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Orenda
08-14-2011, 03:25 PM
I thought this was funny. From Hal McCoy:



http://www.daytondailynews.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/dayton/cincinnatireds/entries/2011/08/13/whats_in_the_great_miami_river.html?cxtype=feedbot

now that is HOF material

Blitz Dorsey
08-14-2011, 09:07 PM
Interesting read from ESPN.com:

The aging St. Louis Cardinals

Heading into the season, the St. Louis Cardinals armed themselves to the teeth with veterans. With Albert Pujols under team control for one more season, and Tony La Russa essentially working year-to-year, this was the time to push their chips to the middle of the table. But as the trade deadline neared, the Cardinals' playoff chances were tenuous at best, so they doubled down for even more veterans, and did so in part by trading their youngest premium position player -- Colby Rasmus. Unfortunately, the Cards' new acquisitions have failed to stem the tide, and as their playoff hopes fade, it's fair to wonder if the window of opportunity has closed for the suddenly old Cardinals.

In breaking down FanGraphs' WAR of each team in the game by age group, we find that at the start of play on Friday, the Cardinals were one of five teams in baseball in which players aged 30 or higher were contributing close to half of their team's WAR or more. The Cardinals were at 56 percent; the other four are the Texas Rangers (49 percent), Chicago Cubs (54 percent), New York Yankees (67 percent) and Philadelphia Phillies (76 percent). While the Cubs are in a league of their own, the Yankees, Rangers and Phillies all stand a very good chance of reaching the postseason.

In Rasmus, the Cardinals had the guy to balance the aging scales. Last season, at the precocious age of 23, Rasmus compiled a .366 wOBA that ranked third among center fielders, trailing only Josh Hamilton and Carlos Gonzalez. But as center field was not the primary position for either Hamilton or Gonzalez, there was a case to be made for Rasmus as the best offensive center fielder in the game entering the season. Rasmus, however, hasn't been the same player this year, and the pitching-thin Cards decided they needed pitching more than they did their young center fielder.

In the deal, the Cards did receive two players under 30 -- 27-year-old Edwin Jackson and 25-year-old Marc Rzepczynski. But whereas Rasmus still has another three years to go before he reaches free agency, Jackson is a free agent at season's end. The Cards will have Rzepczynski for quite some time, but they have already marginalized him in favor of another uber-veteran -- 41-year old Arthur Rhodes, who the club signed off the scrap heap Friday. It's a head-scratching move, as Rzepczynski's FIP this season is a career-best 3.22, while Rhodes' is a putrid 5.97, the fourth-worst mark among relievers with at least 20 innings pitched.

Despite all the jockeying, St. Louis continues to slip. At the time of the Rasmus trade, the Cards had a 45.1 percent chance to reach the playoffs, according to Cool Standings. After Friday's win over the Rockies, that percentage had dropped to 29.9 percent -- sixth in the National League. Again though, the situation may be bleaker than it appears, as the Cards have not been able to solve the Milwaukee Brewers, their only remaining competition in the National League Central. For the season, St. Louis is 4-8 against the Brewers, but since the start of June, it's even worse: The Cards are just 2-7 and have been outscored by 22 runs against the Brew Crew. The two teams will play six more times between now and Sept. 7, and there is a chance that their final matchup doubles as the Cardinals' last day of contention.

The future isn't completely barren in St. Louis, of course. On the prospect front, Keith Law listed three Cardinals pitchers among his midseason top 50 prospects. But pitching prospects are a notoriously fickle bunch, and if the Cards pick up Chris Carpenter's option, they'll already have five starters under contract for next season -- four of whom will be 30 or older. Among players already in the majors, Rasmus' replacement, Jon Jay, has been above average offensively and is just 26. And when 27-year-old Allen Craig and 28-year-old David Freese have been in the lineup, they have produced as well. However, those guys are seen more as complementary players rather than building blocks.

When the Cardinals signed 35-year-old Lance Berkman, 33-year-old Jake Westbrook, 40-year-old Miguel Batista and 33-year-old Nick Punto before the season, the message was clear: We're going for it. But now the Cardinals are a team filled with players on the wrong side of 30 -- in Friday's game, six of the team's nine starters were 31 or older -- and the Rasmus trade, as well as recent acquisitions like Rhodes and shortstop Rafael Furcal, give them no path to getting younger and maintaining their current level of production at the same time.

And that's without getting into what they will do if they lose Pujols in free agency.

So not only is this year's window closing rapidly for the Cardinals, what's worse is that without Rasmus, there isn't anyone on the left side of 30 to help keep it wedged open.

Will M
08-14-2011, 09:26 PM
The Cards are getting older & I suspect they will lose Pujols after this season. That will leave them with Holliday & a bunch of non stars/role players. To win a division your star could really use a wingman. Sure they could go out & sign someone, they probably will. But losing Albert will hurt a lot, even if they get Wainright back. Holliday, Wainright, Garcia & nobody else who looks like a star.

The Brewers will lose Fielder & they have traded a whole lot of their farm system in recent years. They have Braun, Greinke & Marcum but lots of holes. Can they fill them for 2012? Not so sure.

so IMO despite all the non moves over the last year or so the Reds are actually ok for 2012. if they placed in the NL East or AL East we wouldn't have much of a chance. but the NL Central is going to be weak again next year. what the Reds have to do is 'get er done' this offseason. decide who to keep & who goes. fix the holes. no more sitting on their hands.

notice how when the Reds win I use 'we' & when they stink I use 'the Reds'. the Reds can win the division next year but they have a lot of work to do in the offseason. when they do i can get excited about the team again & start using 'we' instead of 'the Reds'

Blitz Dorsey
08-15-2011, 10:01 AM
The Cards are getting older & I suspect they will lose Pujols after this season. That will leave them with Holliday & a bunch of non stars/role players. To win a division your star could really use a wingman. Sure they could go out & sign someone, they probably will. But losing Albert will hurt a lot, even if they get Wainright back. Holliday, Wainright, Garcia & nobody else who looks like a star.

