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Benihana
06-14-2011, 05:14 PM
It's been a while since we've had a "prospects I was wrong about" thread. With the draft now in the rear view mirror and an otherwise quiet Tuesday, I figured now is a good time to get some chatter going. Here are some guys in the last few years who I thought couldn't miss, and of course, did (to varying degrees):

Cameron Maybin
Lastings Milledge
Wladimir Balentien
Jarrod Saltalamacchia
Taylor Teagarden
Jeff Clement
Jeremy Sowers
Andrew Miller
Rich Hill
Tim Alderson

Patrick Bateman
06-14-2011, 05:36 PM
Maybin actually looks like he's turned the corner... his bat is pretty good considering Petco, and his defense althought tough to fully evaluate has played well in CF this year.

I agree with Salty for sure, I really thought his bat would play in the big leagues considering the numbers he put up at a young age. He's basically a disaster at this point.

I thought Matt Wieters would rival Joe Mauer, but he's still pretty good. I thought Alex Gordon was a stud, he isn't, but he's turned the corner to useful now.

Kc61
06-14-2011, 05:38 PM
Josh Roenicke, so far, now with the Rockies AAA team.

On the other side of the coin, I missed on Matt Belisle, who is doing well in the Rockies pen and could be a big help to the Reds had they kept him.

Sea Ray
06-14-2011, 05:44 PM
Remember this thread from 4 and a half years ago comparing Jay Bruce and Cameron Maybin?

http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=54904

This discussion centered on a popular baseball writer (John Sickels) who compared them and projected their futures and he basically said they projected to be equals refusing to give either one an advantage:


Advantage: Considering that they were born within 24 hours of each other, there's no age/projection edge here. It depends on what flavor of player you like, I suppose.

At the risk of swelling Doug's head, I'm going to use this opportunity to sing his praises. We are extremely fortunate to have him as an active member of Redszone. This is still another example of where his analysis was superior to the national so called experts. His was a lone "wolf" ;) in telling us all that Drew Stubbs was not a bust. He doesn't just regurgitate what someone else has written and he's willing to go against the grain. Doug's got his own view of things and it's frankly quite impressive

OesterPoster
06-14-2011, 05:48 PM
Matt LaPorta for me. He hasn't shown much yet, and I always thought he looked like a future star. Still could be, I guess.

NJReds
06-14-2011, 05:55 PM
I'm going to go the other way.

I didn't think Ian Kennedy and Austin Jackson (two guys the Yankees traded for Curtis Granderson) would amount to much with their new clubs, and both have done quite well.

Sea Ray
06-14-2011, 06:03 PM
I'm going to go the other way.

I didn't think Ian Kennedy and Austin Jackson (two guys the Yankees traded for Curtis Granderson) would amount to much with their new clubs, and both have done quite well.

Austin Jackson had a very good 2010 although they're not sure what to do with him in Detroit right now

cinreds21
06-14-2011, 07:20 PM
It's been a while since we've had a "prospects I was wrong about" thread. With the draft now in the rear view mirror and an otherwise quiet Tuesday, I figured now is a good time to get some chatter going. Here are some guys in the last few years who I thought couldn't miss, and of course, did (to varying degrees):

Cameron Maybin
Lastings Milledge
Wladimir Balentien
Jarrod Saltalamacchia
Taylor Teagarden
Jeff Clement
Jeremy Sowers
Andrew Miller
Rich Hill
Tim Alderson

I weas never a fan of Milledge nor Felix Piť. However, I thought Alderson would do great. He's doing great now in the Double-A Bullpen.

Jeremy Hermida- I was wrong
Celment-I was wrong too. I never thought he would be great, but I thought he'd be better than what he is now.
Adam Lowen and Hayden Penn
I was also wrong on Killa Cam and Andrew Miller. I thought they were gonna be great. Oh well.
And someone mentioned Matt LaPorta. I bought into the hype. Shame on me.

fearofpopvol1
06-14-2011, 07:34 PM
Matt LaPorta for me. He hasn't shown much yet, and I always thought he looked like a future star. Still could be, I guess.

