fallen completely off (although Louisville is on the way back). UConn and Pitt are both going through changes and won't be in discussion.

Outside of Maryland and maybe LSU depending on suspensions, I think WVU runs the table on a crappy Big East conference. They will be the least battletested team in the BCS and that is what I think will cost them.

I'm actually more worried about Marshall with it being the first game there is bound to be more "hiccups" than Maryland. We don't have Stew and Crew calling the shots on offense now. Note I am not saying Marshall wins, just that it might be tighter than expected as we have a huge sea change in philosophy on offense and lost a lot of starters on defense. WVU pulls away in the 2nd half.

WVU 45
Marshall 17

[WVRed]

I'm actually more worried about Marshall with it being the first game there is bound to be more "hiccups" than Maryland. We don't have Stew and Crew calling the shots on offense now. Note I am not saying Marshall wins, just that it might be tighter than expected as we have a huge sea change in philosophy on offense and lost a lot of starters on defense. WVU pulls away in the 2nd half.

WVU 45
Marshall 17

Took the words right out of my mouth.

Maryland IMO is the perfect storm. They have a week off to rest and gameplan, it's at College Park, and Randy Edsall has had some degree of success against WVU. It's also going to be the first legit game for the Mountaineers against a quality opponent.

[Captain13]

Took the words right out of my mouth.

Maryland IMO is the perfect storm. They have a week off to rest and gameplan, it's at College Park, and Randy Edsall has had some degree of success against WVU. It's also going to be the first legit game for the Mountaineers against a quality opponent.

From a (relatively) unbiased outsider, I'm not convinced MD is a quality opponent. I think WVU rolls to a 17 point victory. This is the year the Big East starts to perform in football.

[Slyder]

Took the words right out of my mouth.

Maryland IMO is the perfect storm. They have a week off to rest and gameplan, it's at College Park, and Randy Edsall has had some degree of success against WVU. It's also going to be the first legit game for the Mountaineers against a quality opponent.

But Edsall is also using Fridge's recruits right now. He's trying to fit pieces into his offense just like Holgorson is. I don't think that's an advantage for him.

[marcshoe]

I'm not as psyched for this season as I should be.I liked the Holgerson hire and think you'll see some surprising things from Steadman Bailey this season, but emotionally, I'm not there yet. Probably still down from the Reds' season and need to see some action.

[will5979]

I'm not as psyched for this season as I should be.I liked the Holgerson hire and think you'll see some surprising things from Steadman Bailey this season, but emotionally, I'm not there yet. Probably still down from the Reds' season and need to see some action.

^ This...I haven't been THIS depressed over the Reds since the 2000 season.

02, 04, & 06 had me going until the All-Star break, then the reality set in. With this year it doesn't seem real at all that the Reds suck, I just don't get it. This team should have repeated, they have better pitching than the Brewers.

[WVRed]

The game has been in a prolonged lightning delay since midway through the third quarter. WVU is up 27-13 but its been a lot closer. Marshall had the momentum even though they had to settle for a field goal before Tavon Austin returned a kickoff return 100 yards before the delay.

From what I have heard inside Morgantown, people are staying in the tunnels and indoor practice facility waiting it out. They've been told that the game will be finished, even if its at 4 in the morning. I think it should be called but it will benefit Marshall if they come back out. Marshall is better suited for a ground game than WVU and 2 TDs isn't that difficult to overcome, especially with most of the fans leaving and WVU's passing attack being quarantined.

[Slyder]

The game has been in a prolonged lightning delay since midway through the third quarter. WVU is up 27-13 but its been a lot closer. Marshall had the momentum even though they had to settle for a field goal before Tavon Austin returned a kickoff return 100 yards before the delay.

From what I have heard inside Morgantown, people are staying in the tunnels and indoor practice facility waiting it out. They've been told that the game will be finished, even if its at 4 in the morning. I think it should be called but it will benefit Marshall if they come back out. Marshall is better suited for a ground game than WVU and 2 TDs isn't that difficult to overcome, especially with most of the fans leaving and WVU's passing attack being quarantined.

I really disagree. Outside of the punt return Marshall's offense has done very little. The defense shouldn't be as dominant as last year (would be hard to) but it's stepped up when it's needed. When this game is resumed I don't think Marshall has the talent to make up the deficit because Coach Holgerson appears to be a much better tactical coach than Stew, his teams are not going to make the same mistakes we saw under Stew. Am I ready to annoit them 12-0? No, but with the way this game has flowed I have no doubts that WVU should and will win comfortably.

The biggest differences I see in this game is largely the use of Geno Smith. Last year Stew and Co tried to take Geno and make him into Pat White. Coach Holgerson seems to understand what Geno is and doing what plays to that. We have not seen a single designed QB draw all day, which IMO is a good thing. Pat's first instinct was always first read wasn't there to take off, nothing wrong with that in college because Pat had the pure athleticism/speed to make people miss and take it to the house. Geno's first instinct is use his legs to move and buy time to throw it down the field.

The other difference that I have seen is not a single stupid penalty against WVU. Many games I found myself cursing at the tv or throwing something because of just moronic penalties (usually at the absolute WORST times).

[WVRed]

The game resumed long enough for WVU to score a TD. Delayed again in the fourth quarter.

I'm for Marshall but this game needs to be called. It would be an impossible comeback and with the field conditions it doesn't make sense to keep playing and open it up for possible injuries.

[Slyder]

The game resumed long enough for WVU to score a TD. Delayed again in the fourth quarter.

I'm for Marshall but this game needs to be called. It would be an impossible comeback and with the field conditions it doesn't make sense to keep playing and open it up for possible injuries.

Field will be fine, the field turf drains well enough that short of MONSTEROUS rains (like Vermont in that storm).

[reds1869]

I'm a Marshall fan and have to say I'm impressed with the use of Geno Smith. I also think, on my side of things, that Marshall has something in our freshman QB.

[WVRed]

I really disagree. Outside of the punt return Marshall's offense has done very little. The defense shouldn't be as dominant as last year (would be hard to) but it's stepped up when it's needed. When this game is resumed I don't think Marshall has the talent to make up the deficit because Coach Holgerson appears to be a much better tactical coach than Stew, his teams are not going to make the same mistakes we saw under Stew. Am I ready to annoit them 12-0? No, but with the way this game has flowed I have no doubts that WVU should and will win comfortably.

The biggest differences I see in this game is largely the use of Geno Smith. Last year Stew and Co tried to take Geno and make him into Pat White. Coach Holgerson seems to understand what Geno is and doing what plays to that. We have not seen a single designed QB draw all day, which IMO is a good thing. Pat's first instinct was always first read wasn't there to take off, nothing wrong with that in college because Pat had the pure athleticism/speed to make people miss and take it to the house. Geno's first instinct is use his legs to move and buy time to throw it down the field.

The other difference that I have seen is not a single stupid penalty against WVU. Many games I found myself cursing at the tv or throwing something because of just moronic penalties (usually at the absolute WORST times).

Only point is an offense that is heavily reliant on a passing attack (WVU) is going to have problems in inclement weather. Doesn't really matter being up by three TD's now.

For the record I do think Marshall has actually done ok in this game. When you consider they are bringing a freshman QB and a freshman RB into a hostile environment for their first ever taste of collegiate football and the performance turned in, it's nothing to hang their hat over. They were starting to gain momentum early in the third quarter before the Austin kickoff return and the lightning delay.

[WVRed]

I'm a Marshall fan and have to say I'm impressed with the use of Geno Smith. I also think, on my side of things, that Marshall has something in our freshman QB.

My friend who is the Marshall grad that I had the discussion with over the score was wanting Cato benched. Given the circumstances, I think they have something with the recruits Holliday has. They're a very young team, but I think next year or the following they could make some noise in C-USA.

Whether they deserve to play against WVU on a yearly basis is another argument for another day.

[WVRed]

Looks like they finally called the game.

Also, there was no confirmation of a fan being struck by lightning, contrary to what ESPN is reporting.

http://www.dailymail.com/Sports/WVUSports/201109041748

[Slyder]

Only point is an offense that is heavily reliant on a passing attack (WVU) is going to have problems in inclement weather. Doesn't really matter being up by three TD's now.

There's also a thought process of the offense knows what it wants to do and the defense doesn't.


For the record I do think Marshall has actually done ok in this game. When you consider they are bringing a freshman QB and a freshman RB into a hostile environment for their first ever taste of collegiate football and the performance turned in, it's nothing to hang their hat over. They were starting to gain momentum early in the third quarter before the Austin kickoff return and the lightning delay.

Don't get me wrong they played a good game, but I just don't think with the change in coaches that Marshall could make up the differences in overall depth by coaching advantage like they had the last couple years with Stew in charge at WVU.

[reds1869]

My friend who is the Marshall grad that I had the discussion with over the score was wanting Cato benched.

Wow, because clearly a 15/21 performance by a true freshman against a good defense is unacceptable. :laugh:

[marcshoe]

Whew. It was harder for WVU and Marshall to finish this game than it was for them to start playing each other in the first place.

[will5979]

I'm a Marshall fan and have to say I'm impressed with the use of Geno Smith. I also think, on my side of things, that Marshall has something in our freshman QB.

Your QB did look good for a true freshman in his first start. That has to have Herd fans excited for the next few years.

[RollyInRaleigh]

My friend who is the Marshall grad that I had the discussion with over the score was wanting Cato benched. Given the circumstances, I think they have something with the recruits Holliday has. They're a very young team, but I think next year or the following they could make some noise in C-USA.

Whether they deserve to play against WVU on a yearly basis is another argument for another day.

Deserve? Personally, I think the annual game is great for the state of West Virginia, but if it comes down to Marshall "deserving" to play west virginia, I say move on. There are plenty of other teams out there, to play, that don't require Marshall to have that "qualification."

[marcshoe]

I'm a lifelong WVU fan, but I think this game's good for the fans, and frankly I think Tony Caridi and a few others were way over the top in their opposition to the game taking place. An annual game against the only other 1-A (easier to remember than whatever they're calling it now) team in the state is a natural thing and lets the season get started with a little bit of interest. No matter what you think about the game, it's hard to argue that there isn't more interest than there would have been if WVU opened with Norfolk State.

[WVRed]

Whew. It was harder for WVU and Marshall to finish this game than it was for them to start playing each other in the first place.

Truer words have never been spoken.


Deserve? Personally, I think the annual game is great for the state of West Virginia, but if it comes down to Marshall "deserving" to play west virginia, I say move on. There are plenty of other teams out there, to play, that don't require Marshall to have that "qualification."

Poor choice of wording on my part. I was pulling for Marshall in this game. I do think though that if Holgorsen gets WVU on track, even if Holliday manages to improve the team its going to be like the Rich Rodriguez-Mark Snyder years where Marshall is completely overmatched.

I'd personally rather scrap the Friends of Joe Bowl (and with TCU coming to the Big East next year it very well may be). If Holgorsen either 1. uses WVU as a stepping stone (and I believe he will) or 2. puts WVU on probation by the end of his tenure, there is always the possibility that WVU and Marshall could meet in the Beef O Brady's Bowl. I'm a Kentucky fan first and the series between Kentucky and Louisville didn't start until Louisville beat Kentucky in the 1983 NCAA tournament. It might take Marshall embarrassing WVU in a bowl game to make it an actual "rivalry".


I'm a lifelong WVU fan, but I think this game's good for the fans, and frankly I think Tony Caridi and a few others were way over the top in their opposition to the game taking place. An annual game against the only other 1-A (easier to remember than whatever they're calling it now) team in the state is a natural thing and lets the season get started with a little bit of interest. No matter what you think about the game, it's hard to argue that there isn't more interest than there would have been if WVU opened with Norfolk State.

It's only good for WVU (and I'm using this loosely) when the game is played in Morgantown. Play the game in Huntington where WVU fans won't travel and the officiating favors Marshall and you hear a completely different story.

It's a shame there isn't a central football stadium that could host the game, similar to the basketball game at the Charleston Civic Center. Laidley Field would be the only central location and it seats less than Marshall. Another possibility would be to do out of state neutral sites similar to what Kentucky-Western Kentucky did the past two seasons:

WVU Home Game-Heinz Field in Pittsburgh
Marshall Home Game- Commonwealth Stadium Lexington KY

[Slyder]

It's only good for WVU (and I'm using this loosely) when the game is played in Morgantown. Play the game in Huntington where WVU fans won't travel and the officiating favors Marshall and you hear a completely different story.

It's a shame there isn't a central football stadium that could host the game, similar to the basketball game at the Charleston Civic Center. Laidley Field would be the only central location and it seats less than Marshall. Another possibility would be to do out of state neutral sites similar to what Kentucky-Western Kentucky did the past two seasons:

WVU Home Game-Heinz Field in Pittsburgh
Marshall Home Game- Commonwealth Stadium Lexington KY

First please don't give the idiots in Charleston any ideas. That would be the absolute WORST thing they could do IMO. This game wouldn't mean anything remotely close to what you see with other games that are played on neutral rival games (think Red River Rivalry, World's Largest Cocktail Party) to make it worthwhile to do what would be necessary to use Laidley.