The Brewers will lose Fielder & they have traded a whole lot of their farm system in recent years. They have Braun, Greinke & Marcum but lots of holes. Can they fill them for 2012? Not so sure.

so IMO despite all the non moves over the last year or so the Reds are actually ok for 2012. if they placed in the NL East or AL East we wouldn't have much of a chance. but the NL Central is going to be weak again next year. what the Reds have to do is 'get er done' this offseason. decide who to keep & who goes. fix the holes. no more sitting on their hands.

notice how when the Reds win I use 'we' & when they stink I use 'the Reds'. the Reds can win the division next year but they have a lot of work to do in the offseason. when they do i can get excited about the team again & start using 'we' instead of 'the Reds'

They won't lose Pujols. St. Louis has a very important factor working in their favor: The Yankees and Red Sox are already committed long-term to big-money first basemen. If there were an opening with one of those two teams, all bets would be off. But right now? Where he's going to go? The Cubs? Yeah right. I suppose a West Coast team could make a play for him (the Angels or Giants ... not the Dodgers since they are broke) but I doubt they will offer him more than St. Louis does. I think the Cardinals will be willing/able to at least match whatever another team offers since the Yankees and Red Sox won't be a part of the bidding.

PuffyPig
08-16-2011, 10:38 PM
Pujols will cost plenty.

Count me among those who think the cost will not be worth it.

Ron Madden
08-17-2011, 04:02 AM
Some say losing Brandon Phillips would crush the Reds fan base.

Surely Albert Pujols is just as vital if not more important to the Cardinal fan base.

mth123
08-17-2011, 06:02 AM
More trouble in paradise related to alcohol in the St. Louis Orgabization. This time top prospect and rotation savior Shelby Miller is suspeneded

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/mlb/5977/shelby-miller


The Cardinals have suspended top prospect Shelby Miller indefinitely for violation of team policy

MikeThierry
08-23-2011, 12:51 AM
They won't lose Pujols. St. Louis has a very important factor working in their favor: The Yankees and Red Sox are already committed long-term to big-money first basemen. If there were an opening with one of those two teams, all bets would be off. But right now? Where he's going to go? The Cubs? Yeah right. I suppose a West Coast team could make a play for him (the Angels or Giants ... not the Dodgers since they are broke) but I doubt they will offer him more than St. Louis does. I think the Cardinals will be willing/able to at least match whatever another team offers since the Yankees and Red Sox won't be a part of the bidding.

I actually think a dark horse in all of this is the Texas Rangers. They have yet to maximize profits and their TV deal they signed last year is the largest TV deal to a team that doesn't have its own network. That deal is worth 3 billion over the next 20 years. They have a ton of money they can spend on any given free agent. Plus, with Michael Young's huge contract coming off the book in the next year or so, they might be the one team that can compete with any team in baseball over Pujols.


Since when is gettting 3.5M fans once in the franchise's existence become a place "that gets 3.5 million fans a year"?

Sorry Puffy I wasn't accurate. Let me rephrase even though the point is valid and still remains the same. There would be managers from other ball clubs that would leave in an instant if they can go to a place that gets 3.2-3.5 MILLION fans per year, gets financial support from management, management willing to do anything to put a winning team on the field, and constantly in the playoff picture.

Blitz Dorsey
08-23-2011, 01:18 AM
I actually think a dark horse in all of this is the Texas Rangers. They have yet to maximize profits and their TV deal they signed last year is the largest TV deal to a team that doesn't have its own network. That deal is worth 3 billion over the next 20 years. They have a ton of money they can spend on any given free agent. Plus, with Michael Young's huge contract coming off the book in the next year or so, they might be the one team that can compete with any team in baseball over Pujols.

Sorry Puffy I wasn't accurate. Let me rephrase even though the point is valid and still remains the same. There would be managers from other ball clubs that would leave in an instant if they can go to a place that gets 3.2-3.5 MILLION fans per year, gets financial support from management, management willing to do anything to put a winning team on the field, and constantly in the playoff picture.

Interesting. I hadn't thought about the Rangers, but that makes sense. That said, I will be shocked if Pujols signs anywhere else than with the Cardinals.

You guys know you're keeping Albert. You're just mentally preparing for the worst in case he LeBrons you. But deep down you know he's not going anywhere.

MikeThierry
08-23-2011, 01:45 AM
Interesting. I hadn't thought about the Rangers, but that makes sense. That said, I will be shocked if Pujols signs anywhere else than with the Cardinals.

You guys know you're keeping Albert. You're just mentally preparing for the worst in case he LeBrons you. But deep down you know he's not going anywhere.

I would like it to happen but not at the expense of not putting a competitive team on the field. Still, there is some room for payroll expansion even more so than this year and I have a feeling people would be willing to pay higher ticket prices/concessions if that means keeping a player like Pujols.

mth123
08-23-2011, 06:12 AM
I actually think a dark horse in all of this is the Texas Rangers. They have yet to maximize profits and their TV deal they signed last year is the largest TV deal to a team that doesn't have its own network. That deal is worth 3 billion over the next 20 years. They have a ton of money they can spend on any given free agent. Plus, with Michael Young's huge contract coming off the book in the next year or so, they might be the one team that can compete with any team in baseball over Pujols.



Sorry Puffy I wasn't accurate. Let me rephrase even though the point is valid and still remains the same. There would be managers from other ball clubs that would leave in an instant if they can go to a place that gets 3.2-3.5 MILLION fans per year, gets financial support from management, management willing to do anything to put a winning team on the field, and constantly in the playoff picture.

I think you are right about Texas' werewithal, but I'd guess they'll throw it all at CC when he opts out. They may not get him, but I'll bet the Yankees will need to pay through the nose to keep him.