This is the first one that came to mind for me.

I also thought Andy Marte was going to be a good player and he's been dismal.

Gordon Beckham, who still has a chance to turn it around, is another one I thought would be much better than he's been.

Blitz Dorsey
06-14-2011, 07:41 PM
I'll admit I never thought Drew Stubbs was going to be very good. It started off that I was ticked we didn't draft Lincecum instead. Then, to make matters worse, Stubbs' numbers were pretty bad most of his minor league career.

Not that he's turned into a superstar with the Reds, but he's been very good considering his age and experience level. I have no problem admitting I was wrong there. (Doug, thanks for not reminding me of it. Ha. I remember you and I had quite the many debates about young Mr. Stubbs. You were right.)

As for players on other teams, I feel confident saying that Shin-Soo Choo is the most-overrated player in MLB when you consider how much writers fawned over him the last 2-3 years calling him a "sure-fire future star." Not even close. He's a decent player, nothing more.

Caseyfan21
06-14-2011, 08:19 PM
I'll admit I never thought Drew Stubbs was going to be very good. It started off that I was ticked we didn't draft Lincecum instead. Then, to make matters worse, Stubbs' numbers were pretty bad most of his minor league career.

Not that he's turned into a superstar with the Reds, but he's been very good considering his age and experience level. I have no problem admitting I was wrong there. (Doug, thanks for not reminding me of it. Ha. I remember you and I had quite the many debates about young Mr. Stubbs. You were right.)

As for players on other teams, I feel confident saying that Shin-Soo Choo is the most-overrated player in MLB when you consider how much writers fawned over him the last 2-3 years calling him a "sure-fire future star." Not even close. He's a decent player, nothing more.

Stubbs was what I was going to post. Never figured he'd be much more than a speedy defensive oriented CF'er. Not exactly the type of player you draft at his position. So far I've gladly been wrong. And hoping I continue to be wrong.

redsmetz
06-14-2011, 08:36 PM
Um, Johnny Bench. In my youth, among one of Bench's first games, I actually hollered "Bench bench, things go better with Coke-r" Of course, I once took the side of the Dave Clark 5 as the better band versus the Beatles. Now in all fairness, they did break up after the Beatles... :eek:

dougdirt
06-14-2011, 09:05 PM
The one I will never live down was Hanley Ramirez. I was young and stupid, but I didn't see the power potential people kept talking about with him. Whoops.

More recently though was Alex Gordon. I think just about everyone has egg on their face from that one.

I thought that Delmon Young would be a much better player than he has been. While he is just 25 years old still, I thought he would have several strong seasons under his belt by now instead of 1 and a few bad ones.

Same goes for Matt Wieters. Thought he would have transitioned better to the majors than he has.

At the same time, I thought that Mike Stanton would be good, but not this soon. I thought the power would play, but his plate discipline and strikeout rate would hold him back for a few seasons.

OnBaseMachine
06-14-2011, 09:16 PM
Jeff Clement and definitely Jeremy Hermida. Hermida showed power and excellent plate discipline in the minors...I thought he would develop into a 30+ HR, .400+ OBP monster. He had a very good 2007 season with the Marlins at age 23 when he hit .296/.369/.501 for an .870 OPS and 125 OPS+. Not sure what happened because he never OPS'ed over .740 after that.

Dan
06-14-2011, 10:59 PM
Bruce has shown me more than I thought he would, considering his k/bb ratio in the minors. Mostly I try not to project, though. I'm not smart enough for that.

Oh, going old school, I was mad the day Stillwell was traded for Jackson. I thought it should have been Larkin instead.