I HATE the idea of going to Pittsburgh or Lexington, this state needs NEW money brought in not send what money is here to another state (and this is the one main reason why I am against continuing it). Marshall going to Morgantown is a day trip for most fans, yes they have to eat somewhere but most are not going to use the other facilities like other schools. Likewise when WVU goes to Marshall (maybe not even get to eat as more people would go from Charleston).

It is also why I loved the rumors that WVU was trying to get at least one concert into the stadium this fall, it would draw new money to the program, big money in terms of hotel rooms, big money into restaurants, gas stations, etc. It is why when the state was giving out all the money (I think 2003), I was hoping that the UKV would get the money for a race track close to Quincy. Why? It would bring in some races (not the Sprint cup but a lot of rumors of Craftman Trucks) that are heavily attended by people who come from out of town. Also this facility had (I believe) some agreements with teams to have some full time training/R&D access which would have meant more jobs and opportunities. Not to mention the revenue with the short term construction money.

[marcshoe]

fwiw, I think there has been quite an economic impact when the game's been played in Huntington. I know all hotels in the area were booked up far in advance of the first game, for instance. Someone's coming in for the game, whether it's WVU fans (and honestly, I know of quite a few who have come down) or Marshall alumni.

[WVRed]

fwiw, I think there has been quite an economic impact when the game's been played in Huntington. I know all hotels in the area were booked up far in advance of the first game, for instance. Someone's coming in for the game, whether it's WVU fans (and honestly, I know of quite a few who have come down) or Marshall alumni.

Exactly. It benefits Huntington probably moreso than Morgantown. Marshall alumni and a small segment of WVU fans making the trip to Huntington, stopping at either Pullman Square or Barboursville for meals, gas, etc. All WVU has to do is show up and avoid getting embarrassed, thereby ending their hopes of a BCS bowl.

WVU would have likely sold out if they had opened against Norfolk State for no other reason than a new coach taking the field for the first time. Any other season, it would depend on the product on the field. Case in point, last year when I went when they played Rutgers.

I never thought much about Tony Caridi but you are right, and that is the attitude of most WVU fans, especially the closer you get to Motown. Sometimes I think Caridi and Marty Brenamen should star in a remake of Grumpier Old Men.

[RedsBaron]

Deserve? Personally, I think the annual game is great for the state of West Virginia, but if it comes down to Marshall "deserving" to play west virginia, I say move on. There are plenty of other teams out there, to play, that don't require Marshall to have that "qualification."

As a Marshall alum I am hoping that the series isn't renewed. Marshall reminds me of a guy who keeps asking a girl out who thinks he is beneath her. There are other girls out there; ignore the girl who thinks you are not in her league.

[RollyInRaleigh]

As a Marshall alum I am hoping that the series isn't renewed. Marshall reminds me of a guy who keeps asking a girl out who thinks he is beneath her. There are other girls out there; ignore the girl who thinks you are not in her league.

:thumbup:

[WVRed]

As a Marshall alum I am hoping that the series isn't renewed. Marshall reminds me of a guy who keeps asking a girl out who thinks he is beneath her. There are other girls out there; ignore the girl who thinks you are not in her league.

I wouldn't mind seeing Marshall starting a series with Kentucky.

There's definitely regional interest from the Tri-State area, UK would probably be more receptive than WVU because UK is looking for a team to beat that gets them to three automatic wins out of conference. With the distance between Lexington and Huntington, a two for one series would work and it could be a decent rivalry for the two schools.

Kentucky already has Louisville in both football and basketball. WVU has schools that I don't think really care if they exist. (Pitt, Maryland, Virginia Tech)

[Captain13]

I wouldn't mind seeing Marshall starting a series with Kentucky.

There's definitely regional interest from the Tri-State area, UK would probably be more receptive than WVU because UK is looking for a team to beat that gets them to three automatic wins out of conference. With the distance between Lexington and Huntington, a two for one series would work and it could be a decent rivalry for the two schools.

Kentucky already has Louisville in both football and basketball. WVU has schools that I don't think really care if they exist. (Pitt, Maryland, Virginia Tech)

I think a Louisville/Marshall rivalry could be built, as well. Agian, the two schools aren't that far apart and both fan bases travel pretty well. It could be fun.

[Homer Bailey]

Could have sworn this was called the 2011 WVU Football Thread :).

Didn't get to watch the game live, but caught the replay. It went pretty much exactly like I expected it. O-line (and the WR blocking) has to be a huge concern at this point. If we can't run the ball on Marshall, we sure as heck aren't going to run it on LSU.

I thought the passing game was not very sharp. Geno made some nice scrambling plays on 3rd down, but against a team with a better pass rush, it's not going to be that easy for him to get away.

I'll repeat that Stedman Bailey and Tavon Austin are going to have huge years. Tavon was a bit off on offense, but it's easy to see that he is going to be a focal point in the offense. I'd love to see more plays with him lined up in the backfield.

Defense is still a bit hard to judge after one game, and remains one of my bigger concerns for the year. I have to confess that I've never even heard of some of these defensive players before.

Despite it being not the most impressive offensive display, my man crush on Holgorsen has increased. For years I have screamed that the WVU offense lacks purpose. No one ever seemed confident in the play call, their assignments. Always seemed like the whole offense was back on its heels and reactionary vs. being the aggresor. I saw plenty of assertiveness with the skill players, and with Geno as well. I'm ecstatic for the potential of this offense.

I love Holgorsen's demeanor on the sideline as well. May sound like a silly thing to say, but it was painful to look at Bill Stewart walk the sidelines and seriously wonder if he had any idea what he was doing. Dana is confident, and actually looks like a coach. Not really sure what I'm exactly trying to say, just that I'm so relieved to have him as a head coach.

Bring on Norfolk State!!!!!!!

[Homer Bailey]

Also, this WVU/Missouri to the SEC stuff I'm hearing is starting to gain some traction. I never follow any of the realignment crap because it's all speculation, and no way of separating the fiction from the truth, but I'm seeing a lot... a LOT of interesting stuff come across my twitter feed tonight from pretty reliable sources.

[WVRed]

Also, this WVU/Missouri to the SEC stuff I'm hearing is starting to gain some traction. I never follow any of the realignment crap because it's all speculation, and no way of separating the fiction from the truth, but I'm seeing a lot... a LOT of interesting stuff come across my twitter feed tonight from pretty reliable sources.

I was JUST getting ready to post this. Don't know if anybody on here listened to the game on Sunday during the lightning delay but Oliver Luck was asked this on the radio by Caridi and he responded if the SEC called, he would definitely answer.

I would love for WVU to come to the SEC for obvious reasons (going to Morgantown once a year for basketball), but outside of fan support, I don't see what WVU brings to the table, especially from a media market standpoint. There is already a SEC presence in-state (UK) and Morgantown is a solid eight hours from Lexington, making it the northernmost SEC school.

Missouri (KC, St Louis) and Virginia Tech (Richmond, DC) make sense, but WVU is in the same boat as F$U, Georgia Tech, and Clemson. Actually, I'd put WVU and Free Shoes University by themselves. Both have the fan support and tradition, but don't offer anything of substance that the SEC doesn't already have.

I always thought the ideal situation for WVU would be to replace Virginia Tech in the ACC if the Hokies came to the SEC. They would still be dominant in football and could hold their own against the NC schools in basketball.

[Homer Bailey]

I was JUST getting ready to post this. Don't know if anybody on here listened to the game on Sunday during the lightning delay but Oliver Luck was asked this on the radio by Caridi and he responded if the SEC called, he would definitely answer.

I would love for WVU to come to the SEC for obvious reasons (going to Morgantown once a year for basketball), but outside of fan support, I don't see what WVU brings to the table, especially from a media market standpoint. There is already a SEC presence in-state (UK) and Morgantown is a solid eight hours from Lexington, making it the northernmost SEC school.

Missouri (KC, St Louis) and Virginia Tech (Richmond, DC) make sense, but WVU is in the same boat as F$U, Georgia Tech, and Clemson. Actually, I'd put WVU and Free Shoes University by themselves. Both have the fan support and tradition, but don't offer anything of substance that the SEC doesn't already have.

I always thought the ideal situation for WVU would be to replace Virginia Tech in the ACC if the Hokies came to the SEC. They would still be dominant in football and could hold their own against the NC schools in basketball.

I think it is pretty clear that the SEC is using WVU to force Missouri to make a decision. At the end of the day, I don't see WVU moving to the SEC, but the discussion is, at the very least, starting to get interesting.

[KronoRed]

I don't think anyone from the ACC will be switching, they each come with in state baggage.

I like WVU for balance, Missouri also brings another freaking tiger mascot ;)

[Captain13]

I was/am really hoping that Mizzou ends up in the Big East. Adding TCU and Mizzou puts the Big East in position to then add Kansas/K-State, Houston or UCF. Big Schools in Big Markets is the Big East way. While the Big Minus schools don't fit the Big City aspect they are large schools, and Houston and UCF fit perfectly. It is time for the Big East to act like a Big Boy and do something proactive. While the $EC may be good for WVU it is terrible for the Big East.

[Homer Bailey]

I was/am really hoping that Mizzou ends up in the Big East. Adding TCU and Mizzou puts the Big East in position to then add Kansas/K-State, Houston or UCF. Big Schools in Big Markets is the Big East way. While the Big Minus schools don't fit the Big City aspect they are large schools, and Houston and UCF fit perfectly. It is time for the Big East to act like a Big Boy and do something proactive. While the $EC may be good for WVU it is terrible for the Big East.

Not happening. Mizzou pretty clearly wants the Big Ten invite, and may settle for the SEC.

[Slyder]

Not happening. Mizzou pretty clearly wants the Big Ten invite, and may settle for the SEC.

That's some settling... let me tell you :lol:. But you're right Mizzou is trying to force Big 10's hand. I wish SEC would goto 16 and invite both of us and Va Tech.

[WVRed]

I was/am really hoping that Mizzou ends up in the Big East. Adding TCU and Mizzou puts the Big East in position to then add Kansas/K-State, Houston or UCF. Big Schools in Big Markets is the Big East way. While the Big Minus schools don't fit the Big City aspect they are large schools, and Houston and UCF fit perfectly. It is time for the Big East to act like a Big Boy and do something proactive. While the $EC may be good for WVU it is terrible for the Big East.

I'm going to venture to say Houston, UCF, Memphis, Kansas, KState etc will be grabbed by the Big East when they lose WVU and whoever the B10 decides to poach.

The Big East is going to cease to exist as a major BCS conference when all is said and done, and the fault can be laid at the head office. There has never been strong leadership at the top of the conference, whether it be Marinatto or Tranghese. All that has been seen by the Big East is smoke and mirrors, such as the Big East Network that was rumored about a year ago but never brought to fruition.

I don't know that the conference will dissolve like I think the Big 12 will, but it won't look the same.


That's some settling... let me tell you :lol:. But you're right Mizzou is trying to force Big 10's hand. I wish SEC would goto 16 and invite both of us and Va Tech.

That's my thinking as well. A&M, Missouri, Va Tech, and WVU/Florida State would make the most sense.

The school I would really like to see the SEC add is Oklahoma, but I kinda wonder if it would be a package deal with Oklahoma State in which the deal would be off. Oklahoma adds a top football program in a new and expanding media market in Oklahoma City. I'm guessing they head west with Texas though.

[Slyder]

The school I would really like to see the SEC add is Oklahoma, but I kinda wonder if it would be a package deal with Oklahoma State in which the deal would be off. Oklahoma adds a top football program in a new and expanding media market in Oklahoma City. I'm guessing they head west with Texas though.

I think they looked at it last year and because of that fact they (Ok and SEC) couldn't make any headway in negotiations about OK State. Whereas the PAC likes things in pairs made it a perfect fit.

[WVRed]

I think they looked at it last year and because of that fact they (Ok and SEC) couldn't make any headway in negotiations about OK State. Whereas the PAC likes things in pairs made it a perfect fit.

The negotiations with the PAC however only considers expanding to 16 teams, both of which are Texas and Oklahoma. Haven't heard Oklahoma State in the mix.

I think I wanna hear Jesco White's opinion on a move to the SEC. I couldn't find it, so here's this:

Wvu fans drunk and dancing - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2XHmHNspg2s&feature=player_embedded)

[Slyder]

The negotiations with the PAC however only considers expanding to 16 teams, both of which are Texas and Oklahoma. Haven't heard Oklahoma State in the mix.

I think I wanna hear Jesco White's opinion on a move to the SEC. I couldn't find it, so here's this:

Wvu fans drunk and dancing - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2XHmHNspg2s&feature=player_embedded)

Everything I have heard is that Oklahoma and Ok State are tied together at the hip because of the legislature there. Plus it doesn't hurt that Ok St. has T Boone Pickens to throw money into whatever to help them get in. Plus it fits the Pac's neat little pairs package of teams they have going.