MikeThierry
08-24-2011, 12:13 AM
Well, the way the season is turning out, the Reds fans won't have to put up with LaRussa much longer. I wouldn't be surprised if the Cards decided to move in a different direction in the off season.

bucksfan2
08-24-2011, 09:06 AM
Well, the way the season is turning out, the Reds fans won't have to put up with LaRussa much longer. I wouldn't be surprised if the Cards decided to move in a different direction in the off season.

I don't like TLR. I don't like his antics nor the way he views him self related to the game. That said I think he has done a pretty good job keeping the Cards relevant over the past few seasons with a less talented team. You also have a GM who is trading key everyday regulars for BOR starters with pricey contracts. I think TLR's antics were done in part to give his team a boost. I have a feeling if TLR leaves the Cards may be destined for a couple of difficult seasons.

Always Red
08-24-2011, 09:33 AM
Well, the way the season is turning out, the Reds fans won't have to put up with LaRussa much longer. I wouldn't be surprised if the Cards decided to move in a different direction in the off season.

and neither will Cards fans, Mike.

Interweb rumor has him perhaps going to Chicago to work for his buddy Reinsdorf, maybe in the front office?

TLR, at the end of the day, will be considered one of the great managers of our time. And he is. His "gamesmanship" gets tiresome, especially when he complains when the tables are turned on him. No one likes hypocrisy.

puca
08-24-2011, 11:40 AM
nm

cincrazy
08-24-2011, 12:53 PM
Two times in the last two years, the Cards have folded when faced with adversity. Last year, the brawl with the Reds. This year, the skirmish with the Brewers. After both series, the Cards collapsed. I think LaRussa has run his course in St. Louis. But if they let him go, will Albert stay? Tough situation to be in.

medford
08-24-2011, 01:25 PM
The bigger question to me, if/when TLR leaves, what does Dave Duncan do? I think Dave Duncan has meant more to TLR's success as a manager than any tactics, lineups or advice TLR has Dished out over the years.

He'll be 66 next year, will St Louis give him a shot at manager, does he even want to be a manager, I'm surprised he's never had a chance somewhere, is he ready to hang 'em up?

traderumor
08-24-2011, 10:46 PM
The bigger question to me, if/when TLR leaves, what does Dave Duncan do? I think Dave Duncan has meant more to TLR's success as a manager than any tactics, lineups or advice TLR has Dished out over the years.

He'll be 66 next year, will St Louis give him a shot at manager, does he even want to be a manager, I'm surprised he's never had a chance somewhere, is he ready to hang 'em up?He changes careers and becomes Johnny Cueto's personal barber.

Homer Bailey
08-31-2011, 02:17 PM
Stay classy Albert!

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_league_stew/post/Such-a-tease-Albert-Pujols-taunts-denies-Brewe?urn=mlb-wp17848


Honestly, the play itself would have been noteworthy. But then, when Pujols stopped his momentum, he locked eyes with a gentleman standing along the railing with his arms extended. Pujols approached the fan, stuck out his glove in what appeared to be an invitation to take the ball, and then snatched it away and returned the ball to the infield.

CTA513
08-31-2011, 02:28 PM
Hes a Brewers fan so he probably deserved it.

puca
08-31-2011, 02:33 PM
Albert was just having a little fun. Nothing to crucify him over.

Strikes Out Looking
08-31-2011, 07:34 PM
Albert was just having a little fun. Nothing to crucify him over.

I can't wait until next year when he's with the Cubs -- thereby killing two franchises at one time.

PuffyPig
09-01-2011, 07:54 AM
Albert was just having a little fun. Nothing to crucify him over.

If Pujols had later returned after the inning and gave him a ball, that would have been Albert having fun.

This was Albert being Albert.

MikeThierry
09-01-2011, 11:21 PM
If Pujols had later returned after the inning and gave him a ball, that would have been Albert having fun.

This was Albert being Albert.

You mean the same Albert that gives millions to charity every year, goes down to the Dominican on a yearly basis and helps the poor, and gives his time and energy to children with downs syndrome? I'm not so sure what you mean by Albert being Albert. The fan he was going to give the ball to looked about 60 and heckled him after the play. It more looked like Albert forgot that there were only two outs. This whole thing is just silly.

Patrick Bateman
09-01-2011, 11:42 PM
You mean the same Albert that gives millions to charity every year, goes down to the Dominican on a yearly basis and helps the poor, and gives his time and energy to children with downs syndrome? I'm not so sure what you mean by Albert being Albert. The fan he was going to give the ball to looked about 60 and heckled him after the play. It more looked like Albert forgot that there were only two outs. This whole thing is just silly.

You can be arrogant and charitable.

Albert probably is. Not that big deal.

Ron Madden
09-02-2011, 04:14 AM
If Albert Pujols wore Cincinnati Red Everyone would Love him.

PuffyPig
09-02-2011, 05:15 PM
The fan he was going to give the ball to looked about 60 and heckled him after the play.

Huh?

Fans above 60 don't deserve a baseball?

OldXOhio
09-04-2011, 06:15 PM
In this season of disappointment, I at least will take heart in the fact that we handled St Louis in 2011 and were one of the reasons why they too will be on their couches watching the playoffs rather than playing in them.

Enjoy your offseason cardinals

PuffyPig
09-04-2011, 07:24 PM
If Albert Pujols wore Cincinnati Red Everyone would Love him.

Of course we would.

But about the only people who love Pujols are Cards fans.

puca
09-04-2011, 07:31 PM
Of course we would.

But about the only people who love Pujols are Cards fans.

I strongly disagree with that statement.

I believe Albert is one of the more popular players in all of baseball.

PuffyPig
09-04-2011, 10:56 PM
I strongly disagree with that statement.

I believe Albert is one of the more popular players in all of baseball.

I strongly disagree with your statement.

5 years ago, maybe.

But today, he's seen as an arrogant superstar who will likely chase the $$$.

fearofpopvol1
09-04-2011, 11:00 PM
I strongly disagree with that statement.

I believe Albert is one of the more popular players in all of baseball.