GADawg
06-14-2011, 11:07 PM
if you're gonna go old school I'll fess up that i thought Gary Redus was a triple crown threat!

camisadelgolf
06-14-2011, 11:08 PM
I overrated: Jeff Clement, Rich Hill, Nolan Reimold, Ruben Mateo (before he was a Red)
I underrated: Chris Young (outfielder), Adam Jones, Gil Meche, Joel Pineiro

edabbs44
06-14-2011, 11:10 PM
I thought Tomko was going to be a very good pitcher for Cincy. Wrong.

I was fairly angry that the Reds totally overdrafted a Canadian catcher in the 2nd rd of the 2002 draft. Whoops.

I thought Kearns was the second coming. If King didn't give him an earthquake, things may have been different.

I was a huge Deno supporter. Thought he was jerked around a bit, especially at that time when they had nothing better going on. Oh well.

mth123
06-14-2011, 11:36 PM
Better than I thought they would be:

Drew Stubbs.
Devin Mesoraco (I assume)
Travis Wood
Logan Ondrusek
Ryan Hanigan
Aaron Harang


Worse than I thought:

Jeremy Hermida
Zach Duke
Jeff Weaver
Chin Lung Hu
Brandon Wood
Austin Kearns
Wily Mo Pena
Brandon Claussen

savafan
06-15-2011, 12:28 AM
Gregg Jefferies, Bill Pulsipher and Brien Taylor...

dougdirt
06-15-2011, 01:00 AM
I will go ahead and just say it now.... I don't like Dee Gordon much as a future Major Leaguer that is anything more than a fringe average regular. Nothing wrong with that, but scouts have been ranking him like a future All Star (as in true All Star ability rather than a guy who got voted in because he is fast or flashy or plays for a big market).

kaldaniels
06-15-2011, 01:01 AM
I will go ahead and just say it now.... I don't like Dee Gordon much as a future Major Leaguer that is anything more than a fringe average regular. Nothing wrong with that, but scouts have been ranking him like a future All Star (as in true All Star ability rather than a guy who got voted in because he is fast or flashy or plays for a big market).

What a disappointment. I saw you posted in this thread Doug, and fully expected to read "Hi, my name is Doug and I overrated Zach Stewart". :D

I keed.

dougdirt
06-15-2011, 01:24 AM
What a disappointment. I saw you posted in this thread Doug, and fully expected to read "Hi, my name is Doug and I overrated Zach Stewart". :D

I keed.

Maybe the next one. Still too early to say either way on him.

Tom Servo
06-15-2011, 05:19 AM
I saw Milledge when he first arrived to the Mets and thought his game was just going to get better and better. Apparently that was his peak.

OesterPoster
06-15-2011, 08:53 AM
I will go ahead and just say it now.... I don't like Dee Gordon much as a future Major Leaguer that is anything more than a fringe average regular. Nothing wrong with that, but scouts have been ranking him like a future All Star (as in true All Star ability rather than a guy who got voted in because he is fast or flashy or plays for a big market).

I don't know what it is, but I'm not that enamored with Gordon either. Would Billy Hamilton be a similar comp to Gordon? I'm not that sold on him either. (Nevermind...I saw your comp on the minor league forum.)

CarolinaRedleg
06-15-2011, 09:50 AM
I thought Brandon McCarthy would be better. I seem to remember he had a solid K/BB rate in the minors and thought that would translate well to the show.

Big Klu
06-15-2011, 01:24 PM
Gabe Kapler.

MikeS21
06-15-2011, 01:40 PM
Two Words: Rob Bell

cumberlandreds
06-15-2011, 02:24 PM
Shawn Abner and Gregg Jeffries. When I lived in SE Kentucky I would go over to Kingsport,TN and catch some Appalachian League games. I saw both of these players and thought they would make great MLB players someday. Especially Abner. I learned that if you look great in the Rookie Leagues that doesn't mean you will be like that in the big leagues.

Redsfan320
06-15-2011, 02:31 PM
Someone mentioned Wieters, count me in as well. I thought he was gonna be a stud, but he has turned out alright.