I too heard the rumor that the Big 12-3 is trying the "vows of unity" one more time and that they will all wave their rights to sue the SEC if the SEC doesn't poach another team. This is meant to put pressure on Oklahoma to stay and not go to west. Or thats what I have heard.

[WVRed]

Just saw on the bottom of the ESPNNews ticker where the Big East is now trying to get involved.

Big East is looking to add Missouri, Kansas, Kansas State, and possibly Baylor and Iowa State.

The Big East is already ridiculous enough in terms of size. Now its just going for overkill. They really need to just rename the conference in general because geographically nothing about it makes sense.

[KronoRed]

The basketball only schools need to spin themselves off.

If the big12-3 survives they will grab tcu first.

[RedsBaron]

The Big East is already ridiculous enough in terms of size. Now its just going for overkill. They really need to just rename the conference in general because geographically nothing about it makes sense.

"The Big East" makes more sense IMO than a conference made up of 12 schools calling itself "The Big 10" or a conference of 9 or 10 schools calling itself "The Big 12." ;)

[RichRed]

"The Big East" makes more sense IMO than a conference made up of 12 schools calling itself "The Big 10" or a conference of 9 or 10 schools calling itself "The Big 12." ;)

The conferences need to do away with "Big" and/or a number in their names, and just call themselves "Larry" or "Bill" or "Clyde."

[KronoRed]

I'm still in favor of 'These Guys' 'Those Guys'.

[WVRed]

WVU trailed 12-10 at halftime before erupting for 28 points in the third quarter on route to a 55-12 blowout of Norfolk State.

Geno finished with 371 yards passing and 4 TDs.

They are still learning Holgorsen's offense and I really think not getting a full game in against the Herd probably messed up the rhythm, but the real test will be next week at Maryland.

With Oklahoma traveling to Tallahassee next Saturday in a battle of top 5 teams, LSU could be coming into Morgantown ranked no 1 the following week.

[marcshoe]

btw, congrats to Marshall on beating Southern Miss. That was a good win for them.

[WVRed]

Just saw this while ago:

http://www.msnsportsnet.com/page.cfm?cat=netnews&story=19264

This is what the bottom part "should" read:


I would like to request that if you see someone wearing one of these t-shirts that you politely ask him or her to change or to cover it up. Even wearing it inside-out would be an improvement. As you know, we have a big home football game against LSU coming up next Saturday and we would like to present a more favorable image to the SEC so we can receive an invitation to join.

[Homer Bailey]

Soooooo there is kind of a big game in Morgantown this weekend. Aaaaaand I'm kind of flying in from Chicago for it. Sooooooooo.... yeah.... I'm a little bit excited.

[Slyder]

Soooooo there is kind of a big game in Morgantown this weekend. Aaaaaand I'm kind of flying in from Chicago for it. Sooooooooo.... yeah.... I'm a little bit excited.

oh really... I hadn't heard I guess you're coming back for the men's soccer match against South Florida right? :D

[WVRed]

Soooooo there is kind of a big game in Morgantown this weekend. Aaaaaand I'm kind of flying in from Chicago for it. Sooooooooo.... yeah.... I'm a little bit excited.

So should we look for you on College Gameday leading the "SEC" chants? ;)

PS: I've been fairly indifferent to WVU outside of when Kentucky plays them, but when you play Louisville later this season, please kick their ass. Your new neighbors in the SEC would be eternally grateful. :)

[Homer Bailey]

So should we look for you on College Gameday leading the "SEC" chants? ;)

PS: I've been fairly indifferent to WVU outside of when Kentucky plays them, but when you play Louisville later this season, please kick their ass. Your new neighbors in the SEC would be eternally grateful. :)

Some good ideas I've seen are "The ACC stole my other sign", or "The ACC robbed our house but only stole our trash."

Despite following every snap of WVU football for many, many years, I still have the same opinion of this game that I have of any game. I just have no idea what is going to happen.

LSU is going to control the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball. I fear that Geno is going to be running for his life for most of the night, and may not even last through this game. I'd be amazed if WVU ran the ball for over 50 yards, honestly. The offensive line gets no push, and the freshman backs don't seem to be elite athletes.

The obvous question is, can they throw on LSU? Remains to be seen, obviously. I'm ecstatic about the trio of Austin, Bailey, and McCartney, but this is their first true test of the season.

Despite LSU not having the most impressive offense, I'm concerned about being able to stop the running game. The 2nd half was not a very impressive performance last week, as the depth just simply isn't there.

Saturday can't get here soon enough.

The crowd is going to be the craziest its been since the Miami game in 1993.

[WVRed]

Turnovers was pretty much the Mountaineers undoing tonight as WVU lost 47-21 in their initiation into the SEC. :)

The more I watch WVU, this offense is a carbon copy of the Air Raid offense that Kentucky ran during the 1990s. It will work in the Big East and even the Big 12 and maybe the ACC, but the SEC has the speed and athleticism to beat teams with it, as LSU showed tonight. If WVU ends up in the SEC, they are going to have to make some adjustments or they will end up middle of the pack.

LSU isn't flashy, but they do just enough to win. The first two TD's took the air right out of Mountaineer Field and even with surges by WVU, I don't think they ever really took it back.

[Slyder]

Turnovers was pretty much the Mountaineers undoing tonight as WVU lost 47-21 in their initiation into the SEC. :)

The more I watch WVU, this offense is a carbon copy of the Air Raid offense that Kentucky ran during the 1990s. It will work in the Big East and even the Big 12 and maybe the ACC, but the SEC has the speed and athleticism to beat teams with it, as LSU showed tonight. If WVU ends up in the SEC, they are going to have to make some adjustments or they will end up middle of the pack.

LSU isn't flashy, but they do just enough to win. The first two TD's took the air right out of Mountaineer Field and even with surges by WVU, I don't think they ever really took it back.

Geno put up 400+ yards through the air. I think Holgs would be fine in the SEC with time to recruit that caliber of athletes.

I was impressed by our offense tonight, they really played well (save the turnovers and the early adrenaline personal foul on the opening drive). Geno had plenty of time to throw all night, not one sack allowed (unless you count that personal foul). I really think Holgs has us in the best position offensively since White and Slaton were running all over the place.

The defense on the other hand tried to keep us in the game in the first half but WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too many arm tackles and whiffs against a team the caliber of LSU. I also know we lost 8 starters from last years d. I hope almost all next week they are hitting the tackle dummies and practicing wrapping up.

Special Teams must still be coached by Bill Stewart and the whiffs on the KO return were sickening.

In closing A million lessons are learned in a loss. I think we saw a glimpse of what this team is capable of offensively there to start the 2nd half. And after watching some of our future opponents USF is the only one that really scares me but "any given saturday".

[Slyder]

SEC commissioner was apparently supposedly in attendance tonight hopefully he enjoyed himself and we proved that we were indeed an SEC type program tonight. And Oliver had a chance to discuss the future.

[WVRed]

Something I heard today and with how many times it happened I am starting to wonder.

Did anybody else think LSU was faking injuries in order to keep WVU from running the no huddle? Seemed like everytime Geno got into a groove, a LSU player got hurt and killed the momentum.

[Homer Bailey]

Something I heard today and with how many times it happened I am starting to wonder.

Did anybody else think LSU was faking injuries in order to keep WVU from running the no huddle? Seemed like everytime Geno got into a groove, a LSU player got hurt and killed the momentum.

It couldn't have been more obvious. I've got several in person stories about it. I'll provide my summary later this week, maybe tomorrow.

[KronoRed]

Something I heard today and with how many times it happened I am starting to wonder.

Did anybody else think LSU was faking injuries in order to keep WVU from running the no huddle? Seemed like everytime Geno got into a groove, a LSU player got hurt and killed the momentum.

I thought they were as well.

[Slyder]

ESPN even zoomed in on Holg at one time and you could lip read Bull **** clear as day. I liked one suggestion that a hurt player must sit out the duration of that series, if the ref has to stop play in order to treat an injured player.

If that player attempts to come back in make it a personal foul and 15 yards against the offending team. 2nd time someone gets ejected. Sort of like yellow/red rules in soccer.

[WVRed]

ESPN even zoomed in on Holg at one time and you could lip read Bull **** clear as day. I liked one suggestion that a hurt player must sit out the duration of that series, if the ref has to stop play in order to treat an injured player.

If that player attempts to come back in make it a personal foul and 15 yards against the offending team. 2nd time someone gets ejected. Sort of like yellow/red rules in soccer.

You could make a debate as to whether its ethical or not, but its pure exploitation of the rules. I'd say something will be done about it in both the NFL and NCAA after this season.

In the meantime, I wonder how many teams in the Big East will watch game film of that game and start to duplicate LSU in faking an injury to kill WVU's momentum. Of course, not every team in the league has a defense like LSU either.

[Captain13]

You could make a debate as to whether its ethical or not, but its pure exploitation of the rules. I'd say something will be done about it in both the NFL and NCAA after this season.

In the meantime, I wonder how many teams in the Big East will watch game film of that game and start to duplicate LSU in faking an injury to kill WVU's momentum. Of course, not every team in the league has a defense like LSU either.

I'm quite certain WVU will not face another defense like LSU unless they play in a BCS bowl; even then it is unlikely.

[jojo]

I don't think LSU players were faking injuries.

[Homer Bailey]

I don't think LSU players were faking injuries.

I saw a play in person that made this issue not even debate-able. I honestly can't believe that the other side is being argued (not just you, but other message boards I've read).

Hate to be that guy that says "I was there, you weren't, I know what I'm talking about, you don't", but there is no way the television could have told the full story.

[Homer Bailey]

Alright, I finally summarize my thoughts.

What a Saturday night in Morgantown. I haven't seen/heard an atmosphere like that since the Miami game in 1993, and I was only 7 years old at the time. This night was one of the coolest memories of my years as a WVU fan. Going into the game, I acknowledged that the experience wasn't really about the actual final score, but participating in the excitement, and enjoying have the national spotlight.

The crowd was electric. I've never seen so much gold in my entire life, and as silly as the "terrible towels" are, they really did add to the excitement I believe. When WVU pulled back to 27-21, that place was BUMPIN. Sure, there are louder stadiums, and stadiums with more people, but I've never head 60,000 people that loud.

Now to the actual game. If you had told me we would have gotten beat 47-21, I would have said, "I guess we really don't belong on the field with those guys." However, I do not feel that way at all. WVU seemed to get every bad bounce imaginable (dropped pick on the first possession, Austin's drop that got tipped and picked, Geno's silly pick with 30 seconds left in the half, the punt bounces (going both ways), etc.). They may sound like excuses, and they very well may be lame excuses, but if the turnover battle of this game is (at minimum) even, WVU has an EXCELLENT shot to win that game. Simply put, and I never thought I would say this: LSU could not stop the WVU offense. Couldn't do it. Probably sounds silly, as WVU only managed 21 points, but I don't think I've ever seen a team have such bad field position. WVU had SEVEN possessions that started inside their ten yard line. It's so hard to put up points when you are losing the field position battle all night.

Geno was soooo good at times, but just made a couple plays that made my scratch my head. The Mathieu pick right before the half was just devastating. I think it was a horrible play call by HOlgorsen to begin with, but Geno still has to be smarter there. Regardless, what a play by Mathieu.

The WVU passing attack is 100% legit. LSU is widely regarded as the best defense in the country, and Geno almost put up 500 yards passing. It's so refreshing to see an offense that plays with purpose, and gets the ball in the hands of the playmakers in space. The most exciting part is that basically all of the offense will be back next year if no one goes pro. Running game still isn't great, but it's enough to keep defenses honest.

As I feared, the WVU front 7 was no match for the LSU O-Line/running game. That being said, WVU missed sooooo many tackles due to poor fundamentals. Everytime WVU got momentum, LSU pulled something out of their hat to bust it. Three guys had Ware in the backfield on one run, he spins out of it, and gets a first down on 3rd down. Once the D got warned down, LSU got some easy touchdowns.

The kickoff return was when the game ended. As I indicated, after WVU made it 27-21, the place was going absolutely nuts. I still have no idea how no one got Claiborne to the ground on that return. It was probably the most bizarre kick return TD I've ever seen.

Regarding the injury faking. I don't recall the first time it happened, but briefly, there were two LSU players on the ground, then one got up. The guy that stayed down (#77), was not involved in any tackle, hit, knockdown, or anything on the play. Just fell down, laid on the field, walked off on his own power, AND WAS BACK IN THE GAME 2 PLAYS LATER.

The second one could not have been more obvious. I remember it pretty specifically, but may have the play sequence slightly off. The score is 27-14, and Tavon rips off a 72 yard catch and run, and WVU is inside the 20. WVU throws an incompletion, then completes a pass to McCartney. #90 chases after Geno, doesn't get him, falls down, then.... GETS UP AND CHECKS THE RESULT OF THE PLAY. After he saw the catch, he went back down to the ground as if he was shot. Again, walked off under his own power, and was back in the game the next series (WVU scored shortly after). It was so obvious, that about 25 guys in our section started simultaneously pointing at the guy. Everyone saw him do it.