I think 5 years ago, this was very true. I think the true Albert has shown his colors the last 3 or so years and a lot of fans are turned off by that.

cincrazy
09-04-2011, 11:16 PM
I strongly disagree with your statement.

5 years ago, maybe.

But today, he's seen as an arrogant superstar who will likely chase the $$$.

Really? I don't get that impression at all. I think he's one of the better ambassadors for the game.

Patrick Bateman
09-04-2011, 11:48 PM
Really? I don't get that impression at all. I think he's one of the better ambassadors for the game.

I'm sure there is at least one Brewer fan who strongly disagrees.

KronoRed
09-05-2011, 12:03 AM
I think Reds fans are the last people that would have an unbiased opinion about Albert Pujols.

Ron Madden
09-05-2011, 12:25 AM
I think most fans around the league appreciate watching super star players. They root for their home team to win but still respect and admire talented players like Pujols even though they play for the opposition.

puca
09-05-2011, 07:31 AM
Pujols was still #6 in MLB jersey sales in 2010, so some people apparently still like him.

Caveman Techie
09-05-2011, 08:35 AM
I was just curious, I missed the post game show has there been any stink about the pitch that was up and in on Brandon Phillips? I mean, according to Don Tony you don't throw there. So then how was it there was a pitch up and in to Brandon. And then after it looked like the pitch hit BP the "best fans in baseball" all started to cheer.

blumj
09-05-2011, 08:51 AM
I think most fans around the league appreciate watching super star players. They root for their home team to win but still respect and admire talented players like Pujols even though they play for the opposition.
Respected and admired as a player, absolutely, but he's never seemed particularly loved, or hated, for a star. I think that, if you don't have a dog in the fight, and aren't watching that closely, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of personality that comes across from him to create strong feelings in most general baseball fans either way.

RANDY IN INDY
09-05-2011, 09:28 AM
I was just curious, I missed the post game show has there been any stink about the pitch that was up and in on Brandon Phillips? I mean, according to Don Tony you don't throw there. So then how was it there was a pitch up and in to Brandon. And then after it looked like the pitch hit BP the "best fans in baseball" all started to cheer.

Rule is, you don't throw there to Cardinal hitters. Anyone else is fair game.

cincrazy
09-05-2011, 07:42 PM
I'm sure there is at least one Brewer fan who strongly disagrees.

This one incident doesn't erase a career full of good deeds. We don't know the circumstances, we don't know what the fan said, etc. Sure, he looks bad. But it wasn't a kid, it was a grown adult, and that leads me to believe there was a reason for this. I mean, come on, it's a baseball. I don't see the big deal.

kaldaniels
09-05-2011, 08:51 PM
What can I say, I give kudos to Albert for the interaction with the Brewers fan.

PuffyPig
09-05-2011, 09:21 PM
This one incident doesn't erase a career full of good deeds. We don't know the circumstances, we don't know what the fan said, etc. Sure, he looks bad. But it wasn't a kid, it was a grown adult, and that leads me to believe there was a reason for this. I mean, come on, it's a baseball. I don't see the big deal.


I'm sure if there were "circumstances", we would have heard it.

Instead no defense has been presented.

I'm sure King Albert thought it was hilarious toying with a Brewer fan.

Yeah, huge joke.....

cincrazy
09-05-2011, 11:05 PM
I'm sure if there were "circumstances", we would have heard it.

Instead no defense has been presented.

I'm sure King Albert thought it was hilarious toying with a Brewer fan.

Yeah, huge joke.....

Why do you assume we would have heard it? If this was Braun, a Brewer, and not Pujols, the Cardinal, it wouldn't even be mentioned anywhere on this site. Pujols has a track record of kindness that can't be ignored, whether we despise the Cardinals or not. So me an elite athlete that doesn't have an ego and a touch of arrogance. I'm not saying what he did was ok, clearly it's rude, but I hardly think it smears his character.

PuffyPig
09-05-2011, 11:17 PM
Why do you assume we would have heard it? If this was Braun, a Brewer, and not Pujols, the Cardinal, it wouldn't even be mentioned anywhere on this site. Pujols has a track record of kindness that can't be ignored, whether we despise the Cardinals or not. So me an elite athlete that doesn't have an ego and a touch of arrogance. I'm not saying what he did was ok, clearly it's rude, but I hardly think it smears his character.

While the rude episode was mentioned on every Cards site I read daily, there was nothing that explained it. I certainly would have heard it.

Many, many elite athletes don't have large ego's and even more have zero arrogance.

Think Ken Griffey Jr. Tony Perez. Adam Wainwright.

A touch of arrogance? Pujols bathes in arrogance, then rolls in it for good measure.

Caveman Techie
09-06-2011, 10:05 AM
Lol, this is priceless. Now the Cardinals are complaining about the field conditions AT THEIR OWN FIELD! http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball/professional/article_47c65f0a-68aa-5e41-8397-07d581d9ba3d.html

2011 Cardinals, proving Brandon Phillips point with every article.

Reds/Flyers Fan
09-06-2011, 11:35 AM
Lol, this is priceless. Now the Cardinals are complaining about the field conditions AT THEIR OWN FIELD! http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball/professional/article_47c65f0a-68aa-5e41-8397-07d581d9ba3d.html

2011 Cardinals, proving Brandon Phillips point with every article.

And, apparantly, Pujols and Holiday think it "wasn't fair" that the game started at 3:15 p.m. due to the shadows.

This team never fails to amaze with its incessant complaining. It's surreal at this point. Yet the alleged "best fans in baseball" continue to boo Brandon Phillips? At this point, I wouldn't even say STL fans are the best fans in the Central Time Zone (Minnesota, Milwaukee).

traderumor
09-06-2011, 12:03 PM
Question: The other team has scored 7 and 4 in the games cited. How can this be? If the Cards can't hit it, how possibly can the other team be expected to play under such horrible conditions--and score also.

I'm going to make a mint off my Cardinals' excuse shirt.

MikeThierry
09-07-2011, 11:02 PM
And, apparantly, Pujols and Holiday think it "wasn't fair" that the game started at 3:15 p.m. due to the shadows.