320

Benihana
06-15-2011, 02:59 PM
Going back a bit, Charles Johnson is another one for me. I saw him play with the Portland Sea Dogs and thought he would rival Pudge for the best catcher in the game. He obviously had a decent career, but he was no HOFer.

As far as ex-Reds go, I expected a whole lot more out of Ruben Mateo, Brandon Claussen and Rob Bell.

bucksfan2
06-15-2011, 03:15 PM
I bought into Luke Hudson. I also thought Jose Acevedo was going to be a good pitcher for the Reds.

Rojo
06-15-2011, 03:21 PM
No Drew Henson mention yet?

From the Yankees, Neagle brought back Henson, Jackson Melian, Brian Reith and Ed Yarnall.

A power bat third baseman, a toolsy centerfielder, a polished lefty starter and a high upside RHP -- seemed like quite the hall.

Benihana
06-15-2011, 03:41 PM
No Drew Henson mention yet?

From the Yankees, Neagle brought back Henson, Jackson Melian, Brian Reith and Ed Yarnall.

A power bat third baseman, a toolsy centerfielder, a polished lefty starter and a high upside RHP -- seemed like quite the hall.

We need to make more of those trades - in reverse. 4 prospects that amounted to nothing for an ace. Sounds pretty good to me.
That's why they were the Yankees for the last decade and we were the Reds (amongst other considerations).

(I know, I know, Henson eventually turned into Arroyo)

icehole3
06-15-2011, 03:49 PM
I was always on board with Doug of course about Drew Stubbs since day 1, I also praised Justin Turner and Dorn :)

cumberlandreds
06-15-2011, 03:51 PM
Going way back the Reds had a super prospect named Dave Revering. He was great in the minors. The Reds traded him before he ever played a game for them. I forget to who now. But he never panned out and I don't think played very long in the big leagues.

757690
06-15-2011, 03:54 PM
Going way back the Reds had a super prospect named Dave Revering. He was great in the minors. The Reds traded him before he ever played a game for them. I forget to who now. But he never panned out and I don't think played very long in the big leagues.

Curse you for bringing that up.

Revering was traded for Vida Blue, but Commissioner Kuhn vetoed it "in the best interests of the game." The Reds were forced to re-do the trade and got Doug Bair instead. A very nice pitcher, but no Vida Blue.

Benihana
06-15-2011, 04:10 PM
John Roper was supposed to be a stud. Ricardo Aramboles at one point wasn't far behind.

GOYA
06-15-2011, 04:17 PM
No one is going to say Wilkin Castillo?

For those that said Stubbs, it's not really a fair call. Stubbs changed his swing when he went to the Reds. He obviously has the frame/build for power but the swing he showed in the minors had little power.

It's too early to call, really, but for me, I'll say Carlos Fisher. He showed flat out dominance in the minors but he hasn't translated well to the majors.

Brutus
06-15-2011, 04:22 PM
Remember this thread from 4 and a half years ago comparing Jay Bruce and Cameron Maybin?

http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=54904

This discussion centered on a popular baseball writer (John Sickels) who compared them and projected their futures and he basically said they projected to be equals refusing to give either one an advantage:



At the risk of swelling Doug's head, I'm going to use this opportunity to sing his praises. We are extremely fortunate to have him as an active member of Redszone. This is still another example of where his analysis was superior to the national so called experts. His was a lone "wolf" ;) in telling us all that Drew Stubbs was not a bust. He doesn't just regurgitate what someone else has written and he's willing to go against the grain. Doug's got his own view of things and it's frankly quite impressive

Not to diminish your points about Doug, because I tremendously respect his opinions about guys in the minors, but there were a lot of people that didn't give up on Stubbs here on this board. I give Doug more credit for his insistence on Devin Mesoraco when he was OPS'ing like .580 lol

GOYA
06-15-2011, 05:56 PM
I have to admit I gave up on Mesoraco too.