Make no mistake, the injury faking had ZERO impact on the outcome of the game. LSU was going to win that game regardless. I just think it's extremely weak of a supposedly big bad SEC team to have to fake injuries to try to slow down a Big East offense (and fail at that).

Saw a lot with WVU that has me excited for the rest of the season, and for the future. Geno Smith is absolute star.

[WVRed]

Excellent analysis HB,

I wouldn't argue that LSU couldn't stop WVU's offense, but they did limit it. Geno did throw for almost 500 yards (463 to be exact), but only managed two TD's on 65 completions. Note that I said LSU didn't stop WVU, but they limited the damage that WVU did through the air.

I guess if you want to look at it that way, its a moral victory and nothing else.

This loss does expose a couple of things:

1. The air raid offense (I'm still calling it this from the Kentucky days) when executed flawlessly such as against Norfolk State will put up points in a hurry. The downside though is that it ignores a traditional ground game which when the offense doesn't work puts more pressure on the defense to bail them out. The good news is that WVU isn't likely going to see another defense similar until they play either USF or a BCS bowl game.

2. I wouldn't be shocked if more teams start faking injuries against WVU. It might be unethical but it is a loophole in the rules (that probably won't be resolved until after the season) and it works long enough to stall momentum. Geno is the type of QB who has to be in a groove and by faking injuries that would knock him out of it. That being said, see above on not playing another good defense until the end of the season.

[Homer Bailey]

Another solid performance by the Mountaineers this weekend, as the yards on the field translated to points on the scoreboard. It helped that the opponent was BG, but WVU finally showed that they’re capable of running the football, as true freshman Dustin Garrison put up 291 yards and two touchdowns on the ground. Honestly, it could have been a heck of a lot more as well. He had 233 yards in the first half alone, and WVU eased off the gas pedal late in the game, and worked in some other running backs.

Geno looked solid again, and played a very unselfish role according to Holgorsen. Per DH, Geno audibled out of several pass plays to get the ball to Garrison, who was running all over everyone. The offense seems to be hitting on cylinders.

Defense was pretty good. Bowling Green is pretty solid offensive team, just didn’t have the athletes to stay on the field with WVU.

Special teams was a disaster again. WVU has to find someone who can punt the football, and the kickoff coverage looks Bill Stewart-esque. It’s going to be interesting to see if Holgorsen can begin to get some athletes on the defensive side of the ball, because it looks like Stewart left it pretty bare on that side of the ball (which extends to the special teams).

[WVRed]

I think its safe to say WVU has found their running back.

Twitter seems to be abuzz today with WVU to the SEC talk. Anybody following anything worth reporting?

[marcshoe]

I was wondering about that. I haven't seen anything solid, but everyone from Desean Butler on down the line has been tweeting rumors.

[WVRed]

I was wondering about that. I haven't seen anything solid, but everyone from Desean Butler on down the line has been tweeting rumors.

A friend of mine on Facebook said the SEC is supposed to be in Morgantown today.

[medford]

The odds of West Virginia moving to the SEC will be strongly influenced by actions just west of the Mississippi River this evening.

[WVRed]

The odds of West Virginia moving to the SEC will be strongly influenced by actions just west of the Mississippi River this evening.

Yep, following it on KOMU. They're holding a meeting now and there will be a presser afterwards.

[Slyder]

I am hearing that people with "sources" are saying it doesn't matter what Missouri does that WVU is in. That tells me they 16 but would take 15 (given lifting of the 2 team cap for BcS games). The rumor of 15 is 3 5 team pods and the 2 highest rated in the bcs poll play in the title game.

[WVRed]

I am hearing that people with "sources" are saying it doesn't matter what Missouri does that WVU is in. That tells me they 16 but would take 15 (given lifting of the 2 team cap for BcS games). The rumor of 15 is 3 5 team pods and the 2 highest rated in the bcs poll play in the title game.

I don't see how it would work geographically with a 15/3 format. A 16/4 would be more ideal.

Just for fun:

SEC North:
West Virginia
Kentucky
Vanderbilt
Tennessee
Missouri

SEC South:
Georgia
Florida
Alabama
Auburn
South Carolina

SEC West:
Ole Miss
Mississippi State
LSU
Texas A&M
Arkansas

[Slyder]

Just for fun:

SEC North:
West Virginia
Kentucky
Vanderbilt
Tennessee
South Carolina

SEC South:
Georgia
Florida
Alabama
Auburn
Florida State

SEC West:
Ole Miss
Mississippi State
LSU
Texas A&M
Arkansas

Does that change your thoughts any? Because thats what 15 would look like I would guess.

[WVRed]

Does that change your thoughts any? Because thats what 15 would look like I would guess.

FSU isn't getting in. Same goes for Georgia Tech, Clemson, and Louisville. There is a gentlemens agreement in place between Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, and Kentucky to block any other in-state school from joining the conference.

With Missouri's announcement regarding leaving, I hope you're right about the SEC going to 15 teams.

[KronoRed]

I really hope Missouri has a secret agreement with the big 10, don't want them in the SEC.

They are all Cardinals fans ya know :D

[WVRed]

I really hope Missouri has a secret agreement with the big 10, don't want them in the SEC.

They are all Cardinals fans ya know :D

Part of the reason I'm not crazy about Mizzou. Of course, I kinda wonder if anybody in the state is paying any attention with the Cardinals in the playoffs.

[Slyder]

FSU isn't getting in. Same goes for Georgia Tech, Clemson, and Louisville. There is a gentlemens agreement in place between Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, and Kentucky to block any other in-state school from joining the conference.

With Missouri's announcement regarding leaving, I hope you're right about the SEC going to 15 teams.

The "gentlemen's agreement" is a rumor like everything else out there, not saying whether its true or not just that its a rumor like everything else.

Money talks and besides ND and Texas, FSU brings the most on a national stage of anyone else there is left. The SEC shops quality product where the ACC just goes on tv markets (regardless of whether anyone cares). The last ACC move was for basketball and FSU knows exactly where their bread is buttered (read not basketball) and they are about to become the big fish in a glass of water. The SEC knows what it would mean to get them as 16. Another rumor was that they were one to push HARD for WVU inclusion in the last expansion but the Tobacco Road Mafia called their bluff and FSU did setup a committee to look at conference affiliation.

And before someone else brings up the buyout raise. FSU was one of the reasons it was only raised to 20 mil from 13 or whatever it was before. For a major athletic department that is a few phone calls to the big cat donors.

A little bit of history Florida actually pushed hard for FSU in the 90s before Bowden and FSU decided to take the "easier path". Florida would accept FSU's inclusion but they won't politic for them like they did then, I believe.

No one else makes sense for 16 (that wouldn't have to bring little brother with them). Va Tech sold their freedom to get into ACC, I doubt if even if they wanted they could get out from under the legislatures thumb (note all bets are off if B1G wants UVa Long Shot I know), Do NC State or Clemson see value of leaving the blue bloods and the Big East schools do ANY of them really provide any value football wise that might entice SEC?

The cap on BcS teams is far from certain so you add more confusion to your member schools staying at 15 without relative security from someone that they would be 16.

[Slyder]

In Luck I trust.

[WVRed]

In Luck I trust.

Anything new?

[Slyder]

Anything new?

Just more rumors. Lot of posters on the scout site were saying done deal we're 14.

[Homer Bailey]

Just more rumors. Lot of posters on the scout site were saying done deal we're 14.

Don't believe a word. Will drive you nuts reading that crap.

[WVRed]

Don't believe a word. Will drive you nuts reading that crap.

I feel about the same way regarding Scout or Rivals. Seems like there isn't a good WVU site to read.

You've been kinda quiet on the conference issues, where do you think WVU ends up or do they stay in a watered down Big East?

[Slyder]

I feel about the same way regarding Scout or Rivals. Seems like there isn't a good WVU site to read.

You've been kinda quiet on the conference issues, where do you think WVU ends up or do they stay in a watered down Big East?

If you said I was Oliver Luck and I could pick where we would be it would be the following:

1) SEC: Best football in the land, our fan base would fit perfectly with the powers that be in the conference. This move also gives us the highest ceiling potential as we would start off with an advantage of already being in Ohio, PA, NY, NJ, Maryland, and Virginia alone. I believe we would CRUSH all of our rivals in recruiting in the SEC. How many top flight recruits do you think would be swayed when we say come to play the best football in the nation and be close enough for parents and friends to see you play EVERY home game?
WV would immediately become a 2nd tier destination job (behind the likes of USC, FSU, Alabama, Fla, etc) and the list of schools that could pilfer coaches would be slimmer.
2) Big 12: While not being ideal it would certainly be better than some of the alternatives plus could you imagine Mountaineer Field with #2 Oklahoma coming into play? You would probably have to upgrade some of the OOC for ticket purposes but the Big 12 would be better in football than what the big east has been since 07.
3,589,039) ACC: I don't want to be there, they don't want us. The only reason they are showing interest in us is because schools like Va Tech, Maryland, etc are scared to death of what we could become if we get into the SEC. The ACC would tolerate us as we would carry the banner with FSU and Va Tech to fat BcS paydays while we are treated like 2nd class members by Tobacco Road Mafia. Not to mention the cheap knockoff basketball where every Dookie flops and gets a technical foul called on us in the ACC tournament.
321,356,832) Recalibrated Big East: All sticking around in the Big East would do is help propel schools with bigger markets into a more appealing light for the conferences to snatch and ignore us. Plus looking at what is available I just don't see how WVU would remain as a high level football school playing none of the rivals.

I think that Big East football is dead, everyone knows it and everyone's just arguing to kill it. That's why you got the bball schools blocking (reportedly) any expansion, that's why you have WVU pushing Boise and others balking, that's why the idiot from Providence can't get a simple measure to increase buyouts passed, its why you have reports of the bball schools blaming Notre Dame.

I think everyone realizes that its a useless venture, the only thing they're waiting on is who's the last team out the door Louisville or WVU to bury it for good. And it's such a shame with even a little bit of leadership this could have been prevented.

The Big East needed to go to at least 10 when Va Tech and co bolted. I would have taken the tv hit because you were negotiating from a position of weakness anyways and taken another school with a lot of potential. East Carolina has a very similar fan base to WVU and I think they would have THRIVED in Big East football after the first raid and maybe developed a bit of a market for themselves while Carolina (the whole ACC) football was garbage.

[WVRed]

My only problem with the Big 12 is it makes sense for football only and somewhat in basketball. You listed the positive in bringing an Oklahoma to Mountaineer Field, but what happens when WVU has to travel to Norman. How many WVU fans are going to make the trip?

Its going to be an every year trip to Oklahoma or Texas, whether it be Norman, Stillwater, Austin, Lubbock, Ft Worth, or Waco. That's fine for football, but how about for girls softball?

If WVU joins the Big 12, I'd go football only. Keep them in the Big East in everything else or if the Big East collapses, maybe the Atlantic 10.

[Slyder]

My only problem with the Big 12 is it makes sense for football only and somewhat in basketball. You listed the positive in bringing an Oklahoma to Mountaineer Field, but what happens when WVU has to travel to Norman. How many WVU fans are going to make the trip?

Its going to be an every year trip to Oklahoma or Texas, whether it be Norman, Stillwater, Austin, Lubbock, Ft Worth, or Waco. That's fine for football, but how about for girls softball?

If WVU joins the Big 12, I'd go football only. Keep them in the Big East in everything else or if the Big East collapses, maybe the Atlantic 10.

I doubt that would fly with the Big 12 or Big East/A10. Flight Travel anymore makes a flight from Pittsburgh to Dallas in an hour and a half. Jump on a bus for maybe another hour to even the more remote places. You can get around much faster and easier than before I doubt it would be that much of an issue. Or get a sponsorship from one of the airlines to make the flights.

[WVRed]

I doubt that would fly with the Big 12 or Big East/A10. Flight Travel anymore makes a flight from Pittsburgh to Dallas in an hour and a half. Jump on a bus for maybe another hour to even the more remote places. You can get around much faster and easier than before I doubt it would be that much of an issue. Or get a sponsorship from one of the airlines to make the flights.

This works for football, but what about the other sports that don't make any money? Not to mention flying is a lot more expensive.

[Slyder]

This works for football, but what about the other sports that don't make any money? Not to mention flying is a lot more expensive.

How does BC do it in the ACC? How does Penn State travel to Iowa, Indiana, Nebraska? How does USF do it now? How does UTEP which is in the middle of BFE fly to ECU and Marshall? Its why I suggested talking with the airlines and see what could be done for the offsports.

[Slyder]

Don't believe a word. Will drive you nuts reading that crap.

I know. I read it mostly for the :lol: moments. I enjoyed looking at things when it first started. Its why I believe all this mess is just cover for the SEC to get who they really want (FSU). If the SEC is indeed only going to 14 then I bet they wish they could take WVU's program combine it with the tvs in Missouri and you would have what theyd need.

[Homer Bailey]

I feel about the same way regarding Scout or Rivals. Seems like there isn't a good WVU site to read.