This team never fails to amaze with its incessant complaining. It's surreal at this point. Yet the alleged "best fans in baseball" continue to boo Brandon Phillips? At this point, I wouldn't even say STL fans are the best fans in the Central Time Zone (Minnesota, Milwaukee).

I'm not sure what Pujols and Holiday had to say about the shadows (which is stupid and ridiculous by the way) has anything to do with the fandom. The two are completely separate issues.

By the way, the Braves just lost so that puts the Cards 6 1/2 games behind them in the standings. What is interesting is the Cards have a 3 game series this weekend with the Braves at home. The chances of the Cards winning the Wild Card is slim but it sure will be interesting if the Cards happened to sweep the Braves this weekend (which probably won't happen). Still, this weekend series will be interesting if you are a Cards fan hoping against hope that they can pull it out. It will also be interesting for Reds fans that despise the Cards to the point where you look at every single article, pick out every little thing, and point it out as evidence of whining. I mean, wouldn't watching the Cards fall down to the Braves this weekend eliminating any hope for the Cards be like baseball porn to those Reds fans?

mbgrayson
09-07-2011, 11:06 PM
I mean, wouldn't watching the Cards fall down to the Braves this weekend eliminating any hope for the Cards be like baseball porn to those Reds fans?

No, the Cards simply being the Cards is like porn to those of us who loath LaRussa and company.

Reds/Flyers Fan
09-07-2011, 11:42 PM
I'm not sure what Pujols and Holiday had to say about the shadows (which is stupid and ridiculous by the way) has anything to do with the fandom. The two are completely separate issues.

By the way, the Braves just lost so that puts the Cards 6 1/2 games behind them in the standings. What is interesting is the Cards have a 3 game series this weekend with the Braves at home. The chances of the Cards winning the Wild Card is slim but it sure will be interesting if the Cards happened to sweep the Braves this weekend (which probably won't happen). Still, this weekend series will be interesting if you are a Cards fan hoping against hope that they can pull it out. It will also be interesting for Reds fans that despise the Cards to the point where you look at every single article, pick out every little thing, and point it out as evidence of whining. I mean, wouldn't watching the Cards fall down to the Braves this weekend eliminating any hope for the Cards be like baseball porn to those Reds fans?

It would be even more interesting for the Cards if the Reds didn't walk into St. Loo last weekend and take two of three. :beerme: :lol: :laugh: :D :p :thumbup: :beerme:

MikeThierry
09-07-2011, 11:56 PM
It would be even more interesting for the Cards if the Reds didn't walk into St. Loo last weekend and take two of three. :beerme: :lol: :laugh: :D :p :thumbup: :beerme:

You bring up an issue into why I have sporadically watch the games for about a month now. The Cards just look lifeless at time and just don't look like they give rats you know what about what they are doing on the field. At times, it is just uninspiring baseball. I have been a loyal fan of the team for a long time but there comes a point where enough is enough. We haven't made the playoffs going on two years now (after this year is finished of course) and that is unacceptable. Mehh... I'm just glad hockey and football season is coming up. At least with the Rams I know they will be trying hard to win each and every game.

Homer Bailey
09-08-2011, 12:19 AM
Move over Brandon Phillips.... I present, Mr. Nyjer Morgan:


Where still n 1st and I hope those crying birds injoy watching tha Crew in tha Playoffs!!! Aaaaahhhhh!!!


Alberta couldn't see Plush if she had her gloves on!!! Wat was she thinking running afta Plush!!! She never been n tha ring!!!

(Alberta of course referring to Pujols)

MikeThierry
09-08-2011, 12:34 AM
Move over Brandon Phillips.... I present, Mr. Nyjer Morgan:





(Alberta of course referring to Pujols)



I can at least respect Phillips because I can actually understand what he is saying and when he called the Cards out, he had to play them several more series. Nyjer says all this stuff while leaving town and the Brewers don't have to play the Cards anymore this season.

By the way, Albert would destroy Morgan if they got in the ring together.

CTA513
09-08-2011, 02:31 AM
Morgan is the type of person that deserves to be punched.

reds44
09-08-2011, 02:37 AM
Love me some Tony Plush.

Ron Madden
09-08-2011, 03:51 AM
Move over Brandon Phillips.... I present, Mr. Nyjer Morgan:





(Alberta of course referring to Pujols)

Nyger Morgan is an Idiotic Hot Dog who doesn't deserve to be called Mr.

I'd love to see someone on the Reds pitching staff drill him in the ribs in retaliation for that cheap shot elbow to the head he gave Ryan Hanigan.

PuffyPig
09-08-2011, 07:56 AM
It will also be interesting for Reds fans that despise the Cards to the point where you look at every single article, pick out every little thing, and point it out as evidence of whining.

A Card's fan whining about whining.

Colour me surprised.......

Always Red
09-08-2011, 07:59 AM
Colour me surprised.......

Nyjer Morgan and Chris Carpenter *****ing at each other?

Color me surprised.

wolfboy
09-08-2011, 08:58 AM
Pujols has to dash across the field to protect Carp? How's he going to....oh nevermind.

Chip R
09-08-2011, 09:05 AM
You bring up an issue into why I have sporadically watch the games for about a month now. The Cards just look lifeless at time and just don't look like they give rats you know what about what they are doing on the field. At times, it is just uninspiring baseball. I have been a loyal fan of the team for a long time but there comes a point where enough is enough. We haven't made the playoffs going on two years now (after this year is finished of course) and that is unacceptable. Mehh... I'm just glad hockey and football season is coming up. At least with the Rams I know they will be trying hard to win each and every game.

Far be it from me to defend the Cards but when any team loses they usually look uninspired. I see it from Reds fans all the time. It's a long season and baseball isn't a contact sport like football and hockey. Even the best teams are going to lose 40 games and they aren't going to look like world beaters in a lot of those games.

cincrazy
09-08-2011, 10:11 AM
Nyjer Morgan is insane, and Chris Carpenter should drill him in the ribs next time they face off. There's nothing cute or funny about Morgan's routine, the guy is like a crazier version on Milton Bradley.