Benihana
06-15-2011, 06:15 PM
I have to admit I gave up on Mesoraco too.

Yes, me too. He's probably close to a top 10 prospect in the game at this point, and the best positional prospect we've had since Jay Bruce. (Yes, a better prospect than Votto was).

Orenda
06-15-2011, 06:32 PM
Drew Stubbs is a better hitter than I thought. But, Ryan Freel is OPSing over 800 for San Diego in a limited sample.

Edit* I meant to say Chris Denorfia, the centerfielder who didn't get picked off 6 times a game.

Homer Bailey
06-15-2011, 06:34 PM
I have to admit I gave up on Mesoraco too.

Me as well.

I would have given up on Stubbs as well, but Doug's insistence somehow intrigued me.

dougdirt
06-15-2011, 06:56 PM
Oh... here is a good one. Elizardo Ramirez. I didn't think he was going to be anything special, but I thought his stuff was solid and he was able to throw plenty of strikes and thought he could be a solid #4 who could give you 175 innings of 4.25 ERA baseball. Whoops.

Benihana
06-15-2011, 07:03 PM
Oh... here is a good one. Elizardo Ramirez. I didn't think he was going to be anything special, but I thought his stuff was solid and he was able to throw plenty of strikes and thought he could be a solid #4 who could give you 175 innings of 4.25 ERA baseball. Whoops.

Only because I've admitted so many of my misjudgements on this thread and you've received so much praise (at times, like with Mesoraco, deservedly so) I will point out another one of your hiccups:

Adam Rosales

Benihana
06-15-2011, 07:07 PM
Only because they've been mentioned several times on this thread already, I STILL believe Delmon Young and Alex Gordon can be pretty good players, and would happily take either one on the Reds right now. Gordon especially as a 3B/LF swingman would look pretty good, and I'm sure we could interest the Royals in some of our minor leaguers (Tucker Barnhart perhaps?)

Roy Tucker
06-15-2011, 07:09 PM
Duane Walker, Kurt Stilwell, Bill Plummer, and Johnny Edwards were my "thought they'd be great" guys. Scott Scudder, Chris Stynes/Jon Nunnaly, Tracey Jones, Kal Daniels, and the all-time Willie Greene are runner-ups.

I thought Eric Davis had terrible hitting habits and would strike out too much. Larkin just wasn't that good.

dougdirt
06-15-2011, 07:21 PM
Only because I've admitted so many of my misjudgements on this thread and you've received so much praise (at times, like with Mesoraco, deservedly so) I will point out another one of your hiccups:

Adam Rosales

I did think he would be better than he has been. Though I do still wonder what letting him hit in GABP instead of whatever Oakland's stadium goes by now would do. Last season, in about 50% of a season, he was solid. 95 OPS+, which is a little below league average, but he was also playing the middle infield.

LvJ
06-15-2011, 07:30 PM
Where is Wladimir Balentien now?

kaldaniels
06-15-2011, 07:34 PM
Where is Wladimir Balentien now?

He's a stud in Japan.

LvJ
06-15-2011, 07:41 PM
He's a stud in Japan.

Just looked up his stats.

Yes, yes he is. Nice.

thatcoolguy_22
06-15-2011, 08:36 PM
I was in the trade Votto for Bedard campp because I didn't think he would be more than league average at 1B.

Daryl Thompson- After his first (maybe 2nd) game against the Yankess in NY mixed with his success that year in the minors, I thought he would be what Cueto is now.

Denorfia- I blame all of you guys ;)

Matt Gamel- I guess its still early for him

Matt Bush- I know he was a signability pick but... horrible waste

Saltalamacchia, Andrew Miller, LaPorta, and Milledge have already been listed.

Brian Anderson CF, White Sox- My buddy is a diehard Sox fan, and I listened to him rave for a year plus and eventually bought into the hype.