You've been kinda quiet on the conference issues, where do you think WVU ends up or do they stay in a watered down Big East?

Realignment is like the NFL lockout for me. No point in following it. All you get is rumors this, rumors that. No idea what is true and what isn't. It'll all be sorted out when its sorted out, and there is no point in driving myself crazy thinking about it and talking about it.

Obviously, I don't want to stay in this version of the Big East. SEC, WVU is going to get their butt kicked a little bit until they start getting SEC caliber athletes on the defensive side of the ball, but ultimately their football program will be stronger because of it. Also, if I have the choice between watching a WVU/Rutgers game, and a WVU/Alabama game.

If I had a choice, I would want to be in the SEC.

[WVRed]

Obviously, I don't want to stay in this version of the Big East. SEC, WVU is going to get their butt kicked a little bit until they start getting SEC caliber athletes on the defensive side of the ball, but ultimately their football program will be stronger because of it. Also, if I have the choice between watching a WVU/Rutgers game, and a WVU/Alabama game.

If I had a choice, I would want to be in the SEC.

That's kinda how I feel. WVU isn't going to compete right away in the SEC and it may result in a coaching change before all is said and done. UK ran the exact same offense in the SEC under Hal Mumme and the most success was in reaching the Outback Bowl. WVU might have a recruiting advantage that UK does not but as long as you play in the SEC where you have quality defense, I don't see the Air Raid working. People will point to 500 yards against LSU but LSU was successful in limiting the damage of the offense.

[WVRed]

I know. I read it mostly for the :lol: moments. I enjoyed looking at things when it first started. Its why I believe all this mess is just cover for the SEC to get who they really want (FSU). If the SEC is indeed only going to 14 then I bet they wish they could take WVU's program combine it with the tvs in Missouri and you would have what theyd need.

I did post over there a "source" that I had. You should be able to figure out which post it is. :)

[Slyder]

I did post over there a "source" that I had. You should be able to figure out which post it is. :)

PM Coming :P.

[Slyder]

If you said I was Oliver Luck and I could pick where we would be it would be the following:

1) SEC
2) Big 12
1,356,832) Recalibrated Big East
3,589,039) ACC


I think that Big East football is dead, everyone knows it and everyone's just arguing to kill it. That's why you got the bball schools blocking (reportedly) any expansion, that's why you have WVU pushing Boise and others balking, that's why the idiot from Providence can't get a simple measure to increase buyouts passed, its why you have reports of the bball schools blaming Notre Dame.

I think everyone realizes that its a useless venture, the only thing they're waiting on is who's the last team out the door Louisville or WVU to bury it for good. And it's such a shame with even a little bit of leadership this could have been prevented.

The Big East needed to go to at least 10 when Va Tech and co bolted. I would have taken the tv hit because you were negotiating from a position of weakness anyways and taken another school with a lot of potential. East Carolina has a very similar fan base to WVU and I think they would have THRIVED in Big East football after the first raid and maybe developed a bit of a market for themselves while Carolina (the whole ACC) football was garbage.

My desire has been updated if the rumors of NBC wanting to throw some money around to keep the Big East together (read theyre desperate for a piece beyond ND football). If I'm in a position of power and they say they can bring Penn State home I listen to the rest of the proposal, if they just want to elevate a bunch of midmajors then we got to get out for our own good.

Yes I despise the ACC that much.

[medford]

Penn State isn't leaving the B10, forget about it. I don't care how much money NBC wants to throw at them to get them to do it, its going to be tough to realistically beat what the BTN and the BT TV deals bring them, then on top of them, they'd loss their affiliation w/ the B10 AAU members and revenue sharing thru research, which from reports I've read, dwarf the amount of money brought in thru sports.

[WVRed]

Penn State isn't leaving the B10, forget about it. I don't care how much money NBC wants to throw at them to get them to do it, its going to be tough to realistically beat what the BTN and the BT TV deals bring them, then on top of them, they'd loss their affiliation w/ the B10 AAU members and revenue sharing thru research, which from reports I've read, dwarf the amount of money brought in thru sports.

It's just more throwing crap to the wall to see what sticks. The Big East is a smoke and mirrors conference, that is why they are on the way down. Before Syracuse and Pitt got poached it was how the expiring TV deal would save them and how Marianotto and Paul Tagliabue were working on a Big East Network.

[Slyder]

Penn State isn't leaving the B10, forget about it. I don't care how much money NBC wants to throw at them to get them to do it, its going to be tough to realistically beat what the BTN and the BT TV deals bring them, then on top of them, they'd loss their affiliation w/ the B10 AAU members and revenue sharing thru research, which from reports I've read, dwarf the amount of money brought in thru sports.

I know but I just wanted to bring up how much it would take for me to even listen to the plan. LoL.

[Captain13]

As I just posted on another thread, it looks like Boise is coming. There recent history may be enough to keep the BCS bid in the Big East. I'm a Louisville fan, and generally dislike WVU, but I am cheering for the 'Neers to run the conference this year and finish in the T-op 10. As long as UofL is in the Big East, I need to keep the best interest of the conference in mind, and that is a team in the Top 10.

[WVRed]

So much for giving Syracuse a nice ACC sendoff courtesy of 500+ yards of offense. (a friend of mine said that earlier this week, I am going to bring that up tomorrow for sure. :) )

The officiating sucked, but Geno was awful tonight. I don't know if playing in a dome affected him or what but his passes floated in the air just waiting to be picked.

Seemed like WVU just waited for a bailout that never came. I thought WVU would come back and win it when they marched down the field on the first possession of the second half. Once Syracuse went up on the next possession, its just like the team rolled over and quit (save Starks TD catch in the 4th quarter).

If I am a WVU fan I would be a bit alarmed right now. Rutgers isn't looking too bad right now and with road trips to Cincinnati and South Florida left to go, they could end up dropping more games than originally thought.

Either way, Doug Marrone has WVU's number.

[GAC]

Wow! Someone got taken to the wood shed last night.

[Slyder]

So much for giving Syracuse a nice ACC sendoff courtesy of 500+ yards of offense. (a friend of mine said that earlier this week, I am going to bring that up tomorrow for sure. :) )

The officiating sucked, but Geno was awful tonight. I don't know if playing in a dome affected him or what but his passes floated in the air just waiting to be picked.

Seemed like WVU just waited for a bailout that never came. I thought WVU would come back and win it when they marched down the field on the first possession of the second half. Once Syracuse went up on the next possession, its just like the team rolled over and quit (save Starks TD catch in the 4th quarter).

If I am a WVU fan I would be a bit alarmed right now. Rutgers isn't looking too bad right now and with road trips to Cincinnati and South Florida left to go, they could end up dropping more games than originally thought.

Either way, Doug Marrone has WVU's number.

We shall see what kind of coach Holgorsen is, Syracuse gave a pretty good idea for people to use against our offense (blitz early and often and everything). Geno played like crap, the line played like crap, defense played like crap, special teams played like crap. Could they have been believing the headlines? Possibly, it just seemed to be one of those nights that EVERYTHING Syracuse tried turned to freaking gold.

[WVRed]

We shall see what kind of coach Holgorsen is, Syracuse gave a pretty good idea for people to use against our offense (blitz early and often and everything). Geno played like crap, the line played like crap, defense played like crap, special teams played like crap. Could they have been believing the headlines? Possibly, it just seemed to be one of those nights that EVERYTHING Syracuse tried turned to freaking gold.

Syracuse took a page from LSU. LSU did the exact same thing except WVU's line did a much better job in that game (including some more faking injuries). Geno had pressure all night and even when he didn't he made some poor throws.

[Slyder]

Reading the Rivals board today and you would think that EVERYTHING was lost based on one nights performance...

I think we have a good scale on this team now.

The LSU game (minus the turnovers) is probably the best this team can play. Which is pretty darn good IMO.

Last night was the absolute worst this team is capable of playing. Given a crap ton of new starters on d, new offensive system, a qb who seems to want to gun it more than he should, being the biggest game Syracuse has had in the dome in the last oh 7-8 years.

[marcshoe]

I think expectations have been too high this year, given all the changes. I was anticipating a possible league loss down the line. I wasn't expecting it to come at Syracuse, admittedly.

[Homer Bailey]

I'm still not ready to talk about it. I'll let you know when I am.

[will5979]

I'm still not ready to talk about it. I'll let you know when I am.

I passed denial up after the LSU game, we were pretenders all along, we have no business being in the Top 25, and IF, and believe me that is a hypothetical IF, we win the Big East, we will get DESTROYED in a BCS game.

WVU Football died on the night of December 1, 2007. It will not be relevant again for a long time, IF EVER. I actually wept that night because I knew the program was dead and we haven't recovered, I just never wanted to publically admit it, well now I'll admit it.

[WVRed]

In other news, looks like WVU is headed to the Big 12.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/college/football/wvu_set_to_leave_big_east_for_big_aS3e4cF01Oc4fAyQ 6qlw4O

Don't blame WVU for leaving the Big East, but this has the makings of a geographic nightmare. If/When Texas and Oklahoma decide to leave for the Pac-12 when they decide to expand again, WVU will be right back to where they started.

[Slyder]

In other news, looks like WVU is headed to the Big 12.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/college/football/wvu_set_to_leave_big_east_for_big_aS3e4cF01Oc4fAyQ 6qlw4O

Don't blame WVU for leaving the Big East, but this has the makings of a geographic nightmare. If/When Texas and Oklahoma decide to leave for the Pac-12 when they decide to expand again, WVU will be right back to where they started.

Which if you believe the stories won't be for at least 10 years (the proposed agreement of giving tier 1 and 2 tv rights to the conference).

[WVRed]

Which if you believe the stories won't be for at least 10 years (the proposed agreement of giving tier 1 and 2 tv rights to the conference).

All I know is that there is so much drama in that conference that nothing would surprise me.

I think we can all agree that the Big East is the equivalent of Conference USA, especially if WVU leaves. I would even argue that WVU was chosen ahead of Louisville as the "death blow" to the conference's AQ status. Even if Boise comes into the fold, its going to be impossible for them to hold onto the status now.

The Big 12 as it stands is the weakest of the "Fab Five". Oklahoma and Texas are keeping the conference afloat but a lot can happen. If Oklahoma becomes disenfranchised over something that Texas does with the Longhorn Network, I could see them and Okie Jr reaching out to the SEC. If the Pac-12 decides to expand to 16 and take the four big schools out of the Big 12, the conference is severely weakened into a similar conference where WVU and Kansas State might be a marquee football matchup.

It's a risk, but one WVU has to make. I don't see the SEC expanding to 16 anytime soon, but the Big 12 could be the next domino to fall.

[will5979]

All I know is that there is so much drama in that conference that nothing would surprise me.

I think we can all agree that the Big East is the equivalent of Conference USA, especially if WVU leaves. I would even argue that WVU was chosen ahead of Louisville as the "death blow" to the conference's AQ status. Even if Boise comes into the fold, its going to be impossible for them to hold onto the status now.

I'm not insulting or bashing you but WVU is not all that great and doesn't bring much to the table as far as a BCS status goes, and this is coming from a die-hard lifelong WVU fan and graduate.

What I'm saying is that if WVU leaves the Big East the conference can survive with an automatic BCS berth. Hell WVU only has 2 of them and that was during the White/Slaton era of 05-07.

WVU was only relevant on a National Scale during the Major Harris and Pat White/Steve Slaton era.

[5TimeWSChamps]

Louisville fans aren't gonna take it!

boobrewer All-District
Rating: 3. 1/5 this site
993 posts this site
Posted: Today 1:24 PM
Federal Lawsuit
-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
Now that we are being screwed out of the BCS, UL
and the Big East needs to consider a federal
lawsuit to stop all this nonsense. We should sue
the BCS, the Big 12, and the ACC for anti-trust ,
tortious interfence with contractual relations and
business practices and whatever else can be
thought of. There is no way that state schools such
as UL, UCONN, Rutgers, USF and Cinci should be
denied an equal playing field with other state
schools to compete for the BCS, its title and its
money. With WVU gone, no way the BIg East
keeps its AQ bid. The way all this has transpired is
plainly illegal. With that being said, if Big East can
somehow retain its AQ bid with revamped league
including service academies, etc. then I'm fine
with staying. Screw all the rest of these schools
and conferences that think they're too good for
us. As long as we have equal chance to make BCS
then we can compete. If not, a lawsuit needs to
be filed. Who knows who I should contact about
filing suit? What is Jurich's email?

[medford]

I'm not sure what risk there is in WVU leaving for the B12. Lets say Texas & OU both leave for greener pastures in the next 6-10 years, the B12 over the next 6-10 years will be much stronger both on the field and in television revenue than the Big East over the next 6-10 years. Over that same time frame, WVU can use the national prestige of Texas & OU to increase their brand name to the nation. If/when OU & Texas leaves, WVU will be in a much more stable position than they find themselves in today in the Big East. I literally see this as a no lose situation for WVU over what the Big East offers them today. Sure, an ACC or SEC bid would have been tits, but neither were coming anytime soon; this allows them to increase upon their brand over the next 6-10+ years and perhaps look even more attractive to the SEC/ACC/Big 10 should the B12 begin to fall apart.