Reds/Flyers Fan
09-08-2011, 11:01 AM
I'll support Nyjer Morgan any day against the Cards. Wouldn't want him on my team though.

PuffyPig
09-08-2011, 12:35 PM
You bring up an issue into why I have sporadically watch the games for about a month now. The Cards just look lifeless at time and just don't look like they give rats you know what about what they are doing on the field. At times, it is just uninspiring baseball. I have been a loyal fan of the team for a long time but there comes a point where enough is enough. We haven't made the playoffs going on two years now (after this year is finished of course) and that is unacceptable. Mehh... I'm just glad hockey and football season is coming up. At least with the Rams I know they will be trying hard to win each and every game.

I'm quite surprised by your response.

I watch pretty much every Reds game until the bitter end.

And usually it's the bitter end most years.

Patrick Bateman
09-08-2011, 12:40 PM
You bring up an issue into why I have sporadically watch the games for about a month now. The Cards just look lifeless at time and just don't look like they give rats you know what about what they are doing on the field. At times, it is just uninspiring baseball. I have been a loyal fan of the team for a long time but there comes a point where enough is enough. We haven't made the playoffs going on two years now (after this year is finished of course) and that is unacceptable. Mehh... I'm just glad hockey and football season is coming up. At least with the Rams I know they will be trying hard to win each and every game.

2 years?

You are complaining about a 2 year hiatus?

On a Reds board?

I think you need to find a Yankee audience to find some pity for you :)

RANDY IN INDY
09-08-2011, 01:04 PM
I'm quite surprised by your response.

I watch pretty much every Reds game until the bitter end.

And usually it's the bitter end most years.

Same here.

MikeThierry
09-08-2011, 03:12 PM
I'm quite surprised by your response.

I watch pretty much every Reds game until the bitter end.

And usually it's the bitter end most years.


Why waste my time with a team that doesn't seem to care? If there is anything in sports that just annoys me and turns me off is when I see a team going through the motions and not seeming to care. I have better things to do with my time esp. since school is starting up again.



2 years?

You are complaining about a 2 year hiatus?

On a Reds board?

I think you need to find a Yankee audience to find some pity for you

I'm not trying to find pity. All I'm saying is that its inexcusable. That statement isn't to incite pity on my part. From Cardinals fans point of view, making the playoffs once in five years and not having a playoff win since 2006 is pathetic and unacceptable. Not trying to throw a pity party, it is just different expectations for Cards fans.

PuffyPig
09-08-2011, 03:28 PM
Why waste my time with a team that doesn't seem to care?

My view is that we support out teams through thick and thin.

Especially thin.

It's what separates the diehards from the bandwagon jumpers.

Matt700wlw
09-08-2011, 04:33 PM
Lots of 'splanin' needed for sons of both parties.



It is two years straight though, the 2nd place Cardinals get in a spat with the team ahead of them...

Spitball
09-08-2011, 09:04 PM
I'll support Nyjer Morgan any day against the Cards. Wouldn't want him on my team though.

That is about the way I feel about it, also... especially with Carpenter involved.

traderumor
09-08-2011, 10:07 PM
You bring up an issue into why I have sporadically watch the games for about a month now. The Cards just look lifeless at time and just don't look like they give rats you know what about what they are doing on the field. At times, it is just uninspiring baseball. I have been a loyal fan of the team for a long time but there comes a point where enough is enough. We haven't made the playoffs going on two years now (after this year is finished of course) and that is unacceptable. Mehh... I'm just glad hockey and football season is coming up. At least with the Rams I know they will be trying hard to win each and every game.Apparently you weren't a fan from 1969-1981. Or for the decade of the 90s. And you could be watching the best you'll see for a few more years.

REDblooded
09-08-2011, 11:28 PM
Go look at Cardinals attendance in the years proceeding Mark McGuire... Then look at the attendance during the HR chase. Immediately following that was Pujols.

Yeah, you've had great attendance #'s recently, but before the super-juicer they were just sub-par... let's see how well the "best fans in the history of baseball" represent themselves after Pujols leaves....

Ron Madden
09-09-2011, 03:33 AM
This is just my humble opinion but I feel a need to express it.

I honestly can't understand what seems to be hatred and disrespect directed at Albert Pujols in this thread.

I admit I've always hated the Dodgers. Hated them in the 1960's but still respected Walter Alston, Sandy Koufax and Don Drysdale.

I hated the Dodgers in the 1970's but still respected the way Steve Garvey and Davey Lopes played the game.

I've often found myself rooting against the Cardinals the last few years but I still must be honest with myself and give credit where credit is due.

I respect Albert Pujols and honestly believe he is one of the best hitters I've ever seen.

PuffyPig
09-09-2011, 07:26 AM
I respect Albert Pujols and honestly believe he is one of the best hitters I've ever seen.

I think everyone agrees that he is one of the best hitters ever. That is beyond debate.

But many people believe he's become very arrogant, and I am one of those people.

OldXOhio
09-09-2011, 10:03 AM
This is just my humble opinion but I feel a need to express it.

I honestly can't understand what seems to be hatred and disrespect directed at Albert Pujols in this thread.

I admit I've always hated the Dodgers. Hated them in the 1960's but still respected Walter Alston, Sandy Koufax and Don Drysdale.

I hated the Dodgers in the 1970's but still respected the way Steve Garvey and Davey Lopes played the game.

I've often found myself rooting against the Cardinals the last few years but I still must be honest with myself and give credit where credit is due.

I respect Albert Pujols and honestly believe he is one of the best hitters I've ever seen.

My opinion as well Ron. I find it humorous when a professional athlete is accused of being arrogant. Most in the game are in some fashion.

Tony Cloninger
09-09-2011, 10:31 AM
I think everyone agrees that he is one of the best hitters ever. That is beyond debate.