BJ Upton- Making it to the majors and being a starter is huge, so obviously not really a bust. However I thought he was would be a perennial All-Star selection and finish top 5 in the MVP voting a few times.

Cedric
06-15-2011, 08:46 PM
I thought the LH beanpole up in Seattle would be a multiple Cy Young winner. Ryan Anderson.

I guess he was a head case. I also thought Sean Burroughs would get 3000 hits.

Always Red
06-15-2011, 09:59 PM
Duane Walker, Kurt Stilwell, Bill Plummer, and Johnny Edwards were my "thought they'd be great" guys. Scott Scudder, Chris Stynes/Jon Nunnaly, Tracey Jones, Kal Daniels, and the all-time Willie Greene are runner-ups.

I thought Eric Davis had terrible hitting habits and would strike out too much. Larkin just wasn't that good.

Early on, Duane Walker hit 2 HR's in the same game off Nolan Ryan and I thought he was gonna be great. Not so much.

I bought into the Paul Householder hype. Switch hitter with power. Next Mickey Mantle. Not so much.

I always loved watching Eric Davis play (he could literally steal a base, ANYTIME he wanted to), but my dad and his buddies scorned him as "Erica" who would not play hurt. Dad changed his tune when Davis came back to play after cancer. Davis remains one of my favorite Reds- 1987 was magical.

I really though Encarnacion was going to be a fixture at 3B for some time. Miss.

Slyder
06-15-2011, 10:00 PM
This thread is why I don't really hype up prospects. So many things could happen. But at work one day I saw LaPorta just absolutely DESTROY one baseball and hit about 90% of the way up the scoreboard and thought he might make Adam Dunn look like Willy Tavares...

RedsManRick
06-15-2011, 10:20 PM
I thought Danny Graves was going to be a very effective starter.

KittyDuran
06-15-2011, 10:26 PM
I thought Danny Graves was going to be a very effective starter.

NOBODY scores on Danny Graves!!!

Blitz Dorsey
06-15-2011, 10:57 PM
if you're gonna go old school I'll fess up that i thought Gary Redus was a triple crown threat!

He led the '83 Reds in home runs. What more do you want?

(Oh, you want a team that doesn't have a guy who hit 17 HRs lead the team in HRs? OK, fair enough.)

Interestingly, Gary Redus was my favorite player as a kid (because my first Reds game in person was in '83). One day, they had an autograph session before a game and I told Redus TWICE that he was my favorite player. Said it loud. He completely ignored me; never even looked up. Gary Redus was a Grade A Jerk and it crushed me as a 7-year-old kid. My dad told me, "Don't worry son, he's no good anyway."

LOL. My dad experienced the Big Red Machine. Needless to say he was not impressed with someone of Gary Redus' skills. Especially if Redus wanted to act like a richard to a 7-year-old kid.

Also, at my first Reds game, Redus and Dale Murphy had a HR Derby before the game and Redus won. Can you imagine them doing something like that these days? Does anyone remember when the Reds did that at home games?

VR
06-15-2011, 11:01 PM
Householder, Kearns, Howington, Larson.....in addition to many already mentioned.

jojo
06-15-2011, 11:03 PM
I thought the LH beanpole up in Seattle would be a multiple Cy Young winner. Ryan Anderson.

I guess he was a head case. I also thought Sean Burroughs would get 3000 hits.

Injuries were a problem for Anderson...

Blitz Dorsey
06-15-2011, 11:04 PM
Oh... here is a good one. Elizardo Ramirez. I didn't think he was going to be anything special, but I thought his stuff was solid and he was able to throw plenty of strikes and thought he could be a solid #4 who could give you 175 innings of 4.25 ERA baseball. Whoops.

I was wrong about Stubbs, but I had "The Lizard" pegged. I thought he was horrible from day one. Didn't think his stuff was solid at all. His fastball was usually in the 90-91 MPH range and I wasn't all that impressed with his off-speed stuff either.

Cedric
06-15-2011, 11:19 PM
Injuries were a problem for Anderson...