I'm not a WVU fan, but WVU was relavant far before Pat White and Major Harris eras. They may not be on the same national stage as Ohio State, Texas, Alabama, etc... but they've always been a step above everyone else in the Big East (save perhaps Miami and arguably VTech) They have a smaller state, but the fans are rabidly loyal, the programs are generally strong. After BC, Miami & VTech departed, they're the only nationally consistant program in the conference. Every program has ups & downs, but UC spends a pittance on football compared to most BCS schools. Louisville is coming off a huge downswing and still working its way back, syracuse hasn't been relavant since McNabb graduated, Pitt is up & down, Rutgers has had 1 good season, UConn is a newcommer to the game, in a poor recruiting area.

The biggest problem the Big East has, is that so many teams play 2nd, 3rd, even 4th fiddle in their own region. Either to the pro teams or bigger colleges in the area. WVU was the exception to that. Louisville is behind UK, UC is behind OSU, Notre Dame, UK 0.1 miles south of the River, not to metion the Bengals & Reds, Pitt has taken a back seat to the Steelers & penquins, Rutgers & UConn get lost in the Pro scene of NYC, USF falls behind Florida, FSU and Miami in their own state.

The big East is in trouble not because WVU, Pitt & Syracuse are leaving, but because none of the football programs left move the needle. Friday evening is generally regarded as a terrible time to play a college football game. Its harder on the fans to get down there and tailgate, you're limited in the amount of recruits that can attend a game and perhaps take interest in your school, and there are fewer eyeballs on TV than there are on a saturday afternoon. What does it say about the big east that it had not 1, but 2 games on at the same time on Friday evening? Rutgers @ 'Ville, WVU & Sryacuse. Tells me that ESPN isn't all that interested in putting them up head to head vs the B10, SEC & ACC games they carry all day saturday.

[marcshoe]

Whooo! Road trip to Lubbock!!! :cool:

[Slyder]

All I know is that there is so much drama in that conference that nothing would surprise me.

I think we can all agree that the Big East is the equivalent of Conference USA, especially if WVU leaves. I would even argue that WVU was chosen ahead of Louisville as the "death blow" to the conference's AQ status. Even if Boise comes into the fold, its going to be impossible for them to hold onto the status now.

The Big 12 as it stands is the weakest of the "Fab Five". Oklahoma and Texas are keeping the conference afloat but a lot can happen. If Oklahoma becomes disenfranchised over something that Texas does with the Longhorn Network, I could see them and Okie Jr reaching out to the SEC. If the Pac-12 decides to expand to 16 and take the four big schools out of the Big 12, the conference is severely weakened into a similar conference where WVU and Kansas State might be a marquee football matchup.

It's a risk, but one WVU has to make. I don't see the SEC expanding to 16 anytime soon, but the Big 12 could be the next domino to fall.

The BIg East was already the equivalent of CUSA, WVU's following was the only thing really keeping it afloat BcS wise IMO.

Big 12 weaker than the ACC? In football? Pac 12 is done right where it is Texas won't give on the LHN and Pac won't let them have it. Texas overplayed its hand and got jacked up, they're a watered down ND all bravado with that nice TV contract to fall back on. They aren't going anywhere unless LHN collapses in an epic ball of fail and fire. Oklahoma is that guy with a jerk friend (Texas) but they think they need that jerk friend for something (recruiting). The two will NEVER separate.

This move for WVU is all about time. This buys OLuck and Pres Clement time to fix some minor problems before the next round of expansion and make this nice program look extravagant. It maybe the Big East all over again in 6 years like you said but thats about 6 more years than the Big East was going to give you.

[Slyder]

With the way things are going for WVU it wouldn't shock me to see Missery stay, big 12 stay at 10, and SEC swoops in and takes VPI or Clemson for 14 and stops.

We've gone from hearing that the invite is offered regardless of Missery and a presser tomorrow, to no presser. Please just make this END!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111111111

[WVRed]

I'm not insulting or bashing you but WVU is not all that great and doesn't bring much to the table as far as a BCS status goes, and this is coming from a die-hard lifelong WVU fan and graduate.

What I'm saying is that if WVU leaves the Big East the conference can survive with an automatic BCS berth. Hell WVU only has 2 of them and that was during the White/Slaton era of 05-07.

WVU was only relevant on a National Scale during the Major Harris and Pat White/Steve Slaton era.

For the Big East, WVU brings realistically the closest thing to a powerhouse school. I say that because if WVU runs the table minus the LSU game, they are likely top 10 and play in a BCS bowl with the likelihood of being able to compete against somebody from another conference.

WVU losing to Syracuse Friday night was really the worst thing that could have happened to the Big East as a conference. The conference needed a dominant team to surge in the polls and hold their own in a BCS bowl. With WVU losing the way they did and the schedule not looking much better, odds are a team ranked in the 20-25 range will play for a BCS bid and get throttled.

[WVRed]

I'm not sure what risk there is in WVU leaving for the B12. Lets say Texas & OU both leave for greener pastures in the next 6-10 years, the B12 over the next 6-10 years will be much stronger both on the field and in television revenue than the Big East over the next 6-10 years. Over that same time frame, WVU can use the national prestige of Texas & OU to increase their brand name to the nation. If/when OU & Texas leaves, WVU will be in a much more stable position than they find themselves in today in the Big East. I literally see this as a no lose situation for WVU over what the Big East offers them today. Sure, an ACC or SEC bid would have been tits, but neither were coming anytime soon; this allows them to increase upon their brand over the next 6-10+ years and perhaps look even more attractive to the SEC/ACC/Big 10 should the B12 begin to fall apart.


Let's assume the worst case scenario plays out and the Big Four of the conference decide to leave. This is what is left:

Baylor
Iowa State
Kansas
Kansas State
West Virginia
Missouri (all signs point to them leaving, but assuming they stay)

Looks like the Big East currently.

For the record, I don't blame WVU at all for leaving the Big East. It's a sinking ship that was done in by terrible leadership that unfortunately it took loyal fans this long to see. The Big 12 is by far and away a step up from the Big East currently, but ten years from now that may not be the case.

It's a gamble leaving, especially when you factor in that WVU is going to be an "island" in that conference. But its one that WVU had to make.

[Slyder]

I'm not insulting or bashing you but WVU is not all that great and doesn't bring much to the table as far as a BCS status goes, and this is coming from a die-hard lifelong WVU fan and graduate.

What I'm saying is that if WVU leaves the Big East the conference can survive with an automatic BCS berth. Hell WVU only has 2 of them and that was during the White/Slaton era of 05-07.

WVU was only relevant on a National Scale during the Major Harris and Pat White/Steve Slaton era.

WVU is the only school that actually has a tradition of travelling and actually doing something with BcS appearances left.

As for your last part you forgot 1993 and how many schools can claim lifetime .600 winning percentage outside of blatently obvious (ND, USC, Alabama, etc).

How many schools currently sitting in a BcS conference can't claim as few "great years" as WVU has experienced? I'll start that list with every member of the ACC (including Pitt and Syracuse) outside of FSU and Va Tech, Vandy, Baylor, Kansas, Missouri, Minnesota, Northwestern, Oregon State, UCLA, Arizona, Arizona State.

WVU's luster is that we draw tvs outside of what should be our natural viewing area (Pitt, WV, VA, MD) are we ND? No but we're more than what most of the 3rd and 4th tier schools can offer. We have been relevant and in the discussion (rightfully or wrongfully) for BcS since the first raid we lost some games we really should never have (Syracuse twice, ECU, UConn) but when we have reached that big stage we've put on quite a show for the nation.

The Syracuse debacle was a perfect storm of everyone playing/coaching like crap at the very same point. Our youth and inexperience showed, this was the first real ROAD challenge for a new offensive coaching staff and they panicked and laid an egg the size of Time Square on National TV. Are they destined to fail? No, I mean Rich lost to f'ing TEMPLE his first year and that turned out as a pretty good hire until 13-9.

[WVRed]

The BIg East was already the equivalent of CUSA, WVU's following was the only thing really keeping it afloat BcS wise IMO.

Big 12 weaker than the ACC? In football? Pac 12 is done right where it is Texas won't give on the LHN and Pac won't let them have it. Texas overplayed its hand and got jacked up, they're a watered down ND all bravado with that nice TV contract to fall back on. They aren't going anywhere unless LHN collapses in an epic ball of fail and fire. Oklahoma is that guy with a jerk friend (Texas) but they think they need that jerk friend for something (recruiting). The two will NEVER separate.

This move for WVU is all about time. This buys OLuck and Pres Clement time to fix some minor problems before the next round of expansion and make this nice program look extravagant. It maybe the Big East all over again in 6 years like you said but thats about 6 more years than the Big East was going to give you.

In terms of conference stability, yes. The ACC is set at 14 teams and I don't forsee anyone paying a $20 million exit fee to jump to another conference. I'm not bashing WVU by saying this but the fact that they offered a team that is 731 miles from its closest school (distance from Ames, Iowa to Morgantown) with harsh traveling conditions for making road trips should tell you how weak the Big 12 is compared to the rest of the conferences. Tommy Tuberville complained about it in the press release on ESPN and I'm sure other coaches aren't too thrilled about it either.

As for the Texas situation, time is going to be a factor. Five years from now, the Pac-12 could work out an agreement with Texas allowing them to keep the network and join the conference.

Of course there is a best case scenario in which nothing happens and the Big 12 expands back to 12 and adds some playmates geographically closer to WVU, such as Louisville.

Let me ask this to every WVU fan on here, "Where do you see the Big 12 ten years from now, and what is WVU's role in that conference?"

[marcshoe]

I've given up trying to predict what will happen ten hours from now, much less ten years. It wouldn't surprise me if current conference alignments become irrelevant due to sea changes in the way football is broadcast over the next decade. No real idea.

And stability or not, none of the 'big' conferences is currently weaker in football than the ACC. It isn't even close. Arguing the ACC's stability makes them a better football conference than the big 12 is like suggesting that the Pirates' consistency is a plus.

[Slyder]

In terms of conference stability, yes. The ACC is set at 14 teams and I don't forsee anyone paying a $20 million exit fee to jump to another conference. I'm not bashing WVU by saying this but the fact that they offered a team that is 731 miles from its closest school (distance from Ames, Iowa to Morgantown) with harsh traveling conditions for making road trips should tell you how weak the Big 12 is compared to the rest of the conferences. Tommy Tuberville complained about it in the press release on ESPN and I'm sure other coaches aren't too thrilled about it either.

As for the Texas situation, time is going to be a factor. Five years from now, the Pac-12 could work out an agreement with Texas allowing them to keep the network and join the conference.

Of course there is a best case scenario in which nothing happens and the Big 12 expands back to 12 and adds some playmates geographically closer to WVU, such as Louisville.

Let me ask this to every WVU fan on here, "Where do you see the Big 12 ten years from now, and what is WVU's role in that conference?"

Again if you believe the rumors FSU had a clause written in the buyouts that they only pay 6 mil if the SEC calls. If you believe all the rumors, you have to know that when the Big East football officially dies all eyes will turn to ACC as they are by far (statistically) the worst of the remaining BcS conferences left. 2 other points:
1) Media has a bad habit of building up something just so they can rip it later.
2) Karma can be a real *(@%#. Or Becareful who you step on, on the way up the mountain... because they will be the same ones you see when you fall back down.

I still believe when/if the big boys go 16 WVU will be in the SEC. If you want to say it happens 10 years down the road then here's how the b12 goes:

Missery and Us to SEC
Texas, TT, Oklahoma, and OK State to Pac 12
Kansas and the rest are left picking up the pieces or joining with that monstrosity (if it hasn't dissolved by then).

If you want to say "if nothing changes" (read no one goes past 14) then I see WVU as a all around solid program that is in the 2nd tier that picks its fights with Texas during meetings serving with Oklahoma a counter-weight to keep Texas from going complete and total Napoleon on them.

[KronoRed]

With the way things are going for WVU it wouldn't shock me to see Missery stay, big 12 stay at 10, and SEC swoops in and takes VPI or Clemson for 14 and stops.

We've gone from hearing that the invite is offered regardless of Missery and a presser tomorrow, to no presser. Please just make this END!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111111111

I've read in a few places that Missouri doesn't have the votes to get into the SEC, with the Elephants leading the charge against them.

[medford]

Let's assume the worst case scenario plays out and the Big Four of the conference decide to leave. This is what is left:

Baylor
Iowa State
Kansas
Kansas State
West Virginia
Missouri (all signs point to them leaving, but assuming they stay)

Looks like the Big East currently.

For the record, I don't blame WVU at all for leaving the Big East. It's a sinking ship that was done in by terrible leadership that unfortunately it took loyal fans this long to see. The Big 12 is by far and away a step up from the Big East currently, but ten years from now that may not be the case.