But many people believe he's become very arrogant, and I am one of those people.

He has been arrogant from day 1..... I think he took someone deep from San Diego during is 1st season...and he just stood there at the plate and acted like he owned the place. He got called out for it....was thrown at....and acted incredulous that he was even being questioned. He has always been arrogant.

PuffyPig
09-09-2011, 10:50 AM
My opinion as well Ron. I find it humorous when a professional athlete is accused of being arrogant. Most in the game are in some fashion.

If most are arrogant, why would it be "humorous" to be accused of it?

Isn't it, then, exepcted that players will be called "arrogant" since they are?

cincrazy
09-09-2011, 11:07 PM
Joey Votto doesn't stand and watch home runs?

I(heart)Freel
09-09-2011, 11:58 PM
Say what you will about Morgan's idiocy. And there is a lot to say. But at least he was straight with reporters about what happened from the beginning. He didn't take two homer journalists aside later to "clarify" when it became apparent he was lying.

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball/professional/cardinal-beat/article_f77214b8-db2e-11e0-94de-0019bb30f31a.html?mode=comments

Man I despise Carpenter. Is there a bigger tool in the game?

WVRedsFan
09-10-2011, 12:03 AM
He has been arrogant from day 1..... I think he took someone deep from San Diego during is 1st season...and he just stood there at the plate and acted like he owned the place. He got called out for it....was thrown at....and acted incredulous that he was even being questioned. He has always been arrogant.I guess if you are called the greatest player of all time by ESPN, Fox Sports, TBS, George Grande, Thom Brenneman, and the rest of the western world, it might make you arrogant, but there is arrogant and then there is arrogant. Albert takes the cake. The guy simply is off the wall arrogant.

WVRedsFan
09-10-2011, 12:05 AM
Same here.Three of us 99% of the time. Illness and times I am away from home are the only exceptions.

The Operator
09-10-2011, 12:19 AM
As much as I despise Chris Carpenter, I probably would have reacted just as he did in that situation.

Nyjer Morgan is a clown and there's no excuse for yelling profanities at a pitcher while on the basepaths. That's ridiculous.

The Tony Plush stuff might be funny if Morgan wasn't such a tool in real life, but his actual persona takes away from any humor in his alias.

traderumor
09-10-2011, 09:38 AM
Several Cardinals use Twitter to interact with fans or other players, and La Russa was asked how he would feel if one of his players used the medium to taunt or ridicule another team or player.
"If they ever use it like he did, we would ban tweeting," La Russa said. "I think it's over. We're not worried about what Albert is thinking."
There's even a Cardinals approved way to use Twitter. They're just so dang perfect, how do they ever lose a game? Oh wait, they don't, they never get beat, there's always some excuse why they lost, be it slippery balls, shadows, throwing inside the wrong way, getting even close to hitting Albert, moths in ears, bad calls, and of course, in Cincinnati, "its always something there."

That excuse shirt is getting mighty full.

traderumor
09-10-2011, 09:39 AM
As much as I despise Chris Carpenter, I probably would have reacted just as he did in that situation.

Nyjer Morgan is a clown and there's no excuse for yelling profanities at a pitcher while on the basepaths. That's ridiculous.

The Tony Plush stuff might be funny if Morgan wasn't such a tool in real life, but his actual persona takes away from any humor in his alias.
Morgan and Carpenter deserve each other, that's for sure. I'm thinking roomies in the Narcissicist wing of the local mental hospital.

cincrazy
09-10-2011, 09:43 AM
There's even a Cardinals approved way to use Twitter. They're just so dang perfect, how do they ever lose a game? Oh wait, they don't, they never get beat, there's always some excuse why they lost, be it slippery balls, shadows, throwing inside the wrong way, getting even close to hitting Albert, moths in ears, bad calls, and of course, in Cincinnati, "its always something there."

That excuse shirt is getting mighty full.

I despise the Cards as much as anyone, but I fail to see how they're in the wrong here. Nyjer Morgan has a history of being a wack job, hence his elbow thrown at Hanigan. And he's a big man, talking trash on Pujols on a social networking site. He's lucky Albert didn't get ahold of him on the field, it would've been a T-Rex devouring a chicken.

Yes, I dislike Nyjer Morgan so much he leads me to defend the Cardinals.

PuffyPig
09-10-2011, 09:43 AM
As much as I despise Chris Carpenter, I probably would have reacted just as he did in that situation.

Nyjer Morgan is a clown and there's no excuse for yelling profanities at a pitcher while on the basepaths. That's ridiculous.



So, you would swear at every player you struck out?

Morgan was simply reacting to a situation Carpenter started.

I'm also a little confused that Carpenter has come clean as he didn't want people thinking he was a lair, by telling us that he is, in fact, a liar.

At least we can add "liar" to Chris' resume.

traderumor
09-10-2011, 09:50 AM
So, you would swear at every player you struck out?

Morgan was simply reacting to a situation Carpenter started.

I'm also a little confused that Carpenter has come clean as he didn't want people thinking he was a lair, by telling us that he is, in fact, a liar.

At least we can add "liar" to Chris' resume.These Cardinals remind me of Dusty's Cubs his last year there. They've done about everything but call the radio booth and tell the announcers to stop criticizing them. Of course, with their homer announcers, that is no wonder.

VR
09-10-2011, 10:54 AM
So, you would swear at every player you struck out?

Morgan was simply reacting to a situation Carpenter started.

I'm also a little confused that Carpenter has come clean as he didn't want people thinking he was a lair, by telling us that he is, in fact, a liar.

At least we can add "liar" to Chris' resume.

Absolutely stunning to me how this is just being brushed aside and excused.

The Operator
09-10-2011, 11:57 AM
So, you would swear at every player you struck out?

No, but I'd probably have words for somebody who was swearing at me from the basepaths in previous innings.