Obviously the injuries were more important than his attitude, I messed up not listing that.

I just remember some pretty bad stories about his ego. At his age I would probably have been a little wild also though.

membengal
06-15-2011, 11:21 PM
The 12-year-old me had high hopes for Bruce Berenyi. Seven years later, I kept thinking Scott Scudder had enough stuff to get people out. I still don't think I was wrong on Kal Daniels, still the best young hitter I have ever seen in Cincy, but it didn't work out for him.

Oh, and Nick Esasky. I was just sure that someday he would put it together.

cumberlandreds
06-16-2011, 09:07 AM
Curse you for bringing that up.

Revering was traded for Vida Blue, but Commissioner Kuhn vetoed it "in the best interests of the game." The Reds were forced to re-do the trade and got Doug Bair instead. A very nice pitcher, but no Vida Blue.

I had forgotten he was part of that trade. Bair was a decent closer for a couple of seasons but Blue would have been the difference in them making the playoffs in 1978. I looked up Revering on Retrosheet. He had a couple decent seasons for Oakland but nothing really good. He was out the big leagues after the 1982 season.

MikeS21
06-16-2011, 11:20 AM
OUCH! I was just glancing over the rosters of some of those Reds teams from the early to mid 80"s. Those were some brutal line-ups: Brad Gulden, Dann Bilardello, and Dave Van Gorder were the primary catchers.

It's funny. I remember sometime around 1978-1981, we got some free tickets to go watch the Reds play against their AAA team at the time (Indianapolis?). The AAA team stomped them. :D

jojo
06-16-2011, 11:28 AM
I thought it would take Dustin Ackley longer to make it to the big leagues than it has given he was learning a new position.

cumberlandreds
06-16-2011, 12:39 PM
OUCH! I was just glancing over the rosters of some of those Reds teams from the early to mid 80"s. Those were some brutal line-ups: Brad Gulden, Dann Bilardello, and Dave Van Gorder were the primary catchers.

It's funny. I remember sometime around 1978-1981, we got some free tickets to go watch the Reds play against their AAA team at the time (Indianapolis?). The AAA team stomped them. :D

I can remember listening to those games against the AAA team. It seems like the AAA team,Indianapolis in the 70's,usually beat them. The Reds would play their regulars about three innings or so and then bring on the bench,not Johnny, and I think they added some AA players too for just this game. I really don't know why they played it except for the payday the AAA team probably got for them coming there and a sellout crowd.

Dan
06-16-2011, 12:44 PM
I was wrong about Stubbs, but I had "The Lizard" pegged. I thought he was horrible from day one. Didn't think his stuff was solid at all. His fastball was usually in the 90-91 MPH range and I wasn't all that impressed with his off-speed stuff either.

This game (http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/WAS/WAS200604240.shtml) is the one that I was actually at that I saw Elizardo Ramirez pitch. Looked great in that one. Oh, well.

Sea Ray
06-16-2011, 03:06 PM
I had forgotten he was part of that trade. Bair was a decent closer for a couple of seasons but Blue would have been the difference in them making the playoffs in 1978. I looked up Revering on Retrosheet. He had a couple decent seasons for Oakland but nothing really good. He was out the big leagues after the 1982 season.

Yep, Tony Perez lasted longer. Who would have thought that at the time?

_Sir_Charles_
06-16-2011, 05:06 PM
For me there were 2 that I thought were sure fire stars. Without a doubt. Not so much unfortunately.

Nick Esasky & Gary Redus. I thought they had all-star written all over them. Ah...the delusions of youth. :O)

cumberlandreds
06-17-2011, 08:50 AM
Yep, Tony Perez lasted longer. Who would have thought that at the time?

I had never thought of that. But yea, who would have thunk it?
Revering also would have had to climb over Driessen too. He was the golden boy then who was going take over for Perez. Looking back Revering never really had a chance to make it with the Reds.