It's a gamble leaving, especially when you factor in that WVU is going to be an "island" in that conference. But its one that WVU had to make.

Well you left out TCU, unless you think they're getting picked up along w/ Texas, TT, OU, & OSU. As you say, that's no worse than the current Big East, so from that standpoint they're in no worse shape if/when something like the above happened. If they're no worse off in that scenerio, then I don't see the gamble, even if all hell breaks lose, they're no worse off than they are by remaining in the Big East. Meanwhile, the upside of having OU & Texas on the rotation in their schedule has to be seen as a huge plus over anything that the Big East can offer. There is only upside from their current situation as far as I see.

[will5979]

WVU is the only school that actually has a tradition of travelling and actually doing something with BcS appearances left.

As for your last part you forgot 1993 and how many schools can claim lifetime .600 winning percentage outside of blatently obvious (ND, USC, Alabama, etc).

How many schools currently sitting in a BcS conference can't claim as few "great years" as WVU has experienced? I'll start that list with every member of the ACC (including Pitt and Syracuse) outside of FSU and Va Tech, Vandy, Baylor, Kansas, Missouri, Minnesota, Northwestern, Oregon State, UCLA, Arizona, Arizona State.

WVU's luster is that we draw tvs outside of what should be our natural viewing area (Pitt, WV, VA, MD) are we ND? No but we're more than what most of the 3rd and 4th tier schools can offer. We have been relevant and in the discussion (rightfully or wrongfully) for BcS since the first raid we lost some games we really should never have (Syracuse twice, ECU, UConn) but when we have reached that big stage we've put on quite a show for the nation.

The Syracuse debacle was a perfect storm of everyone playing/coaching like crap at the very same point. Our youth and inexperience showed, this was the first real ROAD challenge for a new offensive coaching staff and they panicked and laid an egg the size of Time Square on National TV. Are they destined to fail? No, I mean Rich lost to f'ing TEMPLE his first year and that turned out as a pretty good hire until 13-9.

How many National Championships do we have?

You what is sick? WE played for the title twice in 5 years-88 and 93. The only way Notre Dame beat us is because they played dirty and purposely took Major Harris out of that game, I'll ALWAYS believe that and no one is going to convince me otherwise.

93 we just got our asses handed to us by Florida and even IF we would've won it would have been a shared NAtional Title.

2007 is what REALLY makes me sick, we would have destroyed tOSU in the title game, we know it, they know it, and everyone else knows it. If not for some egotistical prick named Dick Rod we would have won that Backyard Brawl, defeated tOSU and had a 2007 NAtional Champions banner hanging at Mountaineer Field...

I had to vent I still get sick thinking about what could have been. Not to mention that ugly old stupid moron Stewart that took our program back 20 years.

So realistically what could have been, WVU 1988 and 2007 National Champions...

UGH that makes me sick, we have been nothing but pretenders for years.

[WVRed]

Well you left out TCU, unless you think they're getting picked up along w/ Texas, TT, OU, & OSU. As you say, that's no worse than the current Big East, so from that standpoint they're in no worse shape if/when something like the above happened. If they're no worse off in that scenerio, then I don't see the gamble, even if all hell breaks lose, they're no worse off than they are by remaining in the Big East. Meanwhile, the upside of having OU & Texas on the rotation in their schedule has to be seen as a huge plus over anything that the Big East can offer. There is only upside from their current situation as far as I see.

My bad, I forgot about TCU.

[Homer Bailey]

Now it looks like its between UL and WVU for the Big XII. This is why I don't get involved in this crap.

[WVRed]

Now it looks like its between UL and WVU for the Big XII. This is why I don't get involved in this crap.

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/10/26/report-louisville-behind-wvu-to-big-12-snag/related/

Oh. My. God.

[jojo]

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/10/26/report-louisville-behind-wvu-to-big-12-snag/related/

Oh. My. God.

Isnt that kind of like Brad Pitt chosing Rosanne Barr over Jennifer?

[WVRed]

Isnt that kind of like Brad Pitt chosing Rosanne Barr over Jennifer?

Somewhat. Louisville isn't a bad choice though. The basketball program will always be top notch, even if Pitino does lose his mind. Football is a work in progress, but they are somewhat closer geographically than WVU without the travel concerns, and provide a better media market than West Virginia as a whole.

Mitch McConnell is the one behind the organization. He is a U of L grad and has been lobbying with the Oklahoma president and some Republican senators in the Big 12 states to get Louisville over WVU.

Every WVU game this point forward, home and away, is going to be extremely hostile. Rutgers, UC, and USF on the road with WVU looking to jump ship, Louisville at home with a possible Big 12 bid on the line, and Pitt at home with what has already happened with Pitt going to the ACC.

[5TimeWSChamps]

Goodness...

West Virgina Sen. Joe Manchin wants investigation
into Big 12/WVU /Louisville stuff.
Sen. Manchin to have 6 p.m . press conference in
Charleston to discuss conference realignment
issues.
Manchin will call for investigation into whether
any inappropriate/unethical actions were taken by
members of Congress to influence decision.

[5TimeWSChamps]

Manchin also issued a statement, which reads:
"If these outrageous reports have any merit ? and
especially if a United States Senator has done
anything inappropriate or unethical to interfere
with a decision that the Big 12 had already made ?
then I believe that there should be an investigation
in the U.S. Senate, and I will fight to get the truth.
West Virginians and the American people deserve
to know exactly what is going on and whether
politics is interfering with our college sports."
West Virginia Senator Jay Rockefeller also released
a statement Wednesday, saying, "The Big 12
picked WVU on the strength of its program --
period. Now the media reports that political
games may upend that. That's just flat wrong. I
am doing and will do whatever it takes to get us
back to the merits."

[WVRed]

First off, to set the stage:

A verbal contract is NOT legally binding. It's like promising you are going to mow your neighbors yard or wash his car. You can verbally say you are going to do it, but if something comes up you are free to pursue it, even though harm is done to your reputation in the process. However, if you sign an agreement (an actual contract, not a memorandum of understanding), you are obligated to fulfill it. WVU and the Big 12 had not made it that far yet.

Mitch McConnell is doing what is in the best interest of his state. That is why the people of Kentucky elected him, similar to why people re-elected Robert C Byrd for a number of years. McConnell knows the same thing WVU fans and politicians know, being invited to a better conference where you will have Texas and Oklahoma making visits will likely sell out in football and Kansas coming to town will sell out in basketball, which in turn generates revenue for the state economy and for a major university in the state. Manchin has lobbied for WVU as well, especially with his buddy and West Virginia native Nick Saban at trying to get WVU into the SEC.

The only question on McConnell's part is timing. WVU had already been told an agreement was in place (although not legally binding) to take them. McConnell asked his friend, David Boren, a former Senator and current President of the University of Oklahoma, to reconsider Louisville. Reading between the lines, I really kinda wonder if a lot of Big 12 schools were really happy with adding West Virginia given some of the quotes from Tommy Tuberville regarding traveling to Morgantown. Louisville isn't as strong a football program as WVU, but they do offer a better media presence, easier travel, and somewhat closer to the rest of the conference.

Here's where Manchin and Rockefeller getting involved could backfire: Most of the Big 12 states are red states and since politics being what they are, Manchin and Rockefeller, both Democrats, aren't going to have any persuasion. So the only other tactic is bullying through threatening an investigation. The best scenario is for WVU (or both) to be accepted into the Big 12, but even then, is WVU really that desperate to get out of the Big East that they would walk into a new conference knowing they were only taken because they threatened legal action?

And if the Big 12 tells WVU to shove it (and possibly Louisville as well), then this whole mess is a black eye for both schools at possibly ever being accepted into another conference. Does anybody think the SEC will offer WVU knowing that they will come with Senators ablazing?

[marcshoe]

So what would you suggest? Just lying down?

Responding to leverage with leverage seems to be a reasonable action given the situation. I seriously doubt this would lead to a "black eye" in the way you suggest. One could as easily say that this demonstrates both states' desire to be a part of the Big 12, which would be a more positive way to spin this.

I don't see doing nothing as a very good option.

[Mutaman]

I don't have any dog in this fight but the actions of these conferences and these universities do not seem to be in the long term interest of anyone. Right now its getting to be a joke. I question whether a United States senator lobbying on behalf of one university is appropriate or "in the best interest of his state". I do know that if these allegations against McConnell are true that he is a hypocrite since he recently said:


"I don't think the universities need any advice from Congress about how to run their business," McConnell told ESPN.com's Pat Forde. "I have concerns about it, but I'm not an expert on why the universities are doing what they're doing. I assume it is in their own best interests. From a fan perspective, it is a little perplexing. I don't know what's going to happen to traditional rivalries when they're traveling thousands of miles to play."

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/mitch-mcconnell-stiff-arm-keep-west-virginia-big-171224651.html

[Slyder]

I don't have any dog in this fight but the actions of these conferences and these universities do not seem to be in the long term interest of anyone. Right now its getting to be a joke. I question whether a United States senator lobbying on behalf of one university is appropriate or "in the best interest of his state". I do know that if these allegations against McConnell are true that he is a hypocrite since he recently said:


"I don't think the universities need any advice from Congress about how to run their business," McConnell told ESPN.com's Pat Forde. "I have concerns about it, but I'm not an expert on why the universities are doing what they're doing. I assume it is in their own best interests. From a fan perspective, it is a little perplexing. I don't know what's going to happen to traditional rivalries when they're traveling thousands of miles to play."

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/mitch-mcconnell-stiff-arm-keep-west-virginia-big-171224651.html

He probably said that before Louisville was seen as possibly being left out. As soon as that became possible Louisville went kicking and screaming to an alumni.

[Roy Tucker]

Its all about the money and the TV rights.

Universities are trying to maximize the dollars and everything else is coming second. Including rivalries, academics, etc etc. It is getting harder and harder to see any other outcomes besides the ones that make the most money. And I'm not saying this about just WVU. It's almost every major US university.

[WVRed]

So what would you suggest? Just lying down?

Responding to leverage with leverage seems to be a reasonable action given the situation. I seriously doubt this would lead to a "black eye" in the way you suggest. One could as easily say that this demonstrates both states' desire to be a part of the Big 12, which would be a more positive way to spin this.

I don't see doing nothing as a very good option.

I don't really know what to suggest. I do think its unfortunate but some of the reactions from WVU fans that I have heard are laughable, especially since I am from Kentucky originally. This isn't Jim Bunning going senile toward the end of his term, this is Mitch McConnell, who is equally as popular in the state of Kentucky as Robert C Byrd was in West Virginia during his tenure. Some of the reactions even suggest McConnell should resign as Senator.

But threatening litigation over an oral agreement which would never hold up in a court outside of West Virginia isn't the answer either. I think I actually would stand pat. If Louisville is accepted into the Big 12, they will have the stink of using politicians and making it public that it happened. By not threatening to hold an investigation where a WV Senator (Rockefeller) is the head, WVU looks better possibly to the SEC, ACC, or Big 10 should any expand. All money would be on the former.

[Mutaman]

By not threatening to hold an investigation where a WV Senator (Rockefeller) is the head, WVU looks better possibly to the SEC, ACC, or Big 10 should any expand. All money would be on the former.

West Virginia has as much chance of getting added to the Big 10 as Rutgers.

[WVRed]

West Virginia has as much chance of getting added to the Big 10 as Rutgers.

Given Rutgers is high on academics, I would move them ahead. Thats why I said all money would be on the SEC.

[Mutaman]

Rutgers also pushes this myth that New Yorkers will watch them on TV and thus give the Big 10 Network a chance to really expand into the biggest Metropolitan area. The reality is that the only college football New Yorkers care about is Notre Dame.

[marcshoe]

I don't really know what to suggest. I do think its unfortunate but some of the reactions from WVU fans that I have heard are laughable, especially since I am from Kentucky originally. This isn't Jim Bunning going senile toward the end of his term, this is Mitch McConnell, who is equally as popular in the state of Kentucky as Robert C Byrd was in West Virginia during his tenure. Some of the reactions even suggest McConnell should resign as Senator.

But threatening litigation over an oral agreement which would never hold up in a court outside of West Virginia isn't the answer either. I think I actually would stand pat. If Louisville is accepted into the Big 12, they will have the stink of using politicians and making it public that it happened. By not threatening to hold an investigation where a WV Senator (Rockefeller) is the head, WVU looks better possibly to the SEC, ACC, or Big 10 should any expand. All money would be on the former.


Given what you said I have to assume you believe WV's senators should have just kept quiet and let the August Senator McConnell have his way, and I just don't get that.

fwiw, Texas wants WVU in the SEC so I wouldn't say it's not going to happen just yet.

[WVRed]

Given what you said I have to assume you believe WV's senators should have just kept quiet and let the August Senator McConnell have his way, and I just don't get that.

fwiw, Texas wants WVU in the SEC so I wouldn't say it's not going to happen just yet.

Thats exactly what I am saying. Whos to say even without the lobbying by McConnell that WVU still doesn't get in and if they don't, its going to look really bad on Louisville and the Big 12. By threatening a Senate hearing, you are risking not only being possibly left out of the discussion for the Big 12, but possibly other conferences such as the SEC if they decide to call.