Don't get me wrong, I hate Chris Carpenter. I'd say that's pretty well documented. But unless I'm reading the whole thing wrong, sounds like Morgan started this interaction.

cincrazy
09-10-2011, 05:41 PM
No, but I'd probably have words for somebody who was swearing at me from the basepaths in previous innings.

Don't get me wrong, I hate Chris Carpenter. I'd say that's pretty well documented. But unless I'm reading the whole thing wrong, sounds like Morgan started this interaction.

cincrazy
09-10-2011, 05:42 PM
No, but I'd probably have words for somebody who was swearing at me from the basepaths in previous innings.

Don't get me wrong, I hate Chris Carpenter. I'd say that's pretty well documented. But unless I'm reading the whole thing wrong, sounds like Morgan started this interaction.

Agreed. Which is typical Nyjer Morgan. Actually, he'd be a perfect fit for the Cards. I wouldn't be surprised if he ended up there next season.

He's like the Ron Artest of MLB.

Reds/Flyers Fan
09-11-2011, 10:55 AM
There's even a Cardinals approved way to use Twitter. They're just so dang perfect, how do they ever lose a game? Oh wait, they don't, they never get beat, there's always some excuse why they lost, be it slippery balls, shadows, throwing inside the wrong way, getting even close to hitting Albert, moths in ears, bad calls, and of course, in Cincinnati, "its always something there."

That excuse shirt is getting mighty full.

Wow, you forgot at least 100 of their excuses. My favorite after a road loss earlier this year: Unpredictable hotel room service :lol:

RANDY IN INDY
09-11-2011, 05:42 PM
Sad thing is that I always liked the Cardinals, up until Larussa. Probably will like them again when he is gone.

Ron Madden
09-11-2011, 06:10 PM
Don't look now but the Cardinals are still alive in the WC race.

WVRedsFan
09-11-2011, 10:11 PM
Don't look now but the Cardinals are still alive in the WC race.Yes, and the Brewers are faltering. That's what happens when....oh, never mind.

marcshoe
09-12-2011, 01:09 AM
Just saw the Cards extended Carpenter for two years and 21 mil. Easier than trying to explain changing teams to his son, I guess.

Ron Madden
09-12-2011, 01:36 AM
Bryant Gumbel rips Mark McGwire.

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball/article_31bba744-c9e4-11e0-84b4-0019bb30f31a.html

PuffyPig
09-12-2011, 10:25 PM
With two out in the 9th, and needing a single to win the game, Larussa sends up Patterson to strike out.

Cards gave up 3 in the 8th to lose 6-5.

Patrick Bateman
09-13-2011, 12:20 AM
Mike wasn't watching though since he didn't even know the Cards were back in the race since he aleady gave up.

reds44
09-13-2011, 03:34 AM
Cards would be 3.5 out of the WC if they didn't blow that one today.

Thank God they did.

PuffyPig
09-13-2011, 07:41 AM
Cards would be 3.5 out of the WC if they didn't blow that one today.

Thank God they did.

They would have been 5.5 out if the Braves hadn't blown their game.

MikeThierry
09-15-2011, 01:12 AM
Mike wasn't watching though since he didn't even know the Cards were back in the race since he aleady gave up.

Look, I'm dealing with some real life issues at the moment and don't have time to watch baseball. Give me a break.



There's even a Cardinals approved way to use Twitter. They're just so dang perfect, how do they ever lose a game?

Isn't this a bit nit picky? It isn't unheard of for some teams to ban certain social media outlets. I know the Dolphins banned its players for using twitter and I know a lot of colleges ban their athletes from using twitter. I have no problem with the Cards setting a standard for their players. Another non-issue that gets made into a big deal by some Reds fans.

PuffyPig
09-15-2011, 06:53 AM
Look, I'm dealing with some real life issues at the moment and don't have time to watch baseball. Give me a break.






Well, in fairness to Mr. Batemen, you did state that you stopped watching baseball when you felt your team was no longer in contention.

traderumor
09-15-2011, 11:59 AM
Isn't this a bit nit picky? It isn't unheard of for some teams to ban certain social media outlets. I know the Dolphins banned its players for using twitter and I know a lot of colleges ban their athletes from using twitter. I have no problem with the Cards setting a standard for their players. Another non-issue that gets made into a big deal by some Reds fans.
The point was that they are commenting on another team's use of Twitter and deeming it unacceptable in their own, special, condescending, self-righteous kind of way, just like every other issue. Tony thinks he's E.F. Hutton.

MikeThierry
09-20-2011, 12:34 AM
Well, in fairness to Mr. Batemen, you did state that you stopped watching baseball when you felt your team was no longer in contention.

Yeah you are right. I'm a bit irritable at the moment with the steroids I took for my medical condition, so I'm blaming it on roid rage, lol. Thank god I just got off those things a day or so ago.

Anyway, enough with my problems. I have started to watch them again because they actually look like they care about playing a competent brand of baseball.

There was a thread earlier about MVP candidates and how Jay Bruce should be the leading candidate. I stated in there that Pujols would have a say in the NL MVP before its all over. I still think Braun will get it but Pujols is coming through when his team needs him the most. He has got on base 35 straight games and is hitting .410 with a .457 OBP in September.

Ron Madden
09-20-2011, 03:06 AM
Looks like the WC races in the NLC and ALE will go down to the wire.

Should be enough to keep Baseball fans interested the rest of the regular season. :thumbup:

savafan
01-10-2012, 02:15 PM
Want To Work For The St. Louis Cardinals?

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=15818


The St. Louis Cardinals have contacted us to ask us to share a pair of openings they have in their front office, in the Baseball Operations department. If you know databases and/or web development, these are great entry-level positions in the wonderful world of baseball. And with the World Series champions at that. Good luck everyone.

MikeThierry
01-10-2012, 04:08 PM
Want To Work For The St. Louis Cardinals?

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=15818

ohh... dream job!!!! :D

There is probably a lot of job openings considering that most of the coaching staff left, including Dave McKay and Joe Pettini, and Jeff Lunow became the Astros GM.