If Louisville gets picked, public sentiment might help WVU get into another conference or even force the Big 12 to take both teams.

[Homer Bailey]

WVU is in, for reals this time.

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/29532522/32980106

[WVRed]

WVU is in, for reals this time.

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/29532522/32980106

Beat me to it:

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/7159905/west-virginia-mountaineers-formally-invited-join-big-12

I'm kinda enjoying the Pitino meltdown:


The Big 12's decision to remain at 10 members will prevent Louisville from following WVU out of the Big East. Louisville men's basketball coach Rick Pitino said Friday that Big East commissioner John Marinatto was disappointed in WVU's decision.

"I told him to stop taking that attitude," Pitino told ESPN.com's Andy Katz. "If Louisville had left the Big East was over. Nobody was going to come in. I told him to be fired up and go get those teams."

[WVRed]

Pretty brutal schedule possibly for next season:

http://www.wvmetronews.com/news.cfm?func=displayfullstory&storyid=48827


The news release from the Big 12 says WVU will begin playing in the league next year. WVU has locked in games with Marshall, Florida State, Maryland and James Madison. If WVU would take over Missouri’s games, the schedule for 2012 could look something like this, but note that under this scenario, WVU has 13 games and would have to drop one.

Sept. 1 Marshall

Sept. 8 at Florida State

Sept. 15 James Madison (at Washington, D.C.)

Sept. 22 Maryland

Sept. 29 Oklahoma

Oct. 6 Kansas State

Oct. 13 at Iowa State

Oct. 20 at Oklahoma State

Oct. 27 TCU

Nov. 3 Baylor

Nov. 10 at Texas

Nov. 17 at Texas Tech

Nov. 24 Kansas (Missouri is scheduled to play that game in Kansas City)

This may not be popular, but if I am WVU, I would extend the Friends of Joe Bowl for at most three more years. F$U on the schedule might be overkill and depending on how the transition goes, the Marshall game could make a difference starting out in being bowl eligible or not. WVU is going to need a cupcake or two on the schedule and outside of Kansas and Iowa State I don't see too many.

[Slyder]

Pretty brutal schedule possibly for next season:

http://www.wvmetronews.com/news.cfm?func=displayfullstory&storyid=48827



This may not be popular, but if I am WVU, I would extend the Friends of Joe Bowl for at most three more years. F$U on the schedule might be overkill and depending on how the transition goes, the Marshall game could make a difference starting out in being bowl eligible or not. WVU is going to need a cupcake or two on the schedule and outside of Kansas and Iowa State I don't see too many.

I say go for broke, give yourself the best chance at the biggest splash you can make in the new conference. Since you have to buy out one of those games it doesn't leave you much options. I would work with the deadskins and see if they would be interested in a Kansas/WVU game and buy out JMU (moving the game if you can to that early September slot). That's just IMO.

[WVRed]

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/7175251/west-virginia-files-civil-lawsuit-big-east-places-blame-commissioner-john-marinatto


West Virginia also alleges, "The denigration of the Big East Conference is a direct and proximate result of ineffective leadership and breach of fiduciary duties to the football schools by the Big East Conference and its commissioner."

Yep. I think that about sums it up. Its not just Marianotto but Tranghese deserves a fair share of the blame.

[Slyder]

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/7175251/west-virginia-files-civil-lawsuit-big-east-places-blame-commissioner-john-marinatto



Yep. I think that about sums it up. Its not just Marianotto but Tranghese deserves a fair share of the blame.

I'm surprised they went to the lawsuit this quickly, unless the big east wasn't willing to give a price to pay out the 27 months and just expected WVU to kiss up like Syracuse and Pitt.

[WVRed]

I'm surprised they went to the lawsuit this quickly, unless the big east wasn't willing to give a price to pay out the 27 months and just expected WVU to kiss up like Syracuse and Pitt.

I expect the latter two to follow quickly. My guess is you'll see a negotiated buyout.

Then again, I wouldn't be surprised for a countersuit of the Big East and its remaining schools against WVU, Syracuse, and Pitt.

[RedsBaron]

The suit was filed in Monongalia Circuit Court. I wonder if the trial could be held at Mountaineer Field? ;)

[Slyder]

The suit was filed in Monongalia Circuit Court. I wonder if the trial could be held at Mountaineer Field? ;)

Where better? I think WVU feared letting the Big East pick the circuit because we would be looking at Rhode Island and a very unfriendly court.

[WVRed]

Where better? I think WVU feared letting the Big East pick the circuit because we would be looking at Rhode Island and a very unfriendly court.

I don't see it making it to court. If it does WVU will be held to the Big East for the duration of the exit term.

The whole point to this is public relations. By WVU filing the lawsuit and alleging that the conference failed because of the leadership is trying to get the Big East to cave. If they cave, which may happen if the invited teams join, WVU plays in the Big 12 next year and Syracuse and Pitt go to the ACC.

If not, it will likely be overturned in an appeals court not in the Mountain State. WVU is using the argument that TCU was able to exit and join right away as well as using the Big East's conference failure, but Oliver Luck has played both sides and as much as I like and respect Luck, I could see him being the downfall in this case.

[WVRed]

If I had to guess, the Dana Holgorson honeymoon is officially over.

[marcshoe]

All I know is that the special team situation has to change. And a little less arm tackling wouldn't hurt either.

[WVRed]

All I know is that the special team situation has to change. And a little less arm tackling wouldn't hurt either.

I wouldn't be shocked if Casteel is gone at the end of the season. If the Holgorson rumors are true (Georgia), he might force WVU's hand with it.

[Slyder]

All I know is that the special team situation has to change. And a little less arm tackling wouldn't hurt either.

Both those things have been issues long before Dana got here and its going to take time. Not to mention the losses to the NFL from last years d. If this were last year 12-0 beating down Va Tech in Miami is what I would expect with a top 5 offense and defense like we could have had.

[Boston Red]

If the Holgorson rumors are true (Georgia), he might force WVU's hand with it.

What's going on with Georgia? They're going to win the SEC East this year, so it's unlikely that Georgia will be in the market for a new coach.

And I doubt Georgia fans would be thrilled by a switch to Dana at this point.

[jojo]

What's going on with Georgia? They're going to win the SEC East this year, so it's unlikely that Georgia will be in the market for a new coach.

And I doubt Georgia fans would be thrilled by a switch to Dana at this point.

They might win the SEC east, which is very weak this season and if they do they will be embarrassed miserably in the SEC championship game and the bowl their subsequent bowl game.

[KronoRed]

They beat Florida and likely have the east, Richt is safe.

[marcshoe]

I think Dana H needs to be given the opportunity to bring his own coaches in and make the program his. I expected there to be some mess this season because of the way the transition happened (I started to say 'was handled' but it wasn't handled, it just happened.) We've had two losses that shouldn't have happened and still have Cincinnati, probably the best league team on the schedule, to go. The school needs to gain a bit of stability before tackling the Big 12*.

[Slyder]

I think Dana H needs to be given the opportunity to bring his own coaches in and make the program his. I expected there to be some mess this season because of the way the transition happened (I started to say 'was handled' but it wasn't handled, it just happened.) We've had two losses that shouldn't have happened and still have Cincinnati, probably the best league team on the schedule, to go. The school needs to gain a bit of stability before tackling the Big 12*.

I agree, I don't know if I agree wholly though. The whole mess of the casino, Stew's idiocy, the Pittsburgh reporter et all really put DH and WVU behind the 8-ball. This year was suppose to be a year of transition, now he's had to learn by the seat of his pants and at times he's shown his inexperience. This team doesn't reflect him because outside of a very few people isn't his. He already overhauled the offensive coaching staff and I feel very secure in saying that the staff as a whole is much better (and probably the best its been since Trickett left).

I mean just look at the advancement of the O-Line a unit that was a cause of great heartburn the last couple years. They don't have the depth but they have far exceeded my expectations for this year and I think it is a testament to the caliber of coaches that DH brought in.

I don't know about the two losses that shouldn't have happened. We got completely manhandled by Syracuse in a perfect storm kind of night, it happens when you play in a conference where you are perceived (rightly or wrongfully) to be everyone's super bowl. Playing in the Big 12 we won't be anyone's super bowl and maybe we will start to find that swagger we had during the Rich Years and earn back that sort of respect in a REAL conference. Louisville a case could be made that WVU should have won by 10+ but they wanted it more.

We haven't had a team play with any emotion since the Fiesta Bowl. When we had Pat White, Steve Slaton, and company we could get away with it (most weeks) but Geno has had a good year but he still has a few things to learn and the lack of a d makes it difficult. As I said after Syracuse I think we have a gage on how good/bad this team.

Here is my grades on JUST the Louisville game:
Offense B- Not getting a td after that INT was HUGE. Geno's attempted rushed fade at the end of the 3rd was HUGE. We have got to clean up some minor things.
Defense C They made some plays, I'd argue they made "enough" to win yesterday. They still lack the depth to really go after it like the 3-3-5 should. Its kind of grown on me while I play Madden and watch it but its much better when you can be aggressive out of it and Casteel hasn't been this year.

Special Teams F.. no that grade is too good for it I give Special Teams an I for incompetent. Besides the Starks return to start the game absolutely NOTHING went well for this unit. The shank punt right before half gave Louisville the field position they needed to go after the defense, a decent punt even to the like 25 most likely puts Louisville in just get to half time as is. Missed Chip Shot was a HUGE swing of momentum. The blocked kick was the difference in the game and a 10 pt swing in a matter of moments.

[texasdave]

Arizona has hired former Michigan coach Rich Rodriguez to take over a program that has never played in the Rose Bowl, and has been mired in mediocrity for most of the past decade.

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/football/ncaa/11/21/arizona-rich-rodriguez.ap/index.html#ixzz1eOPlTUsr

[WVRed]

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/football/ncaa/11/21/arizona-rich-rodriguez.ap/index.html#ixzz1eOPlTUsr

I posted pretty much the same link in the UK thread, as Rodriguez was somebody I wanted at Kentucky.

I think Rodriguez does well in Arizona. He was in over his head at Michigan and I think will have an easier path to prominence in the Pac-12 as opposed to the SEC. I think he would be fine with playing second fiddle to a basketball program and getting his own recruits. Going to be fun seeing him recruit California though.

[Slyder]

I posted pretty much the same link in the UK thread, as Rodriguez was somebody I wanted at Kentucky.

I think Rodriguez does well in Arizona. He was in over his head at Michigan and I think will have an easier path to prominence in the Pac-12 as opposed to the SEC. I think he would be fine with playing second fiddle to a basketball program and getting his own recruits. Going to be fun seeing him recruit California though.

He's a fish out of water in Arizona IMO. I don't think his "bravado" is going to go over well there, I don't think he's got the contacts he would at an ACC, CUSA, Big East type position in rcruiting. He should have probably waited a little bit longer to see what the coaching carousel offered even if he ended up at a UAB type position because of it.

If the rumors are true and Casteel is on his short list for DC's, I think Casteel has a better chance of sticking around out west with his 3-3-5 it would be in a league where a lot of the teams use a version of the spread.

[Slyder]

I think we mountaineer fans just got to watch the maturation of Coach Holgorsen tonight and I still believe he will be not just a good coach but a GREAT one.

[WVRed]

I think we mountaineer fans just got to watch the maturation of Coach Holgorsen tonight and I still believe he will be not just a good coach but a GREAT one.

I don't disagree with the maturation process, but he is going to have to take some major steps forward once WVU gets rolling in the Big 12. The SEC would have likely been a death sentence given the way the previous weeks had gone.

[texasdave]

West Virginia 2012 Schedule
Sept. 1 Marshall
Sept. 15 James Madison (Landover)
Sept. 22 Maryland
Sept. 29 Baylor
Oct. 6 at Texas
Oct. 13 at Texas Tech
Oct. 20 Kansas State
Nov. 3 TCU
Nov. 10 at Oklahoma State
Nov. 17 Oklahoma
Nov. 24 at Iowa State
Dec. 1 Kansas
* The Mountaineers open their first season in the Big 12 with a date against Baylor – a team they have never played before. A favorable non-conference slate should have West Virginia at 3-0 before they play in the Bears on Sept. 29.
* After playing Baylor, West Virginia has to travel for back-to-back games against Texas and Texas Tech.
* Mark it down: Nov. 3 is the meeting of the Big 12’s newest members, as TCU visits Morgantown.
* Nov. 10 – The Dana Holgorsen Bowl. West Virginia head coach Dana Holgorsen served as Oklahoma State’s offensive coordinator in 2010.
* Although the Mountaineers draw a difficult start to the final stretch of the season – TCU, at Oklahoma State and Oklahoma – they close with games against Iowa State and Kansas.
* Seeing a West Virginia schedule with no Pittsburgh is certainly strange, but closing the year with a game at Kansas is even more bizarre. However, that’s the price of realignment, as rivalries across college football are disappearing.